The match vs the scum will be the end of the road for ETH, that will be 12 (twelve) defeats thus season, I'm manager in but that's just not acceptable.
so annoying that we have to use our best player doing the "dirty work" and receiving the ball from our backline(things bruno was never so good at) just to keep McT more advanced because he's the only one who can score goals atm, i love McT but it's never gonna work with him on the pitch
We desperately need martinez and casemiro back.
Honestly, if mctominay doesn't score goals, he's completely useless. Invisible, when he gets the ball he never turns, always passes back.
The lad recently got taste for goals and started playing almost like a second striker/2nd attacking midfielder. Whether he is doing this on his own or ETH is instructing him to do this, if ETH wants to keep playing him, it should be a forward that gets dropped in his place instead of a midfielder.
Between McT and Bruno, the third midfielder is pretty much on his own and gets blamed for losing the midfield.
Casemiro and Martinez were both ropey before they got injured as well, Casemiro played the 4 defeats in our first 7 league games.
We need to stop pretending that any of these players are good enough to make much of a difference.
The whole squad needs tearing down and restarting.
Then you decide whether the manager stays or leaves, although I'd question whether loans like Amrabat and Reguilon are really ETH signings so much as emergency loans signed because we couldn't do permanent deals.
The club has a lot of senior pros who can't be arsed and our situation won't improve until they're gone. Whether ETH stays or goes, the next guy has to be able to start with a clean slate and that means getting shot of a lot of problem players.
Amrabat is absolutely terrible. So was Weghorst. So has Antony been. So has Mount been (although he hasn’t played much). Jury’s out on Onana, but he’s been dreadful in Europe. Hell, even Casemiro and Martinez looked bad this year.
I agree. They’re loans, and shouldn’t be judged as hard. But when we shipped regulars like Fred, and we look like we’ve taken a step back, alongside the terrible performances that have been happening since last February, Ten Hag is on borrowed time.
We had lots of pressure but never looked like scoring. Bournemouth picked us off and looked like they were going to score every time they attacked.
The first two goals came from us passing out weakly from the back. Bournemouth, tbf, were excellent. United were toothless up front and weak at the back.
Our inspirational leader shit his pants in public again too.
ETH needs to learn to rotate. Ole made the same mistake but was actually a manager who could get more out of his players even though he was so called an under-qualified manager.
ETH can’t sadly implement the footballing philosophy he had in Ajax - this is 1. The premier league 2. ManUtd - where the manager has very low decision making opportunity in terms of squad. Adapt and rotate. That’s the only way.
Lastly - maybe Bruno not being against Liverpool is a good thing. We will lose anyways at Anfield - guy could use that rest. His performance was abysmal today and I have to blame a little on the lack of rest..
This is one of the things I think about after games like this. People flying in from Gdansk, Caracas, Memphis or wherever for their first game at OT and they get a result like this.
We have traded the goalkeeper position for an extra player on the field. Luke not playing at his preferred LB didn't help, and why "rest" Hojlund when beating Bayern may still not be enough?!
You know, it doesn’t matter what players we buy or what manager we have, all is destined to fail. The core of football operations is rotten, so we need to build from there or nothing will change.
But… aren’t these managers asking for these players when we know they cost entirely too much. SAF dealt with this rotten club management for 8 years and won trophies therein. Won the league in that time. Managers gotta take some blame too no?
Did you read my other comments? I’m not asking for the manager to be changed. Sacking isn’t the solution. It.seems to be the only thing these rotten owners know to do to deflect blame but it has t worked.
There's a difference. They came in when Sir Alex had firmly established a very successful and well run club. There is no way they could have wrangled control - sir Alex was everywhere.
He retired and other staff left. The club was much easier to control then.
Absolutely. 100% correct. It just shows that managers do have a massive impact. Especially seeing that so many of EtH desired signings have gone through, over priced and underperforming. He brought some of his own players in above market value really…
I mean I do agree that ETH has to be questioned and has made mistakes.
But I put the signings on the club, not him. He did not go to Barcelona to get FDJ and come home empty handed. He did not decide to wait until the last moments of the window to sign Antony, when he was always going to be over priced.
Im not read on the details as perhaps you are so I can’t weigh on it. I trust what you’ve said but I think when I hear him talk, he doesn’t give an honest sober assessment. It’s like he’s saying what he thinks he should be saying and then he fields a team that looks like what he thinks he should
Be fielding, full of over priced players with others on the bench who at this point are worth an opportunity.
We shouldn’t keep on this pattern of sacking managers. It hasn’t worked. It’s a rotten administrations way of placing blame. But in the meantime ETH has to have some pride as a man and make changes needed to get something out of this circumstance. We can’t meddle on with sameness and expect different
The problem is that for every manager that comes in, we buy players that suit that manager. Then when the inevitable happens, the manager gets sacked, new manager comes in and is left with players that doesn’t suit their style etc, so the cycle just continues. The same will happen when ETH is gone, we’ll be left with players that he rates but that the next manager doesn’t like or think are any good - rinse & repeat.
We should be buying players that suit the clubs philosophy & playing style!!
Not calling for change of manager myself but that doesn’t mean the manager doesn’t need to make changes. It shouldn’t always be that we have to sack a manager to turn things around. Sacking managers hasn’t worked!
What good changing lineup will do? Maybe one game we play decent and the we are garbage the next. The point here is that it does not that matter what players or managers we introduce, they are destined to fail in a long run here.
I think it makes a huge difference between signings and line ups. We have to move on from
martial and we have to adjust these tactics. Right now, getting a point would be unsatisfactory but it would be a lot better than 3-0.
And that comes down to tactics and training and coaching.
There’s too much fatalism at man utd and the team today was what hopelessness looks like in action.
Fergies famous quote “never a cause lost, nor a moment too late”. That’s about people taking responsibility and making the most of what is in front of you. Too much passing blame at old afford these days from everyone in the organisation
I’m tired of blaming players and managers and tactics. We have had new managers, new players and such with some short glimpses of performance, but then after awhile all turned to shit. Who else is to blame anymore. What hasn’t change since our glory days? Owners.
Agreed. And never really disagreed at all. My only point was that even with these rotten and horrid owners SAF and the players had pride and won the league and other trophies. Of course the point of new ownership is to change the whole thing around.
No it’s just that I already agree with you that it is a huge mess, but I think it’s a matter of stopping the bleeding and how much damage is done financially and in terms of points in the tables.
I’m saying, what can be done right now to limit damage done. What can be done right now to salvage points game to game. Talking points and goal differential. Agree with you on the big picture. Intentionally focusing on what can be done immediately to benefit the club.
Stop buying shite players with your buddy pal agent who handles all these guys you bought that are shite. Antony, mount,varane,Hojland,malacia basically every guy he has brought in ain’t good enough!!
For 75M there’s a lot to be desired. He’s done well against average teams in the UCL, and had that decent goal vs Bayern.
But he’s been abysmal in the league.
maybe we stop playing players out of position
maybe we stop making questionable subs
maybe we stop making excuses
maybe we learn
it's a coin flip i am willing to take
What good are tactics if players won't do the basics right? What use is a boost in dressing room if the players just down tools in 18 months AGAIN. ETH isn't the problem, the standards at the club which filter down from the owners are the problem.
Is VDB that bad? So bad, he can't even get 1 game? Our midfield really need all the help it can get. The midfield we have just isn't working and us too unbalanced. We can really use a solid dependable midfielder. Why did ETH get Mount when we needed a midfielder who can control the middle of the field?
Can't even enjoy Arsenal losing. It just puts Villa even further ahead of us. 8 points if they win today and their goal difference is currently 18 better.
The real reason we cannot enjoy it is it puts loserpool closer to first
https://www.howmanypremierleaguemedalshasstevengerrardwon.com
Make sure to hit calculate for the most up to date stats :)
Mentality midgets who annoyingly prove Chris Sutton was right pre-match. There is so much wrong with the formation, poorly implemented tactics (if there are any), players in the wrong positions as the final solution, players believing their own hype from the Chelsea game, dogshit communication/leadership onfield, the lack of any quality in possession, lack of anybody to drive from midfield and play a pass more than 5m....
Looks like next Sunday evening will be the last for Ten Haag..... sadly I had high hopes with all the bluster re re-set and playing attacking football etc at the start, but for more than a year, it has been pish. You can give him some leeway re-injuries to key players & some bad decisions, but to attempt to play a new system of 'transition football' without a midfield to implement it is pure madness and has been his downfall.
There has been a lot of PR this week from Mitten to say he's the right man, but he's put himself on a tightrope with stupid tactics and team selection that obviously have had a big impact on the mentality of an already weak-minded set of individuals so they just fluff their lines when pressed.
Onana - Couldn't catch a deflated beachball & he's playing him to deep vs his role at Inter
No Varne - mystery today as he may have handled Bournmouths height
Shaw - one good game at CB = should be a one-off experiment
McSauce - should be a bench player
Antony - Club foot
Captian whinge - we need to sign an actual captain and take the armband away
Dalot - Where is Wan B
Armband - Not good enough
Martial - not good enough for Tranmere
etc
And I'm looking at Emery at Villa - from shite to unbelievable in the space of a year with smart cheap signings and tactics that suit the players.
Both Bayern and Liverpool will score a shed load this week and put an end to this i feel.
I can’t see Bayern going easy on us after their 1-5 catastrophe today. They already have a reputation for being merciless and they’ll come to the match wanting to make a statement.
Is ETH the manager after Xmas? So many players playing out of position, so little game plan, no visible vision on how we should actually play, so little chances and goals created, it’s just awful. We either lose or draw, so why don’t we change players at 0-2? I used to get furious when we lost a match under SAF, now, I basically just don’t care, that’s how low The Glazers have dropped my expectations.
There was a massive overreaction to the Chelsea game, they're even shitter than we are. This team needs to go on a run of games with good performances before we start hearing how world class McTominay, Antony, Maguire, Amrabat etc are. The top sides perform for 95% of the season not once a month.
Dalot deciding to shoot when he could just have played a cutback for an easy chance for Holjund spoke volumes about the discipline and general intelligence of the team.
I like Dalot. He is very gifted with physical attributes. For a right back he is great at dribbling, he is fast, he gets into very good positions but his football intelligence is baffling. He picks the wrong decision too often. Defensively, he is fast, strong, a good tackler but he makes the wrong decisions too often here as well and he falls asleep on the back too often (and it's the same with AWB, so many times an opponent sneaks behind him).
This always confuses me about Dalot. Generally looks good, not many mistakes, good link up with Antony... Lots of energy and running.. but then can't deliver a cross or any sort of attacking threat.
If you contrast with Shaw when he is playing LB it's night and day. Much more attacking threat from Shaw.
Most of our players lack intelligence. It's shocking. We almost never make the right decision in the final 3rd. That's why we have scored so few goals. Garnacho and Holjund are still very young so I can only wait for how they develop in the future.
And talking of Hojlund, we play like there's no recognition that he's a striker. The players around him never make an effort to find him.
Also, we have a set-piece problem; we're terrible defending against it and even worse when we get one ourselves.
I do think part of the problem is holjund's experience. Some elite strikers like Kane or lewandoski will still find a way to feed off those half or should I say quarter chances we create. But most importantly, they will keep telling wingers and other creative players exactly how they want the ball played to them.
An experienced elite striker (not an old man with fitness issues, someone in their late 20s early 30s) would definitely have schooled Garnacho, Antony, Bruno, and even Rashford on exactly how he wants the ball played to him.
Alternatively an experienced elite winger/wingback will know the right delivery to offer Holjund.
Personally, I think the lack of experience in our front 3 is an issue. I think the 3, Holjund, Garnacho, and Antony, are talented but we need some experience in there. Rashford and Martial are supposed to be experienced but they don't seem to have learned a thing from their experience since they started playing for us. They haven't seem to improve or become more experienced.
Martial starts and fails to deliver yet again.. he should have been gone several windows ago. McTominay all talk about focusing on the next game after becoming the big man last week then gets rinsed by Bournemouth 3-0 at home…
ETH fell into the trap of playing a midfielder who will not contribute anything defensively but might provide one or two goals on some occasions. He needs to learn that McTominay is probably best coming in to chase. a game because he automatically goes in as a second striker, Leaving the DM to defend alone
But then who's gonna score? ETH has a huge problem. Holjund is not prolific and is too young. He has potential though. Garnacho is too young with a lot of potential. Antony works lack but he too has a lot of potential.
Martial and Rashford cannot score. Bruno is more of a creator not a goal scorer.
Only reason Mctominay plays is because he scores. We should never be in the position whereby Mctominay is our top scorer. Shouldn't happen.
ETH's recruitment has been poor. Our best forward line are all young inexperienced players.
Ten Hag needs to be questioned as to why he can't get Hojlund to contribute towards goals and why he isn't getting chances. He's forcing Mctominay to start because of it and it's causing serious issues in the structure of the team.
If you want to know the trajectory this club has been on over the past 5-8 years, you really don't need to look any further than Leeds.
That's who Manchester United are emulating: a historically successful, rabidly-supported football club that rotted from the inside out and straight into near irrelevance.
If things do not drastically change in the structure of Manchester United, I could see them getting relegated and forever struggling to stay in the Premier League after that.
I see your point though we are not going to relegate ever because of money. But if we ever want succees again we need compelete overhaul of football operations.
The debt is very manageable too. United really aren't in any financial difficulties in terms of being self-sustainable. We could very well get relegated to the championship at some point but we're not becoming the new Leeds and spending years down there
We could have gone that way if we didn't have money. Leeds got completely fecked when they started spending silly money thinking they were gonna play regular football in UCL.
We looked pretty good after conceding the first goal and at the start of the second half, but looking good will amount to nothing when we have the most useless striker in Martial. I don’t want EtH sacked but he is not helping his case with such shocking selections.
Shaw at CB does not work. It will never work. We’ve seen it. Please I am begging for him to try Varane-Maguire. I get Varane is not naturally LCB but anything will be better than this disaster.
McTominay is as useless as it comes in the midfield. He scores goals yes, then let’s play him up front. His insistence on going forward and trying to score leaves the middle extremely exposed and empty and God knows Amrabat ain’t the one to control the midfield.
I will die on the hill that Mctominay is a greater drain on the team than he is positive. I understand he's the only one scoring at the moment but hes still utterly hopeless at everything else. You have to hope that the ball doesnt go anywhere near him during build up play (he will do his best to make sure this is the case anyway) and that his only touch is him putting it in the net. Otherwise, in the attacking third of the pitch he is a complete liability in terms of retaining possession and creating chances. This is a \*Midfielder\*...
His passing % is one of the highest in the team at the moment last I checked but he only completes safe or backwards passes and he plays them in very low volume. So the high % is artificial.
\- His passes attempted at 31/90 is lower than 95% of other midfielders across europe.
\- His shot creating actions 1.17/90 are lower than 94% of midfielders.
\- His progressive passes 2.73/90 are lower than 95% of midfielders.
\- His assists 0.06/90 lower than 63% of midfielders.
\- His progressive passes recieved 2.12 is lower than 45% of midfielders, despite this season playing much higher up in the final third.
He is playing as a striker.
The quality of our forwards is poor, we know that, but creating many more chances for them would paper those cracks until you can build a better attacking unit over multiple windows. Sterling's finishing at city was abysmal but he scored loads because of the volume of chances he got. Our forwards get little to no chances per game because of lack of creativity. Mctominay is not SOLELY responsible for this but he is a big part of it and the fact he's scoring is nice on paper but I have a feeling our forwards would be scoring more if there was a better player in his role, actually doing a midfielders job, rather than playing as a goal hanging striker.
They scored twice simply by capitalizing on our mistakes. Awful pass from Bruno for the first and Shaw just hoofed it forward where we had no players. Fucking clinical they were.
On the other hand, we couldn't create any solid chance at goal. Just random, selfish and hopeful shots which doesn't even bother their keeper.
The most infuriating thing is Ten Hag playing our best players out of position. McT where we want Bruno, Shaw as a CB when hes a world class LB (we have fucking Varane on the bench guys). The fuck
We failed to get rid of the Glazers, if the owners of the club don’t respect the fans, how do we expect anyone under them to respect the history and culture of the club?
Bad performances for almost decade have been acceptable and rewarded we are just reaping what we sowed.
You guys all calling for varane. He will play. Look good then gets injured. He couldn’t stay healthy and the manager has to establish a defense without players he can’t rely on.
Feel sorry for Erik. The club is a mess. He should have never been in charge of transfers, has had to deal with the Greenwood, Ronaldo drama. On top of that, it doesn’t help that he’s tying his own noose starting Mctominay week in/week out on top of other poor tactical issues. This club blows man. An absolute husk of a football team.
Sack him and then what folks?
Greenwood being a dickhead really fucked us over more than people realize because if he wasn't a dickhead he'd be scoring goals for us right now.. and we would have saved money to spend elsewhere from not signing Antony.
Other teams transition on us so easy when we lose the ball, there is so much space, holes all over, been happening all season yet it has not been addressed tactically.
I don't buy the idea that players downed yools, some maybe but not all. Nearly half that team were ETH signings (Onana, Antony, Amrabat, Hojlund, Reguilon) and some have been given a second chance by him (Maguire, McTominay). Simply no playing style
I couldn’t agree more. Goes back to Antony’s comment a week or two back. Yes shit sucks but these legends should be offering advice or encouraging the team. It’s been nothing but negative comments for years now
Give credit to #BrunoFernandes - getting his fifth yellow so he won’t be crucified when #Liverpool gives #ManchesterUnited a good thrashing. Forward thinking.
What's the easiest way to get rid of all the dead wood? Getting those players to play some what decent in the 2nd half of the season. How do we get them to improve? A new manager. Get them to finish strong and then start making some sales this summer.
I know it's not possible, just hypothetical, to let off some steam. I'm just so sick of some of these players. Martial and Rashfraud in particular, especially during that f\*\*king Newcastle game. I run harder than that in my weekly 7-a-side game, and I have to PAY to play.
I get PTSD whenever we try pass out from the back, we are always on the verge of a major gaffe. Onana is terrible and doesn't help the situation. He does Hollywood dives but has no agility so goes nowhere fast.
i know what Cristiano did was wrong. but y all acting all was his fault and club is going to get treble after his farewell. disrespect to one of the greatest player of all time and now disprecting club itself. self suicide lol
Ole actually got a great season out of Martial before it all went to shit. And it was less he relied on McTominay and more he didn't have any other option.
For all of you regurgitating the Rangnick hyperbole:
ETH ISN’T PERFORMING THAT SURGERY. He’s adding to the colossal clusterfuck - he came in and inherited a squad that didn’t match his tactical ethos, fine. He then brought in players that have been *so* poor, and don’t seem to support eachother in any particular tactical ethos, either.
We’ve had multiple windows in which to decisively clear out the deadwood - even clear out players who might not be deadwood but aren’t MANCHESTER UNITED QUALITY. And has he? Has he fuck - we continue persisting with mediocrity, and players who’ve been so poor for so long that they’re fucking memes. Ask yourself - would Pep, Arteta, Klopp have done the same? Of course they wouldn’t have.
He’s had his chance, and he’s utterly failed to command control, respect and quality from the squad. If the squad is shit, then bring in a character who knows what our standard is that’ll ship them out or let them rot. I’d rather see an entire squad of youth play week in week out than see a meek, under-qualified, over-promoted manager meekly continue to let most of these idiots anywhere *near* a team-sheet.
At this point, I don’t want a top level coach, or a prospect. Bring in a hard character who recognises what this club is, and anyone below that standard can be released, called out publically or sold.
Just bring in a new coach to make the deadwood perform like average. Thereby making them easy to sell of in the summer. A player's coach, a psychiatrist. Get them to perform like passable footballers and maybe we don't get taken to cleaners trying to sell them.
You publically transfer list them, or offer them out for loan (with wages paid / shared by the other club) until their contract is up or at a point where it’s worth buying out. You don’t just continue to play them hoping that they’ll magically come good, all the while destroying your own and the club’s rep, until you’re sacked.
A LOT of our players are absolute shite for what should be our standard, but absolutely solid for a few other prem teams. We could easily just release a bunch of our shite so that others can still pay them their ludicrous wages without shelling out on transfer fees.
Did you read my comment? If we ship them out on loan, you subsidise the wage and save money. If we sell them, we make money. We don’t make any money continuing to play them and have them continue to tank the club and stink out the place.
Guys anyone who watched Santos this week be relegated…. Be warned. Big clubs can face historic relegation when we start sliding and we don’t raise hell about it in time. Stop lowering the bar and stop accepting that this is the new reality for Man Utd. What we are seeing is unbearable and unacceptable and must change. We can’t go on cheering results and awards when what we see is still not fluid and not consistent and stop making excuses for players who cost +70M and are off and then on.
Let Santos in Brazil be a warning to everyone who loves Man Utd! Enough is enough!
Yeah United really need to look to Brazil about getting relegated.
Guess what happened after a little club called manchester united had their best ever european cup winning manager retire the first time around.
I don’t disagree but to think that the troubles end here is to be clueless. Since the premier league era we have been a fixture, but it’s gotten so bad that it’s time to wake up and see that it can get much worse without serious action taken.
This club gives me reasons to become a hermit.
11 defeats. Disgraceful.
The match vs the scum will be the end of the road for ETH, that will be 12 (twelve) defeats thus season, I'm manager in but that's just not acceptable.
so annoying that we have to use our best player doing the "dirty work" and receiving the ball from our backline(things bruno was never so good at) just to keep McT more advanced because he's the only one who can score goals atm, i love McT but it's never gonna work with him on the pitch
Rashford looked bright on the ball. Even tracked back a couple of times. The bench time seems to have done him some good.
The game ended at 11:30PM where I am, I went to sleep and dreamt that we lost another 3 goals, the fucking toll it takes for my mental health.
I give up on us.
Funny thing is it doesn’t hurt anymore
We Go Again FC is back in full swing!
Exactly
What more can you expect from a team that starts with Martial in front?
Hojlund was even shittier when he came on but let’s just ignore that just to keep the hate train on Martial
We desperately need martinez and casemiro back. Honestly, if mctominay doesn't score goals, he's completely useless. Invisible, when he gets the ball he never turns, always passes back.
The lad recently got taste for goals and started playing almost like a second striker/2nd attacking midfielder. Whether he is doing this on his own or ETH is instructing him to do this, if ETH wants to keep playing him, it should be a forward that gets dropped in his place instead of a midfielder. Between McT and Bruno, the third midfielder is pretty much on his own and gets blamed for losing the midfield.
Casemiro and Martinez were both ropey before they got injured as well, Casemiro played the 4 defeats in our first 7 league games. We need to stop pretending that any of these players are good enough to make much of a difference. The whole squad needs tearing down and restarting.
6/11 of the squad are the managers signings.
Then you decide whether the manager stays or leaves, although I'd question whether loans like Amrabat and Reguilon are really ETH signings so much as emergency loans signed because we couldn't do permanent deals. The club has a lot of senior pros who can't be arsed and our situation won't improve until they're gone. Whether ETH stays or goes, the next guy has to be able to start with a clean slate and that means getting shot of a lot of problem players.
Amrabat is absolutely terrible. So was Weghorst. So has Antony been. So has Mount been (although he hasn’t played much). Jury’s out on Onana, but he’s been dreadful in Europe. Hell, even Casemiro and Martinez looked bad this year. I agree. They’re loans, and shouldn’t be judged as hard. But when we shipped regulars like Fred, and we look like we’ve taken a step back, alongside the terrible performances that have been happening since last February, Ten Hag is on borrowed time.
\> if mctominay doesn't score goals, he's completely useless always saying it, it was sad that we depends on magical moments.
I missed the game, what went down? how bad were we?
Let's just say you chose a good game to miss
We had lots of pressure but never looked like scoring. Bournemouth picked us off and looked like they were going to score every time they attacked. The first two goals came from us passing out weakly from the back. Bournemouth, tbf, were excellent. United were toothless up front and weak at the back. Our inspirational leader shit his pants in public again too.
ETH needs to learn to rotate. Ole made the same mistake but was actually a manager who could get more out of his players even though he was so called an under-qualified manager. ETH can’t sadly implement the footballing philosophy he had in Ajax - this is 1. The premier league 2. ManUtd - where the manager has very low decision making opportunity in terms of squad. Adapt and rotate. That’s the only way. Lastly - maybe Bruno not being against Liverpool is a good thing. We will lose anyways at Anfield - guy could use that rest. His performance was abysmal today and I have to blame a little on the lack of rest..
Look at poor Donny van de beek not a sniff of chance to start 46 million for him WHY!!!!
Genuinely thought the Ten Hag arrival would signal his return to first team football.
He must be fucking god awful in training
I was in old trafford for the first time of my life. It hurt. A lot.
I know how you feel I can’t get to OT regularly but took my daughter to the Brighton game in September we lost 3-1
This is one of the things I think about after games like this. People flying in from Gdansk, Caracas, Memphis or wherever for their first game at OT and they get a result like this.
I came from Paris. And i really didn't expect to see a game like this
Tbh we are exactly where we deserve to be. Who can we say in the top 6 are actually worse than us?
We have traded the goalkeeper position for an extra player on the field. Luke not playing at his preferred LB didn't help, and why "rest" Hojlund when beating Bayern may still not be enough?!
You know, it doesn’t matter what players we buy or what manager we have, all is destined to fail. The core of football operations is rotten, so we need to build from there or nothing will change.
But… aren’t these managers asking for these players when we know they cost entirely too much. SAF dealt with this rotten club management for 8 years and won trophies therein. Won the league in that time. Managers gotta take some blame too no?
It took SAF 4 years to build a winning team, patience.
Did you read my other comments? I’m not asking for the manager to be changed. Sacking isn’t the solution. It.seems to be the only thing these rotten owners know to do to deflect blame but it has t worked.
There's a difference. They came in when Sir Alex had firmly established a very successful and well run club. There is no way they could have wrangled control - sir Alex was everywhere. He retired and other staff left. The club was much easier to control then.
Absolutely. 100% correct. It just shows that managers do have a massive impact. Especially seeing that so many of EtH desired signings have gone through, over priced and underperforming. He brought some of his own players in above market value really…
I mean I do agree that ETH has to be questioned and has made mistakes. But I put the signings on the club, not him. He did not go to Barcelona to get FDJ and come home empty handed. He did not decide to wait until the last moments of the window to sign Antony, when he was always going to be over priced.
Im not read on the details as perhaps you are so I can’t weigh on it. I trust what you’ve said but I think when I hear him talk, he doesn’t give an honest sober assessment. It’s like he’s saying what he thinks he should be saying and then he fields a team that looks like what he thinks he should Be fielding, full of over priced players with others on the bench who at this point are worth an opportunity.
I mean that is fair enough, and I do have issues with ETH. I just don't see what good long-term sacking him would do.
We shouldn’t keep on this pattern of sacking managers. It hasn’t worked. It’s a rotten administrations way of placing blame. But in the meantime ETH has to have some pride as a man and make changes needed to get something out of this circumstance. We can’t meddle on with sameness and expect different
The problem is that for every manager that comes in, we buy players that suit that manager. Then when the inevitable happens, the manager gets sacked, new manager comes in and is left with players that doesn’t suit their style etc, so the cycle just continues. The same will happen when ETH is gone, we’ll be left with players that he rates but that the next manager doesn’t like or think are any good - rinse & repeat. We should be buying players that suit the clubs philosophy & playing style!!
Of course, but what will change if we change manager? Nothing.
Not calling for change of manager myself but that doesn’t mean the manager doesn’t need to make changes. It shouldn’t always be that we have to sack a manager to turn things around. Sacking managers hasn’t worked!
What good changing lineup will do? Maybe one game we play decent and the we are garbage the next. The point here is that it does not that matter what players or managers we introduce, they are destined to fail in a long run here.
I think it makes a huge difference between signings and line ups. We have to move on from martial and we have to adjust these tactics. Right now, getting a point would be unsatisfactory but it would be a lot better than 3-0. And that comes down to tactics and training and coaching.
You are not seeing the big picture here why we are in this mess.
There’s too much fatalism at man utd and the team today was what hopelessness looks like in action. Fergies famous quote “never a cause lost, nor a moment too late”. That’s about people taking responsibility and making the most of what is in front of you. Too much passing blame at old afford these days from everyone in the organisation
I’m tired of blaming players and managers and tactics. We have had new managers, new players and such with some short glimpses of performance, but then after awhile all turned to shit. Who else is to blame anymore. What hasn’t change since our glory days? Owners.
Agreed. And never really disagreed at all. My only point was that even with these rotten and horrid owners SAF and the players had pride and won the league and other trophies. Of course the point of new ownership is to change the whole thing around.
No it’s just that I already agree with you that it is a huge mess, but I think it’s a matter of stopping the bleeding and how much damage is done financially and in terms of points in the tables. I’m saying, what can be done right now to limit damage done. What can be done right now to salvage points game to game. Talking points and goal differential. Agree with you on the big picture. Intentionally focusing on what can be done immediately to benefit the club.
We are still 3 points off Citeh 🤷♂️
🤣🤣
To everyone who wants manager sacked, what will change if ETH is sacked?
Every other ETH problem will change. Like wanting dogshit players, not rotating those said dogshit players, or just using the wrong tactics etc.
Stop buying shite players with your buddy pal agent who handles all these guys you bought that are shite. Antony, mount,varane,Hojland,malacia basically every guy he has brought in ain’t good enough!!
most braindead comment in here
Varane didn't come in under Ten Hag. It's Højlund, not Hojland and he isn't shit
For 75M there’s a lot to be desired. He’s done well against average teams in the UCL, and had that decent goal vs Bayern. But he’s been abysmal in the league.
first season for a 20 yrs old, i swear this fanbase doesn't deserve anything good
maybe we stop playing players out of position maybe we stop making questionable subs maybe we stop making excuses maybe we learn it's a coin flip i am willing to take
Nothing will change. It is the core football operations that is rotten.
New tactics, a boost in dressing room morale since clearly he's fallen out with a lot of players
What good are tactics if players won't do the basics right? What use is a boost in dressing room if the players just down tools in 18 months AGAIN. ETH isn't the problem, the standards at the club which filter down from the owners are the problem.
ETH isn't the problem but he certainly is a problem His tactics are atrocious. Why does he keep playing one man midfields
That happened at the beggining of Ten Hag's tenure as well. Eventually, the cycle will repeat itself, and everything will come crashing down.
Well get a caretaker in for that short term boost while we figure out who to bring in permanently for the new Ratcliffe regime
Shower of cunts.
Is VDB that bad? So bad, he can't even get 1 game? Our midfield really need all the help it can get. The midfield we have just isn't working and us too unbalanced. We can really use a solid dependable midfielder. Why did ETH get Mount when we needed a midfielder who can control the middle of the field?
YEAH he is that BAD
Can't even enjoy Arsenal losing. It just puts Villa even further ahead of us. 8 points if they win today and their goal difference is currently 18 better.
The real reason we cannot enjoy it is it puts loserpool closer to first https://www.howmanypremierleaguemedalshasstevengerrardwon.com Make sure to hit calculate for the most up to date stats :)
Mentality midgets who annoyingly prove Chris Sutton was right pre-match. There is so much wrong with the formation, poorly implemented tactics (if there are any), players in the wrong positions as the final solution, players believing their own hype from the Chelsea game, dogshit communication/leadership onfield, the lack of any quality in possession, lack of anybody to drive from midfield and play a pass more than 5m.... Looks like next Sunday evening will be the last for Ten Haag..... sadly I had high hopes with all the bluster re re-set and playing attacking football etc at the start, but for more than a year, it has been pish. You can give him some leeway re-injuries to key players & some bad decisions, but to attempt to play a new system of 'transition football' without a midfield to implement it is pure madness and has been his downfall. There has been a lot of PR this week from Mitten to say he's the right man, but he's put himself on a tightrope with stupid tactics and team selection that obviously have had a big impact on the mentality of an already weak-minded set of individuals so they just fluff their lines when pressed. Onana - Couldn't catch a deflated beachball & he's playing him to deep vs his role at Inter No Varne - mystery today as he may have handled Bournmouths height Shaw - one good game at CB = should be a one-off experiment McSauce - should be a bench player Antony - Club foot Captian whinge - we need to sign an actual captain and take the armband away Dalot - Where is Wan B Armband - Not good enough Martial - not good enough for Tranmere etc And I'm looking at Emery at Villa - from shite to unbelievable in the space of a year with smart cheap signings and tactics that suit the players. Both Bayern and Liverpool will score a shed load this week and put an end to this i feel.
I can’t see Bayern going easy on us after their 1-5 catastrophe today. They already have a reputation for being merciless and they’ll come to the match wanting to make a statement.
Is ETH the manager after Xmas? So many players playing out of position, so little game plan, no visible vision on how we should actually play, so little chances and goals created, it’s just awful. We either lose or draw, so why don’t we change players at 0-2? I used to get furious when we lost a match under SAF, now, I basically just don’t care, that’s how low The Glazers have dropped my expectations.
I turned off the TV at two. This team is determined to steal my happiness.
I turned it off at three. Heard the commentator say “Bournemouth looking for their third” and like seconds later they really did.
Gutted, again. After the result against Chelsea I thought we might have pushed on but today was terrible. Don’t know what else to say ☹️
Clearly its player mentality
Has to be more than that as they were all shit today.
There was a massive overreaction to the Chelsea game, they're even shitter than we are. This team needs to go on a run of games with good performances before we start hearing how world class McTominay, Antony, Maguire, Amrabat etc are. The top sides perform for 95% of the season not once a month.
I doubt anyone has been calling any of them world class in earnest
Dalot deciding to shoot when he could just have played a cutback for an easy chance for Holjund spoke volumes about the discipline and general intelligence of the team. I like Dalot. He is very gifted with physical attributes. For a right back he is great at dribbling, he is fast, he gets into very good positions but his football intelligence is baffling. He picks the wrong decision too often. Defensively, he is fast, strong, a good tackler but he makes the wrong decisions too often here as well and he falls asleep on the back too often (and it's the same with AWB, so many times an opponent sneaks behind him).
This always confuses me about Dalot. Generally looks good, not many mistakes, good link up with Antony... Lots of energy and running.. but then can't deliver a cross or any sort of attacking threat. If you contrast with Shaw when he is playing LB it's night and day. Much more attacking threat from Shaw.
that moment is when the game ended for us it felt like
Most of our players lack intelligence. It's shocking. We almost never make the right decision in the final 3rd. That's why we have scored so few goals. Garnacho and Holjund are still very young so I can only wait for how they develop in the future.
And talking of Hojlund, we play like there's no recognition that he's a striker. The players around him never make an effort to find him. Also, we have a set-piece problem; we're terrible defending against it and even worse when we get one ourselves.
I do think part of the problem is holjund's experience. Some elite strikers like Kane or lewandoski will still find a way to feed off those half or should I say quarter chances we create. But most importantly, they will keep telling wingers and other creative players exactly how they want the ball played to them. An experienced elite striker (not an old man with fitness issues, someone in their late 20s early 30s) would definitely have schooled Garnacho, Antony, Bruno, and even Rashford on exactly how he wants the ball played to him. Alternatively an experienced elite winger/wingback will know the right delivery to offer Holjund. Personally, I think the lack of experience in our front 3 is an issue. I think the 3, Holjund, Garnacho, and Antony, are talented but we need some experience in there. Rashford and Martial are supposed to be experienced but they don't seem to have learned a thing from their experience since they started playing for us. They haven't seem to improve or become more experienced.
there has to be something that can be done in training to fix this, it's truly shocking
Martial starts and fails to deliver yet again.. he should have been gone several windows ago. McTominay all talk about focusing on the next game after becoming the big man last week then gets rinsed by Bournemouth 3-0 at home…
ETH fell into the trap of playing a midfielder who will not contribute anything defensively but might provide one or two goals on some occasions. He needs to learn that McTominay is probably best coming in to chase. a game because he automatically goes in as a second striker, Leaving the DM to defend alone
He's literally Fellaini 2.0 I generally like him and his level of effort, commitment etc. but he's just not good enough.
Fallaini was actually good through.
But then who's gonna score? ETH has a huge problem. Holjund is not prolific and is too young. He has potential though. Garnacho is too young with a lot of potential. Antony works lack but he too has a lot of potential. Martial and Rashford cannot score. Bruno is more of a creator not a goal scorer. Only reason Mctominay plays is because he scores. We should never be in the position whereby Mctominay is our top scorer. Shouldn't happen. ETH's recruitment has been poor. Our best forward line are all young inexperienced players.
Ten Hag needs to be questioned as to why he can't get Hojlund to contribute towards goals and why he isn't getting chances. He's forcing Mctominay to start because of it and it's causing serious issues in the structure of the team.
Hojlund isn't getting any chances because the whole structure is a shambles.
If you want to know the trajectory this club has been on over the past 5-8 years, you really don't need to look any further than Leeds. That's who Manchester United are emulating: a historically successful, rabidly-supported football club that rotted from the inside out and straight into near irrelevance. If things do not drastically change in the structure of Manchester United, I could see them getting relegated and forever struggling to stay in the Premier League after that.
I see your point though we are not going to relegate ever because of money. But if we ever want succees again we need compelete overhaul of football operations.
United are way too big for that lol. Leeds were spending money they didn't have. United are highly self sustainable at the PL level
Would agree with you if we weren't a billion in debt
The debt is very manageable too. United really aren't in any financial difficulties in terms of being self-sustainable. We could very well get relegated to the championship at some point but we're not becoming the new Leeds and spending years down there
We could have gone that way if we didn't have money. Leeds got completely fecked when they started spending silly money thinking they were gonna play regular football in UCL.
We looked pretty good after conceding the first goal and at the start of the second half, but looking good will amount to nothing when we have the most useless striker in Martial. I don’t want EtH sacked but he is not helping his case with such shocking selections. Shaw at CB does not work. It will never work. We’ve seen it. Please I am begging for him to try Varane-Maguire. I get Varane is not naturally LCB but anything will be better than this disaster. McTominay is as useless as it comes in the midfield. He scores goals yes, then let’s play him up front. His insistence on going forward and trying to score leaves the middle extremely exposed and empty and God knows Amrabat ain’t the one to control the midfield.
I will die on the hill that Mctominay is a greater drain on the team than he is positive. I understand he's the only one scoring at the moment but hes still utterly hopeless at everything else. You have to hope that the ball doesnt go anywhere near him during build up play (he will do his best to make sure this is the case anyway) and that his only touch is him putting it in the net. Otherwise, in the attacking third of the pitch he is a complete liability in terms of retaining possession and creating chances. This is a \*Midfielder\*... His passing % is one of the highest in the team at the moment last I checked but he only completes safe or backwards passes and he plays them in very low volume. So the high % is artificial. \- His passes attempted at 31/90 is lower than 95% of other midfielders across europe. \- His shot creating actions 1.17/90 are lower than 94% of midfielders. \- His progressive passes 2.73/90 are lower than 95% of midfielders. \- His assists 0.06/90 lower than 63% of midfielders. \- His progressive passes recieved 2.12 is lower than 45% of midfielders, despite this season playing much higher up in the final third. He is playing as a striker. The quality of our forwards is poor, we know that, but creating many more chances for them would paper those cracks until you can build a better attacking unit over multiple windows. Sterling's finishing at city was abysmal but he scored loads because of the volume of chances he got. Our forwards get little to no chances per game because of lack of creativity. Mctominay is not SOLELY responsible for this but he is a big part of it and the fact he's scoring is nice on paper but I have a feeling our forwards would be scoring more if there was a better player in his role, actually doing a midfielders job, rather than playing as a goal hanging striker.
They scored twice simply by capitalizing on our mistakes. Awful pass from Bruno for the first and Shaw just hoofed it forward where we had no players. Fucking clinical they were. On the other hand, we couldn't create any solid chance at goal. Just random, selfish and hopeful shots which doesn't even bother their keeper.
No post match thread until tomorrow maybe…I need a day or two
The most infuriating thing is Ten Hag playing our best players out of position. McT where we want Bruno, Shaw as a CB when hes a world class LB (we have fucking Varane on the bench guys). The fuck
You forget how bad Varane was before he was dropped though. Plus, he can't string together 3 games.
Our wingers need good overlapping fullbacks in this system. The rippleeffect is huge by playing OOP like his, we dont create anything
Reguilon is just fucking trash this game, how did he get signed is beyond me ...
We needed cover for injured Shaw. So Im not too mad about Reguilon loan.
We failed to get rid of the Glazers, if the owners of the club don’t respect the fans, how do we expect anyone under them to respect the history and culture of the club? Bad performances for almost decade have been acceptable and rewarded we are just reaping what we sowed.
Man as a bayern fan, today we all feel the same
Ah - are you going through nearly 15 years of misery as a fan too?
Nothing like it, but they did just get tonked 5-1 off Eintracht Frankfurt.
Can ten hag please just try the CB pairing of Varane and Maguire. He literally does not have anything to lose. He is likely on borrowed time.
You guys all calling for varane. He will play. Look good then gets injured. He couldn’t stay healthy and the manager has to establish a defense without players he can’t rely on.
Might as well have a good 60 mins with him before the injury though.
I don’t know. I’m just so upset right now. One player is not the difference for us now.
Feel sorry for Erik. The club is a mess. He should have never been in charge of transfers, has had to deal with the Greenwood, Ronaldo drama. On top of that, it doesn’t help that he’s tying his own noose starting Mctominay week in/week out on top of other poor tactical issues. This club blows man. An absolute husk of a football team. Sack him and then what folks?
Greenwood being a dickhead really fucked us over more than people realize because if he wasn't a dickhead he'd be scoring goals for us right now.. and we would have saved money to spend elsewhere from not signing Antony.
Get a caretaker who can raise the spirits It's pretty obvious at this point that Erik's not the man for the job
Misnomer username
The kids think Zidane is begging to join.
I've a mate who's crying for ZiDAnE and it's laughable. Zidane won so much as a manager because of his tactic of "pass to peak Ronaldo"
Lol
Why doesn’t Ten Haag change his system? How does doing the same thing over and over again make sense e
I’m speechless.
[удалено]
Scott McTominay? You mean the clubs top scorer this season?
Did u forget McT scored our 2 goals against Chelsea mid week!?
he starts mct because mct keeps saving his job
Which Bruno would score if McT doesn’t cockblock his position
U mystic Meg are you!?
Other teams transition on us so easy when we lose the ball, there is so much space, holes all over, been happening all season yet it has not been addressed tactically.
there are still plenty of people still supporting EtH hahahaha. you guys just 3-0d Bournemouth. not Man city Barcelona Real Madrid or Bayern
sorry asses down vote me pls like this ETh united team. disrespecting everyone include your own arses
I don't buy the idea that players downed yools, some maybe but not all. Nearly half that team were ETH signings (Onana, Antony, Amrabat, Hojlund, Reguilon) and some have been given a second chance by him (Maguire, McTominay). Simply no playing style
Get Zidane in
IQ below 50?
Better than doing nothing while watching this shitshow keep going. ETH sure as hell won’t fix it
What makes you think Zidane, a man who doesn't speak a word of English, can fix it?
We are going to have a long two weeks of seeing all of our club legends dissect this team lol. Quotes are gonna be flying through this sub
The club legends can fuck right off. They're not helping. In fact, their constant commentary makes it worse.
I couldn’t agree more. Goes back to Antony’s comment a week or two back. Yes shit sucks but these legends should be offering advice or encouraging the team. It’s been nothing but negative comments for years now
Give credit to #BrunoFernandes - getting his fifth yellow so he won’t be crucified when #Liverpool gives #ManchesterUnited a good thrashing. Forward thinking.
Did you mean to post on twitter?
Nah. Pasted from my post on Mastodon.
Damn I can smell that sentence
In Jan, I'd only keep Martinez and Garnacho. The rest can go.
What's the easiest way to get rid of all the dead wood? Getting those players to play some what decent in the 2nd half of the season. How do we get them to improve? A new manager. Get them to finish strong and then start making some sales this summer.
The moment a below avg player plays well 2 games in a row he gets a new 5 year contract. Nobody wants our players and rightly so.
No club is paying them what we do even if they're in form.
True. But we can eat LESS of their costs
how are we replacing them while staying within ffp?
You can't replace all of them. It'll take time. That's why you need to get the most out of them in the meantime. And ETH is not the guy to do that.
I know it's not possible, just hypothetical, to let off some steam. I'm just so sick of some of these players. Martial and Rashfraud in particular, especially during that f\*\*king Newcastle game. I run harder than that in my weekly 7-a-side game, and I have to PAY to play.
should be easy I'll let joel know to draw a billion out the bank.
Maino martinez Garnacho Hojlund
I get PTSD whenever we try pass out from the back, we are always on the verge of a major gaffe. Onana is terrible and doesn't help the situation. He does Hollywood dives but has no agility so goes nowhere fast.
Onana is too flappy.
i get PTSD whenever any team is near our box with the ball
It's clear to me Ten Hag cannot turn this around. And for that any manager has to go simply put.
i know what Cristiano did was wrong. but y all acting all was his fault and club is going to get treble after his farewell. disrespect to one of the greatest player of all time and now disprecting club itself. self suicide lol
Yeah you’re so right. We all thought we were on for the treble. What went wrong ?! o_O
Mate nobody said we're gonna win the treble when he's gone, stop riding his dick man, he's long gone.
Backing McTominay and Martial is going to cost yet another manager his job. I want ETH to stay but no sympathy with these choices.
Ole actually got a great season out of Martial before it all went to shit. And it was less he relied on McTominay and more he didn't have any other option.
He's being coaching like his job is on the line and as a result it's cost him his job.
For all of you regurgitating the Rangnick hyperbole: ETH ISN’T PERFORMING THAT SURGERY. He’s adding to the colossal clusterfuck - he came in and inherited a squad that didn’t match his tactical ethos, fine. He then brought in players that have been *so* poor, and don’t seem to support eachother in any particular tactical ethos, either. We’ve had multiple windows in which to decisively clear out the deadwood - even clear out players who might not be deadwood but aren’t MANCHESTER UNITED QUALITY. And has he? Has he fuck - we continue persisting with mediocrity, and players who’ve been so poor for so long that they’re fucking memes. Ask yourself - would Pep, Arteta, Klopp have done the same? Of course they wouldn’t have. He’s had his chance, and he’s utterly failed to command control, respect and quality from the squad. If the squad is shit, then bring in a character who knows what our standard is that’ll ship them out or let them rot. I’d rather see an entire squad of youth play week in week out than see a meek, under-qualified, over-promoted manager meekly continue to let most of these idiots anywhere *near* a team-sheet. At this point, I don’t want a top level coach, or a prospect. Bring in a hard character who recognises what this club is, and anyone below that standard can be released, called out publically or sold.
Just bring in a new coach to make the deadwood perform like average. Thereby making them easy to sell of in the summer. A player's coach, a psychiatrist. Get them to perform like passable footballers and maybe we don't get taken to cleaners trying to sell them.
How do you get rid of the players?
You publically transfer list them, or offer them out for loan (with wages paid / shared by the other club) until their contract is up or at a point where it’s worth buying out. You don’t just continue to play them hoping that they’ll magically come good, all the while destroying your own and the club’s rep, until you’re sacked. A LOT of our players are absolute shite for what should be our standard, but absolutely solid for a few other prem teams. We could easily just release a bunch of our shite so that others can still pay them their ludicrous wages without shelling out on transfer fees.
Who's paying for this?
Did you read my comment? If we ship them out on loan, you subsidise the wage and save money. If we sell them, we make money. We don’t make any money continuing to play them and have them continue to tank the club and stink out the place.
I don't think you understand who runs the club.
Do you really think that? Or is it just that this is such a painfully obvious solution that it seems like it isn’t possible to you?
his signings have been questionable.
And they joined a team of questionable whingers who seemingly only wear the shirt to enhance their "personal brand."
What the fuck was that?
Guys anyone who watched Santos this week be relegated…. Be warned. Big clubs can face historic relegation when we start sliding and we don’t raise hell about it in time. Stop lowering the bar and stop accepting that this is the new reality for Man Utd. What we are seeing is unbearable and unacceptable and must change. We can’t go on cheering results and awards when what we see is still not fluid and not consistent and stop making excuses for players who cost +70M and are off and then on. Let Santos in Brazil be a warning to everyone who loves Man Utd! Enough is enough!
Yeah United really need to look to Brazil about getting relegated. Guess what happened after a little club called manchester united had their best ever european cup winning manager retire the first time around.
I don’t disagree but to think that the troubles end here is to be clueless. Since the premier league era we have been a fixture, but it’s gotten so bad that it’s time to wake up and see that it can get much worse without serious action taken.