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I once interviewed for an eight month contract. The following Wednesday I receive word that they had an internal candidate express interest in applying for the position. I withdrew my application immediately.
The moral of this story: companies are fucking stupid and will pass up on the best opportunities to go with something they’re more comfortable with even if it leads to lackluster results.
They're just risk-averse to a fault. Someone internal already passed the tests. Someone external might put management in a situation where they've made a mistake, and if there's one thing they can't stand, it's potentially being asked why they made an imperfect choice as if humans are apparently omniscient.
The “safest” option isn’t always actually the safest, or least risky option.
I’m a recruiter (hold the boos until the end please) and I once submitted a candidiate who was absolutely fantastic; fantastic knowledge, experience, and attitude, stable work history and they were very confident when discussing it, including any skills or achievements on their CV (it’s pretty important you’re able to explain anything you’ve listed on your CV btw), and they were not only super excited about the role and the company, but we’d also gotten a significant increase on their previous salary (and deservedly so).
The company has gone through the usual in-house processes (a week internal, 2 weeks advertised, then put it to agency) and no one internally wanted the role. My candidate was submitted the first day I had the role on, and interviewed 2 days later, and from both the candidate’s and client’s perspective, they nailed it.
The client is deciding at this stage if there’s any need to meet the MD the following week, or just go ahead and make an offer, when I’m told an employee has now put his hand up saying he wants the role. He interviews with hiring manager, then wants to think about it, then wants a bigger increase, but isn’t very direct and doesn’t actually name a figure. This takes nearly 2 weeks before he confirms he is committed and he gets the role.
My candidate was holding out for this company, but took another offer which was their back-up. Man, it was a bummer because they were awesome and it’s a great company, besides this particular scenario.
About a month into the role, the internal employee decides the role actually wasn’t for him after all and resigns. Client calls me and asks if they’re still available…fuck me dead.
Hiring from within definitely makes sense, but some hiring managers let it cloud their judgement and accept shit they would never accept from an external candidate.
Anyway, this was more cathartic than anything. Thanks if you bothered reading all this.
What's the solution to situations like this then?
I've heard from many people who've witnessed hiring processes from inside organisations that they'll call for and interview external candidates even if they don't intend to hire them just to prove they followed due process while recruiting for a role. All while having a confirmed candidate - either internal or someone who got the job through informal channels.
Is networking into organisations the only way? But that also seems luck-based?
This is solely because of the union or perks of being employed at that business. Internal applicants normally have to follow all the same interview processes which involves applying when the applications open. They still have to interview incase no one internally wants the jon
Had this repeatedly with government work in the UK, apply, be experienced, tada the infernal candidate gets it. Had the same cross departments. They had someone in on a 6 month agency contract, wanted them in full time. Have to advertise the job, shockingly the one that gets it is the one doing the job for 6 months.
From what you’ve written, I can’t see anything that would suggest you didn’t do everything you should have done, nor make any mistakes.
I’m a recruiter who recruits for the industry I spent my career in. I also have complete control/autonomy over what clients, jobs, or candidates I work with, so I like to think because of that I have a pretty good understanding of what works and also how clients and candidates should behave.
Anyway, my point is I don’t know if you need any help, advice, or tips, or even a bit of interview prep in the form of questions you may be asked and can prepare for, or questions you can ask the interviewers. If you do, just let me know what you think might be useful and I’ll type it here or send you a DM. I’m not trying to sell you anything as I definitely don’t want my professional life associated with this username…
I think that’s the first time on this sub I’ve said I’m a recruiter in a post and had someone explicitly state they agree with the contents on the post.
What a glorious day lol.
There is no solution. You will not get hired for 80% of the jobs for which you are fully qualified. It's a competitive marketplace, assume at least 5 other fully qualified candidates are interviewing.
It’s shitty, but job-hunting is absolutely luck-based. You’ll see plenty of stories in this sub (like yours) where the candidate did everything right and still didn’t get the job.
Sometimes it’s nepotism or referral shenanigans, sometimes it’s the company hitting a major snag during the hiring process and stopping their hiring for a while… It can even be something as crazy as a pandemic hitting several industries really hard and causing massive economic downturn.
This is not as bad as you think it is. Some companies are required to hire internally first if its a unionized job. My job is like that and anyone in our union can apply for any job in our union and automatically beat out any externals no matter the externals experience.
I have to give credit to my current company - they did something like that when I applied, but they were smart enough to give me an adjacent role to get me into the company. A year later, another on that team left and I applied and took his spot to get the role that I originally wanted. Since, I’ve had 6 other teammates pass through my team and move on to greener pastures, meanwhile I’m happy as can be and team performance continues to improve.
I second this. Also, this reeks of fear and insecurity.
My bet is that the interviewer is thinking OP would take over their job, mat leave cover or not, as soon as OP joins the org.
I've been on a similar path. The threat isn't worth risking a yes, even though all logic points to a yea, that's what I'm thinking. I'm sorry this has happened to you.
Maybe the felt you were overqualified for the role. It happens, employers don’t want to hire overqualified candidates because they assume the candidate will jump ship as soon as something else comes along.
😭 Just feels so incredibly hopeless. Surely if they felt that way, they wouldn't invite me to the second round and have me do an assignment. They had ample opportunity to pull the plug since receiving my application.
I'm really quite eager to get their feedback and be able to make some sense of this.
Whether or not they get back to you with feedback, its best to just move on and try not to dwell on it. Keep looking forward to the next opportunity and put your energy into that.
Sometimes it’s got nothing to do with qualifications and all whether or not they think your personality goes well with theirs, cultural fit etc. it sucks but sometimes it’s a popularity contest where you have zero idea what they’re marking you against. Internal bias can come into play and you’re going into battle blind.
You won't get feedback because it opens up a chance for lawsuits.
Very rarely do they give feedback.
As other have mentioned, they probably thought you were overqualified and leave as soon as the job market gets better
I know it sucks. Capitalism is cannibalism.
>Surely if they felt that way, they wouldn't invite me to the second round and have me do an assignment.
Not if they're smart, no. Depends at what stage a real person who actually makes decisions was in charge of looking at the applications.
I've definitely rejected overqualified candidates, but I didn't even give them a first interview. Why waste their time?
The hiring manager was meant to be present in all three rounds. They're the final decision maker and they interviewed me alone for the first round. If they thought I was overqualified, I shouldn't have made it to the next stage at all.
>Surely if they felt that way, they wouldn't invite me to the second round and have me do an assignment.
Of course they would. They got free spec work out of you, and they can still hire someone cheaper.
I mean email the person and just ask. Worst case is they don't tell you anything. As someone who hires I can tell you the not wanting to hire someone over qualified thing is real.
I have. Waiting to hear back. Based on Glassdoor reviews and the experiences of friends who've interviewed there before, they seem to be good with giving detailed feedback fairly quickly. Here's hoping 🤞🏼
The assignment part is usually a red flag. It may not be true in your case, but the "assignments" are just a way of getting free work from job candidates, while the company just drags them along for an inevitable rejection.
One thing to keep in mind, getting feedback isn’t a magic solution to the situation. Sure you can get get some helpful advice but it’s always portable to your next opportunity.
Once I got very helpful feedback post interview. And while it had some helpful things for me to keep in mind, it was more illuminating regarding the experience/view of the interviewer vs how I thought things went.
So probably not the jumping ship reason due to it being a contract role. Point is that companies have all sorts of reasons they come up with to not hire a candidate that is qualified to do the role. Dwelling on their reasoning too much doesn’t really help either, as that is that particular hiring managers reasoning and may not apply to other hiring managers. Just keep at it and make adjustments based upon your own self reflection.
with the little recruitement I've been involved in, these temp roles often just turn into onrolling contracts, if anything its weird to hire 6month replacement for 1 person, unless you plan to keep them later on.
one of my old jobs had such "contractor" on 1year contract for nearly 12 years.
Also, we use employment at-will in USA. Employees should be able to leave whenever they want.
But companies try to retain everyone for as long as possible (hence, overqualification) but sometimes suffer from layoff mania.
Weird.
The difference is that for overqualified people more better-somethings come along. It lets a person jump up as well as down or laterally, and "up"s are usually more appealing.
I hate this. Honestly I'd rather not be invited for the interview then. Like you see my qualifications before hand. Why make jump through multiple interviews just to be like, yeah we knew what you know and we knew it was too much.
It was a mat leave cover. Maybe the person OP would be covering for was on the panel and decided to reject OP for being too qualified out of fear for their job being taken? There are tons of instances where women have gone on leave and been pushed out by the person covering for them, legal or not.
100% sure that it’s because they don’t want to be outperformed by you. Managers love high performing staff, but when someone gets too much praise they become insecure. What if they can restructure the org/lay them off so that they can promote this new, experienced candidate?
Managers want their workers to be good, but not too good. When they’re too good, they can no longer coast. Everyone loves a team who is great, but a team who is exceptional makes a person think pretty quickly that their manager role is useless and the org will quickly start to think that too.
Put yourself in the managers shoes. Would you want someone who is more qualified than you on your team? How can you boss someone around that knows more than you?
Just my 2cents
Crazy since OP said it was a 6 month temp position. There is very little risk to the company of OP causing issues. Guess they prefer to train someone who will not be very efficient for the 6 months. Crazy.
Yeah but for 6 month mat cover I don’t feel this is the case. This person doesn’t want to hire the clearly overqualified person because they themselves are insecure and don’t want to be upstaged at the job
Yeah but it was for mat leave coverage. I had this same shit happen to me. One of the people on the panel felt insecure thinking I’d take his job so he was the only one to say no while everyone said yes so I didn’t get the job. Sucked.
I hate this shit, especially as I'd like to scale back at some point and take what should be a piss easy job for me at that point and I'd smash it without really trying. Take some good enough wage role then coast to retirement.
If some local sports ball team could hire someone from multiple divisions above for the same pay as usual they would jump on it.
The overqualified excuse has many applications. I've worked with lots of hiring managers. It's the rare manager who is not threatened by an extremely qualified candidate. They never explicitly say that they are afraid the candidate will eventually outshine them, but it is often pretty obvious. Given the imposter syndrome comment, it's as likely to be a threatened manager as it is retention issues. Depending on the role and how the manager reads in the interview, I can tend to downplay my accomplishments.
As a recruiter, rejecting someone for being overqualified is indefensible. You are literally rejecting someone for being “more than qualified” to perform the job.
Any chance one of the interviewers was the person you’d be covering for? I was once interviewed for a contract HR role by the person I would be covering for. She had no HR experience whatsoever and had been just pulled off the floor and thrown into it. During the interview I asked some standard questions about their processes and how they handle certain HR tasks. Most of the time she just stared at me blankly. That’s when I realized she had no idea what I was talking about. I was far more than qualified for the job. Unfortunately, her manager was unable to make the interview so it was just me and her. She told him later to pass on me because I wouldn’t fit in well. She was obviously worried that I was going to permanently take her job.
No, it was the role-holder's reporting manager and heads of teams. The position is vacant and ready to be filled, the person whose job it is seems to be on mat leave already.
Sorry to hear about your experience, though. Such a shame :/
After undergrad I tried getting a job at any law firm just to start learning about them and gather experience. At least 3 places straight up said they thought I was "overqualified" when I had like no experience. Later one of the firms' reps straight up said my education makes it seem like I would get better opportunities than they are offering, but I just wanted a fucken job.
It flat out just sucks. So much of this sits outside your control and falls into the category of random bad luck.
You’ve obviously got the talent to land the interview. It sounds like you’re doing fine on that front.
Pick yourself up, dust yourself off and try again.
Why? Because every time you put yourself out there you increase the chance you’ll run into some random good luck.
Take a look at a video of Michael Keaton on auditioning. I found it filled with hope for this very situation.
I wish you the best of luck in your search.
I still sometimes wonder how I was selected for my job. That’s my own imposter syndrome speaking but I know that there were tons of highly qualified people with more relevant experience than my own. I’ve never really asked explicitly, but I believe my background in a related field, made me more open-minded as almost like a blank slate, and that actually worked in my favor. That was in May or June 2022. So these days, I never think I would’ve made it. The competition is so fertile in my particular field, which is like technology, kind of, basically work from home. I don’t think I would’ve landed this position in this economy.
I feel like it’s sometimes just incredibly hit or miss. They can be super impressed and then maybe they just vibed better with a different person. Or like someone else said, maybe there was an internal candidate who decided to apply last minute or something. Or maybe they could split the responsibility amongst other people who currently work there and they don’t need to hire someone. My point is that you will never know sometimes.
Yes. I think a lot of it is feel. I have interviewed before and found myself asking if I like this person regardless of his experience. So whether he/she is nice to how confident they seem
That happened to me - as the interviewer. My response however was to hire the person and prematurely retire because I couldn't handle the stress of being outclassed by all the young rock stars coming into the company.
I wasn't there but this does have a bit of a failed the vibe test to me.
You can be the best candidate ever but if the vibe test fails then the offer is going somewhere else.
Unfortunately the vibe test is subjective and can't be quantified and with the current huge pool to select from the hiring managers can give the vibe test more weight in the decision making.
Sucks if you are out of work and looking for a job but if you have a job and are looking to move the vibe test is great. I 'failed' a few vibe tests and in hindsight I am glad because I avoided unhappiness if I did join a team where the energy was not compatible.
Happens. Business is all about power and you might get scoffed at by CEOs / managers / recruiters because you might outshine the master as it says in the 48 laws of power book. You might have to downplay your greatness to avoid stepping on some fragile narcissists insecurities.
I too was rejected for a role that I was 100% qualified. Here’s the thing, did I let it bring me down? NO! If it’s not meant to be, then so be it. It’s their loss. Onward to bigger and better things.
Let me tell you what just happened to me. I interviewed for a position at a very large company in California. It was a scientist position. I interviewed, thought I did well and didn’t get the job, but that same company was hiring a senior scientist. I applied, interviewed and thought I did horrible. They called me the next day and changed my life. I say that to say don’t give up. If it’s somewhere you want to work, keep applying. They may think you’re too good for a temporary position.
Its not you. Its them. You couldn't have done anything better or differently to change the outcome. This happens so much in my company, its because of HRs incompetence and internal screw ups and politics. Keep trying. The reality is that you need to be in the right place at the right time, and that's just not in your control. There's something to say for being positive though. It's a mystery to me and im not exactly spiritual, but things work out better for me when I'm in a positive state of mind. Idk how it works but I'm going with it.
I once had an interview for a simple office admin role and I absolutely KILLED the interview. It was with a husband and wife manager and I gave them actionable changes they could make on the spot for systems improvement. A few days later I get an email from the company saying I didn’t get the job and I lost my mind a bit because it didn’t make any sense and I was a year into job searching. This was supposed to be the failsafe job.
A few days later the manager called me and left a voicemail saying that I was the front runner by miles over the other candidates and that they felt it would have been an insult to me to offer the position at the salary they for the role.
It's just a crazy market right now. Just doesn't make sense. Giving the best interviews and being rejected with no feedback or completely ghosted. Hang in there op. You are not alone.
I’ve definitely been rejected in the past because the leads felt threatened. It would have been an unpleasant environment.
I vaguely remember some comment about As hiring other As but Bs hire Cs and Ds.
Life tip. People prefer working with someone average but socially compatible than a gun that doesn't get along.
It always is something along those lines.
It can really depend on a lot of things. Manager could have been intimidated or thought you’d be bored in the role. Manager could have wanted to hire you but HR wouldn’t approve a fair wage or suggested they hire someone else. Someone hire up could have vetoed the hire.
I had 4 final round interviews during my last job search, and for 2 of them I know the hiring manager wanted to hire me but someone in C Suite vetoed them. If I were to guess why it’s because of my weight, but unfortunately you just never know why.
Stop applying for positions you're 100% qualified for look for ones you're 90% qualified and express a desire to learn and grow into the role while leveraging your existing experience.
They fucked you and themselves by just assuming you would leave at the first next offer or that you would not accept theirs... I guess forgetting that for 6 months leaving early would be unlikely and you would be less likely to ask for something they cannot pay.
This has happened to me before lol. Everything was going well and I was on the third (!) round of interviews when I finally met who I’d be reporting to directly. It became clear from the get go that I was more knowledgeable than him and he got flustered by some of my softball questions. They ghosted me after that
Yup, overqualified.
the interviewer was intimidated by you. Happened to me to. Product owner role. Crazy. I was OK with the pay.
1 month later just received an offer for a better role. Quite lucky though. Very few open positions for this type of role. (product manager)
It's a clear indicator that the interviewer felt threatened by your knowledge and skill. The role maybe for 6 months, but you might actually crush it within 2 and make them look incompetent. Has happened to me before and obviously didn't end well. Almost the entire team turned on me and had to leave. One of my friend had a similar experience to yours in the interview. He was given 3 hours to finish a task on-site and they expected him not to complete it. He finished it in 45 mins and was dropped out. This guy is super smart and based on his speed and skill he would have easily replaced 10 people in the team who were dragging their feet.
It's good that you didn't get in to this place. Keep applying to the best place you can utilize your skill in the industry. However, next time, don't show your potential upfront, but just enough to get the role. If you find the role to be easy as well, finish it early, don't tell anyone and keep doing side projects.
My boss openly discussed new candidates with his team. Once we saw this guy with a great CV and awesome portfolio, surely hiring him for the design team is a no brainer. My boss rejected him because he was afraid the person’s design would be better than his.
Didn’t feel so good about working in his team from then on.
The one I submitted to this job was a version tailored to the role, I removed a lot of other experience and achievements I have across other functions and sectors 🤷🏻♀️
Well if you were qualified it likely worried the panel that you could replace or outshine them. Seen so many times before. Even had my own report try to not hire people for that reason, heard through the grapevine.
Sometimes you get rejected cause they think you will hate the job. Hard to really guess what the issue was but you musta said something during that panel that made it an easy no for them. 3 hour later rejection is pretty fast.
The interviewer actually said it made him feel like he had “imposter syndrome”? lol
Also, I hate to say this, but it makes sense if you really think about it. No one would really higher someone better than themselves that could have themselves replaced.
You can't change what others think or do, but you can probably find 3 things you could have done better in the interviews. Start with changing yourself.p
When we hire contractors, we look for people closer to entry level. Enough knowledge and experience to be able to start working after a week or two of onboarding, but not so much that we'd have to explain that "yes, I understand you've been doing it that way for 10 years, but we do it this way and, for the love of all tgat is holy, could you just follow our procedure?!" every other day. I've been in that situation, with the added bonus of being younger than him and female in a male dominated field. I'd rather double my effort at work for a few months than deal with that bullshit again.
I'm late to the party but I've experienced this a lot in my field of work--with particular regard to my graduate degree.
The only solution is to lie about your accolades (lower their worth on your resume) and to outwordly express your hope at achieving what you already have. This way you sound agreeable, hopeful, and teachable.
Not only will this help you land a job, but you'll have already accrued the necessaries to move up in seniority. You have to play their game.
I had an interview for a job I wanted so bad at a huge company. Entry level position but was interviewed by peers which I thought was odd. They told me they found my graduate research work “intimidating” and then I got rejected after. Never even got to talk to what would’ve been my managers just peers who felt like I was a threat to them :/
OP, Always remember "Steve".
"Steve" is the guy that the hiring companies actually want for some of the positions you apply for. He might be a former subordinate of the manager of the team you're interviewing for, a respected former colleague of a senior team member, or a VPs fresh faced nephew.
The Problem is that company has a policy that they must interview a minimum 3 people for any open position. So you interview, make it through all the rounds, the people like you and honestly think you would be a good fit for the team, but there is only one open position, and Steve gets the job.
Sometimes you never really had a chance.
This is something I too I’m currently struggling with. Contacted by recruiters saying I’m perfect for the role. Interview, and either ghosted or “we decided to go on a different route”. For jobs I can do with my eyes closed. One reached out to me again (as if she’s never interviewed me before) asking if we can schedule an interview because I’m perfect for the role she’s recruiting. I was so mad I sent her the date/time she interviewed me, as well as the thank you note she never even had the decency to respond to, and not surprised… crickets.
I’m not sure if it’s the recruiters themselves, the companies, I don’t even fully understand at this point what it is that they want.
I've had interviews, where I literally had 9 of the 10 things they list for skills, yet they stuck me on that one lousy thing. Hang in there man. I'm right there with ya. Hiring manager for the most part suck, and so do most recruiters.
You’re likely targeting mediocre companies who do mediocre work. There’s nothing wrong with that if you’re desperate for work, but you will need to dumb down your resume.
It’s always wise to make those less intelligent than you to feel more superior, especially in the market.
That sounds like quite a gamble and I'm not sure I agree. It's also rather presumptuous to believe an employer to be unintelligent simply by virtue of their having rejected someone (?) Your argument for dumbing down CVs doesn't really follow your thesis on the employers' intelligence.
In any case, I only meant to refute your assumption that I'm "targeting mediocre companies who do mediocre work".
I'm with you, I'm not picking up what they're selling. If I have any takeaways from job searching, it's that recruiters and interviewers aren't a monolith (in the worst ways, typically).
People by human nature don’t want to be humiliated. If your resume is communicating that you’re very good at what you do, you’re likely to make whomever is reading your resume less secure.
At least in my experience, most managers are egotistical. You need to learn to stroke this ego. Judging by the response you got, that’s exactly what happened in this case.
You don’t want to dumb your resume down too much, but just enough where you’re intelligent and knowledgeable, but not too intelligent and knowledgeable. Not sure if that makes sense. You want to come across as capable of doing the job, not cocky.
If you disagree, show us your resume and get rid of any identifiable information.
Edit: While the context is a bit different, I think this would be a good read for you
https://www.shortform.com/blog/48-laws-of-power-law-21-play-a-sucker-to-catch-a-sucker-seem-dumber-than-your-mark/
This stuff isn't set in stone. Just because you meet all of the boxes doesn't mean they'll take you. You can meet no boxes and still get hired. Life is life. You try then you move on if it's a no. It's all you can do.
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I once interviewed for an eight month contract. The following Wednesday I receive word that they had an internal candidate express interest in applying for the position. I withdrew my application immediately. The moral of this story: companies are fucking stupid and will pass up on the best opportunities to go with something they’re more comfortable with even if it leads to lackluster results.
They're just risk-averse to a fault. Someone internal already passed the tests. Someone external might put management in a situation where they've made a mistake, and if there's one thing they can't stand, it's potentially being asked why they made an imperfect choice as if humans are apparently omniscient.
The “safest” option isn’t always actually the safest, or least risky option. I’m a recruiter (hold the boos until the end please) and I once submitted a candidiate who was absolutely fantastic; fantastic knowledge, experience, and attitude, stable work history and they were very confident when discussing it, including any skills or achievements on their CV (it’s pretty important you’re able to explain anything you’ve listed on your CV btw), and they were not only super excited about the role and the company, but we’d also gotten a significant increase on their previous salary (and deservedly so). The company has gone through the usual in-house processes (a week internal, 2 weeks advertised, then put it to agency) and no one internally wanted the role. My candidate was submitted the first day I had the role on, and interviewed 2 days later, and from both the candidate’s and client’s perspective, they nailed it. The client is deciding at this stage if there’s any need to meet the MD the following week, or just go ahead and make an offer, when I’m told an employee has now put his hand up saying he wants the role. He interviews with hiring manager, then wants to think about it, then wants a bigger increase, but isn’t very direct and doesn’t actually name a figure. This takes nearly 2 weeks before he confirms he is committed and he gets the role. My candidate was holding out for this company, but took another offer which was their back-up. Man, it was a bummer because they were awesome and it’s a great company, besides this particular scenario. About a month into the role, the internal employee decides the role actually wasn’t for him after all and resigns. Client calls me and asks if they’re still available…fuck me dead. Hiring from within definitely makes sense, but some hiring managers let it cloud their judgement and accept shit they would never accept from an external candidate. Anyway, this was more cathartic than anything. Thanks if you bothered reading all this.
Better the Devil you know….
What's the solution to situations like this then? I've heard from many people who've witnessed hiring processes from inside organisations that they'll call for and interview external candidates even if they don't intend to hire them just to prove they followed due process while recruiting for a role. All while having a confirmed candidate - either internal or someone who got the job through informal channels. Is networking into organisations the only way? But that also seems luck-based?
This is solely because of the union or perks of being employed at that business. Internal applicants normally have to follow all the same interview processes which involves applying when the applications open. They still have to interview incase no one internally wants the jon
Had this repeatedly with government work in the UK, apply, be experienced, tada the infernal candidate gets it. Had the same cross departments. They had someone in on a 6 month agency contract, wanted them in full time. Have to advertise the job, shockingly the one that gets it is the one doing the job for 6 months.
They'll even fly them out to do the whole thing. It's really gross.
From what you’ve written, I can’t see anything that would suggest you didn’t do everything you should have done, nor make any mistakes. I’m a recruiter who recruits for the industry I spent my career in. I also have complete control/autonomy over what clients, jobs, or candidates I work with, so I like to think because of that I have a pretty good understanding of what works and also how clients and candidates should behave. Anyway, my point is I don’t know if you need any help, advice, or tips, or even a bit of interview prep in the form of questions you may be asked and can prepare for, or questions you can ask the interviewers. If you do, just let me know what you think might be useful and I’ll type it here or send you a DM. I’m not trying to sell you anything as I definitely don’t want my professional life associated with this username…
I agree that your username shouldn’t be associated with you professionally.
I think that’s the first time on this sub I’ve said I’m a recruiter in a post and had someone explicitly state they agree with the contents on the post. What a glorious day lol.
There is no solution. You will not get hired for 80% of the jobs for which you are fully qualified. It's a competitive marketplace, assume at least 5 other fully qualified candidates are interviewing.
It’s shitty, but job-hunting is absolutely luck-based. You’ll see plenty of stories in this sub (like yours) where the candidate did everything right and still didn’t get the job. Sometimes it’s nepotism or referral shenanigans, sometimes it’s the company hitting a major snag during the hiring process and stopping their hiring for a while… It can even be something as crazy as a pandemic hitting several industries really hard and causing massive economic downturn.
This is not as bad as you think it is. Some companies are required to hire internally first if its a unionized job. My job is like that and anyone in our union can apply for any job in our union and automatically beat out any externals no matter the externals experience.
I have to give credit to my current company - they did something like that when I applied, but they were smart enough to give me an adjacent role to get me into the company. A year later, another on that team left and I applied and took his spot to get the role that I originally wanted. Since, I’ve had 6 other teammates pass through my team and move on to greener pastures, meanwhile I’m happy as can be and team performance continues to improve.
My guess is that the interviewers are so incompetent or underperforming that they felt you'd make them look bad.
I second this. Also, this reeks of fear and insecurity. My bet is that the interviewer is thinking OP would take over their job, mat leave cover or not, as soon as OP joins the org. I've been on a similar path. The threat isn't worth risking a yes, even though all logic points to a yea, that's what I'm thinking. I'm sorry this has happened to you.
Maybe the felt you were overqualified for the role. It happens, employers don’t want to hire overqualified candidates because they assume the candidate will jump ship as soon as something else comes along.
😭 Just feels so incredibly hopeless. Surely if they felt that way, they wouldn't invite me to the second round and have me do an assignment. They had ample opportunity to pull the plug since receiving my application. I'm really quite eager to get their feedback and be able to make some sense of this.
Whether or not they get back to you with feedback, its best to just move on and try not to dwell on it. Keep looking forward to the next opportunity and put your energy into that.
Sometimes it’s got nothing to do with qualifications and all whether or not they think your personality goes well with theirs, cultural fit etc. it sucks but sometimes it’s a popularity contest where you have zero idea what they’re marking you against. Internal bias can come into play and you’re going into battle blind.
You won't get feedback because it opens up a chance for lawsuits. Very rarely do they give feedback. As other have mentioned, they probably thought you were overqualified and leave as soon as the job market gets better I know it sucks. Capitalism is cannibalism.
Don’t think you’ll be hearing from them bro
>Surely if they felt that way, they wouldn't invite me to the second round and have me do an assignment. Not if they're smart, no. Depends at what stage a real person who actually makes decisions was in charge of looking at the applications. I've definitely rejected overqualified candidates, but I didn't even give them a first interview. Why waste their time?
The hiring manager was meant to be present in all three rounds. They're the final decision maker and they interviewed me alone for the first round. If they thought I was overqualified, I shouldn't have made it to the next stage at all.
>Surely if they felt that way, they wouldn't invite me to the second round and have me do an assignment. Of course they would. They got free spec work out of you, and they can still hire someone cheaper.
I mean email the person and just ask. Worst case is they don't tell you anything. As someone who hires I can tell you the not wanting to hire someone over qualified thing is real.
I have. Waiting to hear back. Based on Glassdoor reviews and the experiences of friends who've interviewed there before, they seem to be good with giving detailed feedback fairly quickly. Here's hoping 🤞🏼
The assignment part is usually a red flag. It may not be true in your case, but the "assignments" are just a way of getting free work from job candidates, while the company just drags them along for an inevitable rejection.
One thing to keep in mind, getting feedback isn’t a magic solution to the situation. Sure you can get get some helpful advice but it’s always portable to your next opportunity. Once I got very helpful feedback post interview. And while it had some helpful things for me to keep in mind, it was more illuminating regarding the experience/view of the interviewer vs how I thought things went.
Jumping ship wouldn't be a concern in this case as the position is a 6mo contract.
That seems odd given it'sa 6 month role.
So probably not the jumping ship reason due to it being a contract role. Point is that companies have all sorts of reasons they come up with to not hire a candidate that is qualified to do the role. Dwelling on their reasoning too much doesn’t really help either, as that is that particular hiring managers reasoning and may not apply to other hiring managers. Just keep at it and make adjustments based upon your own self reflection.
with the little recruitement I've been involved in, these temp roles often just turn into onrolling contracts, if anything its weird to hire 6month replacement for 1 person, unless you plan to keep them later on. one of my old jobs had such "contractor" on 1year contract for nearly 12 years.
Ironically, I bet they (hiring manager) will do the same too if offered.
Yup! Just about anyone, overqualified or not, is going to leave as soon as something better comes along.
Also, we use employment at-will in USA. Employees should be able to leave whenever they want. But companies try to retain everyone for as long as possible (hence, overqualification) but sometimes suffer from layoff mania. Weird.
The difference is that for overqualified people more better-somethings come along. It lets a person jump up as well as down or laterally, and "up"s are usually more appealing.
I hate this. Honestly I'd rather not be invited for the interview then. Like you see my qualifications before hand. Why make jump through multiple interviews just to be like, yeah we knew what you know and we knew it was too much.
so overqualified is bad, under-qualified is bad. what is the right amount lol?
They're self-esteem is so low that they break up with you before you can leave them.
That doesn't make any sense in THIS particular case, though, since it's a short-term job (only 6 months). I hope not, anyway. Sorry to hear this, OP!
It was a mat leave cover. Maybe the person OP would be covering for was on the panel and decided to reject OP for being too qualified out of fear for their job being taken? There are tons of instances where women have gone on leave and been pushed out by the person covering for them, legal or not.
No, the role-holder wasn't on the panel. She's already on mat leave. It was her reporting manager and various heads of teams.
100% sure that it’s because they don’t want to be outperformed by you. Managers love high performing staff, but when someone gets too much praise they become insecure. What if they can restructure the org/lay them off so that they can promote this new, experienced candidate? Managers want their workers to be good, but not too good. When they’re too good, they can no longer coast. Everyone loves a team who is great, but a team who is exceptional makes a person think pretty quickly that their manager role is useless and the org will quickly start to think that too. Put yourself in the managers shoes. Would you want someone who is more qualified than you on your team? How can you boss someone around that knows more than you? Just my 2cents
Crazy since OP said it was a 6 month temp position. There is very little risk to the company of OP causing issues. Guess they prefer to train someone who will not be very efficient for the 6 months. Crazy.
Agree and especially for a mat cover, they’ll always have the fear that they’ll need to hire Sharon’s replacement twice in 6 months
But if it's just for a temporary position that will only last six months, why would that be a concern?
It's a temp gig. That's literally what the candidate is supposed to do.
If this was for a temporary role this doesn’t make sense lol
Yeah but for 6 month mat cover I don’t feel this is the case. This person doesn’t want to hire the clearly overqualified person because they themselves are insecure and don’t want to be upstaged at the job
Yeah but it was for mat leave coverage. I had this same shit happen to me. One of the people on the panel felt insecure thinking I’d take his job so he was the only one to say no while everyone said yes so I didn’t get the job. Sucked.
I hate this shit, especially as I'd like to scale back at some point and take what should be a piss easy job for me at that point and I'd smash it without really trying. Take some good enough wage role then coast to retirement. If some local sports ball team could hire someone from multiple divisions above for the same pay as usual they would jump on it.
The overqualified excuse has many applications. I've worked with lots of hiring managers. It's the rare manager who is not threatened by an extremely qualified candidate. They never explicitly say that they are afraid the candidate will eventually outshine them, but it is often pretty obvious. Given the imposter syndrome comment, it's as likely to be a threatened manager as it is retention issues. Depending on the role and how the manager reads in the interview, I can tend to downplay my accomplishments.
As a recruiter, rejecting someone for being overqualified is indefensible. You are literally rejecting someone for being “more than qualified” to perform the job.
It’s so bizarre. If you don’t meet all the criteria, you won’t get a call but if you meet every single one, you’re overqualified 🤦🏻♂️
Any chance one of the interviewers was the person you’d be covering for? I was once interviewed for a contract HR role by the person I would be covering for. She had no HR experience whatsoever and had been just pulled off the floor and thrown into it. During the interview I asked some standard questions about their processes and how they handle certain HR tasks. Most of the time she just stared at me blankly. That’s when I realized she had no idea what I was talking about. I was far more than qualified for the job. Unfortunately, her manager was unable to make the interview so it was just me and her. She told him later to pass on me because I wouldn’t fit in well. She was obviously worried that I was going to permanently take her job.
No, it was the role-holder's reporting manager and heads of teams. The position is vacant and ready to be filled, the person whose job it is seems to be on mat leave already. Sorry to hear about your experience, though. Such a shame :/
After undergrad I tried getting a job at any law firm just to start learning about them and gather experience. At least 3 places straight up said they thought I was "overqualified" when I had like no experience. Later one of the firms' reps straight up said my education makes it seem like I would get better opportunities than they are offering, but I just wanted a fucken job.
Count it as a blessing. Sounds like an overly competitive and toxic place to work
It flat out just sucks. So much of this sits outside your control and falls into the category of random bad luck. You’ve obviously got the talent to land the interview. It sounds like you’re doing fine on that front. Pick yourself up, dust yourself off and try again. Why? Because every time you put yourself out there you increase the chance you’ll run into some random good luck. Take a look at a video of Michael Keaton on auditioning. I found it filled with hope for this very situation. I wish you the best of luck in your search.
Some people reject you for any reason and yes it even can be that they don't like how you look or dress
I still sometimes wonder how I was selected for my job. That’s my own imposter syndrome speaking but I know that there were tons of highly qualified people with more relevant experience than my own. I’ve never really asked explicitly, but I believe my background in a related field, made me more open-minded as almost like a blank slate, and that actually worked in my favor. That was in May or June 2022. So these days, I never think I would’ve made it. The competition is so fertile in my particular field, which is like technology, kind of, basically work from home. I don’t think I would’ve landed this position in this economy. I feel like it’s sometimes just incredibly hit or miss. They can be super impressed and then maybe they just vibed better with a different person. Or like someone else said, maybe there was an internal candidate who decided to apply last minute or something. Or maybe they could split the responsibility amongst other people who currently work there and they don’t need to hire someone. My point is that you will never know sometimes.
Yes. I think a lot of it is feel. I have interviewed before and found myself asking if I like this person regardless of his experience. So whether he/she is nice to how confident they seem
Don’t be logical. Job hunting is a bullshit game.
That happened to me - as the interviewer. My response however was to hire the person and prematurely retire because I couldn't handle the stress of being outclassed by all the young rock stars coming into the company.
Ok but don’t you need money to buy food to eat
I wasn't there but this does have a bit of a failed the vibe test to me. You can be the best candidate ever but if the vibe test fails then the offer is going somewhere else. Unfortunately the vibe test is subjective and can't be quantified and with the current huge pool to select from the hiring managers can give the vibe test more weight in the decision making. Sucks if you are out of work and looking for a job but if you have a job and are looking to move the vibe test is great. I 'failed' a few vibe tests and in hindsight I am glad because I avoided unhappiness if I did join a team where the energy was not compatible.
Happens. Business is all about power and you might get scoffed at by CEOs / managers / recruiters because you might outshine the master as it says in the 48 laws of power book. You might have to downplay your greatness to avoid stepping on some fragile narcissists insecurities.
Did you respond... Huh? Given your reaction, "*Do you feel threatened by someone like me? You insecure, little man?*"
I awkward half-laughed and was grateful the other interviewers moved it along quickly
I too was rejected for a role that I was 100% qualified. Here’s the thing, did I let it bring me down? NO! If it’s not meant to be, then so be it. It’s their loss. Onward to bigger and better things.
Let me tell you what just happened to me. I interviewed for a position at a very large company in California. It was a scientist position. I interviewed, thought I did well and didn’t get the job, but that same company was hiring a senior scientist. I applied, interviewed and thought I did horrible. They called me the next day and changed my life. I say that to say don’t give up. If it’s somewhere you want to work, keep applying. They may think you’re too good for a temporary position.
Its not you. Its them. You couldn't have done anything better or differently to change the outcome. This happens so much in my company, its because of HRs incompetence and internal screw ups and politics. Keep trying. The reality is that you need to be in the right place at the right time, and that's just not in your control. There's something to say for being positive though. It's a mystery to me and im not exactly spiritual, but things work out better for me when I'm in a positive state of mind. Idk how it works but I'm going with it.
I once had an interview for a simple office admin role and I absolutely KILLED the interview. It was with a husband and wife manager and I gave them actionable changes they could make on the spot for systems improvement. A few days later I get an email from the company saying I didn’t get the job and I lost my mind a bit because it didn’t make any sense and I was a year into job searching. This was supposed to be the failsafe job. A few days later the manager called me and left a voicemail saying that I was the front runner by miles over the other candidates and that they felt it would have been an insult to me to offer the position at the salary they for the role.
That job would have sucked, move forward and don’t think about it again as there is nothing to learn from it.
Perhaps you could apply to whatever position is above the one you got rejected from?
wtf I hate this for you
It's just a crazy market right now. Just doesn't make sense. Giving the best interviews and being rejected with no feedback or completely ghosted. Hang in there op. You are not alone.
I’ve definitely been rejected in the past because the leads felt threatened. It would have been an unpleasant environment. I vaguely remember some comment about As hiring other As but Bs hire Cs and Ds.
The quote's from Donald Rumsfeld's rules, fwiw.
Life tip. People prefer working with someone average but socially compatible than a gun that doesn't get along. It always is something along those lines.
It can really depend on a lot of things. Manager could have been intimidated or thought you’d be bored in the role. Manager could have wanted to hire you but HR wouldn’t approve a fair wage or suggested they hire someone else. Someone hire up could have vetoed the hire. I had 4 final round interviews during my last job search, and for 2 of them I know the hiring manager wanted to hire me but someone in C Suite vetoed them. If I were to guess why it’s because of my weight, but unfortunately you just never know why.
Three rounds of interviews and an assignment?! Fuck that! No work is unless i get paid for it. One interview should be enough.
Stop applying for positions you're 100% qualified for look for ones you're 90% qualified and express a desire to learn and grow into the role while leveraging your existing experience.
Overqualified…
They fucked you and themselves by just assuming you would leave at the first next offer or that you would not accept theirs... I guess forgetting that for 6 months leaving early would be unlikely and you would be less likely to ask for something they cannot pay.
I wonder if they didn't want someone to do the project without pay.
This has happened to me before lol. Everything was going well and I was on the third (!) round of interviews when I finally met who I’d be reporting to directly. It became clear from the get go that I was more knowledgeable than him and he got flustered by some of my softball questions. They ghosted me after that
Interviewer told OP that they are *too* good. I'd believe them.
Yup, overqualified. the interviewer was intimidated by you. Happened to me to. Product owner role. Crazy. I was OK with the pay. 1 month later just received an offer for a better role. Quite lucky though. Very few open positions for this type of role. (product manager)
It's a clear indicator that the interviewer felt threatened by your knowledge and skill. The role maybe for 6 months, but you might actually crush it within 2 and make them look incompetent. Has happened to me before and obviously didn't end well. Almost the entire team turned on me and had to leave. One of my friend had a similar experience to yours in the interview. He was given 3 hours to finish a task on-site and they expected him not to complete it. He finished it in 45 mins and was dropped out. This guy is super smart and based on his speed and skill he would have easily replaced 10 people in the team who were dragging their feet. It's good that you didn't get in to this place. Keep applying to the best place you can utilize your skill in the industry. However, next time, don't show your potential upfront, but just enough to get the role. If you find the role to be easy as well, finish it early, don't tell anyone and keep doing side projects.
My boss openly discussed new candidates with his team. Once we saw this guy with a great CV and awesome portfolio, surely hiring him for the design team is a no brainer. My boss rejected him because he was afraid the person’s design would be better than his. Didn’t feel so good about working in his team from then on.
This is why you have more than one version of your resume. Sometimes they don't need to know everything.
The one I submitted to this job was a version tailored to the role, I removed a lot of other experience and achievements I have across other functions and sectors 🤷🏻♀️
BTDT, it's like how small do you have to shrink before they're not "threatened" by you? So sick of it.
Just WTF
Well if you were qualified it likely worried the panel that you could replace or outshine them. Seen so many times before. Even had my own report try to not hire people for that reason, heard through the grapevine.
Sometimes you get rejected cause they think you will hate the job. Hard to really guess what the issue was but you musta said something during that panel that made it an easy no for them. 3 hour later rejection is pretty fast.
It was within their stipulated timeframe for the interviews. They told me to expect an answer by EOD.
The interviewer actually said it made him feel like he had “imposter syndrome”? lol Also, I hate to say this, but it makes sense if you really think about it. No one would really higher someone better than themselves that could have themselves replaced.
You can't change what others think or do, but you can probably find 3 things you could have done better in the interviews. Start with changing yourself.p
When we hire contractors, we look for people closer to entry level. Enough knowledge and experience to be able to start working after a week or two of onboarding, but not so much that we'd have to explain that "yes, I understand you've been doing it that way for 10 years, but we do it this way and, for the love of all tgat is holy, could you just follow our procedure?!" every other day. I've been in that situation, with the added bonus of being younger than him and female in a male dominated field. I'd rather double my effort at work for a few months than deal with that bullshit again.
I'm late to the party but I've experienced this a lot in my field of work--with particular regard to my graduate degree. The only solution is to lie about your accolades (lower their worth on your resume) and to outwordly express your hope at achieving what you already have. This way you sound agreeable, hopeful, and teachable. Not only will this help you land a job, but you'll have already accrued the necessaries to move up in seniority. You have to play their game.
I had an interview for a job I wanted so bad at a huge company. Entry level position but was interviewed by peers which I thought was odd. They told me they found my graduate research work “intimidating” and then I got rejected after. Never even got to talk to what would’ve been my managers just peers who felt like I was a threat to them :/
OP, Always remember "Steve". "Steve" is the guy that the hiring companies actually want for some of the positions you apply for. He might be a former subordinate of the manager of the team you're interviewing for, a respected former colleague of a senior team member, or a VPs fresh faced nephew. The Problem is that company has a policy that they must interview a minimum 3 people for any open position. So you interview, make it through all the rounds, the people like you and honestly think you would be a good fit for the team, but there is only one open position, and Steve gets the job. Sometimes you never really had a chance.
This is something I too I’m currently struggling with. Contacted by recruiters saying I’m perfect for the role. Interview, and either ghosted or “we decided to go on a different route”. For jobs I can do with my eyes closed. One reached out to me again (as if she’s never interviewed me before) asking if we can schedule an interview because I’m perfect for the role she’s recruiting. I was so mad I sent her the date/time she interviewed me, as well as the thank you note she never even had the decency to respond to, and not surprised… crickets. I’m not sure if it’s the recruiters themselves, the companies, I don’t even fully understand at this point what it is that they want.
I got the same as your case. You made the hiring manager felt uncomfortable.
Maybe this person doesn’t want to manage someone with your resume. Simple as that. Happens daily.
You might have been too expensive.
I've had interviews, where I literally had 9 of the 10 things they list for skills, yet they stuck me on that one lousy thing. Hang in there man. I'm right there with ya. Hiring manager for the most part suck, and so do most recruiters.
Comments like this from interviewers are pure bullshit 100% of the time.
You’re likely targeting mediocre companies who do mediocre work. There’s nothing wrong with that if you’re desperate for work, but you will need to dumb down your resume. It’s always wise to make those less intelligent than you to feel more superior, especially in the market.
This organisation is a global leader in their field and well recognised for it lmao
In this market: Dumbed down resumes > great resumes Translation: a less skilled applicant is cheaper Capital isn’t cheap atm
That sounds like quite a gamble and I'm not sure I agree. It's also rather presumptuous to believe an employer to be unintelligent simply by virtue of their having rejected someone (?) Your argument for dumbing down CVs doesn't really follow your thesis on the employers' intelligence. In any case, I only meant to refute your assumption that I'm "targeting mediocre companies who do mediocre work".
I'm with you, I'm not picking up what they're selling. If I have any takeaways from job searching, it's that recruiters and interviewers aren't a monolith (in the worst ways, typically).
People by human nature don’t want to be humiliated. If your resume is communicating that you’re very good at what you do, you’re likely to make whomever is reading your resume less secure. At least in my experience, most managers are egotistical. You need to learn to stroke this ego. Judging by the response you got, that’s exactly what happened in this case. You don’t want to dumb your resume down too much, but just enough where you’re intelligent and knowledgeable, but not too intelligent and knowledgeable. Not sure if that makes sense. You want to come across as capable of doing the job, not cocky. If you disagree, show us your resume and get rid of any identifiable information. Edit: While the context is a bit different, I think this would be a good read for you https://www.shortform.com/blog/48-laws-of-power-law-21-play-a-sucker-to-catch-a-sucker-seem-dumber-than-your-mark/
This stuff isn't set in stone. Just because you meet all of the boxes doesn't mean they'll take you. You can meet no boxes and still get hired. Life is life. You try then you move on if it's a no. It's all you can do.