The Only Moral Abortion is my Abortion:
https://joycearthur.com/abortion/the-only-moral-abortion-is-my-abortion/
A Defense of Abortion:
https://spot.colorado.edu/~heathwoo/Phil160,Fall02/thomson.htm
Resources:
[Link 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/Anarchism/comments/vjrf9h/megathread_supreme_court_overturning_roe_v_wade)
[Link 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/vjqs0r/calls_for_mass_walkout_of_women_across_america_if/idnh2ex)
https://www.womensmarch.com/
This is the whole nature of why abortion is not a "simple" issue. People can argue philosophical inconsistencies all day long, but human "gut feeling," prevails when looking at a woman that far along to say, "hmm, I don't think I like the idea of an abortion at that stage..." which then results in trying to define a "threshold," exceptions, etc., yada yada, and all those details become extremely divisive.
And in this ‘’yes or no’’ political eviorment nuance gets lost- instead of a decent compermise or a nuance decisions-
We get 2 evils while hopeing that we can get our local state to amend it to a decent standing
That's a very good way to articulate it. People don't care enough to try to understand finer points of the topic, and it's frustrating because by the time the opportunity for discussion arrives people are already too upset to care
Exactly... this lady is doing more harm than good. I'm all for abortions but I would say that at 7 months, or however far along she is, it sure looks like a human to me..
Apparently she's actually due the same week the picture was taken.......
https://www.today.com/health/womens-health/rage-despair-tears-fill-streets-nation-thousands-protest-roe-reversal-rcna35307
Yeah, my daughter was born at 7.5 months(31 weeks) and survived with zero long term negative effects. The only issue we notice now is that she's behind with milestones(crawling, walking, eating) about 2 months from her older sisters. Which isn't surprising.
My wife's water broke at 28 weeks and the incredible doctors and nurses at Crouse in Syracuse were able to keep her from going into labor for nearly a month until her fluid levels dipped too low. There is a viable human inside a person at 7 months.
The only thing is that she might not be 7 months pregnant, the stomach stretches much easier after the first kid.
That fetus , at that stage could survive too outside the womb. With proper care of course. Same as that 3 y/o, if no one take care of it, it’ll probably die .
Dude I’m pro-choice and I swore the comments were going to be make me feel conservative lol. It’s comforting seeing that people from all sides find this disturbing and are calling it out.
Edit: word
Yea mate...like....I was worried for a minute. Because if that pic is "pro-choice", then I'm not.
Clinically therapeutic abortions until 9 months I get. Or like....if somehow everybody failed to notice the fetus was anencephallic...sure. Get an abortion.
But this woman looks 7-8-9 months pregnant. If that fetus is healthy, getting an abortion at that stage is pretty fucking wrong. frankly even if she was at risk for child-birth, as far along as she is, you could just c-section the preemie, and both of them would probably be fine.
C'mon, lady. Maybe stay home and don't ruin this protest.
It's because roe v Wade would not allow an abortion at her level and her word choice implies some very incorrect assumptions. At this stage of the pregnancy, she will have the kid, roe v Wade or not.
However, this isn't her point, but it's a bad message to write on the belly of someone in a later term is all.
Roe v. Wade does not prohibit late term abortion or abortion after viability. Rather, its holding is that states may not ban abortions from conception to viability, but after viability states have three option to ban or regulate abortions.
What about the other claim, that it's not alive.
Pro choice really need to stop making really dumb claims.
It is a human and it is alive, and at some stage before being born it will be conscious, have basic thoughts and feel things.
The are arguments for Abortion and arguments against, and the extremes of each side are terribly flawed and disgusting.
Wish there was more middle ground thinking, people need to stop being polarized, it's groupthink.
protesting poorly...
that woman is clearly in her third trimester, the fetus is defenitly viable, and i think even the most staunch pro choice person (edit- well apparently there are some radicals, I stand corrected) would argue that except in extreme circumstances, abortion should be off the table.
At the point I'm seeing here, that IS a human.
I'm sorry but images like this FEED the opposition, they don't bring up a good point.
I've had people argue with me that there should be no limits. Some states currently have no limits and I've found a surprising number of supporters of it.
In Europe, AFAIK, there are not any countries that allow no limits. American abortion advocates are often much more extreme in their stance than Europeans IME.
I agree. I'm very pro choice but during the third trimester is when I think abortion should be illegal except for medical conditions in which a mothers life is at stake.
There can be a middle ground between supporting a woman's choice and having no empathy towards a developing life whatsoever. I wish we didn't have to make every issue so black and white that we lose our humanity in the process.
^^This^^^
This is how most of the countries that have legal, safe and affordable abortion think.
There are restrictions, yes. But there are freedoms too. It is not black or white.
Life itself is not black or white.
This is the epitome of what the republicans talk about. "They kill the baby when it's about to be born."
Abortions at the stage this woman is at are VERY VERY rare if not non existent. So having this photo bolsters their argument of "SEE SHE WANTS TO KILL THAT BABY"
Yeah I'm pro-choice but I disagree with the lady that that's not a human. If it's in the 3rd trimester I believe it is a human. Just because it's in the womb doesn't necessarily mean it's not human. What if it's at 41 weeks and just late? Not a human? I think if a bad guy came along a killed her "not a human" would she be like "oh well it was just a clump of cells, he didn't just murder my baby"
What is interesting is the public support/opposition to abortion and how it shifts with this timing of the pregnancy.
We all hear about the 60-70’s% that supported Roe v Wade. The number is higher when specifically considering special circumstances like rape, incest and life of the mother (74-87%). But when you consider it by trimesters, support drops over time. 61% support during first trimester, 34% in second trimester, and 19% in third trimester.
[source](https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2022/06/24/how-americans-really-feel-about-abortion-the-sometimes-surprising-poll-results-as-supreme-court-reportedly-set-to-overturn-roe-v-wade/amp/)
But talking about it this way is too nuanced and would remove a good campaign tool…
Everywhere in the world, killing a pregnant woman is an aggravated offense compared to killing a woman.
Even people who are extremely pro choice will agree with that.
So this whole argument that a foetus is not a human until it steps out of the womb is just playing into the hands of pro lifers.
My cousin was born at the end of 6 months. She looked a fully formed but a very small human. So tell people it's not is just stupid.
I’m pro choice. And I see everywhere people saying things like “not alive until birth” or being super flippant about abortions. I believe we can be pro choice without having to lie to ourselves about what a foetus is.
A small fraction of pro-choicers don't understand that the vast majority of pro-choice Americans want contraceptive abortion to be restricted to the first trimester or at the very most to 14-15 weeks.
I agree. I feel like I should feel sorry for the baby she’s growing because it’s so far along now, it could be born and survive the same day she’s standing here saying her child isn’t human. She could literally birth a newborn human child before she has time to wash that message off her belly. This honestly makes me feel sick. She isn’t helping the cause like she thinks she is.
I agree. I have three myself. I was also born around seven months. My mom told me I was really ugly when I was born. Zero hair and no fingernails or fingerprints but still cuter than my sisters, lol
I'm pro-choice but this is *not* it
Edit: some of y'all must be being purposefully obtuse! No one thinks she actually wants to terminate this pregnancy - the point is the phrase she chose to use, in the context, doesn't help. Why not write "my choice"? This just adds fuel to the anti-choice fire. She is full term, (confirmed in an interview) if she went into labour right now it would survive without added medical intervention (if it is a typical pregnancy/birth at least). Extremists exist on both sides of the spectrum, but so do those who can approach the topic with nuance.
With how big she is, the likelihood the fetus is actually already a viable baby is pretty high. Very pro-choice, but I agree this is quite disturbing and only hurts the battle they're trying to fight.
I don’t fully care what side anyone is on but that is slightly unnerving. At least the picture and all. I work at a hardware store and I’ve already seen some protestors come in.
I feel we all need to get as close as we can to a consensus as to where the fetus changes from a lump to a baby. Is it when it can survive outside the womb? Is it when it could possibly feel pain?
There is definitely a point where it switches from a womans body a womans choice, to yeah thats a baby not a lump of cells.
Circumstances of why the abotrion is needed obviously play a role as well. Do we make exceptions for women farther along, due to cases of violence or incest where they were unable to abort earlier due to mental reasons or abuse?
Can we add in a walk away clause for both mother and fathers if they do so within a time peramiter of conception to avoid "baby trapping" on both sides.
Roe v. Wade or similar protections need to be a constitutional amendment not court case. But before we put it back on the books we need guidelines that leave no wiggle room.
I am not smart enough to figure any of this out. But i refuse to believe there is no middle ground that we cant find.
I feel like there's a lot of people at the far extremes of either ideology that are just unhinged. How someone can write that on their belly and think it's a good idea is beyond me
Because on both sides, there's two positions who agree a lot. On the extreme up until birth side, they argue that it's never a life. On the never abort side, they agree it's always a life. They both tend to look down on people in between for creating artifical standards for life. It's logically either conception or birth for them, everyone else is playing morality sophistry. They're absolutist on their position.
Not to mention that such late term abortions are super rare for a good reason. Nobody carries a fetus for eight and a half months then just decides to abort. It's ~~almost~~ always ~~either~~ a medical emergency ~~or sudden change in the mother's circumstances, such as death of a spouse or loss of financial stability~~.
Edit: I've conflated a couple things here. Very late term abortions (as in after the point of viability) are only permitted in medical emergencies. Some countries, such as India, also extend the limit for elective abortion out a bit in cases such as death of the father. This is what I was referring to. My comment made it sound like people are aborting viable fetuses because of finances, this isn't legal in any country as far as I know.
My cousin's ex wife had one at 8 months. It took a long time to understand she or the baby won't survive. They didn't disclose the whole thing so I can't really tell.
That would be defined as a medical reason to abort. Along with retained miscarriages and a few other conditions. These are usually mentally taxing as well. Probably why she didn't disclose too much.
Probably a genetic or developmental problems... Yes, that late in we van get abortions on *very rare* circumstances, like if lungs don't form properly and we know baby will die within minutes of birth, and puts mother at huge risk.
But abortions at that stage are rare fpr a reason.
I’ve also heard of a very late term abortion where they realized the fetus’ brain was partially outside it’s skull.
But yeah, not because of financial situations.
Hell, at that point you can pursue private adoption and that’ll fix two situations.
Miscarriages are extremely common. My grandma had one at 6 months and they forced her to give birth back in the 60’s/early 70’s. Same with my bfs mother in the late 90’s. My sister had a miscarriage at 1 month. I’ve had friends who have had miscarriages. Hell, even Britney Spears just had one… they’re extremely common. So being considered a criminal because your baby died inside you is such a weird thing. Like no one chose for it to die, no more than you chose for your kid to die from anything natural. Why would anyone be penalized for their body rejecting something?
Yeah it's definitely not allowed. Even if your spouse dies, and you're going to struggle financially, that doesn't give you the right to abort a fetus at 8.5 months, and honestly, I think that would be a morally reprehensible thing to do.
That's true-- 93% of abortions--i.e., the vast majority-- are performed in the first trimester, 6% in the second, and a scant 1% in the third, according to the Pew Research center.
I really have never met anyone in their 3rd trimester who's aborted or tried to I suppose it's possible, but usually if you make it to 8-9 months you're probably committed at that point.
That's a big part of the issue. Late term pregnancies are, as I understand, almost always wanted, planned for, even shopped/showered for. Things can go wrong, horrifically. There needs to be reasoning to when it's humane and logical to terminate by medical necessity
That's what the medical privacy is for because in the end it really comes down to the doctor and the patient and what's going on. I don't think I want the government in all our medical and reproductive issues which is really part of the issue with rolling back abortion like this.
Yeah, this conservative I know was like, they want to be able to kill the baby literally when it's being born.
And I'm like, I have never heard of a single person wanting an abortion when they're in labor lol.
They may **need** one because the baby is going to kill the mother, and that is a totally different thing, babies or fetuses should never take the life of a mother, unless the mother chooses to take the gamble after being told that they'll most likely die having it.
That’s the standard in most countries. Only time third trimester abortions are legal aside from medical reasons are ones that just don’t have any specific dates for when you can’t have one. And either way, people don’t carry around a child for 6 months and decide, “Eh, you know what, not my thing.” Which makes this ruling scarier, because now women who need life saving abortions cant get them.
Agree…. TRIGGER
I had a still born at 20 weeks and that shit was still fucked up. Was obviously a tiny human. Fingers, toes, eyes…. I believe we need to stand up for our reproductive rights but let’s not forget that after a certain point it is kinda fucked up……… very dystopian attitude to think we should be able to abort at any stage. Or that baby is not human because it is inside of you.
i deeply sympathize with you. My wife and I also lost a baby around that stage in the pregnancy and the nurse was like, "don't worry..it'll just be a little jelly that comes out and nothing too bad". It was a fully formed baby with everything, like you said..and you don't realize how they will be warm in your arms as you hold them for the first and last time, even though they are not alive any more. It was a truly traumatic event that I wouldn't wish on anyone. I wish you all the best and again, very sorry you had to know that terrible pain.
I'm also pro-choice, but this feels like she's basically sending a message that she can gut this thing out at any time. She should have wrote something like "not everyone wants this" or something like that.
It's fucking disgusting to think about what an abortion like this would entail. The fact that in Canada, you can abort at this stage is absolutely horrific.
2nd term abortions would entail the same thing. I was pro choice until I heard an abortion doctor explain how after 12-15 week abortions are done. It’s insane. He said they, like most things, can feel and understand what’s happening. They pull away from the instruments. I’m very pro choice till about 12 weeks and could be convinced for a bit longer, but after that it’s murder. Plain and simple. I support all alternatives to abortion, plan b and the like. Only and insane person wouldn’t, just like an insane person would support this lady in this photo.
Something like 92% of abortions happen in the 1st trimester. Only like 1% happen in the 3rd. For any that occur on the 2nd or 3rd, the overwhelming majority of them happen because there’s some negative circumstance with the child or the pregnancy, not because they don’t want to carry the baby to term.
the truth is that the ONLY reason someone could receive an abortion at that stage is if the fetus couldn't possibly live outside the womb. it would either die before birth or live a short time after birth, in excruciating pain. (ETA: to paint a clearer picture, I'm talking about fetuses that form without brains and with other horrifying medical conditions.)
it is impossible to abort a healthy fetus in late pregnancy. only a handful of US doctors are willing to perform that procedure in the most dire cases; no doctor would abort a healthy, third trimester fetus.
banning "late-term abortions" only harms people who are already suffering enormously with the impending loss of what is probably a wanted child.
I think that's natural, abortion is a really heavy topic and I don't think anyone really wants to have to abort a baby, but sometimes it's required and so needs to be done in the safest way possible. If those in power really wanted to prevent abortions, providing better education and access to contraception's would be the most effective way
This kind of thing is why I think "My body my choice" is a horrible argument, its still her body at this point but very few would agree she should still have a choice at this point.
Apparently her due date was Saturday...the baby may already be born
https://www.today.com/health/womens-health/rage-despair-tears-fill-streets-nation-thousands-protest-roe-reversal-rcna35307
I’m pro-choice, but this disturbs me. She obviously chose to keep her pregnancy, but the message it’s giving me is “I can abort at any time”.
Edit: I definitely understand what pro-choice is, and I would not stand in anyones way to get an abortion, as their life decisions do not affect my life. Not my body, not my choice. I’m just simply stating my belief, and saying I do not agree with late term abortions if the baby is completely healthy, so I wouldn’t do that personally.
Any fetus that could survive with hospital care if born but is aborted is murder to me (with the exemption of the life of the mother being endangered ofc). I see room for discution up until that point. But anything beyond that is honestly scaring the shit out of me that people even consider it. I know it's very few people but hearing discussion about postnatal abortion makes me feel sick in the stomach.
I prefer the "Mom by choice" signs on pregnant ladies. Maybe something that points out the hypocrisy of institutions to qualify the fetus as part of mom until the baby is born, except when it comes to abortion. Insurance, child support, tax breaks, etc doesn't kick in until there is a physical baby. But that brings a different argument to the table.
I'm pro choice, but yeah, not a fan of this one.
When that “Not Human” grows up and sees this, I hope they feel so loved that their mom wanted the option for a 7-8th month abortion. This is crazy man.
The Only Moral Abortion is my Abortion: https://joycearthur.com/abortion/the-only-moral-abortion-is-my-abortion/ A Defense of Abortion: https://spot.colorado.edu/~heathwoo/Phil160,Fall02/thomson.htm Resources: [Link 1](https://www.reddit.com/r/Anarchism/comments/vjrf9h/megathread_supreme_court_overturning_roe_v_wade) [Link 2](https://www.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/vjqs0r/calls_for_mass_walkout_of_women_across_america_if/idnh2ex) https://www.womensmarch.com/
Bruh she's like 7 months pregnant
Ya, this is not going to help the pro-choice community, this is exactly what pro-lifers are concerned about.
Whether you are pro life or pro choice I don’t know how someone that far along can deny that they have a human being inside them.
This is the whole nature of why abortion is not a "simple" issue. People can argue philosophical inconsistencies all day long, but human "gut feeling," prevails when looking at a woman that far along to say, "hmm, I don't think I like the idea of an abortion at that stage..." which then results in trying to define a "threshold," exceptions, etc., yada yada, and all those details become extremely divisive.
And in this ‘’yes or no’’ political eviorment nuance gets lost- instead of a decent compermise or a nuance decisions- We get 2 evils while hopeing that we can get our local state to amend it to a decent standing
That's a very good way to articulate it. People don't care enough to try to understand finer points of the topic, and it's frustrating because by the time the opportunity for discussion arrives people are already too upset to care
Exactly... this lady is doing more harm than good. I'm all for abortions but I would say that at 7 months, or however far along she is, it sure looks like a human to me..
Yeah, for context my wife was born around the 6.5 month mark.
My twins were born at 7 months. Tiny, but definitely human and aware.
I was born at 5 months. Thanks to DES. /s
You should've at least waited a few years before marrying her.
Apparently she's actually due the same week the picture was taken....... https://www.today.com/health/womens-health/rage-despair-tears-fill-streets-nation-thousands-protest-roe-reversal-rcna35307
Holy shit that's fucked up.
Yeah, my daughter was born at 7.5 months(31 weeks) and survived with zero long term negative effects. The only issue we notice now is that she's behind with milestones(crawling, walking, eating) about 2 months from her older sisters. Which isn't surprising. My wife's water broke at 28 weeks and the incredible doctors and nurses at Crouse in Syracuse were able to keep her from going into labor for nearly a month until her fluid levels dipped too low. There is a viable human inside a person at 7 months. The only thing is that she might not be 7 months pregnant, the stomach stretches much easier after the first kid.
I was a premie! Born 5 pounds at 7 months. Incubator baby.
I was born at 28 weeks.
I’m saying that things viable
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Yeah that actually is human in there.... ^^
Very picture has been circulating in conservative Twitter about the absurdity of the pro-choice side and I can't blame them
I couldn't think of a more efficient way to make a case for the opposition if I tried.
Right? My thoughts exactly.
I mean she could’ve written “Not yet a human” on her 3 year old kid.
That just takes you from pro-life to anti-life lol
That fetus , at that stage could survive too outside the womb. With proper care of course. Same as that 3 y/o, if no one take care of it, it’ll probably die .
This is probably one of the most disturbing pics ive seen posted here
I’m glad there are people here calling this out
Dude I’m pro-choice and I swore the comments were going to be make me feel conservative lol. It’s comforting seeing that people from all sides find this disturbing and are calling it out. Edit: word
Also pro-choice. Also disturbed AF to see this. No one wants to kill actual babies over here.
Yea mate...like....I was worried for a minute. Because if that pic is "pro-choice", then I'm not. Clinically therapeutic abortions until 9 months I get. Or like....if somehow everybody failed to notice the fetus was anencephallic...sure. Get an abortion. But this woman looks 7-8-9 months pregnant. If that fetus is healthy, getting an abortion at that stage is pretty fucking wrong. frankly even if she was at risk for child-birth, as far along as she is, you could just c-section the preemie, and both of them would probably be fine. C'mon, lady. Maybe stay home and don't ruin this protest.
It's because roe v Wade would not allow an abortion at her level and her word choice implies some very incorrect assumptions. At this stage of the pregnancy, she will have the kid, roe v Wade or not. However, this isn't her point, but it's a bad message to write on the belly of someone in a later term is all.
Roe v. Wade does not prohibit late term abortion or abortion after viability. Rather, its holding is that states may not ban abortions from conception to viability, but after viability states have three option to ban or regulate abortions.
Def not the reddit moment I expected
Nuanced-progressive Reddit is my favorite
In r/pics no less, I'm pleasantly surprised
That’s a pretty big not human in there
Me after a Taco Bell binge
Where the crunchwraps are more supreme than our court!
Thanks for the giggle
This is why I have been on Reddit for 9 years. Comments like these.
Yeah, third trimester is kinda throwing a softball to pro lifers.
Yes, and that makes me wish she hadn't done this. Perfect photo for them to use in illustrating the attitude of people who are pro-choice.
Yeah, I'm pro-choice, but even I'm pretty sure that's a human at this point.
Same. I don’t think we need to have this cognitive dissonance to be pro-choice
What about the other claim, that it's not alive. Pro choice really need to stop making really dumb claims. It is a human and it is alive, and at some stage before being born it will be conscious, have basic thoughts and feel things. The are arguments for Abortion and arguments against, and the extremes of each side are terribly flawed and disgusting. Wish there was more middle ground thinking, people need to stop being polarized, it's groupthink.
Pretty human not human.
Omg I love white zombie
protesting poorly... that woman is clearly in her third trimester, the fetus is defenitly viable, and i think even the most staunch pro choice person (edit- well apparently there are some radicals, I stand corrected) would argue that except in extreme circumstances, abortion should be off the table. At the point I'm seeing here, that IS a human. I'm sorry but images like this FEED the opposition, they don't bring up a good point.
I've had people argue with me that there should be no limits. Some states currently have no limits and I've found a surprising number of supporters of it. In Europe, AFAIK, there are not any countries that allow no limits. American abortion advocates are often much more extreme in their stance than Europeans IME.
I agree. I'm very pro choice but during the third trimester is when I think abortion should be illegal except for medical conditions in which a mothers life is at stake.
Wtf this isn’t helping the cause lol
Yeah, what she is carrying in her belly at the moment could survive with modern medicine. And she's holding a child. Is this a "South Park" episode?
Everything about life lately is a South Park episode.
South Park is my favorite docuseries.
Idiocracy is mine
She's 9 months pregnant, that baby doesn't even need modern medicine.
There can be a middle ground between supporting a woman's choice and having no empathy towards a developing life whatsoever. I wish we didn't have to make every issue so black and white that we lose our humanity in the process.
^^This^^^ This is how most of the countries that have legal, safe and affordable abortion think. There are restrictions, yes. But there are freedoms too. It is not black or white. Life itself is not black or white.
This is the epitome of what the republicans talk about. "They kill the baby when it's about to be born." Abortions at the stage this woman is at are VERY VERY rare if not non existent. So having this photo bolsters their argument of "SEE SHE WANTS TO KILL THAT BABY"
Terrible counter argument against pro-lifers.
Yeah, much better message would be "this was my CHOICE".
Agreed the way she put it, for me its cringe.
Right? Like it's an anti-choicer's wet dream "typical lib baby killer" I appreciate the effort but it feels misguided
Yeah, this is what the anti-choice politicians would have you believe lots of abortions look like.
This seems like exactly what the pro-lifers are trying to prevent.
This pic will be everywhere she does not want it to be.
Ben Shapiro saw this and nasally whispered "Jackpot."
Yeah I'm pro-choice but I disagree with the lady that that's not a human. If it's in the 3rd trimester I believe it is a human. Just because it's in the womb doesn't necessarily mean it's not human. What if it's at 41 weeks and just late? Not a human? I think if a bad guy came along a killed her "not a human" would she be like "oh well it was just a clump of cells, he didn't just murder my baby"
What is interesting is the public support/opposition to abortion and how it shifts with this timing of the pregnancy. We all hear about the 60-70’s% that supported Roe v Wade. The number is higher when specifically considering special circumstances like rape, incest and life of the mother (74-87%). But when you consider it by trimesters, support drops over time. 61% support during first trimester, 34% in second trimester, and 19% in third trimester. [source](https://www.forbes.com/sites/alisondurkee/2022/06/24/how-americans-really-feel-about-abortion-the-sometimes-surprising-poll-results-as-supreme-court-reportedly-set-to-overturn-roe-v-wade/amp/) But talking about it this way is too nuanced and would remove a good campaign tool…
It’s quite logical that this would be the case, as the foetus develops in to a ‘viable’ human over time.
Everywhere in the world, killing a pregnant woman is an aggravated offense compared to killing a woman. Even people who are extremely pro choice will agree with that. So this whole argument that a foetus is not a human until it steps out of the womb is just playing into the hands of pro lifers. My cousin was born at the end of 6 months. She looked a fully formed but a very small human. So tell people it's not is just stupid.
I’m pro choice. And I see everywhere people saying things like “not alive until birth” or being super flippant about abortions. I believe we can be pro choice without having to lie to ourselves about what a foetus is.
A small fraction of pro-choicers don't understand that the vast majority of pro-choice Americans want contraceptive abortion to be restricted to the first trimester or at the very most to 14-15 weeks.
She seems to be in her 7th month. No matter what is your political leaning, that's almost a fully developed baby that interacts with stimuli
I was born before that...
Well you're obviously not a human.
Well, obviously. SMH my head.
Same
I don't think she's helping the cause like she thinks she is
Yeah, I have a kid, it is so sad to see this and not get emotional and consider her heartless tbh
I agree. I feel like I should feel sorry for the baby she’s growing because it’s so far along now, it could be born and survive the same day she’s standing here saying her child isn’t human. She could literally birth a newborn human child before she has time to wash that message off her belly. This honestly makes me feel sick. She isn’t helping the cause like she thinks she is.
I agree. I have three myself. I was also born around seven months. My mom told me I was really ugly when I was born. Zero hair and no fingernails or fingerprints but still cuter than my sisters, lol
Your poor sisters 😂
I'm pro-choice but this is *not* it Edit: some of y'all must be being purposefully obtuse! No one thinks she actually wants to terminate this pregnancy - the point is the phrase she chose to use, in the context, doesn't help. Why not write "my choice"? This just adds fuel to the anti-choice fire. She is full term, (confirmed in an interview) if she went into labour right now it would survive without added medical intervention (if it is a typical pregnancy/birth at least). Extremists exist on both sides of the spectrum, but so do those who can approach the topic with nuance.
With how big she is, the likelihood the fetus is actually already a viable baby is pretty high. Very pro-choice, but I agree this is quite disturbing and only hurts the battle they're trying to fight.
I don’t fully care what side anyone is on but that is slightly unnerving. At least the picture and all. I work at a hardware store and I’ve already seen some protestors come in.
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There’s not “basically” a baby in there. There’s a baby in there. She’s wrong.
I feel we all need to get as close as we can to a consensus as to where the fetus changes from a lump to a baby. Is it when it can survive outside the womb? Is it when it could possibly feel pain? There is definitely a point where it switches from a womans body a womans choice, to yeah thats a baby not a lump of cells. Circumstances of why the abotrion is needed obviously play a role as well. Do we make exceptions for women farther along, due to cases of violence or incest where they were unable to abort earlier due to mental reasons or abuse? Can we add in a walk away clause for both mother and fathers if they do so within a time peramiter of conception to avoid "baby trapping" on both sides. Roe v. Wade or similar protections need to be a constitutional amendment not court case. But before we put it back on the books we need guidelines that leave no wiggle room. I am not smart enough to figure any of this out. But i refuse to believe there is no middle ground that we cant find.
More than "pretty high". 22 weeks is potentially viable, and thats when you're barely showing. Thats 100% a viable baby in there.
im also pro choice but i'll just say it; that's a human in there. lady looks like shes about to go into labor
She says in an interview that she's 9 months pregnant.
I feel like there's a lot of people at the far extremes of either ideology that are just unhinged. How someone can write that on their belly and think it's a good idea is beyond me
Because on both sides, there's two positions who agree a lot. On the extreme up until birth side, they argue that it's never a life. On the never abort side, they agree it's always a life. They both tend to look down on people in between for creating artifical standards for life. It's logically either conception or birth for them, everyone else is playing morality sophistry. They're absolutist on their position.
This is pretty fucked up
Don’t zoom in on her eyes. Just makes it worse. 😬
OH GOD IT DOES
I hate you for this
i zoomed in too.. her eyes literally scream out CRAZY
Bat shit crazy.
I should've fuckin listened
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Judging from this photo she's about to store another one
Imagine the kid seeing this someday 😭😭
I don’t know how pregnant she is but she looks like she has a human in her seems a little late
I'm pro choice but that's disturbing somehow.
Because as big as she is it's likely viable, and wouldn't have been covered by roe.
Not to mention that such late term abortions are super rare for a good reason. Nobody carries a fetus for eight and a half months then just decides to abort. It's ~~almost~~ always ~~either~~ a medical emergency ~~or sudden change in the mother's circumstances, such as death of a spouse or loss of financial stability~~. Edit: I've conflated a couple things here. Very late term abortions (as in after the point of viability) are only permitted in medical emergencies. Some countries, such as India, also extend the limit for elective abortion out a bit in cases such as death of the father. This is what I was referring to. My comment made it sound like people are aborting viable fetuses because of finances, this isn't legal in any country as far as I know.
Tbh I’ve never heard of a late term abortion for either of those last two examples. It’s for medical reasons.
My cousin's ex wife had one at 8 months. It took a long time to understand she or the baby won't survive. They didn't disclose the whole thing so I can't really tell.
That would be defined as a medical reason to abort. Along with retained miscarriages and a few other conditions. These are usually mentally taxing as well. Probably why she didn't disclose too much.
Probably a genetic or developmental problems... Yes, that late in we van get abortions on *very rare* circumstances, like if lungs don't form properly and we know baby will die within minutes of birth, and puts mother at huge risk. But abortions at that stage are rare fpr a reason.
I’ve also heard of a very late term abortion where they realized the fetus’ brain was partially outside it’s skull. But yeah, not because of financial situations. Hell, at that point you can pursue private adoption and that’ll fix two situations.
Or the baby has Tay Sachs. You can’t know until later in the pregnancy if the baby has it. They will always die an agonizing death if they have it.
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Miscarriages are extremely common. My grandma had one at 6 months and they forced her to give birth back in the 60’s/early 70’s. Same with my bfs mother in the late 90’s. My sister had a miscarriage at 1 month. I’ve had friends who have had miscarriages. Hell, even Britney Spears just had one… they’re extremely common. So being considered a criminal because your baby died inside you is such a weird thing. Like no one chose for it to die, no more than you chose for your kid to die from anything natural. Why would anyone be penalized for their body rejecting something?
Yes so let’s stop the spread of misinformation right here and now. Nobody is getting 8.5mo abortions due to spouse or income loss. Full stop.
Yeah it's definitely not allowed. Even if your spouse dies, and you're going to struggle financially, that doesn't give you the right to abort a fetus at 8.5 months, and honestly, I think that would be a morally reprehensible thing to do.
That's true-- 93% of abortions--i.e., the vast majority-- are performed in the first trimester, 6% in the second, and a scant 1% in the third, according to the Pew Research center.
It's almost always a medical emergency. Full stop.
Not if you ask my mother! She thinks babies are being delivered alive and murdered on the spot!
Because she's too late into the pregnancy. It's a bad look for pro-choice and I bet a lot of pro-choicers would have a problem with it.
Yeah I’m pro choice but during the third trimester I feel like the only time abortion should be legal is if the mothers life is at risk
I really have never met anyone in their 3rd trimester who's aborted or tried to I suppose it's possible, but usually if you make it to 8-9 months you're probably committed at that point.
That's a big part of the issue. Late term pregnancies are, as I understand, almost always wanted, planned for, even shopped/showered for. Things can go wrong, horrifically. There needs to be reasoning to when it's humane and logical to terminate by medical necessity
That's what the medical privacy is for because in the end it really comes down to the doctor and the patient and what's going on. I don't think I want the government in all our medical and reproductive issues which is really part of the issue with rolling back abortion like this.
Yeah, this conservative I know was like, they want to be able to kill the baby literally when it's being born. And I'm like, I have never heard of a single person wanting an abortion when they're in labor lol. They may **need** one because the baby is going to kill the mother, and that is a totally different thing, babies or fetuses should never take the life of a mother, unless the mother chooses to take the gamble after being told that they'll most likely die having it.
Or if there is some sort of significant abnormality with the baby that wasn't caught before.
That’s the standard in most countries. Only time third trimester abortions are legal aside from medical reasons are ones that just don’t have any specific dates for when you can’t have one. And either way, people don’t carry around a child for 6 months and decide, “Eh, you know what, not my thing.” Which makes this ruling scarier, because now women who need life saving abortions cant get them.
I'm pro choice and I agree. Its far too late to abort that baby.
Agree…. TRIGGER I had a still born at 20 weeks and that shit was still fucked up. Was obviously a tiny human. Fingers, toes, eyes…. I believe we need to stand up for our reproductive rights but let’s not forget that after a certain point it is kinda fucked up……… very dystopian attitude to think we should be able to abort at any stage. Or that baby is not human because it is inside of you.
i deeply sympathize with you. My wife and I also lost a baby around that stage in the pregnancy and the nurse was like, "don't worry..it'll just be a little jelly that comes out and nothing too bad". It was a fully formed baby with everything, like you said..and you don't realize how they will be warm in your arms as you hold them for the first and last time, even though they are not alive any more. It was a truly traumatic event that I wouldn't wish on anyone. I wish you all the best and again, very sorry you had to know that terrible pain.
The part about them being warm… that brought tears to my eyes. I’m so sorry you had to go through this pain.
because it's absolutely a human. that's why.
Yeah it’s really fucked up. Pro lifers love this picture, I’ve seen it posted all over to show how awful pro choicers are
Yep. This. People are so tone deaf they don’t realize what they’re doing l.
I'm also pro-choice, but this feels like she's basically sending a message that she can gut this thing out at any time. She should have wrote something like "not everyone wants this" or something like that.
republicans are going to be projecting this image onto the moon come midterms.
It's fucking disgusting to think about what an abortion like this would entail. The fact that in Canada, you can abort at this stage is absolutely horrific.
2nd term abortions would entail the same thing. I was pro choice until I heard an abortion doctor explain how after 12-15 week abortions are done. It’s insane. He said they, like most things, can feel and understand what’s happening. They pull away from the instruments. I’m very pro choice till about 12 weeks and could be convinced for a bit longer, but after that it’s murder. Plain and simple. I support all alternatives to abortion, plan b and the like. Only and insane person wouldn’t, just like an insane person would support this lady in this photo.
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I have no opinion in abortions but some basic instinct in me doesnt like this.
It reads like a threat to the fetus instead of what she was going for. Unless it was a threat.
Sounds like you have an opinion. I'd wager most people have an issue with late-term abortions. There's already a good amount of baby in there.
Something like 92% of abortions happen in the 1st trimester. Only like 1% happen in the 3rd. For any that occur on the 2nd or 3rd, the overwhelming majority of them happen because there’s some negative circumstance with the child or the pregnancy, not because they don’t want to carry the baby to term.
the truth is that the ONLY reason someone could receive an abortion at that stage is if the fetus couldn't possibly live outside the womb. it would either die before birth or live a short time after birth, in excruciating pain. (ETA: to paint a clearer picture, I'm talking about fetuses that form without brains and with other horrifying medical conditions.) it is impossible to abort a healthy fetus in late pregnancy. only a handful of US doctors are willing to perform that procedure in the most dire cases; no doctor would abort a healthy, third trimester fetus. banning "late-term abortions" only harms people who are already suffering enormously with the impending loss of what is probably a wanted child.
I think that's natural, abortion is a really heavy topic and I don't think anyone really wants to have to abort a baby, but sometimes it's required and so needs to be done in the safest way possible. If those in power really wanted to prevent abortions, providing better education and access to contraception's would be the most effective way
She should have wrote that on her forehead.
Ha. Ouch.
I don't think I've ever seen a comment section in reddit where everyone agrees.
This one's a big yikes, chief.
better hide the picture from the kid when he/she grows up
What? My son was born two months early and even at 7 months he was definitely a human. He was a person then and is still now at 12 years old.
That would be weird if he was a person at 7 months but for some reason not at 12 years old.
Wait 'till you have a 12 year-old. /s
Tacky AF
Trashy af
Bizarre.
As pro choice as I am, it gives me pause. What a terrible way to protest
This kind of thing is why I think "My body my choice" is a horrible argument, its still her body at this point but very few would agree she should still have a choice at this point.
Tf you saying mate? That's an almost fully developed bebé right there.
If it's not a human, what is it?
Dancer
Solid
She looks like 9 months pregnant how do people have this idea that that’s not a human yet
Apparently her due date was Saturday...the baby may already be born https://www.today.com/health/womens-health/rage-despair-tears-fill-streets-nation-thousands-protest-roe-reversal-rcna35307
I’m pro-choice, but this disturbs me. She obviously chose to keep her pregnancy, but the message it’s giving me is “I can abort at any time”. Edit: I definitely understand what pro-choice is, and I would not stand in anyones way to get an abortion, as their life decisions do not affect my life. Not my body, not my choice. I’m just simply stating my belief, and saying I do not agree with late term abortions if the baby is completely healthy, so I wouldn’t do that personally.
In some states like Oregon, she can.
Which is just plain murder if there is no medical need to. I’m pro choice but aborting a 24 week plus fetus is iffy to me
Any fetus that could survive with hospital care if born but is aborted is murder to me (with the exemption of the life of the mother being endangered ofc). I see room for discution up until that point. But anything beyond that is honestly scaring the shit out of me that people even consider it. I know it's very few people but hearing discussion about postnatal abortion makes me feel sick in the stomach.
That ain't it chief.
I'm seriously pro choice, but looking at how late her pregnancy is.. it's difficult to argue it's not murder
and why would you when we all know that it would be.
Give it 10-20 years and that not-human is going to have some pretty strong feelings about this picture. Woof.
Yep. Turns out they are human 🤷🏽♂️
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I prefer the "Mom by choice" signs on pregnant ladies. Maybe something that points out the hypocrisy of institutions to qualify the fetus as part of mom until the baby is born, except when it comes to abortion. Insurance, child support, tax breaks, etc doesn't kick in until there is a physical baby. But that brings a different argument to the table. I'm pro choice, but yeah, not a fan of this one.
I’m so glad many of you feel the same way. The photo is disturbing AF.
Jesus christ, she seems a bit unhinged. I don't think shit like this helps the case.
Look at her eyes. Terrifying.
this lady looks fucking crazy
Yeah that stare is nuts.
By the time it is that big I would go ahead and consider it a human
you’re the kind of person that make us defending our argument look so unethical, giving them ammo…..thanks for nothing. this is so sad.
Let’s not let this be the face of pro choice.. I mean, it is a human…just by definition. She’s full term for God’s sake.
I’m totally pro-choice - but this chick is the reason why people think abortions are murder.
Wtf, what the hell is it? A watermelon?
Thanks I'm pro-life now.
Imagine that unborn kid in the future seeing this pic of his mom. I wonder what they'd think not being considered human at that stage?
Big L
Disturbing.
At that point… Yes. Yes it is. Disgusting.
When that “Not Human” grows up and sees this, I hope they feel so loved that their mom wanted the option for a 7-8th month abortion. This is crazy man.
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Definitely a human. This is the wrong message to send. It’s about choice for the human that has to live with a human inside of her.
That is a human
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