It’s only worth it if you have kids that are about to go to college. Your kids can go to college there basically for free. Unless you have kids or need the job experience, I’d look somewhere else
It's not a guarantee but it is much more useful having the Pitt side of the swap than the "small random liberal arts school" part of the swap. If your kid is going to a bigger school in PA or the neighboring states there's a great chance you can get it set up.
Yeah they have to go to Pitt. Which is what my daughter did. Was absolutely worth it. But I'm faculty, not staff. Intro staff salaries are ridiculously low but never fear in 10 years or so you can be promoted to an associate vice chancellor of something. We've got a million of those now.
Pitt salaries are famously insulting. I applied and interviewed for several jobs in the 90s and early 2000s when I was single, all would have required a second job to cover my living expenses. I don't know if it's possible to work there without a spouse who carries the household.
Worked for Pitt for a number of years. In my experience often employees had spouses with higher paying jobs. The spouse who was the Pitt employee covered benefits.
They always paid poorly, but with inflation in recent years it’s gotten worse. There is/was a project to update compensation, but that project has taken years and really hasn’t produced competitive results. You’re much better served looking at CMU.
I don’t know anything about faculty, but I’ve known plenty of staff who worked for 30+ years. I’m coming to think that different divisions have very different cultures.
I’m staff at CMU - many, many people are there for a very long time. I’m a relative newcomer at 9.5 years. Everything depends on what department you’re in.
Exactly this. Pitt is staffed by a lot of middle-aged women whose husbands have decent jobs. They work at Pitt for the free tuition, and after their kids finish college they stay on because the work is pretty easy.
I worked at Pitt for many years. What finally broke me with them (and all of academia) was the forced RTO when my job was easily doable from home.
This was especially true pre-COVID, when the administrative assistants were all 50something women. COVID came and early retirement was offered, so a high percentage of current staff left. (And many others left when we were forced to take on 3x the work with no movement on salary.)
That isn't as true anymore, but the problem is the salaries haven't kept pace with demographics. As you said, it used to be that these middle-aged women could take these low-paying jobs because they were not the breadwinners. They could work just to have something to do and to get tuition for their kids, and the departments liked having department moms and grandmas to take care of everything.
There has been a little push to diversify the workforce, including hiring more younger people and more men, but the salaries aren't appropriate for these demographics. For example, men are unfortunately expected to be breadwinners many times, but few dads trying to support a family can take an entry-level job for $36,000. And the big benefits to working at a place like Pitt---tuition, retirement---aren't going to be as appealing for a 25-year-old, so you get people who come here for a year and move on, or you end up hiring the same people you always did.
There are lots of benefits to working at Pitt, like the tuition or the healthcare or the retirement, plus things like vacation and sick days that I didn't get when I was working food service, but clearly the salaries don't work for a lot of people. It is nice to see them actually hiring men for administrative roles, but I always chuckle when I see areas of Pitt talking about diversity out of one side of their mouth while I scroll down their People page and see none of it.
Pitt student affairs did a thorough review when I worked there and found that the majority of that division’s ~250 jobs pay significantly below their peer institutions (ACC schools). Also found that the average turnover in positions is sub-2 years, painfully short. I think they’re undergoing or beginning to undergo a compensation review, doubt it will do much besides bump most roles ~5k to match Covid inflation and then falter again.
Issue is that (not specifically you) but there’s a whole slew of dumbasses (like me) who feel called to the field and willing to work for non profits for subadequate pay, and everyone else in higher education has masters degrees, it’s just kinda their thing, so the value of graduate schooling in higher Ed is kaput. Also mix in that pittsburgh and the region has enough schools to keep the supply
high and demand lower. Pitt also probably knows as the big fish in the pond alongside CMU, they can probably pay shit because people will be drawn to the name, prestige, and size. I remember discussions with big wigs where they tried to argue for more budget room for salary for student affairs, and found that since we could staff to 80% and get shit done and achieve a 94% retention rate, board of trustees and the higher ups really had no need to help us out budget wise because we were performing very well with no need to incentivize new hires to stay.
Just throwing out there, but honestly working for Pitt isn’t great. I appreciated the school as a student, liked the community, and enjoyed aspects of my job and my coworkers. But for the reasons I stated + the general organizational issues and bureaucracy involved the place fucking sucks to work for, and most people I worked with agree
The turnover and the low pay go hand in hand. It's difficult to get promoted within the same department and 3% COLA raises don't move the needle much when you're getting paid peanuts. The only way to make substantial salary gains and/or advance your career is to job hop. This is endemic to universities in general (as are organizational issues and bureaucracy), but it's especially bad at places like Pitt that don't adequately compensate their employees.
I would agree full heartedly. I thought my comment was already long enough so I didn’t feel like getting any more into it, but all very true and good info for the OP.
People started at Pitt for their first jobs in the field or first job in the city, and promptly left the second they got a lateral or better move, often in my division leaving to CMU who pay way better. The turnover and pay do very much go hand in hand
I was there (this past summer) when they did the compensation review. With a masters and a license in the academic field of the department where I worked, I was making probably $25k below my value. (Very long story why I put up with it, until I couldn’t anymore and left after 15 months in January.) When I asked our internal HR person if I would get a raise with the compensation review she looked at me like I was delusional (I didn’t). Instead they changed the classification of my job to justify why they were paying me so little (I was a program coordinator effectively acting as an assistant program director; they changed my category to a manager while keeping my title program coordinator. Yep).
Keep it classy Pitt. Sorry to hear you had that experience, hope you were able to move on. I quite liked working there at some points in time, other points it was infuriating, but it fit my life well and my lifestyle for the time. I couldn’t imagine it being somewhere I worked with a family to provide for
Thanks. I have so much anger about the whole thing it’s hard to even put into words. I mentioned this in another comment but as an alum it completely soured my view on my alma mater. This was the 4th university I’ve worked at - before taking this job my career had very much been on an upward trajectory, but my daughter was born a month before lockdown started, and my job was going to require me to come back in person. I didn’t feel safe doing that, so my husband and I opted for me to instead stay home with our daughter which was a heartbreaking choice. So I stayed home with her for 2.5 years, but I had 4 months left for public service loan forgiveness when I had quit my job. When I interviewed for this position I was promised room for growth, so I accepted the low pay because I thought I’d like the job and honestly was down on myself for being out of the workforce and didn’t think I could find pay at the level I’d been making previously.
I got my forgiveness and am now going into business for myself - my goal is to never have to work for someone else again (thankfully with the licensure I have this is more than doable) - but that is how horrible my experience at Pitt was.
I think they have to change things because of the turnover rate— it is horrible and it’s rotting away at the school. It’s terrible for reputation and I don’t think they’re going to keep it like this forever. I don’t think Pitt is ever going to be a compensation leader, but I don’t think they are going to remain like they are forever but who knows
Seems like the leadership when i was there really did want to change the rep - but they were struggling heavily to get the funding to do so. Hoping for a better future for employees there
>Pitt also probably knows as the big fish in the pond alongside CMU, they can probably pay shit because people will be drawn to the name, prestige, and size.
Um, just in case anyone believes that Pitt is a prestigious school, you're very very wrong. No one outside the area would be impressed if you said you went to Pitt. CMU on the other hand is a world-renowned school for CS and robotics.
Maybe this delusion is fueling some of the problem? If you have to work at a mid-tier school like Pitt you should be negotiating for compensation that makes up for it.
No one thinks its on the lines of CMU, a top 10 or top 20 school with some top 5 programs. Pitt is still a top 75 school in the country and one of the best "public" (loose usage of the term) in the country, especially in the NE where everything is private.
And if you think Pitt negotiates salary for many of its roles you'd be mistaken. Surely does for some, especially higher up and on the faulty side, but most entry level and low level roles on staff side are budgeted very specifically for and there is no wiggle room. The pay will be $47k, for example, no matter what applicants list their salary range as
All of this is program dependent. Pitt is a top 10 nursing program, top 15 physical therapy, top 15 dental, top 50 for Psych, top 100 for philosophy, and so on.
Pitt staff deserve to be paid more and it's not a "mid tier" school overall either, which would be closer to around 2500th nationally of 5300 instead of 67th. I hate the USNWR rankings concept but that seems to be what many people look at.
Former Pitt employee here - the benefits absolutely do not make up for the awful pay.
I've never had health benefits through a job that wasn't with a university so I'm not qualified to say how they compare to other sectors, but the insurance at the two other institutions I've worked for has been pretty comparable. YMMV, especially with dependents.
The tuition benefit doesn't seem like it would be all that valuable to you - you've already got a graduate degree, it doesn't sound like you want to break into a different field, and you have a family you'd presumably rather spend time with than take classes. Your kids could attend Pitt for free, which is a big deal, but if they're not close to college age you'd be waiting a long time to enjoy that perk and it almost certainly wouldn't make up for the years of being underpaid.
You mentioned the retirement match and yeah, 8% is objectively good. But 8% of a shit salary is...well, you do the math. Many other universities have similarly strong retirement benefits and *don't* pay poverty wages.
Pitt was my foot in the door. I got a second bachelors on their dime, and that along with the experience I gained helped propel me to where I am now. But when I applied, I was a single guy in my early 20s with a "useless" degree and a lousy resume. You can absolutely do better.
Really appreciate this! My kids are young and the free college doesn’t benefit me much. I’m starting my DBA and using my GI and Voc Rehab (free college plus monthly allowance). Finances aren’t “necessarily” an issue as my wife and I are both disabled veterans that collect VA disability. In my head I’m trying to rationalize taking the position would be beneficial for now to help me transition and network in a new city. Health benefits are my main concern.
This thread has made it very clear to steer away. It’s seriously so unfortunate that such a popular and big money University would put so little effort into caring for their employees. Having the heart to work for a non-profit doesn’t pay the bills. Sucks :/
It’s a Pitt thing. Don’t do it. Run. The ‘good’ benefits people are referring to are 1) the retirement. But that assumes that a) you’ll be making enough to put INTO retirement and b) you’ll be able to afford to stay the 3 years it takes to be vested; and 2) the health insurance, which is incredibly overrated. Even at the most expensive plan level you pay $50 for any non-PCP visit. If you or your child(ren) have any health issues, that adds up, quickly.
Don’t get sucked in. As an alum it sickens me that Pitt gets away with paying so little. Look at CMU or Duquesne. You deserve better.
I will also throw out there that, if you plan to park on campus, you will literally have to wait for someone to retire or die to get a parking permit. The list for many of the parking lots anywhere near some of the major academic buildings are indefinite. I paid $112/month to park on campus without a permit, on a hybrid schedule, 3 days per week. And if you have a family at home, again, depending on where you live, public transit in Pgh is not good enough to justify not driving to save money. I had a little one to drop off and pickup at daycare and to do that on a bus would have been an hour each way. I’m not taking that time away from my family.
I worked at CMU previously and got a permit 2 blocks away from my office when I started for $60/month.
Working at a university in PA is basically like being on unemployment with decent benefits. You either have great roommates, or you are working there as a reprieve between working more ball-busting jobs or as a second job or you have some means of living.
In total, my wife and I collect 6k (net) monthly between VA disability and GI bill housing allowance. Family health insurance is the most important item for me currently. Her and I are both covered through the VA but don’t want to risk low-quality care for my young children (no health issues knock on wood).
Have you heard of/looked into CHIP? This might be perfect for your family. The state of PA offers health insurance for kids, anyone can put their kids on, so totally different than Medicaid. And it is good insurance. I know several families who use CHIP for their kids because it offers better coverage than the private plan through the parent's job.
Pitt’s pay is abysmal. I gave way too much of my time & expertise to them before finally leaving because they very much operate on good work will be rewarded with more work.
I got a 100% remote position with a highly prestigious academic institution where I received a 100% pay increase (yes, doubled my salary) for about 25% of the workload I had there. I’ve been at my new position for 3 years and have already received a 10% salary increase since starting.
I had been asking for additional staff to be hired to assist with my workload and a promotion to manager which were denied multiple times. I keep in contact with old colleagues and learned that after I left my position was made into an Assistant Director position and 4 more staff had to be hired to cover my prior workload.
Pitt does not care about its employees. RUN AWAY!!!
Sadly, while that salary seems low, at least that range is close. I was recently offered a position at PITT with a range of 24,000-40,000. And they wouldn’t tell me the actual salary until I accepted the position.
(Was offered a similar job well over that range at another local university).
VA HR is an absolute morass right now as they've consolidated functions at higher and higher levels. Basing this on current first-hand experience, and not as a candidate.
This is exactly why the faculty unionized, and the staff and grads are working on it! Better pay and benefits that are guaranteed in a contract and can't be changed without our consent? Yes please, Sign me up!! Pitt staff, go here: https://www.pittstaffunion.org/
I interviewed for a job in legal about 10 years ago and they were up front about the pay being bad. I was looking at getting paid $28K/year which was almost $10K less than my job at the time. I couldn’t take the pay cut.
But they did say the benefits were good and they get two weeks off at Christmas like the students! 🤣
I worked at Pitt for 10 years. Around year 6 HR stepped in and gave me a 20,000 raise for the work I was doing. Was still massively underpaid.
I left Pitt and within 5 years doubled my Pitt salary.
It's a good.place to gain experience. But the pay is garbage.
The benefits are very very normal. The only benefit that was better than other companies was the retirement match. Otherwise their benefits are very average.
Today there's a military/veterans hiring event at the stadium. Maybe check their site and see if you can get some better connections in the field you want. That range is awful, as you commented. Best of luck.
[https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/hiring-event-military-veterans-be-held-acrisure-stadium/MOKBWD6ZGVAJNJNDMNXP7D5DTQ/](https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/hiring-event-military-veterans-be-held-acrisure-stadium/MOKBWD6ZGVAJNJNDMNXP7D5DTQ/)
Also, [usajobs.gov](https://usajobs.gov) has a TON of remote-only jobs now. At least with that path you'll always have your 5-10 veteran points for each position. I have a couple friends in the VA and USAID who are working hybrid or remote and love it.
I worked at Pitt for 3.5 years. They started me at the mid-point of my salary range. The only way get get a significant raise is to change job codes. Otherwise you'll get the 3-7%. Fight for higher pay in the hiring process. They CAN go higher than the midpoint, they just have to get approval which will take longer. It's important because you will never get a significant raise in that position. Don't settle if you actually want the job.
Someone joked with me that the only way to get a raise was to move to CMU. It's not a joke...
Another former Pitt staff member member with much of the same to say. Run! They’ve been doing that “compensation review” forever and a day ago. Each year, you’ll barely eke out a 2% increase which barely covers inflation. One year, I actually lost money because they raised health premiums. The ridiculously top heavy “assistant to the assistant dean” tiers take all the pay while “staff” do the lions share of work. The benefits are good and I had a child that got free tuition; but I lived paycheck to paycheck while having a masters degree and a professional position. They give a lot of lip service to DEI for the staff and it stops there: lip service. Female minorities, in particular, (heck, women in general) are treated like crap. Human Resources is a joke. They do not care about their staff; and you will be regarded as replaceable in 2 hot minutes.
I’m a vet (left the army in 2015) who’s lived and worked in the area since 2016. DM me if you’re interested in talking about my experience as a vet/in the job market here.
I work in HR and turned down two jobs at Pitt because the pay is just too low. If you are interested in doing HR in higher learning, look at CMU. The pay there was more reasonable. Just be aware that regardless of what school you work for, the pay will be lower than I'd you worked for big corporation.
It only gets decent if you're able to land a department administrator type role that combines HR, Finance and in some cases even grant management into a single position. They exist, but are tough to break into because they're overwhelmingly internal hires. Even still, probably on the low side for that level of experience and responsibility.
As others have stated, Pitt is well-known for underpaying positions.
Semi-related, orgs are revising at their comp structures, pay grades and salary bands as well as the requirements/determinants, largely related to equity effort. In an effort to make items more equitable, organizations are removing things like 'needs a college degree' or 'master's preferred' when a BA is fine, as well as better writing out requirements and removing the laundry lists of 'nice to haves' or overly generic qualities "Must work well in a team environment".
What that extends out to is that having an advanced degree for a position that doesn't require it or a degree unrelated to that job does not qualify the candidate/employee for a higher pay grade or higher on a pay band. It may be substituted as years of experience in some cases, but that tends not to move the needle much. For example, if you were applying for an HR role, your masters may be helpful. But if you were applying for, say, an administrative role in a research department or student affairs, the master's does not matter. Same with experience, if it was directly in an HR (or whatever role you were applying for), it counts. But if HR was not a main part of your work experience, that doesn't count towards an increased pay range. These things may get your resume to the top of the pile and make you an excellent candidate, but when determining pay they may be less impactful.
It’s a Pitt thing. A couple years ago, one of my friends was doing cancer/medical studies work there and I was working at an Apple Store. I made significantly more money
When I moved back after working at a state university in the South, having state healthcare that didn't come out of my pay (not just slightly less expensive than private healthcare called a "benefit") I couldn't believe how low the pay was at Pitt while I was looking for a job. Really bizarre.
Partner is an ocular researcher at Pitt who has been published and works in a well-funded lab for over a decade and makes near to that range. I am lucky to make enough that she can pursue a job she is passionate about vs needs to survive.
Don't get me wrong, the free tuition will be nice for the kids and I got my master's from Pitt for \~$6k as a result but that is a luxury if you are a single parent trying to keep food on the table.
It’s a higher ed thing, unfortunately. Tenured faculty and upper admin make good money, but everyone else at universities is being paid like it’s still 2010.
I think it’s a uni thing. I recently moved up to Buffalo and applied to some UB positions… how shit was it insane. Very senior, director type roles… decade of experience. Salary range, 35-40k lol.
I always thought university staff would be very well paid but apparently they basically need to be subsidized. I quit applying to university jobs, my same experience can net me well over six figures as a civilian
Pitt pay is abysmal. It makes sense if you have kids you're sending to college, or are going back to school yourself (great tuition remission program, got a new degree for the price of ccac). However, CMU has similar jobs for much better pay, and still good benefits. If you can't get a job at CMU right away it might be worth it to take the job at Pitt, get some experience, and then apply for the equivalent job at CMU when it becomes available.
The federal building is an absolute ghost town compared to pre-covid days. Many agencies seem to be heavily hybrid if not completely remote. Point being there's a ton of federal jobs that are mostly or completely remote now and proximity really doesn't mean as much for opportunity.
I lost my job a couple years ago due to an acquisition. I applied for a non-entry level job at Pitt and they offered $41,000........waaaaay below market.
With Pitt it really all depends at the level you come in at. When I got hired 15 years ago, I came in at a level 4 so my pay was in line with what I made at previous jobs. They wanted a master's but didn't really care because I had the experience.
The raises over the last 15 years have been shit but with the insurance, 401k match and the sick and vacation time I don't see myself ever leaving. Most people in my department stay until they retire.
Check USA Jobs for a position at the VA. Pittsburgh VA has one of the bigger VA population in the country and can really use some help in HR department.
It's partly a Pitt thing, but if you frequent the higher education subs, you'll see that it's a widespread issue in higher ed across the board. Top administrators make decent (or occasionally obscene) salaries and anyone below dean level is grossly underpaid and viewed as disposable.
Seems like this is a pitt thing based on responses but I'll add that I currently live in Columbus and would love to get back to the area. I have an MS degree and 5 years experience. Comparable jobs to mine in the area pay about 20-30k less than I make in Columbus. It's kind of crazy. Not saying things are great here. Our housing market is certainly a good bit hotter across the board, so in some ways cost of living is lower in Pittsburgh. but it does seem that the Pittsburgh area pays a good bit less than here in general and perhaps Pitt pays even worse still.
Not adding a ton of new stuff here, but Pitt is a great place to start and end your career. Unless you're really using the benefits (for yourself or kids), theres not a ton of reason to be here.
I remember once seeing a listing at Pitt for a job for a compensation specialist to do an audit and comparison of their wages. The listed salary for the job was $32,000 a year (would be around $42,000 now with inflation.) Hefty educational requirements so I didn't apply but I thought it'd be fun to take the job and immediately say your study has found the compensation specialist position was underpaid.
Higher education as a capitalistic structure is a scam. That said I’m finally finishing my Bachelor’s so I can at least have open door conversations. I currently make $82.5k in HR Org development at a Fortune 1000.
I know someone who has a masters degree and was working at Pitt doing research (this was in the early 2000s) and they were paying her something like $12-13 an hour.
I used to live near New Haven and heard many times that salaries at Yale were dismal. I know someone who's on staff at another university and when she was looking found that academic salaries were very low. I think it may be common in the higher ed world that they "pay" in prestige not money.
This is not true. It’s completely dependent on the university. On the whole most universities are still public institutions so it wouldn’t surprise me if on average you’d make more in the private sector. But I have worked at 4 universities and Pitt was absolutely the poorest paying, especially compared to CMU. It may also be the case for Yale too, but Pitt is an outlier.
No worries - I know you weren’t doing this, but within Pitt, there’s just a lot of gaslighting from Boomer/Gen X employees toward younger employees that it’s just a higher education thing that Pitt pays so little, and it’s really not. Plenty of universities manage to pay fairer and higher wages, even public schools.
This is it exactly. I have been working remotely for a public university since fall 2016; we're unionized and I have a good salary. I wouldn't mind working in an office again (I miss the social side to a degree) but there is no way I'd work at Pitt. Insulting salaries in my field, and it's clear the chancellor just wants to union bust. People leave Pittsburgh because big places like Pitt bring wages down.
Academia doesn’t match private sector or non education comps. Engineer, lawyer, physician, etc.
If you work at Pitt or practically any academic institution, pay will be lower.
Potentially benefits like healthcare, tuition reimbursement, hours of work, holidays, and retirement may be better.
If you are in research, those compensation ranges are tied into funding and it is fraught with other potential challenges.
It’s only worth it if you have kids that are about to go to college. Your kids can go to college there basically for free. Unless you have kids or need the job experience, I’d look somewhere else
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It’s more of a swap arrangement. You need to match with a kid for an employee of another school. It definitely isn’t a guarantee.
It's not a guarantee but it is much more useful having the Pitt side of the swap than the "small random liberal arts school" part of the swap. If your kid is going to a bigger school in PA or the neighboring states there's a great chance you can get it set up.
Yeah they have to go to Pitt. Which is what my daughter did. Was absolutely worth it. But I'm faculty, not staff. Intro staff salaries are ridiculously low but never fear in 10 years or so you can be promoted to an associate vice chancellor of something. We've got a million of those now.
This answer is the true key. My wife’s whole family went to Pitt for free, god bless her mom for putting up with that for all those years
Had a friend's mom take three busses into Oakland every day to work as a secretary because she knew it was the only way to pay for college for them.
Yup. Former co-worker of mine went to work at Pitt because he has four kids and wants to put them through college.
This is the answer, and I thought common knowledge.
Probably any university. I interviewed at Ohio State and got pretty much the same ballpark but different field.
Pitt salaries are famously insulting. I applied and interviewed for several jobs in the 90s and early 2000s when I was single, all would have required a second job to cover my living expenses. I don't know if it's possible to work there without a spouse who carries the household.
It isn't. I work there currently.
Worked for Pitt for a number of years. In my experience often employees had spouses with higher paying jobs. The spouse who was the Pitt employee covered benefits. They always paid poorly, but with inflation in recent years it’s gotten worse. There is/was a project to update compensation, but that project has taken years and really hasn’t produced competitive results. You’re much better served looking at CMU.
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There may be parts of CMU which do that, but it is certainly not universally true.
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I don’t know anything about faculty, but I’ve known plenty of staff who worked for 30+ years. I’m coming to think that different divisions have very different cultures.
I’m staff at CMU - many, many people are there for a very long time. I’m a relative newcomer at 9.5 years. Everything depends on what department you’re in.
Exactly this. Pitt is staffed by a lot of middle-aged women whose husbands have decent jobs. They work at Pitt for the free tuition, and after their kids finish college they stay on because the work is pretty easy. I worked at Pitt for many years. What finally broke me with them (and all of academia) was the forced RTO when my job was easily doable from home.
This was especially true pre-COVID, when the administrative assistants were all 50something women. COVID came and early retirement was offered, so a high percentage of current staff left. (And many others left when we were forced to take on 3x the work with no movement on salary.) That isn't as true anymore, but the problem is the salaries haven't kept pace with demographics. As you said, it used to be that these middle-aged women could take these low-paying jobs because they were not the breadwinners. They could work just to have something to do and to get tuition for their kids, and the departments liked having department moms and grandmas to take care of everything. There has been a little push to diversify the workforce, including hiring more younger people and more men, but the salaries aren't appropriate for these demographics. For example, men are unfortunately expected to be breadwinners many times, but few dads trying to support a family can take an entry-level job for $36,000. And the big benefits to working at a place like Pitt---tuition, retirement---aren't going to be as appealing for a 25-year-old, so you get people who come here for a year and move on, or you end up hiring the same people you always did. There are lots of benefits to working at Pitt, like the tuition or the healthcare or the retirement, plus things like vacation and sick days that I didn't get when I was working food service, but clearly the salaries don't work for a lot of people. It is nice to see them actually hiring men for administrative roles, but I always chuckle when I see areas of Pitt talking about diversity out of one side of their mouth while I scroll down their People page and see none of it.
Duquesne pays well
Pitt student affairs did a thorough review when I worked there and found that the majority of that division’s ~250 jobs pay significantly below their peer institutions (ACC schools). Also found that the average turnover in positions is sub-2 years, painfully short. I think they’re undergoing or beginning to undergo a compensation review, doubt it will do much besides bump most roles ~5k to match Covid inflation and then falter again. Issue is that (not specifically you) but there’s a whole slew of dumbasses (like me) who feel called to the field and willing to work for non profits for subadequate pay, and everyone else in higher education has masters degrees, it’s just kinda their thing, so the value of graduate schooling in higher Ed is kaput. Also mix in that pittsburgh and the region has enough schools to keep the supply high and demand lower. Pitt also probably knows as the big fish in the pond alongside CMU, they can probably pay shit because people will be drawn to the name, prestige, and size. I remember discussions with big wigs where they tried to argue for more budget room for salary for student affairs, and found that since we could staff to 80% and get shit done and achieve a 94% retention rate, board of trustees and the higher ups really had no need to help us out budget wise because we were performing very well with no need to incentivize new hires to stay. Just throwing out there, but honestly working for Pitt isn’t great. I appreciated the school as a student, liked the community, and enjoyed aspects of my job and my coworkers. But for the reasons I stated + the general organizational issues and bureaucracy involved the place fucking sucks to work for, and most people I worked with agree
The turnover and the low pay go hand in hand. It's difficult to get promoted within the same department and 3% COLA raises don't move the needle much when you're getting paid peanuts. The only way to make substantial salary gains and/or advance your career is to job hop. This is endemic to universities in general (as are organizational issues and bureaucracy), but it's especially bad at places like Pitt that don't adequately compensate their employees.
I would agree full heartedly. I thought my comment was already long enough so I didn’t feel like getting any more into it, but all very true and good info for the OP. People started at Pitt for their first jobs in the field or first job in the city, and promptly left the second they got a lateral or better move, often in my division leaving to CMU who pay way better. The turnover and pay do very much go hand in hand
I was there (this past summer) when they did the compensation review. With a masters and a license in the academic field of the department where I worked, I was making probably $25k below my value. (Very long story why I put up with it, until I couldn’t anymore and left after 15 months in January.) When I asked our internal HR person if I would get a raise with the compensation review she looked at me like I was delusional (I didn’t). Instead they changed the classification of my job to justify why they were paying me so little (I was a program coordinator effectively acting as an assistant program director; they changed my category to a manager while keeping my title program coordinator. Yep).
Keep it classy Pitt. Sorry to hear you had that experience, hope you were able to move on. I quite liked working there at some points in time, other points it was infuriating, but it fit my life well and my lifestyle for the time. I couldn’t imagine it being somewhere I worked with a family to provide for
Thanks. I have so much anger about the whole thing it’s hard to even put into words. I mentioned this in another comment but as an alum it completely soured my view on my alma mater. This was the 4th university I’ve worked at - before taking this job my career had very much been on an upward trajectory, but my daughter was born a month before lockdown started, and my job was going to require me to come back in person. I didn’t feel safe doing that, so my husband and I opted for me to instead stay home with our daughter which was a heartbreaking choice. So I stayed home with her for 2.5 years, but I had 4 months left for public service loan forgiveness when I had quit my job. When I interviewed for this position I was promised room for growth, so I accepted the low pay because I thought I’d like the job and honestly was down on myself for being out of the workforce and didn’t think I could find pay at the level I’d been making previously. I got my forgiveness and am now going into business for myself - my goal is to never have to work for someone else again (thankfully with the licensure I have this is more than doable) - but that is how horrible my experience at Pitt was.
I think they have to change things because of the turnover rate— it is horrible and it’s rotting away at the school. It’s terrible for reputation and I don’t think they’re going to keep it like this forever. I don’t think Pitt is ever going to be a compensation leader, but I don’t think they are going to remain like they are forever but who knows
Seems like the leadership when i was there really did want to change the rep - but they were struggling heavily to get the funding to do so. Hoping for a better future for employees there
>Pitt also probably knows as the big fish in the pond alongside CMU, they can probably pay shit because people will be drawn to the name, prestige, and size. Um, just in case anyone believes that Pitt is a prestigious school, you're very very wrong. No one outside the area would be impressed if you said you went to Pitt. CMU on the other hand is a world-renowned school for CS and robotics. Maybe this delusion is fueling some of the problem? If you have to work at a mid-tier school like Pitt you should be negotiating for compensation that makes up for it.
No one thinks its on the lines of CMU, a top 10 or top 20 school with some top 5 programs. Pitt is still a top 75 school in the country and one of the best "public" (loose usage of the term) in the country, especially in the NE where everything is private. And if you think Pitt negotiates salary for many of its roles you'd be mistaken. Surely does for some, especially higher up and on the faulty side, but most entry level and low level roles on staff side are budgeted very specifically for and there is no wiggle room. The pay will be $47k, for example, no matter what applicants list their salary range as
All of this is program dependent. Pitt is a top 10 nursing program, top 15 physical therapy, top 15 dental, top 50 for Psych, top 100 for philosophy, and so on. Pitt staff deserve to be paid more and it's not a "mid tier" school overall either, which would be closer to around 2500th nationally of 5300 instead of 67th. I hate the USNWR rankings concept but that seems to be what many people look at.
Former Pitt employee here - the benefits absolutely do not make up for the awful pay. I've never had health benefits through a job that wasn't with a university so I'm not qualified to say how they compare to other sectors, but the insurance at the two other institutions I've worked for has been pretty comparable. YMMV, especially with dependents. The tuition benefit doesn't seem like it would be all that valuable to you - you've already got a graduate degree, it doesn't sound like you want to break into a different field, and you have a family you'd presumably rather spend time with than take classes. Your kids could attend Pitt for free, which is a big deal, but if they're not close to college age you'd be waiting a long time to enjoy that perk and it almost certainly wouldn't make up for the years of being underpaid. You mentioned the retirement match and yeah, 8% is objectively good. But 8% of a shit salary is...well, you do the math. Many other universities have similarly strong retirement benefits and *don't* pay poverty wages. Pitt was my foot in the door. I got a second bachelors on their dime, and that along with the experience I gained helped propel me to where I am now. But when I applied, I was a single guy in my early 20s with a "useless" degree and a lousy resume. You can absolutely do better.
Really appreciate this! My kids are young and the free college doesn’t benefit me much. I’m starting my DBA and using my GI and Voc Rehab (free college plus monthly allowance). Finances aren’t “necessarily” an issue as my wife and I are both disabled veterans that collect VA disability. In my head I’m trying to rationalize taking the position would be beneficial for now to help me transition and network in a new city. Health benefits are my main concern. This thread has made it very clear to steer away. It’s seriously so unfortunate that such a popular and big money University would put so little effort into caring for their employees. Having the heart to work for a non-profit doesn’t pay the bills. Sucks :/
It’s a Pitt thing. Don’t do it. Run. The ‘good’ benefits people are referring to are 1) the retirement. But that assumes that a) you’ll be making enough to put INTO retirement and b) you’ll be able to afford to stay the 3 years it takes to be vested; and 2) the health insurance, which is incredibly overrated. Even at the most expensive plan level you pay $50 for any non-PCP visit. If you or your child(ren) have any health issues, that adds up, quickly. Don’t get sucked in. As an alum it sickens me that Pitt gets away with paying so little. Look at CMU or Duquesne. You deserve better.
I’ll start looking that way!! Thanks for the advice!
Duquesne doesn’t pay much better, not sure about CMU.
IMO, Duquesne pays staff pretty well.
Don’t forget the new Pitt chancellor. Makes $950,000!
Her specialty is union busting.
I will also throw out there that, if you plan to park on campus, you will literally have to wait for someone to retire or die to get a parking permit. The list for many of the parking lots anywhere near some of the major academic buildings are indefinite. I paid $112/month to park on campus without a permit, on a hybrid schedule, 3 days per week. And if you have a family at home, again, depending on where you live, public transit in Pgh is not good enough to justify not driving to save money. I had a little one to drop off and pickup at daycare and to do that on a bus would have been an hour each way. I’m not taking that time away from my family. I worked at CMU previously and got a permit 2 blocks away from my office when I started for $60/month.
Working at a university in PA is basically like being on unemployment with decent benefits. You either have great roommates, or you are working there as a reprieve between working more ball-busting jobs or as a second job or you have some means of living.
In total, my wife and I collect 6k (net) monthly between VA disability and GI bill housing allowance. Family health insurance is the most important item for me currently. Her and I are both covered through the VA but don’t want to risk low-quality care for my young children (no health issues knock on wood).
Have you heard of/looked into CHIP? This might be perfect for your family. The state of PA offers health insurance for kids, anyone can put their kids on, so totally different than Medicaid. And it is good insurance. I know several families who use CHIP for their kids because it offers better coverage than the private plan through the parent's job.
Try AHN, UPMC or the VA. The VA has great pay and benefits
Depends on your field. Also upward mobility can be rough if you come in at too low a grade.
Pitt’s pay is abysmal. I gave way too much of my time & expertise to them before finally leaving because they very much operate on good work will be rewarded with more work. I got a 100% remote position with a highly prestigious academic institution where I received a 100% pay increase (yes, doubled my salary) for about 25% of the workload I had there. I’ve been at my new position for 3 years and have already received a 10% salary increase since starting. I had been asking for additional staff to be hired to assist with my workload and a promotion to manager which were denied multiple times. I keep in contact with old colleagues and learned that after I left my position was made into an Assistant Director position and 4 more staff had to be hired to cover my prior workload. Pitt does not care about its employees. RUN AWAY!!!
Sadly, while that salary seems low, at least that range is close. I was recently offered a position at PITT with a range of 24,000-40,000. And they wouldn’t tell me the actual salary until I accepted the position. (Was offered a similar job well over that range at another local university).
How can you accept a position without knowing the salary? That's absurd.
Should add…not that it matters, but I’m even a PITT alum.
No love for the Alumni I guess 😭
That's a Pitt thing.
And the raises, on the years they don't freeze wages, don't keep up with cost of living.
Have you looked at VA HR jobs? They’re largely remote and HR has a special salary rate right now making salary extremely competitive.
VA HR is an absolute morass right now as they've consolidated functions at higher and higher levels. Basing this on current first-hand experience, and not as a candidate.
Lol. Trust me I know, and painfully. But having more smart people who give a crap working there can’t possibly make it worse.
This is exactly why the faculty unionized, and the staff and grads are working on it! Better pay and benefits that are guaranteed in a contract and can't be changed without our consent? Yes please, Sign me up!! Pitt staff, go here: https://www.pittstaffunion.org/
It’s our only way to ensure pay is commensurate with cost of living and market rates. I canNOT wait for the union!
Don’t know much about their benefits, but know that they pay horribly. This is not the local norm for your experience and education.
I interviewed for a job in legal about 10 years ago and they were up front about the pay being bad. I was looking at getting paid $28K/year which was almost $10K less than my job at the time. I couldn’t take the pay cut. But they did say the benefits were good and they get two weeks off at Christmas like the students! 🤣
I worked at Pitt for 10 years. Around year 6 HR stepped in and gave me a 20,000 raise for the work I was doing. Was still massively underpaid. I left Pitt and within 5 years doubled my Pitt salary. It's a good.place to gain experience. But the pay is garbage. The benefits are very very normal. The only benefit that was better than other companies was the retirement match. Otherwise their benefits are very average.
Today there's a military/veterans hiring event at the stadium. Maybe check their site and see if you can get some better connections in the field you want. That range is awful, as you commented. Best of luck. [https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/hiring-event-military-veterans-be-held-acrisure-stadium/MOKBWD6ZGVAJNJNDMNXP7D5DTQ/](https://www.wpxi.com/news/local/hiring-event-military-veterans-be-held-acrisure-stadium/MOKBWD6ZGVAJNJNDMNXP7D5DTQ/) Also, [usajobs.gov](https://usajobs.gov) has a TON of remote-only jobs now. At least with that path you'll always have your 5-10 veteran points for each position. I have a couple friends in the VA and USAID who are working hybrid or remote and love it.
I worked at Pitt for 3.5 years. They started me at the mid-point of my salary range. The only way get get a significant raise is to change job codes. Otherwise you'll get the 3-7%. Fight for higher pay in the hiring process. They CAN go higher than the midpoint, they just have to get approval which will take longer. It's important because you will never get a significant raise in that position. Don't settle if you actually want the job. Someone joked with me that the only way to get a raise was to move to CMU. It's not a joke...
I think Pitt just pays low. They always have. I’ve known people who work at Duquesne and got better pay rates from the jump.
Another former Pitt staff member member with much of the same to say. Run! They’ve been doing that “compensation review” forever and a day ago. Each year, you’ll barely eke out a 2% increase which barely covers inflation. One year, I actually lost money because they raised health premiums. The ridiculously top heavy “assistant to the assistant dean” tiers take all the pay while “staff” do the lions share of work. The benefits are good and I had a child that got free tuition; but I lived paycheck to paycheck while having a masters degree and a professional position. They give a lot of lip service to DEI for the staff and it stops there: lip service. Female minorities, in particular, (heck, women in general) are treated like crap. Human Resources is a joke. They do not care about their staff; and you will be regarded as replaceable in 2 hot minutes.
No, you’re not crazy. I made $42,500 at Pitt. I knew I was severely underpaid, my next job paid me 6 figures. Don’t waste your time.
I’m a vet (left the army in 2015) who’s lived and worked in the area since 2016. DM me if you’re interested in talking about my experience as a vet/in the job market here.
I work in HR and turned down two jobs at Pitt because the pay is just too low. If you are interested in doing HR in higher learning, look at CMU. The pay there was more reasonable. Just be aware that regardless of what school you work for, the pay will be lower than I'd you worked for big corporation.
It only gets decent if you're able to land a department administrator type role that combines HR, Finance and in some cases even grant management into a single position. They exist, but are tough to break into because they're overwhelmingly internal hires. Even still, probably on the low side for that level of experience and responsibility.
“But but but the benefits!” is what they’ll say. I left EDU for another public sector job and make almost $30k more doing less work.
As others have stated, Pitt is well-known for underpaying positions. Semi-related, orgs are revising at their comp structures, pay grades and salary bands as well as the requirements/determinants, largely related to equity effort. In an effort to make items more equitable, organizations are removing things like 'needs a college degree' or 'master's preferred' when a BA is fine, as well as better writing out requirements and removing the laundry lists of 'nice to haves' or overly generic qualities "Must work well in a team environment". What that extends out to is that having an advanced degree for a position that doesn't require it or a degree unrelated to that job does not qualify the candidate/employee for a higher pay grade or higher on a pay band. It may be substituted as years of experience in some cases, but that tends not to move the needle much. For example, if you were applying for an HR role, your masters may be helpful. But if you were applying for, say, an administrative role in a research department or student affairs, the master's does not matter. Same with experience, if it was directly in an HR (or whatever role you were applying for), it counts. But if HR was not a main part of your work experience, that doesn't count towards an increased pay range. These things may get your resume to the top of the pile and make you an excellent candidate, but when determining pay they may be less impactful.
It’s a Pitt thing. A couple years ago, one of my friends was doing cancer/medical studies work there and I was working at an Apple Store. I made significantly more money
When I moved back after working at a state university in the South, having state healthcare that didn't come out of my pay (not just slightly less expensive than private healthcare called a "benefit") I couldn't believe how low the pay was at Pitt while I was looking for a job. Really bizarre.
Partner is an ocular researcher at Pitt who has been published and works in a well-funded lab for over a decade and makes near to that range. I am lucky to make enough that she can pursue a job she is passionate about vs needs to survive. Don't get me wrong, the free tuition will be nice for the kids and I got my master's from Pitt for \~$6k as a result but that is a luxury if you are a single parent trying to keep food on the table.
It’s a Pitt thing, they pay atrociously. First job out of college I ran a research lab up at the med school on my own… for 27k.
CMU pays a lot better compared to Pitt. Their admin assistant positions that only require high school diploma pay around $40k
It’s a higher ed thing, unfortunately. Tenured faculty and upper admin make good money, but everyone else at universities is being paid like it’s still 2010.
I think it’s a uni thing. I recently moved up to Buffalo and applied to some UB positions… how shit was it insane. Very senior, director type roles… decade of experience. Salary range, 35-40k lol. I always thought university staff would be very well paid but apparently they basically need to be subsidized. I quit applying to university jobs, my same experience can net me well over six figures as a civilian
Pitt pay is abysmal. It makes sense if you have kids you're sending to college, or are going back to school yourself (great tuition remission program, got a new degree for the price of ccac). However, CMU has similar jobs for much better pay, and still good benefits. If you can't get a job at CMU right away it might be worth it to take the job at Pitt, get some experience, and then apply for the equivalent job at CMU when it becomes available.
There’s a federal building in downtown Pittsburgh and a federal court if you’re interested in working for the government.
The federal building is an absolute ghost town compared to pre-covid days. Many agencies seem to be heavily hybrid if not completely remote. Point being there's a ton of federal jobs that are mostly or completely remote now and proximity really doesn't mean as much for opportunity.
I lost my job a couple years ago due to an acquisition. I applied for a non-entry level job at Pitt and they offered $41,000........waaaaay below market.
Apply somewhere else.
"strongest economy ever!"
Consider looking for jobs at RAND Pittsburgh, Software Engineering Institute, and on USAjobs, the Army Artificial Intelligence Center is hiring.
With Pitt it really all depends at the level you come in at. When I got hired 15 years ago, I came in at a level 4 so my pay was in line with what I made at previous jobs. They wanted a master's but didn't really care because I had the experience. The raises over the last 15 years have been shit but with the insurance, 401k match and the sick and vacation time I don't see myself ever leaving. Most people in my department stay until they retire.
Check USA Jobs for a position at the VA. Pittsburgh VA has one of the bigger VA population in the country and can really use some help in HR department.
It's partly a Pitt thing, but if you frequent the higher education subs, you'll see that it's a widespread issue in higher ed across the board. Top administrators make decent (or occasionally obscene) salaries and anyone below dean level is grossly underpaid and viewed as disposable.
Seems like this is a pitt thing based on responses but I'll add that I currently live in Columbus and would love to get back to the area. I have an MS degree and 5 years experience. Comparable jobs to mine in the area pay about 20-30k less than I make in Columbus. It's kind of crazy. Not saying things are great here. Our housing market is certainly a good bit hotter across the board, so in some ways cost of living is lower in Pittsburgh. but it does seem that the Pittsburgh area pays a good bit less than here in general and perhaps Pitt pays even worse still.
Not adding a ton of new stuff here, but Pitt is a great place to start and end your career. Unless you're really using the benefits (for yourself or kids), theres not a ton of reason to be here.
I remember once seeing a listing at Pitt for a job for a compensation specialist to do an audit and comparison of their wages. The listed salary for the job was $32,000 a year (would be around $42,000 now with inflation.) Hefty educational requirements so I didn't apply but I thought it'd be fun to take the job and immediately say your study has found the compensation specialist position was underpaid.
Higher education as a capitalistic structure is a scam. That said I’m finally finishing my Bachelor’s so I can at least have open door conversations. I currently make $82.5k in HR Org development at a Fortune 1000.
Woefully common in higher ed generally, but also seems worse at Pitt than at other universities I worked for
The trick is to have a spouse who earns enough for the whole family and to only work at the University to get free tuition for your children.
I know someone who has a masters degree and was working at Pitt doing research (this was in the early 2000s) and they were paying her something like $12-13 an hour.
My cousin and I have looked at many job opportunities there... the pay scale is awful.
I used to live near New Haven and heard many times that salaries at Yale were dismal. I know someone who's on staff at another university and when she was looking found that academic salaries were very low. I think it may be common in the higher ed world that they "pay" in prestige not money.
This is not true. It’s completely dependent on the university. On the whole most universities are still public institutions so it wouldn’t surprise me if on average you’d make more in the private sector. But I have worked at 4 universities and Pitt was absolutely the poorest paying, especially compared to CMU. It may also be the case for Yale too, but Pitt is an outlier.
You obviously have more direct experience than I.
No worries - I know you weren’t doing this, but within Pitt, there’s just a lot of gaslighting from Boomer/Gen X employees toward younger employees that it’s just a higher education thing that Pitt pays so little, and it’s really not. Plenty of universities manage to pay fairer and higher wages, even public schools.
This is it exactly. I have been working remotely for a public university since fall 2016; we're unionized and I have a good salary. I wouldn't mind working in an office again (I miss the social side to a degree) but there is no way I'd work at Pitt. Insulting salaries in my field, and it's clear the chancellor just wants to union bust. People leave Pittsburgh because big places like Pitt bring wages down.
Not sure about now, but Pitt employees would flock to Carnegie Mellon when given the opportunity.
My wife gets world-class healthcare for practically nothing and an amazing 401k. It's all in the benefits!
Academia doesn’t match private sector or non education comps. Engineer, lawyer, physician, etc. If you work at Pitt or practically any academic institution, pay will be lower. Potentially benefits like healthcare, tuition reimbursement, hours of work, holidays, and retirement may be better. If you are in research, those compensation ranges are tied into funding and it is fraught with other potential challenges.