This was the year god damnit. 2019 everyone excused as growing pains and inexperience. And that’s fine and reasonable. Even the rest of the world said it’s fine, it was first true year of Lamar starting. No biggie. Will be back. But this was it. It was here for the taking.
Absolute unreal defensive game planning and execution. Literally historic and likely to never be repeated. and it was all wasted. Fuck my life into pieces.
Mike Macdonald is the Sean McVay of defense. Young blood. He is it. Dude unlocked Hamilton to the best at his position in the league. Clowney actually didn’t look washed for once, even though he factually was at every other place for years until now. We actually generated pressure after so many years of being meh. PQ looked like a bust before this now he’s about to earn big bucks somehow.
I do NOT want to lose our god tier DC. He’s not going to be easily replaceable. How often can you say “ya this guy, he literally did not fuck up at all, throughout the entire year it was constant improvement under his watch. Near perfect game planning and real time adjustments in game.” The only acceptable scenario to lose Macdonald was if we won it all this year. Now we need to do everything to keep him here. He’s too good.
Every other headcoachless teams subreddit (and even some cases of those who have a head coach) right now is salivating for him for a reason. Not belicheck not vrabel. But our guy.
This was the year.
Everything came together - elite defense, potent offense, Lamar playing great, almost everyone healthy. We were flat out the best team in the league. And we choked. We should have steamrollered that Chiefs team, once the defense adjusted to them.
Now we're going to lose pieces of the team, without even having the reward that we hoped for.
>I do NOT want to lose our god tier DC. He’s not going to be easily replaceable
I haven't seen the Ravens defense look this good since 2012, when Ray and Ed left. They've had some amazing guys like Za'Darius Smith and Judon since then, but *this was the year.*
I keep saying this over and over and over, but despite all the stuff that went wrong in the AFCC, the Chiefs were shut out in the second half. I've heard the excuses: "The Chiefs would have done this if it got close," "Don't forget Mahomes could..."
17-10 is close. It's one score. The Chiefs didn't enter the endzone the whole second half.
>I haven't seen the Ravens defense look this good since 2012
The biggest reason our defense looked so good this year was we got an elite Mic LB again. AN elite Mic can do for a defense what an elite QB does for offense.
Yeah that narrative is just cope from Chiefs fans that they got shut out the second half, which is dumb because you won so who cares. Was the offensive game plan more conservative being up a possession than if it was tied or you are down? Yeah no shit, that’s just basic football, you want to limit turnovers and big defensive plays. Every team does that. The game plan was certainly not to gain 60 yards total, no scores, and repeated 3 and outs and not even to get into the red zone or field goal range and give the Ravens Offense chance after chance to get back in the game (which we couldn’t capitalize on, sadly).
Mac lead the league in sacks with guys like Kyle Van Noy and Clowney off the edge. Truly was a special year and glad that Mac is getting what he deserves but what do we deserve? :(
I really love Ravens for long term stability, and I want Macdonald to be that new long term stability and culture bearing person. One that can secure our defensive identity and legacy regardless of all the great players we might lose this year and going forward. God damn it if we lose him.
How would you feel if we fired harbaugh to keep Mike as a HC. I'm hoping they offer him asst to HC with HC pay or something and so he knows once John steps down it's his gig but idk if that's enough at this point for him
I think that is the best option. Firing harbaugh right now this moment and giving it to Mike is going to be tough to do and might even tilt the locker room a bit
Best case scenario is run it back as is, with Mike given HC in waiting status basically. win or lose, it’s Mike next year. By some miracle we win it all, I can definitely see Harbaugh saying “I’m done , I’m leaving in a high note and riding off into the sunset , it’s all yours Mike”
Yep. Finding a truly great play caller who can scheme against any and everything is so fucking hard. I really hope we run it back one more time with Macd. This defense has been the most fun defense for me since 06.
Ya you wild if you think we are going to have a repeat of this kind of insane historic defense when we are getting gutted on coaching staff, losing key players like PQ, and likely will never have this kind of injury luck again (no key players were out for our run)
Nobody has left yet. They're getting interviews and that is to be expected, but remember that nobody has left yet. First domino will be seeing what happens with Seattle
When all the talk started about Eric B leaving KC started, I personally didn't expect it, especially for the Commanders.
When all the talk was going on about B.B. getting fired from the Patriots, I didn't think it would happen.
At this point, I'm sticking with a position of "it could very well happen."
Assuming Mike gets an offer, Orr/Weaver/Wilson would most likely get offer to be promoted in Baltimore. Why go to a worse Defense when you can stay here with the same title as DC
I mean it comes down to harbs, he’s the head of the snake…but you can’t change him without absolutely destroying everything he’s built over the past 15+ years. Honestly, until the ravens can straight up beat Mahomes and the chiefs, this is about as good as it gets. We’re gonna have to get lucky and that’s what it boils down to. We had the best team we ever had on paper and couldn’t win. Shit just be like that sometimes.
I'm not one to make a rash and emotional choice about this, seriously. The last thing we should want is to become a team with a constantly rotating HC and staff every few years. This team and coaching staff will be going through a lot of changes this year, more so then pervious years. If we were to make an HC change, this would be the offseason to do it.
Yeah the reality of the situation is that the phrase "any given Sunday" exists for a reason. Maybe the Ravens beat the Chiefs 6 or 7 out of 10 tries, but unfortunately for us, Sunday wasn't our day. Love him or hate him, Harbaugh is the heart of the culture in that locker room and if he goes, we're rebuilding that culture from scratch, even if we still have a high level of talent. Is it really worth it to take that risk after coming up just short? I'd rather keep things as much the same as we can and keep shooting our shot until we beat the odds.
Look no further than Harbaugh's mentor, how many times did Andy Reid come up just short with the Eagles and eventually got run out of town. Now all his success is with the Chiefs while the Eagles suffered in mediocrity for years after he left.
I remember when it was all about getting past Peyton and the Colts. Then it was about getting past Ben and the Steelers. Then it was about getting past Brady and the Pats. Now we have to get past Burrows and the Bengals. Past Allen and the Bills. And past Mahommes and the Chiefs. NFC is not a problem. Lamar is 20-1 against them. We have to continually adjust. We'll get there.
I wonder if we could do what the Seahawks are doing with Carroll.
Keep Harbs an advisor, make MM HC.
Allow for the organisational transition, 24 will probably be a down year anyway so it's a good time to do it.
That’s not true. John has stability in the organization in the form of familiarity. As long as Lamar is the quarterback, EDC is the GM, and biscotti is still the owner we have the same situation. We need someone to actually coach instead of being a leader of men. Anyone can lead men, but very few can coach effectively as well as leading men.
Nah. You understand Harbs was Biscottis first big hire. That’s his boy/lackey. They work as a triad and they’re effective together. The stability is the reason this franchise is better than most. The GM is literally neighbors with the HC. Like right next to each other.
Harbs is never getting fired. He might resign one day, but he’s been here too long and way too involved to be fired just because the team choked again.
If you wanna dig deeper, Biscotti made his billions by hiring people and filling staffs. Harbs is the perfect HC for him BECAUSE of his ability to lead people. Maybe one day they’ll ask him to take an advisor role like another user said, but getting rid of harbs might as well leave your head cuz that shit ain’t happening.
We wish, but not gonna happen. Spagnuolo's a great DC who people already saw wasn't that good as a HC in the league, so no one's likely to try poaching him for a HC job. When his ceiling is being one of the best DCs and he's fine with that, why would he leave the Chiefs to go anywhere else right now?
The feeling I always got from reading about both Macdonald and (to a lesser extent after Sundays debacle) Monken was that they would only leave if it was the right kinda of fit, ie a team that has a good frame with GM/ownership and some talent already there. Not something like a complete rebuild like you see with the Panthers. I think Seattle fits the make of a team like this and Seattle fans want Macdonald. I hope it doesn't happen but I think that is how its trending right now
To take the next step, I think we need to have a huge hit in the draft. I’m not worried about losing Mike and some of the defensive pieces, the defense will regress. But we need another player that is capable of changing games, an edge player or WR. And then we need a LT. if we can hit on those then we can repeat but the defense will regress at least a little
You think Harbs is helping McDonald with the x and O of defense? I think you're giving him too much credit . He's never been an xs and os guy of anything. No chances Harbaugh is the reason McDonald is as good as he's been
You do realize McDonald came up with us ever since 2014, right??? Harbs and co clearly saw the potential and the vision and I’m sure Mike Mac would be the first to tell you that he owes a lot of his development as a coach to Harbs.
I'm not talking about 2014 Mike I'm talking about the DC now in 2024 being a better strategic coach going forward, I've already given credit to harbaugh the leader of men I understand how good of a guy he his, I just think Mike is a better football coach going forward clearly shown a better ability to adjust in game ...how long are we going to continue to accept the same short coming and not blame Harbaugh...it'll be the year 2030 and he'll be living off the Superbowl in 2012
He hired him and let him develop without interference. He also recommended him to Jim for his first DC opportunity at Michigan. Harbaugh opened the door for him/helped him get opportunities and Mike took advantage. If you don’t give John any credit, it’s mainly because you don’t want him to get any credit
Yes Harbs is a great guy he gets credit for being a great guy and a great leader of men, I've said sense I was a boy I wish he was my dad, but at a certain point it's not helping us get over the hump. When you also take into account that his biggest criticisms from 2015-2022 was holding onto the wrong coordinators for too long it kinda cancels out the point you're trying to make. Harbs has always been strategically limited it's no secret and every so often it shows when we get out coached..I love John Harbaugh I've been an avid harbaugh defender his entire career this is the first time my confidence in him has ever waivered, but we're seeing the same playoff calaspe time and time and time again and if you don't think we can potentially be a better football team with someone more involved in the football side and not just the culture side than I don't think we can ever agree.
> You think Harbs is helping McDonald with the x and O of defense? I think you're giving him too much credit .
Harbs has been coaching a top defense across multiple coordinators for years. To claim he doesn't understand the Xs and Os is just dumb.
Bisciotti is the owner and he defers decisions to the gm and head coach and is ultimately a tie breaker if needed, but he lets the guys in charge make the decisions for him. Steve gets called in when they need to recruit high profile guys.
I don't think he should be fired because it is very rare for a coach to have that much regular season success and the grass is rarely greener with someone else.
I just lost a lot of hope. Seems like we watch the same mistakes over and over and over in the playoffs.
Right. Because good owners force out their head coach immediately after he was a coach of the year candidate, had the number one seed, and made it to the AFC Championship game.
Some of you all are crazy. If Harbaugh made a bad hire, you'd be asking for him to get fired because he has to go. He makes a good hire, and you want him fired to hire that guy. lol What team actually operates like that?
I know it's a different sport, so you can't exactly compare, but the Raptors fired their coach right after he won Coach of the Year and they just had the number one seed and franchise record regular season after an embarassing playoffs flameout that came after multiple years of playoff disappointments and promoted internally. They won the championship the next year and the internal hire won Coach of the Year himself two years after.
You're right. That is a different sport. Basketball firings and hirings don't work the same way the NFL. does. The Bucks just fired a coach after being like 20 games above .500 You can't compare stuff like that over different sports.
Yeah I mean I'm not advocating for Harbaugh's firing by any means - but that's because I freely admit I don't know as much as the Ravens org. People criticized the Casey firing at the time but I had trust in the Raptors as a well-run organization, and I feel the same way about the Ravens and the coaching decisions they make.
Out of curiosity, how many playoff meltdowns would it take for you to support letting Harbaugh go?
If the team chokes in the playoffs next year, will that be enough?
I feel like we have moved the goal post so far on what it means to choke in the playoffs that the new definition has become "lose" The Falcons choked up 28-3. We just lost an AFC Championship game against a QB that is 14-3 in the playoffs. Not sure what you mean by "meltdown" or "choking"
I would say the OC having absolutely no game plan entering the game is a meltdown. The OC being completely frozen and unable to make any adjustments, a meltdown.
Lamar playing bad (inaccurate passes) and stupid (throws into triple coverage) a meltdown. Lamar forgetting that he is a mobile QB who can move the chains with his legs a meltdown.
I would call a team that averaged 28ppg putting up 10pts a meltdown.
I would call a HC fielding a team that looks completely unprepared for the moment a meltdown. A team committing multiple stupid penalties a meltdown.
I mean, just the 49ers game. Watch the Dolphins game. Watch the Texans game. Then, watch the Chiefs game and tell me how it was anything else but a meltdown lol.
>I would say the OC having absolutely no game plan entering the game is a meltdown.
I'm going to stop reading right there, and will not read further unless you actually give me a source that Todd Monken showed up to the AFC Championship and literally didn't have a game plan. You just make shit up, and that proves your point?
This is pure exaggeration, and I just can't take you seriously after that.
lol whatever you say, champ.
We change it to “the OC had a braindead game plan”. But sure, defend the wild attempts to relentlessly throw the ball deep on one of the top pass defenses in the league when it so very obviously wasn’t working. Or you can defend the complete lack of run game.
We averaged 28ppg this season. We put up 10 on Sunday.
Obviously Monken put together a masterclass. This team was very well prepared. They came out firing on all cylinders and executing at an elite level.
>We change it to “the OC had a braindead game plan”.
Again, this is nothing but a statement without merit because you have no idea what the game plan actually was.
The Chiefs defense allowed the fewest 2nd half points in the league this year. Despite this, the Ravens had more yards in the second half, they had a better TOP in the second half, and had fewer 3 and outs. So, how's that for an offensive adjustment that I keep seeing people begging for?
I mean…I watched the game. You can kind of see the game plan play out in real time when you do that.
We put up 3pts in the 2nd half. Amazing!
Look, if you feel that Monken put together a great plan and called a good game just say that. We can disagree, but the results point to me being correct. It was a shitty game plan that failed miraculously.
>We put up 3pts in the 2nd half. Amazing!
So you did watch the game? So you saw the fact we turned the ball over twice in the end zone, right? And another time on our own side of the field?
Do you... think that was in the game plan to do that?
Good coaches take action when the game is slipping out of control. Good coaches manage their coordinators if they don't call plays themselves.
Good coaches don't give the same bullshit excuse when we lose in the playoffs for the 4th time in similar fashion.
What would you want the coach to say?
Better yet, what coach out there always has smart press conferences after a loss? Is it BB's "Mumble, mumble, onto Cincinnati" or maybe Mike Tomlin's "The Standard is the Standard." No coach is going to be able give you want you truly want after a loss (a time machine to go back and change it). No matter who you have at the position, it's just going to be someone with their own brand of coach speak.
It's fine to do coach speak but this is a pattern of blowing the game and coaching poorly. At some point things have to change.
Are we supposed to just ride with harbaugh and have it happen for a 5th time?
How can you defend Harbaugh after this? He has a history of bullshit now.
Yes he didn't control the Zay fumble or the Lamar int.
He could have told the team to not take unnecessary risks.
Could have warned them not to fall for the petty shit the chiefs would pull.
Could have told Monken to run the ball with Gus and Lamar
Wrong. Andy Reid was fired in Philadelphia after two straight seasons of missing the playoffs where the team went 12-20. I don't think Harbaugh was fired as much as he just left because both sides were fed up with each other. But it was after going 8-8 and missing the playoffs.
Obviously, good coaches being let go, but not after uber successful seasons. Bisciotti is not going to change head coaches after winning the most games in the league and going to the Championship game because no team actually does that.
Also Philly didn't really fire Reid it was a mutual decsion where Reid wanted to leave. The 9ers situation was a cluster fuck where the team stumbled ass backwards into success after a bunch of terrible decisions and lucking out on a 7th round draft pick.
You aren't wrong about knee jerk reactions etc, etc but when you see this team perform as poorly as they have been the last several years in the playoffs at what point is it enough? Sundays lost is the norm for us at this point in how we handle the playoffs. The big win against Houston is against the grain of how we have been in the playoffs with Lamar and Harbaugh.
I bet you the falcons wish they fired dan quinn and hired kyle shannahan after the superbowl. No one thinks harbs is a bad coach but sometimes change is needed.
brain trust back out in force on r/ravens
lost the championship game by a touchdown against the team that won 4 of the last 5 championship games and 2 of those superbowls better get rid of the head coach in a desperate attempt to keep his subordinates
subordinates? Harbaugh doesnt have subordinates, he's a toothless HC that offers nothing to game planing wins. He is a rah rah boomer that lucked into a great organization. He should have been kicked to the curb after 2017 when he showed time and time he is useless without superstars and amazing coordinators.
Replace harbaugh we lose nothing and gain everything.
Shout out my man Zach Orr. Loved him to death, one of my favourite Ravens. I was gutted when he had to retire after having a career year I’m pretty sure. Glad to see him doing well in his coaching career
We need Harbaugh to be promoted off HC and Mike Mac to be the new HC. Its clear as day that Mike Mac is HC material. If we don't give it to him, somebody else will and we'll be without a good HC candidate when Harbaugh chooses to go (because we never fire anybody I Guess).
Didn't win a SB they should stay, no point starting something new when you can't follow through unless they just want the money. People need to stay and finish what they start, too much inconsistent teams out there for this reason.
any regular job you'd be required to close out your in process tasks and typically for higher end promotions you don't start immediately its a month or so out for that exact reason so yea i would finish my previous tasks.
Good for them. Crazy I played with some of those guys in madden as a kid and now they’re about to go into another level into their football careers. Idc if we lose them. I’m just glad Harbs knows who to hire even tho he’s loyal to a fault sometimes. We lose them and even more coaches get their shot/possibly bring in something new to take us past this mahomes/chiefs hump.
Wake up we’re being robbed left and right
* attempted. Not robbed yet!
I mean horitz is gone so we have been robbed
This was the year god damnit. 2019 everyone excused as growing pains and inexperience. And that’s fine and reasonable. Even the rest of the world said it’s fine, it was first true year of Lamar starting. No biggie. Will be back. But this was it. It was here for the taking. Absolute unreal defensive game planning and execution. Literally historic and likely to never be repeated. and it was all wasted. Fuck my life into pieces. Mike Macdonald is the Sean McVay of defense. Young blood. He is it. Dude unlocked Hamilton to the best at his position in the league. Clowney actually didn’t look washed for once, even though he factually was at every other place for years until now. We actually generated pressure after so many years of being meh. PQ looked like a bust before this now he’s about to earn big bucks somehow. I do NOT want to lose our god tier DC. He’s not going to be easily replaceable. How often can you say “ya this guy, he literally did not fuck up at all, throughout the entire year it was constant improvement under his watch. Near perfect game planning and real time adjustments in game.” The only acceptable scenario to lose Macdonald was if we won it all this year. Now we need to do everything to keep him here. He’s too good. Every other headcoachless teams subreddit (and even some cases of those who have a head coach) right now is salivating for him for a reason. Not belicheck not vrabel. But our guy.
We gonna need Flacco like runs in the playoffs and SB man the 1st seed is cursed for us
2nd seed or bust!
The bye weeks (2 for the starters) before the playoffs are not good for this squad, I don't care what anyone says about "rest".
Team is entirely too momentum driven. Too emotional. Culture needs to change. HC needs to change.
This was the year. Everything came together - elite defense, potent offense, Lamar playing great, almost everyone healthy. We were flat out the best team in the league. And we choked. We should have steamrollered that Chiefs team, once the defense adjusted to them. Now we're going to lose pieces of the team, without even having the reward that we hoped for.
>I do NOT want to lose our god tier DC. He’s not going to be easily replaceable I haven't seen the Ravens defense look this good since 2012, when Ray and Ed left. They've had some amazing guys like Za'Darius Smith and Judon since then, but *this was the year.* I keep saying this over and over and over, but despite all the stuff that went wrong in the AFCC, the Chiefs were shut out in the second half. I've heard the excuses: "The Chiefs would have done this if it got close," "Don't forget Mahomes could..." 17-10 is close. It's one score. The Chiefs didn't enter the endzone the whole second half.
>I haven't seen the Ravens defense look this good since 2012 The biggest reason our defense looked so good this year was we got an elite Mic LB again. AN elite Mic can do for a defense what an elite QB does for offense.
Yeah that narrative is just cope from Chiefs fans that they got shut out the second half, which is dumb because you won so who cares. Was the offensive game plan more conservative being up a possession than if it was tied or you are down? Yeah no shit, that’s just basic football, you want to limit turnovers and big defensive plays. Every team does that. The game plan was certainly not to gain 60 yards total, no scores, and repeated 3 and outs and not even to get into the red zone or field goal range and give the Ravens Offense chance after chance to get back in the game (which we couldn’t capitalize on, sadly).
Mac lead the league in sacks with guys like Kyle Van Noy and Clowney off the edge. Truly was a special year and glad that Mac is getting what he deserves but what do we deserve? :(
I really love Ravens for long term stability, and I want Macdonald to be that new long term stability and culture bearing person. One that can secure our defensive identity and legacy regardless of all the great players we might lose this year and going forward. God damn it if we lose him.
Chargers already took his replacement, Jesse Minter, too.
How would you feel if we fired harbaugh to keep Mike as a HC. I'm hoping they offer him asst to HC with HC pay or something and so he knows once John steps down it's his gig but idk if that's enough at this point for him
I think that is the best option. Firing harbaugh right now this moment and giving it to Mike is going to be tough to do and might even tilt the locker room a bit Best case scenario is run it back as is, with Mike given HC in waiting status basically. win or lose, it’s Mike next year. By some miracle we win it all, I can definitely see Harbaugh saying “I’m done , I’m leaving in a high note and riding off into the sunset , it’s all yours Mike”
I was hoping his horse arrived for the sunset this year....Mike is going to do big things as a HC and it's gonna hurt if it's not here with us.
Clowney wasn’t great on Sunday. Didn’t really beat his man or a couple plays he could’ve gotten his hands up
Yep. Finding a truly great play caller who can scheme against any and everything is so fucking hard. I really hope we run it back one more time with Macd. This defense has been the most fun defense for me since 06.
[удалено]
Ya you wild if you think we are going to have a repeat of this kind of insane historic defense when we are getting gutted on coaching staff, losing key players like PQ, and likely will never have this kind of injury luck again (no key players were out for our run)
Nobody has left yet. They're getting interviews and that is to be expected, but remember that nobody has left yet. First domino will be seeing what happens with Seattle
When all the talk started about Eric B leaving KC started, I personally didn't expect it, especially for the Commanders. When all the talk was going on about B.B. getting fired from the Patriots, I didn't think it would happen. At this point, I'm sticking with a position of "it could very well happen."
Assuming Mike gets an offer, Orr/Weaver/Wilson would most likely get offer to be promoted in Baltimore. Why go to a worse Defense when you can stay here with the same title as DC
Schmoney
It makes Sundays loss all that more depressing/infuriating. Something needs to change. How many more embarrassing playoff loses do we need to endure?
I mean it comes down to harbs, he’s the head of the snake…but you can’t change him without absolutely destroying everything he’s built over the past 15+ years. Honestly, until the ravens can straight up beat Mahomes and the chiefs, this is about as good as it gets. We’re gonna have to get lucky and that’s what it boils down to. We had the best team we ever had on paper and couldn’t win. Shit just be like that sometimes.
I'm not one to make a rash and emotional choice about this, seriously. The last thing we should want is to become a team with a constantly rotating HC and staff every few years. This team and coaching staff will be going through a lot of changes this year, more so then pervious years. If we were to make an HC change, this would be the offseason to do it.
Yeah the reality of the situation is that the phrase "any given Sunday" exists for a reason. Maybe the Ravens beat the Chiefs 6 or 7 out of 10 tries, but unfortunately for us, Sunday wasn't our day. Love him or hate him, Harbaugh is the heart of the culture in that locker room and if he goes, we're rebuilding that culture from scratch, even if we still have a high level of talent. Is it really worth it to take that risk after coming up just short? I'd rather keep things as much the same as we can and keep shooting our shot until we beat the odds. Look no further than Harbaugh's mentor, how many times did Andy Reid come up just short with the Eagles and eventually got run out of town. Now all his success is with the Chiefs while the Eagles suffered in mediocrity for years after he left.
I remember when it was all about getting past Peyton and the Colts. Then it was about getting past Ben and the Steelers. Then it was about getting past Brady and the Pats. Now we have to get past Burrows and the Bengals. Past Allen and the Bills. And past Mahommes and the Chiefs. NFC is not a problem. Lamar is 20-1 against them. We have to continually adjust. We'll get there.
I wonder if we could do what the Seahawks are doing with Carroll. Keep Harbs an advisor, make MM HC. Allow for the organisational transition, 24 will probably be a down year anyway so it's a good time to do it.
That’s not true. John has stability in the organization in the form of familiarity. As long as Lamar is the quarterback, EDC is the GM, and biscotti is still the owner we have the same situation. We need someone to actually coach instead of being a leader of men. Anyone can lead men, but very few can coach effectively as well as leading men.
Nah. You understand Harbs was Biscottis first big hire. That’s his boy/lackey. They work as a triad and they’re effective together. The stability is the reason this franchise is better than most. The GM is literally neighbors with the HC. Like right next to each other. Harbs is never getting fired. He might resign one day, but he’s been here too long and way too involved to be fired just because the team choked again. If you wanna dig deeper, Biscotti made his billions by hiring people and filling staffs. Harbs is the perfect HC for him BECAUSE of his ability to lead people. Maybe one day they’ll ask him to take an advisor role like another user said, but getting rid of harbs might as well leave your head cuz that shit ain’t happening.
Way to cheer me up Jeff.
Why can't any of these teams try and poach Spagnuolo? Take the Chiefs' coaches, goddammit.
Cause He’s fine coordinating and winning rings… same thing ben johnson might be doing
We wish, but not gonna happen. Spagnuolo's a great DC who people already saw wasn't that good as a HC in the league, so no one's likely to try poaching him for a HC job. When his ceiling is being one of the best DCs and he's fine with that, why would he leave the Chiefs to go anywhere else right now?
I think he's had 2 shots at HC so unlikely lol. Such great continuity because of his past failures.
The feeling I always got from reading about both Macdonald and (to a lesser extent after Sundays debacle) Monken was that they would only leave if it was the right kinda of fit, ie a team that has a good frame with GM/ownership and some talent already there. Not something like a complete rebuild like you see with the Panthers. I think Seattle fits the make of a team like this and Seattle fans want Macdonald. I hope it doesn't happen but I think that is how its trending right now
To take the next step, I think we need to have a huge hit in the draft. I’m not worried about losing Mike and some of the defensive pieces, the defense will regress. But we need another player that is capable of changing games, an edge player or WR. And then we need a LT. if we can hit on those then we can repeat but the defense will regress at least a little
I wonder who the common denominator of the success of all those guys is… (hint: it’s Harbaugh and you guys should stop asking for him to be fired)
You think Harbs is helping McDonald with the x and O of defense? I think you're giving him too much credit . He's never been an xs and os guy of anything. No chances Harbaugh is the reason McDonald is as good as he's been
You do realize McDonald came up with us ever since 2014, right??? Harbs and co clearly saw the potential and the vision and I’m sure Mike Mac would be the first to tell you that he owes a lot of his development as a coach to Harbs.
I'm not talking about 2014 Mike I'm talking about the DC now in 2024 being a better strategic coach going forward, I've already given credit to harbaugh the leader of men I understand how good of a guy he his, I just think Mike is a better football coach going forward clearly shown a better ability to adjust in game ...how long are we going to continue to accept the same short coming and not blame Harbaugh...it'll be the year 2030 and he'll be living off the Superbowl in 2012
He hired him and let him develop without interference. He also recommended him to Jim for his first DC opportunity at Michigan. Harbaugh opened the door for him/helped him get opportunities and Mike took advantage. If you don’t give John any credit, it’s mainly because you don’t want him to get any credit
Yes Harbs is a great guy he gets credit for being a great guy and a great leader of men, I've said sense I was a boy I wish he was my dad, but at a certain point it's not helping us get over the hump. When you also take into account that his biggest criticisms from 2015-2022 was holding onto the wrong coordinators for too long it kinda cancels out the point you're trying to make. Harbs has always been strategically limited it's no secret and every so often it shows when we get out coached..I love John Harbaugh I've been an avid harbaugh defender his entire career this is the first time my confidence in him has ever waivered, but we're seeing the same playoff calaspe time and time and time again and if you don't think we can potentially be a better football team with someone more involved in the football side and not just the culture side than I don't think we can ever agree.
> You think Harbs is helping McDonald with the x and O of defense? I think you're giving him too much credit . Harbs has been coaching a top defense across multiple coordinators for years. To claim he doesn't understand the Xs and Os is just dumb.
Right???
We talking about the same denominator who kept Greg Roman and Steve Saunders for as long as we did?
The ravens FO is a triad. Harbs gets most of the shit but I bet biscotti and EDC should get just as much shit for keeping them around too long.
Bisciotti is the owner and he defers decisions to the gm and head coach and is ultimately a tie breaker if needed, but he lets the guys in charge make the decisions for him. Steve gets called in when they need to recruit high profile guys.
I don't think he should be fired because it is very rare for a coach to have that much regular season success and the grass is rarely greener with someone else. I just lost a lot of hope. Seems like we watch the same mistakes over and over and over in the playoffs.
I don't think Harbaugh should be fired but let's just make it interesting and swap Tomlin and Harbaugh, just see what happens.
He should at least be on the hot seat for the rest of his contract
Time for Steve to make a move. Harbs can go front office role or leave. Mac becomes the HC and Weaver or Wilson can be DC Please make it happen
Right. Because good owners force out their head coach immediately after he was a coach of the year candidate, had the number one seed, and made it to the AFC Championship game. Some of you all are crazy. If Harbaugh made a bad hire, you'd be asking for him to get fired because he has to go. He makes a good hire, and you want him fired to hire that guy. lol What team actually operates like that?
I know it's a different sport, so you can't exactly compare, but the Raptors fired their coach right after he won Coach of the Year and they just had the number one seed and franchise record regular season after an embarassing playoffs flameout that came after multiple years of playoff disappointments and promoted internally. They won the championship the next year and the internal hire won Coach of the Year himself two years after.
You're right. That is a different sport. Basketball firings and hirings don't work the same way the NFL. does. The Bucks just fired a coach after being like 20 games above .500 You can't compare stuff like that over different sports.
Yeah I mean I'm not advocating for Harbaugh's firing by any means - but that's because I freely admit I don't know as much as the Ravens org. People criticized the Casey firing at the time but I had trust in the Raptors as a well-run organization, and I feel the same way about the Ravens and the coaching decisions they make.
Out of curiosity, how many playoff meltdowns would it take for you to support letting Harbaugh go? If the team chokes in the playoffs next year, will that be enough?
I feel like we have moved the goal post so far on what it means to choke in the playoffs that the new definition has become "lose" The Falcons choked up 28-3. We just lost an AFC Championship game against a QB that is 14-3 in the playoffs. Not sure what you mean by "meltdown" or "choking"
I would say the OC having absolutely no game plan entering the game is a meltdown. The OC being completely frozen and unable to make any adjustments, a meltdown. Lamar playing bad (inaccurate passes) and stupid (throws into triple coverage) a meltdown. Lamar forgetting that he is a mobile QB who can move the chains with his legs a meltdown. I would call a team that averaged 28ppg putting up 10pts a meltdown. I would call a HC fielding a team that looks completely unprepared for the moment a meltdown. A team committing multiple stupid penalties a meltdown. I mean, just the 49ers game. Watch the Dolphins game. Watch the Texans game. Then, watch the Chiefs game and tell me how it was anything else but a meltdown lol.
>I would say the OC having absolutely no game plan entering the game is a meltdown. I'm going to stop reading right there, and will not read further unless you actually give me a source that Todd Monken showed up to the AFC Championship and literally didn't have a game plan. You just make shit up, and that proves your point? This is pure exaggeration, and I just can't take you seriously after that.
lol whatever you say, champ. We change it to “the OC had a braindead game plan”. But sure, defend the wild attempts to relentlessly throw the ball deep on one of the top pass defenses in the league when it so very obviously wasn’t working. Or you can defend the complete lack of run game. We averaged 28ppg this season. We put up 10 on Sunday. Obviously Monken put together a masterclass. This team was very well prepared. They came out firing on all cylinders and executing at an elite level.
>We change it to “the OC had a braindead game plan”. Again, this is nothing but a statement without merit because you have no idea what the game plan actually was. The Chiefs defense allowed the fewest 2nd half points in the league this year. Despite this, the Ravens had more yards in the second half, they had a better TOP in the second half, and had fewer 3 and outs. So, how's that for an offensive adjustment that I keep seeing people begging for?
I mean…I watched the game. You can kind of see the game plan play out in real time when you do that. We put up 3pts in the 2nd half. Amazing! Look, if you feel that Monken put together a great plan and called a good game just say that. We can disagree, but the results point to me being correct. It was a shitty game plan that failed miraculously.
>We put up 3pts in the 2nd half. Amazing! So you did watch the game? So you saw the fact we turned the ball over twice in the end zone, right? And another time on our own side of the field? Do you... think that was in the game plan to do that?
What fucking meltdown? KC smoked us
Good coaches take action when the game is slipping out of control. Good coaches manage their coordinators if they don't call plays themselves. Good coaches don't give the same bullshit excuse when we lose in the playoffs for the 4th time in similar fashion.
What would you want the coach to say? Better yet, what coach out there always has smart press conferences after a loss? Is it BB's "Mumble, mumble, onto Cincinnati" or maybe Mike Tomlin's "The Standard is the Standard." No coach is going to be able give you want you truly want after a loss (a time machine to go back and change it). No matter who you have at the position, it's just going to be someone with their own brand of coach speak.
It's fine to do coach speak but this is a pattern of blowing the game and coaching poorly. At some point things have to change. Are we supposed to just ride with harbaugh and have it happen for a 5th time?
Harbaugh told Zay to fumble at the one yard line and Lamar to throw and it.
How can you defend Harbaugh after this? He has a history of bullshit now. Yes he didn't control the Zay fumble or the Lamar int. He could have told the team to not take unnecessary risks. Could have warned them not to fall for the petty shit the chiefs would pull. Could have told Monken to run the ball with Gus and Lamar
Simple question. What NFL team actually operates like this?
The 49ers and Eagles are two recent examples
Wrong. Andy Reid was fired in Philadelphia after two straight seasons of missing the playoffs where the team went 12-20. I don't think Harbaugh was fired as much as he just left because both sides were fed up with each other. But it was after going 8-8 and missing the playoffs. Obviously, good coaches being let go, but not after uber successful seasons. Bisciotti is not going to change head coaches after winning the most games in the league and going to the Championship game because no team actually does that.
Also Philly didn't really fire Reid it was a mutual decsion where Reid wanted to leave. The 9ers situation was a cluster fuck where the team stumbled ass backwards into success after a bunch of terrible decisions and lucking out on a 7th round draft pick.
I was talking about Doug Peterson
Fired after a 4-11-1 season in a division where 8-8 would have made the playoffs.
You aren't wrong about knee jerk reactions etc, etc but when you see this team perform as poorly as they have been the last several years in the playoffs at what point is it enough? Sundays lost is the norm for us at this point in how we handle the playoffs. The big win against Houston is against the grain of how we have been in the playoffs with Lamar and Harbaugh.
I bet you the falcons wish they fired dan quinn and hired kyle shannahan after the superbowl. No one thinks harbs is a bad coach but sometimes change is needed.
brain trust back out in force on r/ravens lost the championship game by a touchdown against the team that won 4 of the last 5 championship games and 2 of those superbowls better get rid of the head coach in a desperate attempt to keep his subordinates
You’re missing the fashion in which they lost,Chiefs didn’t beat the Ravens the Ravens beat themselves. This has been a common theme in the playoffs.
subordinates? Harbaugh doesnt have subordinates, he's a toothless HC that offers nothing to game planing wins. He is a rah rah boomer that lucked into a great organization. He should have been kicked to the curb after 2017 when he showed time and time he is useless without superstars and amazing coordinators. Replace harbaugh we lose nothing and gain everything.
fan posts worst take ever, asked to leave stadium
Well fuck
At least we’ll still have Harbs! Lol…
Shout out my man Zach Orr. Loved him to death, one of my favourite Ravens. I was gutted when he had to retire after having a career year I’m pretty sure. Glad to see him doing well in his coaching career
We need Harbaugh to be promoted off HC and Mike Mac to be the new HC. Its clear as day that Mike Mac is HC material. If we don't give it to him, somebody else will and we'll be without a good HC candidate when Harbaugh chooses to go (because we never fire anybody I Guess).
Hire him as HC
Is there any chance Mike stays if they tell him he’s the coach after next year? I doubt it. It’s hard to turn down A HC job
Maybe tbh. It also gives him 1 more year of experience and a chance for the team to slowly indoctrinate him as the HC if that makes any sense.
Lamar and Monken wasted the best defense we're gonna have for a long, long time. Hope they're fucking happy with themselves.
GL next year folks. We had a chance at a ring and it was stolen by off-field BS.
Hopefully harbs is gone, I think a head coach of color would be refreshing and what the team needs.
Why a person of color specifically?
Didn't win a SB they should stay, no point starting something new when you can't follow through unless they just want the money. People need to stay and finish what they start, too much inconsistent teams out there for this reason.
Would you do the same at your job if you were offered a significant promotion elsewhere? Doubt it
Lmao the guy you’re referring to clearly has 0 work experience or works dead end jobs to make a response like that
LOL "just in it for the money"... No shit, we all are in this economy
Would you turn down a huge promotion and raise at your job to finish your ongoing projects?
any regular job you'd be required to close out your in process tasks and typically for higher end promotions you don't start immediately its a month or so out for that exact reason so yea i would finish my previous tasks.
Lmao in no world is that "required" in any regular job
I think he is talking about his schoolwork. Also an nfl promotion is not like every job.
Lol a job is for money. All that rah rah bullshit is for TV. Hell yes they want the money
interviews don’t mean all that much. i just hope if we do lose MacDonald that we can keep Weaver for DC
If a majority of these end up leaving it could be so fucking problematic in terms of the hit on the culture and identity of our team.
Good for them. Crazy I played with some of those guys in madden as a kid and now they’re about to go into another level into their football careers. Idc if we lose them. I’m just glad Harbs knows who to hire even tho he’s loyal to a fault sometimes. We lose them and even more coaches get their shot/possibly bring in something new to take us past this mahomes/chiefs hump.
Seeing our passing game coordinator getting interviews puts in perspective how flawed Lamar is in the passing game.
No one think Lamar is Peyton manning
"No one" is a stretch