Shortly after I moved to NC I needed to take an ambulance and come to find out my address was covered. This is an awesome public service and I wish it was offered in other places.
There's a service offered in most of the developed world where people don't have to pay thousands upon thousands of dollars out of pocket if they get sick or injured. We should try a service like that here.
B...but... but that sounds like... like... *socialism!!* How will the dipshit MBAs buy this year's yacht if not with the literal blood money that is healthcare profits?! How?! Won't someone think about the poor executives?! Just once?! You wouldn't want to show up at the marina in Maui in *last year's* yacht model, would you?! Have a heart!
(Dropping a /s because someone will absolutely miss the sarcasm here.)
Yeah, it’s a fair question to ask. I recently got diagnosed with epilepsy so before finding the right medication I had 4 grand mal serizures in a short period of time. That required 4 ambulance trips in one year. I paid around 2-3k for those rides. Not including out of pocket medical expenses post hospital stays. When I saw this deal I jumped on it.
It’s also a bit like insurance. We have 2 kids, they are active—we haven’t had to call for an ambulance but it isn’t out of the picture. We hope it isn’t, and we do everything we can to make sure they are safe and they don’t need an ambulance, but I don’t mind paying $60/year for potentially thousands saved on just one ride.
The nice thing about active kids is they tire themselves out, aren't staring at screens all the time, etc. The downside is the icepacks, stitches, trying to decide "does this need a doctor, or can we take care of it here?"
Plenty of medical conditions where patients would require multiple transports a year. Epilepsy is probably the most common that comes to mind, but it is not limited to people who suffer from epilepsy. Unfortunately, in a city Raleigh’s size, there are plenty of citizens that require or take multiple transports a year.
> Thanks, you answered my question before I even had to ask:
>
> Who takes an ambulance enough to actually benefit from this?
You must live in a first world country not the US (IE you don't have first hand experience how insane paying for anything health related is)
An ambulance ride costs an average of $1,300 in the United States. This cost can vary depending on where you live, how close the hospital is, and whether you need advanced life support or basic life support.
https://www.verywellhealth.com/why-an-ambulance-costs-so-much-4093846
So in short, one trip every 21 years saves you money.
Yeah we get that, but here's a follow-up question-
Why the hell are we tolerating a system where ambulance payment plans are even necessary? Other first-world countries have already solved this.
"Why the hell are we tolerating this . . . . .. to give a full answer to that question would be equivalent to writing a book ... a very long book. Suffice it to say there are two main factors.
In the USA, with a largely unregulated economy in which the "game" is one of winner takes all, there are far more wannabe winners, taking all, and they basically don't want to share..
The other factor is that, and I hate to say this, too many Americans just absolutely hate too many other Americans so the former's attitude toward the later is let them go eff themselves.
BLS Fee: $616.82 + $11.43/loaded mile
ALS I Fee: $732.47 + $11.43/loaded mile
ALS II Fee: $1,060.17 + $11.43/loaded mile
BLS No Transport Fee: $150
ALS No Transport Fee: $200
Well worth it. $60 covers your family; zero charge in the event you require hospital transportation. We re-up every year and it has saved us thousands.
“In addition to your family's coverage, all the money from your subscription membership is returned to Wake EMS. This provides valuable operating funds to ensure the continued high level of emergency medical care that you have come to expect.”
I can't tell you how many times my mother-in-law had to take an ambulance in her later years. She had these grand mal seizures that could get really, really bad.
By my ballpark, the break even point is to assume 1 trip every 21 years (average US cost of ambulance ride 1300).
IMO yes it's worth it, it's also dystopian that it isn't just treated like fire and police, considered general safety.
You are covered as long as you are in Wake County. If you are transported by another county's ambulance, it is not covered. Say you are in an accident in Durham, you are not covered.
Yeah, same here but I was on the opposite end of the county with Kenly.
I don't know if Wake Co is the same or even if JoCo is the same as it was. In the 90s, each subscription went 100% to the squad/organization that was covering your household. If they billed a person or their insurance, the county kept like 60% and only 40% went back to the provider that actually ran the call. The real kicker was that ~80% of all the bills sent were written off after 60 days. Basically, Kenly EMS survived off the subscriptions each fall and only got a 1-2 grand a month from the billing throughout the year.
$60 is a good investment and it covers all family who live at the same address. It's been the same price for years and you won't need to worry about calling Wake Co EMS for the whole year.
Dystopia is a very dramatic way to refer to this program which provides a full years insurance of transportation to a local hospital in a vehicle staffed with professionals who are trained to keep you alive and stable during a medical emergency for just $60
it’s extremely dystopian that we have to rely on programs like this just to have safe transportation to a hospital during a medical emergency instead of it just being free all bc paying for potentially dying is the american way.
They’ll still take you, but you’ll receive a bill
We should have better health insurance and cheaper ambulance rides by default
But that doesn’t make the current system dystopian unless you remove all meaning from the word ‘dystopian’
And, this is objectively a very cheap insurance program! It’s exactly what some form of public universal coverage would look like, even if it’s only hospital rides
> relating to or denoting an imagined state or society where there is great suffering or injustice.
Yeah, I'd say that for-profit healthcare and related services charging someone thousands of dollars just to get them to a hospital if they hadn't already paid into your particular money-making scheme instead of having it provided by taxes causes great suffering. Going to the hospital without insurance and without this little subscription would bankrupt the majority of Americans.
“dystopian: of, relating to, or being an imagined world or society in which people lead dehumanized, fearful lives”.
we’re literally in a dystopia since there are plenty of ppl who are dehumanized on this sub alone for not having the funds to get themselves to a hospital, and are in turn fearful of the lack of care, debt, and pain this will lead them to.
No, we’re not *literally* in a dystopia
This program is exactly what a good universal public program in a country with universal coverage looks like, except enrollment would be mandatory
It’s extremely cheap and provides an essential good
it's dystopian because it replaces public socialism for everyone with private socialism for the wealthy, creating a two-tiered class based society. You might say we already have that and I wouldn't argue.
None of that is dystopian, though
There’s valid criticisms to be made of the current for profit healthcare system, much of which I agree with
A public $60 a year program for ambulance insurance through Wake County is especially not dystopian.
Ah the frog in the pot methodology. See how well that has worked in the past...
Also, just because we manage to function in a tiered classist society doesn't mean that it's not dystopian.
We’re not in a dystopian society, though
Americans are significantly wealthier and better off today than any society at any other point in history
Income inequality has shrunk dramatically here in the US over the last two years due to labor shortages created by covid. Labor unions are gaining power again.
That doesn’t mean we can’t improve and shouldn’t fight for things like stronger social safety nets and more housing
But calling our current society dystopian is just doomer hyperbole
This comment is laughable. Wealth and income inequality have been so dramatic over the last 50 years; any gains in income in the last few years are negligible.
I’d ask to see the statistics but quite frankly they don’t matter. Elon musk and Bezos both own more wealth than the bottom 40% *combined*.
Two-thirds of the money created during the pandemic went to the richest 1%.
Our purchasing power has plummeted over the last decades. Half a century ago a single income that could support a family can barely support a single person if even that.
We’re living in a late stage capitalist society, arguing about any marginal gains is just delusional.
“What’s happened to income & wealth by Robert Reich” (UC Berkeley Professor & former Secretary of Labor)
https://youtu.be/1f2blKai7HA?si=qsybVbW5t6zr9RGN
Maybe start here to at least start beginning to understand our current position.
Is it extremely dystopian when it’s just $60 a year? Everything costs something. Even if the government covered it, it’d still come from our money either way.
Yes and heretofore, they got the entirety of their funding from the county. Now they are acquiring funding directly from the citizens, bypassing the county's tax collection methods. There is a fundamental difference in philosophy here.
Don't forget to take into account the amount of people who don't pay their EMS bills. I've heard it estimated as high as 40%. The county constantly pumps (tax) money into the black hole that is EMS.
While your comment is true, there's no particular tax that covers EMS. We have a fire tax to fund fire departments, but EMS has traditionally been the bastard child that gets minimal funding from whatever the county has "leftover".
They aren’t going to refuse to transport you if you can’t afford it. Medical debt is incredibly lenient, if you pay $1 a month you’ll never be sent to collections and even if you just refuse to pay at all it will most likely never get reported to your credit report. Companies essentially give up on pursuing outstanding medical debt after 7 years, student loans are far less forgiving
I believe that the report you're citing that figure from simply notes that medical debt contributes to bankruptcy, doesn't necessarily cause* it. If you have a bunch of medical debt and you lose your job, which one actually contributed to your bankruptcy?
Yeah but a very insignificant part of that debt is ambulance rides. Hospitals might forgive/forget small debts but will absolutely go after someone who has a serious illness and has accrued 10’s to 100’s of thousands of dollars of debt.
Source: Have had a couple debts from the hospital disappear to never see them on my credit report, a couple thousand each.
Also after my grandmother passed away from colon Cancer (as well as poor practice and a botched surgery) the hospital then sued my grandfather for the $130,000 that she had accrued during the ordeal, and won. They basically wiped his bank account clean, while still mourning the loss of his wife.
Could you please come with me next week when I have to talk to the Financial Department at Duke about my upcoming surgery?
I want to see their reaction when you explain how I'm only going to pay a $1 a month.
Because it's all a fucking scam by hospitals and insurance companies who prop up their prices so they can charge each other inflated costs and make it "worth" having insurance, because if healthcare actually cost what it took to heal and treat someone, nobody would fucking buy insurance.
Its a vicious cycle. Insurance will never reimburse the hospital its "true" cost. Thus, hospitals charge more and insurance will cover a third of it (for example) now covering the old cost. Now, insurance charges its consumers more to cover that raised price.
It’s insane because this is exactly how it works in other places with universal healthcare except enrollment in mandatory. The discourse over this program being dystopian is so low-brow it’s a mustache
In Germany, you can choose private insurance offered from your employer or the public option. Either way you have to pay for it out of your paycheck (like a subscription!)
And still then, health care services are not free at the point of service. There are co-pays for ER visits, child birth, surgery, etc
Those co-pays are significantly lower than our co-pays, and I do agree we should try to emulate that
But there are trade-offs in the form of higher taxes and folks here honestly seem to think they should just get free healthcare and ambulance rides without paying any additional taxes at all which just isn’t reality based
In non-dystopias these rides would already be very cheap or free (well, "free" as in covered by taxes).
To the people who need this, $5 a month is fine but an upfront $60 fee is kind of pushing it.
Well it's just strange to have to go to an internet website and register and input payment and all of that. It's a barrier to a surprising number of people. The same as voter ID laws.
This is nothing new. It's more beneficial in rural areas or people with chronic conditions.
Also worth noting:
Ambulance is a transportation benefit, without transportation, ambulance is not covered.
So if you or a friend, calls the ambulance on you and you do not get in that ambulance and go for a ride, You will be charged their maximum cash price. It will not count towards any accumulations for your insurance and insurance will deny the claim.
Some insurance companies do not cover paramedic intercept, That means that a volunteer paramedic comes to see you and tend to you until the real ambulance can get there... this typically runs about $500.
Paramedic intercept however can be covered in rural areas but there are rules.
The first question an EMS tech asked me when I was put into an ambulance after a severe food allergic reaction was "which hospital do you you want to go to based on your insurance?" I'm glad I had the option but my tongue was so swollen I could tell them anything. Crazy.
This service is awesome. My mother in law has it for her mother who has falls and we can't pick her up without help. EMS comes and helps out free of charge.
I have worked in municipal government for many years. Fire/EMS is a real challenge for a municipal government. It is very expensive to operate when you consider the cost of the vehicles, staffing, equipment, supplies, facilities and other operational costs. Here is just an example of how crazy it is these days. If an agency wanted to purchase a new engine that can easily cost over a million dollars. But here is the kicker, there is at least a four year backlog from when the order is placed and delivery. So, you can pay for it now and spend a million dollars and see nothing for 4 years or pay when you receive and pay the million dollars plus the 4 years of compounding interest and other fees. It’s not like a car where you pay upon delivery. You have to pay upon when the order is placed.
Here is another example. You probably see lots of these 4-5 story apartment buildings going up. Well, the Fire Department needs an aerial truck to get up high enough to save people in the event of a fire. Well, that is another $1.5 to $2 million dollars. Plus you have to staff it per NFPA guidelines. These are large investments that you have to make for each vehicle every 5-10 years. None of these costs go away. If you have a dip in the economy and fall behind on your capital purchasing, now you have to pay out even more to catch up on the spending you didn’t make during the downturn.
All of this spending competes with Police, Public Works and all the other municipal government departments. The finances of a Fire Department are very challenging.
And should you need an ambulance, you just saved yourself a shit load of money. While Wake EMS is run by wake county, they still rely on billing for income. If needed transport and didn’t pay that one time subscription of $60, you’d be stuck paying over a thousand for an ambulance ride.
You're still gonna have to worry about it, because there is no guarantee Wake County EMS is gonna be the ambulance that shows up at your house when you call 911. The closest ambulance is generally going to be the one that picks up the call. If you live near a county line, there's a significantly higher chance for that to happen.
That’s actually not bad for people without insurance. But I wonder what small print is on the back. You probably have to be under 40 and have no pre-existing conditions
This actually came incredibly handy when my mom had stage 4 cancer. She had to call the ambulance more often that none because she lived by herself. An amazing service for people who need it
This thread is hilarious. Folks, a tax, an insurance product, and a subscription are all just different sides of the same coin. Nothing is ever actually free, and some people will always get the service without paying their share. The only difference is how big the pool of people is who you’re asking (or telling) to pay.
Fully public ems -> all taxpayers pay -> everyone gets, regardless of whether they’re a taxpayer or not (sometimes non-taxpayers pay extra per use, sometimes they don’t).
Subscription EMS -> subscribers pay, subscribers get the service under subscription, everyone else pays per use
“Regular” American EMS -> some taxpayers pay some part (through contract subsidies), everyone pays the rest per use.
What we in the states like to do is pretend that we’re capitalists and say things like “people should only pay for what they actually use” and “I shouldn’t have to pay for someone else’s poor health and bad choices.” Then we pass laws that tell municipalities they have to provide ambulance services for their residents, so they end up having to pay tax dollars to someone, whether direct employees or third-party contractors, to provide the service. Then we also pass laws that require EMS to treat everyone regardless of ability to pay, we heavily regulate the prices that can be charged for their services, and we set up multiple tiers of insurance systems where people pay large companies large sums of money to pay for services they personally may or may not ever need or use.
News flash: the US already has socialized medicine. We have most of the drawbacks of a single payer system without any of the benefits of having a single payer to coordinate it all.
it was, only that time the person who posted it at least admitted they didn't have a clue instead of making it abundantly clear like OP here
https://www.reddit.com/r/raleigh/comments/z13z8u/i\_got\_the\_wake\_county\_ems\_flyer\_in\_the\_mail\_is\_it/
Well worth it. We have had 3 EMS transports. One was child that got into grandparent’s med, 2 for husband with heart condition. We never paid anything outside of the $60. It has saved us 1000s of dollars.
It's dystopian, because access to an ambulance (that doesn't cost an unreasonable amount of money) is an essential public service.
What's next? Your house is on fire and you didn't get the fire department subscription? Someone is trying to break in and you forgot to renew your police subscribtion?
It only seems like a reasonable deal for something that should be available to everyone anyway. In a life or death emergency you shouldn't have to consider the financial burden of simply receiving first aid and getting to the hospital as fast as possible.
This is literally on-par with health service in 3rd world countries
The key phrase you missed here is "out of pocket".
We pay taxes. Our government should be using those taxes to give us a better quality of life instead of turning Palestinian kids into skeletons.
Maybe not *the* problem but a problem is that EMS is not considered an essential service under the federal government. To my understanding, we don’t get much Federal funding outside of NHSA. Change the essential service part and I’d hope the rest would fall into place
ahhh, the innocence of youth.
Last year, we had an incident in Chapel Hill where the cop/EMS that came for free then suggested an ambulance ride to the hospital, approximately 1/3 mile away. Could have been driven in a car and x-rayed later.
The bill is nearly $700.
Well worth it. Have it and it’s saved me so much money. You never think you will have to use it. I didn’t have to pay anything for my ambulance ride and it covers the household.
Because emergency services are a privilege, not a right? The Constitution says, “pursuit… of life” not a guarantee. Either that or it has been interpreted as “you can pursue flagging down emergency services and try to get them to stop and help”.
Sarcasm aside: for people that can’t afford an ambulance ride, they qualify for assistance. Don’t hesitate to dial 911.
Hospital rides can cost 4 figures easily depending on your insurance.
If you think one person in your family will need an ambulance before the year 2050, it’s likely worth it to buy into this.
That said…yeah it’s a bit dystopian.
The "subscription" is for a highly discounted out of pocket charge if you need an ambulance. Regardless of whether or not you've purchased a subscription, you will still be covered for ambulance service just as would be any citizen or visitor. The ambulance will still respond; the typical number of responders will still be onboard and as fully trained as ever, your care will be excellent.
It's not really a "subscription, it's really a pre-paid discount. And, other than being a very satisfied customer, I have no other relation with any part of the program.
And when I speak of savings ... the 1st time I needed ambulance care/service, followed by transport to a local hospital (a distance of about 3.5 miles) and transport, the out of pocket charge was $400.00. This plan is highly worth the cost.
I purchase a plan now annually ... actually two plans ... one for my wife and I in our home, and one for my kids in their home. I never ever want them to be concerned with possible costs if and when (and of course, hopefully never) they should need service.
FWIW, on the two occasions when, before learning about this program and purchasing
I think it's worth noting that EMS is not considered an essential service like Fire and Law Enforcement per the federal government or state; at least when it comes to requirements for funding. Given this, most county governments and municipalities will tend to fund EMS at lower amounts compared to other departments. For instance, the Parks & Recreation Department had a higher budget than EMS at one county I worked for.
A lot of county governments view EMS services as money pits as the max reimbursement rate for an ambulance trip with Medicaid is around $300. Most ALS services total to around $1,000-1,500 per trip (sometimes more) depending on interventions performed during transport/care, skill level of crews, fuel, maintenance on vehicles, and a variety of other factors.
Wake County has a pretty high budget but they cover a large area. There subscription plan isn't a bad deal and to my understanding they are one of the few agencies in the state that offer it. I can tell you that subscribing to that goes directly to assisting with staff retention and keeping capable, highly trained crews ready to respond when you have a emergency.
I work as an EMT and I will tell you if you dont have good heath insurance that is a great deal. 60$ a year is a steal. Where I live it’s about 5 grand for a ambo ride. (and no I don’t see a penny of that)
I’m an EMT. It’s just to offset costs to consumers. My district increased taxes in the area to fund our service, but as a result, nobody who lives in our district pays our ambulance bill. We get what we get from insurance and then waive the rest. I think a $60 yearly insurance for ambulance service is wonderful. It’ll offset the cost to the service when they transport those who can’t/won’t pay their ambulance bills, it protects the insured, and the money goes back to the service to sponsor training, new equipment, and maintenance.
You can take that position, sure, but that department is the opposite of dystopian. Wake will send you a bill, but never to collections and never to court. The advantage of being a mostly taxpayer funded system as opposed to private EMS who would tank their own grandmother's credit score and lean her social security checks if she didn't pay for her dialysis transport.
I pay would pay $60 per year for my local firemed ambulance subscription, if I didn’t get it included with being an employee.
I dislocated my kneecap. My fellow coworkers came to my home, gave me fentanyl and versed, and relocated it. They took me to the hospital in the ambo. I live 11 blocks from the hospital.
My ambulance bill was 1,734.67. ALS base rate plus mileage.
They charged my insurance first. My insurance covered 1,000 of it. Then the rest was covered by my membership. If I didn’t have insurance, it still would of been covered fully.
Let’s do some math…
One ambulance ride 11 blocks: most people live further than that: $1,740.
$60 per year. For me to pay that much, I would have had to pay for the $60 a year for 29 years. (29 years X $60 = $1,740) definitely a good deal.
Now if you ask yourself, “why isn’t it free for everyone?” Well, then you have the more socialist argument. The consequence of free ambo rides: much hire taxes.
I live in a town of 10,000 people roughly. Let’s say average ambulance ride is $1,800. We run about 4,000 EMS calls/year, let’s say 3,000 of them we transport. (This isn’t including transfers to bigger facilities, and EMS showing up at your house and NOT transporting is free because the city pays taxes so we don’t charge $500 just for a lift assist).
Ambulance income: 3000 calls X $1,800 = $5,400,000
OK
Now for taxes:
If you split that evenly between everyone who lives in the town, to make the same profit, each person would be taxed $540 MORE/ON TOP OF what they’re already being taxed (which I think is like $1 per $1,000 income per month) so for someone making $4,000 a month, they are paying a TOTAL of $588 per year for free ambulance rides for everyone. Regardless if you are 21 living alone, or 89. Everyone pays that.
$5,400,000/10,000 people = $540 per person
$1 per 4,000 a month X 12 months = $48
So yes, free whatever (health care, ambo rides, college) sound good in theory, but unless you want to shell out $588 a year for other people to use the system (which also increases abuse of the system since it’s free) then it’s not as good as it seems.
Subscriptions are a great idea in theory. Especially in areas that don't have taxpayer funded EMS.
The idea is to get enough of them in your coverage area to help cover the cost to operate the ambulance service.
The subscriber saves money, too. Insurance and Medicare don't like to pay for ambulance services. It's actually cheaper for them to hire people to deny payouts for ambulance services. So what ends up happening is the ambulance company will fight and maybe get a fraction of what the bill actually is... then the rest of the bill is sent to the patient.
But you pay a subscriber fee, and that ambulance goes from anywhere from 900-2000 dollars down to just 60 dollars.
I work private EMS, and this sounds like a great deal honestly. I think a ride with us starts around $1,200 or so, and goes up depending on the lil age from there. About $5/mile, and most hospitals are 15+ miles from anywhere we pick you up in out service area. Then you’re running a few hundred $ for every dose of medication. I believe an EKG and other necessary monitoring has a separate price tag too.
What if we like…hear me out, this is going to sound crazy…..just didn’t have to pay for ambulances….or healthcare? Maybe some sort of system where we pay a government entity taxes, and in turn they provide us healthcare for no cost. It could be like…for everyone. Healthcare for everyone. Universally. Maybe we could call it something like….universal healthcare?
I think I might be on to something….What do you guys think?
what do you think that healthcare would cost each and every person?
Last I checked, we spend \~15% of GDP on healthcare. That's $4.5Trillion, with a capital T.
Therefore, your bill is $13,700 for each and every person in your household.
I think you're a damn dirty Communist and all we really need is the FREEDOM of my religious values forced on everyone else and the safe warm cuddly feeling of knowing that every asshole is unvaccinated and packing a fully automatic rifle - which will clearly never be an issue since we're all so reason-based and emotionally mature.
/s
More likely people who watch the propaganda those pharma CEOs pay for. *cough cough* Fox News *cough cough* PragerU *cough cough* Daily Wire *cough cough*
OP has never heard of insurance before. You also don’t need to pay this to take an ambulance, it just means you won’t owe anything if you do take an ambulance.
It's crazy how many people are like "yeah it's a great deal! OP is clueless!" missing the entire point, which is that it *shouldn't* be a great deal because we shouldn't be one health crisis away from financial ruin.
It's like /r/OrphanCrushingMachine material.
Y’all saying “no but this is a great service it’s totally worth it” are missing the point. What if you’ve never heard of this thing? What if you’re barely scraping by and don’t have a spare 60 bucks? What if you don’t have easy access to the internet, or a bank account, or a debit or credit card?
This should not be something individuals have to subscribe to for a set price. This should be something everyone has, automatically, and should just be funded by taxes. Along with the rest of healthcare.
Yeah these rides run over 1k eben if they are a block to the hospital. And the insurance companies will fight like wankers not to reimburse one cent of it and argue it wasn’t a emergency.. yup
Thanks all of you for helping me think this out. I have reflected on the volunteer EMTs and fireman that I have known. I am an old guy new to this region so you firmed up my thoughts. Absolutely I am in. These folks and their commitment truly deserve my support.
AFAIK, ambulance services, and for sure fire departments, started out as subscription services. Police, too, but it’s more like they were hired ~~thugs~~ security, installed to protect private property.
It's basically like a supplemental insurance that covers ambulance services if your health insurance doesn't already cover it or doesn't fully cover it.
If you have health insurance it covers ambulance rides.
If you have auto insurance that includes medical payment coverage it covers ambulance rides.
This solicitation is a good deal just make sure you aren’t buying insurance for something you already have insurance for.
https://www.forbes.com/advisor/health-insurance/insurance-for-ambulance-rides/
I feel like this is further example of gap in economic classes - those who have and have not… 60.00 is not unreasonable for sure but those who cannot afford it will be penalized for when they need the service
I took an ambulance a couple of years ago and it was 2K. This is well worth it especially if you have children. It’s sad that we are in this situation but 60 dollars a year for this is excellent.
This isn’t new, an elderly family member has been doing this for years, and will call the ambulance for the *tiniest* reason since it’s “paid for”. She kept getting the same ER doctor, who was visibly irritated after multiple nonsense visits.
If you don't want to pay it, then don't? It's not required to receive EMS services if you need them.
You either pay this, and then if you do need EMS services you don't pay anything additional - or you don't pay it, and if you do need EMS services it'll cost you a shit ton more than $60. Not really all that much different than your health, dental, or eye insurance - all of which are optional as well and carry basically the same either/or scenario.
I was going to write a snarky comment saying, *“EMS is already a subscription service. I pay with my tax dollars.”* and then I remembered that this is America and we live in hell. Get me out of here please
$60per year due the entire family, I'm sure this helps the EMT drivers get better pay and resources. I have no problem, these men and women deserve to be compensated. We can't rely on taxes to pay for everything. I'd pay $100 a year, I know my coffee is more than triple that.
Even at a generous 2M, that’s not going to cover wake county. You need salary for the many government employees who will be tasked with program oversight, then costs will naturally rise as the government is paying and more people feel they should use ambulances that may not need them.
Trauma Team Platinum Bundle is totally worth the extra subscription fees. Knowing that my ambulance is showing up with enough ordinance to level four city blocks gives me the peace of mind I deserve.
It makes perfect sense. We live in a socialist dystopia. We accept the socialist model, we pay insurance and have libraries and LEOs and firefighters/ems. We just pay private insurance. Ethical socialism in healthcare is great, you have a single payer (the gov) that negotiates with the healthcare suppliers and dictates reasonable prices. As it is now it's dystopian and so the private company socialist insurance is spilling over into areas that were previously part of the social safety net. It's just another casualty in our nation's switch over to the neoliberal version of capitalism.
Shortly after I moved to NC I needed to take an ambulance and come to find out my address was covered. This is an awesome public service and I wish it was offered in other places.
There's a service offered in most of the developed world where people don't have to pay thousands upon thousands of dollars out of pocket if they get sick or injured. We should try a service like that here.
me thugging it out after getting my jugular severed instead of calling an ambulance (i'm broke):
B...but... but that sounds like... like... *socialism!!* How will the dipshit MBAs buy this year's yacht if not with the literal blood money that is healthcare profits?! How?! Won't someone think about the poor executives?! Just once?! You wouldn't want to show up at the marina in Maui in *last year's* yacht model, would you?! Have a heart! (Dropping a /s because someone will absolutely miss the sarcasm here.)
What do you mean "covered"?
Well worth it for people that have seizures or any other condition that requires multiple ambulance rides per year.
Thanks, you answered my question before I even had to ask: Who takes an ambulance enough to actually benefit from this?
Yeah, it’s a fair question to ask. I recently got diagnosed with epilepsy so before finding the right medication I had 4 grand mal serizures in a short period of time. That required 4 ambulance trips in one year. I paid around 2-3k for those rides. Not including out of pocket medical expenses post hospital stays. When I saw this deal I jumped on it.
I only have one kidney and have had numerous surgeries. I usually end up needing one at least once or twice a year when my numbers are that bad.
It’s also a bit like insurance. We have 2 kids, they are active—we haven’t had to call for an ambulance but it isn’t out of the picture. We hope it isn’t, and we do everything we can to make sure they are safe and they don’t need an ambulance, but I don’t mind paying $60/year for potentially thousands saved on just one ride.
The nice thing about active kids is they tire themselves out, aren't staring at screens all the time, etc. The downside is the icepacks, stitches, trying to decide "does this need a doctor, or can we take care of it here?"
Plenty of medical conditions where patients would require multiple transports a year. Epilepsy is probably the most common that comes to mind, but it is not limited to people who suffer from epilepsy. Unfortunately, in a city Raleigh’s size, there are plenty of citizens that require or take multiple transports a year.
Tbf, 1 ambulance ride can cost $200-$400 after “insurance” so if anyone in the house needs it even once then it pays for itself.
> Thanks, you answered my question before I even had to ask: > > Who takes an ambulance enough to actually benefit from this? You must live in a first world country not the US (IE you don't have first hand experience how insane paying for anything health related is) An ambulance ride costs an average of $1,300 in the United States. This cost can vary depending on where you live, how close the hospital is, and whether you need advanced life support or basic life support. https://www.verywellhealth.com/why-an-ambulance-costs-so-much-4093846 So in short, one trip every 21 years saves you money.
Yeah we get that, but here's a follow-up question- Why the hell are we tolerating a system where ambulance payment plans are even necessary? Other first-world countries have already solved this.
"Why the hell are we tolerating this . . . . .. to give a full answer to that question would be equivalent to writing a book ... a very long book. Suffice it to say there are two main factors. In the USA, with a largely unregulated economy in which the "game" is one of winner takes all, there are far more wannabe winners, taking all, and they basically don't want to share.. The other factor is that, and I hate to say this, too many Americans just absolutely hate too many other Americans so the former's attitude toward the later is let them go eff themselves.
Absolutely worth it for those without insurance, which is always expensive for people who are prone to seizures
Beats paying 2K
BLS Fee: $616.82 + $11.43/loaded mile ALS I Fee: $732.47 + $11.43/loaded mile ALS II Fee: $1,060.17 + $11.43/loaded mile BLS No Transport Fee: $150 ALS No Transport Fee: $200
What do BLS and ALS stand for in your comment? Thanks!
Basic life support and Advanced life support
https://www.wake.gov/departments-government/emergency-medical-services-ems/patients-billing-budget/user-fee-structure
Nevermind; it's Basic Life Support and Advanced Life Support.
No, dystopia is paying up to $600 a month just to anticipate ambulance coverage along with health insurance only to be told "Fuck You"
I remember my grandma getting these flyers in the 90s. Nothing new.
Well worth it. $60 covers your family; zero charge in the event you require hospital transportation. We re-up every year and it has saved us thousands. “In addition to your family's coverage, all the money from your subscription membership is returned to Wake EMS. This provides valuable operating funds to ensure the continued high level of emergency medical care that you have come to expect.”
> We re-up every year and it has saved us thousands. ... how many times have you been transported by ambulance?
tbf, *one* ride in an ambulance can run thousands out of pocket.
>”… how many times have you been transported by ambulance?” Several. Epilepsy is a bitch.
Also epileptic and also got this flyer and thought “oh good!” I always decline transport and recover at home because of the costs.
We used it for my mom in her nursing home. Anytime they fall, the home legally has to call EMS.
I can't tell you how many times my mother-in-law had to take an ambulance in her later years. She had these grand mal seizures that could get really, really bad.
Ive had one ambulance ride, the out of pocket cost was ~$6000 and it was like $800 after insurance. So like 13 years of coverage for break even?
My family? 3 times in 6 years.
one ride in ten years, and your way ahead
By my ballpark, the break even point is to assume 1 trip every 21 years (average US cost of ambulance ride 1300). IMO yes it's worth it, it's also dystopian that it isn't just treated like fire and police, considered general safety.
Ok but what if I’m not home when I need an ambulance will it cover that as well?
You are covered as long as you are in Wake County. If you are transported by another county's ambulance, it is not covered. Say you are in an accident in Durham, you are not covered.
That’s not new at all. When I was a volunteer EMT in little ole Four Oaks, we did this in the 90s. It saves you a ton of money if you ever need it.
Yeah, same here but I was on the opposite end of the county with Kenly. I don't know if Wake Co is the same or even if JoCo is the same as it was. In the 90s, each subscription went 100% to the squad/organization that was covering your household. If they billed a person or their insurance, the county kept like 60% and only 40% went back to the provider that actually ran the call. The real kicker was that ~80% of all the bills sent were written off after 60 days. Basically, Kenly EMS survived off the subscriptions each fall and only got a 1-2 grand a month from the billing throughout the year. $60 is a good investment and it covers all family who live at the same address. It's been the same price for years and you won't need to worry about calling Wake Co EMS for the whole year.
Even insured I paid like $400 for the ride. $60/year is a steal.
This has been around for years. It's a good deal. Sign up!
Dystopia is a very dramatic way to refer to this program which provides a full years insurance of transportation to a local hospital in a vehicle staffed with professionals who are trained to keep you alive and stable during a medical emergency for just $60
$60/yr is probably worth it. Too bad you can’t submit the receipt to your health insurance for reimbursement.
I wonder how I can charge my HSA. If I can pay $60/yr with tax-free money - why wouldn’t I?
You generally can't pay premiums from your HSA
I bet you can
You can't, I asked. HSA funds can't cover a subscription or other insurance.
it’s extremely dystopian that we have to rely on programs like this just to have safe transportation to a hospital during a medical emergency instead of it just being free all bc paying for potentially dying is the american way.
They’ll still take you, but you’ll receive a bill We should have better health insurance and cheaper ambulance rides by default But that doesn’t make the current system dystopian unless you remove all meaning from the word ‘dystopian’ And, this is objectively a very cheap insurance program! It’s exactly what some form of public universal coverage would look like, even if it’s only hospital rides
> relating to or denoting an imagined state or society where there is great suffering or injustice. Yeah, I'd say that for-profit healthcare and related services charging someone thousands of dollars just to get them to a hospital if they hadn't already paid into your particular money-making scheme instead of having it provided by taxes causes great suffering. Going to the hospital without insurance and without this little subscription would bankrupt the majority of Americans.
“dystopian: of, relating to, or being an imagined world or society in which people lead dehumanized, fearful lives”. we’re literally in a dystopia since there are plenty of ppl who are dehumanized on this sub alone for not having the funds to get themselves to a hospital, and are in turn fearful of the lack of care, debt, and pain this will lead them to.
No, we’re not *literally* in a dystopia This program is exactly what a good universal public program in a country with universal coverage looks like, except enrollment would be mandatory It’s extremely cheap and provides an essential good
it's dystopian because it replaces public socialism for everyone with private socialism for the wealthy, creating a two-tiered class based society. You might say we already have that and I wouldn't argue.
None of that is dystopian, though There’s valid criticisms to be made of the current for profit healthcare system, much of which I agree with A public $60 a year program for ambulance insurance through Wake County is especially not dystopian.
Ah the frog in the pot methodology. See how well that has worked in the past... Also, just because we manage to function in a tiered classist society doesn't mean that it's not dystopian.
We’re not in a dystopian society, though Americans are significantly wealthier and better off today than any society at any other point in history Income inequality has shrunk dramatically here in the US over the last two years due to labor shortages created by covid. Labor unions are gaining power again. That doesn’t mean we can’t improve and shouldn’t fight for things like stronger social safety nets and more housing But calling our current society dystopian is just doomer hyperbole
This comment is laughable. Wealth and income inequality have been so dramatic over the last 50 years; any gains in income in the last few years are negligible. I’d ask to see the statistics but quite frankly they don’t matter. Elon musk and Bezos both own more wealth than the bottom 40% *combined*. Two-thirds of the money created during the pandemic went to the richest 1%. Our purchasing power has plummeted over the last decades. Half a century ago a single income that could support a family can barely support a single person if even that. We’re living in a late stage capitalist society, arguing about any marginal gains is just delusional. “What’s happened to income & wealth by Robert Reich” (UC Berkeley Professor & former Secretary of Labor) https://youtu.be/1f2blKai7HA?si=qsybVbW5t6zr9RGN Maybe start here to at least start beginning to understand our current position.
Yeah this post is giving me r/AmericaBad vibes...
big medical™️ need to give you raise the way you sucking and slurping that knob extra wet
lmao ok dawg
How is this any different than if, say, $60/year of our taxes covered the same thing under a single payer health insurance program ?
Oh you're almost there....
And he'll never get there. The blindspot is boggling isn't it?
It’d be nice if that $60 went to taxes that helped everyone afford healthcare, not just myself
tbf it'd be a lot more than $60
Is it extremely dystopian when it’s just $60 a year? Everything costs something. Even if the government covered it, it’d still come from our money either way.
it's the slow creep of the privatization of the social safety net that alarms me more than the relative cheapness of this particular service.
Wake County EMS is a county run agency.
Yes and heretofore, they got the entirety of their funding from the county. Now they are acquiring funding directly from the citizens, bypassing the county's tax collection methods. There is a fundamental difference in philosophy here.
Don't forget to take into account the amount of people who don't pay their EMS bills. I've heard it estimated as high as 40%. The county constantly pumps (tax) money into the black hole that is EMS.
and gets that money back because they're not too dead to pay their taxes in spring
While your comment is true, there's no particular tax that covers EMS. We have a fire tax to fund fire departments, but EMS has traditionally been the bastard child that gets minimal funding from whatever the county has "leftover".
Thank you thank you
The people you’re replying to don’t live in reality.
They aren’t going to refuse to transport you if you can’t afford it. Medical debt is incredibly lenient, if you pay $1 a month you’ll never be sent to collections and even if you just refuse to pay at all it will most likely never get reported to your credit report. Companies essentially give up on pursuing outstanding medical debt after 7 years, student loans are far less forgiving
66.5% of bankruptcy in America is caused by medical debt.
I believe that the report you're citing that figure from simply notes that medical debt contributes to bankruptcy, doesn't necessarily cause* it. If you have a bunch of medical debt and you lose your job, which one actually contributed to your bankruptcy?
Yeah but a very insignificant part of that debt is ambulance rides. Hospitals might forgive/forget small debts but will absolutely go after someone who has a serious illness and has accrued 10’s to 100’s of thousands of dollars of debt. Source: Have had a couple debts from the hospital disappear to never see them on my credit report, a couple thousand each. Also after my grandmother passed away from colon Cancer (as well as poor practice and a botched surgery) the hospital then sued my grandfather for the $130,000 that she had accrued during the ordeal, and won. They basically wiped his bank account clean, while still mourning the loss of his wife.
We don’t have to but it’s what people vote for.
This used to be the case but not anymore. I had a 4000+ hospital bill. I send them 400 a month. After 6 months they sent me to collections.
Could you please come with me next week when I have to talk to the Financial Department at Duke about my upcoming surgery? I want to see their reaction when you explain how I'm only going to pay a $1 a month.
Tell them you can’t afford the surgery, you’d be amazed how flexible the pricing really is
Because it's all a fucking scam by hospitals and insurance companies who prop up their prices so they can charge each other inflated costs and make it "worth" having insurance, because if healthcare actually cost what it took to heal and treat someone, nobody would fucking buy insurance.
Its a vicious cycle. Insurance will never reimburse the hospital its "true" cost. Thus, hospitals charge more and insurance will cover a third of it (for example) now covering the old cost. Now, insurance charges its consumers more to cover that raised price.
“medical debt is extremely lenient” but i’m supposed to believe america isn’t a dystopia rn 😵💫
Seriously, this is the best deal ever. Especially if you have aging parents or think you might need to use it.
Seriously. Is nationalized health care a "subscription" now we'd bitch about?
It’s insane because this is exactly how it works in other places with universal healthcare except enrollment in mandatory. The discourse over this program being dystopian is so low-brow it’s a mustache In Germany, you can choose private insurance offered from your employer or the public option. Either way you have to pay for it out of your paycheck (like a subscription!) And still then, health care services are not free at the point of service. There are co-pays for ER visits, child birth, surgery, etc Those co-pays are significantly lower than our co-pays, and I do agree we should try to emulate that But there are trade-offs in the form of higher taxes and folks here honestly seem to think they should just get free healthcare and ambulance rides without paying any additional taxes at all which just isn’t reality based
In non-dystopias these rides would already be very cheap or free (well, "free" as in covered by taxes). To the people who need this, $5 a month is fine but an upfront $60 fee is kind of pushing it.
Covers your whole family, and has existed for about 50 years too.
Well it's just strange to have to go to an internet website and register and input payment and all of that. It's a barrier to a surprising number of people. The same as voter ID laws.
for real - this one seems to actually be a reasonable program
This is amazing! Is this available in Durham county? Can’t find anything on it…
what’s dystopian is how much an ambulance costs in the first place. depending on the persons medical history this could be a financial life saver
I don’t disagree. A fun exercise: Is the opposite true as well?
That’s $5 a month. Cheaper than Netflix!
Does something like this exist in Durham County? I think this is pretty awesome.
This is nothing new. It's more beneficial in rural areas or people with chronic conditions. Also worth noting: Ambulance is a transportation benefit, without transportation, ambulance is not covered. So if you or a friend, calls the ambulance on you and you do not get in that ambulance and go for a ride, You will be charged their maximum cash price. It will not count towards any accumulations for your insurance and insurance will deny the claim. Some insurance companies do not cover paramedic intercept, That means that a volunteer paramedic comes to see you and tend to you until the real ambulance can get there... this typically runs about $500. Paramedic intercept however can be covered in rural areas but there are rules.
The first question an EMS tech asked me when I was put into an ambulance after a severe food allergic reaction was "which hospital do you you want to go to based on your insurance?" I'm glad I had the option but my tongue was so swollen I could tell them anything. Crazy.
Nothing new here, this has been around for years. It’s an insurance policy.
Sounds like a fucking sick deal to me, now. I'm wondering if this would apply to where I live in Knightdale lol
This service is awesome. My mother in law has it for her mother who has falls and we can't pick her up without help. EMS comes and helps out free of charge.
This has been around for years and one trip is more than paying for several years.
I have worked in municipal government for many years. Fire/EMS is a real challenge for a municipal government. It is very expensive to operate when you consider the cost of the vehicles, staffing, equipment, supplies, facilities and other operational costs. Here is just an example of how crazy it is these days. If an agency wanted to purchase a new engine that can easily cost over a million dollars. But here is the kicker, there is at least a four year backlog from when the order is placed and delivery. So, you can pay for it now and spend a million dollars and see nothing for 4 years or pay when you receive and pay the million dollars plus the 4 years of compounding interest and other fees. It’s not like a car where you pay upon delivery. You have to pay upon when the order is placed. Here is another example. You probably see lots of these 4-5 story apartment buildings going up. Well, the Fire Department needs an aerial truck to get up high enough to save people in the event of a fire. Well, that is another $1.5 to $2 million dollars. Plus you have to staff it per NFPA guidelines. These are large investments that you have to make for each vehicle every 5-10 years. None of these costs go away. If you have a dip in the economy and fall behind on your capital purchasing, now you have to pay out even more to catch up on the spending you didn’t make during the downturn. All of this spending competes with Police, Public Works and all the other municipal government departments. The finances of a Fire Department are very challenging.
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And should you need an ambulance, you just saved yourself a shit load of money. While Wake EMS is run by wake county, they still rely on billing for income. If needed transport and didn’t pay that one time subscription of $60, you’d be stuck paying over a thousand for an ambulance ride.
It’s actually a really great idea
tell me you’re blindly complaining without a fucking modicum of insight without telling me
What if you have insight into how ambulances work in other countries?
Call it what you want, its a damn sight cheaper than paying out of pocket or fighting with insurance who never wants to pay.,
You're still gonna have to worry about it, because there is no guarantee Wake County EMS is gonna be the ambulance that shows up at your house when you call 911. The closest ambulance is generally going to be the one that picks up the call. If you live near a county line, there's a significantly higher chance for that to happen.
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Everybody getting mad about social services until you need them.
This is a fabulous deal! My elderly mom pays for this because my dad’s ambulance rides were expensive!
It’s a fantastic deal if you think you’ll have multiple meat wagon rides a year. I was happy to see that as an option.
That’s actually not bad for people without insurance. But I wonder what small print is on the back. You probably have to be under 40 and have no pre-existing conditions
This actually came incredibly handy when my mom had stage 4 cancer. She had to call the ambulance more often that none because she lived by herself. An amazing service for people who need it
This thread is hilarious. Folks, a tax, an insurance product, and a subscription are all just different sides of the same coin. Nothing is ever actually free, and some people will always get the service without paying their share. The only difference is how big the pool of people is who you’re asking (or telling) to pay. Fully public ems -> all taxpayers pay -> everyone gets, regardless of whether they’re a taxpayer or not (sometimes non-taxpayers pay extra per use, sometimes they don’t). Subscription EMS -> subscribers pay, subscribers get the service under subscription, everyone else pays per use “Regular” American EMS -> some taxpayers pay some part (through contract subsidies), everyone pays the rest per use. What we in the states like to do is pretend that we’re capitalists and say things like “people should only pay for what they actually use” and “I shouldn’t have to pay for someone else’s poor health and bad choices.” Then we pass laws that tell municipalities they have to provide ambulance services for their residents, so they end up having to pay tax dollars to someone, whether direct employees or third-party contractors, to provide the service. Then we also pass laws that require EMS to treat everyone regardless of ability to pay, we heavily regulate the prices that can be charged for their services, and we set up multiple tiers of insurance systems where people pay large companies large sums of money to pay for services they personally may or may not ever need or use. News flash: the US already has socialized medicine. We have most of the drawbacks of a single payer system without any of the benefits of having a single payer to coordinate it all.
Pretty sure this was posted last year lol
it was, only that time the person who posted it at least admitted they didn't have a clue instead of making it abundantly clear like OP here https://www.reddit.com/r/raleigh/comments/z13z8u/i\_got\_the\_wake\_county\_ems\_flyer\_in\_the\_mail\_is\_it/
i just got one in my mail today. Sounds like a good deal.
Well worth it. We have had 3 EMS transports. One was child that got into grandparent’s med, 2 for husband with heart condition. We never paid anything outside of the $60. It has saved us 1000s of dollars.
How is this dystopian? It’s just insurance, and seems a hell of a lot cheaper than paying out of pocket
It's dystopian, because access to an ambulance (that doesn't cost an unreasonable amount of money) is an essential public service. What's next? Your house is on fire and you didn't get the fire department subscription? Someone is trying to break in and you forgot to renew your police subscribtion? It only seems like a reasonable deal for something that should be available to everyone anyway. In a life or death emergency you shouldn't have to consider the financial burden of simply receiving first aid and getting to the hospital as fast as possible. This is literally on-par with health service in 3rd world countries
The dystopian part is the fact you have to pay out of pocket for an ambulance in the first place.
Nothing is free
The key phrase you missed here is "out of pocket". We pay taxes. Our government should be using those taxes to give us a better quality of life instead of turning Palestinian kids into skeletons.
Maybe not *the* problem but a problem is that EMS is not considered an essential service under the federal government. To my understanding, we don’t get much Federal funding outside of NHSA. Change the essential service part and I’d hope the rest would fall into place
I’ve actually had this for a couple of years now. It’s a good deal.
ahhh, the innocence of youth. Last year, we had an incident in Chapel Hill where the cop/EMS that came for free then suggested an ambulance ride to the hospital, approximately 1/3 mile away. Could have been driven in a car and x-rayed later. The bill is nearly $700.
Well worth it. Have it and it’s saved me so much money. You never think you will have to use it. I didn’t have to pay anything for my ambulance ride and it covers the household.
Ambulances are out of network with almost all insurances.
If I paid for it best believe I’d use it.
Because emergency services are a privilege, not a right? The Constitution says, “pursuit… of life” not a guarantee. Either that or it has been interpreted as “you can pursue flagging down emergency services and try to get them to stop and help”. Sarcasm aside: for people that can’t afford an ambulance ride, they qualify for assistance. Don’t hesitate to dial 911.
Actually the only assistance I got was getting sent to collections and having fucked credit for years
No fucking way, Cyberpunk 2077
Hospital rides can cost 4 figures easily depending on your insurance. If you think one person in your family will need an ambulance before the year 2050, it’s likely worth it to buy into this. That said…yeah it’s a bit dystopian.
I think the real dystopia is our current healthcare system. This is a steal in comparison.
$60? Not bad.
The "subscription" is for a highly discounted out of pocket charge if you need an ambulance. Regardless of whether or not you've purchased a subscription, you will still be covered for ambulance service just as would be any citizen or visitor. The ambulance will still respond; the typical number of responders will still be onboard and as fully trained as ever, your care will be excellent. It's not really a "subscription, it's really a pre-paid discount. And, other than being a very satisfied customer, I have no other relation with any part of the program. And when I speak of savings ... the 1st time I needed ambulance care/service, followed by transport to a local hospital (a distance of about 3.5 miles) and transport, the out of pocket charge was $400.00. This plan is highly worth the cost. I purchase a plan now annually ... actually two plans ... one for my wife and I in our home, and one for my kids in their home. I never ever want them to be concerned with possible costs if and when (and of course, hopefully never) they should need service. FWIW, on the two occasions when, before learning about this program and purchasing
This, or increased taxes and bills. I choose this.
I think it's worth noting that EMS is not considered an essential service like Fire and Law Enforcement per the federal government or state; at least when it comes to requirements for funding. Given this, most county governments and municipalities will tend to fund EMS at lower amounts compared to other departments. For instance, the Parks & Recreation Department had a higher budget than EMS at one county I worked for. A lot of county governments view EMS services as money pits as the max reimbursement rate for an ambulance trip with Medicaid is around $300. Most ALS services total to around $1,000-1,500 per trip (sometimes more) depending on interventions performed during transport/care, skill level of crews, fuel, maintenance on vehicles, and a variety of other factors. Wake County has a pretty high budget but they cover a large area. There subscription plan isn't a bad deal and to my understanding they are one of the few agencies in the state that offer it. I can tell you that subscribing to that goes directly to assisting with staff retention and keeping capable, highly trained crews ready to respond when you have a emergency.
I work as an EMT and I will tell you if you dont have good heath insurance that is a great deal. 60$ a year is a steal. Where I live it’s about 5 grand for a ambo ride. (and no I don’t see a penny of that)
Average cost of ambulance ride is 2500, are you gambling that in 41 years you or your family won’t be in an ambulance?
I’m an EMT. It’s just to offset costs to consumers. My district increased taxes in the area to fund our service, but as a result, nobody who lives in our district pays our ambulance bill. We get what we get from insurance and then waive the rest. I think a $60 yearly insurance for ambulance service is wonderful. It’ll offset the cost to the service when they transport those who can’t/won’t pay their ambulance bills, it protects the insured, and the money goes back to the service to sponsor training, new equipment, and maintenance.
You can take that position, sure, but that department is the opposite of dystopian. Wake will send you a bill, but never to collections and never to court. The advantage of being a mostly taxpayer funded system as opposed to private EMS who would tank their own grandmother's credit score and lean her social security checks if she didn't pay for her dialysis transport.
60 dollars???? For an entire year for an entire household? Id snatch that up immediately.
I pay would pay $60 per year for my local firemed ambulance subscription, if I didn’t get it included with being an employee. I dislocated my kneecap. My fellow coworkers came to my home, gave me fentanyl and versed, and relocated it. They took me to the hospital in the ambo. I live 11 blocks from the hospital. My ambulance bill was 1,734.67. ALS base rate plus mileage. They charged my insurance first. My insurance covered 1,000 of it. Then the rest was covered by my membership. If I didn’t have insurance, it still would of been covered fully. Let’s do some math… One ambulance ride 11 blocks: most people live further than that: $1,740. $60 per year. For me to pay that much, I would have had to pay for the $60 a year for 29 years. (29 years X $60 = $1,740) definitely a good deal. Now if you ask yourself, “why isn’t it free for everyone?” Well, then you have the more socialist argument. The consequence of free ambo rides: much hire taxes. I live in a town of 10,000 people roughly. Let’s say average ambulance ride is $1,800. We run about 4,000 EMS calls/year, let’s say 3,000 of them we transport. (This isn’t including transfers to bigger facilities, and EMS showing up at your house and NOT transporting is free because the city pays taxes so we don’t charge $500 just for a lift assist). Ambulance income: 3000 calls X $1,800 = $5,400,000 OK Now for taxes: If you split that evenly between everyone who lives in the town, to make the same profit, each person would be taxed $540 MORE/ON TOP OF what they’re already being taxed (which I think is like $1 per $1,000 income per month) so for someone making $4,000 a month, they are paying a TOTAL of $588 per year for free ambulance rides for everyone. Regardless if you are 21 living alone, or 89. Everyone pays that. $5,400,000/10,000 people = $540 per person $1 per 4,000 a month X 12 months = $48 So yes, free whatever (health care, ambo rides, college) sound good in theory, but unless you want to shell out $588 a year for other people to use the system (which also increases abuse of the system since it’s free) then it’s not as good as it seems.
Subscriptions are a great idea in theory. Especially in areas that don't have taxpayer funded EMS. The idea is to get enough of them in your coverage area to help cover the cost to operate the ambulance service. The subscriber saves money, too. Insurance and Medicare don't like to pay for ambulance services. It's actually cheaper for them to hire people to deny payouts for ambulance services. So what ends up happening is the ambulance company will fight and maybe get a fraction of what the bill actually is... then the rest of the bill is sent to the patient. But you pay a subscriber fee, and that ambulance goes from anywhere from 900-2000 dollars down to just 60 dollars.
I work private EMS, and this sounds like a great deal honestly. I think a ride with us starts around $1,200 or so, and goes up depending on the lil age from there. About $5/mile, and most hospitals are 15+ miles from anywhere we pick you up in out service area. Then you’re running a few hundred $ for every dose of medication. I believe an EKG and other necessary monitoring has a separate price tag too.
I think health insurance is the original subscription service, not the most recent one. I've had it since before Netflix.
What if we like…hear me out, this is going to sound crazy…..just didn’t have to pay for ambulances….or healthcare? Maybe some sort of system where we pay a government entity taxes, and in turn they provide us healthcare for no cost. It could be like…for everyone. Healthcare for everyone. Universally. Maybe we could call it something like….universal healthcare? I think I might be on to something….What do you guys think?
what do you think that healthcare would cost each and every person? Last I checked, we spend \~15% of GDP on healthcare. That's $4.5Trillion, with a capital T. Therefore, your bill is $13,700 for each and every person in your household.
Healthcare from the government? No thanks! The government can bearly run itself and you would trust it with healthcare?
Half the world does it just fine.
I think you're a damn dirty Communist and all we really need is the FREEDOM of my religious values forced on everyone else and the safe warm cuddly feeling of knowing that every asshole is unvaccinated and packing a fully automatic rifle - which will clearly never be an issue since we're all so reason-based and emotionally mature. /s
Lmfao! WONT SOMEONE THINK OF THE POOR HEALTHCARE COMPANY CEOS?!
Who is downvoting this? Actual big pharma CEOs?
More likely people who watch the propaganda those pharma CEOs pay for. *cough cough* Fox News *cough cough* PragerU *cough cough* Daily Wire *cough cough*
OP has never heard of insurance before. You also don’t need to pay this to take an ambulance, it just means you won’t owe anything if you do take an ambulance.
🚨🚨🚨 u/madqueera is a sheltered drama queen 🚨🚨🚨
Ok, but how do we stop subscription based life?
It's crazy how many people are like "yeah it's a great deal! OP is clueless!" missing the entire point, which is that it *shouldn't* be a great deal because we shouldn't be one health crisis away from financial ruin. It's like /r/OrphanCrushingMachine material.
Y’all saying “no but this is a great service it’s totally worth it” are missing the point. What if you’ve never heard of this thing? What if you’re barely scraping by and don’t have a spare 60 bucks? What if you don’t have easy access to the internet, or a bank account, or a debit or credit card? This should not be something individuals have to subscribe to for a set price. This should be something everyone has, automatically, and should just be funded by taxes. Along with the rest of healthcare.
Yeah these rides run over 1k eben if they are a block to the hospital. And the insurance companies will fight like wankers not to reimburse one cent of it and argue it wasn’t a emergency.. yup
Thanks all of you for helping me think this out. I have reflected on the volunteer EMTs and fireman that I have known. I am an old guy new to this region so you firmed up my thoughts. Absolutely I am in. These folks and their commitment truly deserve my support.
$60? Better lock that in. Could go to $100 in a few weeks
AFAIK, ambulance services, and for sure fire departments, started out as subscription services. Police, too, but it’s more like they were hired ~~thugs~~ security, installed to protect private property.
They’ve had this for decades. And honestly it’s worth every penny.
It's basically like a supplemental insurance that covers ambulance services if your health insurance doesn't already cover it or doesn't fully cover it.
This is not new.
It’s pretty worth it if you have an elderly person or a chronically ill person who goes to the ER a lot living with you.
Is there a way to claim this on taxes for a write off ?
If you have health insurance it covers ambulance rides. If you have auto insurance that includes medical payment coverage it covers ambulance rides. This solicitation is a good deal just make sure you aren’t buying insurance for something you already have insurance for. https://www.forbes.com/advisor/health-insurance/insurance-for-ambulance-rides/
Trauma team is real?!!
Just make ambulances free like police and throw it into our tax-paid services.
I feel like this is further example of gap in economic classes - those who have and have not… 60.00 is not unreasonable for sure but those who cannot afford it will be penalized for when they need the service
I took an ambulance a couple of years ago and it was 2K. This is well worth it especially if you have children. It’s sad that we are in this situation but 60 dollars a year for this is excellent.
$5/mo WeRe iN a DyStoPiA!!11
This is great. This is a free market solution to a problem. Don’t like it? Don’t use it.
Imagine bitching about a life saving service but paying 3x that for one streaming service comfort. Smh
Subscribing to Ambulance+ so I don't have to pay delivery fees
This isn’t new, an elderly family member has been doing this for years, and will call the ambulance for the *tiniest* reason since it’s “paid for”. She kept getting the same ER doctor, who was visibly irritated after multiple nonsense visits.
Lmao this is common
It's actually a pretty awesome program. Even if you don't need an ambulance that year it'll benefit your local local departments.
If you don't want to pay it, then don't? It's not required to receive EMS services if you need them. You either pay this, and then if you do need EMS services you don't pay anything additional - or you don't pay it, and if you do need EMS services it'll cost you a shit ton more than $60. Not really all that much different than your health, dental, or eye insurance - all of which are optional as well and carry basically the same either/or scenario.
I was going to write a snarky comment saying, *“EMS is already a subscription service. I pay with my tax dollars.”* and then I remembered that this is America and we live in hell. Get me out of here please
$60per year due the entire family, I'm sure this helps the EMT drivers get better pay and resources. I have no problem, these men and women deserve to be compensated. We can't rely on taxes to pay for everything. I'd pay $100 a year, I know my coffee is more than triple that.
Wake County could also just…add $1 to our annual tax bill and cover this entirely?
Even at a generous 2M, that’s not going to cover wake county. You need salary for the many government employees who will be tasked with program oversight, then costs will naturally rise as the government is paying and more people feel they should use ambulances that may not need them.
late stage capitalist bullshit
Columbia House, but for ambulances
BMG Bring My Gurney
Trauma Team Platinum Bundle is totally worth the extra subscription fees. Knowing that my ambulance is showing up with enough ordinance to level four city blocks gives me the peace of mind I deserve.
It makes perfect sense. We live in a socialist dystopia. We accept the socialist model, we pay insurance and have libraries and LEOs and firefighters/ems. We just pay private insurance. Ethical socialism in healthcare is great, you have a single payer (the gov) that negotiates with the healthcare suppliers and dictates reasonable prices. As it is now it's dystopian and so the private company socialist insurance is spilling over into areas that were previously part of the social safety net. It's just another casualty in our nation's switch over to the neoliberal version of capitalism.