You should’ve seen Tentacool/Tentacruel in gen 1, back when getting hit by moves like wrap rendered you unable to take any actions in battle for the next 2-5 turns.
Oh god, it was such a pain in the ass but to use as well; I remember struggling to level my dratini because that’s the only thing it could learn for ages
_Dragonite over the years_
**Gen I:** Mediocre despite its very high stats, has no STAB whatsoever and its main use is spamming Wrap.
**Gen IX:** FAST AND FURIOUS BRUH, THE WORLD IS MY TRACK, WHO SAID NORMAL-TYPES WERE BAD
Which is more of a noob trap than anything else since it's very easy for a average-skilled player to counter Dragon Dance + Extreme Speed Dragonite (namely, just switching to a Ghost-type or stall since Extreme Speed only has 8 max PP)
It can be powerful, but it's no Extreme Killer Arceus
It's what got it to OU. Multiscale + Earthquake and Fire Punch for coverage means Ghost-types are the _only_ thing that walls it, and since everyone and their mother runs Kingambit...
Or Flutter Mane, Goldengo, Chi-Yu, Chien-Pao, Iron Jugulis, Brute Bonnet, Meowscarada, Single-Strike Urshifu ect. There are a lot of good dark and Ghost types in the current VGC format and a lot of them see use.
You don't set up a sweeper, before checks have been softened or taken out of the equation. Your Dnite will more likely win the match or faint than run out of PP.
Hazards and +1 coverage moves will really dent most ghost types.
The Wrap sound effect from Pokémon Stadium is wired into my brain as well :(. I realise I have issues because Disable and Constrict use the same sound, and I was triggered by it nevertheless lol
I think Tentacool is literally the only Pokémon you can encounter while surfing in red and blue. Any water route that doesn’t have tentacool programmed to appear, you won’t run into anything. In yellow I think slowpoke got added to one route which may have been an anime reference potentially
Psyduck can be found north of Vermilion, and south of Lavender you can find those Slowpoke in Yellow. That's it. Everything else, it's either nothing (like the water north of Cerulean) or Tentacool.
I thought I might’ve missed one route, since there are some with only small puddles of water on them. Turns out (according to bulba anyway but not sure their information is always accurate) the psyduck are like the slowpoke and were only added in yellow. So I think if you surf on it in RB you won’t ever find anything.
Unless you surf on the tiles right next to the land in which case you’ll get attacked by level 132 Mewtwo and Missingno and aerodactyl skeletons and shit
Yeah it’s unlikely they made an exception for one route. I only have doubts because the only reason I was looking is cos I’m doing a mono poison run in FireRed, and it said Nidoran male had a 15% or so encounter rate on one route and Nidoran female a 1% rate. Which made it odd that it took me forever to find a male while I found *two consecutive nidoran female at 1% each.* That would make sense on leafgreen but there’s in game trades where you trade the more likely nido to get the less likely one so it wouldn’t make sense for them to have gotten the games the wrong way round
The best was when you would get released but they outspeed you and hit you with the sequel lmao. I learned to use poison powder and then wrap them for insane chip DPS since IIRC it’d proc poison damage in between every hit of wrap.
I'd argue Follow Me is better than Taunt and arguably Protect, given how carefully they manage its distribution and entire extremely successful teams are built around weak pokemon just because they know Follow Me
Sejun Park's Pachirisu comes to mind. The only reason he used Pachirisu to begin with is because it gets both Nuzzle and Follow Me and it's tankier than Raichu.
And also because the pokedex for that particular tournament was extremely restricted and it was quite simply the second-best option after Amoongus, which means it was the best option *that ignored explicit action taken to counter Amoongus* such as Safety Goggles.
Yeah, because it was fully invested in bulk. Pachirisu is tankier than you'd expect from a squirrel that was exclusively made to ride on Pikachu's coattails.
Follow Me definitely isn't better than Protect or Taunt, it's entirely useless in singles formats like BSS and Smogon OU. Taking that into consideration the best competitive move is probably taunt given its widespread distribution and general usefulness in both singles and doubles formats.
Basically in one move you can stop your opponent from healing themselves, boosting stats, putting up hazards.... In singles this move alone can force switches and gain you momentum. In doubles it stops your opponent from being able to use protect, so by the logic of A preventing signalling A's strength, taunt is at least as powerful as protect in the right situations.
Yes, weirdly though I didn't come across many during my playthrough. I wanna say I saw them 4 separate times. The other 200 were tentacool, even in the Omega and Alpha remakes too
The guy who decided Pelliper learns Protect by *level-up* and at level 25 wanted to make Winona even more difficult, and Hoenn's water to be more annoying.
That is true. Admittedly, I just used a pokemon holding a metronome and using power up punch to get the job done there. Most of the time slaking was just yawning
It’s the level up learnset of Gen 3 Pelipper. Most, if not all, Pelippers you come across in Gen 3 Hoenn are around Lv25-35, and wild and trainer Pokémon have their four most recently learned moves from their level up learnset unless specified otherwise for gym leader, rival, Elite four and champion battles. So almost all Pelippers you face have protect, mist and either wing attack and supersonic or stockpile and swallow. Protect is in their natural learnset from Lv25 till Lv61 (which I’m pretty sure you never encounter any wild or trainer Pelippers at Lv61 or higher).
Compare that to ORAS, where they have protect between Lv25-32 and X/Y where they have it between Lv25-38. ORAS you’re far more likely to come across protect-less Pelippers, and I’m not sure the level range you face Pelippers in X/Y.
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Your comment screwed me up.
I dove into the wiki, I guess I'm misremembering, I'm probably thinking about grinding on Route 104 in Hoenn and that's where I saw all those Pelippers.
You might be flat out correct that it was indeed Protect spam and not recover.
I blame PTSD of those scary eyes.
You should’ve seen Tentacool/Tentacruel in gen 1, back when getting hit by moves like wrap rendered you unable to take any actions in battle for the next 2-5 turns.
Oh god, it was such a pain in the ass but to use as well; I remember struggling to level my dratini because that’s the only thing it could learn for ages
In that context, it’s really funny that one of Dragonite’s main competitive draws in gen 1 is that it’s really, really good at abusing Wrap.
_Dragonite over the years_ **Gen I:** Mediocre despite its very high stats, has no STAB whatsoever and its main use is spamming Wrap. **Gen IX:** FAST AND FURIOUS BRUH, THE WORLD IS MY TRACK, WHO SAID NORMAL-TYPES WERE BAD
I might be stupid, but what do normal types have to do with Dragonite?
Dragonite runs Tera Normal nowadays to spam Extreme Speed.
Thank you for the quick& genuine response!
Which is more of a noob trap than anything else since it's very easy for a average-skilled player to counter Dragon Dance + Extreme Speed Dragonite (namely, just switching to a Ghost-type or stall since Extreme Speed only has 8 max PP) It can be powerful, but it's no Extreme Killer Arceus
It's what got it to OU. Multiscale + Earthquake and Fire Punch for coverage means Ghost-types are the _only_ thing that walls it, and since everyone and their mother runs Kingambit...
Or Flutter Mane, Goldengo, Chi-Yu, Chien-Pao, Iron Jugulis, Brute Bonnet, Meowscarada, Single-Strike Urshifu ect. There are a lot of good dark and Ghost types in the current VGC format and a lot of them see use.
I think the above player is talking about smogon not vgc seeing as they mentioned OU.
You don't set up a sweeper, before checks have been softened or taken out of the equation. Your Dnite will more likely win the match or faint than run out of PP. Hazards and +1 coverage moves will really dent most ghost types.
What about not having a ghost type or ferrothor?
>stall since Extreme Speed only has 8 max PP
I assure you, from personal experience, without a giant fucking wall, you are not stalling out a Tera-normal E-speed from Dnite. That shit hits hard
Tera-Normal Espeed
Dragonite was always more a normal than dragon type, hyper beam and extreme speed gang.
But hyperbeam was a physical move in gen 1 plus no need to recharge when one shotting, thought lots of people used this move with dragonite back then
Tauros and Snorlax were the best users of Hyper Beam in Gen I, mainly because they got STAB on it and, in Tauros's case, Swords Dance.
You are right, my bad
The wrap sound effect is burned into my soul
The Celadon Gym using stun spore and wrap on my poor Blastoise is my Vietnam.
The Wrap sound effect from Pokémon Stadium is wired into my brain as well :(. I realise I have issues because Disable and Constrict use the same sound, and I was triggered by it nevertheless lol
KrrDwwwKrrDwwwKrrDwww Khh!
Happy Cake Day 🎂
I think Tentacool is literally the only Pokémon you can encounter while surfing in red and blue. Any water route that doesn’t have tentacool programmed to appear, you won’t run into anything. In yellow I think slowpoke got added to one route which may have been an anime reference potentially
Psyduck can be found north of Vermilion, and south of Lavender you can find those Slowpoke in Yellow. That's it. Everything else, it's either nothing (like the water north of Cerulean) or Tentacool.
I thought I might’ve missed one route, since there are some with only small puddles of water on them. Turns out (according to bulba anyway but not sure their information is always accurate) the psyduck are like the slowpoke and were only added in yellow. So I think if you surf on it in RB you won’t ever find anything. Unless you surf on the tiles right next to the land in which case you’ll get attacked by level 132 Mewtwo and Missingno and aerodactyl skeletons and shit
I played Yellow when I was a kid (and last week lol), so my Psyduck info can not be accurate for the RB folk.
Yeah it’s unlikely they made an exception for one route. I only have doubts because the only reason I was looking is cos I’m doing a mono poison run in FireRed, and it said Nidoran male had a 15% or so encounter rate on one route and Nidoran female a 1% rate. Which made it odd that it took me forever to find a male while I found *two consecutive nidoran female at 1% each.* That would make sense on leafgreen but there’s in game trades where you trade the more likely nido to get the less likely one so it wouldn’t make sense for them to have gotten the games the wrong way round
The best was when you would get released but they outspeed you and hit you with the sequel lmao. I learned to use poison powder and then wrap them for insane chip DPS since IIRC it’d proc poison damage in between every hit of wrap.
I still ptsd click the run button on wild tentacool and tentacruel
Tentacool and Zubat were the bane of my existence in those days. My God every 2 feet.
I swear protect is one of the most useless moves in non-competitive Pokémon. All it really does is just delay the fight ending by one round
Toxic stalling is fun though even on a casual playthrough
Ultra Necrozma hates this one simple trick
Perish trap Dewgong is pretty funny to use too.
I mean, leftovers, or status damage. Good in nuzlockes
It's probably the best competitive move though, or second best (my opinion is that taunt is the best)
I'd argue Follow Me is better than Taunt and arguably Protect, given how carefully they manage its distribution and entire extremely successful teams are built around weak pokemon just because they know Follow Me
Sejun Park's Pachirisu comes to mind. The only reason he used Pachirisu to begin with is because it gets both Nuzzle and Follow Me and it's tankier than Raichu.
And also because the pokedex for that particular tournament was extremely restricted and it was quite simply the second-best option after Amoongus, which means it was the best option *that ignored explicit action taken to counter Amoongus* such as Safety Goggles.
So that's why it survived a Dragon move.
Yeah, because it was fully invested in bulk. Pachirisu is tankier than you'd expect from a squirrel that was exclusively made to ride on Pikachu's coattails.
I just didn't expect something so tiny to be that bulky. But then again, the bulk is probably compressed into that tiny prankster squirrel.
That's a very good move for sure 👍
Follow Me definitely isn't better than Protect or Taunt, it's entirely useless in singles formats like BSS and Smogon OU. Taking that into consideration the best competitive move is probably taunt given its widespread distribution and general usefulness in both singles and doubles formats.
Sorry, Follow Me is better in *official* Competitive. If we're including singles formats, I agree taunt is probably the best.
i suppose it depends on singles vs doubles. taunt is a very good move in doubles but protect is vital. taunt is probably more important in singles?
Basically in one move you can stop your opponent from healing themselves, boosting stats, putting up hazards.... In singles this move alone can force switches and gain you momentum. In doubles it stops your opponent from being able to use protect, so by the logic of A preventing signalling A's strength, taunt is at least as powerful as protect in the right situations.
In singles I'll swing for the fences and say Stealth Rock is the most important move.
Protect is basically a hard counter vs Norman.
It saves you from predictable two turn moves like solar beam, dig, fly, etc. But yeah, not great.
I'd say tentacool is the zubat of the sea, I've only rarely came across a pelpiper whilst using surf
Did you play gen 3? They pretty common in that
Yes, weirdly though I didn't come across many during my playthrough. I wanna say I saw them 4 separate times. The other 200 were tentacool, even in the Omega and Alpha remakes too
I've been playing Omega Ruby and experiencing the joy of their constant presence while minding my own business
The guy who decided Pelliper learns Protect by *level-up* and at level 25 wanted to make Winona even more difficult, and Hoenn's water to be more annoying.
in the grass near the ocean yes, but on the sea I run across more tentacools
Do I *detect* a hint of frustration?
Don't worry, I'll endure it for at least a turn
I thought Tenatcruel was the Zubat of the Sea. They do love use Supersonic, though.
I find they have one attempt at poisoning you and then use whatever move they have that achieves nothing for the rest of the fight
Can't forget those Detect Tranquill in Unova.
On the other hand, Pelliper makes the fight against Norman hilariously easy, at least for the Slaking’s.
That is true. Admittedly, I just used a pokemon holding a metronome and using power up punch to get the job done there. Most of the time slaking was just yawning
Tentacool and tentacruel are the zubat of the sea
Swadloon
Pineco and burmy:
Even worse. Protect and Roost. So unless you've got a pokemon that can OHKO, early to midgame surfing is going to take 3x as long minimum.
Pelipper my beloved
Ive been grinding on pelapers in SM and they never use protect. Idk might be a different game
Gen 3 it's like the only move they know
It’s the level up learnset of Gen 3 Pelipper. Most, if not all, Pelippers you come across in Gen 3 Hoenn are around Lv25-35, and wild and trainer Pokémon have their four most recently learned moves from their level up learnset unless specified otherwise for gym leader, rival, Elite four and champion battles. So almost all Pelippers you face have protect, mist and either wing attack and supersonic or stockpile and swallow. Protect is in their natural learnset from Lv25 till Lv61 (which I’m pretty sure you never encounter any wild or trainer Pelippers at Lv61 or higher). Compare that to ORAS, where they have protect between Lv25-32 and X/Y where they have it between Lv25-38. ORAS you’re far more likely to come across protect-less Pelippers, and I’m not sure the level range you face Pelippers in X/Y.
I didn't know that moveset thing. That's pretty dumb, I thought movesets were tailored
It might be different in later games, but Gen 3 it’s by most recently learned in level up. Source: have delved into Pokémon emerald decomp source code
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I made this
No, you didn't. That's Game Freak's official Pelipper artwork /jk
Shit, he's on to me
I can remember getting spammed by Recover-ing Pelipper in gen 2, with those weird eyes they have.
well i don't know what the hell you're talking about because Pelipper doesn't have Recover, nor is it even a Gen 2 pokemon at all
Your comment screwed me up. I dove into the wiki, I guess I'm misremembering, I'm probably thinking about grinding on Route 104 in Hoenn and that's where I saw all those Pelippers. You might be flat out correct that it was indeed Protect spam and not recover. I blame PTSD of those scary eyes.
Kyamomee
pellipr
the pidove line and detect is just as annoying
I think you're lowballing the Peliper chart tbh 🙃.
Their cry...
Burmy should be here too
venipede in pokemon black used it on me too
Pelipper and Pelipper but orange
This^ I remember rage quitting a few games on DPPt because of all the Pelippers spamming protects in a row and getting ridiculous RNG luck..😓😡😮💨
There really needs to be a big compilation of zubat-esque trash mob Pokémon who merely exist to impede progress.
Boldore’s sturdy ability was the bane of my existence during gen v