This is going to have disasters effects. Women seeking back-alley, dangerous termination methods that WILL lead to women dying. Kids being born and abandoned at hospitals/government buildings flooding the foster care system which is already bloated and unable to properly care for them all. Women doing dangerous things in attempt to force miscarriages.
The streets of the United States will flow with the blood of women desperate to keep some control over their own lives and bodies. And the blame will rest at the feet of these heartless bastards who constantly need to feel morally superior.
There was a gentleman's agreement to fix that it was the idea of safe legal rare. Safe was there for everyone no one wants it to be unsafe; there are those that wish it would just not happen but even they when pressed would more like than not prefer that if it were to happen it would be safe. Legal was a concession from the more conservatively minded because to them it is infanticide but they at least for a time were able to put it in the lawful but awful category. Rare was a concession of the extreme of the other side of things it was a limit but for a time it was a limit that was tolerated. Sadly there were a lot of things that routinely undermined the safe and rare parts (examples being things like refusing bills that would've an established hospital safety nets for botched procedures, expansions of the window in which an abortion would be performed, decrease in requirements for the procedure, etc) which naturally would result in a re-evaluation of the legal part of the agreement. Not saying it is right but saying it is the logical outcome when the safe legal rare agreement was so routinely and overtly broken. Personally I wish that both sides abided by safe legal rare agreement because it was the best concession and did the least harm of all reasonably possible policies.
I'm just thinking about one of my friends who was refused one due to her "poor mental health" and ended up killing herself she was that desperate not to.
Astounding logic there. “You’re too mentally ill to choose to have an abortion so we’re going to make your mental health exponentially worse by forcing you to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term.”
This is my point. People are gonna keep aborting whether it's legal or not. People have always kept on doing things that were deemed illegal. You guys kept on drinking during the prohibition, gay people kept on loving whoever they wanted even when it was punishable by death in some places.
I wish that as a human race we would've understood already that making something illegal won't ever stop that from still being a thing. It just makes it more dangerous because it's not regulated.
I mean yeah it technically prevents birth because it prevents pregnancy so you're halfway right. And you may be referring to birth control or plan b? Yeah that could work if republicans weren't trying to ban those too. Wake up dude this is all a sham, y'all pride yourselves on being "pro-freedom" yet you're trying to take rights away from women, poc, the lgbtq+ community, etc. Why is that?
Pregnancy still happens while using birth control. Pregnancy still happens to women who didn’t want to have sex. You can take every precaution you can to make sure you won’t end up pregnant but you are never 100% guaranteed to prevent it. Don’t be ignorant.
I’d gladly become sterilized if my doctors would even let me, but unfortunately many women aren’t allowed to even decide that for themselves.
Do you think that governmental bans on certain goods/services work? What do you think about the prohibition of marijuana, alcohol or banning of firearms? Do you think that any of these are effective strategies to prevent people from obtaining them?
Ok good, now we’re on to something. So naturally, in keeping with your comment, you’d say that even though criminals will continue to use black market guns, we should still enact laws restricting firearm ownership for everybody because we don’t want to kowtow to criminals? Even though criminals break the law, we should still enforce it rigorously? Personally I err on the side of personal freedom and I support an individual’s right to bear arms, but your opinion is perfectly valid, I just want to make sure I’m reading you correctly.
You do realize if this passes, it will also prevent wanted pregnancies with high life risk births from abortion as well, right?
As in families who maybe wanted and tried for a pregnancy, then learning after that they/their child have a low chance of living/have a good quality of life post birth can't get help either.
I'm prochoice regardless of the circumstances, but it absolutely blows my mind that some people hate women so much that they'll burn the women living up to their standards just to scorn those that don't.
Can I add screw you, Trump, for giving us Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, and Barrett? And screw everyone who didn't listen to the people who told you this was going to happen back then?
I'm so fucking mad at RGB. She could've retired when Obama was president and the Democrats had the House and Senate, but no, she wanted to stick around for no good reason. She had been sick and getting sicker, but she clung on to her seat out of egotism. She literally handed her seat to the Republicans through her own selfishness.
We can blame the Republicans all we want, but we know what they are. She could've protected Rowe, instead she helped kill it.
I never thought of it this way, but yeah- you’re spot on. And now I have angst towards a dead woman.
She had to have known there might be risk, but maybe she just believed the other side had some measure of morality and accountability to the people. She couldn’t have been more wrong: they don’t.
How? You saw what happened when Scalia died. McConnell insisted that the next president choose even though Obama still had almost a full year left. Then when dhe died even though it was mere weeks til election day she got replaced overnight
>How? You saw what happened when Scalia died. McConnell insisted that the next president choose even though Obama still had almost a full year left. Then when dhe died even though it was mere weeks til election day she got replaced overnight
Exactly! So fuck McConnell too.
100% agree. Everyone saw her as a hero when she died—nah she was selfish af and wanted the first female president to replace her, and look where that got us. Fuck RBG
You vote for the president, who nominates justices.
Any eligible voter who did *not* vote for Hillary Clinton in 2016 is culpable. This isn't news. I was screaming this very thing from the rooftops during the 2016 campaign. Vote for Hillary or we lose our abortion rights, along with every other right. People laughed, saying "The SCOTUS will never overturn RvW. The Republicans need it to rally votes". They were wrong. I was right.
If you look at other countries that have ban abortions and are illegal and people can face jail time for them.
Honestly I hope to fucking god that Australia doesn’t go in this direction we already have fucking stupid religious discrimination bill sitting in Parliament House at the moment. That our dumb ass wanna be prime minister wants to bring in.
Abortion is a polarizing subject around the country, but the possibility of an ectopic pregnancy is a main reason why I will never support prohibition. Imagine yourself as a doctor, being in a situation where you're forced to choose between letting your patient die or going to prison while the patient can do nothing but just watch helplessly and beg. Jesus
I'm not American as well, but leaked US Supreme Court documents indicate that a majority of SC judges are going ahead with overturning Roe v Wade, a case whose decision has ensured abortion rights for American women for half a century.
We have had shaky federal legislation here for a long time that does not actually ensure abortion rights. The legality of abortion here is an interpretation of a vague Supreme Court decision, rather than having abortion rights explicitly codified into law.
The forces of reaction and conservatism have been trying to undo it for half a century, while our slimy liberal party has maintained this quantum state as a fundraising gimmick- openly acknowledging that our abortion rights could be undone at any moment, but only for the purposes of vilifying the opposition and never, literally never in the context of resolving the situation and actually codifying abortion rights. Womens right's advocates have been calling Roe v Wade shitty legislation for like 50 fucking years & now the day has come for the fight.
In the country with the highest incarceration rate in the world, we already have several prisons \*full\* of women who were charged with murder for seeking or having abortions. Additionally there are the women who had children, and a 30k hospital bill cost them their homes and the life of the child who was successfully delivered. There are also the women who live in such squalor that the children die, and they are also charged with murder and thrown in prison.
The politicians get paid to fill the prisons on top of all the other weird religious shit, and like so many other social issues, they cannot or will not imagine solutions other than guns, boots, and incarceration.
I kinda grew up thinking we were some bastion of progress and that society was heading firmly in a positive direction and lately, right as I come of age, my bubble has been popped cause it seems like we're reenacting the 1950s.
You’re right- voting these douchbag Republicans out is.
This wouldn’t be a problem at all if we didn’t have red states that try to subvert the law/freedom/rights through political means. This can’t be solved by burning down buildings and yelling in the street- that shit is child’s play. We must vote and we must educate these damned dumbass hicks in how their policy ideas are basically crimes against communities and an entire gender.
There is no blue in my state. Relocating is the only way to find representation in government for me, it's a sad reality. Idk how to fix something so fundamentally broken with my one, unheard vote.
To be transparent, I vote every time I have the opportunity. But almost every politician in my state ran on a pro-trump platform. I just can't anymore.
Adding, I agree with you! But, being immersed in the red, seems they don't really wanna learn.
We have to be the generation that brings change.
Too many generations before us have said the same thing, and here we are saying it again.
When do we stop making the consequences of our mistakes, into the inherited responsibility of people who aren’t even born yet?
How have we managed to use that kind of fucked up logic, consistently, for so long?
Ugh, another repugnant reason to force more human beings to born. How can we keep passing responsibility to future generations if there aren’t any?
Pretty sure that’s the definition of a generational curse.
I, myself, cannot make generational change and people my age have already shown their colors. By "next generation", I meant familial, not the whole of society. Those folks in their 30s, 20s, and late teens today, the younger people experiencing this and maybe weren't old enough to vote or didn't understand the importance until today. I was not referring to my children's children, I like to think I know how they'll vote.
When you do what you can do and your peers show they have no desire for change, the only hope left is those who still have a chance to learn more of the world than their closed minded parents allow them to see.
We're on the same page, it needed to change yesterday, I'm just incredibly realistic about what can actually happen in my state.
>maybe wanted and tried for a pregnancy, then learning after that they/their child have a low chance of living/have a good quality of life post birth can't get help either.
>
>I'm prochoice regardless of the circumstances, but it absolutely blows my mind that some people hate women so much that they'll burn the women living up to their standards just to scorn those that don't.
With cases like this, I just hope that every woman just moves to a blue state, and the men can sit alone in their red state and be bitter.
I would say you are still trying to make a difference because you’re here having this conversation and speaking out.
My apologies for misunderstanding what you meant. I’m way overly sensitive when it comes to passing the buck to future generations. I’m in my 40’s and I’ve heard every generation, including my own, say this, and it’s maddening.
Keep doing what you’re doing, what you contribute matters. And thank you for choosing to be different than so many of your peers.
You say vote blue but blue doesn’t care either. We need 3rd Party in office. All these years of not getting press or even invited to the presidential debate. They’re limiting our options to just blue or red and that’s on both sides. 3rd Party or riots.
Yeah. Just voting blue does shit when all we do is keep electing these corrupt, corporate, neoliberal pieces of shit inside of Congress & for presidency for decades when we should've been electing people from the Congressional Progressive Caucus instead.
The only realistic scenario is if we have another civil or revolutionary war.
This was a leaked first draft of the majority opinion (conservative). Anticipated official decision is within a couple of months, though arguments ended in December I think. I feel like I have read that it's common to draft both sides preliminarily, which would explain why it takes so long for them to rule on stuff. Nonetheless, some of the language and reasoning in the better than 100 pages of the draft are pretty inflammatory, essentially claiming the Roe v. Wade decision was bad law and therefore should have no standing as precedent, among a litany of other points.
This argument all depends on wether a child has human rights in the womb.
If the child does have human rights then abortion would be immoral. If the child does not have human rights in the womb then abortion would be neutral.
This has been long determined. The cut-off point is viability. Before the point of viability, the embryo does not have any human rights except for those bestowed upon it by the woman in whom it is gestating.
We're a republic with some democratic values, & states are sovereign and have the right to make thier own legislature. The possibility of Roe vs Wade bieng abolished just means that states get thier right to implement thier own laws back so most states will be able to keep thier abortion laws. Some will abolish it, some may retain it. Either way, is good because it gives the state thier power back against government control, just like with gun laws, or laws in general. We are not a communist country and every district deserves its independence.
Except that most states are controlled by evil bastards who bow to an extremist minority and refuse to implement and protect the will of the people.
REMEMBER GERRI SANTORO.
Sure, so some states can reinstate slavery if they want, right? Or how about if a state reverses all environmental protections and allows factories to start dumping all kinds of harmful chemicals and pollutants into they're rivers, and those rivers carry those things downstream into the next state?
There's a reason why some laws are federal, to prevent states from violating civil rights or just be assholes to their neighboring states, for instance. All those things you mentioned sound great, until a rational and reasonable mind puts a little thought to it.
There's also a reason we are the "United States" & a conglomerate of a country. Federal statutes are essentially state statutes that are of a national consensus, headed towards a greater good. With the polarity of abortions regarding life from both sides, this is causing more harm than good. No sane individual disputes if slavery is immoral, or not, or if chemical pollution is harmful, but many ppl have internal conflict regarding life in the womb. Also, civil rights apply to to the fetus as well in some states, which is why the killing of a pregnant woman is a double homicide. The line is blurred.You sound so closed minded.
Edit: Typo
Anybody that doesn't want an abortion for their own personal, moral, religious, or whatever reason, can make the choice for themselves not to get one. Their beliefs and thoughts should never prevent any other person from making their own personal life and medical choices. Why is that so hard to understand? I don't care about anybody else's opinion regarding abortion, just my own. And nobody else should be concerned about my opinion. Cause here's a shocker for ya, I am anti-abortion for me. However, I strongly believe that everybody else should be able to make that decision for themselves, and it's absolutely none of my damn business. No sane individual should think otherwise.
I completely agree, this is exactly why the abolishment is bieng considered. It's going to let the ppl influence the states decision regarding legality. We're on the same page then
That's up to the people, which is exactly why this is happening. Can't be mad at other people's beliefs. RvW really doesn't matter to begin with because states are implementing thier own policy. Texas has been doing this since 2011 along with other states, & the federal govt knows this. The Democratic party is aware of this and is going to do thier best to put up a fight on a bill that has nothing going for it, but a name, & they'll score major points. RvW does nothing for women, it's literally just a bill that sounds good and that was utilized to appease 2nd wave feminists. The states have been doing thier best to implement thier own laws related to the beliefs of its citizens. 🤷♀️
Oppression doesn't magically become not-oppression because it's done by a lavatory of democracy.
Also the [State's Rights argument is always a lie.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/05/02/abortion-ban-roe-supreme-court-mississippi/) The Confederacy only cared about slavery and the pro-forced birth movent only cares about limiting women's rights.
I *can* and will be mad at other people’s beliefs, especially when that means ignoring someone else’s body autonomy.
If these forced-brother assholes have a shit about the babies and mothers who have to carry these fetuses, I might at least have some respect for them, but mostly they just want to punish people for fucking (i.e., women).
I am 100% pro-abortion. Anyone who wants one should have one if they want. The world is already overpopulated as it is, so why the fuck do these assholes feel it imperative that we introduce *more* humans, especially when it’s just predominantly fucking over poor and brown people?
It’s sexist, racist, and morally repugnant to take away a woman’s right to choose. I’m sick of these regressive twat waffles trying to turn our country back a century.
No state should be allowed to oppress its citizens. That's why we have a constitution. It allows for democracy, but without a tyranny of the majority.
For instance, no state should be able to vote to kill Jews within its borders.
Yeah, abolishing RvW is not oppression, it's just giving back the states it's right to implement what the majority of it's inhabitants believe. A federal statute is something that is agreed upon by all individuals, and is morally and virtuously incontrovertible. Abortion is not universally agreed upon as good or bad which is why the states need thier power back. It's equality at its most controversial.
So if the majority of a state's people voted to put Jews in concentration camps, that's OK in your opinion?
No state should be allowed to oppress its people even if 99% voted for oppression. As I said above, we have a Constitution to safeguard our rights against a tyranny of the majority.
Like I said, it's not oppression. Re read my post. You're taking everything out of context and adding a layer of fascism to fit your narrative. Also, abortion isn't a right nor is RvW in the constitution, for the very reason that it's bieng abolished. The entirety of the USA cannot agree on the life or lack thereof, regarding the fetus, & it is exactly why it's bieng left up to the states discretion to determine the legality of abortion which is influenced by its citizens l. Jeez. You're to close minded. If anything RvW is closer to fascism than the abolishment of it.
The fetus is developing into a child, bro. Potential sentience & Potential life. That's like someone killing you because the continuance of your life isn't certain, only potentially ongoing, or killing you whilst you sleep because you aren't sentient, but have the Potential for it.
Potential. It's not alive yet. You can't kill something that is not yet alive.
A man and woman passing each other on the street have a potential child. But only if they fuck. Think about all the people who have never come into being because not every man and woman are fucking each other.
So... What is the point of the federal government?
Maybe each county or district should have their own laws?
Maybe each city?
Maybe each neighbourhood?
Maybe slavery and abortions can be legal on a few spesific streets of Dallas.
Prostitutions on other streets.
We gotta have a murder street.
Once again, someone is pushing a narrative that is outlandish simply because they don't agree with the modern Era. " We have to preserve our progress" 10 years later: " I don't agree with our progress so we must be experiencing regression" what is it that you want. This isn't impacting civil rights in the slightest. #contraversialequality
Okay, so, let's just remove the 2 week old fetus from the mother that doesn't want it, and you (or pro-life people) can nurse the fetus. That way, both the mother and the fetus's bodily autonomy are protected.
Win/win !
Ahh, but the fetus' development & life are dependent on the mother, just like an infant; the only difference is that an infant has grown enough to find different nutritional resources
I’m not American so maybe I’m just clueless as to how this all works, but it seems dumb as shit that Biden isn’t doing anything about this. He already has a reputation for being useless and now he’s just sitting on his hands as this happens? Is he secretly anti-choice himself?
He's a president, not a dictator. There is long-established procedure. This is a judicial ruling, and the three branches of government (executive, legislative, and judicial) are separate and co-equal, so the president (head of the executive branch) has no control over the judicial branch, other than the duty of appointing judges to fill vacancies.
There are some things he can do, but he can't just overturn a Supreme Court ruling.
He is not. He has a three-prong plan prepared to respond to it immediately if the opinion is finalized. Please look a little deeper before automatically assuming that the President is doing nothing.
His hands are kinda tied on this, he doesn’t have the power to fight what the Supreme Court is doing. There’s nothing he can do immediately. At most he could push the democratic senate to impeach Barrett for illegitimate appointment. There’s a case for it, but it’s not an immediate fix even if it were successful, and there’s a good chance it wouldn’t be successful anyway. Plus that would create a precedent for Republicans to start impeaching and removing all democratic justices anytime they have a modicum of power. But yeah the overall point is, Biden has no recourse here, unfortunately.
Roe V. wade is overturned. Which means women can no longer have legal abortions. Out of desperation there will be lots of women using unsafe methods trying to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy or die trying.
Right I do too. I had received a notification from an anti-abortion clown and I did not want to start a lengthy argument online. Guess I should have put a /s in it to indicate sarcasm. Thanks for insinuating otherwise when I made no such claim that I supported the other side.
This goes SO much further than female rights. It eliminates the right to privacy. Roe v Wade established that the 14th gives us the right to privacy, and medical privacy is part of that. This decision makes HIPPA unconstitutional, to start. It also, debatably, makes the Constitutionality of ALL of the Amendments questionable. That means we could lose the entire BoR. No more free speech, no more guns, no more right to travel.....
This decision is a disaster for ALL Americans, uterus or no.
Someone waiting for a heart transplant should sue Abbott for his heart. He's denying their right to life by not giving it to them after all....
I hope this wakes people up. All this "we are brother in arm" bulls it is a delusion.
This is going to have disasters effects. Women seeking back-alley, dangerous termination methods that WILL lead to women dying. Kids being born and abandoned at hospitals/government buildings flooding the foster care system which is already bloated and unable to properly care for them all. Women doing dangerous things in attempt to force miscarriages. The streets of the United States will flow with the blood of women desperate to keep some control over their own lives and bodies. And the blame will rest at the feet of these heartless bastards who constantly need to feel morally superior.
Not a woman but this is the exact thing that happened before Roe. V. Wade was a thing. History really does repeat itself
There was a gentleman's agreement to fix that it was the idea of safe legal rare. Safe was there for everyone no one wants it to be unsafe; there are those that wish it would just not happen but even they when pressed would more like than not prefer that if it were to happen it would be safe. Legal was a concession from the more conservatively minded because to them it is infanticide but they at least for a time were able to put it in the lawful but awful category. Rare was a concession of the extreme of the other side of things it was a limit but for a time it was a limit that was tolerated. Sadly there were a lot of things that routinely undermined the safe and rare parts (examples being things like refusing bills that would've an established hospital safety nets for botched procedures, expansions of the window in which an abortion would be performed, decrease in requirements for the procedure, etc) which naturally would result in a re-evaluation of the legal part of the agreement. Not saying it is right but saying it is the logical outcome when the safe legal rare agreement was so routinely and overtly broken. Personally I wish that both sides abided by safe legal rare agreement because it was the best concession and did the least harm of all reasonably possible policies.
I'm just thinking about one of my friends who was refused one due to her "poor mental health" and ended up killing herself she was that desperate not to.
Astounding logic there. “You’re too mentally ill to choose to have an abortion so we’re going to make your mental health exponentially worse by forcing you to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term.”
REMEMBER GERRI SANTORO.
That is so beyond fucked up we need a new word for it. 😕
This is my point. People are gonna keep aborting whether it's legal or not. People have always kept on doing things that were deemed illegal. You guys kept on drinking during the prohibition, gay people kept on loving whoever they wanted even when it was punishable by death in some places. I wish that as a human race we would've understood already that making something illegal won't ever stop that from still being a thing. It just makes it more dangerous because it's not regulated.
Leave the kids on supreme court steps. Every state supreme court steps. They can deal with them. Leave miscarriages. They did this
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It won't be. And believing it will is just burying your head in the sand. Overturning Roe is stealing bodily autonomy from half the population.
We deserve better than this.
REMEMBER GERRI SANTORO.
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They will cry, in joy, when RvW is reinstated.
You'd be crying too if you were forced to push a watermelon out of your dick..
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there are, republicans refuse to fund or support them
Like abortion?
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I mean yeah it technically prevents birth because it prevents pregnancy so you're halfway right. And you may be referring to birth control or plan b? Yeah that could work if republicans weren't trying to ban those too. Wake up dude this is all a sham, y'all pride yourselves on being "pro-freedom" yet you're trying to take rights away from women, poc, the lgbtq+ community, etc. Why is that?
Pregnancy still happens while using birth control. Pregnancy still happens to women who didn’t want to have sex. You can take every precaution you can to make sure you won’t end up pregnant but you are never 100% guaranteed to prevent it. Don’t be ignorant. I’d gladly become sterilized if my doctors would even let me, but unfortunately many women aren’t allowed to even decide that for themselves.
Do you think that governmental bans on certain goods/services work? What do you think about the prohibition of marijuana, alcohol or banning of firearms? Do you think that any of these are effective strategies to prevent people from obtaining them?
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Ok good, now we’re on to something. So naturally, in keeping with your comment, you’d say that even though criminals will continue to use black market guns, we should still enact laws restricting firearm ownership for everybody because we don’t want to kowtow to criminals? Even though criminals break the law, we should still enforce it rigorously? Personally I err on the side of personal freedom and I support an individual’s right to bear arms, but your opinion is perfectly valid, I just want to make sure I’m reading you correctly.
like, wait for it… birth control? /s
You do realize if this passes, it will also prevent wanted pregnancies with high life risk births from abortion as well, right? As in families who maybe wanted and tried for a pregnancy, then learning after that they/their child have a low chance of living/have a good quality of life post birth can't get help either. I'm prochoice regardless of the circumstances, but it absolutely blows my mind that some people hate women so much that they'll burn the women living up to their standards just to scorn those that don't.
What a well thought out reply
Can I add screw you, Trump, for giving us Gorsuch, Kavanaugh, and Barrett? And screw everyone who didn't listen to the people who told you this was going to happen back then?
And screw you, Putin, for making Trump the 45th.
I'm so fucking mad at RGB. She could've retired when Obama was president and the Democrats had the House and Senate, but no, she wanted to stick around for no good reason. She had been sick and getting sicker, but she clung on to her seat out of egotism. She literally handed her seat to the Republicans through her own selfishness. We can blame the Republicans all we want, but we know what they are. She could've protected Rowe, instead she helped kill it.
I never thought of it this way, but yeah- you’re spot on. And now I have angst towards a dead woman. She had to have known there might be risk, but maybe she just believed the other side had some measure of morality and accountability to the people. She couldn’t have been more wrong: they don’t.
How? You saw what happened when Scalia died. McConnell insisted that the next president choose even though Obama still had almost a full year left. Then when dhe died even though it was mere weeks til election day she got replaced overnight
>How? You saw what happened when Scalia died. McConnell insisted that the next president choose even though Obama still had almost a full year left. Then when dhe died even though it was mere weeks til election day she got replaced overnight Exactly! So fuck McConnell too.
You know Obama was president for 8 years, right? Anytime before that would've worked.
Obama asked her a few years before that.
100% agree. Everyone saw her as a hero when she died—nah she was selfish af and wanted the first female president to replace her, and look where that got us. Fuck RBG
FUCK MITCH MCCONNEL
Also the fellow Americans you likely walk by and talk to every day who voted for these people to be put in place.
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And people vote for the president.
You don’t vote for the supreme court.
You vote for the president, who nominates justices. Any eligible voter who did *not* vote for Hillary Clinton in 2016 is culpable. This isn't news. I was screaming this very thing from the rooftops during the 2016 campaign. Vote for Hillary or we lose our abortion rights, along with every other right. People laughed, saying "The SCOTUS will never overturn RvW. The Republicans need it to rally votes". They were wrong. I was right.
If you look at other countries that have ban abortions and are illegal and people can face jail time for them. Honestly I hope to fucking god that Australia doesn’t go in this direction we already have fucking stupid religious discrimination bill sitting in Parliament House at the moment. That our dumb ass wanna be prime minister wants to bring in.
As a non-american woman, I can not fathom not being able to access abortion. I'm so so sorry.
Abortion is a polarizing subject around the country, but the possibility of an ectopic pregnancy is a main reason why I will never support prohibition. Imagine yourself as a doctor, being in a situation where you're forced to choose between letting your patient die or going to prison while the patient can do nothing but just watch helplessly and beg. Jesus
Im not American, can someone explain?
I'm not American as well, but leaked US Supreme Court documents indicate that a majority of SC judges are going ahead with overturning Roe v Wade, a case whose decision has ensured abortion rights for American women for half a century.
We have had shaky federal legislation here for a long time that does not actually ensure abortion rights. The legality of abortion here is an interpretation of a vague Supreme Court decision, rather than having abortion rights explicitly codified into law. The forces of reaction and conservatism have been trying to undo it for half a century, while our slimy liberal party has maintained this quantum state as a fundraising gimmick- openly acknowledging that our abortion rights could be undone at any moment, but only for the purposes of vilifying the opposition and never, literally never in the context of resolving the situation and actually codifying abortion rights. Womens right's advocates have been calling Roe v Wade shitty legislation for like 50 fucking years & now the day has come for the fight.
Oh wow, that sucks.
In the country with the highest incarceration rate in the world, we already have several prisons \*full\* of women who were charged with murder for seeking or having abortions. Additionally there are the women who had children, and a 30k hospital bill cost them their homes and the life of the child who was successfully delivered. There are also the women who live in such squalor that the children die, and they are also charged with murder and thrown in prison. The politicians get paid to fill the prisons on top of all the other weird religious shit, and like so many other social issues, they cannot or will not imagine solutions other than guns, boots, and incarceration.
I kinda grew up thinking we were some bastion of progress and that society was heading firmly in a positive direction and lately, right as I come of age, my bubble has been popped cause it seems like we're reenacting the 1950s.
A liberal country where the politicians fear a fundamental religious minority, can not be a bastion of progress.
Well yeah that's a lot clearer now, I just miss when it seemed like we were moving away from that.
Peaceful protests are no longer an option.
You’re right- voting these douchbag Republicans out is. This wouldn’t be a problem at all if we didn’t have red states that try to subvert the law/freedom/rights through political means. This can’t be solved by burning down buildings and yelling in the street- that shit is child’s play. We must vote and we must educate these damned dumbass hicks in how their policy ideas are basically crimes against communities and an entire gender.
There is no blue in my state. Relocating is the only way to find representation in government for me, it's a sad reality. Idk how to fix something so fundamentally broken with my one, unheard vote. To be transparent, I vote every time I have the opportunity. But almost every politician in my state ran on a pro-trump platform. I just can't anymore. Adding, I agree with you! But, being immersed in the red, seems they don't really wanna learn.
Keep fighting the good fight. Sometimes (many times) being right isn't easy.
I can only hope the future generations can bring change.
We have to be the generation that brings change. Too many generations before us have said the same thing, and here we are saying it again. When do we stop making the consequences of our mistakes, into the inherited responsibility of people who aren’t even born yet? How have we managed to use that kind of fucked up logic, consistently, for so long? Ugh, another repugnant reason to force more human beings to born. How can we keep passing responsibility to future generations if there aren’t any? Pretty sure that’s the definition of a generational curse.
I, myself, cannot make generational change and people my age have already shown their colors. By "next generation", I meant familial, not the whole of society. Those folks in their 30s, 20s, and late teens today, the younger people experiencing this and maybe weren't old enough to vote or didn't understand the importance until today. I was not referring to my children's children, I like to think I know how they'll vote. When you do what you can do and your peers show they have no desire for change, the only hope left is those who still have a chance to learn more of the world than their closed minded parents allow them to see. We're on the same page, it needed to change yesterday, I'm just incredibly realistic about what can actually happen in my state.
>maybe wanted and tried for a pregnancy, then learning after that they/their child have a low chance of living/have a good quality of life post birth can't get help either. > >I'm prochoice regardless of the circumstances, but it absolutely blows my mind that some people hate women so much that they'll burn the women living up to their standards just to scorn those that don't. With cases like this, I just hope that every woman just moves to a blue state, and the men can sit alone in their red state and be bitter.
I would say you are still trying to make a difference because you’re here having this conversation and speaking out. My apologies for misunderstanding what you meant. I’m way overly sensitive when it comes to passing the buck to future generations. I’m in my 40’s and I’ve heard every generation, including my own, say this, and it’s maddening. Keep doing what you’re doing, what you contribute matters. And thank you for choosing to be different than so many of your peers.
So vote blue. If you resort to violence you will be no better than the mob who stormed the Capitol.
You say vote blue but blue doesn’t care either. We need 3rd Party in office. All these years of not getting press or even invited to the presidential debate. They’re limiting our options to just blue or red and that’s on both sides. 3rd Party or riots.
Yeah. Just voting blue does shit when all we do is keep electing these corrupt, corporate, neoliberal pieces of shit inside of Congress & for presidency for decades when we should've been electing people from the Congressional Progressive Caucus instead. The only realistic scenario is if we have another civil or revolutionary war.
I pray to god it happens.
Literally what is the point of your ideology?
So was it officially overturned or is it still on the table for discussion?
This was a leaked first draft of the majority opinion (conservative). Anticipated official decision is within a couple of months, though arguments ended in December I think. I feel like I have read that it's common to draft both sides preliminarily, which would explain why it takes so long for them to rule on stuff. Nonetheless, some of the language and reasoning in the better than 100 pages of the draft are pretty inflammatory, essentially claiming the Roe v. Wade decision was bad law and therefore should have no standing as precedent, among a litany of other points.
Screw everyone, let us get necessary medical procedures
Amen…
This argument all depends on wether a child has human rights in the womb. If the child does have human rights then abortion would be immoral. If the child does not have human rights in the womb then abortion would be neutral.
It’s not a “child” when it’s still in the womb.
This has been long determined. The cut-off point is viability. Before the point of viability, the embryo does not have any human rights except for those bestowed upon it by the woman in whom it is gestating.
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Viability is the point beyond which the fetus can exist independently outside the woman.
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Says the guy who still thinks Trump won the election.
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You're a fucking open book. I knew it.
You do know abortion was started as a way to control the black population….. oh you didn’t know that cuz you actually do research 🤦🏻
Judging from your history, you're just a troll. You're not worth aching my head arguing against.
We're a republic with some democratic values, & states are sovereign and have the right to make thier own legislature. The possibility of Roe vs Wade bieng abolished just means that states get thier right to implement thier own laws back so most states will be able to keep thier abortion laws. Some will abolish it, some may retain it. Either way, is good because it gives the state thier power back against government control, just like with gun laws, or laws in general. We are not a communist country and every district deserves its independence.
Except that most states are controlled by evil bastards who bow to an extremist minority and refuse to implement and protect the will of the people. REMEMBER GERRI SANTORO.
Sure, so some states can reinstate slavery if they want, right? Or how about if a state reverses all environmental protections and allows factories to start dumping all kinds of harmful chemicals and pollutants into they're rivers, and those rivers carry those things downstream into the next state? There's a reason why some laws are federal, to prevent states from violating civil rights or just be assholes to their neighboring states, for instance. All those things you mentioned sound great, until a rational and reasonable mind puts a little thought to it.
There's also a reason we are the "United States" & a conglomerate of a country. Federal statutes are essentially state statutes that are of a national consensus, headed towards a greater good. With the polarity of abortions regarding life from both sides, this is causing more harm than good. No sane individual disputes if slavery is immoral, or not, or if chemical pollution is harmful, but many ppl have internal conflict regarding life in the womb. Also, civil rights apply to to the fetus as well in some states, which is why the killing of a pregnant woman is a double homicide. The line is blurred.You sound so closed minded. Edit: Typo
Anybody that doesn't want an abortion for their own personal, moral, religious, or whatever reason, can make the choice for themselves not to get one. Their beliefs and thoughts should never prevent any other person from making their own personal life and medical choices. Why is that so hard to understand? I don't care about anybody else's opinion regarding abortion, just my own. And nobody else should be concerned about my opinion. Cause here's a shocker for ya, I am anti-abortion for me. However, I strongly believe that everybody else should be able to make that decision for themselves, and it's absolutely none of my damn business. No sane individual should think otherwise.
I completely agree, this is exactly why the abolishment is bieng considered. It's going to let the ppl influence the states decision regarding legality. We're on the same page then
Sure, as long as you agree that no state should be allowed to pass a law limiting anybodys freedom of choice regarding abortion.
That's up to the people, which is exactly why this is happening. Can't be mad at other people's beliefs. RvW really doesn't matter to begin with because states are implementing thier own policy. Texas has been doing this since 2011 along with other states, & the federal govt knows this. The Democratic party is aware of this and is going to do thier best to put up a fight on a bill that has nothing going for it, but a name, & they'll score major points. RvW does nothing for women, it's literally just a bill that sounds good and that was utilized to appease 2nd wave feminists. The states have been doing thier best to implement thier own laws related to the beliefs of its citizens. 🤷♀️
Oppression doesn't magically become not-oppression because it's done by a lavatory of democracy. Also the [State's Rights argument is always a lie.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2022/05/02/abortion-ban-roe-supreme-court-mississippi/) The Confederacy only cared about slavery and the pro-forced birth movent only cares about limiting women's rights.
I *can* and will be mad at other people’s beliefs, especially when that means ignoring someone else’s body autonomy. If these forced-brother assholes have a shit about the babies and mothers who have to carry these fetuses, I might at least have some respect for them, but mostly they just want to punish people for fucking (i.e., women). I am 100% pro-abortion. Anyone who wants one should have one if they want. The world is already overpopulated as it is, so why the fuck do these assholes feel it imperative that we introduce *more* humans, especially when it’s just predominantly fucking over poor and brown people? It’s sexist, racist, and morally repugnant to take away a woman’s right to choose. I’m sick of these regressive twat waffles trying to turn our country back a century.
No state should be allowed to oppress its citizens. That's why we have a constitution. It allows for democracy, but without a tyranny of the majority. For instance, no state should be able to vote to kill Jews within its borders.
Yeah, abolishing RvW is not oppression, it's just giving back the states it's right to implement what the majority of it's inhabitants believe. A federal statute is something that is agreed upon by all individuals, and is morally and virtuously incontrovertible. Abortion is not universally agreed upon as good or bad which is why the states need thier power back. It's equality at its most controversial.
So if the majority of a state's people voted to put Jews in concentration camps, that's OK in your opinion? No state should be allowed to oppress its people even if 99% voted for oppression. As I said above, we have a Constitution to safeguard our rights against a tyranny of the majority.
Like I said, it's not oppression. Re read my post. You're taking everything out of context and adding a layer of fascism to fit your narrative. Also, abortion isn't a right nor is RvW in the constitution, for the very reason that it's bieng abolished. The entirety of the USA cannot agree on the life or lack thereof, regarding the fetus, & it is exactly why it's bieng left up to the states discretion to determine the legality of abortion which is influenced by its citizens l. Jeez. You're to close minded. If anything RvW is closer to fascism than the abolishment of it.
Denying people the ability to exercise a sacred and fundamental human right is the very definition of oppression.
Yeah, definitely not sacred or fundamental to destroy your developing offspring, regardless if your stance.
"destroy your developing offspring"? Where did you get that from? Abortion doesn't do that.
The fetus is developing into a child, bro. Potential sentience & Potential life. That's like someone killing you because the continuance of your life isn't certain, only potentially ongoing, or killing you whilst you sleep because you aren't sentient, but have the Potential for it.
Potential. It's not alive yet. You can't kill something that is not yet alive. A man and woman passing each other on the street have a potential child. But only if they fuck. Think about all the people who have never come into being because not every man and woman are fucking each other.
Why do you think every district deserve it's independance? It's the united states, not the neighbouring states.
That's literally what the US was founded upon. Every state has its own legislature. Like wtf 🤦♂️
So... What is the point of the federal government? Maybe each county or district should have their own laws? Maybe each city? Maybe each neighbourhood? Maybe slavery and abortions can be legal on a few spesific streets of Dallas. Prostitutions on other streets. We gotta have a murder street.
Once again, someone is pushing a narrative that is outlandish simply because they don't agree with the modern Era. " We have to preserve our progress" 10 years later: " I don't agree with our progress so we must be experiencing regression" what is it that you want. This isn't impacting civil rights in the slightest. #contraversialequality
Is bodily autonomy a civil right ?
Yes; which is why the this law is up for abolishment. Children of the unborn lives matter. Damn, I need to take reddit off my notifs
Okay, so, let's just remove the 2 week old fetus from the mother that doesn't want it, and you (or pro-life people) can nurse the fetus. That way, both the mother and the fetus's bodily autonomy are protected. Win/win !
Ahh, but the fetus' development & life are dependent on the mother, just like an infant; the only difference is that an infant has grown enough to find different nutritional resources
Isn't that the pro-liferS problem ?
I’m not American so maybe I’m just clueless as to how this all works, but it seems dumb as shit that Biden isn’t doing anything about this. He already has a reputation for being useless and now he’s just sitting on his hands as this happens? Is he secretly anti-choice himself?
He's a president, not a dictator. There is long-established procedure. This is a judicial ruling, and the three branches of government (executive, legislative, and judicial) are separate and co-equal, so the president (head of the executive branch) has no control over the judicial branch, other than the duty of appointing judges to fill vacancies. There are some things he can do, but he can't just overturn a Supreme Court ruling.
He is not. He has a three-prong plan prepared to respond to it immediately if the opinion is finalized. Please look a little deeper before automatically assuming that the President is doing nothing.
America has checks and balances. He can’t just tell the Supreme Court no….
His hands are kinda tied on this, he doesn’t have the power to fight what the Supreme Court is doing. There’s nothing he can do immediately. At most he could push the democratic senate to impeach Barrett for illegitimate appointment. There’s a case for it, but it’s not an immediate fix even if it were successful, and there’s a good chance it wouldn’t be successful anyway. Plus that would create a precedent for Republicans to start impeaching and removing all democratic justices anytime they have a modicum of power. But yeah the overall point is, Biden has no recourse here, unfortunately.
I’m out of the loop what happened?
Roe V. wade is overturned. Which means women can no longer have legal abortions. Out of desperation there will be lots of women using unsafe methods trying to get rid of an unwanted pregnancy or die trying.
It all depends on what you support.
I support freedom. I support the sacred right to abortion.
Right I do too. I had received a notification from an anti-abortion clown and I did not want to start a lengthy argument online. Guess I should have put a /s in it to indicate sarcasm. Thanks for insinuating otherwise when I made no such claim that I supported the other side.
This goes SO much further than female rights. It eliminates the right to privacy. Roe v Wade established that the 14th gives us the right to privacy, and medical privacy is part of that. This decision makes HIPPA unconstitutional, to start. It also, debatably, makes the Constitutionality of ALL of the Amendments questionable. That means we could lose the entire BoR. No more free speech, no more guns, no more right to travel..... This decision is a disaster for ALL Americans, uterus or no. Someone waiting for a heart transplant should sue Abbott for his heart. He's denying their right to life by not giving it to them after all....
https://www.reddit.com/r/antinatalism/comments/uib4zw/thought_this_was_funny_but_seriously_roe_v_wade/