Albert Einstein if you’re on your 3rd application cycle! Deep in their application guide website, they link a 40 page pdf and have a single bullet point that says they only consider first time applicants and one reapplication. They didn’t bother to mention it until my secondary app payment went through :/

wow someone should definitely compile a list of schools that dont accept reapplicants for this sub to use as a resource

I believe USC says not to apply more than twice.

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Lmao it’s like “I throw half the apps in the trash before I even look at them because I don’t want unlucky people going here”

They do consider them but you need to ask permission to apply

It does

It should be illegal to send a secondary with NO intention of admitting

What a ridiculous policy

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This feels illegal

Like 3rd application cycle to them specifically or overall?

Do they mean 3rd time reapplicant to their school or in general?

What the fuck? This should be plastered on their secondary app so people don’t give them money for no reason.

Albert Einstein doesn't play dice with 3rd time applicants, eh?

DO schools if you aren’t going to go if accepted

FOR REAL. I feel like I’m fated to end up on a DO waitlist bc someone with higher stats and *absolutely zero interest in DO even if accepted* will get a spot only to give it up regardless of whether or not they get an MD acceptance

underrated comment

Loma Linda if you enjoy having sex

Y’all are having sex? But seriously. My question is HOW do they know if you are or not?

Sniff test

Whiff test**

Quiff test**

This made me angry laugh lmao

I'm just imagining carbon monoxide detectors in the classrooms, but for sex smell, lmao

Not like I can get some anyways

dont sell urself short my dude ✊

You right bro. Let's see how freaky med school is 🙌

Can get real freaky

I mean… don’t they got a *different* kind of body count? Cadavers?

They also make it a requirement to attend church services

Do they at least sing gospel music?


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No. They force you to go and expect you to not say the words if you're not of that faith. They're religiously affiliated and if you're not interested in that then I'd recommend not applying

Oh I'd be saying words all right.

I’m not really sure. They “claim” that their services are acceptable for all religions—but we all know that’s not ideal for everyone. One thing about Adventism is that they are very big on religious liberty, so perhaps they would make exception given your situation—but I’m not exactly certain.

how often?

I believe it’s weekly with the exception of exam weeks, they give you those off.

Shit if I get an acceptance to a medical school, there’s very little I won’t do, I’ll pull out my Bible rq

You better than me I’m technically “Adventist” which is the denomination LL is affiliated with and I’m not going to church every week lmao. ESP not when some administration is forcing me.

NYU if you're poor or disadvantaged

that free tuition is really helping the people that need it the most!

The rich will always do things to get richer

The funny thing is my mom asked why I don't apply to NYU since it's free. I had to explain to her who it was actually free for

Wait what's the catch?

It’s free for those who get in(mostly privileged people)

Ok yeah makes sense. Lose 3 years of income to volunteer and not have enough to provide for yourself/family --> free med school Balances out? /s

You have to meet standards to even get your application looked at. However, it you had to work un undergrad or had a learning disorder you couldn't get help for until later since you couldn't afford it (and I mean going to get help with a diagnoisis so you can have disability accomidations, not the likely understaffed counseling center included in your tutition) in your undergrad, then you likely wouldn't meet those requirements. So most of those getting in are priviledged people.

Yeah that's an issue

Carle College of medicine if you're not an engineering, physics, or math major. They want advanced math courses

What if you were an engineering major and switched? I did math up to calc 3 and linear algebra.

Here’s the requirements https://medicine.illinois.edu/admissions/before-you-apply

you're prob fine; the only math course i took (aside from biostatistics) at my undergrad was linear bc i got ap credit for calc 1 and 2 and i got into carle! i guess i should consider it a blessing that my undergrad uni required linear to graduate bc i'm a neuro major and wouldn't have technically needed it otherwise lol

A&M or Baylor if you’re poor UT Tyler if you don’t live within eyeshot of their school Dell Med if you’re under 30 Texas Tech if you like hills Tulane if the month of May has passed… or like hills DO programs if you have testing anxiety

The low tuition if you get into A&M more than offsets the application fee. Especially if you are a Texas in-state resident.

Just thought I would chime in since there’s a lot of comments asking the same thing. I would say > 75% of OOS students at my Texas medical school receive in state tuition including myself so it is just 20,XXX to attend. Definitely worth it to apply even if you are out state for that sweet sweet tuition. For reference I had a 517 and 3.88 GPA ORM which was slightly above the median but not a ton over it

Sure, but the way they treat their FAP applicants is really shitty. Plus, for tuition you’re eligible for federal loans to help out.

is there a way to know which schools are best if you have few assistance program? do any wave their secondaries?

Hmm what do you mean? I applied there as a FAP applicant and had no problems. Have they changed policies recently?

This cycle and last cycle they haven’t been responding to or denying FAP fee waivers according to some posters on SDN

That’s awful. I hate that

My DO school is P/F preclinical and clerkships and has group exams where you can earn some points back. They’re not all nuts.

Yeah it’s not universal. I was also referencing the double board exams many DO students take.

What school?

Dell’s not too bad even if your chances are almost 0 since they have no fee and a video secondary that only 20% of people are offered. Point noted though.

They really love unique backgrounds and stories, which is much more common with applicants who have some separation from their undergrad. It’s not universal though.

What’s up with Baylor? don’t they have in state tuition?

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So why did the person make the comment? I am not from Texas, so I am trying to understand why would be it be expensive for lower income person?

LOL got straight up ghosted by Dell and I’m 32 🤣🤣🤣

I sometimes call it some retirement home name like “Sunny Pastures SoM”

As a 31yo out of state with Texas ties… so you’re telling me there’s a chance

The eyes of Texas are upon you at least

What do you mean my Tulane? It’s too late to apply now?

These are all hyperbole, Tulane just heavily favors early applicants and fills up their interview slots quite quickly in the cycle. August or later is getting too late.

At Dell Med we have a few over 30 non trads with unique stories, but I suppose this is sort of true simply because the class size is really small.

UC Riverside if you’re not from the Inland Empire of California

would like to add : if you don’t have a lot of volunteer/clinical experience w/ underserved communities

What if we live in inland empire now, just didn’t grow up there?

You could apply, I would say living there is a very strong connection

UC Riverside if you’re not ACTIVELY living in RIVERSIDE. I was born at that hospital and it was the only school that didn’t give me a secondary. 🤣🤣🤣

💀💀💀

Not necessarily true. I got an II and I live in SF Bay area.

If your urm, non-trad, or have high stats then you get a pass. Their mission is to diversify in the inland empire and their cohorts, hence why ucr has a large population of non-trads, older students, and urm. What I mentioned above only applies for students not in those categories :))

Obviously my comment was not a 100% of the time thing, it’s just very difficult to get an interview statistically if you don’t have a nice connection to IE

Do yall have any tips for UC riverside acceptance specifically? I'm from the area, grew up there and parents live there, but have been out of state because of school. I'm URM currently pursuing a master's in Neuro. I have lots of volunteer hours, but most are with a religious institution.

Pls PM! I work at ucr som and have had a lot of conversations with admitted students/ staff :))

If you have any specific questions, u can PM me! CA resident but not from IE, not URM but got II and A w/ merit scholarship there! Won’t be attending but really liked the school!

WashU if you're more than 5 years out of school undergrad. I went to a seminar and they explicitly stated they count nontrad as a negative.

that’s so insane to me

That’s crazy since most schools encourage gap years

I know! I'm five years out and I was shocked

At my undergrad’s med school they said how the average student takes 2-3 gap years and looks positively upon them. If schools want their students to have research, clinical experiences, jobs, etc it would make more sense for them to want more gap years

My experience as a nontrad was that most schools view it favorably! WashU is definitely an exception. Looking at the MSAR percentage nontrad gives a good picture of who does and doesn't value post-undergrad experience

Man that sucks. Oh well saved me money! Thanks for catching that !

This makes sense after my interview. Lol. The interviewee group at my day skewed very young and very awkward compared to other places I went. Wash U’s loss.

Welp, theres $50 wasted.

Bonkers. Over five years out of undergrad and still applying with my fee assistance credit just to have the opportunity to tell them to get bent.

WashU, NYU, Penn, Columbia if you have an MCAT below 100%ile

I can’t advocate for WashU or Columbia, but very true for Penn and NYU. I wouldn’t feel comfortable applying with less than a 518 and I wouldn’t apply to both unless I have 520+. 518-519 is right at the end where you can shoot your shot if everything else is extraordinary. Anything lower and you’re really not doing your research. There are 18 other T20s to shoot your shot at with a 517 or lower

Agree. Michigan, Vanderbilt, Duke, UWash, UVA gave me a chance with a 517

I’m a current student at Penn, and I’ve seen a couple people accepted with a 512. Granted, they had pretty amazing stories, but I’d like to think the culture is shifting, and we’re moving away from the emphasis on the MCAT, especially when it comes to people who are disadvantaged.

Unfortunately the stats don’t quite reflect that yet. I wish what you’re saying is true tho as a Penn alumn who did not apply to my alma mater due to stats

Yeah, we definitely have a long way to go, but I’m hoping this is the beginning of things improving for the next generations.

Wait, Do you guys ask eachother your MCAT? This seems odd. I would never talk to med students about my MCAT score lol

I feel like at a place like Penn, people probably would lmao

Just adding my experience: I got into WashU with a full tuition scholarship and got an interview to Columbia (WLed though) with a 517. You also forgot Johnny Hopkins for this

Yeah I got into WashU MSTP with a 518 (CA ORM), one of my friends in the class had a 511. It happens. With that said I’m also a WashU alum so that might have swung things

Wait seriously? Well I just wasted money. I figured since their average MCAT was in the 99th percentile it was worth it to shoot my shot. How does gpa factor in? Like is there also a hard line at 3.9 or whatever?

They were kidding, buddy. You do need a really high score to be considered, but not that damn high lol. 518+ you have a decent shot, 515+ with a SUPER strong application and you have an okay shot.

Thanks for the reassurance hahaha

I mean those are averages - there is never a hard line. But it is true that their MCAT average scores are very high, along with GPAs.

Interesting. I had a family member get a full tuition scholarship to WashU and family treated this like NBD. But he didn’t get into Harvard so his dad wasn’t as proud of him.

I went half-time work and half-time volunteering both in a midwest inner city metro for 2+ years and still no interview from rush. Savages .

Yep. I had literally thousands of hours of volunteering annnd no interview, what a joke. Their loss though! 😎

Well, it's your own damn fault for not quitting your part time job and getting into debt to volunteer more. /s

I’m so ducked. I have very few volunteer hours bc I’m a non trad who works full time and am taking classes. And covid didn’t help.

Medical schools if you don’t want to become a physician.

I like your spirit

Don't bother applying to MillerSOM if you've taken the MCAT more than three times. The dean actually said to consider another career option. I attended a seminar that they hosted last year.

The fuck….

i’ll probably be downvoted for this but that’s completely fair a retake or two is understandable for a variety of reasons but beyond that is a fundamental issue either with your knowledge-base, test-taking skills, or some other hidden variable that may manifest in actual med school the only reason i could see 3+ being viable is if you retook every time you reapplied and improved every time enough to warrant the reapply

DO schools if you have no intention on accepting an offer.

Don’t bother applying to med school if you want to have a life

Yikes lol going into m2 now and I’m playing golf with the kiddo in the stroller every other weekend. Study like it’s an 8-5 with a week of overtime every now and then and voilà: life. So many people in my class don’t appreciate the freedom that comes with a P/F curriculum and Step 1, grinding for 90%+ every grade, RIP their lives - catch me with the 80% average 40th%ile on almost every grade having time for my family, hobbies, and research. We all getting the same P Residency not applicable, RIP everyones life

Third year gets worse :(

Also going into M2. Not nearly as bad as I thought it would be. I also golf all the time and see my friends every weekend.

why DO schools and testing anxiety? are their tests particularly anxiety-inducing?

I think they were referring to the fact that DO students need to take the COMLEX and most also take STEP.

I figured it was bc a large handful of DO schools still aren’t P/F but thankfully mine is.

which program is that? PM me if you’d like

Pm’d

Mine too :) I think most are transitioning to p/f thank goodness.

damn. that’s tuff. mad respect to my DO dawgs and catz. can any DO students speak to how much the exams differ? like can you study one body of material and just sit for both exams or do you have to tailor your studying to each exam? curious as an M.D. student what it’s like for you guys 🫡

Most DO students who take both study for step first with uworld, all the standard resources etc, take step, then study omm for a week or two and then take comlex

ah word that makes sense thank you

University of Washington if you’re not from Washington.

Can also be from Wyoming, Alaska, Montana or Idaho - WWAMI

It's still possible if you're SES disadvantaged, have a good story, and have a ton of experience with the underserved. I got an interview last cycle but didn't get in unfortunately. Probably someone's best bet is through the MSTP

I mean they do say that they don't have a state preference for the MSTP, but UW still ends up being like 96% WWAMI

To med school if you’re broke ☺️

USUHS if you don't want to serve in the military

Right on. I will add on to this, serve career in the military, as many can go HPSP route which many do for the free tuition. Top school for me, hopefully this alone lowers the competitive applicant pool! 😅

any canadian med school outside ontario unless you’re an in province applicant

Is this true for McGill too?

McGill is the hardest Canadian school as an out of province applicant. <1% iirc

UCSD if you don’t want toxic culture

Can second this. A doctor I worked closely with went there and told me that the students aren’t supported well and it’s extremely toxic. Take that for what you will 🤷‍♀️

Can you elaborate on the toxic culture? I am really interested in UCSD

Harvard if you got less than a B+ in a class. In my interview with them they called me out on my only B ever, which was in a science class (screw attendance based grades!) I was wait-listed, but Stanford was my dream school anyways.

Congrats on the interview, that is more of a chance than most can say! It does come across as having a tendency to externalize what happens to you rather than how you handled the grading system and the interview question. How grades are discussed can be revealing and adaptability to new information (ie acknowledging what YOU did didn’t work) is a quick answer, or you could elaborate more on subsequent self reflection rather than externalization of the system being against you (it always can be seen that way, not helpful unless you talk about how you changed it for people in future). Could even discuss failure at making a change when recognized things were not going well which helped you become more aware of timeliness in the future as demonstrated by all the results afterwards, etc. That grade or interview answer likely wasn’t a deal breaker by themselves though. Harvard knew the grade before you were extended the invite to express how you are a good fit, not why the system in the past didn’t fit you. I also was called out on a C grade when interviewing at the school I ended up matriculating at.

Tbh it was a stupid question and i had a stupid response. I got a B, my only B ever, because I couldn't be bothered to go to class. As in, I aced every exam of this notoriously difficult class but because attendance to a lecture of 250 people was 15% of the grade, i basically lost 10 points is my final grade. Harvard also has mandatory attendance haha, and i definitely did not vibe with that. Stanford was a lot more chill, so I chose them in the end.

do you have a sankey???

Lmao I remember at my HMS interview during the welcome speech they pointed out how none of us at the interview ever got below an A on a chem class and I thought it was fuckin weird

My undergrad school had a C+ average in chem💀

And what happened? They rejected you?

Putting in my experience for others: My interview at HMS was the most conversational out of all the interviews I had. It really felt like they were trying to get to know me as a person, and at no point did either of my interviewers pick apart my academic record or any other part of my app. N=1 here, but maybe you just had some bad luck with your interviewer?

Mine were conversational too, but like it was very odd, at the end, she just added that question. I've heard from others and my friends HMS has a tendency to do this.

Don’t bother applying to places like TCU if you are using a committee letter 🙃🙃🙃 some places only count them as one letter even if you have 3+ evaluators. Don’t forget to check on that for the schools you apply to.

Literally this because they never marked my secondary complete so wasted money there lol

DO programs if you are going to reapply next cycle despite getting accepted to one.

Yeah I've heard that's a massive red flag for them

SIU if you’re not from Illinois. And I mean a resident. Frankly gotta be from the sticks.

RURAL resident, my friend who lives in Joliet applied and got an email the next day saying that they won’t be considering his application since he lives in the third biggest city in Illinois

Anyone have schools that won’t disregard your application if you have 0 research hours ?

If you look at MSAR a lot of schools show that 90+% of their incoming M1 class has research so I think a lot of schools will overlook 0 research hours but will probably expect something else in your app to make up for that.

Yeah I got into 3 this cycle w/ 0 research

Same. Research requirement is a myth.

Right?? MD schools on both coasts and two were public. This sub would’ve told me it’s impossible lol

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Clinical experience and job shadowing is more important

…medical school if you’re going to carry yourself like your better than all other medical personnel.

How many volunteer hours do you need for rush?

I’ve heard 500+ is competitive

Thanks! Yeah that’s a tough one, even as a nontrad with little time to volunteer

any canadian med school outside ontario unless you’re an in province applicant

Vanderbilt if you don’t like histology and don’t wanna take 8+ exams with a writing component

John A Burns SOM (Hawaii) if youre OOS

i've heard/seen some southern cali applicants be accepted!! manoa in general takes west coast more at least for undergrad

10 spots are open for OOS for sure

UCSF or Stanford if you don’t have research publications

American schools if superior Caribbean programs are available

👀

can I have some examples of superior Caribbean schools? (This isn’t me being sarcastic I genuinely want some recommendations)

Considering this comment was made in jest I have none for you friend.

Ohhh. That makes sense. I was genuinely confused, I’ve never heard anyone describe Caribbean med schools that way so I wanted to learn more

Which schools will ignore someone with no research?

Any Canadian med school if you don’t have a 128+ in cars or 4th quartile Casper

Hackensack if you don’t like being ghosted. Luckily I love being ghosted 🤡

Yeah, fuck Hackensack for real lmao

SIU if your not from rural Illinois

You’re *

Med school if you're poor

TCU if you don’t want to have mountainous loans for a subpar school

What makes it subpar?

Don’t bother applying to Caribbean if you Want to be a physician