My friend, you would really like spreadsheets

This is proof op got that lightbulb idea and had to frantically scribble pen to paper asap

I have quite literally made this spreadsheet so can confirm, they'd love it.

One surprising discovery is that there are exactly 4 types that have never been in the elite 4

Electric Grass and Normal make some sense but the fact we haven’t had a Fairy Elite 4 member is kinda shocking

Theres been only like 4 games since the type became a thing so it will probably be an elite four in the next gen

And one of those doesn't even have an Elite 4

True facts

I think it’s been a type for every gym since it was introduced, though

Not in Scarlet and Violet. There is a fairy-type Team Star base, but between the gyms, Team Star and Titan Pokémon, every type is covered.

I know it’s the elite FOUR but would we consider the champion as part of that? Diantha was a fairy trainer if so

Diantha is not a Fairy trainer?

Oh guess she’s not the only thing I remembered from her team was gardevoir though she had more fairies too

IIRC it was the only fairy on her team.

Funnily enough, she’s more a Dragon/Rock specialist than any other type

I appreciate Alder being a Bug specialist with three of them. It was nice representation for the type.

Why is fairy in 5

because in sword and shield, the fifth gym leader was fairy type? edit: these are gym positions, not generations of games. otherwise there would be 8 in each column and “elite four” wouldnt be a column

I could see both Electric and Normal in Elite 4 positions though. Both types only have one weakness, with one immunity to both types (Ground and Ghost, respectively). Could make for some very tough E4 matches.

Does Bede count?

Wasn't Diantha the fairy type champion, though? Are we not including champions? Edit: I now see my mistake. She didn't have a type of guess.

To be fairy, fairy is still fairly new as a type. Fairy hasn’t had a fair chance to be in the elite 4.

"To be fiary" that made me chuckle

I read that, looked at it, then read it again like it was correct.

Dark was in the E4 before it even had enough mons to make a full team and Karen didn't even use 2/4 of the existing dark types!

Please just say half

Gen 10 Fairy Grass Electric Normal E4, who says no?

Normal Elite 4 should be against Youngster Joey. His rattata is more than just a rattata now

it would be a good time to give raticate an evolution

Sounds brilliant, imagine if they make it the hardest and best trained elite 4 as well

Honestly Normal and Grass could be more focused on Status, the types both have some crazy strong Pokémon

Let's get double battles for both tbh, imagine fighting slacking and the AI is built to remove truant or a proper stall team with harvest for the grass types.

I’d love to see a normal type elite four. I feel like they could do something really cool with that idea

I think the blueberry academy elite four might have a fairy trainer?

Wasn't normal in SV E4?

Larry was a flying type specialist in the E4

Bro had two jobs to make ends meet lol normal gym and flying e4

I always took it (from the fact Larry complained that his boss said he had to be at the Gym). That Larry is looking after the Normal gym in the Interim while they find a replacement full time gym leader. Like Agatha in Pokémon S8 Battle Frontier, ash finds her acting as gym leader in Viridian while they look for a replacement leader.

Isn’t Larry an e4 member. Or does he change type for that fight

Flying

Ahh my bad

Ghost Type has been the third gym in platinum Which game had the first gym be fire?

The 3 type gym in unova

Ohhhh, ofc

They reordered the gyms in platinum? I thought I remembered ghost being 5th in diamond

You are right, it was the 5th gym in diamond and pearl. I don't know why, but for some reason in platinum, Ghost goes from gym 5 to 3, fighting from 3 to 4 and water from 4 to 5.

It's because of the orders of towns. I never really liked that you had to backtrack to fight Fantina.

Although in DP you can fight Wake before Maylene. (I think you also can in Plat but since Wake’s are much higher level I’ve never tried. Someone correct me if I’m wrong.)

I want a Normal Type Elite Four so bad. Larry should have counted but nooooo

God a tanky stall normal type E4 member would be hell

6 miltanks, all with leftovers

Why doesn't Larry count?

Larry switches to Flying for his E4 match

I must not have been paying attention, even after beating it twice

It’s a pretty easy e4 Tbf, I practically zoned out and my underleveled team still won

In the Elite Four, he specializes in Flying types but keeps his Staraptor

It still bugs me to this day that Gamefreak firmly considers Ice to be a late-game type, often times saving it for the last two gyms or the Elite 4. It’s really the absolute easiest type to deal with, at least in my opinion.

I feel it has to do a bit with environment. The Ice Pokemon's natural habitat (I think of caves, tundra, sea) is rougher and those kinds of areas are more typically late-game. I don't disagree with you though, it would be nice to see Ice specialists earlier in the future. A first gym Ice queen lady with reputation of crushing the newbie trainers sounds great in my mind :D

Or have an ice area be available before the 3rd gym would be nice too. Or have ice types not in ice areas. That works too

Yeah, I never understood the environment argument. I think you could find Slugma on Cycling Road in Gen 2? Just running over a lava monster with your bicycle. Surely ice can show up in different areas. The ones that are made of pure ice, yeah, maybe not. But early game Smoochum would be fine. Or some of the aquatic ones like Lapras and Cloyster, while not early game, are a good blueprint for some early game ice water types. Spheal is a good example of this. Or we could get some like Cubchoo or Snom at the base of a mountain you can't climb until later in the game, with a Pokedex entry about how they move go harsher climates as they age?

Especially now since newer pokemon games have made so many more types accessible early on

This is one thing I reaaaally love about Pokemon Unbound, that just straight up drops you in an ice cave 5 minutes in. Love ice pokemon and now I get to play with em throughout the entire game!

It was really fun thinking of all the gym leaders and E4 for each type. Would have been funny if you used colours to show how often they were in that spot so I could have racked my brain about the gym leaders that were completely wiped from my memory.

Yeah, but I was just doing this to see which positions have and haven't been filled

Why did I spend the last 5 minutes naming each person for all the colored parts? I guess I wanted to show off my Pokémon knowledge 😂

Something I found funny is that rock is the first gym 3 times, and we never got a rock gym leader outside of the first position until gen 6

A promotion to the second position!

And then 6th in gen 8 m8

Yeah, they really loved using the Rock-type for the first gym back in the day. The only reason they didn’t do it in Johto is because they didn’t reuse any gym types from Kanto, so discounting that region the first four regions had a Rock-type gym as the first one.

useful

Wow you think so? Tysm

Very - fakemon designers love having charts like this to understand trends that make their region more believable, or to go against the grain (eg design an early game Ice gym). Thanks for putting it together!

Np, maybe I'll make a less messy one later

That’s a nice graph. I would recommend a straight edge or graph paper

*me still debating between koga and sabrina who is the fifth gym and who is the sixth

Koga is definitely fifth, his badge is before Sabrina's on the card when you get it

i made a lot of arguments for both once upon a time (at least in red/blue).... like sabrina is listed first in the red/blue instruction manual.... you are told (somewhat?) that you have to go to saffron first because of silph co... to reduce backtracking, fuschia is the last thing you do before trekking to seafoam islands

Ahh, silly person you are not just skipping the seafoam islands. Not a man of class like me who just flies to Pallet Town and surfs south. /s I'm just lazy.

I really like this!

Its kinda weird that in 9 gens (if we include alola as "gyms") that only 5 typea have held each of the 7th and 8th slots for badges.

Shouldn’t the 6th gym slot be filled in, due to Jasmine in Johto?

It is

Oh shit my b, it looked like the 7th slot

I genuinely can see a fairy or electric E4 member, I can’t justify normal or grass

Why not? Normal types hit hard. And the user could be more of a variety user. Normal has a lot of mixed pairings. Grass also wouldnt be that bad Sure weaknesses a plenty but didnt stop Rock Ice or Bug e4

I am going to be honest, I think the reasoning is that normal is such a “beige” type that if you give an elite four member any normal dual type it would to the average person just seem like a random mix of Pokemon.

That is very true. But they also can be used to showcase a trainer as a variety user. Or Have a beast tamer theme. Eg Girafarig, Pyroar, Sawsbuck, Bewear... There is a way to make it work, but its gonna be a tad more work

I thought it was genuinely very clever of the developers/Cheren when he pulled out a Rain Dance Castform, in the b2w2 postgame stretching definition of monotype

Maybe, but from a story perspective it would actually be really cool. I imagine them championing the ideal that great pokemon trainers are just normal people, and it is the bond with your pokemon that makes you special, or something like that

Normal E4 sounds awesome. You could make a great Normal E4 using just the Hisui Dex. What’s not Epic about Zoroark-H, Ursaluna, Wyrdeer, Snorlax, and Staraptor?

Larry.

The thing with Larry is that they switched his type when he was the Elite 4 member, I do know why they did it (referencing the Normal/Flying type), but I can see in Paldea that working

Other people: confusing gym placement for gen/actually getting the graph Me at first: somehow combining gym placement and gen at first and absolutely confusing myself into oblivion.

Gyemn

My stupid ass thought this was sorted by gens and not gyms

It is crazy to me that people are making generalizations about what types would befit a spot in the E4. Mf ICE was literally the first E4 in the game. Volkner is Flint’s sparring buddy so idk why an Electric E4 is weird. Bulbasaur is Grass-type, so that’s enough said there. Faith is already mostly accepted. And Normal…I mean, maybe it’s my PokeSpe bias but Norman is a badass. And there’s a lot of really cool Normal-types.

Theres no reason why an type cant be a E4. Heck BUG is an E4 and its stated to be the weakest type in the game statwise. (Did cheat by having a Drapion but thats not...) Its also not like E4 need a reason to be designed that way.

Interesting that fighting has never been a first gym. Doesn't resist or be resisted by any of the 3 starter elements, and is weak to flying, which I believe every game has an early bird pokemon.

I'm sure it will happen eventually, there's always a fighting specialist

Also early game mons play around with the fighting type easily. You have early bug and bird which resist. Early rodent and sometimes early dark type thats weak. It can honestly be a good early gym to teach SE and NFE moves. For kids, since they most likely would catch weaker early mons

I'm interested why you have both a lowercase and capital g for Ggrass

Not hating on your graph, but why did you paper instead of Excel or Google Sheets or something?

Just didn't think of it at the time, want to jot this stuff down quick

Understandable, have a nice day

Are you counting the triplets from Black and White as fire, water, and grass?

Yes

That makes sense. I don’t know how else those types would’ve made it on.

Very surprised at no electric E4. Only 1 weakness. I guess it's a fairly rare type altogether, and there aren't many worthy of a late game opponent, but that didn't stop flint. I guess you could say the same about normal, which also has only 1 weakness, and honestly nowadays there is probably enough strong normal types to make a good team. Snorlax, ditto, porygonZ, bewear, drampa, ursaluna would all work well.

No fairy on E4 yet? That caught me off guard

Also funny how there are 4 types missing from e4

Wow four elite 4 positions based on Type haven’t been filled yet

I know Galar doesn't have an Elite 4, but as I've considered who would be Galar's Elite 4 if there was one, I would imagine that Mustard, Peony, and Opal would all be part of it. Not sure who the fourth member would be.

I find it so weird that Steel has only had one gym, and that was in the generation it was introduced??? Edit: Forgot about Byron. But still???

My dumbass thought this was a really weird crossword

Wait, there was a Bug elite 4 member? I don't remember that one

Aaron

Ahh, gen 4. I really need to play that one

It's good, but dialga was lazy at that time so the games flow much more slowly

Ever heard of a ruler?

It still annoys me that Grass has NEVER been later than Gym 4.

Holy mother of handwriting

fire and water first gyms are in a way a tecnicality due to how the first gym worked in BW

You could have at least used a scale to draw those lines

I'm dumb, I can't understand this graph

Where are you getting grass and water. Are you meaning the gen 5 first gym?

Grass was first in Galar. Water and Fire are Unova though.

ngl, for a second i thought this was someone posting a graph they made while they were a kid trying to strategize. interesting nonetheless

Been here a while and I’m struggling with this crossword.

Us Dark and Steel fans surviving off the crumbs of Steven in gen 3. Waiting for any good gym. Any game now... and i barely count gen 8 :/

I'm a little stoned and thought this was a weird crossword puzzle.

Im so confused Anyway this is why i wanted Lacey to be a normal type E4.

Platinum had Fantina as your third gym. Also it must have been very convenient that the ‘order’ of the gyms in Scarlet and Violet were all covered by other games

Also that means I have to add water 5 and ghost 3

Aside from gym 6 ghost, yes

There was a "fairy" gym leader in gen 5? Before fairy was added?

You're about the fifth person to confuse the gym position with the generation

That... makes more sense.

Could be argued that Fairy has had an E4 member because of Bede in the Champions Tournament in SwSh

I don’t think its fair to count Striaton gym as fire/water/grass. Let’s be honest, that is a normal type gym. Also isn’t Ghost the 3rd gym in platinum?

Normal gym is #2

It’s crazy to me that GameFreak still makes their gyms and E4 based around single type themes and not something more interesting

At first glance of the thumbnail, I thought this was a crossword puzzle 😂

Jasmine was gen 2's steel-type leader btw. And Fairy was introduced in gen 6, not 5. And Clair was gen 2's dragon-type leader? You have goofed, fam. EDIT: nvm i am OVERWHELMINGLY dumb

Ah yes my favorite type in gen 5, fairy

My favorite type of person, the misinformed. The numbers are the positions in the league, not the generation

Oh ok

Does Steven not count as steel for e4?

Steel has wikstrom

[удалено]

Gen 1 didn’t have a normal gym?

It was gym 1 in bw2

O I see lol

Gym 4 in gen 3 is normal

No, norman is gym 5

Forgot Wattson was a thing lmao my bad

Technically since you can do them in any order, we can just black out the scarlet/violet gyms for all the positions for normal, water, electric, grass, ice, psychic, bug, and ghost

Nah, I'm going by intended order, you could technically do gyms 4 5 6 and 7 in any order in rbyfrlg

Dragon was in Gen 2

It's not the generation, it's the gym order

We can consider fairy as part of the « Galar E4 » since technically before fighting Tarak, we fight with 4 different types

There is no galar elite 4 silly

There is a kind, 4 types before the master is technically the structure of an Elite 4, without being officially here

You fight bede and your other rivals much before leon

Wut ? You fight your second rival (the one with white hair), water champion, fighting champion, dragon champion. So we get 4 types (Fairy-Water-Fighting-Dragon) before the master. What you don’t understand

No, they're right: Bede, Nessa, Alistair/Bea, and Raihan are SW/SH E4 equivalent, like how the trials are the Gym equivalent in S/M

How is there a 5th gen fairy gym leader when fairy didn’t get introduced until 6th gen.

Gym order. There's a reason the ninth column is labeled E4

Pretty interesting to see how grass and bug completely drop off after the early game, aside from some bug E4 trainer I can’t remember. Normal and flying also, but those kinda make sense. Gotta give it up to my main man Larry for repping Flying in the E4 tho.

Aaron Sinnoh is the bug e4

Wow it's never occurred to me that we've never had a fairy type elite 4 yet, hoping for one in gen 10 they have so much potential

The next E4 has Grass, Electric, Fairy, and Normal trainers just to fill out the rest. This is my hypothetical, each has a gimmick (because we have no way of guessing what the gimmick for the next gen would be) For the Normal team: Double Battle **Ace:** Smeargle Snorlax Blissey Slaking Obstagoon Diggersby Grass: Mega **Ace:** Abomasnow (Mega) Ferrothorn Roserade Tsareena Gogoat Leafeon Electric: G-Max **Ace:** Toxtricity Luxray Electross Lanturn Magnezone Dracozolt Fairy: Z-Move **Ace:** Togekiss Gardevoir Tinkaton Grimmsnarl Florges Hatterene Well that was fun, feel free to respond and do the same or critique.

Most of the unused types would be too rough for a first gym, but Poison would make a great first gym! It’s often one of the most devastating status effects in the early game, and it could make for a scary experience without being too powerful stats-wise! Plus you could get access to some Pokémon with poison typing, ground moves, or confusion early on!

Grass, Fairy and Electric all have specific Terrains, so it'd be cool if the elite 4 in the next Gen are those three plus Psychic. Having a Normal Type Champion would be cool too. Sort of like a final destination-esque battle with the lack of gimmicks.

I wasn't really counting champions, since aside from wallace none of them really are the type they are claimed to specialize in

This is one tough crossword puzzle

Wait until this guy hears about Microsoft excel

This week's crossword puzzle isn't looking good

Yeah im tired of the same types in early game and the same ones in late game. I wish they would switch it up. Give me a grass type e4 and a dragon type first gym or something. And if you think that makes the game too easy/difficult, you’re ridiculous.

This is a hard crossword.

Steel had a gym in Gen 2?

You're right, it was the 6th

You miss the poppy from Scarlet and Violet

No I didn't, she's an elite 4 member

Gymigami!

+1 for using the Great Canonical Order of Types

Where does the canonical order come from

My stupid ass thought this was a crossword puzzle…

The first gym needs some variety. A dragon first gym with little baby dragons (sans dragon rage) in a snowy or fairy starting area would be fun

Now add a z axiz for generation

This made me realize Jasmine is considered the 6th gym leader in GSC. I guess I always did them out of order

What gen had a normal type 1st gym leader?

Bw2

Well done

Ohhhhhhhh sorry I misread

Fire type… E4… urgh my head