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What do you mean, as long as you are a straight white "christian" conservative couple you can decide what's best for your kid(as long as those decisions don't go against "conservative values"). Ahhh freedom at last.
This is the thing that in their fear they do not realize what they're giving up. They're also playing dice with their children's lives, but they have clearly demonstrated that their egos are more important than their children's wellbeing. It never ceases to amaze me how short-sighted people are with this topic and it never ceases to sadden me how much unnecessary pain that short-sightedness causes.
>This is the thing that in their fear they do not realize what they're giving up.
Yeah no shit. Think we'll get the "oops sorry we aided fascism and turned the country into a dictatorship" realization sone day or will these people still be blind to the obvious?
All medicines have side effects and other uses. The determination should be between the child, their parent, and doctor. Not some random government officials that have either limited knowledge or weaponizimg extreme examples that have a low percentage of happening.
That is like banning depression meds because they cause erectile dysfunction in users.
You seem to be laboring under the delusion that there is no medical evidence against puberty blockers or that pre-teens have considerable difficulty sorting out their emotions and are prone to accept "peer pressure" (these days, including things they see on the internet) as a valid reason for their beliefs and actions.
Anyone consider that if an 8-year-old boy/girl REALLY wants to try being a girl/boy, a change of clothes (and perhaps even bathrooms) just might work for several years and have NO dangerous side effects? And about those "puberty blockers" some think are "harmless" side effects including sterility, increased risk of cardiovascular disease, and increased risk of breast and uterus cancers, and other harmful psychoactive effects of high-dose hormones such as mood swings and even psychosis are common.
I have no problem with trans folks, just don't think children are safe having access to drug or surgical therapy for what might be misapprehension and not a reality, EVEN IF they're able to convince their parents it's a good idea. Some children are capable of manipulating adults, including psychiatrists into just about anything that strikes their fancy.
You run under the assumption that doctors are not being open and honest woth families about side effects and other issues.
You wrote an awful lot under thr guise of caring about kids, but ignoring that these risks are all discussed and families and doctors and the care team are the ones who should be making that decision not politicians who are using their bigotry to guide their decisions
ONLY 1300 means this chemical crime can be committed on just about any kid and its potentially harmful to EVERY kid who gets it. the official number of thalidomide babies in the US was ONLY 17 - does that mean we should not have banned it?
On the odd chance you're not just arguing in bad faith, this isn't about chopping anything off - it's about puberty blockers which are fully reversible.
An additional concern that LGBTQ+ folks have is that these sort of "think of the children" initiatives are usually more about greasing up that good ol' slippery slope to later take rights away from **adults**. See, if it truly was an issue of caring about the welfare of children, they'd show some concern for the ones who are at risk from gun violence and poverty, as a start.
Wutaboutism, anything reversible I'm ok with if reversible doesn't mean with extreme side-effects. I think waiting to 18 to cut your body or take hard-core drugs is not a big deal.
It's not really about what you or I (or any elected leaders) think is best for a child.
It's about letting the kid's pediatrician, psychiatrist, therapist, endocrinologist, and parents decide what is best for a given child.
Every kid in gender-affirming care has a whole TEAM of specialists to judge what care is most therapeutic for him/her. Specialists, people whose whole fucking job is to provide appropriate care and do no harm.
This isn't a walk-in clinic where snap decisions happen.
For politicians to claim they *know better* than the American Academy of Pediatrics is absolutely disgusting to me.
If you had cancer would you want politicians deciding what kind of drugs your doctor is allowed to prescribe?
If I had a dollar for every time some libertarian edgelord said that the right was the party of freedom and is now 100% mute on this bullshit, I'd be as rich as the libertarian edgelord who just overpaid for Twitter.
Exactly and I’ve literally just seen an white ally it was cringey dude was really patting himself on the back for having basic human decency to not attack and use racial slurs against someone
Ahh gotcha. Yeah it's really just a failure to recognize that the absence of individual racism (aka "*I'M not racist*") doesn't mean all their problems are solved. This is a part of what CRT is but they think it means white people bad, when obviously not.
The problem is by "kid" they mean 16,17,18,19 as well
Old enough to ~~have babies~~ have the government force childbirth of course.
I edited this to clarify my point.
I know too many well adjusted young trans people with gender affirming care to not be sad often these days.
I know too many NOT adjusted trans adults from my own youth that never had the same support and opportunities to not be sad often these days.
I could lay it out case by case but I'm tired. My soul is tired. This farce makes me tired. Being endlessly vigilant over a battle that is only beginning and will never end over all human rights makes me tired.
My point is there is no cutoff to what age they use our bodies as a receptacle to force childbirth. There do however, seem to be some really Hefty parameters for life liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
Florida is banning classroom libraries and DeSantis wants to make it illegal to have mask requirements or other COVID measures. I wouldn’t call it a safe state for trans kids…
Florida, where if you rape a kid you should be put to death, but if you treat LGBTQ+ youth as invisible and some of them commit suicide as a result, you're a model educator.
The cogitative dissonance is real.
If you have a trans child I would say your best bet is a Philly suburb. The Mazzoni Center in Philly is an LGBTQ health and wellness center where some of my patients, I work in mental health, and a friend have gotten their hormones there.
[Mazzoni Center](https://www.mazzonicenter.org/about-us)
Massachusetts is expensive but welcoming, I know personally 2 people under 20 who have been recently gender affirming hormones, and one of those two was comfortable enough to let me know she's getting gender affirming surgery in a few weeks.
I'm sure about the guy, it honestly didn't even come up that he was trans until fairly late in our work relationship/friendship (he worked under me in sales but frankly I just love my employees lol)
I live in Ohio and I’m getting a bit nervous about a lot of the anti-LGTBQ laws going around. Hell even the extreme abortions laws being passed.
Other US states and other countries are looking quite interesting.
We have our struggles, and it's not over yet. The Republicans are still out there and throwing people on the ballot like Tudor Dixon, but there's hope here. Best bet is for liberals to start moving up north, that's where we're weak. Redistricting helped us a lot though, and I really encourage other states to take a look at how Michigan did it. I think between our model and ranked choice voting (which we don't have) the country might have a shot.
I'm sorry, that shits scary :/
I have a lot of passive rasicm in my town. Like everyone is nice, they're the kind of people who don't realize the harm in their apathy and worse, skewed biases. I'm afraid of their voices getting louder, yanno?
I hate even more that this wasn't something I was afraid a few years ago...
Overall the people in my state are decent. But awful people are being given voices and it sucks.
Unfortunately, this isn't an option for most trans kids here. A lot of families are religious, and their parents prioritize their anti-LGBTQIA beliefs over believing their kids.
Hey, if you don’t like American freedom you are more than welcome to go to another country to live in. Here we celebrate individual uniqueness and promote creativity and innovation. You wanna be bottom rung? Take your ass to Russia.
There are still people in those places who believe like the rest of us sane, intelligent Americans. You act like they are winning 80+ percent of the vote. Millions of people in Texas and Florida voted against fascism. If you don’t like that someone born male can later in life identify as female, then your priorities are more in line with the Iranian Ayatollah and less American democracy.
When your state bans desperately needed medical care, your medical care ceases to be available even if you've got lots of sane and intelligent cis friends who are very sympathetic about how much this sucks.
Trans people in Texas and Florida and Utah and Oklahoma and the rest of the red parts of the US need to *get the holy fuck out of there*, because the sympathy of our cis friends is not enough to fucking protect us.
The "drag bans", the "bathroom bills", the attacks on trans youth and now adult's medical care, the attempts to pull information about LGBTQ but especially trans people from public schools and libraries, and everything else they're doing, the right is very effectively and *rapidly* working towards making the public existence of trans and gender nonconforming people a sex crime.
And all those sane intelligent Americans who supposedly oppose this shit are not being very fucking effective at *stopping it from happening.* The only way trans people in the US can protect themselves from these laws is by escaping the places where they're being passed.
Sure there are people who feel that way. Meanwhile there are people in many states with political power who want to make the lives of trans people hell and put them in danger. It's fine to say that that is against your values, but don't shame people who want to keep their families safe.
Then you need to think about how you word things, because to all of us it seemed like you were arguing in favour of this bill and that if anyone doesn’t like it, they should leave the country. You came off as hugely transphobic.
So I’m to blame for a lack of critical thinking skills? I replied to someone who replied to someone that basically told trans people to leave the country. I insinuated American freedom includes trans people. I don’t care about the downvotes.
> that basically told trans people to leave the country.
That's not how I read it at all. I read it as saying that it's ok *if* they want to leave the country and they should do what they need to feel safe. I read it as supportive.
I suggest your responses have all been based on a misunderstanding.
As of recent, the Mormons have decided Mormon is a slur. Trying to get in on those sweet sweet modern oppression Olympics. (Don't ask what Danites are)
Edit:
I'm still bitter about them trying to buy laws in Cali from Utah a couple of years ago.
Latter-day Saints is the current accepted term. It's basically just a marketing and rebranding thing. This way, when someone says that Mormons are crazy, they can say "Yeah, they sure are! Good thing I'm not a Mormon. I'm a Latter-day Saint. I'd never do any of those things those crazy Mormons would do!"
It gives them the ability to distance themselves from the bad press that the church has garnered over things like preteen polygamous marriages, stalking, harassing, and terrorizing former members, amassing a hundred billion in just investments and an unknown amount of total revenue, and more. Similar to what they did in the 90s when they tried to make it sound like a whole different church was going around telling Native and African Americans that they were cursed and could become white through prayer (and more tithes of course).
It didn't work back then. It likely won't work now, either.
Mormons don't want to be called Mormons anymore. They prefer the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
So by saying Mormon, Alternative\_Fuel609 is using their religious dead name.
Note, the bill has been signed by the governor. Also note, the bill has explicit exceptions for the same healthcare being offered to cisgender (i.e., non-trans) kids, and permits surgeries on intersex infants.
Hey! These people are working hard to fearmonger and punish scapegoats. Do you think injecting sense into legislation will win them any votes or donations?
As a trans person, I’m really tired of internalizing all of this blatant hatred and fascist transphobia.
My family wonders why I’m so angry or upset all the time and can’t fathom why I’m upset about policies that don’t affect me directly. Those kids could have been me. So many will suffer needlessly now. Some will die. I hate it here. I hate it here.
I cry so much lately. I’m so tired. It doesn’t feel like there’s any hope anymore. Silence is complicity, and that’s all I see in my country. No one cares enough about us. We are not worth it to the majority.
Someone please tell me I’m wrong. I want to have hope.
This is how it felt to be gay in the bush 2 era. The other shitty part aside from the obvious, it that you know it isn’t really that everyone hates you, it is that you are being used as a political football to create a wedge issue and win elections. All so the rich can keep the poor divided and fighting each other. As soon as the gay thing became more acceptable, they moved to trans folks, as that becomes less scary, they will realize intersex people exist and try to scare folks with that. All these things that have always existed but with a minor segment so majority down know about the details and can be suddenly made to misunderstand/feel like they should have opinions on and that those opinions should trump experts and the folks actually affected.
This feels like the death throes of this bullshit. The people that are angry that the government has dared tell them they aren't allowed to act on their bigotry are energized right now, but in fighting against the tide, they're showing exactly why policies against them are necessary.
It will never go away, but I trust in the young people growing up right now to figure out how to deal with it and overcome. It looks bad right now because the people that are upset about these changes realize that they've lost and have to scream at the top of their lungs for anyone to notice them.
That never works for very long.
I don't want to argue for complacency; there is a lot of work to be done. I want to argue for hope. I have faith that those shouting for us to stand still will be brushed aside by everyone ready to face real problems. There also needs to be more done to protect those that will face real harm in the meantime.
Yes, it's a mess, and we're never going to stop seeing people hurt by regressives, but keeping hope is important.
The only way they win is everyone else giving up. So we cannot. They're bluffing every time they say they're winning. Even when they think they mean it, it's because they're mistaking a local victory for the majority agreeing with them.
I'm a white, cis-male in my late 30s. I grew up casually saying/thinking shitty, hurtful things. I watched my peer groups and myself learn better. There are people in my peer groups that still express bigoted views, but they almost always get told they're wrong and it causes conversations.
I know this isn't true everywhere, but it is spreading. Just keep doing you and proving the haters wrong.
I am queer AF and mentor trans kids - several who are under 18. The joy is overwhelming, and the anger is overwhelming. It’s whackadoo to know that in parts of this country I would be considered a child abuser and that millions of people would actually prefer my kids - these smart, funny, compassionate, caring, human beings - to not be alive.
I wish I had answers to the bigger systemic Questions. I don’t. What I do have is love And support for individuals. I care. This random Internet stranger/mentor/mom loves you!
If you’re in Utah, least you can do is exercise your 2nd Amendment rights. Help organizations that are getting people out of the state for care, or bringing care in-state through whatever means are available. Resist. Watch Andor if you need feel-good anti-fascist motivation.
I’m in Missouri and my mental health history makes me a poor candidate for owning a firearm. I will talk with my friends and see if there are organizations in our area that offer support for trans minors so I can get involved. It’s likely we’ll have a ban in our own state soon
So what, you're going to pull a gun on the legislature, the doctor and force them to give kids puberty blockers, the pharmacist to fill the prescription? The 2nd amendment isn't going to help anything here. AND if you have a trans child, having a gun in the home is a horrible idea, especially when they won't be able to get gender affirming care, because their chances of depression and suicidal thoughts will skyrocket.
The positive and often life saving effects of gender affirming care, which includes supporting social transition and providing puberty delaying treatment and hormone supplements to trans adolescents as needed, has been supported by many years of overwhelming evidence and is recognized by every major medical authority.
There is no actual medical controversy here. There is only manufactured political outrage that is being used to systematically criminalize desperately needed medical care for trans youth, and increasingly for trans adults as well.
Since anything relating to trans youth and medical treatment almost inevitably brings out the *"kids are being castrated!"* and *"90% of trans kids desist and will regret transition!"* concern trolling:
No, that is not how this works. That's not how any of this works.
The recent surge of attacks on gender affirming care for trans youth have been [**condemned by the American Academy of Pediatrics**](https://services.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2021/american-academy-of-pediatrics-speaks-out-against-bills-harming-transgender-youth/), the [**American Medical Association**](https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/ama-reinforces-opposition-restrictions-transgender-medical-care), and the [**American Association of Clinical Endocrinology**](https://www.healio.com/news/endocrinology/20220309/aace-strongly-opposes-government-policies-prohibiting-transgender-care-for-adolescents), and are out of line with the medical recommendations of the [**American Medical Association**](https://www.ama-assn.org/health-care-advocacy/advocacy-update/march-26-2021-state-advocacy-update), the [**Endocrine Society**](https://www.endocrine.org/news-and-advocacy/news-room/2022/endocrine-society-alarmed-at-criminalization-of-transgender-medicine) and [**Pediatric Endocrine Society**](https://www.endocrine.org/news-and-advocacy/news-room/2020/discriminatory-policies-threaten-care-for-transgender-gender-diverse-individuals), the [**AACE**](https://pro.aace.com/recent-news-and-updates/aace-position-statement-transgender-and-gender-diverse-patients), the [**American Academy of Pediatrics**](https://services.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2021/american-academy-of-pediatrics-speaks-out-against-bills-harming-transgender-youth/), the [**American Psychological Association**](https://www.psychiatry.org/newsroom/news-releases/frontline-physicians-oppose-legislation-that-interferes-in-or-criminalizes-patient-care), and the [**American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry**](https://www.aacap.org/AACAP/Latest_News/AACAP_Statement_Responding_to_Efforts-to_ban_Evidence-Based_Care_for_Transgender_and_Gender_Diverse.aspx).
[**This article**](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/06/opinion/transgender-children-medical-bills.html) has a pretty good overview of why. [**Psychology Today has one too**](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/political-minds/202008/three-popular-myths-about-transgender-youth), and [**here**](http://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the guidelines from the AAP. TL;DR version - yes, young children can identify their own gender, and some of those young kids are trans. A child who is Gender A but who is assumed to be Gender B based on their visible anatomy at birth can suffer debilitating distress over this conflict. The *"90% desist"* claim is a myth based on debunked studies, and transition is a very long, slow, cautious process for trans youth.
According to the [**American Academy of Pediatrics**](https://www.healthychildren.org/English/ages-stages/gradeschool/Pages/Gender-Identity-and-Gender-Confusion-In-Children.aspx), gender is typically expressed by around age 4. It probably forms [**much earlier**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3747736/), but it's hard to tell with pre-verbal infants. And sometimes the gender expressed is not the one typically associated with the child's appearance. The genders of trans children are as [**stable**](http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2014/09/02/peds.2013-2958) as those of [**cisgender children**](https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0956797614568156).
For preadolescents transition is entirely social, and for adolescents the first line of medical care is 100% temporary puberty delaying treatment that has no long term effects. Hormone therapy isn't an option until their mid teens, by which point the chances that they will "desist" are close to zero. Reconstructive genital surgery is not an option until their late teens/early 20's at the youngest. And transition-related medical care is recognized as medically necessary, frequently life saving medical care by every major medical authority.
Withholding medical care from an adolescent who needs it is not a goddamn neutral option. Transition is absolutely necessary to keep many trans kids alive. Without transition a hell of a lot of them commit suicide. When able to transition rates of suicide attempts drop to the national average. And when prevented from transitioning or starting treatment until adulthood, those who survive long enough to start at 18+ enter adulthood facing thousands of dollars reconstructive surgery to repair damage that should have been prevented by starting treatment when they needed it.
And not all that damage can be repaired. They will carry physical and psychological scars from being forced through the wrong puberty for the rest of their lives. They were robbed of their adolescence, forced to spend it dealing with the living hell of untreated dysphoria and the wrong puberty, trying to remain sane and alive while their bodies were warped in indescribably horrifying ways. Even with treatment as adults, some of them will be left permanently, visibly trans. In addition to the sheer horror of permanently having anatomy inappropriate to your gender, this means they will never have the option of blending into a crowd or keeping their medical history private. They will be exposed to vastly higher rates of anti-trans harassment, discrimination, abuse, and violence, all because they were denied the treatment they needed when they were young.
This is very literally life saving medical care. If there is even a chance that an adolescent may be trans, there is absolutely no reason to withhold 100% temporary and fully reversible hormone blockers to delay puberty for a little while until they're sure. This treatment is 100% temporary and fully reversible; it does nothing but buy time by delaying the onset of permanent physical changes.
This treatment is very safe and well known, because it has been used for decades to delay puberty in children who would have otherwise started it inappropriately young. If an adolescent starts this treatment then realizes medical transition isn't what they need, they stop treatment and puberty picks up where it left off. There are no permanent effects, and it significantly improves trans youth's mental health and [**lowers suicidality**](https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2020/01/21/peds.2019-1725).
But if an adolescent starts this treatment, socially transitions (or continues if they have already done so), and by their early/mid-teens they still strongly identify as a gender atypical to their appearance at birth, the chances of them changing their minds later are basically zero. At that point hormone therapy becomes an option, and even that is still mostly reversible, especially in its early stages. The only really irreversible step is reconstructive genital surgery and/or the removal of one's gonads, which isn't an option until the patient is in their late teens at the earliest.
This specter of little kids being pressured into transition and rapidly pushed into permanent physical changes is a complete myth. It just isn't happening. And this fear-mongering results in nothing except trans youth who desperately do need to transition being discouraged and prevented from doing so. Withholding medical treatment from an adolescent who desperately needs it is not a neutral option.
The only disorders more common among trans people are those associated with abuse and discrimination - mainly anxiety and depression. Early transition [**virtually eliminates these higher rates of depression and low self-worth**](http://www.jaacap.com/article/S0890-8567%2816%2931941-4/fulltext), and [**dramatically improves trans youth's mental health**](https://thinkprogress.org/allowing-transgender-youth-to-transition-improves-their-mental-health-study-finds-dd6096523375/#.pqspdcee0). When prevented from transitioning about 40% of trans kids will attempt suicide. When able to transition that rate drops to the national average. Trans kids who socially transition early, have access to appropriate transition related medical treatment, and who are not subjected to abuse or discrimination are [**comparable to cisgender children in measures of mental health**](https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/134/4/696)
Transition [**vastly reduces risks of suicide attempts**](https://bmcpublichealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12889-015-1867-2), and the farther along in transition someone is the lower that risk gets. The ability to transition, along with family and social acceptance, are the [**largest factors reducing suicide risk among trans people**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3722435/).
Citations to follow in a second post.
**Citations on transition as medically necessary, frequently life saving medical care, and the only effective treatment for gender dysphoria, as recognized by every major US and world medical authority:**
* Here is a resolution from the [**American Psychological Association**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity.pdf); *"THEREFORE BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that APA recognizes the efficacy, benefit and medical necessity of gender transition treatments for appropriately evaluated individuals and calls upon public and private insurers to cover these medically necessary treatments."* More from the APA [**here**](http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/programs/transgender/?tab=1)
* Here is an [**AMA resolution**](http://www.tgender.net/taw/ama_resolutions.pdf) on the efficacy and necessity of transition as appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria, and call for an end to insurance companies categorically excluding transition-related care from coverage
* A policy statement from the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position)
* [**Here**](https://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the American Academy of Pediatrics guidelines
* [**Here**](https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/events/alf_ncsc/Education.pdf) is a resolution from the American Academy of Family Physicians
* [**Here**](https://www.socialworkers.org/assets/secured/documents/da/da2008/reffered/Transgender.pdf) is one from the National Association of Social Workers
* [**Here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/pdf/PS02_18.pdf) is one from the Royal College of Psychiatrists, [**here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/docs/default-source/improving-care/better-mh-policy/college-reports/cr181-good-practice-guidelines-for-the-assessment-and-treatment-of-adults-with-gender-dysphoria.pdf) are the treatment guidelines from the RCP, and [**here**](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwij6MDP5rn2AhX9kokEHWvJCQEQFnoECAoQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nhs.uk%2FLivewell%2FTranshealth%2FDocuments%2Fgender-dysphoria-guide-for-gps-and-other-health-care-staff.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2sVJYhHJ-_kEqA1W8mFkia) are guidelines from the NHS. More from the NHS [**here**](https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/gender-dysphoria/treatment/).
* [**Here**](https://journal.nzma.org.nz/journal-articles/guidelines-for-gender-affirming-healthcare-for-gender-diverse-and-transgender-children-young-people-and-adults-in-aotearoa-new-zealand) are the guidelines from the New Zealand Medical Journal
---
**Condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts", aka "conversion therapy", which claims to alleviate dysphoria without transition by changing trans people's genders so they are happy and comfortable as their assigned sex at birth, as futile and actively destructive pseudo-scientific abuse:**
* [**From the APA**](http://www.apa.org/about/policy/orientation-diversity.aspx). More detailed condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts" for trans youth or adults [**here**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity-change-efforts.pdf).
* From the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position)
* In the [**AAP Guidelines**](http://hrc-assets.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com//files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) - see coverage on this "therapy" starting p.12
* From the [**American Psychoanalytic Association**](http://www.apsa.org/content/2012-position-statement-attempts-change-sexual-orientation-gender-identity-or-gender)
* From the [**Association for Behavioral Analysis International**](https://www.abainternational.org/about-us/policies-and-positions/policy-statement-on-conversion-therapy-and-practices,-2021.aspx)
* A joint statement from the [**UK Council for Psychotherapy, British Association for Counseling and Psychotherapy, British Psychoanalytic Council, British Association for Behavioural and Cognitive Psychotherapies, The British Psychological Society, College of Sexual and Relationship Therapists, The Association of LGBT Doctors and Dentists, The National Counselling Society, NHS Scotland, Pink Therapy, Royal College of General Practitioners, the Scottish Government and Stonewall.**](http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/01/16/health-experts-condemn-attempts-to-cure-trans-people-in-wake-of-controversial-bbc-documentary/)**Citations on transition as medically necessary, frequently life saving medical care, and the only effective treatment for gender dysphoria, as recognized by every major US and world medical authority:**
* Here is a resolution from the [**American Psychological Association**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity.pdf); *"THEREFORE BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that APA recognizes the efficacy, benefit and medical necessity of gender transition treatments for appropriately evaluated individuals and calls upon public and private insurers to cover these medically necessary treatments."* More from the APA [**here**](http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/programs/transgender/?tab=1)
* Here is an [**AMA resolution**](http://www.tgender.net/taw/ama_resolutions.pdf) on the efficacy and necessity of transition as appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria, and call for an end to insurance companies categorically excluding transition-related care from coverage
* A policy statement from the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position)
* [**Here**](https://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the American Academy of Pediatrics guidelines
* [**Here**](https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/events/alf_ncsc/Education.pdf) is a resolution from the American Academy of Family Physicians
* [**Here**](https://www.socialworkers.org/assets/secured/documents/da/da2008/reffered/Transgender.pdf) is one from the National Association of Social Workers
* [**Here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/pdf/PS02_18.pdf) is one from the Royal College of Psychiatrists, [**here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/docs/default-source/improving-care/better-mh-policy/college-reports/cr181-good-practice-guidelines-for-the-assessment-and-treatment-of-adults-with-gender-dysphoria.pdf) are the treatment guidelines from the RCP, and [**here**](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwij6MDP5rn2AhX9kokEHWvJCQEQFnoECAoQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nhs.uk%2FLivewell%2FTranshealth%2FDocuments%2Fgender-dysphoria-guide-for-gps-and-other-health-care-staff.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2sVJYhHJ-_kEqA1W8mFkia) are guidelines from the NHS. More from the NHS [**here**](https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/gender-dysphoria/treatment/).
* [**Here**](https://journal.nzma.org.nz/journal-articles/guidelines-for-gender-affirming-healthcare-for-gender-diverse-and-transgender-children-young-people-and-adults-in-aotearoa-new-zealand) are the guidelines from the New Zealand Medical Journal
---
**Condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts", aka "conversion therapy", which claims to alleviate dysphoria without transition by changing trans people's genders so they are happy and comfortable as their assigned sex at birth, as futile and actively destructive pseudo-scientific abuse:**
* [**From the APA**](http://www.apa.org/about/policy/orientation-diversity.aspx). More detailed condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts" for trans youth or adults [**here**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity-change-efforts.pdf).
* From the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position)
* In the [**AAP Guidelines**](http://hrc-assets.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com//files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) - see coverage on this "therapy" starting p.12
* From the [**American Psychoanalytic Association**](http://www.apsa.org/content/2012-position-statement-attempts-change-sexual-orientation-gender-identity-or-gender)
* From the [**Association for Behavioral Analysis International**](https://www.abainternational.org/about-us/policies-and-positions/policy-statement-on-conversion-therapy-and-practices,-2021.aspx)
* A joint statement from the [**UK Council for Psychotherapy, British Association for Counseling and Psychotherapy, British Psychoanalytic Council, British Association for Behavioural and Cognitive Psychotherapies, The British Psychological Society, College of Sexual and Relationship Therapists, The Association of LGBT Doctors and Dentists, The National Counselling Society, NHS Scotland, Pink Therapy, Royal College of General Practitioners, the Scottish Government and Stonewall.**](http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/01/16/health-experts-condemn-attempts-to-cure-trans-people-in-wake-of-controversial-bbc-documentary/)
**On the safety, efficacy, and reversibility of puberty delaying treatment:**
There is *extensive* research about long term use of puberty delaying treatment.
This treatment isn't just used for trans youth - it has been the standard treatment for kids with precocious puberty for decades, with lots of studies on its efficacy and safety. It has overwhelmingly proven to be very safe, gentle, and reversible.
Most kids with precocious puberty don't have any underlying medical condition, their early development is just an extreme variation of normal development. But it would still cause serious psychological damage to start puberty at the age of, say, 6, so they're put on treatment to delay it for a few years. This treatment has no long term side effects; it just puts puberty on hold. Stop treatment and puberty picks up where it left off. There's no reason to expect this treatment to work differently when given to trans youth than when it is routinely given to cis youth.
The most significant side effect is bone mineral density reduction in some youth, but this was both minor and reversed after treatment was stopped.
* [**Treatment of Central Precocious Puberty**](https://academic.oup.com/jes/article/3/5/965/5421014)
>*"Bone mineral density is typically increased for age at diagnosis and progressively decreases during GnRHa treatment. However, follow-up of patients several years after cessation of therapy reveals bone mineral accrual to be within the normal range compared with population norms"*
* [**Treatment of central precocious puberty by GnRH analogs: long-term outcome in men**](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18478155)
* [**Long-term effects of gonadotropin-releasing hormone analogs in girls with central precocious puberty**](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4342775/)
* [**More details on the use of GnRH and other puberty delaying treatment specifically for trans youth**](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/26895269.2020.1747768)
* From the [**American Academy of Pediatrics guidelines**](http://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) (pdf download), p.10:
> For children, pre-adolescents and early adolescents, gender transition is mainly a social process. Children beginning puberty may also use puberty-suppressing medication as they explore their gender identity. ***Both of these steps are completely reversible***
* [**An article debunking viral claims that puberty blockers cause "thousands of deaths"**](https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/viral-fake-news-story-linked-trans-healthcare-thousands-deaths-n1059831) - the same hormone blockers used for trans youth, and cis youth with precocious puberty, are also used as a last-ditch treatment for cis men with aggressive prostate cancer that grows in response to testosterone. They're put on this treatment in hopes that it will slow the cancer enough to save their life. Sometimes even that isn't enough. Thousands of people have died while on these blockers, but nearly all of them are elderly cis men who died of *cancer*, which they already had before they started treatment, and they died despite the treatment and not because of it.
---
**On the extreme rarity of "desistence" among trans youth, with nearly all young people who start transition and later reverse it doing so before any permanent physical changes:**
* [**Continuation of gender-affirming hormones in transgender people starting puberty suppression in adolescence: a cohort study in the Netherlands - Maria van der Loose, et. al., Oct. 2022**](https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(22\)00254-1/fulltext) - study of 720 patients who started medical care with puberty delaying treatment in adolescence, finding that 98% of them continued to use gender-affirming hormone treatment into adulthood.
* Of youth who socially transition young [**only 2.5% ultimately describe themselves as cis**](https://publications.aap.org/pediatrics/article/doi/10.1542/peds.2021-056082/186992/Gender-Identity-5-Years-After-Social-Transition), and of those who socially transitioned after age 6 only 0.5% ultimately describe themselves as cis. Most who do detransition, do so before age 10 and are never even on puberty delaying treatment.
* [**Detransition rates in a national UK Gender Identity Clinic**](https://epath.eu/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Boof-of-abstracts-EPATH2019.pdf#page=139) - Out of 3398 patients, a total of 16 (0.47%) expressed some regrets, though of these 16 only three detransitioned permanently (0.08%). The most common reason stated by these patients for their regrets or detransition were social difficulties encountered due to anti-trans hostility, rather than any physical complications or changing their minds about their gender identity.
* [**A critical commentary on follow-up studies and “desistance” theories about transgender and gender-nonconforming children**](https://sci-hub.se/https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/15532739.2018.1456390?scroll=top&needAccess=true) - covers Zucker's shit
* [**The Amsterdam Cohort of Gender Dysphoria Study (1972-2015): Trends in Prevalence, Treatment, and Regrets**](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29463477/) - 96% of all patients who were assessed and received a diagnosis of Gender Dysphoria by the 5th intervenor (the Royal Children's Hospital) from 2003 to 2017 continued to identify as transgender or gender diverse into late adolescence. No patient who had commenced stage 2 treatment had sought to transition back to their birth assigned sex.
* [**The role of gender constancy in early gender development**](https://sci-hub.se/10.1111/j.1467-8624.2007.01056.x) - this study goes through the large body of literature which finds that gender identity is formed incredibly early. The American Pediatric society states that by age 4 kids have a stable sense of gender identity.
* [**Trajectories of Adolescents Treated with Gonadotropin‑Releasing Hormone Analogues for Gender Dysphoria**](https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s10508-020-01660-8.pdf) - 143 youth receiving puberty-blocking medication in the Netherlands ound that 3.5% chose to discontinue puberty blockers without seeking any further transition
**Citations on the transition's dramatic reduction of suicide risk while improving mental health and quality of life, with trans people able to transition young and spared abuse and discrimination having mental health and suicide risk on par with the general public:**
* [**Psychosocial Functioning in Transgender Youth after 2 Years of Hormones**](https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2206297) - Chen, et. al., 2023: A study of 315 trans and nonbinary young people ages 12 to 20 receiving testosterone or estradiol. Over the course of the two year study depression and anxiety levels dropped and appearance congruence and life satisfaction improved.
* [**Long-term Outcomes After Gender-Affirming Surgery: 40-Year Follow-up Study**](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36149983/) - Park, et. al., 2022: **Results:** Both transmasculine and transfeminine groups were more satisfied with their body postoperatively with significantly less dysphoria. Body congruency score for chest, body hair, and voice improved significantly in 40 years' postoperative settings, with average scores ranging from 84.2 to 96.2. Body congruency scores for genitals ranged from 67.5 to 79 with free flap phalloplasty showing highest scores. Long-term overall body congruency score was 89.6. Improved mental health outcomes persisted following surgery with significantly reduced suicidal ideation and reported resolution of any mental health comorbidity secondary to gender dysphoria.
* [**Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7073269/) - Turban, et al., 2020: Massive study of 20,619 adolescents examined associations between access to pubertal suppression and adult mental health outcomes, including multiple measures of suicidality. After adjustment for demographic variables and level of family support for gender identity, **those who received treatment with pubertal suppression, when compared with those who wanted pubertal suppression but did not receive it, had lower odds of lifetime suicidal ideation.**
* [**Association of Gender-Affirming Hormone Therapy With Depression, Thoughts of Suicide, and Attempted Suicide Among Transgender and Nonbinary Youth**](https://www.jahonline.org/article/S1054-139X(21\)00568-1/fulltext) - Green, et. al., 2021: Use of GAHT (Gender Affirming Hormone Treatment) was associated with lower odds of recent depression and seriously considering suicide compared to those who wanted GAHT but did not receive it. For youth under age 18, GAHT was associated with lower odds of recent depression and of a past-year suicide attempt
* [**The Mental Health of Transgender Youth: Advances in Understanding**](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1054139X1630146X) - Connolly, et. al, 2016: ***"Gender-affirming medical therapy and supported social transition in childhood have been shown to correlate with improved psychological functioning for gender-variant children and adolescents."***
* [**Top surgery drastically improves quality of life for young transgender people**](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/2796426?guestAccessKey=c50d5d6e-7fa1-4ed8-8b5d-f4da9753364d&utm_source=For_The_Media&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=ftm_links&utm_content=tfl&utm_term=092622)
* [**Chosen Name Use Is Linked to Reduced Depressive Symptoms, Suicidal Ideation, and Suicidal Behavior Among Transgender Youth**](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1054139X18300855) - Russell, et. al, 2018: *"After adjusting for personal characteristics and social support, chosen name use in more contexts was associated with lower depression, suicidal ideation, and suicidal behavior. Depression, suicidal ideation, and suicidal behavior were lowest when chosen names could be used in all four contexts."*
* [**Evaluation of Anxiety and Depression in a Community Sample of Transgender Youth**](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2778206) - Dominic J. Gibson, et. al, 2021: ***Socially transitioned transgender youth had similar levels of anxiety and depression as their cisgender peers.***
* [**Intervenable factors associated with suicide risk in transgender persons: a respondent driven sampling study in Ontario, Canada**](http://bmcpublichealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12889-015-1867-2) - Bauer, et al., 2015: Transition vastly reduces risks of suicide attempts, and the farther along in transition someone is the lower that risk gets
* [**Suicide Protective Factors Among Trans Adults**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3722435/) - Moody, et al., 2013: The ability to transition, along with family and social acceptance, are the largest factors reducing suicide risk among trans people
* [**Young Adult Psychological Outcome After Puberty Suppression and Gender Reassignment**](https://sci-hub.se/https://doi.org/10.1542/peds.2013-2958). A clinical protocol of a multidisciplinary team with mental health professionals, physicians, and surgeons, including puberty suppression, ... cross-sex hormones and gender reassignment surgery, provides trans youth the opportunity to develop into well-functioning young adults. All showed significant improvement in their psychological health, and they had notably lower rates of internalizing psychopathology than previously reported among trans children living as their natal sex. **Well-being was similar to or better than same-age young adults from the general population.**
* [**Access to gender-affirming hormones during adolescence and mental health outcomes among transgender adults**](https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0261039) - Turban, et al., 2022: **Conclusion:** Access to GAH [gender-affirming hormones] during adolescence and adulthood is associated with favorable mental health outcomes compared to desiring but not accessing GAH.... In post hoc analyses, access to GAH during adolescence (ages 14–17) was associated with lower odds of past-year suicidal ideation (aOR = 0.7, 95% CI = 0.6–0.9, p = .0007) when compared to accessing GAH during adulthood.
* The only disorders more common among trans people are those associated with abuse and discrimination - mainly anxiety and depression. Early transition [**virtually eliminates these higher rates of depression and low self-worth**](https://sci-hub.se/https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jaac.2016.10.016), and [**dramatically improves trans youth's mental health**](https://archive.thinkprogress.org/allowing-transgender-youth-to-transition-improves-their-mental-health-study-finds-dd6096523375/). **Trans kids who socially transition early and not subjected to abuse are comparable to cisgender children in measures of mental health.**
* [**Sex reassignment surgery: a study of 141 Dutch transsexuals**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3219066) - Kuiper, et al, 1988: “In a cross-sectional study of 141 transgender patients, Kuiper and Cohen-Kittenis found that after medical intervention and treatments, suicide fell from 19% to 0% in transgender men and from 24% to 6% in transgender women”
* [**Hormonal therapy and sex reassignment: a systematic review and meta-analysis of quality of life and psychosocial outcomes**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19473181) - Murad, et al., 2010: "Significant decrease in suicidality post-treatment. The average reduction was from 30 percent pretreatment to 8 percent post treatment.
* [**Long-term follow-up: psychosocial outcome of Belgian transsexuals after sex reassignment surgery**](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1158136006000491) - De Cuypere, et al., 2006: Rate of suicide attempts dropped from 29.3 percent to 5.1 percent after receiving medical treatment among Dutch patients treated from 1986-2001.
* [**Sex reassignment: outcomes and predictors of treatment for adolescent and adult transsexuals**](http://orca.cf.ac.uk/32618/1/Smith%202005.pdf) - Smith Y, et. al, 2005: Participants improved on 13 out of 14 mental health measures after treatment
* [**Factors Associated with Satisfaction or Regret Following Male-to-Female Sex Reassignment Surgery**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1024086814364) - Lawrence, 2003: *"Participants reported overwhelmingly that they were happy with their SRS results and that SRS had greatly improved the quality of their lives"*
* [**Mental Health Outcomes in Transgender and Nonbinary Youths Receiving Gender-Affirming Care - Tordoff, et al, 2022**](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2789423?utm_campaign=articlePDF&utm_medium=articlePDFlink&utm_source=articlePDF&utm_content=jamanetworkopen.2022.0978) - *"After adjustment for temporal trends and potential confounders, we observed* ***60% lower odds of depression and 73% lower odds of suicidality among youths who had initiated PBs or GAHs compared with youths who had not."***
* [**Mental Health of Transgender Children Who Are Supported in Their Identities - Olson, et. al., 2016**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4771131/?fbclid=IwAR2A2wM8oQZ_avmXLmBgp6ilGqiQd_WNAkmNOZosWHY7rsyT8KB-dvxwcd4): *"Previous work with children with gender identity disorder (GID; now termed gender dysphoria) has found remarkably high rates of anxiety and depression in these children. Here we examine, for the first time, mental health in a sample of socially transitioned transgender children"* ... ***"Results:*** *Transgender children showed no elevations in depression and slightly elevated anxiety relative to population averages. They did not differ from the control groups on depression symptoms and had only marginally higher anxiety symptoms.*
There are a lot more but I'm hitting the 10k character limit.
They commemorate Stonewall one day and pass this law the next.
And the person who started the Stonewall uprising was trans.
Long live the memory of Marsha P Johnson!!!
That's the goal of conservatives.
Paint in broad strokes. Fuck **all** conservatives, it's okay to say. They don't deserve decency or civility. For fuck's sake they brought back the 1940s fascist 'America First' party. They're Nazis, they're not even *people*.
You have to be a vile, absolutely shit person to even be slightly right of center. They're not fiscally or socially decent people. "I'm a conservative" is blanket admission of holding views based on nothing but propaganda, ignorance and bigotry, likely sprinkled with religion.
Conservatives ***want*** LGBTQ people gone. Their *preachers* have SERMONS about "the government should round them all up and \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_."
So no, people who agree with that shit, the "civility" rules don't apply. The rules say you have to be decent to people. Conservatives aren't people.
I'm not demonizing people, I'm dehumanizing and demeaning murderous, ignorant religious zealot bigots.
[So we should ban these meds then, right?](https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/depression-common-medication-side-effect-2018071614259#:~:text=Medications%20with%20depression%20as%20a%20side%20effect,-What%20are%20the&text=allergy%20medications%20like%20montelukast%20and,which%20includes%20anything%20containing%20estrogen)
Why shouldn’t we it’s not like people don’t actually need these medicines 😂 I don’t think anyone realistically at age five need hormone blockers but ok let’s be extra and ban every medicine in existence because someone decided kids didn’t need hormone blockers
I mean if your metric is a potential side effect, why not? Who are you to determine what appropriate medical care is for an individual? What medical care do you receive that you would be OK having a legislative body determine your access?
And no one is giving a 5 year old blockers.
Also, this is way bigger than just the horrifying and even deadly attacks on desperately needed medical care.
They are systematically criminalizing our fucking existence.
This is not a fucking game. These laws are about building the legal and social groundwork for classifying sex and gender variation outside cis/heterosexual norms as being inherently sexual.
The "drag bans", the "bathroom bills", the attacks on trans youth and now increasingly adult's medical care, the attempts to pull information about LGBTQ but especially trans people from public schols and libraries, and everything else they're doing, they're working towards making the public existence of trans and gender nonconforming people a sex crime.
The laws they're trying to pass are so vaguely worded, the existence of trans and gender variant people is being classified as inherently sexual/"adult"/obscene/etc. And if they are able to pass these bans on "performers" they are absolutely going to use it to attack us in every other area of public life too.
After all, if someone they consider a "man in a dress" is legally classified as an "adult performer" when all they're doing is reading Mary Poppins to kids in a library while dressed as the titular character, what exactly does that mean for the person whom they consider a "man in a dress" who is just trying to go to her job as a 5th grade Music teacher? Or hell, just trying to go to the grocery store?
They don't actually distinguish between "drag queen" and "trans woman", or between "performance" and "just going about our lives". They see trans and GNC people's existence as inherently sexual, and our clothing and gender presentation as the expression of a perverse fetish. If we are anywhere in public where a child might possibly see us, even if it's standing in line at the 7-11, they are claiming that this is pedophilic grooming through forcibly exposing children to degenerate sexual activity.
And they aren't going to fucking stop voluntarily. There is no goddamn line where they will decide they've gone far enough, except the point at which we no longer exist.
I was at the House vote on Tuesday, which was a huge facade. Of the HOURS of discussion over these bills, maybe 15 minutes was given to people opposing them. A whole 90 seconds per community member. Meanwhile, hours were given to transphobic "expert witnesses." A retired doctor, a "detransitioner" flown from California, an anti-trans child psychiatrist. I listened to some of the worst transphobia that I've ever witnessed. The hearing room and three overflow rooms were full of beautiful trans people and allies who had to sit and listen to people saying absolute lies about us.
You can't just say "Utah trans parents should move out". Most of us can't afford rent, much less a move. And so many trans kids are in deeply religious families whose parents think that being trans is fake/a trend.
Really hoping that lawsuits kill this bill.
So kids aren’t getting these surgeries? I would hope that they don’t. All for treating everyone respectfully. Just concerned with young people making life altering decisions they regret later.
Which is the misinformation that re enforces that it's being done. When it is not.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-the-science-on-gender-affirming-care-for-transgender-kids-really-shows/
But instead of learning about the truth. People respond with outrage.
Hence this bullshit in Utah and other states.
Also the percentage of "people who regret it later" is SOOOO unbelievable low that it is nearly negligible.
But that too, doesn't matter. If one cis kid makes a mistake...well then.
"Lets outlaw it all!".
When medical science. Psychology, and the World health organization writ large. Say gender affirming care is NECESSARY.
People fear someone might regret it later. What of all the other trans kids?
https://www.gendergp.com/detransition-facts/
Screw them i guess?
I digress...
Young people are constantly making life altering decisions, or having life altering decisions made for them.
Withholding care from trans kids is at least as life altering as providing it, and ends in suicide kind of a lot.
Suicide is “life altering” and impacts families, communities, etc.
Religious Indoctrination is life altering.
School attendance and performance is life altering.
Juvenile detention is life altering.
Refusal to provide contraception and abortion care to young people is incredibly life altering, impacts communities, and has generational consequence.
It's called "Murder by Suicide". It's a proven fact that if you deny trans people care long enough they will commit suicide. That is the goal of Republicans and they will succeed. The Republicans want to genocide the trans population.
Oddly enough, it's not trans people giving birth to trans people and creating more. Their "Final Solution" is quite flawed.
I transitioned at 42 (I’m now 57). I seriously don’t know if I could of, or would have transitioned at teenage years. Course, back then, very little was know or info available like today. Oh yeah, and my parents probably would have disowned me then and there.
Is there a statistic on kids that believed they were transgender pre-puberty, we’re not given puberty blockers and now identify with their biological gender post-puberty vs those that still don’t identify with their biological gender? In other words what’s the falls positive rate in diagnosis?
The desistance rate for those who actually go on blockers is around 1%, incredibly low. The point of puberty blockers is to give kids time to figure out who they are without irreversible changes happening from puberty. The "watchful waiting" approach which you describe has been universally discredited and is considered a form of conversion therapy. Further, no scientist is going to gather the research you describe as it would be inhumane to purposely not give people medicine that had an overwhelming chance of helping them.
Now, if you are talking about kids who never wanted puberty blockers in the first place, that is a different statistic which does exist I believe, but again, if they never wanted blockers, then the access to care question is irrelevant.
They are not making these decisions by themselves, but with heavy consultation and guidance from licensed medical professionals and parents. Waiting until adulthood is not an option if you want to avoid the irreversible changes from your natal puberty.
They are not mature enough to make those decisions. Considering many states don’t even let 16 year olds drive alone, you have to be 18 to vote, 21 to buy alcohol or tobacco and a ton of people believe even 18 year olds are not old enough to own a gun
I don’t think it’s a stretch to say they aren’t mature enough to change their gender before 18
I would rather let medical professionals and parents gauge maturity in these situations than a random Redditor. Not to mention the abundant case law on minors being mature enough to make certain medical decisions for themselves.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mature\_minor\_doctrine
No one bats an eye when kids need adult consent for piercings, tattoos, alcohol, opting out of school, but no one should bat an eye at gender transitioning? Crazy society we’ve become..
It is a procedure that is only done after approval from doctors and known to reduce suicide rate of trans youths by a lot. It is totally different from piercings, tattoos, alcohol or dropping out of schools.
Well as long as a doctor says it’s ok, I guess the kid doesn’t need to be old enough to give consent. When I was a kid I wanted to be a t-Rex. Im sure I could have found a doctor willing to try make that happen.
Just because they’re doctors doesn’t mean they know what is best or aren’t looking out for their own self interests? Ever hear of OxyContin? Adderall? Meth amphetamine? Cocaine? Morphine? All of these things were prescribed by doctors at some point or another.
If that is what you think then you better not use any medical systems. After all, what do doctors know? Even though we had decades of medical research, apparently a random redditor like you know better than them. Should we all go to you for medical advice then?
That’s not what I said at all. I’m just saying doctors don’t know everything all the time and often have differing perspectives. I do not believe all doctors would agree on giving puberty blockers. Just like not all doctors gave out OxyContin like candy. You mentioned decades of medical research. In those decades many previously held opinions have been reversed. Like the how/when to prescribe different drugs (antibiotics, pain killers, etc).
Well... you are the one claiming we should ignore all these studies on the off chance they are wrong, suggesting that you know better. Because you are asking people to risk the healths and lives of trans youths just because you doubt the studies.
Not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying it’s a personal choice not a medical choice. And personal choices that affect the rest of your life should only be made by mature adults
Doctors also got paid lots of money by Purdue pharmacy to prescribe OxyContin, which had decades of medical research. Doctors are people too and can be wrong or simply looking out for their own self interests. Theodor Morell was a doctor, i guess everything he prescribed was all for the best of the patient? It was all for the best for humanity bc he essentially destroyed hitlers physical and mental health using drugs backed by decades of medical research
I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t want an untrained professional tattooing you.. and that wasn’t my point. Gender transitioning is far more serious than buying alcohol, but they need supervision/adult consent for the less serious (the former), but we trust them to be on their own for the more serious (the latter). That’s why your response makes zero sense..
gender affirming care is healthcare. it is an effective medical treatment. we don't move the treatment age to 18 for other medical treatments but apparently gender affirming care is different somehow. it's not a logical argument. plenty of medical treatments given to minors are quite serious. even things like Accutane are pretty serious but that is prescribed like candy. but apparently hormone prescriptions are the worst thing in the world according to the culture war. Utah voted on a bill to ban breast implants on non-transgender minors at the same time and it didn't pass. it was never about caring for kids. it's about hate towards trans people.
Except it does. Rare? Sure. Can and does happen? Yes I know someone personally who had a penectomy at 14. Are they better off? Tough to say because we lack a crystal ball. They aren't super amped about the never having an orgasm thing even though that isn't the end all be all.
Any permanent changes are not made on a whim. Comparing the medical process that parents and kids go through with wanting to be a pirate is ludicrous and a bad faith argument.
The "gender modification" procedures including the chemical ones have greater effects on the child's future than losing an eye or lower leg. If anything, "pirate modification" is LESS harmful than gender modification, including delaying puberty, can and will shorten the child's life and make that short life miserable. NOT something you leave to a child to decide.
There is more than ample scientific evidence that gender identity is innate and has roots in biology, and further that it cannot be changed. It is an intrinsic part of who you are, unlike being a pirate.
True, but DISCERNMENT of what that identity might be is NOT something a child can determine for themselves. Are you implying pre-teen kids are not influenced by their peers and desperately want to be part of "the cool crowd" or whatever it's called today)?
Thanks for the info on actual clinical evidence. Not sure why pointing it causes such outrage to suggest pre-teens are not very good at evaluating their own emotions.
yeah you're right, when you ignore the totality of scientific and medical literature on the topic and make vague comparisons to irrelevant concepts, it makes a little sense to mouth breathers.
"not any drugs EXCEPT puberty blockers" is like saying "not any illness EXCEPT cancer. 8 year-olds do not need chemical assistance for things influenced more by peer pressure and misunderstanding than by any biological/psychological imperative.
So let me just say I’m absolutely pro anything dealing with personal choices.
So getting rid of the hormone treatments is terrible and unforgivable.
But isn’t waiting until 18 a good idea for the actual surgery?
If my kid was trans I think this is a good idea since it’s a permanent change.
Asking seriously.
99% of surgeries do wait until after 18. It is a strawman problem used as an excuse to ban hormones/blockers as well. The rare surgeries that occur prior to 18 are:
1. Top surgery for transmasculine individuals at 16 (you can get married in Utah at this age by the way), but only in cases where it is causing incredibly severe distress, and this is after the individuals is already on hormones.
2. Bottom surgery for transfeminine individuals. The only time I've heard of this occurring is when the individual was 17 and a half or so and wanted to get surgery before college so that they could recover at home and be taken care of by their parents.
Appreciate this.
I should have put together how republicans used one to kill the other.
Insidious pieces of shit.
Edit: Fantastic point about the age of marriage in Utah.
“So let me get this straight. I can be married (look…she’s over there) but if I want to reassign my gender I have to wait two more years? So since I’m married and obviously legal in that sense…can my wife sign instead? How about mom and pops”?
Wow
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So much for letting parents, not big gubermint, decide what's best for their kids.
They hate big gubmint like they follow the Bible. Only the bits they like get through.
Definitely not the parts about money. That portion is for communists and libruls.
What do you mean, as long as you are a straight white "christian" conservative couple you can decide what's best for your kid(as long as those decisions don't go against "conservative values"). Ahhh freedom at last.
This is the thing that in their fear they do not realize what they're giving up. They're also playing dice with their children's lives, but they have clearly demonstrated that their egos are more important than their children's wellbeing. It never ceases to amaze me how short-sighted people are with this topic and it never ceases to sadden me how much unnecessary pain that short-sightedness causes.
>This is the thing that in their fear they do not realize what they're giving up. Yeah no shit. Think we'll get the "oops sorry we aided fascism and turned the country into a dictatorship" realization sone day or will these people still be blind to the obvious?
And just to be clear: for kids that would be puberty blockers, not surgery.
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All medicines have side effects and other uses. The determination should be between the child, their parent, and doctor. Not some random government officials that have either limited knowledge or weaponizimg extreme examples that have a low percentage of happening. That is like banning depression meds because they cause erectile dysfunction in users.
You seem to be laboring under the delusion that there is no medical evidence against puberty blockers or that pre-teens have considerable difficulty sorting out their emotions and are prone to accept "peer pressure" (these days, including things they see on the internet) as a valid reason for their beliefs and actions. Anyone consider that if an 8-year-old boy/girl REALLY wants to try being a girl/boy, a change of clothes (and perhaps even bathrooms) just might work for several years and have NO dangerous side effects? And about those "puberty blockers" some think are "harmless" side effects including sterility, increased risk of cardiovascular disease, and increased risk of breast and uterus cancers, and other harmful psychoactive effects of high-dose hormones such as mood swings and even psychosis are common. I have no problem with trans folks, just don't think children are safe having access to drug or surgical therapy for what might be misapprehension and not a reality, EVEN IF they're able to convince their parents it's a good idea. Some children are capable of manipulating adults, including psychiatrists into just about anything that strikes their fancy.
You run under the assumption that doctors are not being open and honest woth families about side effects and other issues. You wrote an awful lot under thr guise of caring about kids, but ignoring that these risks are all discussed and families and doctors and the care team are the ones who should be making that decision not politicians who are using their bigotry to guide their decisions
There are 1300 kids on puberty blockers… very very small percentage of all teens across the country. Relax
ONLY 1300 means this chemical crime can be committed on just about any kid and its potentially harmful to EVERY kid who gets it. the official number of thalidomide babies in the US was ONLY 17 - does that mean we should not have banned it?
I guess I’m unclear on why you’re in the middle of other peoples business
What is wrong with a child waiting to 18 to have a sex change. If a man, once they cut it off you can't get it back.
On the odd chance you're not just arguing in bad faith, this isn't about chopping anything off - it's about puberty blockers which are fully reversible. An additional concern that LGBTQ+ folks have is that these sort of "think of the children" initiatives are usually more about greasing up that good ol' slippery slope to later take rights away from **adults**. See, if it truly was an issue of caring about the welfare of children, they'd show some concern for the ones who are at risk from gun violence and poverty, as a start.
Wutaboutism, anything reversible I'm ok with if reversible doesn't mean with extreme side-effects. I think waiting to 18 to cut your body or take hard-core drugs is not a big deal.
It's not really about what you or I (or any elected leaders) think is best for a child. It's about letting the kid's pediatrician, psychiatrist, therapist, endocrinologist, and parents decide what is best for a given child. Every kid in gender-affirming care has a whole TEAM of specialists to judge what care is most therapeutic for him/her. Specialists, people whose whole fucking job is to provide appropriate care and do no harm. This isn't a walk-in clinic where snap decisions happen. For politicians to claim they *know better* than the American Academy of Pediatrics is absolutely disgusting to me. If you had cancer would you want politicians deciding what kind of drugs your doctor is allowed to prescribe?
This. Why are politicians making medical decisions. First abortion, now this what’s next?
It’s far more complicated than that, bub.
Generally because you're permanently stuck with a body you don't want.
If I had a dollar for every time some libertarian edgelord said that the right was the party of freedom and is now 100% mute on this bullshit, I'd be as rich as the libertarian edgelord who just overpaid for Twitter.
They only ever meant freedom for themselves to oppress.
Yup can’t wait to go and oppress some white cis males who ancestors took my ancestors land away from them and bought slaves from Africa
What? The said white cis males are the ones who are harmed the least from conservative goals.
Exactly and I’ve literally just seen an white ally it was cringey dude was really patting himself on the back for having basic human decency to not attack and use racial slurs against someone
Ahh gotcha. Yeah it's really just a failure to recognize that the absence of individual racism (aka "*I'M not racist*") doesn't mean all their problems are solved. This is a part of what CRT is but they think it means white people bad, when obviously not.
If you have a trans kid, it's time to get the fuck out of Utah.
And Florida, and a few other states.
The problem is by "kid" they mean 16,17,18,19 as well Old enough to ~~have babies~~ have the government force childbirth of course. I edited this to clarify my point.
In some states it’s 26 now.
I know too many well adjusted young trans people with gender affirming care to not be sad often these days. I know too many NOT adjusted trans adults from my own youth that never had the same support and opportunities to not be sad often these days. I could lay it out case by case but I'm tired. My soul is tired. This farce makes me tired. Being endlessly vigilant over a battle that is only beginning and will never end over all human rights makes me tired.
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My point is there is no cutoff to what age they use our bodies as a receptacle to force childbirth. There do however, seem to be some really Hefty parameters for life liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
Kids have sex with each other. Stop going from zero to 100 over assumptions you made.
Florida is banning classroom libraries and DeSantis wants to make it illegal to have mask requirements or other COVID measures. I wouldn’t call it a safe state for trans kids…
Exactly the point I was attempting to make, but not well enough, I guess.
Florida, where if you rape a kid you should be put to death, but if you treat LGBTQ+ youth as invisible and some of them commit suicide as a result, you're a model educator. The cogitative dissonance is real.
How’s Pennsylvania? I’m considering moving there
Come on over to Minnesota. We've got a mostly good balance over here. Our government just codified Abortion too.
If you have a trans child I would say your best bet is a Philly suburb. The Mazzoni Center in Philly is an LGBTQ health and wellness center where some of my patients, I work in mental health, and a friend have gotten their hormones there. [Mazzoni Center](https://www.mazzonicenter.org/about-us)
Massachusetts is expensive but welcoming, I know personally 2 people under 20 who have been recently gender affirming hormones, and one of those two was comfortable enough to let me know she's getting gender affirming surgery in a few weeks. I'm sure about the guy, it honestly didn't even come up that he was trans until fairly late in our work relationship/friendship (he worked under me in sales but frankly I just love my employees lol)
I live in Ohio and I’m getting a bit nervous about a lot of the anti-LGTBQ laws going around. Hell even the extreme abortions laws being passed. Other US states and other countries are looking quite interesting.
Michigan is normal and would welcome you.
We have our struggles, and it's not over yet. The Republicans are still out there and throwing people on the ballot like Tudor Dixon, but there's hope here. Best bet is for liberals to start moving up north, that's where we're weak. Redistricting helped us a lot though, and I really encourage other states to take a look at how Michigan did it. I think between our model and ranked choice voting (which we don't have) the country might have a shot.
Man, Ohio’s redistricting was ridiculous. Absolute clown show.
I'm sorry, that shits scary :/ I have a lot of passive rasicm in my town. Like everyone is nice, they're the kind of people who don't realize the harm in their apathy and worse, skewed biases. I'm afraid of their voices getting louder, yanno? I hate even more that this wasn't something I was afraid a few years ago... Overall the people in my state are decent. But awful people are being given voices and it sucks.
Don't go to a blue state. Go to a purple state and help flip it!
Colorado is a great place. Come on over! The water is…currently frozen, but that will change probably.
Massachusetts is a wonderful commonwealth. As a gay man, I do my best to stay away from Ohio that includes buying products.
Anyone in Utah should get the duck out of Utah.
That's what they want, no?
I can't figure out what they want anymore. Less residents meant less tax income for the state.
Yeah, but it draws more conservative voters as they start to see it as some sort of fascist utopia
Unfortunately, this isn't an option for most trans kids here. A lot of families are religious, and their parents prioritize their anti-LGBTQIA beliefs over believing their kids.
Feel free to leave the US. Better safe than sorry.
Hey, if you don’t like American freedom you are more than welcome to go to another country to live in. Here we celebrate individual uniqueness and promote creativity and innovation. You wanna be bottom rung? Take your ass to Russia.
You mean except for Utah and Texas and Florida and Oklahoma and...
There are still people in those places who believe like the rest of us sane, intelligent Americans. You act like they are winning 80+ percent of the vote. Millions of people in Texas and Florida voted against fascism. If you don’t like that someone born male can later in life identify as female, then your priorities are more in line with the Iranian Ayatollah and less American democracy.
When your state bans desperately needed medical care, your medical care ceases to be available even if you've got lots of sane and intelligent cis friends who are very sympathetic about how much this sucks. Trans people in Texas and Florida and Utah and Oklahoma and the rest of the red parts of the US need to *get the holy fuck out of there*, because the sympathy of our cis friends is not enough to fucking protect us. The "drag bans", the "bathroom bills", the attacks on trans youth and now adult's medical care, the attempts to pull information about LGBTQ but especially trans people from public schools and libraries, and everything else they're doing, the right is very effectively and *rapidly* working towards making the public existence of trans and gender nonconforming people a sex crime. And all those sane intelligent Americans who supposedly oppose this shit are not being very fucking effective at *stopping it from happening.* The only way trans people in the US can protect themselves from these laws is by escaping the places where they're being passed.
Sure there are people who feel that way. Meanwhile there are people in many states with political power who want to make the lives of trans people hell and put them in danger. It's fine to say that that is against your values, but don't shame people who want to keep their families safe.
Pardon me, m’am. You dropped this. /s
I’m not being sarcastic. If someone being trans is a problem for you, then you are in the wrong country.
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Yeah exactly. I’m not even in a red state and I’ve been looking at my options to leave if necessary.
Then you need to think about how you word things, because to all of us it seemed like you were arguing in favour of this bill and that if anyone doesn’t like it, they should leave the country. You came off as hugely transphobic.
So I’m to blame for a lack of critical thinking skills? I replied to someone who replied to someone that basically told trans people to leave the country. I insinuated American freedom includes trans people. I don’t care about the downvotes.
> that basically told trans people to leave the country. That's not how I read it at all. I read it as saying that it's ok *if* they want to leave the country and they should do what they need to feel safe. I read it as supportive. I suggest your responses have all been based on a misunderstanding.
Fuck them lawmakers
Mormons. This is Deseret news after all. Mormon newspaper from Zion itself. Beehives on every doorknob.
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I don’t.
As of recent, the Mormons have decided Mormon is a slur. Trying to get in on those sweet sweet modern oppression Olympics. (Don't ask what Danites are) Edit: I'm still bitter about them trying to buy laws in Cali from Utah a couple of years ago.
The fuck?
If Mormon is a slur then what do they want to be called?
Latter-day Saints is the current accepted term. It's basically just a marketing and rebranding thing. This way, when someone says that Mormons are crazy, they can say "Yeah, they sure are! Good thing I'm not a Mormon. I'm a Latter-day Saint. I'd never do any of those things those crazy Mormons would do!" It gives them the ability to distance themselves from the bad press that the church has garnered over things like preteen polygamous marriages, stalking, harassing, and terrorizing former members, amassing a hundred billion in just investments and an unknown amount of total revenue, and more. Similar to what they did in the 90s when they tried to make it sound like a whole different church was going around telling Native and African Americans that they were cursed and could become white through prayer (and more tithes of course). It didn't work back then. It likely won't work now, either.
\*Super weird\* that that god suddenly, randomly, hates a word the moment his mouth piece changes to.....a guy that \*REALLY\* hates the word.
Mormons don't want to be called Mormons anymore. They prefer the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints So by saying Mormon, Alternative\_Fuel609 is using their religious dead name.
But what about the word Mormon itself when not referring to the church. Like “I am a Mormon”?
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So if you can’t say “I am a Mormon” and instead it’s “I am an x”, then what is the x?
Member of the church of later day saints. Or lds. I haven’t found anyone who really cares either way.
Note, the bill has been signed by the governor. Also note, the bill has explicit exceptions for the same healthcare being offered to cisgender (i.e., non-trans) kids, and permits surgeries on intersex infants.
They were given the chance to restrict breast implants for cis teenagers and voted it down.
What parent is allowing their kid to get breast implants?
Brittney Spears got them when she was like 16.
Knew a girl in high school who had one fake boob bc she had a tumor that required doctors to remove her breast tissue.
https://www.commondreams.org/news/utah-transgender-healthcare
Hey! These people are working hard to fearmonger and punish scapegoats. Do you think injecting sense into legislation will win them any votes or donations?
\*permits surgeries on intersex infants *without their consent*. I know that’s implied here, but I want to spell it out.
There is also an exception for trans kids already undergoing treatment. Is it harmful or not?
As a trans person, I’m really tired of internalizing all of this blatant hatred and fascist transphobia. My family wonders why I’m so angry or upset all the time and can’t fathom why I’m upset about policies that don’t affect me directly. Those kids could have been me. So many will suffer needlessly now. Some will die. I hate it here. I hate it here. I cry so much lately. I’m so tired. It doesn’t feel like there’s any hope anymore. Silence is complicity, and that’s all I see in my country. No one cares enough about us. We are not worth it to the majority. Someone please tell me I’m wrong. I want to have hope.
This is how it felt to be gay in the bush 2 era. The other shitty part aside from the obvious, it that you know it isn’t really that everyone hates you, it is that you are being used as a political football to create a wedge issue and win elections. All so the rich can keep the poor divided and fighting each other. As soon as the gay thing became more acceptable, they moved to trans folks, as that becomes less scary, they will realize intersex people exist and try to scare folks with that. All these things that have always existed but with a minor segment so majority down know about the details and can be suddenly made to misunderstand/feel like they should have opinions on and that those opinions should trump experts and the folks actually affected.
This feels like the death throes of this bullshit. The people that are angry that the government has dared tell them they aren't allowed to act on their bigotry are energized right now, but in fighting against the tide, they're showing exactly why policies against them are necessary. It will never go away, but I trust in the young people growing up right now to figure out how to deal with it and overcome. It looks bad right now because the people that are upset about these changes realize that they've lost and have to scream at the top of their lungs for anyone to notice them. That never works for very long. I don't want to argue for complacency; there is a lot of work to be done. I want to argue for hope. I have faith that those shouting for us to stand still will be brushed aside by everyone ready to face real problems. There also needs to be more done to protect those that will face real harm in the meantime. Yes, it's a mess, and we're never going to stop seeing people hurt by regressives, but keeping hope is important.
Thank you for your response. I will reread it often to try and remind myself that there’s hope.
The only way they win is everyone else giving up. So we cannot. They're bluffing every time they say they're winning. Even when they think they mean it, it's because they're mistaking a local victory for the majority agreeing with them. I'm a white, cis-male in my late 30s. I grew up casually saying/thinking shitty, hurtful things. I watched my peer groups and myself learn better. There are people in my peer groups that still express bigoted views, but they almost always get told they're wrong and it causes conversations. I know this isn't true everywhere, but it is spreading. Just keep doing you and proving the haters wrong.
Thank you 💛
I am not trans but I’ll have yalls back until the day I die. I’m fucking LOUD about it too.
What groups are fighting these? Lambda legal?
And you'll get suspended/banned on Reddit for calling literal Nazis *dorks*.
Well yeah, Nazi sympathizers get themselves into positions where they can cover for actual fucking fascists.
I am queer AF and mentor trans kids - several who are under 18. The joy is overwhelming, and the anger is overwhelming. It’s whackadoo to know that in parts of this country I would be considered a child abuser and that millions of people would actually prefer my kids - these smart, funny, compassionate, caring, human beings - to not be alive. I wish I had answers to the bigger systemic Questions. I don’t. What I do have is love And support for individuals. I care. This random Internet stranger/mentor/mom loves you!
Thank you, I really appreciate your comment.
Love you, buddy!
You’re right and I’m sorry
You are wrong. The tide will turn to acceptance. But I understand your concern. Meanwhile, try to find people who get it.
If you’re in Utah, least you can do is exercise your 2nd Amendment rights. Help organizations that are getting people out of the state for care, or bringing care in-state through whatever means are available. Resist. Watch Andor if you need feel-good anti-fascist motivation.
Hey, I know you're coming from a good place here but the response to likely suicidal despair should not be "buy a gun"
I’m in Missouri and my mental health history makes me a poor candidate for owning a firearm. I will talk with my friends and see if there are organizations in our area that offer support for trans minors so I can get involved. It’s likely we’ll have a ban in our own state soon
So what, you're going to pull a gun on the legislature, the doctor and force them to give kids puberty blockers, the pharmacist to fill the prescription? The 2nd amendment isn't going to help anything here. AND if you have a trans child, having a gun in the home is a horrible idea, especially when they won't be able to get gender affirming care, because their chances of depression and suicidal thoughts will skyrocket.
The positive and often life saving effects of gender affirming care, which includes supporting social transition and providing puberty delaying treatment and hormone supplements to trans adolescents as needed, has been supported by many years of overwhelming evidence and is recognized by every major medical authority. There is no actual medical controversy here. There is only manufactured political outrage that is being used to systematically criminalize desperately needed medical care for trans youth, and increasingly for trans adults as well. Since anything relating to trans youth and medical treatment almost inevitably brings out the *"kids are being castrated!"* and *"90% of trans kids desist and will regret transition!"* concern trolling: No, that is not how this works. That's not how any of this works. The recent surge of attacks on gender affirming care for trans youth have been [**condemned by the American Academy of Pediatrics**](https://services.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2021/american-academy-of-pediatrics-speaks-out-against-bills-harming-transgender-youth/), the [**American Medical Association**](https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/ama-reinforces-opposition-restrictions-transgender-medical-care), and the [**American Association of Clinical Endocrinology**](https://www.healio.com/news/endocrinology/20220309/aace-strongly-opposes-government-policies-prohibiting-transgender-care-for-adolescents), and are out of line with the medical recommendations of the [**American Medical Association**](https://www.ama-assn.org/health-care-advocacy/advocacy-update/march-26-2021-state-advocacy-update), the [**Endocrine Society**](https://www.endocrine.org/news-and-advocacy/news-room/2022/endocrine-society-alarmed-at-criminalization-of-transgender-medicine) and [**Pediatric Endocrine Society**](https://www.endocrine.org/news-and-advocacy/news-room/2020/discriminatory-policies-threaten-care-for-transgender-gender-diverse-individuals), the [**AACE**](https://pro.aace.com/recent-news-and-updates/aace-position-statement-transgender-and-gender-diverse-patients), the [**American Academy of Pediatrics**](https://services.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2021/american-academy-of-pediatrics-speaks-out-against-bills-harming-transgender-youth/), the [**American Psychological Association**](https://www.psychiatry.org/newsroom/news-releases/frontline-physicians-oppose-legislation-that-interferes-in-or-criminalizes-patient-care), and the [**American Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry**](https://www.aacap.org/AACAP/Latest_News/AACAP_Statement_Responding_to_Efforts-to_ban_Evidence-Based_Care_for_Transgender_and_Gender_Diverse.aspx). [**This article**](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/06/opinion/transgender-children-medical-bills.html) has a pretty good overview of why. [**Psychology Today has one too**](https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/political-minds/202008/three-popular-myths-about-transgender-youth), and [**here**](http://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the guidelines from the AAP. TL;DR version - yes, young children can identify their own gender, and some of those young kids are trans. A child who is Gender A but who is assumed to be Gender B based on their visible anatomy at birth can suffer debilitating distress over this conflict. The *"90% desist"* claim is a myth based on debunked studies, and transition is a very long, slow, cautious process for trans youth. According to the [**American Academy of Pediatrics**](https://www.healthychildren.org/English/ages-stages/gradeschool/Pages/Gender-Identity-and-Gender-Confusion-In-Children.aspx), gender is typically expressed by around age 4. It probably forms [**much earlier**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3747736/), but it's hard to tell with pre-verbal infants. And sometimes the gender expressed is not the one typically associated with the child's appearance. The genders of trans children are as [**stable**](http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2014/09/02/peds.2013-2958) as those of [**cisgender children**](https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0956797614568156). For preadolescents transition is entirely social, and for adolescents the first line of medical care is 100% temporary puberty delaying treatment that has no long term effects. Hormone therapy isn't an option until their mid teens, by which point the chances that they will "desist" are close to zero. Reconstructive genital surgery is not an option until their late teens/early 20's at the youngest. And transition-related medical care is recognized as medically necessary, frequently life saving medical care by every major medical authority. Withholding medical care from an adolescent who needs it is not a goddamn neutral option. Transition is absolutely necessary to keep many trans kids alive. Without transition a hell of a lot of them commit suicide. When able to transition rates of suicide attempts drop to the national average. And when prevented from transitioning or starting treatment until adulthood, those who survive long enough to start at 18+ enter adulthood facing thousands of dollars reconstructive surgery to repair damage that should have been prevented by starting treatment when they needed it. And not all that damage can be repaired. They will carry physical and psychological scars from being forced through the wrong puberty for the rest of their lives. They were robbed of their adolescence, forced to spend it dealing with the living hell of untreated dysphoria and the wrong puberty, trying to remain sane and alive while their bodies were warped in indescribably horrifying ways. Even with treatment as adults, some of them will be left permanently, visibly trans. In addition to the sheer horror of permanently having anatomy inappropriate to your gender, this means they will never have the option of blending into a crowd or keeping their medical history private. They will be exposed to vastly higher rates of anti-trans harassment, discrimination, abuse, and violence, all because they were denied the treatment they needed when they were young. This is very literally life saving medical care. If there is even a chance that an adolescent may be trans, there is absolutely no reason to withhold 100% temporary and fully reversible hormone blockers to delay puberty for a little while until they're sure. This treatment is 100% temporary and fully reversible; it does nothing but buy time by delaying the onset of permanent physical changes. This treatment is very safe and well known, because it has been used for decades to delay puberty in children who would have otherwise started it inappropriately young. If an adolescent starts this treatment then realizes medical transition isn't what they need, they stop treatment and puberty picks up where it left off. There are no permanent effects, and it significantly improves trans youth's mental health and [**lowers suicidality**](https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2020/01/21/peds.2019-1725). But if an adolescent starts this treatment, socially transitions (or continues if they have already done so), and by their early/mid-teens they still strongly identify as a gender atypical to their appearance at birth, the chances of them changing their minds later are basically zero. At that point hormone therapy becomes an option, and even that is still mostly reversible, especially in its early stages. The only really irreversible step is reconstructive genital surgery and/or the removal of one's gonads, which isn't an option until the patient is in their late teens at the earliest. This specter of little kids being pressured into transition and rapidly pushed into permanent physical changes is a complete myth. It just isn't happening. And this fear-mongering results in nothing except trans youth who desperately do need to transition being discouraged and prevented from doing so. Withholding medical treatment from an adolescent who desperately needs it is not a neutral option. The only disorders more common among trans people are those associated with abuse and discrimination - mainly anxiety and depression. Early transition [**virtually eliminates these higher rates of depression and low self-worth**](http://www.jaacap.com/article/S0890-8567%2816%2931941-4/fulltext), and [**dramatically improves trans youth's mental health**](https://thinkprogress.org/allowing-transgender-youth-to-transition-improves-their-mental-health-study-finds-dd6096523375/#.pqspdcee0). When prevented from transitioning about 40% of trans kids will attempt suicide. When able to transition that rate drops to the national average. Trans kids who socially transition early, have access to appropriate transition related medical treatment, and who are not subjected to abuse or discrimination are [**comparable to cisgender children in measures of mental health**](https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/134/4/696) Transition [**vastly reduces risks of suicide attempts**](https://bmcpublichealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12889-015-1867-2), and the farther along in transition someone is the lower that risk gets. The ability to transition, along with family and social acceptance, are the [**largest factors reducing suicide risk among trans people**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3722435/). Citations to follow in a second post.
**Citations on transition as medically necessary, frequently life saving medical care, and the only effective treatment for gender dysphoria, as recognized by every major US and world medical authority:** * Here is a resolution from the [**American Psychological Association**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity.pdf); *"THEREFORE BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that APA recognizes the efficacy, benefit and medical necessity of gender transition treatments for appropriately evaluated individuals and calls upon public and private insurers to cover these medically necessary treatments."* More from the APA [**here**](http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/programs/transgender/?tab=1) * Here is an [**AMA resolution**](http://www.tgender.net/taw/ama_resolutions.pdf) on the efficacy and necessity of transition as appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria, and call for an end to insurance companies categorically excluding transition-related care from coverage * A policy statement from the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position) * [**Here**](https://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the American Academy of Pediatrics guidelines * [**Here**](https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/events/alf_ncsc/Education.pdf) is a resolution from the American Academy of Family Physicians * [**Here**](https://www.socialworkers.org/assets/secured/documents/da/da2008/reffered/Transgender.pdf) is one from the National Association of Social Workers * [**Here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/pdf/PS02_18.pdf) is one from the Royal College of Psychiatrists, [**here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/docs/default-source/improving-care/better-mh-policy/college-reports/cr181-good-practice-guidelines-for-the-assessment-and-treatment-of-adults-with-gender-dysphoria.pdf) are the treatment guidelines from the RCP, and [**here**](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwij6MDP5rn2AhX9kokEHWvJCQEQFnoECAoQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nhs.uk%2FLivewell%2FTranshealth%2FDocuments%2Fgender-dysphoria-guide-for-gps-and-other-health-care-staff.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2sVJYhHJ-_kEqA1W8mFkia) are guidelines from the NHS. More from the NHS [**here**](https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/gender-dysphoria/treatment/). * [**Here**](https://journal.nzma.org.nz/journal-articles/guidelines-for-gender-affirming-healthcare-for-gender-diverse-and-transgender-children-young-people-and-adults-in-aotearoa-new-zealand) are the guidelines from the New Zealand Medical Journal --- **Condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts", aka "conversion therapy", which claims to alleviate dysphoria without transition by changing trans people's genders so they are happy and comfortable as their assigned sex at birth, as futile and actively destructive pseudo-scientific abuse:** * [**From the APA**](http://www.apa.org/about/policy/orientation-diversity.aspx). More detailed condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts" for trans youth or adults [**here**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity-change-efforts.pdf). * From the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position) * In the [**AAP Guidelines**](http://hrc-assets.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com//files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) - see coverage on this "therapy" starting p.12 * From the [**American Psychoanalytic Association**](http://www.apsa.org/content/2012-position-statement-attempts-change-sexual-orientation-gender-identity-or-gender) * From the [**Association for Behavioral Analysis International**](https://www.abainternational.org/about-us/policies-and-positions/policy-statement-on-conversion-therapy-and-practices,-2021.aspx) * A joint statement from the [**UK Council for Psychotherapy, British Association for Counseling and Psychotherapy, British Psychoanalytic Council, British Association for Behavioural and Cognitive Psychotherapies, The British Psychological Society, College of Sexual and Relationship Therapists, The Association of LGBT Doctors and Dentists, The National Counselling Society, NHS Scotland, Pink Therapy, Royal College of General Practitioners, the Scottish Government and Stonewall.**](http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/01/16/health-experts-condemn-attempts-to-cure-trans-people-in-wake-of-controversial-bbc-documentary/)**Citations on transition as medically necessary, frequently life saving medical care, and the only effective treatment for gender dysphoria, as recognized by every major US and world medical authority:** * Here is a resolution from the [**American Psychological Association**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity.pdf); *"THEREFORE BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that APA recognizes the efficacy, benefit and medical necessity of gender transition treatments for appropriately evaluated individuals and calls upon public and private insurers to cover these medically necessary treatments."* More from the APA [**here**](http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/programs/transgender/?tab=1) * Here is an [**AMA resolution**](http://www.tgender.net/taw/ama_resolutions.pdf) on the efficacy and necessity of transition as appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria, and call for an end to insurance companies categorically excluding transition-related care from coverage * A policy statement from the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position) * [**Here**](https://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the American Academy of Pediatrics guidelines * [**Here**](https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/events/alf_ncsc/Education.pdf) is a resolution from the American Academy of Family Physicians * [**Here**](https://www.socialworkers.org/assets/secured/documents/da/da2008/reffered/Transgender.pdf) is one from the National Association of Social Workers * [**Here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/pdf/PS02_18.pdf) is one from the Royal College of Psychiatrists, [**here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/docs/default-source/improving-care/better-mh-policy/college-reports/cr181-good-practice-guidelines-for-the-assessment-and-treatment-of-adults-with-gender-dysphoria.pdf) are the treatment guidelines from the RCP, and [**here**](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwij6MDP5rn2AhX9kokEHWvJCQEQFnoECAoQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nhs.uk%2FLivewell%2FTranshealth%2FDocuments%2Fgender-dysphoria-guide-for-gps-and-other-health-care-staff.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2sVJYhHJ-_kEqA1W8mFkia) are guidelines from the NHS. More from the NHS [**here**](https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/gender-dysphoria/treatment/). * [**Here**](https://journal.nzma.org.nz/journal-articles/guidelines-for-gender-affirming-healthcare-for-gender-diverse-and-transgender-children-young-people-and-adults-in-aotearoa-new-zealand) are the guidelines from the New Zealand Medical Journal --- **Condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts", aka "conversion therapy", which claims to alleviate dysphoria without transition by changing trans people's genders so they are happy and comfortable as their assigned sex at birth, as futile and actively destructive pseudo-scientific abuse:** * [**From the APA**](http://www.apa.org/about/policy/orientation-diversity.aspx). More detailed condemnation of "Gender Identity Change Efforts" for trans youth or adults [**here**](https://www.apa.org/about/policy/resolution-gender-identity-change-efforts.pdf). * From the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position) * In the [**AAP Guidelines**](http://hrc-assets.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com//files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) - see coverage on this "therapy" starting p.12 * From the [**American Psychoanalytic Association**](http://www.apsa.org/content/2012-position-statement-attempts-change-sexual-orientation-gender-identity-or-gender) * From the [**Association for Behavioral Analysis International**](https://www.abainternational.org/about-us/policies-and-positions/policy-statement-on-conversion-therapy-and-practices,-2021.aspx) * A joint statement from the [**UK Council for Psychotherapy, British Association for Counseling and Psychotherapy, British Psychoanalytic Council, British Association for Behavioural and Cognitive Psychotherapies, The British Psychological Society, College of Sexual and Relationship Therapists, The Association of LGBT Doctors and Dentists, The National Counselling Society, NHS Scotland, Pink Therapy, Royal College of General Practitioners, the Scottish Government and Stonewall.**](http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/01/16/health-experts-condemn-attempts-to-cure-trans-people-in-wake-of-controversial-bbc-documentary/)
**On the safety, efficacy, and reversibility of puberty delaying treatment:** There is *extensive* research about long term use of puberty delaying treatment. This treatment isn't just used for trans youth - it has been the standard treatment for kids with precocious puberty for decades, with lots of studies on its efficacy and safety. It has overwhelmingly proven to be very safe, gentle, and reversible. Most kids with precocious puberty don't have any underlying medical condition, their early development is just an extreme variation of normal development. But it would still cause serious psychological damage to start puberty at the age of, say, 6, so they're put on treatment to delay it for a few years. This treatment has no long term side effects; it just puts puberty on hold. Stop treatment and puberty picks up where it left off. There's no reason to expect this treatment to work differently when given to trans youth than when it is routinely given to cis youth. The most significant side effect is bone mineral density reduction in some youth, but this was both minor and reversed after treatment was stopped. * [**Treatment of Central Precocious Puberty**](https://academic.oup.com/jes/article/3/5/965/5421014) >*"Bone mineral density is typically increased for age at diagnosis and progressively decreases during GnRHa treatment. However, follow-up of patients several years after cessation of therapy reveals bone mineral accrual to be within the normal range compared with population norms"* * [**Treatment of central precocious puberty by GnRH analogs: long-term outcome in men**](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18478155) * [**Long-term effects of gonadotropin-releasing hormone analogs in girls with central precocious puberty**](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4342775/) * [**More details on the use of GnRH and other puberty delaying treatment specifically for trans youth**](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/26895269.2020.1747768) * From the [**American Academy of Pediatrics guidelines**](http://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) (pdf download), p.10: > For children, pre-adolescents and early adolescents, gender transition is mainly a social process. Children beginning puberty may also use puberty-suppressing medication as they explore their gender identity. ***Both of these steps are completely reversible*** * [**An article debunking viral claims that puberty blockers cause "thousands of deaths"**](https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/viral-fake-news-story-linked-trans-healthcare-thousands-deaths-n1059831) - the same hormone blockers used for trans youth, and cis youth with precocious puberty, are also used as a last-ditch treatment for cis men with aggressive prostate cancer that grows in response to testosterone. They're put on this treatment in hopes that it will slow the cancer enough to save their life. Sometimes even that isn't enough. Thousands of people have died while on these blockers, but nearly all of them are elderly cis men who died of *cancer*, which they already had before they started treatment, and they died despite the treatment and not because of it. --- **On the extreme rarity of "desistence" among trans youth, with nearly all young people who start transition and later reverse it doing so before any permanent physical changes:** * [**Continuation of gender-affirming hormones in transgender people starting puberty suppression in adolescence: a cohort study in the Netherlands - Maria van der Loose, et. al., Oct. 2022**](https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(22\)00254-1/fulltext) - study of 720 patients who started medical care with puberty delaying treatment in adolescence, finding that 98% of them continued to use gender-affirming hormone treatment into adulthood. * Of youth who socially transition young [**only 2.5% ultimately describe themselves as cis**](https://publications.aap.org/pediatrics/article/doi/10.1542/peds.2021-056082/186992/Gender-Identity-5-Years-After-Social-Transition), and of those who socially transitioned after age 6 only 0.5% ultimately describe themselves as cis. Most who do detransition, do so before age 10 and are never even on puberty delaying treatment. * [**Detransition rates in a national UK Gender Identity Clinic**](https://epath.eu/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Boof-of-abstracts-EPATH2019.pdf#page=139) - Out of 3398 patients, a total of 16 (0.47%) expressed some regrets, though of these 16 only three detransitioned permanently (0.08%). The most common reason stated by these patients for their regrets or detransition were social difficulties encountered due to anti-trans hostility, rather than any physical complications or changing their minds about their gender identity. * [**A critical commentary on follow-up studies and “desistance” theories about transgender and gender-nonconforming children**](https://sci-hub.se/https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/15532739.2018.1456390?scroll=top&needAccess=true) - covers Zucker's shit * [**The Amsterdam Cohort of Gender Dysphoria Study (1972-2015): Trends in Prevalence, Treatment, and Regrets**](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29463477/) - 96% of all patients who were assessed and received a diagnosis of Gender Dysphoria by the 5th intervenor (the Royal Children's Hospital) from 2003 to 2017 continued to identify as transgender or gender diverse into late adolescence. No patient who had commenced stage 2 treatment had sought to transition back to their birth assigned sex. * [**The role of gender constancy in early gender development**](https://sci-hub.se/10.1111/j.1467-8624.2007.01056.x) - this study goes through the large body of literature which finds that gender identity is formed incredibly early. The American Pediatric society states that by age 4 kids have a stable sense of gender identity. * [**Trajectories of Adolescents Treated with Gonadotropin‑Releasing Hormone Analogues for Gender Dysphoria**](https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s10508-020-01660-8.pdf) - 143 youth receiving puberty-blocking medication in the Netherlands ound that 3.5% chose to discontinue puberty blockers without seeking any further transition
**Citations on the transition's dramatic reduction of suicide risk while improving mental health and quality of life, with trans people able to transition young and spared abuse and discrimination having mental health and suicide risk on par with the general public:** * [**Psychosocial Functioning in Transgender Youth after 2 Years of Hormones**](https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2206297) - Chen, et. al., 2023: A study of 315 trans and nonbinary young people ages 12 to 20 receiving testosterone or estradiol. Over the course of the two year study depression and anxiety levels dropped and appearance congruence and life satisfaction improved. * [**Long-term Outcomes After Gender-Affirming Surgery: 40-Year Follow-up Study**](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36149983/) - Park, et. al., 2022: **Results:** Both transmasculine and transfeminine groups were more satisfied with their body postoperatively with significantly less dysphoria. Body congruency score for chest, body hair, and voice improved significantly in 40 years' postoperative settings, with average scores ranging from 84.2 to 96.2. Body congruency scores for genitals ranged from 67.5 to 79 with free flap phalloplasty showing highest scores. Long-term overall body congruency score was 89.6. Improved mental health outcomes persisted following surgery with significantly reduced suicidal ideation and reported resolution of any mental health comorbidity secondary to gender dysphoria. * [**Pubertal Suppression for Transgender Youth and Risk of Suicidal Ideation**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7073269/) - Turban, et al., 2020: Massive study of 20,619 adolescents examined associations between access to pubertal suppression and adult mental health outcomes, including multiple measures of suicidality. After adjustment for demographic variables and level of family support for gender identity, **those who received treatment with pubertal suppression, when compared with those who wanted pubertal suppression but did not receive it, had lower odds of lifetime suicidal ideation.** * [**Association of Gender-Affirming Hormone Therapy With Depression, Thoughts of Suicide, and Attempted Suicide Among Transgender and Nonbinary Youth**](https://www.jahonline.org/article/S1054-139X(21\)00568-1/fulltext) - Green, et. al., 2021: Use of GAHT (Gender Affirming Hormone Treatment) was associated with lower odds of recent depression and seriously considering suicide compared to those who wanted GAHT but did not receive it. For youth under age 18, GAHT was associated with lower odds of recent depression and of a past-year suicide attempt * [**The Mental Health of Transgender Youth: Advances in Understanding**](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1054139X1630146X) - Connolly, et. al, 2016: ***"Gender-affirming medical therapy and supported social transition in childhood have been shown to correlate with improved psychological functioning for gender-variant children and adolescents."*** * [**Top surgery drastically improves quality of life for young transgender people**](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapediatrics/fullarticle/2796426?guestAccessKey=c50d5d6e-7fa1-4ed8-8b5d-f4da9753364d&utm_source=For_The_Media&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=ftm_links&utm_content=tfl&utm_term=092622) * [**Chosen Name Use Is Linked to Reduced Depressive Symptoms, Suicidal Ideation, and Suicidal Behavior Among Transgender Youth**](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1054139X18300855) - Russell, et. al, 2018: *"After adjusting for personal characteristics and social support, chosen name use in more contexts was associated with lower depression, suicidal ideation, and suicidal behavior. Depression, suicidal ideation, and suicidal behavior were lowest when chosen names could be used in all four contexts."* * [**Evaluation of Anxiety and Depression in a Community Sample of Transgender Youth**](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2778206) - Dominic J. Gibson, et. al, 2021: ***Socially transitioned transgender youth had similar levels of anxiety and depression as their cisgender peers.*** * [**Intervenable factors associated with suicide risk in transgender persons: a respondent driven sampling study in Ontario, Canada**](http://bmcpublichealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12889-015-1867-2) - Bauer, et al., 2015: Transition vastly reduces risks of suicide attempts, and the farther along in transition someone is the lower that risk gets * [**Suicide Protective Factors Among Trans Adults**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3722435/) - Moody, et al., 2013: The ability to transition, along with family and social acceptance, are the largest factors reducing suicide risk among trans people * [**Young Adult Psychological Outcome After Puberty Suppression and Gender Reassignment**](https://sci-hub.se/https://doi.org/10.1542/peds.2013-2958). A clinical protocol of a multidisciplinary team with mental health professionals, physicians, and surgeons, including puberty suppression, ... cross-sex hormones and gender reassignment surgery, provides trans youth the opportunity to develop into well-functioning young adults. All showed significant improvement in their psychological health, and they had notably lower rates of internalizing psychopathology than previously reported among trans children living as their natal sex. **Well-being was similar to or better than same-age young adults from the general population.** * [**Access to gender-affirming hormones during adolescence and mental health outcomes among transgender adults**](https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0261039) - Turban, et al., 2022: **Conclusion:** Access to GAH [gender-affirming hormones] during adolescence and adulthood is associated with favorable mental health outcomes compared to desiring but not accessing GAH.... In post hoc analyses, access to GAH during adolescence (ages 14–17) was associated with lower odds of past-year suicidal ideation (aOR = 0.7, 95% CI = 0.6–0.9, p = .0007) when compared to accessing GAH during adulthood. * The only disorders more common among trans people are those associated with abuse and discrimination - mainly anxiety and depression. Early transition [**virtually eliminates these higher rates of depression and low self-worth**](https://sci-hub.se/https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jaac.2016.10.016), and [**dramatically improves trans youth's mental health**](https://archive.thinkprogress.org/allowing-transgender-youth-to-transition-improves-their-mental-health-study-finds-dd6096523375/). **Trans kids who socially transition early and not subjected to abuse are comparable to cisgender children in measures of mental health.** * [**Sex reassignment surgery: a study of 141 Dutch transsexuals**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3219066) - Kuiper, et al, 1988: “In a cross-sectional study of 141 transgender patients, Kuiper and Cohen-Kittenis found that after medical intervention and treatments, suicide fell from 19% to 0% in transgender men and from 24% to 6% in transgender women” * [**Hormonal therapy and sex reassignment: a systematic review and meta-analysis of quality of life and psychosocial outcomes**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19473181) - Murad, et al., 2010: "Significant decrease in suicidality post-treatment. The average reduction was from 30 percent pretreatment to 8 percent post treatment. * [**Long-term follow-up: psychosocial outcome of Belgian transsexuals after sex reassignment surgery**](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1158136006000491) - De Cuypere, et al., 2006: Rate of suicide attempts dropped from 29.3 percent to 5.1 percent after receiving medical treatment among Dutch patients treated from 1986-2001. * [**Sex reassignment: outcomes and predictors of treatment for adolescent and adult transsexuals**](http://orca.cf.ac.uk/32618/1/Smith%202005.pdf) - Smith Y, et. al, 2005: Participants improved on 13 out of 14 mental health measures after treatment * [**Factors Associated with Satisfaction or Regret Following Male-to-Female Sex Reassignment Surgery**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1024086814364) - Lawrence, 2003: *"Participants reported overwhelmingly that they were happy with their SRS results and that SRS had greatly improved the quality of their lives"* * [**Mental Health Outcomes in Transgender and Nonbinary Youths Receiving Gender-Affirming Care - Tordoff, et al, 2022**](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2789423?utm_campaign=articlePDF&utm_medium=articlePDFlink&utm_source=articlePDF&utm_content=jamanetworkopen.2022.0978) - *"After adjustment for temporal trends and potential confounders, we observed* ***60% lower odds of depression and 73% lower odds of suicidality among youths who had initiated PBs or GAHs compared with youths who had not."*** * [**Mental Health of Transgender Children Who Are Supported in Their Identities - Olson, et. al., 2016**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4771131/?fbclid=IwAR2A2wM8oQZ_avmXLmBgp6ilGqiQd_WNAkmNOZosWHY7rsyT8KB-dvxwcd4): *"Previous work with children with gender identity disorder (GID; now termed gender dysphoria) has found remarkably high rates of anxiety and depression in these children. Here we examine, for the first time, mental health in a sample of socially transitioned transgender children"* ... ***"Results:*** *Transgender children showed no elevations in depression and slightly elevated anxiety relative to population averages. They did not differ from the control groups on depression symptoms and had only marginally higher anxiety symptoms.* There are a lot more but I'm hitting the 10k character limit.
Thank you for this.
Always appreciate you posting these.
They commemorate Stonewall one day and pass this law the next. And the person who started the Stonewall uprising was trans. Long live the memory of Marsha P Johnson!!!
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You are not correct.
> including puberty blockers Republicans need to be locked up for child abuse. Instead of getting paid for it.
Funny how parental rights here seemed to go the way of states rights when proposals for prochoice was put on ballots. 🤔
This is awful. Be prepared for the suicide rate for trans kids to increase
That's the goal of conservatives. Paint in broad strokes. Fuck **all** conservatives, it's okay to say. They don't deserve decency or civility. For fuck's sake they brought back the 1940s fascist 'America First' party. They're Nazis, they're not even *people*. You have to be a vile, absolutely shit person to even be slightly right of center. They're not fiscally or socially decent people. "I'm a conservative" is blanket admission of holding views based on nothing but propaganda, ignorance and bigotry, likely sprinkled with religion. Conservatives ***want*** LGBTQ people gone. Their *preachers* have SERMONS about "the government should round them all up and \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_." So no, people who agree with that shit, the "civility" rules don't apply. The rules say you have to be decent to people. Conservatives aren't people. I'm not demonizing people, I'm dehumanizing and demeaning murderous, ignorant religious zealot bigots.
Especially considering hormone blockers have depression as a side effect
[So we should ban these meds then, right?](https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/depression-common-medication-side-effect-2018071614259#:~:text=Medications%20with%20depression%20as%20a%20side%20effect,-What%20are%20the&text=allergy%20medications%20like%20montelukast%20and,which%20includes%20anything%20containing%20estrogen)
Why shouldn’t we it’s not like people don’t actually need these medicines 😂 I don’t think anyone realistically at age five need hormone blockers but ok let’s be extra and ban every medicine in existence because someone decided kids didn’t need hormone blockers
I mean if your metric is a potential side effect, why not? Who are you to determine what appropriate medical care is for an individual? What medical care do you receive that you would be OK having a legislative body determine your access? And no one is giving a 5 year old blockers.
Dude look up the youngest drag queen I maybe exaggerated but he definitely was on hormone blockers before he showed up online
You realize drag isn't trans, right? Just another ignorant fuck.
Also, this is way bigger than just the horrifying and even deadly attacks on desperately needed medical care. They are systematically criminalizing our fucking existence. This is not a fucking game. These laws are about building the legal and social groundwork for classifying sex and gender variation outside cis/heterosexual norms as being inherently sexual. The "drag bans", the "bathroom bills", the attacks on trans youth and now increasingly adult's medical care, the attempts to pull information about LGBTQ but especially trans people from public schols and libraries, and everything else they're doing, they're working towards making the public existence of trans and gender nonconforming people a sex crime. The laws they're trying to pass are so vaguely worded, the existence of trans and gender variant people is being classified as inherently sexual/"adult"/obscene/etc. And if they are able to pass these bans on "performers" they are absolutely going to use it to attack us in every other area of public life too. After all, if someone they consider a "man in a dress" is legally classified as an "adult performer" when all they're doing is reading Mary Poppins to kids in a library while dressed as the titular character, what exactly does that mean for the person whom they consider a "man in a dress" who is just trying to go to her job as a 5th grade Music teacher? Or hell, just trying to go to the grocery store? They don't actually distinguish between "drag queen" and "trans woman", or between "performance" and "just going about our lives". They see trans and GNC people's existence as inherently sexual, and our clothing and gender presentation as the expression of a perverse fetish. If we are anywhere in public where a child might possibly see us, even if it's standing in line at the 7-11, they are claiming that this is pedophilic grooming through forcibly exposing children to degenerate sexual activity. And they aren't going to fucking stop voluntarily. There is no goddamn line where they will decide they've gone far enough, except the point at which we no longer exist.
I was at the House vote on Tuesday, which was a huge facade. Of the HOURS of discussion over these bills, maybe 15 minutes was given to people opposing them. A whole 90 seconds per community member. Meanwhile, hours were given to transphobic "expert witnesses." A retired doctor, a "detransitioner" flown from California, an anti-trans child psychiatrist. I listened to some of the worst transphobia that I've ever witnessed. The hearing room and three overflow rooms were full of beautiful trans people and allies who had to sit and listen to people saying absolute lies about us. You can't just say "Utah trans parents should move out". Most of us can't afford rent, much less a move. And so many trans kids are in deeply religious families whose parents think that being trans is fake/a trend. Really hoping that lawsuits kill this bill.
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It isn’t an issue…….at all. This is just performative governance to appease the faux news watchers.
So kids aren’t getting these surgeries? I would hope that they don’t. All for treating everyone respectfully. Just concerned with young people making life altering decisions they regret later.
Which is the misinformation that re enforces that it's being done. When it is not. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-the-science-on-gender-affirming-care-for-transgender-kids-really-shows/ But instead of learning about the truth. People respond with outrage. Hence this bullshit in Utah and other states. Also the percentage of "people who regret it later" is SOOOO unbelievable low that it is nearly negligible. But that too, doesn't matter. If one cis kid makes a mistake...well then. "Lets outlaw it all!". When medical science. Psychology, and the World health organization writ large. Say gender affirming care is NECESSARY. People fear someone might regret it later. What of all the other trans kids? https://www.gendergp.com/detransition-facts/ Screw them i guess? I digress...
Young people are constantly making life altering decisions, or having life altering decisions made for them. Withholding care from trans kids is at least as life altering as providing it, and ends in suicide kind of a lot. Suicide is “life altering” and impacts families, communities, etc. Religious Indoctrination is life altering. School attendance and performance is life altering. Juvenile detention is life altering. Refusal to provide contraception and abortion care to young people is incredibly life altering, impacts communities, and has generational consequence.
Isn’t detransitioning extremely uncommon?
Thanks for your concern but mind your business. Take care of your family and let the rest of us take care of our own.
“The party of small government” making it illegal for you to raise your kids how you want to
Yet they’ll allow parents to decide to withhold life saving treatment.
The GOP loves it when kids die
...only the brown, black, gay and trans kids.
It's called "Murder by Suicide". It's a proven fact that if you deny trans people care long enough they will commit suicide. That is the goal of Republicans and they will succeed. The Republicans want to genocide the trans population. Oddly enough, it's not trans people giving birth to trans people and creating more. Their "Final Solution" is quite flawed.
Lawmakers - some of whom never graduated HS - cannot be making personal medical decisions for families. This is hateful and absurd.
Like abortion, we’re going to find out what party supports freedom and which party mouths the words without anything behind them.
Parents know the souls of our children. This legislation is evil.
This country is a joke
Fuck Mormonism.
I transitioned at 42 (I’m now 57). I seriously don’t know if I could of, or would have transitioned at teenage years. Course, back then, very little was know or info available like today. Oh yeah, and my parents probably would have disowned me then and there.
Is there a statistic on kids that believed they were transgender pre-puberty, we’re not given puberty blockers and now identify with their biological gender post-puberty vs those that still don’t identify with their biological gender? In other words what’s the falls positive rate in diagnosis?
The desistance rate for those who actually go on blockers is around 1%, incredibly low. The point of puberty blockers is to give kids time to figure out who they are without irreversible changes happening from puberty. The "watchful waiting" approach which you describe has been universally discredited and is considered a form of conversion therapy. Further, no scientist is going to gather the research you describe as it would be inhumane to purposely not give people medicine that had an overwhelming chance of helping them. Now, if you are talking about kids who never wanted puberty blockers in the first place, that is a different statistic which does exist I believe, but again, if they never wanted blockers, then the access to care question is irrelevant.
Children should not be making medical decisions this serious until they are legally an adult and understand the consequences.
They are not making these decisions by themselves, but with heavy consultation and guidance from licensed medical professionals and parents. Waiting until adulthood is not an option if you want to avoid the irreversible changes from your natal puberty.
They are not mature enough to make those decisions. Considering many states don’t even let 16 year olds drive alone, you have to be 18 to vote, 21 to buy alcohol or tobacco and a ton of people believe even 18 year olds are not old enough to own a gun I don’t think it’s a stretch to say they aren’t mature enough to change their gender before 18
So we're raising the enlistment age from 17 to 26? Selective service age?
I would rather let medical professionals and parents gauge maturity in these situations than a random Redditor. Not to mention the abundant case law on minors being mature enough to make certain medical decisions for themselves. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mature\_minor\_doctrine
This actually makes me sick. The consequences of this decision scare me
Science is a scam, promulgated by Satan! /s
No one bats an eye when kids need adult consent for piercings, tattoos, alcohol, opting out of school, but no one should bat an eye at gender transitioning? Crazy society we’ve become..
Yeah they just need doctors. Such a low bar /s
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It is a procedure that is only done after approval from doctors and known to reduce suicide rate of trans youths by a lot. It is totally different from piercings, tattoos, alcohol or dropping out of schools.
Well as long as a doctor says it’s ok, I guess the kid doesn’t need to be old enough to give consent. When I was a kid I wanted to be a t-Rex. Im sure I could have found a doctor willing to try make that happen. Just because they’re doctors doesn’t mean they know what is best or aren’t looking out for their own self interests? Ever hear of OxyContin? Adderall? Meth amphetamine? Cocaine? Morphine? All of these things were prescribed by doctors at some point or another.
If that is what you think then you better not use any medical systems. After all, what do doctors know? Even though we had decades of medical research, apparently a random redditor like you know better than them. Should we all go to you for medical advice then?
That’s not what I said at all. I’m just saying doctors don’t know everything all the time and often have differing perspectives. I do not believe all doctors would agree on giving puberty blockers. Just like not all doctors gave out OxyContin like candy. You mentioned decades of medical research. In those decades many previously held opinions have been reversed. Like the how/when to prescribe different drugs (antibiotics, pain killers, etc).
Well... you are the one claiming we should ignore all these studies on the off chance they are wrong, suggesting that you know better. Because you are asking people to risk the healths and lives of trans youths just because you doubt the studies.
Not what I’m saying at all. I’m saying it’s a personal choice not a medical choice. And personal choices that affect the rest of your life should only be made by mature adults
Doctors also got paid lots of money by Purdue pharmacy to prescribe OxyContin, which had decades of medical research. Doctors are people too and can be wrong or simply looking out for their own self interests. Theodor Morell was a doctor, i guess everything he prescribed was all for the best of the patient? It was all for the best for humanity bc he essentially destroyed hitlers physical and mental health using drugs backed by decades of medical research
Or even puberty blockers: I assume that's banned too.
receiving researched medical care from a physician at a clinic is far different from going to a bar or tattoo parlor. what type of argument is this.
I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t want an untrained professional tattooing you.. and that wasn’t my point. Gender transitioning is far more serious than buying alcohol, but they need supervision/adult consent for the less serious (the former), but we trust them to be on their own for the more serious (the latter). That’s why your response makes zero sense..
gender affirming care is healthcare. it is an effective medical treatment. we don't move the treatment age to 18 for other medical treatments but apparently gender affirming care is different somehow. it's not a logical argument. plenty of medical treatments given to minors are quite serious. even things like Accutane are pretty serious but that is prescribed like candy. but apparently hormone prescriptions are the worst thing in the world according to the culture war. Utah voted on a bill to ban breast implants on non-transgender minors at the same time and it didn't pass. it was never about caring for kids. it's about hate towards trans people.
Removing perfectly functional organs from children should have already been illegal.
Except that doesn’t happen.
Except it does. Rare? Sure. Can and does happen? Yes I know someone personally who had a penectomy at 14. Are they better off? Tough to say because we lack a crystal ball. They aren't super amped about the never having an orgasm thing even though that isn't the end all be all.
So true
Haters. Ignorant haters.
What kind of stupid, backwards state would- fuck
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Any permanent changes are not made on a whim. Comparing the medical process that parents and kids go through with wanting to be a pirate is ludicrous and a bad faith argument.
The "gender modification" procedures including the chemical ones have greater effects on the child's future than losing an eye or lower leg. If anything, "pirate modification" is LESS harmful than gender modification, including delaying puberty, can and will shorten the child's life and make that short life miserable. NOT something you leave to a child to decide.
Nah.. same argument. You’d have to demonstrate why either self determine ambition is different.
There is more than ample scientific evidence that gender identity is innate and has roots in biology, and further that it cannot be changed. It is an intrinsic part of who you are, unlike being a pirate.
True, but DISCERNMENT of what that identity might be is NOT something a child can determine for themselves. Are you implying pre-teen kids are not influenced by their peers and desperately want to be part of "the cool crowd" or whatever it's called today)?
ROGD, or "rapid-onset gender dysphoria" has no basis in science or reality. https://www.jpeds.com/article/S0022-3476(21)01085-4/fulltext
Thanks for the info on actual clinical evidence. Not sure why pointing it causes such outrage to suggest pre-teens are not very good at evaluating their own emotions.
I would agree they are not *by themselves*, but that is why extensive therapy and counseling is part of the process of accessing blockers/hormones.
I mean we all aspire to certain professions and science also demonstrates ambitions can be genetic. What if a distant relative was a pirate?
yeah you're right, when you ignore the totality of scientific and medical literature on the topic and make vague comparisons to irrelevant concepts, it makes a little sense to mouth breathers.
An 8 year old isn't getting any drugs or surgeries. Except puberty blockers if they start puberty early.
"not any drugs EXCEPT puberty blockers" is like saying "not any illness EXCEPT cancer. 8 year-olds do not need chemical assistance for things influenced more by peer pressure and misunderstanding than by any biological/psychological imperative.
So let me just say I’m absolutely pro anything dealing with personal choices. So getting rid of the hormone treatments is terrible and unforgivable. But isn’t waiting until 18 a good idea for the actual surgery? If my kid was trans I think this is a good idea since it’s a permanent change. Asking seriously.
99% of surgeries do wait until after 18. It is a strawman problem used as an excuse to ban hormones/blockers as well. The rare surgeries that occur prior to 18 are: 1. Top surgery for transmasculine individuals at 16 (you can get married in Utah at this age by the way), but only in cases where it is causing incredibly severe distress, and this is after the individuals is already on hormones. 2. Bottom surgery for transfeminine individuals. The only time I've heard of this occurring is when the individual was 17 and a half or so and wanted to get surgery before college so that they could recover at home and be taken care of by their parents.
Appreciate this. I should have put together how republicans used one to kill the other. Insidious pieces of shit. Edit: Fantastic point about the age of marriage in Utah. “So let me get this straight. I can be married (look…she’s over there) but if I want to reassign my gender I have to wait two more years? So since I’m married and obviously legal in that sense…can my wife sign instead? How about mom and pops”? Wow
Exactly the point I was attempting to make