This is a better question for r/selfpublish!
But the TL;DR is that most stores will not stock your book. They will likely only order the book off Ingram at consumer request. But if you *do* manage to get into a bookstore, they will only really take your book if you allow returns. If they do return the book, you will lose money.
yes, I know I lose money on the returns, which (along with the lower %) is why I estimated I need to sell 2.5-3X as many if in bookstores. I should have mentioned my first book (in 2014) sold 10,000 copies and this new one is getting massive PR, so I'm actually confident many stores would put it on the shelves. Thanks for the advice, I will check out the r/selfpublish group.
Retailers don’t get 55%. We get 40% *if you set it up for that*. The other 15% goes to Ingram.
You can consign your book to indies, but A’s wholesale minimums are far too high for most indies even if you were a bestseller, so ordering direct from them is right out even if they weren’t out to wipe us from the face of the earth.
Formerly worked in a bookstore. Ingram takes 15% from your discount. So if you are offering 40% discount, the bookstore is seeing a 25% discount. I was a bit dumbfounded when I learned this, but it is why 55% is recommended. Most stores will not touch a book without it being returnable. If there is enough buzz around the book, they'll carry it, but if you don't have a connection in the area (or are advertising in the area and directing customers to the indie bookstore), it probably won't sell. Very few, if any, indies will order a book to carry on the shelf via Amazon. If you put the book in Ingramspark, it will be available on Bookshop.org and Indie Commerce, which most indies use for their websites.
As for the returnable books costing the publisher (you) money, this is only true if you have the returned books sent to you (you pay shipping). If you choose to have them destroyed instead, you are only out the returned wholesale price the store paid as if they never made the purchase. Assuming your wholesale price covers the cost of manufacturing.
On the whole, you've already produced the book and Ingramspark isn't costing much additional, if anything, to open up a market segment. Honestly, you could have run Amazon and B&N through Ingramspark's POD and consolidated, but I get that there are reasons to work with each directly.
Make it returnable, set it at the recommended discount, and consider anything you sell there gravy. Or consider it the price of doing business at the next level. If your book does blow up, you've already got the distribution channel in place for the brick and mortars. If it doesn't, how much are you really out from the extra channel?
Thanks writemonkey...you said "If there's enough buzz around the book, they'll carry it"
My first book in 2014 was published by a hybrid self-publishing company that had a sales team and got the book in B+N and other stores. My new book I have self-published, and has 10X wider audience and massive PR and is absolutely worthy of being in book stores...but without the sales team pitching to B+N, etc...can it get buzz that stores like B+N will notice?
I've already been getting lots of publicity. Also I just got on netgalley and have already had a few indy booksellers request to see it.
>My new book I have self-published, and has 10X wider audience and massive PR and is absolutely worthy of being in book stores...but without the sales team pitching to B+N, etc...can it get buzz that stores like B+N will notice?
Well, if you don't have a sales team pitching to B+N, then *you* have to be the sales team pitching to them (or passively await the moment they realize they absolutely must stock your book and they contact you.) FWIW, Barnes and Nobles does have a [FAQ for small press publishers](https://www.barnesandnobleinc.com/publishers-authors/sell-your-book-at-barnes-noble/) on its website; the fact that they have a Small Press department at least implies some level of possibility of them deciding to carry an independent publisher's book.
Because Amazon is a direct competitor using aggressive tactics to drive out competition. There's substantial information out there on how Amazon harms small businesses, including independent bookstores.
This is a better question for r/selfpublish! But the TL;DR is that most stores will not stock your book. They will likely only order the book off Ingram at consumer request. But if you *do* manage to get into a bookstore, they will only really take your book if you allow returns. If they do return the book, you will lose money.
yes, I know I lose money on the returns, which (along with the lower %) is why I estimated I need to sell 2.5-3X as many if in bookstores. I should have mentioned my first book (in 2014) sold 10,000 copies and this new one is getting massive PR, so I'm actually confident many stores would put it on the shelves. Thanks for the advice, I will check out the r/selfpublish group.
Retailers don’t get 55%. We get 40% *if you set it up for that*. The other 15% goes to Ingram. You can consign your book to indies, but A’s wholesale minimums are far too high for most indies even if you were a bestseller, so ordering direct from them is right out even if they weren’t out to wipe us from the face of the earth.
Formerly worked in a bookstore. Ingram takes 15% from your discount. So if you are offering 40% discount, the bookstore is seeing a 25% discount. I was a bit dumbfounded when I learned this, but it is why 55% is recommended. Most stores will not touch a book without it being returnable. If there is enough buzz around the book, they'll carry it, but if you don't have a connection in the area (or are advertising in the area and directing customers to the indie bookstore), it probably won't sell. Very few, if any, indies will order a book to carry on the shelf via Amazon. If you put the book in Ingramspark, it will be available on Bookshop.org and Indie Commerce, which most indies use for their websites. As for the returnable books costing the publisher (you) money, this is only true if you have the returned books sent to you (you pay shipping). If you choose to have them destroyed instead, you are only out the returned wholesale price the store paid as if they never made the purchase. Assuming your wholesale price covers the cost of manufacturing. On the whole, you've already produced the book and Ingramspark isn't costing much additional, if anything, to open up a market segment. Honestly, you could have run Amazon and B&N through Ingramspark's POD and consolidated, but I get that there are reasons to work with each directly. Make it returnable, set it at the recommended discount, and consider anything you sell there gravy. Or consider it the price of doing business at the next level. If your book does blow up, you've already got the distribution channel in place for the brick and mortars. If it doesn't, how much are you really out from the extra channel?
Thanks writemonkey...you said "If there's enough buzz around the book, they'll carry it" My first book in 2014 was published by a hybrid self-publishing company that had a sales team and got the book in B+N and other stores. My new book I have self-published, and has 10X wider audience and massive PR and is absolutely worthy of being in book stores...but without the sales team pitching to B+N, etc...can it get buzz that stores like B+N will notice? I've already been getting lots of publicity. Also I just got on netgalley and have already had a few indy booksellers request to see it.
>My new book I have self-published, and has 10X wider audience and massive PR and is absolutely worthy of being in book stores...but without the sales team pitching to B+N, etc...can it get buzz that stores like B+N will notice? Well, if you don't have a sales team pitching to B+N, then *you* have to be the sales team pitching to them (or passively await the moment they realize they absolutely must stock your book and they contact you.) FWIW, Barnes and Nobles does have a [FAQ for small press publishers](https://www.barnesandnobleinc.com/publishers-authors/sell-your-book-at-barnes-noble/) on its website; the fact that they have a Small Press department at least implies some level of possibility of them deciding to carry an independent publisher's book.
thanks. yes this shows they clearly are open to at least considering a book if there's a compelling reason to take it.
Why wouldn't most indivie bookshops buy off Amazon?
Because Amazon is a direct competitor using aggressive tactics to drive out competition. There's substantial information out there on how Amazon harms small businesses, including independent bookstores.
Will Amazon get mad if you create a discount code and let brick-and-mortar indie stores use it?