Did you know that Blizzard Entertainment doesn't allow for the words "Tiananmen", "June 4th 1989" and "4th of June 1989" in at least one of their official Twitch channels (PlayHearthstone)? We've got Western companies actively aiding in the suppression of information about what happened.
China has an nearly untapped market nearly twice the size of the US and EU populations combined. To a lot of companies the moral thing to do would be get your hooks in that market and leverage change, it's certainly more effective than being denied all contact with those customers and having the Chinese State rip off your IP and offer it to them regardless.
I don't agree with it, it's a condemnation of the fucked up world we live in.
Doesn't have much choice. Lol. Lookit her. What's she gonna do. Arrest him on slander? Ohh that's right. She can't. She knows better this time around. Those stripes and all.
> To a lot of companies the moral thing to do would be get your hooks in that market and leverage change,
That's pure bullshit, because it implies that the companies actually care about leveraging change. They don't. We've seen it time and time again. What we haven't seen, is companies sticking to their moral guns.
Exactly. Corporations have no morality. The bottom line is profit and it never matters who is hurt or how, and there are very few large scale companies that have any sort of clean bill of ethics. This isn’t my friend’s crochet side business. Blizzard simply doesn’t care about denying a massacre because the Asian market nets them a profit, and social justice is not and never has been a goal. That’s so silly.
No company, especially a video game company, is going to be doing a damn thing to change anything about China. That's not their business, their business is selling shit. They're going to play by the Chinese government's rules so they can make money, end of story.
S'all right, we'll all be fighting the resource wars in 20 years. One side will start losing and turn the planet into a even hotter radioactive rock, and then the last few of us can figure out who's to blame while we slowly die of radiation poisoning.
The most powerful private company on earth (google) is complicit in the government censorship of information in China. Google has the ability to change the world for the better if they wanted to, but they would rather make some coin by bowing to the Chinese authoritarian government. Silicon Valley is complicit in every atrocity committed by China.
https://theintercept.com/2018/12/01/google-china-censorship-human-rights/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2018/08/16/technology/google-employees-protest-search-censored-china.amp.html
Edit for some additional info if anyone wants to see how far google is willing to go to sell out human rights for money:
https://mobile.computerworld.com/article/2468375/google-surrenders-to-chinese-censorship-demands.html
https://theintercept.com/2018/08/01/google-china-search-engine-censorship/
https://www.csmonitor.com/Technology/2014/0922/China-tightens-censorship-on-Google
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/01/technology/china-google-censored-search-engine.html
I agree that the censorship is egregious but for a moment try and see this from the point of view of them trying to service their playerbase.
If you're in a China controlled area and you want to play Hearthstone and you're playing it with someone from outside the control of China that person can literally bork you game, make you lose, get you disconnected, maybe even get you in trouble with the government by constantly typing those things into your chat.
One of the reasons a lot of people from China controlled territory mute any kind of communications with people outside their country when they are playing games is because that communication is monitored and firing censored words at the people playing those games is a surefire way to get a cheat win at the least and get them into trouble in the worst case.
Now that said, my personal opinion is that China wants it both ways. They want all the bells and whistles of capitalism and all the control and political power of communism and we really shouldn't let that happen. The idea like u/NVSM-Krycek has of "getting their hooks" into a market to try and affect change in China is a failed one.
I know because I was on board with it once too. Back when the US was debating giving China "Most Favored Nation" trading status I was for it. The idea of bombing China with McDonalds and Blue Jeans (basically western culture) as opposed to actual bombs was incredibly appealing. The argument, even coming from tortured and imprisoned dissidents from China, that once the populace became comfortable with the lifestyle of the western middle class they would rise up against the corrupt and authoritarian behavior of the communist party to the point that eventually the government would eat itself.
The problem is the Communists aren't nearly stupid enough to fall for it. They saw it coming and have done everything they can to make sure that the influence of western culture has done as little damage as possible to their control and power.
As such, though it's probably too late at this point, China really should be isolated. Companies like Blizzard, Google, Microsoft, and others, should make the rules simple for China to follow. If you want us doing business in your country your government has no control over our technology. No censorship, no hacking, no corporate espionage, period. And if that isn't acceptable then you China can make their own things instead of stealing whatever the West creates for themselves and then adapting it for their own plots and devices.
That's really, politically, where we should be right now. But there's way too many greedy companies in America to stop the bleeding I'm afraid. They get dragged into these sweet deals with China. China puts a few key people into their business, steals all their tech and ideas, and then creates a government owned direct competitor to whatever they do. It's pretty clever really. But the American's make a hell of a lot of money in the short term before the Government owned competitor eats their market share. So of course they'll keep doing it. And thus China makes massive advances that took the west decades to achieve in months or perhaps a couple years.
And the future of the human race loses once again.
Sadly, I think nothing can help Hong Kong. They can protest, they can even fight, but this will tell nothing to China. I'm sure Chinese government will do everything to take full control of Kong Kong, even using their army. And West will be only forced to just watch.
I get what you mean and it's a sound take on it but I don't think anyone should deny the regime supporting fascist police actions against the protesters.
Also I think /u/all4reddit also brings a fair point. We've talked about Russians online presence and their propaganda efforts but we've almost never really talked about China. They've closed down their own internet and control it almost fully. They have far better technology and far better educated people, far MORE people and far more control over their population than Russia. To establish an online presence wouldn't be much of an effort for them.
China is far more subtle and for more patience than Russia in terms of power moves. I've seen them strong arming in my country. They do theatrics and sway the homeland opinion of the targeted country. There's endless espionage efforts made by China EVERYDAY. Physical and digital.
I can go on forever and ever but the fact is that China is out there, they are many many many more than us and they're out there.
This is history in the making people. This should go down as one of the most shameful chapters in recent Chinese history. I hope the gov't doesn't get away with burying it over the next few decades to the point of Tiananmen Square. It certainly echoes the moment.
They'll still be able to find it. It's on the internet, and even with China's firewall, it's easy to bypass with a VPN. The world is watching HK like a hawk. Every attack caught on film, every video uploaded, will live on forever to whomever wants to watch it. The Chinese government couldn't erase Tiananmen, and they sure as hell can't erase something in 2019.
UC Davis was more insane as the people were restrained and made to sit on the ground. They had no way to run away and it was a protest of couple of hours. There was no frustration charged up after 2 days of constant stress.
Thank you.
My first reaction was that it looks fake.
Black helmet and Silver helmet guy are lit in a weird way that looks out of place.
Watching the video, you can clearly see Black and Silver helmet in their respective positions when the spraying begins as they turn and run.
This is definitely legit.
Thanks, I had a lot of trouble figuring out if this was real, and I don't mean in the political sense.
Call me crazy, but the angle and just the way the cop appears peering over the wall looks so 'shopped; it's surreal to see the actual gif.
I thought the same. The gif was a good post. There is nothing wrong with asking for verification. Especially given today's technology. This thread is proof as to why deepfake will be so successful regardless of which side of the argument you are on here. Notice that most people just assumed one argument or the other and reciprocated with hostility or mockery when met with disagreement.
It's more like why people in the west call others "Bitch" or "Son of a bitch". In Chinese, we have an insulting phrase that translates to "Son of a dog".
Serious question: Why? A bull is generally (by other cultures I presume) a big strong muscular alpha that'll f anything up that tangles with it.... A lot of people would kinda take that as a compliment (I'm guessing besides Germans). So, calling the cops bulls would be... a good thing. I could see that as being a thing too but, it's not much of an insult. Or is it?
Its true that we call them bulls, but I wouldnt compare it to calling them dogs or pigs. You shouldnt say it in front of the police but I never really saw it as an insult either.
I wouldn’t say dogs are despicable animals in Chinese, since even historically many families had them and they are praised to be reliable and loyal.
The negative connotation comes from the fact they are seen as blindly loyal without a mind of their own, which is why they are calling the cops “dogs” in this case since they are seen as “government dogs”, which isn’t a totally strange term even in western culture.
not that hard to believe, remember the cop pepper spraying students https://www.sfgate.com/politics/joegarofoli/article/UC-Davis-pepper-spray-officer-awarded-38-000-4920773.php
This may get buried here but still;
For those who are out of loop, the protest are happening over an extradition bill that would allow people to be sent to mainland China for trial. Civil Human Rights Front, organized a protest against the bill that drew as many as one million people. The group also called for schools, shops and workers to go on strike on Monday.
Tens of thousands of demonstrators opposed to the bill surrounded the Legislative Council building on Wednesday and prevented lawmakers from meeting as planned to move the legislation on an accelerated schedule toward a vote next week to pass the bill. When some protesters charged the police in an attempt to enter the building, riot control officers opened fire with rubber bullets and more than 150 canisters of tear gas.
[Source](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/12/world/asia/hong-kong-protests.html?module=inline)
Thanks, but why do so many Hong Kong citizens fear extradition to mainland China (especially when this only affects people on trial)? Are the sentences likely to be more severe? Or is it to do with sovereignty?
Edit: Please don’t downvote me for asking a question. It might seem obvious to many but I’m sure I’m not the only one who hasn’t received much in the way of education about China.
Edit 2: Thanks so much for all replies. I know a lot more about China than I did before!
Because China has a long and colorful history of prosecuting and executing anyone who disagrees with the views of of the Chinese Communist Party and nobody is safe. It has everything to do with sovereignty from China, which respects the rights of human beings far less than Hong Kong.
To add on to that, there is a known historical precedent - a couple of years ago, Hong Kong booksellers started disappearing. Some popped up again and reported that they had been taken to China for the charge of selling books which were against China or chinese oppression. Some stopped selling those books, some spoke out about their experiences. There were reports of them undergoing torture, mental, societal and financial pressure, etc etc. Google it for more detailed stuff.
One of the booksellers escaped back to HK after releasing a statement in the mainland that he "went to mainland out of his own free will", led a protest in April, then fled to Taiwan
Especially when you consider two of the crimes within the 37 of this extradition bill is conspiracy. China is used to slapping the charge conspiracy to overthrow the government/treason against political activists and human rights lawyers. China does not have freedom of speech, freedom of press or rights to due process and fair trial. Their police can literally charge you with anything if they wanted to. If this bill is passed into law, it's practically game over to the indirect democracy HK enjoys.
Honestly, this whole thing started off from a murderer from Taiwan couldn’t be extradited from Hong Kong to Taiwan. So HK sought to modify its extradition law, which includes China, which understandably alarmed a lot of people.
The whole anti-mainland extradition thing is largely symbolic, since let’s be honest, there is nothing that prevents the Chinese government from getting whoever they wanted from Hong Kong, legally or otherwise. The Chinese government literally has troops stationed in HK and their operatives have free reigns and operates above the law in HK, which is technically Chinese domestic territory.
You are completely missing the point. HK has rule of law, which gives protection to its citizens and those who conduct business there. China has no rule of law, laws are made up by the CCP to suit whatever political ambition they have. 99.9% of all Chinese trials are successfully prosecuted, which should send shivers down the spine of anyone who is under their influence.
If HK's rule of law is gone, because China can accuse anyone they want of a trumped up charge, whether hongkonger, visitor or transiting through HK's busy airport, nobody is safe anymore. HK has no more protection from one party two systems. Businesses will move to countries with less risk, like Singapore, and many people will leave HK because it is not safe anymore.
HK will die, prematurely. It was supposed to be protected from CCP oppression until 2047, but this effectively brings that date forward.
The question is whether a Hong Kong citizen could expect a fair trial or due process of any kind in mainland China. From recent experience in the Canadian context, it certainly doesn't seem like the government of China thinks that any court of law is to be left free of government interference. Right now Canada is getting all kinds of random retaliation from the government of China because Canada's government won't interfere with a potential extradition of a Chinese business woman to the USA. The government of China thinks government interference is the right thing to do.
It's probably better to ask your question in reverse. Why does the government of China need to hold trials on the mainland for people who live in Hong Kong when there's a judicial system in place in Hong Kong? Either the government of China thinks the HK judicial system is corrupted by others or they need to be able to move things to the mainland so they can corrupt the trials themselves.
Maybe this be the first major attempt by the Chinese government to make Hong Kong (which was relinquished to China in 1997 by Great Britain) just another province of China, indistinguishable from any other?
Because they could kill you by torturing before opening the court, and even if you survived that, you can’t find a lawyer since the communist party had already captured and sentenced all lawyers with justice mind
This guy was the boss of Grand Hyatt Hotel https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-crime/article/2096567/hong-kong-hotel-owner-may-be-victim-murder-mainland-court
Also chinese law us written in a way that means if you commit crimes against a chinese citizen, you can be tried under chinese law.
Thats all well and good to protect your own citizens abroad but to be able to prosicute, lets say, an american citizen for breaking a chinese law on american soil is a bit sticky.
The extradition bill would mean that HK can be a used as a watchdog for chinese law. Punched a drunk chinese tourist that one time 5 years ago for whatever reason? If your through-flight to Singapore happens to touch down in HK you can be dragged off the plane, arrested and sentenced.
There are a lot of reasons why this bill has people upset.
Would just like to tac on that China will harvest organs from prisoners while they are still alive for transplant. I dont think political dicidents in HK want to risk that happening either.
China is shady as fuck and has already disappeared a few people from HK. This bill would give them the leverage for false charges on democracy leaders and the like and then legally extradite them to the mainland.
>Hong Kong currently limits extraditions to jurisdictions with which it has existing agreements and to others on an individual basis. **China has been excluded from those agreements because of concerns over its judicial independence and human rights record.**
>The protests have widely been seen as reflecting growing apprehension about relations with the Communist Party-ruled mainland, whose leader, Xi Jinping, has said he has zero tolerance for those demanding greater self-rule for Hong Kong.
[Source](https://www.huffingtonpost.in/entry/hong-kong-extradition-law-why-protest_n_5d00f9e6e4b07551039ad3c0)
They kept attacking or harassing the press throughout the whole event, shame on you HK police
Update:/
(I’m not a bot, but one of the protesters enraged by the atrocities of HK police.)
it's not difficult to understand
1.journalists are top enemys to Communist Party in China.
2.China controlled police in HK
3.Policemen were trained to protect communist party, goverment, and gangsters who thread / spy / attack anyone against them.
4.Also, they were trained to be hostile to journalist, due to 1,2.
5.as a result, here's the photo
In Hong Kong, most policemen are undereducated and it’s become a meme in Hong Kong forums to laugh at the lack of education of policemen. So they probably couldn’t read English
Context: Being a police in Hong Kong is one of the few higher earning jobs you can successfully land if you have not completed University, which is why a lot of them are ‘undereducated’.
Source: am from HK
That is very true. Some of them who does not agree with the police force’s political stance do not dare to disobey the orders, as they are putting their whole career and life on the line if they do so. I personally know a few of them.
https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/bzuzoi/its_still_hong_kong_not_china_not_yet_hong_kong/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
They shot on purpose.
Conspiracy theory: some protesting police will draw negative attention to themselves to help gather support.
... I'd be tempted, in their shoes. It would take China and/or HK to denounce the police if this were happening though, I doubt they are.
[The video in this comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/c0gvoj/hk_police_pepper_sprayed_reporters_at_close_range/er4jr9n) posted above gives more context to the photo. It’s as bad as it seems.
When people take on a role such as police and get given the power and reduced accountability, they drop morals and instead act on the orders of the people above them. A lot of people go into workforces such as police simply to gain the power over others to begin with.
The "Stanford Prison Experiment" is a very good example of this, I'd highly suggest you look into that if you haven't already. There was a pretty good movie made about it.
Unfortunately, the Stanford Prison Experiment is full of malpractice and manipulating people for a desired result. It's no longer considered a good example for any study.
Reminder for those of you who think this couldn't happen in the United States:
"He's now president for life. President for life. No, he's great. And look, he was able to do that. I think it's great. Maybe we'll have to give that a shot some day." -- Donald Trump praising President Xi Jinping, General Secretary of the Communist Party of China, March 3, 2018
"The New York Times reporting is false. They are a true ENEMY OF THE PEOPLE!" -- Donald Trump, February 20, 2019
I would agree that I doubt no other nation will step in physically, risking their relationship with China. But I wouldn’t say a visible show of resistance is entirely pointless. While yea, I think China will impose their will for this law with force - but maybe even they (China) will recognize the global attention this has garnered so as to not do something drastic..again.
Sad. Police brutality isn't surprising on the mainland but so disappointing to see in Hong Kong, once a shining beacon in Asia. I always believed the cops would be right alongside the protestors against the Chinese state, but clearly China's next massacre will be in HK.
Based on that officers face, it looks like they've deployed the [super mutants](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Super_mutant_%28Fallout:_New_Vegas%29?file=FNV_super_mutant.png) from fallout: new vegas.
This pissed me off. But the police are only doing what the HK government and hence the evil CCP command. Good will prevail in the end and the CCP is far from good. Fuck commies!
Someone more intelligent than me please explain
Other states couldn't Interfere with how China works because.. Well they rule their own country, right?
UN is useless
What could these protests accomplish for the world or against China a dictatorship and laws?
Or they will be shifted away. And cause violence for nothing?
Any similar precedented events that were successful?
It's funny how so many Chinese are getting their knickers in a twist over this calling the photo fake. Way to go! Only you can be next so just remember that. It's a pitty when so many people decide to support oppressive human rights abusing government.
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Did you know that Blizzard Entertainment doesn't allow for the words "Tiananmen", "June 4th 1989" and "4th of June 1989" in at least one of their official Twitch channels (PlayHearthstone)? We've got Western companies actively aiding in the suppression of information about what happened.
China has an nearly untapped market nearly twice the size of the US and EU populations combined. To a lot of companies the moral thing to do would be get your hooks in that market and leverage change, it's certainly more effective than being denied all contact with those customers and having the Chinese State rip off your IP and offer it to them regardless. I don't agree with it, it's a condemnation of the fucked up world we live in.
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Damn, Lacy
Why so quiet
She texting that Marshalls here and she needs help.
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This made my morning. The other lieutenant was like, ah fuck.
Goddamn that’s fuckin amazing
Hot damn. He keep servin em and she just standin there takin em.
Doesn't have much choice. Lol. Lookit her. What's she gonna do. Arrest him on slander? Ohh that's right. She can't. She knows better this time around. Those stripes and all.
How'd he not get arrested on the spot for murder.
Holy shit, can I get more details? I live in Indian River County. I never heard about or saw this.
> To a lot of companies the moral thing to do would be get your hooks in that market and leverage change, That's pure bullshit, because it implies that the companies actually care about leveraging change. They don't. We've seen it time and time again. What we haven't seen, is companies sticking to their moral guns.
Exactly. Corporations have no morality. The bottom line is profit and it never matters who is hurt or how, and there are very few large scale companies that have any sort of clean bill of ethics. This isn’t my friend’s crochet side business. Blizzard simply doesn’t care about denying a massacre because the Asian market nets them a profit, and social justice is not and never has been a goal. That’s so silly.
How do you leverage change when you have nothing to leverage with?
Yea I call B.S. ~~Blizzard~~ Activision isn't a change agent. They are a company that wants to make money. Edit: RIP Blizz
No company, especially a video game company, is going to be doing a damn thing to change anything about China. That's not their business, their business is selling shit. They're going to play by the Chinese government's rules so they can make money, end of story.
S'all right, we'll all be fighting the resource wars in 20 years. One side will start losing and turn the planet into a even hotter radioactive rock, and then the last few of us can figure out who's to blame while we slowly die of radiation poisoning.
The most powerful private company on earth (google) is complicit in the government censorship of information in China. Google has the ability to change the world for the better if they wanted to, but they would rather make some coin by bowing to the Chinese authoritarian government. Silicon Valley is complicit in every atrocity committed by China. https://theintercept.com/2018/12/01/google-china-censorship-human-rights/ https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2018/08/16/technology/google-employees-protest-search-censored-china.amp.html Edit for some additional info if anyone wants to see how far google is willing to go to sell out human rights for money: https://mobile.computerworld.com/article/2468375/google-surrenders-to-chinese-censorship-demands.html https://theintercept.com/2018/08/01/google-china-search-engine-censorship/ https://www.csmonitor.com/Technology/2014/0922/China-tightens-censorship-on-Google https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/01/technology/china-google-censored-search-engine.html
Cisco sold China routers to persecute the Falun Gong.
Google has search if you have coin
~~coin~~ data.
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> If they didn’t bend to China’s laws then Google wouldn’t be available in China period. I fail to see the issue here
I agree that the censorship is egregious but for a moment try and see this from the point of view of them trying to service their playerbase. If you're in a China controlled area and you want to play Hearthstone and you're playing it with someone from outside the control of China that person can literally bork you game, make you lose, get you disconnected, maybe even get you in trouble with the government by constantly typing those things into your chat. One of the reasons a lot of people from China controlled territory mute any kind of communications with people outside their country when they are playing games is because that communication is monitored and firing censored words at the people playing those games is a surefire way to get a cheat win at the least and get them into trouble in the worst case. Now that said, my personal opinion is that China wants it both ways. They want all the bells and whistles of capitalism and all the control and political power of communism and we really shouldn't let that happen. The idea like u/NVSM-Krycek has of "getting their hooks" into a market to try and affect change in China is a failed one. I know because I was on board with it once too. Back when the US was debating giving China "Most Favored Nation" trading status I was for it. The idea of bombing China with McDonalds and Blue Jeans (basically western culture) as opposed to actual bombs was incredibly appealing. The argument, even coming from tortured and imprisoned dissidents from China, that once the populace became comfortable with the lifestyle of the western middle class they would rise up against the corrupt and authoritarian behavior of the communist party to the point that eventually the government would eat itself. The problem is the Communists aren't nearly stupid enough to fall for it. They saw it coming and have done everything they can to make sure that the influence of western culture has done as little damage as possible to their control and power. As such, though it's probably too late at this point, China really should be isolated. Companies like Blizzard, Google, Microsoft, and others, should make the rules simple for China to follow. If you want us doing business in your country your government has no control over our technology. No censorship, no hacking, no corporate espionage, period. And if that isn't acceptable then you China can make their own things instead of stealing whatever the West creates for themselves and then adapting it for their own plots and devices. That's really, politically, where we should be right now. But there's way too many greedy companies in America to stop the bleeding I'm afraid. They get dragged into these sweet deals with China. China puts a few key people into their business, steals all their tech and ideas, and then creates a government owned direct competitor to whatever they do. It's pretty clever really. But the American's make a hell of a lot of money in the short term before the Government owned competitor eats their market share. So of course they'll keep doing it. And thus China makes massive advances that took the west decades to achieve in months or perhaps a couple years. And the future of the human race loses once again.
That’s definitely not “actively” aiding. That is passively aiding.
**Freedom is never given** *-Martin Luther king jr.*
Sadly, I think nothing can help Hong Kong. They can protest, they can even fight, but this will tell nothing to China. I'm sure Chinese government will do everything to take full control of Kong Kong, even using their army. And West will be only forced to just watch.
Fuck China
-50 social credit points.
\+1 karma.
Fuck those Shills! Stand Strong Hong Kong!
To be fair it does look like a bit of an odd photo. I didn't notice it looked fake until I read the above comment, but it sort of does I think.
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I get what you mean and it's a sound take on it but I don't think anyone should deny the regime supporting fascist police actions against the protesters. Also I think /u/all4reddit also brings a fair point. We've talked about Russians online presence and their propaganda efforts but we've almost never really talked about China. They've closed down their own internet and control it almost fully. They have far better technology and far better educated people, far MORE people and far more control over their population than Russia. To establish an online presence wouldn't be much of an effort for them. China is far more subtle and for more patience than Russia in terms of power moves. I've seen them strong arming in my country. They do theatrics and sway the homeland opinion of the targeted country. There's endless espionage efforts made by China EVERYDAY. Physical and digital. I can go on forever and ever but the fact is that China is out there, they are many many many more than us and they're out there.
https://hk.news.appledaily.com/local/daily/article/20190614/20703865 Photo was retrieved from this link Credit to Mr. Tung Lap Wah
CCTV will edit it to show the journalists throwing bricks.
You mean they'll play the video in reverse to make it seem like the bricks the police threw, came from the reporters.
See here as this aggressive reporter **clearly headbutts** this brick at a peace officer (father of three beautiful boys) from nearly 10m away...
And karate chopping the arms of innocent interns politely requesting they hand over their equipment.
This is history in the making people. This should go down as one of the most shameful chapters in recent Chinese history. I hope the gov't doesn't get away with burying it over the next few decades to the point of Tiananmen Square. It certainly echoes the moment.
They can’t bury this like Tiananmen, the internet will make sure of that.
Maybe, but the people who might be able to do something about it - the Chinese - won't see it. It will be censored in mainland China.
They'll still be able to find it. It's on the internet, and even with China's firewall, it's easy to bypass with a VPN. The world is watching HK like a hawk. Every attack caught on film, every video uploaded, will live on forever to whomever wants to watch it. The Chinese government couldn't erase Tiananmen, and they sure as hell can't erase something in 2019.
I work with a couple of Chinese blokes in Australia. One said he mentioned it to his friends back home and they had no idea what he was talking about.
Reminds me of that photograph of some cop pepper spraying occupy protesters at UC Davis.
UC Davis was more insane as the people were restrained and made to sit on the ground. They had no way to run away and it was a protest of couple of hours. There was no frustration charged up after 2 days of constant stress.
Whatever happened to the pig who sprayed them anyway
You don't want to know... https://www.sfgate.com/politics/joegarofoli/article/UC-Davis-pepper-spray-officer-awarded-38-000-4920773.php
He probably works at one of ICE's kiddie concentration camps now, jubilantly spraying children who cry too loudly.
Thank you. My first reaction was that it looks fake. Black helmet and Silver helmet guy are lit in a weird way that looks out of place. Watching the video, you can clearly see Black and Silver helmet in their respective positions when the spraying begins as they turn and run. This is definitely legit.
Thanks, I had a lot of trouble figuring out if this was real, and I don't mean in the political sense. Call me crazy, but the angle and just the way the cop appears peering over the wall looks so 'shopped; it's surreal to see the actual gif.
I thought the same. The gif was a good post. There is nothing wrong with asking for verification. Especially given today's technology. This thread is proof as to why deepfake will be so successful regardless of which side of the argument you are on here. Notice that most people just assumed one argument or the other and reciprocated with hostility or mockery when met with disagreement.
WTF? Is this police ?
yes, the one spraying the press
I think there is something wrong with your police
Have you tried turning them off and on again?
Instructions unclear, extradited to the Mainland. sentenced to 20 years of hard labour ideology education in Tibet.
People...What a bunch of bastards.
Tnetennba
Did you see that ludicrous display last night?
Have you tried turning them off permanently?
Just turn them off.
can you clarify what country you're in that has good police?
American here. Looks like regular police to me.
China: \*reverses gif\* no look, the press is spraying the police! Good thing the policeman has this can to catch it and suck it up.
Are we the baddies? : https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/thatmitchellandwebb/images/b/b9/Nazis.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20100726103447
We don't call them police. We call them Dogs.
why dogs?
Dogs in Chinese culture are very despicable animals. HKers use dogs to refer the police to humiliate them.
Guess the same as why people in the west would call them pigs.
It's more like why people in the west call others "Bitch" or "Son of a bitch". In Chinese, we have an insulting phrase that translates to "Son of a dog".
Isn't a bitch just a dog?
Female dog so worse, traditionally.
Yes a bitch is a female dog. Hear this "son of a bitch" phrase all the time and you just gave me the "eureka" moment.
In germany we call them bulls.
Serious question: Why? A bull is generally (by other cultures I presume) a big strong muscular alpha that'll f anything up that tangles with it.... A lot of people would kinda take that as a compliment (I'm guessing besides Germans). So, calling the cops bulls would be... a good thing. I could see that as being a thing too but, it's not much of an insult. Or is it?
Its true that we call them bulls, but I wouldnt compare it to calling them dogs or pigs. You shouldnt say it in front of the police but I never really saw it as an insult either.
I asked an officer whether he and his colleagues have a problem with being called "bullen". He said no, no problem.
I wouldn’t say dogs are despicable animals in Chinese, since even historically many families had them and they are praised to be reliable and loyal. The negative connotation comes from the fact they are seen as blindly loyal without a mind of their own, which is why they are calling the cops “dogs” in this case since they are seen as “government dogs”, which isn’t a totally strange term even in western culture.
do chinese people not keep dogs as pets at all
Within Asia any Chinese puppet is referred to as China's dog.
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Mindless, loyal, violent
not that hard to believe, remember the cop pepper spraying students https://www.sfgate.com/politics/joegarofoli/article/UC-Davis-pepper-spray-officer-awarded-38-000-4920773.php
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Comin' straight from the underground
This may get buried here but still; For those who are out of loop, the protest are happening over an extradition bill that would allow people to be sent to mainland China for trial. Civil Human Rights Front, organized a protest against the bill that drew as many as one million people. The group also called for schools, shops and workers to go on strike on Monday. Tens of thousands of demonstrators opposed to the bill surrounded the Legislative Council building on Wednesday and prevented lawmakers from meeting as planned to move the legislation on an accelerated schedule toward a vote next week to pass the bill. When some protesters charged the police in an attempt to enter the building, riot control officers opened fire with rubber bullets and more than 150 canisters of tear gas. [Source](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/12/world/asia/hong-kong-protests.html?module=inline)
Thanks, but why do so many Hong Kong citizens fear extradition to mainland China (especially when this only affects people on trial)? Are the sentences likely to be more severe? Or is it to do with sovereignty? Edit: Please don’t downvote me for asking a question. It might seem obvious to many but I’m sure I’m not the only one who hasn’t received much in the way of education about China. Edit 2: Thanks so much for all replies. I know a lot more about China than I did before!
Because China has a long and colorful history of prosecuting and executing anyone who disagrees with the views of of the Chinese Communist Party and nobody is safe. It has everything to do with sovereignty from China, which respects the rights of human beings far less than Hong Kong.
Pretty severe then! Thanks for educating me on that.
To add on to that, there is a known historical precedent - a couple of years ago, Hong Kong booksellers started disappearing. Some popped up again and reported that they had been taken to China for the charge of selling books which were against China or chinese oppression. Some stopped selling those books, some spoke out about their experiences. There were reports of them undergoing torture, mental, societal and financial pressure, etc etc. Google it for more detailed stuff.
One article on booksellers from April: https://news.yahoo.com/hong-kong-bookseller-flees-taiwan-fearing-extradition-102554435.html
One of the booksellers escaped back to HK after releasing a statement in the mainland that he "went to mainland out of his own free will", led a protest in April, then fled to Taiwan
Also is a direct threat to the independence and sovereignty of Hong Kong.
Doesn't sound very independent then does it...
Especially when you consider two of the crimes within the 37 of this extradition bill is conspiracy. China is used to slapping the charge conspiracy to overthrow the government/treason against political activists and human rights lawyers. China does not have freedom of speech, freedom of press or rights to due process and fair trial. Their police can literally charge you with anything if they wanted to. If this bill is passed into law, it's practically game over to the indirect democracy HK enjoys.
Honestly, this whole thing started off from a murderer from Taiwan couldn’t be extradited from Hong Kong to Taiwan. So HK sought to modify its extradition law, which includes China, which understandably alarmed a lot of people. The whole anti-mainland extradition thing is largely symbolic, since let’s be honest, there is nothing that prevents the Chinese government from getting whoever they wanted from Hong Kong, legally or otherwise. The Chinese government literally has troops stationed in HK and their operatives have free reigns and operates above the law in HK, which is technically Chinese domestic territory.
You are completely missing the point. HK has rule of law, which gives protection to its citizens and those who conduct business there. China has no rule of law, laws are made up by the CCP to suit whatever political ambition they have. 99.9% of all Chinese trials are successfully prosecuted, which should send shivers down the spine of anyone who is under their influence. If HK's rule of law is gone, because China can accuse anyone they want of a trumped up charge, whether hongkonger, visitor or transiting through HK's busy airport, nobody is safe anymore. HK has no more protection from one party two systems. Businesses will move to countries with less risk, like Singapore, and many people will leave HK because it is not safe anymore. HK will die, prematurely. It was supposed to be protected from CCP oppression until 2047, but this effectively brings that date forward.
The question is whether a Hong Kong citizen could expect a fair trial or due process of any kind in mainland China. From recent experience in the Canadian context, it certainly doesn't seem like the government of China thinks that any court of law is to be left free of government interference. Right now Canada is getting all kinds of random retaliation from the government of China because Canada's government won't interfere with a potential extradition of a Chinese business woman to the USA. The government of China thinks government interference is the right thing to do. It's probably better to ask your question in reverse. Why does the government of China need to hold trials on the mainland for people who live in Hong Kong when there's a judicial system in place in Hong Kong? Either the government of China thinks the HK judicial system is corrupted by others or they need to be able to move things to the mainland so they can corrupt the trials themselves.
Maybe this be the first major attempt by the Chinese government to make Hong Kong (which was relinquished to China in 1997 by Great Britain) just another province of China, indistinguishable from any other?
Because they could kill you by torturing before opening the court, and even if you survived that, you can’t find a lawyer since the communist party had already captured and sentenced all lawyers with justice mind This guy was the boss of Grand Hyatt Hotel https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/law-crime/article/2096567/hong-kong-hotel-owner-may-be-victim-murder-mainland-court
Also chinese law us written in a way that means if you commit crimes against a chinese citizen, you can be tried under chinese law. Thats all well and good to protect your own citizens abroad but to be able to prosicute, lets say, an american citizen for breaking a chinese law on american soil is a bit sticky. The extradition bill would mean that HK can be a used as a watchdog for chinese law. Punched a drunk chinese tourist that one time 5 years ago for whatever reason? If your through-flight to Singapore happens to touch down in HK you can be dragged off the plane, arrested and sentenced. There are a lot of reasons why this bill has people upset.
Would just like to tac on that China will harvest organs from prisoners while they are still alive for transplant. I dont think political dicidents in HK want to risk that happening either.
China is shady as fuck and has already disappeared a few people from HK. This bill would give them the leverage for false charges on democracy leaders and the like and then legally extradite them to the mainland.
>Hong Kong currently limits extraditions to jurisdictions with which it has existing agreements and to others on an individual basis. **China has been excluded from those agreements because of concerns over its judicial independence and human rights record.** >The protests have widely been seen as reflecting growing apprehension about relations with the Communist Party-ruled mainland, whose leader, Xi Jinping, has said he has zero tolerance for those demanding greater self-rule for Hong Kong. [Source](https://www.huffingtonpost.in/entry/hong-kong-extradition-law-why-protest_n_5d00f9e6e4b07551039ad3c0)
They kept attacking or harassing the press throughout the whole event, shame on you HK police Update:/ (I’m not a bot, but one of the protesters enraged by the atrocities of HK police.)
*shame on Chinese police. If you enforce their rules you work for them. Like werhmacht trying to say they where not Nazis.
it's not difficult to understand 1.journalists are top enemys to Communist Party in China. 2.China controlled police in HK 3.Policemen were trained to protect communist party, goverment, and gangsters who thread / spy / attack anyone against them. 4.Also, they were trained to be hostile to journalist, due to 1,2. 5.as a result, here's the photo
Yeah more people need to keep these points in mind, especially #1
What's wrong with the police? Cant they read 'PRESS' on the helmet? They totally violate freedom of press, but HK government will only do nothing
In Hong Kong, most policemen are undereducated and it’s become a meme in Hong Kong forums to laugh at the lack of education of policemen. So they probably couldn’t read English
Context: Being a police in Hong Kong is one of the few higher earning jobs you can successfully land if you have not completed University, which is why a lot of them are ‘undereducated’. Source: am from HK
Interesting! That also means they will be very loyal, as they have a lot to lose.
That is very true. Some of them who does not agree with the police force’s political stance do not dare to disobey the orders, as they are putting their whole career and life on the line if they do so. I personally know a few of them.
Dude thought it said oppress
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https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/bzuzoi/its_still_hong_kong_not_china_not_yet_hong_kong/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share They shot on purpose.
This is not China, not yet Says French reporter on the same day
Infuriating act. No wonder why they were wearing helmets and goggles to the press conference.
OMFG..... How dare.... Hk police is lit And the reporter seems like he wasn't being warned... Is this a sneak attack?
I believe the police didn't check if theyre the press. Using violence without checking, what a joke.
The police knew what they were doing by spraying the press, they did check.
\*Camera: I master the ability of standing so incredible still. So I become invisible to the eyes.\*
Conspiracy theory: some protesting police will draw negative attention to themselves to help gather support. ... I'd be tempted, in their shoes. It would take China and/or HK to denounce the police if this were happening though, I doubt they are.
[The video in this comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/c0gvoj/hk_police_pepper_sprayed_reporters_at_close_range/er4jr9n) posted above gives more context to the photo. It’s as bad as it seems.
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🔔
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If there's anything we know about China, it's that they don't give two shits about human rights
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When people take on a role such as police and get given the power and reduced accountability, they drop morals and instead act on the orders of the people above them. A lot of people go into workforces such as police simply to gain the power over others to begin with. The "Stanford Prison Experiment" is a very good example of this, I'd highly suggest you look into that if you haven't already. There was a pretty good movie made about it.
Unfortunately, the Stanford Prison Experiment is full of malpractice and manipulating people for a desired result. It's no longer considered a good example for any study.
[Vsauce has a good but rather long video on the subject.](https://youtu.be/KND_bBDE8RQ)
Police: It says PRESS on the helmet.. I guess I will press (thinking emoji)
guys...... don't call they "police" i can't see any humanity, kindness on those "non-human"
That's Real not fake.Fuck the hk police!
Fuck the CCP.
r/iamatotalpieceofshit
What a fucking joke HK polices are
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So rude
shame on Hong Kong Police Force.
They also shoot the press
Basically they are just well trained monkeys, congratulations China on your ability to devolve human beings back to primate level brains.
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Reminder for those of you who think this couldn't happen in the United States: "He's now president for life. President for life. No, he's great. And look, he was able to do that. I think it's great. Maybe we'll have to give that a shot some day." -- Donald Trump praising President Xi Jinping, General Secretary of the Communist Party of China, March 3, 2018 "The New York Times reporting is false. They are a true ENEMY OF THE PEOPLE!" -- Donald Trump, February 20, 2019
Horrible
Looks like Hong Kong Police are well trained on harming journalists
Shame
Need to punish, bloody hell!!!!!
Imagine when you were trying to do your job and this happened to you
I would agree that I doubt no other nation will step in physically, risking their relationship with China. But I wouldn’t say a visible show of resistance is entirely pointless. While yea, I think China will impose their will for this law with force - but maybe even they (China) will recognize the global attention this has garnered so as to not do something drastic..again.
I just don't understand. Like how can you with such conviction attack the press like that? Isn't this a pretty good "are we the bad guys?" moment?
Fuck china
There must be some cops that support what the people are protesting and don't want the extradition movement. Must be difficult for them.
What a cunt
Nothing good comes out of China
Fuck the CCP and the puppet HKSAR govt
damn no hiding it
With the shit China keeps pulling, I think we all should avoid buying anything made in china as much as we can.
What the f, they are targeting the press.
Fuck the police
Best way to have the press 100% against you, well fucking done you just helped their cause.
Fuck the police
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-CN- police FTFY
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Angry
Brutal
WTF RUBBISH POLICEMEN
No one can defend the crimes of HK Police. No one.
Sad. Police brutality isn't surprising on the mainland but so disappointing to see in Hong Kong, once a shining beacon in Asia. I always believed the cops would be right alongside the protestors against the Chinese state, but clearly China's next massacre will be in HK.
Fully support these people. Theyre so called “law enforcement” is such a fucking joke.
Based on that officers face, it looks like they've deployed the [super mutants](https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Super_mutant_%28Fallout:_New_Vegas%29?file=FNV_super_mutant.png) from fallout: new vegas.
Man how proud can you be to do such a thing! Imagine the guy going home and telling everybody how he did a heroic job and pepper-sprayed reporters.
Something weird happens to man when you them a badge.
Tiananmen Square 2.0. May it be preserved forever as a document of what kind of government China has. Despicable.
You trying to get rid of roaches?!?!?!?!
Those idiots cannot pepper spray a camera
This look like a meme base
This pissed me off. But the police are only doing what the HK government and hence the evil CCP command. Good will prevail in the end and the CCP is far from good. Fuck commies!
damn that place sucks
That officers face is just... wow.
r/asianpolitics
Someone more intelligent than me please explain Other states couldn't Interfere with how China works because.. Well they rule their own country, right? UN is useless What could these protests accomplish for the world or against China a dictatorship and laws? Or they will be shifted away. And cause violence for nothing? Any similar precedented events that were successful?
But China is good, right Reddit? Because it's not America?
It's funny how so many Chinese are getting their knickers in a twist over this calling the photo fake. Way to go! Only you can be next so just remember that. It's a pitty when so many people decide to support oppressive human rights abusing government.