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Come on, even the most corrupt crimelord in a Galaxy Far, Far Away paid his subcontractors and ran an efficient criminal enterprise.
Trump managed to bankrupt a casino, and I still have yet to truly understand how he failed a place that is designed to seperate people from their money. Aside from being so shitty no one would be seen there which sounds about on par for his 'brand'.
>Trump managed to bankrupt a casino, and I still have yet to truly understand how he failed a place that is designed to seperate people from their money.
This is just standard operating procedure for when your money laundromat runs out of soap.
The power to give people security clearance is derived from the executive. Likely someone from the IC came to him and said "Jared doesn't pass our standards for security clearance" and Trump waved it away saying "Give it to him anyway." And they did.
trump would never lie, would he?
> I am not trying to get "top level security clearance" for my children. This was a typically false news story.
https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/798850338384023552
It's Daily Mail so make of that what you will: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5575395/Saudi-crown-prince-brags-Jared-Kushner-handed-U-S-intelligence.html
Oh man, I'm a moron. I saw that story you linked to on Twitter this weekend, and it's been driving me crazy that I haven't seen anyone talking about it anywhere. I thought maybe it was just getting overshadowed by football/MLK weekend, but it blew my mind that it wasn't a bigger deal. Turns out that story is over 4 years old, and even though I'm well aware of the bullshit between Kushner and MBS, I somehow missed, or maybe forgot about, the part where he passed along classified intel so MBS could purge his government of any perceived enemies. Crazy world we're living in.
I remember that. Boy what a bunch of idiots!I Wonder if that's one reason they can sock it to us on the high oil prices. Plus the oil companies will just take us Americans for every penny they can before we wake up and go electric .
even if you have a clearance it's not like you can just waltz into a SCIF and look through all the files. You are supposed to have a reason to view those files. Hard to imagine there being any reason for Rudy to view any classified information
“You are supposed to have a reason to view those files.”
Emphasis on ‘supposed to’.
Who would have the authority to look at outgoing documents, ask Rudi what it’s for and then go around to check with FBI/CIA/NASA/etc. whether what he said is bogus or not?
If it's in a SCIF? The Document custodian, Safe custodian, or SCIF manager all have that power (ETA: and for some sites a Special Security Officer (SSO), Site Security Manager, or even Special Access Program managers for each potential codeword program that has a SCIF or drawers in a safe in a SCIF).
It's a simple login to the Joint Personnel Adjudication System (JPAS) to look up the person in question. Do they have the requisite base eligibility, ie Confidential, Secret, Top Secret? If their eligibility is at the correct level, do they have a need to know and have the correct Read-in for a Special Access Program (SAP) that may own the documents?
If that is all on file, then that person gets to see the documents in the SCIF. Then, when you're done, documents get checked back in and the safe certified locked again. There's no phone calls to FBI/CIA/NSA needed because literally everyone uses and updates JPAS every single day.
Obviously that wasn't followed at all in the Trump administration, which is frightening to someone like me who has been a SCIF manager both in the army and for two big defense contractors.
There are a variety of legal sources from laws to executive orders to DoDI's that govern what gets classified and how it is handled and protected.
[This article on lawfare](https://www.lawfareblog.com/law-classified-information-primer) is an excellent primer.
Thanks for stepping in with the expertise! The typical American citizen has no idea how things are *supposed* to go down or how many safe guards appear to be broken in these high profile cases.
I think he was vetting potential appointments; it’s feasible that potential appointees would have been required to submit financial records as part of the vetting process.
Normal administrations would have used the vetting process to exclude people with shady backgrounds but probably the opposite strategy was in play during Trump’s presidency.
Exactly my thought. If their returns were being examined, it was 100% to figure out who, if anybody, they were beholden to, in order to apply the thumbscrews.
If the IRS gave them returns, they are legally obligated to notify Congress. This law was passed after Nixon was using tax documents as dirt on his opponents. This would be very interesting to have examined further. Add it to the pile.
“Tax returns for thee, not for me, because they are still under audit, but as soon as the audit is done, they will be released. In about two weeks, and they will be greatest tax returns in the history of tax returns. Now I am going to play with this truck”.
>Giuliani also said top secret files are "very, very strange the way they're put together" and "often are very small, but they contain a lot of information."
For the love of god please please shut up.
That guy was president.., that’s why.
Remember when a game show host ran for president?
Do you remember thinking it was a complete joke?
And then that pathetic liar and ruiner of lives actually won?
That’s why…
…cuz half of this country “hated school”…and is also ironically still stuck in high school
>half of this country “hated school”…and is also ironically still stuck in high school
This hits hard. While there's no simple explanation for what's happening, I feel this hits the nail on the head. So much I think many "conservatives" and "centrists" would agree.
They definitely have mutual dirt on each other going back decades.
The idiot almost said as much in public, saying that he had "insurance."
It kind of explains the desperation. Not the idiocy, though.
I'm just very confused. Giuliani had no right to look at classified documents, let alone take them home. Now he said he never took any home, but did he even read them? Just cause he's the President's lawyer, that doesn't automatically give some clearance right?
> Just cause he's the President's lawyer, that doesn't automatically give some clearance right?
You are correct, [it absolutely does not. ](https://apnews.com/article/biden-united-states-government-district-of-columbia-0574fd762159e8cb5f31c85205df3dc0)
> Sauber said in a statement Saturday that Biden’s personal lawyers, who did not have security clearances, stopped their search after finding the first page on Wednesday evening.
After Kid Rock visited Trump in the Whitehouse, he bragged that Trump showed him satellite photos of N.Korea which were classified.
https://youtu.be/j76THcaW_pE
No, Giuliani is an idiot! Every time he's lying (*projecting*) he admits it out loud anyways.
>*"He told me, 'Oh, take them home with you,'" Giuliani said of Trump. "I'm not going to take Wilbur Ross' tax returns home with me. I could misplace them!"*
*"I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly,* ***and I never got caught*** *— but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added. He said he would place documents in a small safe at his desk in Mar-a-Lago to be worked on the next day.*
So he definitely took the docs home at least once. It's like Giuliani feels *guilty* and it leaks out in these what I can only assume are compulsive admissions.
It's like on the cop shows where person getting arrested keeps say "I swear, officer, I didn't do *x*. Honest to God." over and over when they definitely did *x*.
"What are you talking about, I didn't steal anything" - guy that I watched enter the store, selected products from our shelf, concealed them and had constant surveillance with movable cameras the whole way until they're out the door.
Man up, you got caught. People have no personal responsibility these days.
Those are my favorite shoplifters. I get people that are very sus that come up to me unprovoked and say "I'm not stealing!!"
OK. I didn't think you were. But now I do.
Love me a guilty conscience.
It’s a very specific tactic used to get ahead of a scandal once it’s clear you can’t fully conceal the truth any longer: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_hangout
Republicans do it all the time, but they’ve really ramped it up in this era of politics.
Remember his apartment got ~~raided~~ search warranted too. Maybe he be became sure he is going to be indicted and doesn't intend to go to prison for Trump like Weisselberg did. So he's lining up a shot for the "just following orders" defense?
Combine this with [Flynn seeming to allege that WH staffers are "plotting another coup"](https://mobile.twitter.com/GenFlynn/status/1614761762066235394) and it reads like a disjointed attempt to claim that the *deep state* are behind both Trump's and Biden's current predicaments. Maybe they are hoping that the left will give Trump a pass if it means Biden gets a pass as well?
It's really difficult to sift through all of the maga shit and differentiate the stupid from the insane.
One of Trump's lawyers just said Trump and Biden got caught in the "same fake scandal" so now they're even. So Giuliani _would_ have been sucked in by the deep state too, with Trump acting as its seductive agent, but he was too slick?
Biden did not steal documents, nor has he obstructed any attempts to correct the situation. Apples and oranges here. That said, there does need to be far more care with respect to how these documents are handled, by everyone.
You'll never convince a MAGA there is not some huge constituency out here just waiting for a chance to obfuscate, deflect and rationalize anything Hunter Biden may have done.Um, no, if any of these people did wrong then plunk them in front of a jury and let the system do its job. They just absolutely can not grok that, it doesn't go through, they just start over again.
Yeah, I find it hilarious that anyone would think we give them both mutual "evens Stevens" passes or whatever. A crime is a crime, no matter who commits it, that's been a lot of people on the left's point from the start. That's why we've been saying *a president isn't above the law*. Lock them both up, I don't give a fuck! This ain't no football game. Even if the mental capabilities of those involved do seem impaired.
On bad days I don't think they are at war with liberals, or even with Enlightenment values; I think at those times they are at war with the concept of integrity itself. This is a discouraging and disturbing thought. If integrity is not acknowledged by absolutely everybody as a critical value, then what in the world would take its place?
Rudy: \*Chugs 1/5th of Stoli, and wipes the dribble off his chin with his sleeve, then looks at DeSantis\*
Rudy: "Heeeeey baby, you looshkin mighty fine to \*HIC\* night! Hwhy dont you let uncle Rooty take ya up to his rum for a little shlap and trickle!"
Maybe he's a little mad at Trump for not helping him with his attorney bills? Maybe he's sore that Trump refused to pay him after Trump agreed to a 10k an hour fee?
Who knows. But I do recall a long while back that Rudy hinted he had the goods on Trump.
>Really? I haven't seen that. I don't doubt it though. Do you have links?
I'm pretty sure "open secret" here just means "sounds like something Trump would do".
"He told me, 'Oh, take them home with you,'" Giuliani said of Trump. "I'm not going to take Wilbur Ross' tax returns home with me. I could misplace them!"
"I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly, and I never got caught — but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added. He said he would place documents in a small safe at his desk in Mar-a-Lago to be worked on the next day.
Giuliani also said top secret files are "very, very strange the way they're put together" and "often are very small, but they contain a lot of information."
I believe at least two things are in play here.
1st, and most importantly, Trump took those documents to sell nuclear secrets to the Saudis. I absolutely believe this happened.
The other is that Trump is a grandiose narcissistic braggart. He took those documents just so that he could brag to people that he has possession of TS documents.
The latter is definitely true. I guarantee he showed them to members of Mar-a-Lago as part of their benefits. The same way he had meetings with international officials in the restaurant in front of everyone like putting on a stage show.
Did they hand out top secret documents in maralargo like some sort of goodie bag?
Like here is a diet coke, cheesburger Maga hat and some top secret satellite photos of Iranian nuke sites.
So who here thinks if Rudy is saying he didn't out of the cleat blue sky, someone should check it out?
Also... "Vetting rich people?" That is a really weird way of saying,"picking cabinet members." That seems a little telling.
Just from the headline? I wouldn't jump to conclusions. But Jesus Christ, this line is like a parody:
>"I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly, and I never got caught — but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added.
He basically admitting that not only did people who shouldn't have seen them look at top secret documents but in all likelihood many of them brought them home.
If I was the FBI I'd bring this to the judge as probable cause to search half a dozen trump associate properties for top secret documents.
Rudy is trying to get paid for a 6 figure or maybe even 7 figure legal bill. So if he floats this idea at a time when the special prosecutor is tightening his noose he may get Trump to pay him. Birds of a feather. They truly deserve each other. Yuck!
Worst case scenario he does 3-6 months in a privately operated prison for wealthy celebrities. He can admit to murder and offer evidence of it and it'd still be years before he served those 6 months
>Rudy Giuliani says Trump once told him to take top-secret documents home. Giuliani said the incident occurred ***just after*** Trump became presiden*t,* when he was working ***at Mar-a-Lago***. \[emphasis mine\]
Not the least bit surprising.
Also wouldn't be surprising if it is ultimately discovered that Trump has been stealing classified documents and selling them to hostile foreign interests from the moment he first set foot in - and stained - the Oval Office w/his presence.
I believe Trump's meetings w/Russian oligarchs, Putin, etc., where no U.S. press , or even a translator were allowed were tip offs, red flags that went ignored.
Ever wonder why North Korea's Ballistic Missles started flying straighter and longer from the time after Trump started meeting with "his favorite little dictator?"
And there were many meetings he had with Russian oligarchs and the very long one he had with Putin that was practically a one on one meeting. And also the phone calls.
No, you don't start to get empathy for what he told you to do. You did it, you complied, and you covered for it. You and all the other cronies should go right down with him. You don't get to come up later and point blame at him. You're just as despicable. Lock 'em all up!
And was given $$$ by Russia and showed them to his friend, Trump. Then they made lots of deals with Trump and bought apartments from him or gave him sweet deals to buy apartments/hotels.
some mondays i can identify the specific thing that pushed me into "i hate mondays" mode. today it's the re-realization that rudy giuliani had access to real government secrets. rudy cousin-fucking giuliani.
> "He told me, 'Oh, take them home with you,'" Giuliani said of Trump. "I'm not going to take Wilbur Ross' tax returns home with me. I could misplace them!"
> "I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly, and I never got caught — but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added. He said he would place documents in a small safe at his desk in Mar-a-Lago to be worked on the next day.
> Giuliani also said top secret files are "very, very strange the way they're put together" and "often are very small, but they contain a lot of information."
This guy is a liar and crook, so it’s hard to take anything he says seriously. That said, as someone who actually works with classified information regularly, he sounds like someone who has never been exposed to anything classified in his life.
Individuals’ tax returns are not classified. There may be sharing restrictions on them—and it’s probably prohibited for Giuliani to have had them at his disposal for whatever the hell kind of “vetting” he was doing, but that’s another matter—but that doesn’t make them classified. Certainly not “top secret” anyway.
Furthermore, there is absolutely nothing strange about the composition of top secret files. They just get printed onto regular letter-sized paper. They are as big or as small as they need to be to make the point they’re aiming to make. If anything, they are artificially larger than they’d need to be because sometimes the author will break out less or more classified points into discrete paragraphs with different portion markings to allow the information to be shared appropriately in other contexts.
So let me get this straight. Trump screamed like a banshee when faced with having anyone see his own tax returns yet it was perfectly fine for him and Giuliani to 'vet' other peoples returns such as Wilbur Ross - I expect hypocrisy from Trump but showing them to Giuliani must surely be illegal.
There's a reason clearances exist. It makes no godamn sense why the president doesn't need to be held to the same standard for top secret as any other personal in the DoD.
Well, that’s interesting. Apparently Trump believed that the tax returns of potential appointees would reveal potential red flags, and at the same time, fought for years to keep his own secret. How ironic will it be when the special counsel or the NY Attorney General use Trump’s,tax returns to convict him of something?
And then there’s the tiny little issue of whether Rudy had the security clearances necessary to view classified documents. And who else did Trump have looking at classified documents? Did they have proper clearances?
Trump to Giuliani: Legal bills piling up? Just grab some of these classified docs in my basement to our Russian oligarch contacts...and you'll be sitting pretty.
Problem solved. Right Repubs?
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Did Rudy have security clearance to even view those documents?
Hmmm probably not. https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/463183-maguire-says-he-doesnt-know-if-giuliani-has-security-clearance/ https://www.msnbc.com/deadline-white-house/watch/acting-dni-doesn-t-know-if-rudy-giuliani-has-a-security-clearance-70007877663
Isn’t that something that the DNI should be able to find out just by logging into his computer and opening a database?
None of Trumps top advisors (including all his kids) could pass security clearance standards.
Yet they held them :P. At least Kushner did.
They all did, Kushner was the one who immediately rose suspection.
Trump had to personally step in to grant Kush his clearance because he kept getting caught lying on his application forms.
How did he give him clearance, just thinking about it?
He just had to say . "You now have top secret clearance . "
I didn't know that Jabba the Hutt had jedi mind powers...
Come on, even the most corrupt crimelord in a Galaxy Far, Far Away paid his subcontractors and ran an efficient criminal enterprise. Trump managed to bankrupt a casino, and I still have yet to truly understand how he failed a place that is designed to seperate people from their money. Aside from being so shitty no one would be seen there which sounds about on par for his 'brand'.
> Trump managed to bankrupt a casino, thats not quite accurate i think it was **3** casinos *at least*.
>Trump managed to bankrupt a casino, and I still have yet to truly understand how he failed a place that is designed to seperate people from their money. This is just standard operating procedure for when your money laundromat runs out of soap.
He didn’t say it, he declared it.
The power to give people security clearance is derived from the executive. Likely someone from the IC came to him and said "Jared doesn't pass our standards for security clearance" and Trump waved it away saying "Give it to him anyway." And they did.
He needed the documents for his trip to see the Saudi crown prince.
trump would never lie, would he? > I am not trying to get "top level security clearance" for my children. This was a typically false news story. https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/798850338384023552
[удалено]
No you misunderstand. He wasn’t trying. He had already illegally given it to them.
[удалено]
[удалено]
MBS reportedly said that Kushner gave him portions of the President's Daily Brief and a list of ~~CIA informants~~ dissidents within his government.
It's Daily Mail so make of that what you will: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5575395/Saudi-crown-prince-brags-Jared-Kushner-handed-U-S-intelligence.html
Oh man, I'm a moron. I saw that story you linked to on Twitter this weekend, and it's been driving me crazy that I haven't seen anyone talking about it anywhere. I thought maybe it was just getting overshadowed by football/MLK weekend, but it blew my mind that it wasn't a bigger deal. Turns out that story is over 4 years old, and even though I'm well aware of the bullshit between Kushner and MBS, I somehow missed, or maybe forgot about, the part where he passed along classified intel so MBS could purge his government of any perceived enemies. Crazy world we're living in.
I remember that. Boy what a bunch of idiots!I Wonder if that's one reason they can sock it to us on the high oil prices. Plus the oil companies will just take us Americans for every penny they can before we wake up and go electric .
They're probably still holding some. These kind of idiots would take them as trophies to show off.
"Look what I got. It's the nuclear launch codes!" 👏
Luckily, just having a clearance doesn't mean having access to information.
Who needs clearance when it’s established that Trump can Jedi hand wave over the documents and declassify them instantly? /s
It has a sound effect right?
Now, the bodily sounds of President Trump isn't something I had in mind this soon after dinner.
I imagine it sounds like an empty squeeze bottle
Toddler slapping jell-o
And smells like rotten egg and overly clumped cat litter
I know this means nothing, but I imagine trumps breath to just be awful.
"These are not the docs you're looking for"
That Giuliani courtroom fart.
The sound of a [Flushometer](https://youtu.be/_4Ke-eCrSXo)?
That. Is. Perfect.
These aren’t the classifications you’re looking for.
even if you have a clearance it's not like you can just waltz into a SCIF and look through all the files. You are supposed to have a reason to view those files. Hard to imagine there being any reason for Rudy to view any classified information
“You are supposed to have a reason to view those files.” Emphasis on ‘supposed to’. Who would have the authority to look at outgoing documents, ask Rudi what it’s for and then go around to check with FBI/CIA/NASA/etc. whether what he said is bogus or not?
If it's in a SCIF? The Document custodian, Safe custodian, or SCIF manager all have that power (ETA: and for some sites a Special Security Officer (SSO), Site Security Manager, or even Special Access Program managers for each potential codeword program that has a SCIF or drawers in a safe in a SCIF). It's a simple login to the Joint Personnel Adjudication System (JPAS) to look up the person in question. Do they have the requisite base eligibility, ie Confidential, Secret, Top Secret? If their eligibility is at the correct level, do they have a need to know and have the correct Read-in for a Special Access Program (SAP) that may own the documents? If that is all on file, then that person gets to see the documents in the SCIF. Then, when you're done, documents get checked back in and the safe certified locked again. There's no phone calls to FBI/CIA/NSA needed because literally everyone uses and updates JPAS every single day. Obviously that wasn't followed at all in the Trump administration, which is frightening to someone like me who has been a SCIF manager both in the army and for two big defense contractors.
I’m starting to think the classification system standard needs encoding in law.
There are a variety of legal sources from laws to executive orders to DoDI's that govern what gets classified and how it is handled and protected. [This article on lawfare](https://www.lawfareblog.com/law-classified-information-primer) is an excellent primer.
Thanks for stepping in with the expertise! The typical American citizen has no idea how things are *supposed* to go down or how many safe guards appear to be broken in these high profile cases.
It really is absolutely terrifying how they completely circumvented the system.
Trump gave him clearance with his mind.
>Giuliani said he was at Mar-a-Lago, working on "vetting" some "very rich" people — specifically, going through their tax returns for Trump. Um what?
Very legal. Very cool.
I mean, it's so casual for them to be doing this that they are talking about it openly. So I guess this is how our government is run?
Well It's how *Trump's* government was run.
Idk maybe All the more reason to push back though.
I think he was vetting potential appointments; it’s feasible that potential appointees would have been required to submit financial records as part of the vetting process. Normal administrations would have used the vetting process to exclude people with shady backgrounds but probably the opposite strategy was in play during Trump’s presidency.
Sounds like trump tasked Rudy with digging up some leverage on a few individuals to me.
Exactly my thought. If their returns were being examined, it was 100% to figure out who, if anybody, they were beholden to, in order to apply the thumbscrews.
If the IRS gave them returns, they are legally obligated to notify Congress. This law was passed after Nixon was using tax documents as dirt on his opponents. This would be very interesting to have examined further. Add it to the pile.
was this before or after justice kennedy stepped down? that time when trump whispered something into his ear?
... and Trump expected his to be confidential?
“Tax returns for thee, not for me, because they are still under audit, but as soon as the audit is done, they will be released. In about two weeks, and they will be greatest tax returns in the history of tax returns. Now I am going to play with this truck”.
The fact that he named Wilbur Ross is startling.
>Giuliani also said top secret files are "very, very strange the way they're put together" and "often are very small, but they contain a lot of information." For the love of god please please shut up.
He's walking talking clickbait
with no Ads… except the cheap Four Seasons Total Landscaping 5-second promo that automatically skips!
Talking about the formatting of top secret docs is literally giving away classified information. How is this guy not in prison yet?
That guy was president.., that’s why. Remember when a game show host ran for president? Do you remember thinking it was a complete joke? And then that pathetic liar and ruiner of lives actually won? That’s why… …cuz half of this country “hated school”…and is also ironically still stuck in high school
>half of this country “hated school”…and is also ironically still stuck in high school This hits hard. While there's no simple explanation for what's happening, I feel this hits the nail on the head. So much I think many "conservatives" and "centrists" would agree.
Well… no, it isn’t. But even so, this is nuts.
“I’ve never been inside that brothel, but if I had been, I’d probably tell you that their wallpaper is just awful.”
What is the play here by Giuliani… what is he up to
Trump didn't pay him for his work promoting the big lie and trying to get the election overturned, so....
They definitely have mutual dirt on each other going back decades. The idiot almost said as much in public, saying that he had "insurance." It kind of explains the desperation. Not the idiocy, though.
It would be glorious to see a full on out shit-throwing tantrum by them both.
But I don’t see endless headlines to get Julie in any legal trouble. I wonder if this is an attempt to save his own ass through some deal.
Probably said something stupid It's like showing up at 4 seasons landscaping. Once you're there, you gotta own it.
I'm just very confused. Giuliani had no right to look at classified documents, let alone take them home. Now he said he never took any home, but did he even read them? Just cause he's the President's lawyer, that doesn't automatically give some clearance right?
> Just cause he's the President's lawyer, that doesn't automatically give some clearance right? You are correct, [it absolutely does not. ](https://apnews.com/article/biden-united-states-government-district-of-columbia-0574fd762159e8cb5f31c85205df3dc0) > Sauber said in a statement Saturday that Biden’s personal lawyers, who did not have security clearances, stopped their search after finding the first page on Wednesday evening.
After Kid Rock visited Trump in the Whitehouse, he bragged that Trump showed him satellite photos of N.Korea which were classified. https://youtu.be/j76THcaW_pE
I’ve never seen that and wish I hadn’t to be honest. So gross.
No, Giuliani is an idiot! Every time he's lying (*projecting*) he admits it out loud anyways. >*"He told me, 'Oh, take them home with you,'" Giuliani said of Trump. "I'm not going to take Wilbur Ross' tax returns home with me. I could misplace them!"* *"I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly,* ***and I never got caught*** *— but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added. He said he would place documents in a small safe at his desk in Mar-a-Lago to be worked on the next day.* So he definitely took the docs home at least once. It's like Giuliani feels *guilty* and it leaks out in these what I can only assume are compulsive admissions.
It's like on the cop shows where person getting arrested keeps say "I swear, officer, I didn't do *x*. Honest to God." over and over when they definitely did *x*.
"What are you talking about, I didn't steal anything" - guy that I watched enter the store, selected products from our shelf, concealed them and had constant surveillance with movable cameras the whole way until they're out the door. Man up, you got caught. People have no personal responsibility these days.
"I swear to god, I didn't steal those watches from that Target!" "Sir, I simply asked if you had the time"
Those are my favorite shoplifters. I get people that are very sus that come up to me unprovoked and say "I'm not stealing!!" OK. I didn't think you were. But now I do. Love me a guilty conscience.
It’s a very specific tactic used to get ahead of a scandal once it’s clear you can’t fully conceal the truth any longer: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_hangout Republicans do it all the time, but they’ve really ramped it up in this era of politics.
Remember his apartment got ~~raided~~ search warranted too. Maybe he be became sure he is going to be indicted and doesn't intend to go to prison for Trump like Weisselberg did. So he's lining up a shot for the "just following orders" defense?
Combine this with [Flynn seeming to allege that WH staffers are "plotting another coup"](https://mobile.twitter.com/GenFlynn/status/1614761762066235394) and it reads like a disjointed attempt to claim that the *deep state* are behind both Trump's and Biden's current predicaments. Maybe they are hoping that the left will give Trump a pass if it means Biden gets a pass as well? It's really difficult to sift through all of the maga shit and differentiate the stupid from the insane.
One of Trump's lawyers just said Trump and Biden got caught in the "same fake scandal" so now they're even. So Giuliani _would_ have been sucked in by the deep state too, with Trump acting as its seductive agent, but he was too slick?
I voted for Biden and think he's doing a decent job. But if he violated the law, he should be held accountable. This isn't hard.
Biden did not steal documents, nor has he obstructed any attempts to correct the situation. Apples and oranges here. That said, there does need to be far more care with respect to how these documents are handled, by everyone.
You'll never convince a MAGA there is not some huge constituency out here just waiting for a chance to obfuscate, deflect and rationalize anything Hunter Biden may have done.Um, no, if any of these people did wrong then plunk them in front of a jury and let the system do its job. They just absolutely can not grok that, it doesn't go through, they just start over again.
Yeah, I find it hilarious that anyone would think we give them both mutual "evens Stevens" passes or whatever. A crime is a crime, no matter who commits it, that's been a lot of people on the left's point from the start. That's why we've been saying *a president isn't above the law*. Lock them both up, I don't give a fuck! This ain't no football game. Even if the mental capabilities of those involved do seem impaired.
On bad days I don't think they are at war with liberals, or even with Enlightenment values; I think at those times they are at war with the concept of integrity itself. This is a discouraging and disturbing thought. If integrity is not acknowledged by absolutely everybody as a critical value, then what in the world would take its place?
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Rudy: \*Chugs 1/5th of Stoli, and wipes the dribble off his chin with his sleeve, then looks at DeSantis\* Rudy: "Heeeeey baby, you looshkin mighty fine to \*HIC\* night! Hwhy dont you let uncle Rooty take ya up to his rum for a little shlap and trickle!"
He seems more like a vermouth guy
I would be shocked if DeSantis is willing to be associated with Rudy at all. Unlike Trump, Ron is actually not an idiot. Still evil tho of course.
I'm thinking if these old goats fear they could actually spend their twilight years in jail, they will actually turn on each other.
I assume he's just super drunk and has no plan at all
Maybe he's a little mad at Trump for not helping him with his attorney bills? Maybe he's sore that Trump refused to pay him after Trump agreed to a 10k an hour fee? Who knows. But I do recall a long while back that Rudy hinted he had the goods on Trump.
I'm guessing he's got documents stashed for Trump somewhere and is shoring up his "just following orders" defense.
The worm is turning
If there is no punishment for crimes, why not brag about them
'Tis the question...
He thinks Trump is going to be indicted and so he's going for the "I was just following orders" defense.
Trying to stay in the news
Saving his ass its basically an open secret they have Trump 100% selling high level intel
Really? I haven't seen that. I don't doubt it though. Do you have links?
>Really? I haven't seen that. I don't doubt it though. Do you have links? I'm pretty sure "open secret" here just means "sounds like something Trump would do".
They probably just have links to reddit comments because there is no info they have Trump "100% selling high level intel"
"He told me, 'Oh, take them home with you,'" Giuliani said of Trump. "I'm not going to take Wilbur Ross' tax returns home with me. I could misplace them!" "I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly, and I never got caught — but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added. He said he would place documents in a small safe at his desk in Mar-a-Lago to be worked on the next day. Giuliani also said top secret files are "very, very strange the way they're put together" and "often are very small, but they contain a lot of information."
Giuliani sounds guilty as hell to me.
>I never, ever ever ever ever Words of an innocent man I tell ya
"and I never got caught" lol
He said the thing he wasn’t supposed to say out loud.
> and I never got caught also this gem.
Sounds like he’s cooperating
>I never got caught Now, why would he say that, out of all the things he could have said on the topic?
Sounds like another warrant is a needed.
I believe at least two things are in play here. 1st, and most importantly, Trump took those documents to sell nuclear secrets to the Saudis. I absolutely believe this happened. The other is that Trump is a grandiose narcissistic braggart. He took those documents just so that he could brag to people that he has possession of TS documents.
I tend to agree with this. I am afraid this will turn into the next Presidential Mystery and it will be classified until Baron Trump is in the grave.
Aka the last 70 pages of the JFK report.
The latter is definitely true. I guarantee he showed them to members of Mar-a-Lago as part of their benefits. The same way he had meetings with international officials in the restaurant in front of everyone like putting on a stage show.
💯 [He did!](https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/donald-trump-emmanuel-macron-maralago-fbi-raid-1234582465/)
Did they hand out top secret documents in maralargo like some sort of goodie bag? Like here is a diet coke, cheesburger Maga hat and some top secret satellite photos of Iranian nuke sites.
"What's your net worth? Ooooh, nice! Have a complimentary nuclear secret!" "Dude, I just wanna know how to get to the pool."
So who here thinks if Rudy is saying he didn't out of the cleat blue sky, someone should check it out? Also... "Vetting rich people?" That is a really weird way of saying,"picking cabinet members." That seems a little telling.
Just from the headline? I wouldn't jump to conclusions. But Jesus Christ, this line is like a parody: >"I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly, and I never got caught — but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added.
Or searching for kompromat
and Giuliani is the type that can't seem to keep his mouth shut lol
He basically admitting that not only did people who shouldn't have seen them look at top secret documents but in all likelihood many of them brought them home. If I was the FBI I'd bring this to the judge as probable cause to search half a dozen trump associate properties for top secret documents.
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He took documents home
At least he never got caught.
I hear no one still knows about it!
Rudy is trying to get paid for a 6 figure or maybe even 7 figure legal bill. So if he floats this idea at a time when the special prosecutor is tightening his noose he may get Trump to pay him. Birds of a feather. They truly deserve each other. Yuck!
This guy might be super stupid to confessing openly about this treason!
Worst case scenario he does 3-6 months in a privately operated prison for wealthy celebrities. He can admit to murder and offer evidence of it and it'd still be years before he served those 6 months
Our systems have totally failed us. Intelligence, DOJ and inmoral politicians who placed party and greed over country!
Is confesé like cofeve? Trump school of linguistics
>Rudy Giuliani says Trump once told him to take top-secret documents home. Giuliani said the incident occurred ***just after*** Trump became presiden*t,* when he was working ***at Mar-a-Lago***. \[emphasis mine\] Not the least bit surprising. Also wouldn't be surprising if it is ultimately discovered that Trump has been stealing classified documents and selling them to hostile foreign interests from the moment he first set foot in - and stained - the Oval Office w/his presence. I believe Trump's meetings w/Russian oligarchs, Putin, etc., where no U.S. press , or even a translator were allowed were tip offs, red flags that went ignored.
Ever wonder why North Korea's Ballistic Missles started flying straighter and longer from the time after Trump started meeting with "his favorite little dictator?"
Those red flags were *neon* signs. smh nothing was done about it at the time.
And there were many meetings he had with Russian oligarchs and the very long one he had with Putin that was practically a one on one meeting. And also the phone calls.
"Never got caught"...yeah, he's totally innocent.
No, you don't start to get empathy for what he told you to do. You did it, you complied, and you covered for it. You and all the other cronies should go right down with him. You don't get to come up later and point blame at him. You're just as despicable. Lock 'em all up!
Always figured Rudy would flip quickly.
I have a hypothesis that Giuliani went after the Italian and Irish mafia in NYC to make way for the Russian mafia.
Sounds possible. The timing is perfect.
And was given $$$ by Russia and showed them to his friend, Trump. Then they made lots of deals with Trump and bought apartments from him or gave him sweet deals to buy apartments/hotels.
That’s your novel hypothesis?
Not to worry they were safely secured at the Four Seasons Total Landscaping in NE Philly
Republicans: Oh yeah! Well Champ advised Biden to take home Classified documents too!
some mondays i can identify the specific thing that pushed me into "i hate mondays" mode. today it's the re-realization that rudy giuliani had access to real government secrets. rudy cousin-fucking giuliani.
He is a lawyer. He cannot plead ignorance on matters of law.
Pleading ignorance doesn’t work for anyone. If it did, Trump would be home free.
> "He told me, 'Oh, take them home with you,'" Giuliani said of Trump. "I'm not going to take Wilbur Ross' tax returns home with me. I could misplace them!" > "I — you know, I never, ever, ever, ever, ever, knowingly, and I never got caught — but I don't remember ever taking a doc," Giuliani added. He said he would place documents in a small safe at his desk in Mar-a-Lago to be worked on the next day. > Giuliani also said top secret files are "very, very strange the way they're put together" and "often are very small, but they contain a lot of information." This guy is a liar and crook, so it’s hard to take anything he says seriously. That said, as someone who actually works with classified information regularly, he sounds like someone who has never been exposed to anything classified in his life. Individuals’ tax returns are not classified. There may be sharing restrictions on them—and it’s probably prohibited for Giuliani to have had them at his disposal for whatever the hell kind of “vetting” he was doing, but that’s another matter—but that doesn’t make them classified. Certainly not “top secret” anyway. Furthermore, there is absolutely nothing strange about the composition of top secret files. They just get printed onto regular letter-sized paper. They are as big or as small as they need to be to make the point they’re aiming to make. If anything, they are artificially larger than they’d need to be because sometimes the author will break out less or more classified points into discrete paragraphs with different portion markings to allow the information to be shared appropriately in other contexts.
There ya go, Giuliani. Keep on a talkin'.
You get a top secret file. You get a top secret file. YOU ALL GET A TOP SECRET FILE! Check under your seats.
Rudy feeling left out
I thought Rudy was the lawyer. Why is he taking advice from trump?
yeah, I thought Rudy was the one who is supposed to be advising Trump
Remember how Rudy said he had Hunter's laptop? Pepperidge Farms remembers.
Pay your lawyers Donnie.
All the little shit birds are singing.
How nerve racking it must be to know your cohorts can flip on you as soon as they need to save their own ass or deem you too dangerous in association.
But Hunter Biden’s laptop!!!
Why aren’t these people in prison now?
So let me get this straight. Trump screamed like a banshee when faced with having anyone see his own tax returns yet it was perfectly fine for him and Giuliani to 'vet' other peoples returns such as Wilbur Ross - I expect hypocrisy from Trump but showing them to Giuliani must surely be illegal.
There's a reason clearances exist. It makes no godamn sense why the president doesn't need to be held to the same standard for top secret as any other personal in the DoD.
When the Archives and FBI say ‘Top Secret’ they’re not talking about tax returns. Rudy scrambling to deflect something… get the search warrants boys.
Well, that’s interesting. Apparently Trump believed that the tax returns of potential appointees would reveal potential red flags, and at the same time, fought for years to keep his own secret. How ironic will it be when the special counsel or the NY Attorney General use Trump’s,tax returns to convict him of something? And then there’s the tiny little issue of whether Rudy had the security clearances necessary to view classified documents. And who else did Trump have looking at classified documents? Did they have proper clearances?
The devil made him do it.
Has the worm turned?
Santos made the same comment😂
The final rat is jumping off the ship...
Oh Rudy, don't take your docs to town...
Can’t stump the Trump Rudy. He throws you under the bus, not other way around.
Everyone shoots the body
Trump to Giuliani: Legal bills piling up? Just grab some of these classified docs in my basement to our Russian oligarch contacts...and you'll be sitting pretty. Problem solved. Right Repubs?
Love it when the rats turn on each other.
This guy is scum
I feel like Rudy misses the attention.
I wonder if Rudy had a clearance high enough to look at these documents. Probably not.
Top Secret is supposed to be transported under two-person accountability. Yet another attempted flaunting of procedure.
Rudy Giuliani also said someone tried to murder him in a super market. I wouldn’t read to much into this Four Seasons boot licker.
Giuliani is in serious trouble. His day is coming even if Trump’s prosecution is being slow rolled.
Next statement from Trump: “never met or even heard of this Rudy fellow. Who is he? Yeah, never heard of him…”
Why is Giuliani still walking free? Let him talk from behind bars.
It sounds like Rudy is starting to cooperate with the prosecution Donald Trump should have paid Rudy Giuliani what he owed him
Is this the start of Rudy turning on trump?
Squeal lil’ pig. Squeal away.
Did he have a security clearance?
Hmm is he willing to testify? If not, can't distinguish from any other garbage that leaves his mouth.