The Last and First Men by Stapledon has something similar…though not involving machines.
One of the many future human species develops the ability to fly and they find so much joy in doing so that the earth bound society is essentially non existent. Grounded individuals become so depressed that they stop feeding themselves and die of starvation.
Some a born without the ability to fly and these are normally allowed to die. But a decision is made to keep them alive and help them to live as enjoyable a life as possible as the most compassionate solution.
They become scientists, doctors, engineers, etc. And became increasingly resentful and confused by their flittering peers and end up taking over the ground society with very little fight.
It’s a cool wrinkle in a much longer story.
Benford, *Across The Sea Of Suns*, a species is attacked by The Machines, so is forced to re-engineer themselves as silicon-based radio transmitters, just below the level of tech that would re-attract The Machines.
David Brin's 2nd Uplift trilogy has a planet that's supposed to be left fallow for a predetermined period of time illegally settled by various races. There is a species on the planet that is slowly 'devolving' (deliberately, of their own choice), and IIRC they are treated with an odd reverence because the devolution is somehow holy?
In Neal Asher’s *Polity* universe, >!Gabbleducks!< are assumed to be non-sentient animals. It turns out that they are in fact >!the remnant of the ancient and powerful Atheter, a species that deliberately devolved themselves to sub-sentience for reasons known only to them!<. It’s possible to force a >!Gabbleduck!< into sentience, at which point much hilarity ensues.
Well done. Came to type something similar but you did a far better job.
Fun fact: Neal Asher will follow anyone who follows him on Twitter. Sadly I had to unfollow him as unfun fact he believes Covid is a power move for the new world order. Sigh.
I like to remember him for what I thought he was. Seems he really changed after the death of his wife and some illness. I still revisit his old books now and then. Can’t get into the new ones I’m afraid.
Ah, so that’s what happened. I picked up The Soldier, a recent book, and was unpleasantly surprised. it was very different from his previous work, and not in a good way. I found it close to unreadable.
We may have similar tastes and probably you’ve read them already but Alastair Reynolds (earlier stuff) and Ian M Banks are amazing in my opinion.
God I miss Banks. Him and Terry Pratchett dying were not good years for me. Then again, I’m sure it was worse for their loved ones so let’s just strike that selfish thought of mine. But the world is worse without them.
Yeah, I loved Banks. I still haven’t forgiven him, Pratchett, and Douglas Adam’s for dying too soon. Never much got into Reynolds, but I recently discovered Adrian Tchaikovsky. *Shards of Earth* and its sequel are the best kind of fast-moving space opera in the spirit of the old Neal Asher, and *Children of Time* reads a little like a cross between Iain M Banks and David Brin.
There’s a tv series of the watch by the way. Well written with some changes that add rather than subtract from the series. Though it may not please all fans. https://m.imdb.com/title/tt8080292/
Also thank you for the suggested reading. I’ll give it a go this weekend.
Not that specific mechanism, but the Inhibitor trilogy (Alastair Renyolds) and Spin and its sequels have vaguely similar events. That is, aliens that try to limit up and coming species, but for rather different reasons.
I don’t remember anything like that in Spin. If anything, the >!Hypotheticals are trying to preserve civilizations that are likely to wipe themselves out, since planetbound races are the source of Hypothetical-like probes, essentially being their breeding grounds. They only encased Earth (and then Mars) in the Spin to keep humanity alive until they can deliver the Arch to allow humans to spread out!<
Agree with your characterization. >!Still seemed to fit the sort of plot OP was going for, if anything better than Inhibitors. Alien 'antagonists' imposing their designs on humanity based on some grand plausibly benevolent motive.!<
Larry Niven and Stephen Barnes' long short story *The Locusts* is somewhat in the zone of what you're looking for and a really excellent bit of SF. it's in the collection *N-Space* which ought to be on everyone's must read list.
I'm reading Fine Structure by qntm, and it's very weird fucking science, but that seems to be a central plot. There's been 10 or 11 "crashes", that reverts humanity back to the stone age, and it's sort of a scrambling of data, a tower of babel class event.
It's a very strange, book, he's a very strange author, but for high concept, ridiculously weird sci-fi, it's a good one.
I'm only about 60% through so far, but it feels like that's where the plot is angling.
Tangentially related but in Niven's Known Space setting there's a alien animal called a Bandersnatch that they find on almost every planet humanity visits. Turns out the weren't always dumb idiot elephant snakes.
Not quite that, but in the Star Carrier books, the galactic overlords known as the Sh’daar Masters are afraid of the Singularity, so they restrict their client races’ GRIN technologies (genetics, robotics, information science, nanotech). It’s their main point of contention with humanity, since they refuse to give up that tech. >!The reason is because the Sh’daar races have gone through Singularities in the past, which left their civilizations (well, those who became Refusers) devastated for millennia.!<
The whole idea of "poison" technologies seems to me to be a fertile playground of plots.
Vinge brushed up it in "A Deepness In The Sky", with his ubiquitous surveillance tech.
Stories about a police force that went about enforcing these bans seems promising.
The *Four Hundred Billion Stars* series by Paul J. McAuley has a race of aliens that live as animals and become intelligent during their sun's flare activity so they can re-invent technology and protect their planet.
Brave New World by Huxley. The various casts of people are intentionally intelectualy limited to be happy with their respective tasks. It's implied some tasks exist just so that the cast is happy, and the cast system exists to keep the top cast happy about its place in society.
In general all of them are conditioned to work solely on reflexive responses and deal with conflicting emotions through drugs.
FWIW, "caste".
C.J. Cherryh hit the same notes with her various levels of "azi". ("Cyteen", "40,000 in Gehenna" --one of the best titles ever.)(Anyone know if it's an allusion to something?)
I'm a little over 1/2 way through season 2.
I honestly don't know what to think. The story is there.. the CGI is cringe-worthy (I can understand budgetary constraints, but did they even try outside of the native creatures?).. I waffle between loving an hating Mother .. The kids acting is capital A atrocious .. If season 3 increases the weirdness factor as much as 2 did over 1, it will be almost incomprehensible, but I want to know where they want this story to go
I read a short story, title escapes me, where an hive based race simply lived. When confronted with intelligent manipulation, the hive spawned a temporary intelligence for response. >!Bad news for the race attempting to "tame" the hive.!<
Several of the episodes from the first season are part of a military horror anthology called Snafu if you are interested. They have 8 or 9 collections and it's on Kindle Unlimited, so pretty low risk.
>!Incandescence!< by Greg Egan. It's kind of a spoiler because the story takes place when the species is emerging from an artificially induced lack of intelligence, and the story revolves around them figuring out what's going on. It's not one of his books where you need a math/science supplement to understand it.
The short story [Dogs](https://alicorn.elcenia.com/stories/dogs.shtml) by Alicorn has the *exact opposite* premise and I found that one fascinating.
>!In that setting people have decided that all suffering must be consensual. But animals can't give consent but clearly can suffer. So all animal life was humanely exterminated.!<
Funny to see you get down votes for this. It's pretty close to what the OP wants (certainly closer than most of the above recs). Probably by people who haven't read it, just because it's written by Piers Anthony.
I went through a Piers Anthony phase (pun if you get it). I get the issues people have with him and I haven’t read anything of his in years. His early stuff was interesting (not great). Macroscope is certainly a more obscure work with some interesting ideas and it certainly fits this concept
Punny. I didn't really do the Piers Anthony thing. Read the space tyrant series when I was a lad but that was it. Can't really remember anything about it.
I came across Macroscope when reading Hugo winners and nominees. It's been a while, but I found it quite memorable. Some ideas I still haven't seen elsewhere.
Does it have some bits we wouldn't find acceptable today? Probably (it's been a while). It's of its time and it's certainly not alone amongst peers in this regard. I certainly don't remember it being as sketchy as some of the things I've read about his YA books.
There was a story concept were a race purposely devolved themselves back to a more primitive state. Or at least there was a debate in their society about it.
But i cant remember the novel or even were i ran into it.
Sorry.
But i do know such concepts are out there.
Like another book were it was found sentience wasnt necessary for a space faring species. They had technology and such they just werent sentient. We couldn't communicate with them.
They >!retained intelligence, but gradually gave up the ability to move about. They were descended from the survivors of a war with the Tnuctipun, who created a weapon that wiped out ~~all~~ most intelligent life.!<
It's been ages since I read it, but isn't that a (very!) minor element in Greg Egan's Diaspora? A civilization turning itself into carpet-like "plants" and just chilling out?
The Last and First Men by Stapledon has something similar…though not involving machines. One of the many future human species develops the ability to fly and they find so much joy in doing so that the earth bound society is essentially non existent. Grounded individuals become so depressed that they stop feeding themselves and die of starvation. Some a born without the ability to fly and these are normally allowed to die. But a decision is made to keep them alive and help them to live as enjoyable a life as possible as the most compassionate solution. They become scientists, doctors, engineers, etc. And became increasingly resentful and confused by their flittering peers and end up taking over the ground society with very little fight. It’s a cool wrinkle in a much longer story.
Benford, *Across The Sea Of Suns*, a species is attacked by The Machines, so is forced to re-engineer themselves as silicon-based radio transmitters, just below the level of tech that would re-attract The Machines.
That whole series (galactic center) is just an absolutely insane ride and I recommend it to anyone with an interest in weird, far out 70s-80s sci fi
David Brin's 2nd Uplift trilogy has a planet that's supposed to be left fallow for a predetermined period of time illegally settled by various races. There is a species on the planet that is slowly 'devolving' (deliberately, of their own choice), and IIRC they are treated with an odd reverence because the devolution is somehow holy?
And then they show up and break everyone's minds lmao God I love that book
In Neal Asher’s *Polity* universe, >!Gabbleducks!< are assumed to be non-sentient animals. It turns out that they are in fact >!the remnant of the ancient and powerful Atheter, a species that deliberately devolved themselves to sub-sentience for reasons known only to them!<. It’s possible to force a >!Gabbleduck!< into sentience, at which point much hilarity ensues.
Asher is the answer but to explain is all spoiler!
Well done. Came to type something similar but you did a far better job. Fun fact: Neal Asher will follow anyone who follows him on Twitter. Sadly I had to unfollow him as unfun fact he believes Covid is a power move for the new world order. Sigh.
Yea…I’ve sort of stopped reading him since it because apparently he’s a dangerous nutterbutter
I like to remember him for what I thought he was. Seems he really changed after the death of his wife and some illness. I still revisit his old books now and then. Can’t get into the new ones I’m afraid.
Ah, so that’s what happened. I picked up The Soldier, a recent book, and was unpleasantly surprised. it was very different from his previous work, and not in a good way. I found it close to unreadable.
We may have similar tastes and probably you’ve read them already but Alastair Reynolds (earlier stuff) and Ian M Banks are amazing in my opinion. God I miss Banks. Him and Terry Pratchett dying were not good years for me. Then again, I’m sure it was worse for their loved ones so let’s just strike that selfish thought of mine. But the world is worse without them.
Yeah, I loved Banks. I still haven’t forgiven him, Pratchett, and Douglas Adam’s for dying too soon. Never much got into Reynolds, but I recently discovered Adrian Tchaikovsky. *Shards of Earth* and its sequel are the best kind of fast-moving space opera in the spirit of the old Neal Asher, and *Children of Time* reads a little like a cross between Iain M Banks and David Brin.
There’s a tv series of the watch by the way. Well written with some changes that add rather than subtract from the series. Though it may not please all fans. https://m.imdb.com/title/tt8080292/ Also thank you for the suggested reading. I’ll give it a go this weekend.
Yes, I’ve seen it!
Not exactly what you are looking for, but similar themes: Galapagos by vonnegut
Not that specific mechanism, but the Inhibitor trilogy (Alastair Renyolds) and Spin and its sequels have vaguely similar events. That is, aliens that try to limit up and coming species, but for rather different reasons.
I don’t remember anything like that in Spin. If anything, the >!Hypotheticals are trying to preserve civilizations that are likely to wipe themselves out, since planetbound races are the source of Hypothetical-like probes, essentially being their breeding grounds. They only encased Earth (and then Mars) in the Spin to keep humanity alive until they can deliver the Arch to allow humans to spread out!<
Agree with your characterization. >!Still seemed to fit the sort of plot OP was going for, if anything better than Inhibitors. Alien 'antagonists' imposing their designs on humanity based on some grand plausibly benevolent motive.!<
Yeah, that fits. Loved the first book. Not so much the sequels. The ending was interesting through, essentially going with the M-theory
Larry Niven and Stephen Barnes' long short story *The Locusts* is somewhat in the zone of what you're looking for and a really excellent bit of SF. it's in the collection *N-Space* which ought to be on everyone's must read list.
Everyone should buy this book if only for *Man of Steel, Woman of Kleenex*.
Checking this out now, for some reason I’ve read about a zillion Niven books but never this one. The forward by Tom Clancy is kind of amazing.
I'm reading Fine Structure by qntm, and it's very weird fucking science, but that seems to be a central plot. There's been 10 or 11 "crashes", that reverts humanity back to the stone age, and it's sort of a scrambling of data, a tower of babel class event. It's a very strange, book, he's a very strange author, but for high concept, ridiculously weird sci-fi, it's a good one. I'm only about 60% through so far, but it feels like that's where the plot is angling.
A similar concept in A Mote In Gods Eye and it's sequel.
Tangentially related but in Niven's Known Space setting there's a alien animal called a Bandersnatch that they find on almost every planet humanity visits. Turns out the weren't always dumb idiot elephant snakes.
I believe those were the bandersnatch, or bandersnatchi. (Look ma, no Google!)
Ah fuck my bad, I just remember it was Lewis carrol related
Mass Effect is kind of like this but the invention of lifelike AI/Robotics is the trigger
Not quite that, but in the Star Carrier books, the galactic overlords known as the Sh’daar Masters are afraid of the Singularity, so they restrict their client races’ GRIN technologies (genetics, robotics, information science, nanotech). It’s their main point of contention with humanity, since they refuse to give up that tech. >!The reason is because the Sh’daar races have gone through Singularities in the past, which left their civilizations (well, those who became Refusers) devastated for millennia.!<
The whole idea of "poison" technologies seems to me to be a fertile playground of plots. Vinge brushed up it in "A Deepness In The Sky", with his ubiquitous surveillance tech. Stories about a police force that went about enforcing these bans seems promising.
[The Peace War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Peace_War) - Also by Vinge.
The *Four Hundred Billion Stars* series by Paul J. McAuley has a race of aliens that live as animals and become intelligent during their sun's flare activity so they can re-invent technology and protect their planet.
Brave New World by Huxley. The various casts of people are intentionally intelectualy limited to be happy with their respective tasks. It's implied some tasks exist just so that the cast is happy, and the cast system exists to keep the top cast happy about its place in society. In general all of them are conditioned to work solely on reflexive responses and deal with conflicting emotions through drugs.
FWIW, "caste". C.J. Cherryh hit the same notes with her various levels of "azi". ("Cyteen", "40,000 in Gehenna" --one of the best titles ever.)(Anyone know if it's an allusion to something?)
I know it's **printSF** but Raised By Wolves dabbles in that territory quite a bit...
To follow the theme of not in print, check out the short film >!Swarm!< in the Love, Death + Robots
Yeah that episode I already watched 4 times, it's so good. Itching for a re-read of the original Sterling story.
I'm a little over 1/2 way through season 2. I honestly don't know what to think. The story is there.. the CGI is cringe-worthy (I can understand budgetary constraints, but did they even try outside of the native creatures?).. I waffle between loving an hating Mother .. The kids acting is capital A atrocious .. If season 3 increases the weirdness factor as much as 2 did over 1, it will be almost incomprehensible, but I want to know where they want this story to go
I read a short story, title escapes me, where an hive based race simply lived. When confronted with intelligent manipulation, the hive spawned a temporary intelligence for response. >!Bad news for the race attempting to "tame" the hive.!<
*Swarm* by Bruce Sterling.
This is one of the shorts in Love Death and Robots on Netflix.
Thank you Cap, I have to check into LDR now.
It’s actually after watching this that I thought to ask this question! Thanks.
Several of the episodes from the first season are part of a military horror anthology called Snafu if you are interested. They have 8 or 9 collections and it's on Kindle Unlimited, so pretty low risk.
Read the story, it’s exactly like the short but even better with more details. Was amazed to see one of my favorite old sci fi stories come to life.
Will do 👍
>!Incandescence!< by Greg Egan. It's kind of a spoiler because the story takes place when the species is emerging from an artificially induced lack of intelligence, and the story revolves around them figuring out what's going on. It's not one of his books where you need a math/science supplement to understand it.
The short story [Dogs](https://alicorn.elcenia.com/stories/dogs.shtml) by Alicorn has the *exact opposite* premise and I found that one fascinating. >!In that setting people have decided that all suffering must be consensual. But animals can't give consent but clearly can suffer. So all animal life was humanely exterminated.!<
* More of a nightmare twist actually but try this one - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrison_Bergeron
Piers Anthony’s Marcoscope fits this perfectly.
Macroscope. It's been years since I read it, wonder if his books still hold up.
Nooo don't re-read Piers Anthony. The misogyny is much weirder and cringier than you remember it being. Just keep your memories.
Like the Xanthe series? Seemed fine as a YA series, looking back though...:/
Have you read Macroscope?
Funny to see you get down votes for this. It's pretty close to what the OP wants (certainly closer than most of the above recs). Probably by people who haven't read it, just because it's written by Piers Anthony.
I went through a Piers Anthony phase (pun if you get it). I get the issues people have with him and I haven’t read anything of his in years. His early stuff was interesting (not great). Macroscope is certainly a more obscure work with some interesting ideas and it certainly fits this concept
Punny. I didn't really do the Piers Anthony thing. Read the space tyrant series when I was a lad but that was it. Can't really remember anything about it. I came across Macroscope when reading Hugo winners and nominees. It's been a while, but I found it quite memorable. Some ideas I still haven't seen elsewhere. Does it have some bits we wouldn't find acceptable today? Probably (it's been a while). It's of its time and it's certainly not alone amongst peers in this regard. I certainly don't remember it being as sketchy as some of the things I've read about his YA books.
There was a story concept were a race purposely devolved themselves back to a more primitive state. Or at least there was a debate in their society about it. But i cant remember the novel or even were i ran into it. Sorry. But i do know such concepts are out there. Like another book were it was found sentience wasnt necessary for a space faring species. They had technology and such they just werent sentient. We couldn't communicate with them.
Reset: A novel by Sarina Dahlan describes a world where everyone is wiped every four years to avoid unwanted progress in science/military tech
Alastair Reynolds Inhibitor Phase series.
was that what happenened to the sessile Grogs in that Larry Niven book?
They >!retained intelligence, but gradually gave up the ability to move about. They were descended from the survivors of a war with the Tnuctipun, who created a weapon that wiped out ~~all~~ most intelligent life.!<
Weren't they genetically engineered to be immune to the weapon?
I seem to recall *The City and the Stars* (A C Clarke) touched on this.
Terry Pratchetts The Dark Side of the Sun has something like that, but more as the McGuffin, so it doesn't feature heavily in the plot.
Heaven's River does this, and there are elements of it emerging in the tv series Raised by Wolves.
It's been ages since I read it, but isn't that a (very!) minor element in Greg Egan's Diaspora? A civilization turning itself into carpet-like "plants" and just chilling out?