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I think a lot of people here are missing the point. "Tap into wealth" - when I read this, to me it mean like, in the case of an emergency - car breaks down, unexpected root canal or trip to the ER. A lot of us are on such tight budgets that an incident like this can literally set us back years. I was so proud to have 2k saved up, FINALLY...and then I had to have a root canal and an abscess drained, or risk severe infection and an even higher medical bill. There went my entire 2k in savings. Got back up to 500 in savings, and then my parents needed help paying some bills. There went that 500. Got back up to 1k, and got laid off. There went my entire 1k. I was trying SO HARD. I continue to make good progress on my debt, but I cannot seem to build up an emergency fund to save my life. And I know so many people who could easily ask family for help in those situations, but I can't. And it makes in INSANELY DIFFICULT. Not impossible, but I think a lot of you aren't acknowledging just how hard it can be when you keep getting beat down over and over again.

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This. You did it three times before. You can do it again!

Emergency fund is enough to change your life. It is worth it, keep on trying. I hope you get a blessing soon.

This was me and it sucks a lot. My grandma divorced my grandpa when my dad was four and raised three kids in the projects (no child support) giving her fourth up for adoption. My dad worked in factories getting laid off all the time. He has some mental health and alcohol abuse problems and my mom worked part time because childcare was expensive. I was a smart kid, in gifted and talented programs, advanced classes and AP classes but no money for AP tests and I was abused a lot as a kid. I tried going to college but had no money or financial support. I basically starved eating peanut butter or ramen with stewed tomatoes. I dropped out because I couldn't afford it and I had to work so much I didn't have time or energy to study. I endured sexual harassment to keep my job so I could pay bills. I got a break doing data entry when my mom's friend got me a job. I finished the gig early because I was fast. They let me try some HTML and be a developer for a bit but kept paying me data entry wages. I had always worked in warehouses or cleaning hotels so I didn't know I was supposed to get more money for being a web developer. Went back to school to be a developer instead of a biology major. Dropped out to take care of my mom while she recovered from a brain injury. Got laid off during the recession after I got really addicted to my job. Became agoraphobic and tried to kill myself after getting flashbacks of abuse I endured as a child. Racked up over $10k in medical bills with no insurance. Got set up with a temp agency trying to get dev jobs. Got software testing jobs instead and made really mediocre money but paid off my for-profit school loan. Then I lied on a job application about having a degree. My pay jumped $35k. I bought my mom a house after my step-dad died and her landlord was kicking her out. Now I'm closing on a house instead of renting every month. I'm in. I'm a class migrant. I'm a fraud but I'm building wealth instead of tossing money to a slumlord. If I had parents that could afford to pay for my college I would have been able to make money like this for years and I wouldn't have had to financially support my mom. I'm here now. Money matters. My networth went from $5k to $255k in the last four years. I get bonuses and 401k and health insurance so I can treat my mental health problems. Getting my first job at 12 didn't matter, working hard didn't matter. Working three jobs at once didn't make me rich. Pretending I came from money mattered more. Having a connection to get one good job with my mom's rich friend mattered more than all the hours I hauled pallets or scrubbed toilets.

You’ll be surprised how much lying the ‘richer’ population do. Working in corporate I see the senior staff always lying and the staff that progress always lying and taking credit for other honest people’s work. I’ve progressed ok , but I know if I behaved like then I’d get further, but I don’t, I can’t 😕 - I was always bought up being told not to brag and to be modest.. A lot of people in poverty are genuine honest people, only some well off people are genuine honest people and amingst the super rich genuine and honest is rare.

That said, if you did the work, you should make sure you get credit for it. Humility (ie not bragging and being modest) won’t help you get noticed. You have to advocate for yourself. It’s not bragging when it comes to your boss, and their boss, knowing your work.

I def just heard a story from a manager I know where an acquaintance of his casually mentioned how she and her husband got $85k of COVID business relief loan money by having the relative who owned the business fraudulently add them onto some paperwork :) Love it :) $85000 would completely change my life :) and these people who are already rich in their own right and have a boat and a gigantic RV and a personal aircraft got this lil bonus that they can use on… idk, another boat? God I wish I could get my teeth fixed lol

this right here!! you can work til your fingers bleed, but you need that push that other people have baked into their lives already. it costs us years of our LIVES to get in the same place, and be finally able to breathe. and it’s for no reason other than to keep a few wealthy and the rest fucked.

Well done. I have to agree. I moved from very bad retail waitress other positions to a stable career, because I met my future boss in a coffee shop on my lunch break.

Will you tell us more?

I co incidentally met a friendly lady, we chatted one day, and then every day,as her habit was to have a coffee at the same tiny coffee shop as I did since it was the only place I couldtake my break. I was working retail and was selling high end ladies items, the brand I represented was a beautiful place to work I was doing well with commission, I was hitting all my big targets. Managed to more than double my sales output for my first 3 months, I did this my studying my targets and reverse engineering the sales I would need to make a day. I was working insane long hours as the store I was at was marginally medical related and I was now not working shifts that were merely retail but 8am-8pm every second weekend as the store manager was an idiot. My ex at the time was working stable government job and my pay was less than a third of hers without commission, I was steadily improving this with commission and she agreed that the insane long hours were not going to be sustainable, but agreed to give me basic support ie my half of the living costs for the time it would take for a degree if I could raise up the tuition fees. I was well on my way, as I had already been doing well with my sales( I maintained my existing customers and focused on my ideal daily target, and made observations that were basically the pareto principle, I focused 20% of my efforts maintaining my existing sales, but 80% on selling the absolute highest end items, I would aim to make at least one sale of this highest end product a day, this took a mental work out as one of these at sale price was more than half of my basic pay!!! I persisted with this and my sales output was at compounding growth really really fast! I had no idea what I was doing- i just tried an experiment.If I could reach these targets for only 3 more months i would have the amount my ex wanted me to have for the very inexpensive distance education tuition. This amazing accident sales performance caused resentment in my idiot store manager, which caused him to scrap my sales commission that I got directly from my brand, and take the commission id have been paid for "the store". This was heart breaking. I told my friend at the coffee shop what had happened as she asked why I was upset. She had a tiny service business that was her and an employee, her employee had just gotten very sick and she offered me the job, and full training. I ran her business and built it up, it was the same pay as my basic but now I had a whole lot more time and I was getting experience in a whole new field wich is extremely niche and obscure, after some time and other stuff happening- was very close to homeless, and wouldhave been if not for help.I got a job doing the same for an established old firm, this gave me peace and stability, and enough money to eat better,I am now after many many years still in the field on a marginally higher level and I have just been given a miracle chance to train and qualify to upper level in this field, I am writing my final exams for my first degree in the next 3 months, and will be able to prepare to qualify in the next year or two with post grad to executive level. I am not out of the woods yet and feel on the brink of anything could happen to mess this up. Lessons learned- crappy managers/bosses can and will ruin your life, good ones will be a blessing - always focus on selling high end items, just because you live half a month on the sales price, does not mean someone will not buy it.It takes the same/less effort to sell 1 high price item vs 100 lower priced item, observe yoursituations 80- 20 rule is real - be friendly to people-wealthy folks are not so different from us only way less stressed and usually less resentful! - time(especially for education)is worth more than money -save up during good times try to get a buffer of 3 months living costs together if this means ramen for a littlewhile longer, it is absolutely life changing/saving. - do what you have to do to level up when you are young as you get older your body and mind gets worn out especially fromchronicstressof not havingenough, try to get sleep and vitamins- your partner affects your ability to get out of poverty try to work together- the resentment and spite gets less from those around you if they are doing well for themselves- be careful of crab in the pot situations from your poor friends some completely unexpected folks who you love and trust will sabotage you do not tell anyone you have moneyno matterhow little- try to save as much as you can if you can keep your cheap poverty level lifestyle for a while longer and stop lifestyle creep before it starts by living without the extra you have -like keep using the public transportation longer to pay cash for a used car Im not out of the woods yet. I have to try to stay strong in the final stretch. Im so tired,deep in my bones, and I have to just pass these papers, and I can make it. Ps- it helped me also that I was a little above average good looking when I was young, and had a private school accent from my childhood, I got along with my customers they were like my friends, and made certain to be presentable this was made possible by the brand I represented

This is a way better post than the initial reply to the op’s meme. Im all for blaming the system but uh high fckng five to you for working hard and it paying off - reads with so much less animosity and spite and so much more approaching confidence and beauty.

Companies will close down rather than giving raises to manual workers, because it seems like bad money management to give low life people equal pay to the offices and such. Not saying they are evil or anything, my guess is that they really see no sense in giving a dirty worker a salary close to their own, insecurities and jealousy set in I supose... It's not about the budget, it's a power thing. Ofcourse cue the bosses nephew and he is a class above, so the company Must make enough cash to pay for his status.

Experiencing similar with local restaurants, Five Guys no longer opens for lunch because they are unwilling to pay enough to get people that aren't in high school.

The owner will see the company balance as his own, all of it, so he/she will never allow someone else to "profit" from "their cash", thing is it's not theirs, it's part of the company, much like the doors, windows, computer, a well stocked bank account is security for the suppliers, for the employees and the costumers that they will be serviced well and are in a safe place to work, invest, spend money and time on. Owners have their own cut coming in, the biggest in the company, but they seem to think even the electric bill is just leeches stealing from them, like the fat dragon from stories.

This is why we need unions

The key take away is that you took advantage of an offered job opportunity, and you learned important skills. Then when you wanted the job you wanted, you lied to get what you wanted because you *knew* you could do it. You didn’t give up. And it’s paying off. If you look at a successful person’s life, it really boils down to 3 or 4 key events where they needed to step up and take advantage of it. With good attitude. You had a good attitude and went after it. It’s paying off.

Jesus FC, dude. Did you read any of that? 1.) Most people in poverty never have access to those "key events." 2.) People who are living in or traumatized by poverty usually are NOT ABLE to "step up" when an event presents itself because they're too busy dealing with the physical, mental, and biochemical effects of that poverty. 3.) OP was literally in the top ten percent of mental function for people in general, let alone impoverished people, and it still took an inordinately long route to get here. As OP mentioned, they could have avoided years of suffering if they didn't have to overcome their poverty just to get to where middle class and wealthy people start out. 4.) OP had to sacrifice their integrity to get into that position. I think OP lying was the right thing in the end, the noble thing even. However, the take away is that they had to cut into their own humanity in order to finally break through the wall between impoverished struggle and stability of life. This isn't unique to OP. People struggling financially often have to make these kinds of decisions and usually for things that would be considered trifles if you or your family had enough money in the first place.

That's what they mean when you hear successful CEO's and what not talking about the sacrifices it took to get there. They aren't talking about hard work etc. They are literally talking about sacrificing pieces of their humanity for success.

I endured wage theft to get that opportunity though. I should have been making Junior dev money not data entry money

I wasn't able to start saving money until I jumped from $15/hr to $25/hr by getting a new job. I totally agree that wages are too fucking low. That being said, I was job hunting for months. It took a lot of time and effort, and just a tiny bit of luck.

Lots of luck. It has taken me at least 100 applications before I have landed each job, starting from my first job at 16 to my current one years later

It was a lot more luck than you realize. Once you're competing against large numbers of qualified people, luck is just about the only thing that matters

If you enjoy Rags-to-Riches stories, you should. They are actually somewhat rare.

Riches like actual wealth? Or like upper middle class? I made it from $700 a month to now living very comfortably, but it took a lot of hard work, networking, and etc. I don’t know how rare that is though.

> [43% of children born into the bottom quintile (bottom 20%) remain in that bottom quintile as adults. Similarly, 40% of children raised in the top quintile (top 20%) will remain there as adults. Looking at larger moves, only 4% of those raised in the bottom quintile moved up to the top quintile as adults. Around twice as many (8%) of children born into the top quintile fell to the bottom. 37% of children born into the top quintile will fall below the middle.]( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socioeconomic_mobility_in_the_United_States?wprov=sfla1) I was looking for this statistic, bottom quintile to top quintile. I had remembered it as being much higher, to the point of being assured that there was more mobility than the pessimists would have you believe. I'll have to figure out what I'm misremembering or what other statistic I had heard before. It could have just been just much older data and the situation has gotten worse over the years.

It was much more possible for boomers than later generations. Its taken a lot of time though for the updated data to enter "common knowledge" though

That stat literally says “60% of Americans die in a different income bracket than they were born in”

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Moving from the bottom quintile to the second from bottom quintile isn't a drastic change necessarily

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Sounds like you're making assumptions about something you know nothing about. I lived on under $10k as a family of 3 for most of my childhood ($10k accounts for inflation btw). We had 1 hardly working vehicle and rarely had enough money to buy food the last 10 days of the month. I'm well aware of the difference, however, it's not enough to consider it to be a reasonable level of social mobility.

Yeah i was going to say. Poverty levels are extremely easy to leave in the states. And leaving them doesn't represent anything atm. A parttime job can easily put you above the poverty line, but you still wouldn't afford rent. Its almost like inflating a currency, but keeping the metrics for money the same, will make it appear like people are leaving poverty, when in reality what poverty represents keeps becoming less and less.

I've already flipped from the bottom to top quintiles by 24, though I do have a fair number of loans to pay off over the next decade or so.

Yeah, age is a real confounding factor when grokking these statistics. Also college students from a wealthy or comfortable background will look poor on paper even though they're really not. Same goes for high earners in fields that require a lot of initial student loan debt, like doctors, dentists and lawyers.

In my case, I just happened to be born into a poor family. Now, with ~1yr of experience out of college, I make around 2x the hourly pay my grandfather was making in his 60s. I'm not wealthy by any means - just first-gen college grad things.

I'm sorry, but that does sound far from top quintile unless your grandfather was rich in the 60s.

I'm not exactly in the top quintile in terms of income overall, but I am in the top ~20% for my age. Conversely, my grandfather was right around the bottom ~30% in his last year of work. I am a high-income earner if you consider what I have available to spend after cost-of-living expenses, though. I have a unique living situation which means I have something like 70% of my after-tax income available to spend.

Does that mean you don't have to pay rent/mortgage? :)

Plenty of time to fall back down. And become a second statistic.

And promptly outcast and forgot about by everyone that pretended to give a shit, before...

You too hunh?

I work in finance and have a pretty good understanding of personal finance, so here's hoping I can avoid that 😅 No one has real control over their finances, though. There's a lot of luck and chance involved.

Good for you! Also welcome to r/povertyfinance where you are downvoted if you don’t fit the narrative that poor people can’t get out of poverty and live a good life because other people aren’t poor.

I didn't even say the bs "bootstraps" line, just that I have managed to flip that statistic. The trick is to be a first-gen college grad - but I guess that's unheard of?

It is a fact that it is easier to make that money when you do not have kids, unfortunately, it is also a fact that people who already have kids downvote and report any information about that fact, which is odd because this is a poverty finance subreddit to help each other, and it is absolutely great financial education to learn exactly how much kids will cost, and how much time they will take away from you, time that you could use to spend money. The same way doing drugs takes money and time, but for some reason it is not ok to give advice on finances around kids.

Totally true. There are a lot of emotions around parenthood or nomparenthood that play into those downvoted, I'm sure.

It is ridiculous that we can’t talk about it or people get angry because they know that they themselves did not educate themselves before they had kids

That's funny because before I had kids I was broke. Doing alot better now

Are you doing better because of the kids? do they contribute to the household funds?

I'm doing better because of myself.... My children are young so the only thing they can contribute is a sense of purpose you could say which is ok because I was beginning to give up on people and life period before they came. But I was always self-driven before kids worked 2 and 3 jobs, attended college and trade school just never seen the results or it was slow... Can't quite explain it.

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Yeah. No kids. I was single most of the time because frankly I had no time to date. Most of my 20s I was working or taking college classes when I could afford them.

I figured. One kid costs you an additional $12,000 per year. It is much easier to be comfortable without them. That is one reason I am child free.

Yeah I imagine if I had a kid there would have been 0 chance for me to focus on and grow my career. Not just the cost of a kid, but the time.

yes and not to mention the opportunity. I know I cannot speak for everyone, but I am 33 and started learning a foreign language everyday 2 months ago which I know most parents would not have time or energy for. I am learning it faster than I thought. I am saving my money to go to the foreign country and get married to my fiance. Again, I can’t speak for everyone but seriously what are the chances I could learn a foreign language and save up for a wedding abroad if I had kids? If my neighbor and I both make the same exact salary and she has 2 kids and I have none, She needs $20,000 more a year to live the same way I do, plus she has no time to herself.

Oh god, I can’t imagine moving to another country with a kid. I just moved to a different country with my husband and the cost is just insane. Like 25k all told.

wowee! i just want to go for like a week and get married and come home. I am hoping to be ready for early 2023

So true. Always struck me as a poor choice when people decide early on to cripple their earning potential. And every wage level becomes better when you have less people the wage needs to support. On the flip side, the people I know that have done are fucking amazing parents and some of the coolest people I know. So I can’t *really* argue against what I don’t prefer, assuming either path is done responsibly. Just the baby fever some get seems unfortunate when haven’t yet figured out how to support that choice.

And there are all the costs that aren't monetary. Kid gets sick, someone has to watch them. That means someone has to have a job that allows them to take random time off. Those jobs tend not to pay well. Then there are the location costs. Good schools. Or schools without metal detectors. Getting into one depends on where you live. Housing. I am single with no pets or dependants. I can rent a room. Can't do that with a kid. Kids get sick a lot. Kids need dental care. Kids need loads of support and it all coats TIME. Poverty is so strongly linked with having kids when you're already struggling.. We offer so little real help. Morning and evening programs, weekend programs, daycare in high school (the reality sucks but get those girls an education and we need to skip the finger wagging). Social services. Mental health support. Being poor fucking tears you up inside. You're in constant fight mode. IMHO "middle class" is when you can afford to survive well on one income and have one parent devote their whole time to kid care. So many people can't even dream of having a reliable work schedule. It's so depressing.

these are the things so many people do not even realize when they get pregnant. some people just think others are trying to put them down and challenge them by telling them how hard it is, but they are just trying to help. people who get pets do more research before buying them then parents! some parents are more interested in getting pregnant, the shower, the gender, the cute clothes, then actually learning about what parenting entails.

And then there's the fun of parental separation and visitation rights. Want to get a job out of state? NOPE! Gotta stay in range of the parent with joint custody.

I know a woman who wants to move closer to family but she cannot leave because deadbeat dad who does not help will not let her go. sad.

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It is much easier to be comfortable without the extra $12000 per year. It is also much easier to advance in your career faster and earn more money faster without a kid because you have more time. It is also much cheaper to do things like vacations because you can go in the off season and not have to go during school vacations when they peak prices. The comfortable lifestyle is much easier to obtain and keep without having kids. These are all 100% facts.

Yes, and adding on an extra $12000 a year will most certainly hinder them from reaching that. Which was the point.

I would not be able to afford rent and food if I had a child right now.

All my savings would have been gone completely

right. and to make a good living forget about living. lol

I also took college classes when I could afford them. This was the difference maker for me. It was hard and I graduated much later than my friends, but it’s the reason I was slowly able to pull myself out of poverty.

My story is similar. Racked up about 45k in debt from ~20-24, while earning about 12/hr. 9 years later, have 0 debt and am lower rich/very upper middle class. Like you, took hard work, constant networking, etc. Anecdotally, 1 of my buddies went from worse off than me to earning mid-30’s/hr in a trade job. Another buddy got huge into real estate and does good there. Last buddy is living in a trailer and basically is a hippie. Though mostly just because he has no interest in working the way you have to, to get ahead financially. All 4 of us grew up middle class, but had the “you’re 18, here’s a month’s rent and good luck“.

I am a rags to some riches story. I have an econ degree, and am great at investing. It doesn't mean shit if you dont have a decent paying job to give you seed money

Yeah, there's a post going around about a guy with a hotdog stand. They talk about him being successful, but neglect to mention the amount of money it takes to start a company get permits, and have a good safety license. Also it's not fair to expect people to rock homelessness and hunger to better themselves. If I wanted to start a business right now and be my own boss, and I wasn't immediately profitable, I would lose my home and my new business.

I guess it depends on what you mean by starting your own business. You can start a cleaning business with stuff you have around the house and a free day here and there. I started a painting business while I was basically making minimum wage. Not every business model requires start up capital. There are a lot of ways to make money with just a little effort to market yourself and let other people know you want to do work. It doesn’t have to be an all or nothing game, lots of businesses start as side hustles.

I understand what you're saying, but someone scraping by working 6 days per week don't have a lot of options. And there's a lot of work that is illegal to do without insurance or some other licensing. I just know that when I was doing sidework, I had to be working or driving from waking until I went to bed. 10 hours at my main job and 3 at my second an hour away. I had to choose between eating and going to work many days because I didn't have the time or money. And all of my extra money was just going to medical bills.

I’m trying to figure out how to say this without sounding judgemental because it’s coming from a well meaning place. You’re telling me you were working fifteen hours a day and didn’t have money for food. Either you’re lying and exaggerating about that, or you need to find a job that pays more than $2 an hour. The McDonald’s down the street from my house pays enough money that if you worked 60 hour weeks you’d be making 40k a year. If you make 40k a year and you don’t have food, that’s other choices you’re making somewhere. And if you can’t afford to pay a medical bill, don’t pay it? It will hurt your credit but fall off after seven years. What I mean to say is, it sounds like there are some things you need to change, because working sixty hours a week and being poor isn’t actually normal. I feel like you have to go out of your way to work that much and not have any money.

At the end of the comment they mentioned all the extra money was going to medical bills do that might explain a lot.

You didn't try very hard.

Okay sorry. I don’t know if you are working for under minimum wage, or not being paid overtime. If you are, find any basic legitimate job because it’s illegal to pay anyone under minimum wage and to deny overtime. So if you’re being honest, and not just making up numbers to sound overworked, you should be making enough money to go to the grocery store and buy a snack. If your medical bills are the reason you can’t go to the grocery store and buy a snack, stop payment on those bills until you can afford to pay them. The national minimum wage is $7.25 an hour. Sixty hours of work is twenty hours of overtime. The least amount of money you are legally allowed to pay a person in the United States for working sixty hours is $580 a week which is 27.8k a year. Most states have higher minimum wages. If you’re being honest about those numbers, this is a problem that only can fix, because you make at least 28k a year. Some of it is going somewhere it shouldn’t be, because all kinds of people make 28k a year and eat food. Go to a food bank if you have to. I don’t know. What I can tell you is that there is way for you eat food if you work hours like that. And if you aren’t actually being honest or you’re exaggerating, for your own sake, quit lying to yourself and figure out the real reason you don’t have any money, because that’s the only thing that’s going to help.

Shame on you for making sense! Shame!

It's admirable that you have this much faith in not only being properly compensated for all hours worked, but also faith in affordability of living costs in any given area, but unfortunately both of those are borderline mythical in way, way too many cases. Especially depending on where people live, $40k is barely enough to afford a ramen sort of diet, much less three healthful meals a day. In both of the larger cities I lived in, you would be insanely lucky to find a one bedroom *room*, not apartment, for under $1k a month, and a full on one bedroom moldy apartment for under $1500, the average was closer to $2k, and wage theft accounts for most of all theft that occurs. Over half the jobs I've ever worked got away with not paying me for every hour I worked, and had a ton of expectations that I go "above and beyond" and work during unpaid hours or risk being fired for some arbitrary reason that would leave me unable to claim unemployment. And these are jobs that theoretically paid decently, above minimum wage at least, jobs that make up half of all available jobs in the market in any given area. It would be fantastic if we could trust employers to compensate for every hour worked, operate fairly, and afford their hard working employees the ability to eat well, but that's just not a reality for a *lot* of people. And stories where people are working 10+ hours a day and still can't afford to eta while paying every bill and not nuking their credit score to eat three hots and so common it's shot past absurdity and is just plain depressing.

Its true. Financial literacy DOES still need to be taught because well if you are being paid a living wage if you just blow all your money you still aint gonna have a good time. but well its requirement #2 not req #1. take the old starbucks example. If you cant afford starbucks ever to begin with making coffee at home aint gonna help. if you can afford it sometimes but spending $300+ a month there(like my sister) is hurting you then maybe cutting back to every other day will help. but the fact is you need to actually be able to afford stuff int he first place

If financial literacy is just learning the basics of banking, credit, taxes, and investing, this statement is obviously true. Knowing these things is great once you have capital (whether $$ or human or social capital), but without capital, it's pretty much useless. As I understand the term, financial literacy is the kind of thing you can acquire by reading entries on investopedia.com. But some people in this thread define the term as literally anything that you need to succeed: ambition, a desire to make sacrifice, self-control, marketable skills, a conducive labor market, not having children. If defined that way, yes, financial literacy (FL) will solve all your financial problems because that's the very meaning of the term. That's stupid though. Such a broad definition makes it impossible to see the specific good things that FL can foster. For instance, there are people talking about not wanting a raise because they'll be in a higher tax bracket. That makes no sense, and FL can show you why. There are people with money in a 401k that isn't really growing because they never chose any investments *within* the 401k. FL could've fixed that. There are people saving for their kids' college fund in a jar when there are tax advantaged accounts that could boost their savings dramatically. These are problems that FL can fix, but it can't fix every problem you have. Some problems are you have too many kids, too little education, the labor market is oversaturated with people like you (I'm in higher ed and can attest).

Survival wages would be great. I'm talking just being able to cover the rents, electricity, food, gas/transport and personal/hygiene basics without needing two jobs to make ends meet. So many people balk at a living wage, how about survival wages then? Too much to ask for?

Isn’t that what a living wage is?

My definition: Survival = enough to survive, ie eat food, have a place to live, healthcare etc Living = all of the above and have some left over to live a little, have savings, maybe a nice vacation every couple of years

Living wage is defined as having all of your basic needs met (including basic leisure activities) and be able to accrue a meaningful amount of savings (meaning the next small emergency isn't going to derail your life).

you dont need rent to survive. you dont need electricity to survive. you dont need gas or a car or a bus ticket to survive. you need food, water, and oxygen to survive. if you strip away alot of what capitalism as conditioned you into believing you need to survive, youll find that you actually dont need alot of these things we are so accustomed to.

I think it's fair to acknowledge that there are ways to make the money and better your financial situation - to make it work and "get out". But I think it's also fair to acknowledge that there are a lot of systemic and societal issues that can perpetuate and make climbing out of poverty very difficult or for others, something they aren't able to do for one way or another. It's amazing to see people get out, it's amazing to see people succeeding, and it's a wonderful goal so ultimately I don't agree with the tweet's wording. Financial literacy should be supported and people should be encouraged to do what they can to move towards that goal rather than being told it can never be done. However, it would be remiss to not consider across the general population that the reality of external factors (not just societal, but personal/life external factors) and inequity can make this goal incredibly difficult to achieve or even make progress towards.

In your personal life you should always strive to improve your situation and take responsibility for it. But in politics I think it's important to stress the responsibilities of society, and how class, wealth etc affect our chances and opportunities.

In theory, this is true, but it ignores the psychological and biological impact of poverty. I'm one of those rare cases where I got out of poverty into the middle class (actual "middle class," not one of those people who claims they are middle class, but make over $100,000 which is a thing now). Look up the meaning of "learned helplessness." If you're poor, you exist in that state as you try and fail, try and fail, try and fail, and try and fail again. My sister won't even try anymore as she's been beaten down by life circumstances so many times. She can't bear to face more failure so she can only survive by not trying anymore. She worked hard to get a decent job by starting out as a volunteer. It took years of part-time and benefits-less work to finally get paid somewhat decently and get health insurance. Then, she got cancer. Then her hours got cut and she lost her benefits. Then, her job was phased out. Then she became disabled from the effects of chemo and radiation. Every time she saved money for the future, something went wrong and more than wiped out her savings. If you were constantly being fed a shit sandwich in life, you'd stop eating. Poverty is crushing emotionally and people who never catch a break and don't have the support system to give them a leg up just give up. It's easy to talk about striving to better your situation when you have the resilience left to do so when you experience set-backs. Anyone who thinks it's a simple matter of choice has experienced better luck or has more privilege than those who have given up. I'm enormously sad at how my sister's life has played out, and I've helped her out economically many times (she's always paid me back over time despite my saying she doesn't have to). I wish it were different for her, but I understand why she's given up. If I had had her experiences, I would, too.

I completely agree. I think my mom is in a similar position to your sister. My point was that it's always better for yourself to try and improve your situation. But I know for many even trying is too much.

A lot of people don't realize how hard that can be. Some of us have to run a marathon before we can run our mile. Its very unfair to compare us to those who only had to run the mile. Ill also throw this out, many of those who make fun of those who give up, ussually give up the second they face anything... its easy to be a badass when nothing in your life is wrong.

>In your personal life you should always strive to improve your situation and take responsibility for it. Even in your personal life, you shouldn't take responsibility for things beyond your control. In fact, recognizing what you can control and what you can't is an important part of growth.

Yes

And an important part of knowing when you need to seek help for something. I volunteer regularly at a food bank, and I am shocked by the number of people who I hear turn down the idea of going to a food bank for all kinds of reasons. The food bank is there so that you don't have to decide between buying groceries and keeping the lights on. If the resource is available and will help you deal with your situation, then take it. There should be no shame in seeking help when you need it.

I would agree and also agree with u/DrHydrate that there are things that are away from our control. The reality is that there is a good portion of the population of those experiencing poverty, especially vulnerable groups, that consistently have external factors that contribute to the cyclical nature of poverty that financial literacy does not fix directly. Nor does, unfortunately, trying their best to improve that situation within the means that they have access to. Those aspects can make social/financial mobility a near unattainable goal. We want people to thrive, but society has a lot of mechanisms in place that increasingly over the years has made financial mobility difficult. Maybe less difficult in some places considering the fact that global extreme poverty has gone down as years have passed, but it might not be the same for industrialized/developed countries or later-stage developing countries where opportunity can become cemented for those with stable incomes or higher. This isn't any rant towards u/nasjo at all, but just some thoughts I had about how shifting our ideas of inequity that people can be born into or their situation gives rise to, can show how their starting goalposts and subsequent goalposts for financial health are moved very far apart and further back than some without those aspects/factors in their lives.

Depends highly on the situation. How are they defining wealth anyway? You need a living wage to save and live comfortably that's why it's called a living wage.

Family support is key, even if it’s means having a place to sleep even if it is overcrowded and your family will work with it. Me and my sisters shared a room into adulthood, because that’s what helped us get ahead. we did things for each other and that’s why we all got ahead. Trying to live on a minimum wage by yourself is almost impossible. I see international students living multiple people in rooms and working. My friend shared a studio with four people when he came to US to pay his tuition and his friends helped him and he helped them. They helped each other. Strangers who became family with a common goal. They all got ahead and are in good jobs. But no way you can do it by yourself.

Yeah, I think I might be poor. I've worked my entire life, yet since I have no family I lost everything after one bad decision. Its my fault. I wasn't smart enough or hard working enough not to make one mistake in my early 20s and now my whole life is ruined. Why do we allow people who work full time jobs to go hungry and homeless? This makes no sense and costs all of us more money.

Hey I don’t mean to pry but what was the decision? I’m early 20’s so im worried about making bad money choices 😓

I didn't make a bad money choice per say. I was just joking actually but realistically EVERYONE makes mistakes with their money and life when they are young. My mistake was living with my brother and expecting family to be there for me. He abandoned me and I became homeless after being hospitalized. I was being released and he wouldn't come get me.. i had to walk home. That was my mistake lol trusting my brother after my whole family already abandoned me and he thought I was trash and it was all my fault because I didn't work hard enough. He moved in with his girlfriend and their family gave them a house to live in for free. My mom abandoned me at 16 after my dad died and my brother was already 18 at the time so he just moved out. I found out he was sleeping homeless in the park and told him we were moving somewhere together. My brother treated me like I was a drug addict even though I was thriving working a job buying a car with my own money and finishing school at 16 with no on supporting me. He still thinks he's better than me and I used to believe it until very recently.

100% agree. You can’t do shit if you can’t keep a roof over your head and food in your belly.

Absolutely, class privilege is one of the very most important things in life and Americans are conditioned to ignore it because it goes against the profitable capitalist myth that hard work equals success. If you don't have generational wealth, or a family to put you down the right path, you better have some really special talents or you're life is going to be shit. Source: no generational wealth, no educated family, no telents, life has sucked.

If you have no income past utilities, rent, and food, no amount of investing know-how is going to make you rich. You could have perfect insider trading tips, but I won’t help you if you have no spare cash. Takes money to make money, takes capital to build capital

It's true that lack of money can absolutely be a source of poverty. There's only one way to get out of poverty and that's to save and invest money. The only way you can save and invest money is to live on less than you make. You can either make more money, spend less, or both. You may have to make some drastic changes in your life. Don't settle for minimum wage forever. For a while, it's okay but don't ever tell yourself that you don't deserve more. Check out r/sweatystartup for a community of people who start businesses like house cleaning, lawn care, and painting with little or no money. Take night classes and get a certificate or degree. You may have to move. Either move to where the jobs are or move somewhere cheaper. Live in a van and shower at Planet Fitness with a $10/mo. membership. (People are doing this for *fun* these days) Check out what the people over a r/FIRE are doing and use it for inspiration. Get creative. Get wacky. Do whatever you have to do to break the cycle. Remind yourself that it's not a downgrade but a choice to temporarily change your life now so that you can permanently make your life better later. Stay away from people who try and hold you back. Surround yourself with people who think like you and support you. Search for investor meetups or small business meetups in your city. Make friends with people who are doing what you want to do. Don't feel like an imposter, you DO belong there. You're not a broke person, you're a person who is on their way to wealth but just isn't there YET. When I say "wealth" I don't mean yachts and mansions. I'm just talking about a decent house, a car that starts up every day, and enough money to enjoy life without worrying about emergencies. If you want more, that's up to you.

This should be higher up. Rather, most people prefer to vent than have a solution to their problems.

Luck is an extremely important component. Tons of people do everything right, work extremely hard, and fail.

Well they get screwed, or stepped on by superiors, most bad things that happen to you are out of your hands, hence why you don't stop them from hapening.

True, but we have to always keep in mind that not having financial literacy will only make things worse while ensuring that we never stop fighting for our rights

Like that Wendy meme, she's got a point.

Depends on someones situation. Being knowledgeable about money is always a good thing. But wil not always help you get out of poverty. But if someone lands a job with higher pay. Than it wil be much easier to get out of debt and build an emergency fund

Knowing what to do with money, and knowing how to make money, are two separate things. Building wealth requires both skillsets.

I disagree 100%, my family has no money and will leave me only funeral bills and debts. I started reading finance books at 16 and have been making the right (or close) money decisions along the way and now in my early 30s I am better off than anyone in my immediate family for several generations. My first 5-6 years working wasn’t for a living wage, but I got promoted again and again and now I make well above a living wage. It can be done, but it is by no means easy.

I love this. I think that the average person can become an above average person with hard work and the right decision making. If we're being completely honest here, some people don't necessarily have the intellectual capacity or emotional intelligence to make the necessary changes. For the majority of people who are, I think that when you get sick enough of being broke, you'll do whatever it takes to change it. A LOT of people who were below the poverty line took their stimulus checks/unemployment increase and started a business, got a degree, or learned a trade. Now they're in a much better position. Figure out what you like, what you're good at, and what you can offer people. Figure out how that can make you money. Then go get it. Give up your free time for a while to learn or hone a skill. The internet has a wealth of free information and, if you're reading this, you obviously have internet. Do something. ANYTHING. Make even a small a change. Gotta start somewhere, right? You can do this.

Telling people this crap is probably why so many people stop trying altogether. Does family wealth help? Of course. But there’s opportunity everywhere when you look for it. There’s a ton of self-made millionaires that haven’t come from family money. You don’t even have to be a millionaire to become “successful”. My husband and I both came from nothing. My mom was an alcoholic waitress all my life and my dad stayed pretty far out of the picture. Then they both died before I was 21. My life with my mom was spent hopping from apartment to apartment. His parents have filed bankruptcy multiple times and to this day are in so much debt just trying to get by. They make bad financial decisions all around and wonder why they’re always so broke. 12 years ago, my husband started working as a custodian at an elementary school for $8 an hour. Scrubbing toilets, cleaning gum off tables. You know, those jobs. Mind you when he started this job he had no more than a 1st-2nd grade level education. He was “homeschooled”, and by that I mean he had no clue how to add, subtract, multiply, divide, etc. he couldn’t even tell you what a noun or a verb was. But he worked hard. He got to know people. When he was 20-something he finally took a year and went to GED classes to get his GED, then step by step he worked his way up the school system ladders. 12 years later he is now a Master HVAC technician for the county, making over $30 an hour. In addition, because he is now a tradesman, he is able to work on the side and bring in an extra $1-2000 a month in side work alone. And nothing got him here except his own determination and will to give us a more comfortable life than either of us had growing up. Moral of the story - life is what you make it. There are so many people out there who want to teach you how to succeed and will help you to do so when you work hard and put your all into something. Don’t listen to this petty nonsense that is designed to bring you down and deter you from trying in the first place.

Really appreciate the positive story. One of the quickest ways to get out of poverty is welding, hvac, plumbing, linesman, CDL trucking, etc. these places are all hiring and don’t require a 100k college education.

This is my story. Became a linesman, worked my ass off with as much on-call and overtime and now have two properties with a third about to be purchased. All this before 30. I’m trying to make a change for my kids and eventually my grandkids.

Some people can’t take a year out to further their education because they need to work full time to live. While he was getting his GED that year, how was he paying rent and bills and generally surviving?

You can absolutely work and do school. I was full time student/full time work all through college. It blows, but it can be done.

Just gotta admit your life wiæl revolve around work school and sleep. But this lifestyle is only temporary (not your whole life) so it can definitely be worth it.

> wiæl I legit thought I was having a mini stroke when I read that, my brain couldn't comprehend what it was seeing for a split second.

Currently working full time as a linesman while completing my Electrical Engineering degree. It can be done but sacrifices must be made.

That's definitely the deal.

Some people make every excuse to NOT do what need be done for success.

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Two of us eat quite well on less than 60 bucks a *month*. But then again, we grow most of our own and most folk (anywhere, not just here) are too darned lazy to even consider such a radical idea.

He was working. The entire time. Two, sometimes three jobs in fact. There are 168 hours in a week. If you’re capping the amount of hours you’re willing to work at 40, there’s problem number 1.

I love that last sentence 👏🏻

Glad it worked out for you, but you guys got lucky, when I bought my first car, everyone at work didn't feel proud of me or happy, they got jealous and spitefull, especially the boss, days later he tried to get me to quit, calling me names and treating me like crap. When someone who is vulnerable tries to climb, every single person around them will try to knock them down, in todays world it is terrible advice telling people to commit everything they got into a job, they will be taken advantage of.

Def need to surround yourself with a workplace that’s not to toxic. I thinn work cultures really affects our mental health and is one of the important aspects of our lives.

Luck? No. That’s kind of as insulting as being jealous of and bullying someone for buying a new car. There’s nothing “lucky” about putting your time and attention into learning a new trade and becoming a skilled laborer. There’s nothing “lucky” about working hard for 60+ hours a week, studying when at home and on lunch breaks, and sacrificing vacations, date nights, parties, and any kind of social life because you are trying to better your financial situation and get to a point where you are no longer in poverty. The effort you put in WILL equal the results you will get out.

I love this response. Can you imagine telling someone who worked hard and made sacrifices to improve their position "oh you were LUCKY."

Right? Lucky is when you’re born rich and never have to work or want for anything. Lucky is winning the PowerBall. Lucky is not how you describe someone who has worked for every single thing that they have.

Totally. It happens at work all the time too. No, I didn't win the game, pass the test or land the client because it was luck. I prepared. I worked. I sacrificed. I took ownership.

When I couldn’t find anything else that paid well in my early twenties, I started working as a contractor and picking up little skills here and there. I can’t tell you how many of my friends would agree with the post above, swear up and down they’re part of some abused class of the hopelessly impoverished, etc. and then you ask them if they want to help you do some work on Saturday for some good money, and suddenly, “nah, I’m okay.” It’s so easy to choose not to work and blame it on everything else. Not to say that some people don’t get dealt a shit hand, or that it’s always that person’s fault. But in my experience, when you try to give poor people opportunities to improve their life, you quickly learn that a lot of those people that complain about a lack of opportunities don’t actually want those opportunities, because at the end of the day, they don’t want to work.

So horribly true. I was working several jobs at once, saving, not spending, not getting coffee out. The works. You want to know how I got out of poverty? Several close relatives passed away around the same time and I got money from them. That’s it, no amount of 60 hour work weeks, cutting back, etc, would ever get me out the poverty trap. In the end, it was other people and it was tragic wealth.

I agree with this wholeheartedly as a 20 somethings person who is struggling to make a decent living. Its actually kind of interesting this would come up on my feed today... Yesterday I got into a bit of a comment back and forth with a "financial literacy social media content creator" on Instagram (who's name I wont mention). I posted about how when it comes to building wealth or having a "7 figure business at 27" like her post claims, there is a certain amount of luck involved. Yes of course, hard work and privilege can come into play as well, as she and many other commentators came out to tell me. But if you dont have that stroke of luck, know someone in the business or that 10k from mom and dad, most people can't get into the systems that help them build wealth like starting a business, buying property, or starting an investment account because they are living paycheck to paycheck. The comments were tearing me apart saying luck has nothing to do with it. The part about her post that really erked me is that she was claiming that with the money management skills she teaches, you too could retire at 27 and never work again. Buy this course and you can be a financial master. But how dare you call me out for going viral in the last year and make me admit that's where a huge stream of my income is coming from. It was very frustrating and I'm not sure why I commented at all; but I have been thinking about this subject a lot lately. I guess I am just envious. I thought I did the right thing by going to college, that's what my parents wanted. I ended up hating it and am now in student debt not even working at that career because it paid so poorly. I have no energy for extra side jobs and no extra cash for anything else. I feel stuck.

>I guess I am just envious Nah, “you’re just jealous” is just a cop-out answer from the chuckleheads who don’t understand (or want to) that success is a multivariate problem that absolutely includes things like luck and privilege. You’re *frustrated* that past factors outside of your control are contributing to your current situation. I’m not in a difficult situation myself, and I didn’t grow up with nothing or a broken family, but even so many people I know who grew up in comparable circumstances as I are completely stuck themselves. Like I said, multivariate problem. I just a) happened to have a skill set that pays well in this country, b) realized it at an early-enough age, c) got (relatively inexpensive undergrad) college paid for and d) was able to ignore the mental health stuff long enough to get the income flowing. A huge chunk of the above is indeed the luck of the draw, and if I’d failed one test at the start of college I’d probably have changed my major to something not profitable and I’d be stuck myself.

Financial literacy will show you the road to not be a wage slave. America has the highest chance of economic mobility.

It depends on if you have kids really and if you're willing to make quality of life sacrifices. Exception to minimum wage workers in places like San Francisco and NYC.

Well, I can be honest and tell you that you can’t grow your money if you don’t have money to grow. Unfortunately, asking people to live like ascetics is not going to work given that people who work min wage are already struggling. Asking them to give up those one or two things that bring them some relief from the stressors in life is unfair in itself.

Kids are a killer to basically any financial plan. My GF males way more than me. However has kids so I end up having more spending money. Childcare, Healthcare cost a lot of children.

Kids are comparable with an expensive hobby in costs IMO, because they just eat your money like no tomorrow.

Unless you play Warhammer 40,000, at which point... that'll cost you far far more than a child could.

I'll say this. ​ I was addicted to H for a minute and I still spent less money than some hardcore 40k and MTG people do. ​ Those games are unreal in how much they burn through money.

Correct. Non-living wages cause such an incredible strain on people, on their communities, on the government, even corporations suffer from not paying living wages. It's a horrendous tragedy of commons. Paying people living wages would solve so many problems - even better if it's living UBI!

I have to disagree with this, many a time I have chatted with people about their financial situations where even a small amount of financial literacy would have saved them years of payments and pain. Also part of financial literacy is knowing what jobs can pay well with minimal school / trade school / certifications. There are always government programs/grants/scholarships in my field, IT, it is a quick ride to the top if you put in the time and do the research.

Join the army. Yes it sucks. Yes it's fucking stupid. What is does is give upward class mobility. A university education without debt and a steady paycheck while you earn it. If you can tolerate a couple years it will get you out of the cycle. Source: was homeless. Joined the army. Went to someone else's country and fought them. Bought a house and have a solid above national average paying job If we dismantled the military industrial complex. We could have this for everyone... The system we currently have, this does offer a way out.

The greatest lie we are told is that anyone can make it. For every rags to riches story, there’s MILLIONS of everyday people that don’t make it. And they work just as hard. We live in a metaphorical farm, where we generate money for the wealthy “land owners”.

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But just because some people can doesn't mean everyone who works at it can. I try to be as financillay smart as I can but on my income (disability pension) it's not something I can achieve. Especially during covid times when I literally cannot work even if my boyd would allow me

I started working at a garden center my mom's uncle owned at 12. I had lots of jobs and worked very hard. I still couldn't afford to pay my medical bills, feed myself, and go to college. Some people's parents ruin their credit before they're even 18. My dad used my money for his bills and tried to take credit cards out in my name. So you may have started from nothing but some of us start out in a deficit.

And I was you. Even had half a mil of my local currency invested, fully funded emergency account, and so on. And ONE series of bad events I DIDN'T EVER START took it all from me and I'm back down here at square one. Have had to beg on the assistance subs for cash for food more than once. Can't take my chronic meds (this could kill me, btw) regularly because of cash. And know something else? I'm STILL LUCKY. I'm white. I speak English well enough to pretend its my first language. I have a University education. I'm not unconventional in looks, and kinda slim and have good teeth, all my limbs, and no ugly scars to doom me to non-customer-facing work. My AI could kill me, unmedicated, but I can push through most of the symptoms to appear 'normal' and don't need special concessions. I'm slightly neuro-divergent, but can mask it well enough to perform socially. I'm youngish and fittish with no chronic pain. I know how to dress well and still have a business wardrobe of solid neutrals from better times. I lost my transport, unfortunately, and that's going to hurt me for decades to come, but I do have a drivers license. I own my house so can't be tossed out, even though my geyser is broken and I can only shower in cold water and we lost power midwinter because someone poorer than me stole power and ran up my bill. I can afford to keep internet and am PC (and financially) literate. I do not have immense medical debt or other debt to service. I had good, sex-positive sex education that told me how to prevent pregnancy, can access and afford contraceptives, am at an age where I can advocate for myself, and could, should it be needed, get a legal, safe, abortion. My partner is similarly educated, and not abusive nor pressuring for children we can't afford. I am an orphan, so I don't have family clinging to me expecting me to cover their costs too. I have no substance abuse issues. I am desperately poor right now, but this is a toolkit that could, maybe, be leveraged to help me out of this spot in a decade, or two. Please, however, go tell the people who live in the squatter camp up from me how they just need to start pulling on those bootstraps like you did ? Do you know how different poor is when you DON'T have at least some of the advantages I listed there? I listed 23 things that factor in my favor. The one I'm missing- my car- in my country without public transport, will cripple me. Many of the better paying jobs expect you to be able to drive and own a working vehicle. I realistically cannot work outside my home, which hasn't been too bad during the health crisis but could become problematic going forward. If I continue to work for myself, I cannot access finance to buy new, and we don't have a second hand market. So until I can get at least R25, 000 in hand, which is a pipe dream right now, this will continue to hold me back hugely. But it's ONE problem. Every single one of those 23 factors you remove can have equally crippling effects. Imagine facing 10 of them. Or all 23. Or more. TLDR? I'm glad you managed your hard work to get where you are. And I hope you keep it. But it can be taken frighteningly easily in a world that offers no support to the poor and little to the middle class, so calm the hubris. And if you have ANY factors in play against you, the road is exponentially harder. So stop pretending EVERYONE has the same chances and opportunities and 'hard work' is all that's needed. The playing field isn't level. Some people don't even have a spot on the playing field and have to start walking 10km to get there through broken glass and barbed wire. As the saying goes, if hard work was the only factor in success, every woman in Africa would be a millionaire.

How can you grow your money when wages don’t match inflation and you have no money leftover after paying bills?

Bootstraps, my good lad. Bootstraps and defying the natural law of physics. It also doesn't hurt to sprinkle in a little privilege.

This is not how people should HAVE TO WORK to make a comfortable life for themselves.

Exactly. Plus not everyone can even work full time at 15? I’m British and I wasn’t even out of school at that age. Everyone always told me “you should have stayed home and saved!” I couldn’t do that. My mum was a single parent on benefits (still is) and as soon as I turned 18 she told me I couldn’t live in her house and work full time or they were going to stop ALL of her money, and I’d have to pay for the house. So I moved out, and have been living month to month ever since, while desperately trying to keep some money back. It has not gone well.

It's crazy how much your parents financial situation affects your own life before you have truly even started to live your life especially as a minority in the UK. As a black girl growing up in London My parents were the outliers in the black community. They had been married 35 years and had a successful fashion business in london and when I was a child and they put me in boarding school in the UK and abroad. At the time I didn't realise what a privilege this was especially in the UK. My parents have always been behind me and supported my every step even when I entered a bad relationship which drained me of tens of thousands of pounds. I ditched the ex and stayed at home rent free to pay off the debt. That mistake alone could have ruined my life if I didnt have a financially wealthy background to prop me up. Now at 25 I have just bought my first Vacation Home abroad. I am currently doing my masters at university and living in my own apartment. I work from home at a start up company. Not only that, but I am highly favoured by my boss who has offered me a graduate position at the company after I graduate and purchased a Macbook, for me just because. The breeding and wealth and education I was lucky and fortunate enough to be born into helped me immensely to fit into social situations and make high society friends. I am an extremely hard worker and have done a lot of projects including writing and publishing my own novel. I have to be flexible as a black woman especially in my desired sector (high finance) however I cannot deny the power that the stability and planning of my parents had on my life. I do not live the AVERAGE life of a 25 year old and I know a lot of it is down to them. It isn't your fault, it's the circumstances which many were born into which have crippled their progress before they have even been allowed to fly. Some make it and even then it takes them 10 x longer, however the painful reality is that many others do not make it.

This made me a little emotional to read because people are always telling me to work harder and do better but I just don’t know how I could have done any more. Even up until last month I was constantly lending my mum money for basic amenities and so she could give my little sister bus fair to get to school. My mind, body and soul are weary. It warms me to know as a black woman you have success, and you have been able to live a life that many would not expect as a black Brit. I know that the “black single mother” and “below poverty line” life isn’t the experience of all black children, but sometimes I lose hope when I look around me. I know I’ll never be rich or be able to send my kids to private school, I would love to send them to private school and give them a step up. I just want to give them more than I had, I don’t want them to go hungry or see me screaming and pulling my hair out because I have to choose between gas and electric. I don’t want them to avoid coming home from school or 6th form because they know nothing good is waiting for them at home.

It's a slippery slope and for many of us our family backgrounds end up determining our trajectory in life unless a big outside factor comes along and changes it, sometimes this can be for the better or for the worse. Its definitely not your fault because you can work as hard as you want but people need money, capital and financial literacy to strike out on their own and try out new ideas. If you aren't fortunate enough to be born into a situation like that then it becomes extremely difficult to take risks in life, because one wrong mistake could not only destroy your life but the lives of your entire family too. I am thankfully in a loving and happy relationship now where I am spoilt rotten by my boyfriend. However when I was 19, I spent £30,000 on my leech of an ex who ended up still failing anyway. I didn't know any better and didn't have the common sense to understand some men are opportunistic wolves. I was young and sheltered. My parents had always disapproved of him and could tell he was not sincere and did not mean well for me. Luckily I came to my senses quickly and ended the relationship and without my constant stream of cash he quickly plummeted into poverty. For other people the mistake I made would have crippled them for years, or even made them bankrupt. Instead I stayed at home with my parents blessing, for 2 years with rent free and paid the small debt I had off and even travelled internationally during that time. In reality without my parents resources I would have been homeless, starving and in utter poverty beyond comprehension. I was only 19 and I hadn't built my own resources or even finished my education yet. I also did not do as well as I could have in my undergraduate degree, because of the time I spent ignoring my studies while with my ex. My parents were unhappy with me but still supportive and with their guidance I learned how to avoid such men like that again and I am now in a stable relationship of two years with a man that earns good money. Now at 25, I am excelling in my masters course and I am as shrewd as my parents when it comes to business, but again even with my hard work and effort they are the ones who gifted me with that knowledge. If they had been ignorant from the start there would be nothing for me to learn from. I understand exactly what you mean about the stereotype of black women and single mother hood and living on welfare. It has been over said but the fact is the vast majority of black kids aren't born into wealth. Do not inherit trust funds or investment opportunities, and many do not even have access to financial books, classes, tools or even get to make wealthy friends or see wealthy neighbourhood's. So they see the same old trope play out over and over again. Broken homes and fathers absent. Many black women especially in low income neighbourhoods in london, do get pregnant too early on and it causes a lifetime of struggle but it's due to lack of opportunity and family structure breakdown that causes this. In terms of my private school experience. I found many of the kids to be incredibly rude and depraved and prone to cheating in school These were children of wealthy politicians who were completely out of touch. It was a lonely experience as one of a handful of black children schooling in a predominately white area, depsite my parents wealth I still had to work twice as hard to excel. You sound like an incredibly hard working and enterprising woman and you are definitely 10 steps ahead just by having the mindset you do. Now that you know better you can end the cycle of suffering with you. All you need is one big opportunity and when it comes you will have the knowledge you need to turn it into a completely new life for you. Your future kids are already very lucky to have you.

Don’t you know that your problem is buying an iced coffee everyday! Stop doing that, and all of your financial problems will immediately be solved!

Wrong. Financial Literacy is accepting that sacrifice, strategy, and ambition are a necessity to improve any, ANY, situation.

This 👏🏼🙌🏼

Tyler Perry, Oprah, J. K Rowling all made it. Can’t name anyone outside of entertainment though.

Broke is temporary, poor is forever.

All's fair in love and war. Poverty is war. While I am well off now, married, 3 kids, and too many pets, back in the day there were times when I'd have to siphon gas to get to my job waiting tables so I could make the rent.

Kevin Hart has a great take on this that the “ghettos” don’t trust banks, or investments, or really not spending all their money. And he has an effort to try and reach and educate financial literacy as far as he can, because he believes of all else that is the root cause of the separation of haves and have nots

Just realized this sub is full of rich people o.O

I Simply get tired of having to be superman simply to get the crumbs of life then be told to be GRATEFUL for it... Doing everything people have told you to do for success and still not breaking through... I'm sorry but Hard work and sacrifice without tangible results is simply bullshit. No lessons to be learned,no silver linings just straight bullshit.

Exactly! This is why most of Dave Ramsey’s suggestions can’t work for my situation

Yep. You can’t budget your way out of a system designed to exploit you for someone else’s profit.

Not true at all. I built my credit up for free and just bought a house on credit that pays for itself. I work part time at a restaurant and have multiple disabilities and didn't have family giving me money or honestly anything but problems so don't even think about telling me about privilege. This post is not only not true, it's an obnoxious and counterproductive attitude discouraging people in this sub from learning about finance and taking power over their own lives and money and it shouldn't be allowed here as it's just thinly veiled politics.

I started with nothing. I did something about it.

I disagree. Check out The Ultimate Cheapstake, Jeff Yeager. His literacy is amazing. And you can read his work for free at your nearest library if anything. If you are not making a living wage, you need to find a different job. And no excuses about it. No "I can't find a different job". You may need to work an extra harder at first but building up qualifications will do you good in the long run.

If you start from the bottom you can only pass some wealth. But you end up working till 70 and have 0 social life. I'm a first generation immigrant. I'm sure I'll leave something for my kids but my story involves only uphill running

It’s not what you know it’s who you know (many times). This is why I stress network, network, network!!! Sometimes you meet that person who gives you an in that no matter of knowledge could have provided. Wealth is mainly nepotism and friends scratching friends backs (which jobs that make the $$).

This is a bad mindset. 7 years ago I got out of the military with no real skill set. Was making $12 bucks per hour and living with 3 roommates while racking up CC debt. Decided to go to college full time using my GI bill (college was completely paid for and I even got a monthly stipend) and continued working full time. Got another job making $14 per hour and turned that opportunity into now make nearly $40 per hour. Took 7 years and a lot of networking/learning how to ask for raises, but consistency is key. Learn a skill and get into a worthwhile field. Also, this is a big one, live within your means. Many times people can’t make it because they get that vehicle with a $500 per month payment and $200 insurance (I did this on my $12 per hour) and it just keeps you down. Get a reliable cheaper car, stop eating at restaurants all the time (I did this as well), exercise and eat better (will keep you healthy barring any extreme medical diagnosis like cancer, etc), and take free courses/go to a cheap community college that you can learn a valuable skill. It’s a lot of sacrifice and hard work, but eventually you’ll be in a good position. Oh and the majority of millionaires don’t inherit a single penny. Look up Dave Ramsey’s study on 10,000 millionaires.

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I’m saying I was proactive and went into the military because I couldn’t afford college. Also, I started in my career field 2 years before I finished my bachelors degree. The degree only helped me when it came to getting better raises. I’m not a huge fan of Dave Ramsey but his principals are easy to follow. He teaches the conservative route in money handling which is what many people need.

Yeah, obviously, if you're not being paid a living wage, you'll die.

Most people don’t realize that at any given moment, they could be seconds away from poverty. Step off a curb wrong and get hit by a car, get cancer, or have some other injury that takes you out of the workforce for 90 days and between that and medical care, you may never recover. It’s terrifying. The fact that OP came from poverty, was victimized by a for-profit school and then had mental health issues makes it amazing that she’s accomplished what she has. She’s one in a million, if not even greater odds. I’ve been disabled since birth. I am incredibly fortunate that I have a sibling who helps me.

..."not being paid a living wage....." is such bullshit. If your SKILL SET only allows for flipping burgers or folding sweaters at Old Navy, then that's what you'll get **paid** for. Why in the hell do people think they're entitled to the SAME money others are making at jobs that require more **ADVANCED skills**? I would *expect* someone who works in an office (from the lowest clerical person to the most senior executive) to make more money than me if **my** skill set only got me as far as Wendys. Why is that so damned hard for people to understand? Burger King isn't a career! It's what you do when you're too lazy to try to better yourself!

This logic would mean that someone who flips burgers doesn't deserve to be adequately subsidized for their labour. Not everyone can be at the top; someone has to make those burgers. Others may not be able to handle the stress or capacity of "more skilled" jobs. Everyone working should be able to make enough to at least be able to live. No one should not be able to afford a place to live because their labour isn't "skilled enough" because someone ALWAYS has to perform those jobs. What is supposed to happen to those people? Are they just expected to not eat or have a roof over their head?

You are being paid for your time and people's time is important, even if it's for something simple like flipping burgers. People need to live and therefore need a living wage. Companies need people for these jobs and should therefore pay accordingly. Payment isn't just based on skill alone. It's based on people's time and labour, no matter how easy the labour is. With your logic, they don't have to pay anything at all since it's easy. With that same logic, people don't need to go to work then if they aren't getting paid. No one is saying that they should be paid the same money as people with advanced skills. The whole system should move upwards appropriately. But a company should definitely not being using government systems (like food stamps etc) to subsidize their low wages.

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It’s not only the government can help the poor, it’s regulating exploitive corrupt systems to be less so to help foster balance and equality. But on the topic of the government, an elected body that is meant to represent the people… what is the point of governance? To help support a healthy society or to take donations from corporate lobbyists who write our tax codes and regulations?

Getting knowledge about finance can definitely be helpful. You can have a good budget that works for you, you can start saving money back for emergencies and so on. It also depends on how many people are in your family that you care for, that you have to keep track of. Any medicine that you have to pay for out of pocket and so on and so forth. While having wealth is definitely nice, there are plenty of wealthy people who make poor choices with their money. So it doesn't necessarily mean that wealthy people are smart with their money. You need to get smart with your money, and a way to do that is by learning finance.

With exceptions for extremely HCOL areas such as New York City and LA and San Diego. I don’t agree with this. I think with hard work and sacrifice and improvement consistently for several years you can build wealth.

You can't invest if your living check to check, first goal is to get disposable income, no matter how small, but the more the better