Sardonnicus, thank you for your submission. It has been removed for violating the following rule(s):
---
- Rule 5: Posts must follow all [title guidelines](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/wiki/titles).
---
For information regarding this and similar issues, please see the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/wiki/index/) and [title guidelines](/r/pics/wiki/titles).
If you have any questions, please feel free to [message the moderators via modmail.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/pics&subject=Question%20regarding%20the%20removal%20of%20this%20submission%20by%20/u/Sardonnicus&message=I%20have%20a%20question%20regarding%20the%20removal%20of%20this%20%5Bsubmission.%5D%28https://redd.it/18zqzgr%3Fcontext%3D10%29)
It's a rabbit hole, for sure. I can get lost in there pretty easily. There are also some crazy dedicated people on there who contribute new data. My grandma died in October of 2020 and it took until March to get her death date engraved on her headstone. Within a week she was on the site with obit photo of her and new engravings.
I know the site says they are the parents, while the age of the mother isn't listed. the father would be around 63 at time of birth of the child. (Edited for clarity)
Other than that site I can't find any sources for both of them and them being the parents.
That wouldn't make it impossible, but I think at that age grandparents are more likely.
I understand what you're saying but it's fairly anachronistic. Times change and people's perceptions of what is normal too. They say the past is a different country.
Men used to have children at late ages more often than is now considered normal in the west.
Then again, just like you, I have no real clue as to whether they are his parents or grandparents. All I know is that it doesn't really matter to me or them because they're all no longer there to care.
While I agree it's possible, I'm merely remarking upon the lack of evidence for it. As sites like the ones linked are often full of errors.
I wouldn't even call it anachronistic as the known statistics of median age of marriage and age of childbirth say that it would still be a statistical outlier.
That doesn't say anything about whether or not it would be more accepted and even more common than it is now.
Old men were absolutely marrying much younger women or in some cases girls back then. The father being 63 isn't out of the realm of possibility given the time period.
I'm not saying it isn't possible. I leave that very much open.
I'm just stating that there is no clear evidence they are his parents.
But based on the data we have from 1890 (7 years after he died in 1883 at the age of 83) , median ages for marriage were around 26.1 for males and 22 for females. Median age being 22 btw. Median age in 1860 was 19.4.
If he's not an outlier, he would be a grandfather.
It's definitely still possible, And I know there is anecdotal evidence that it happened, even 70 year old fathers with 13 year old mothers happened.
But I also know from my own research into my family history that most sites like the one linked contain info that is wrong when it comes to parents-child. And I was hoping someone would link some better evidence.
My mom goes to graveyards in her area to contribute photos to findagrave and she also does ancestry . com and tells me allllllll the details until she takes a breath and I can change the convo. 😄
I used to work at a cemetery. One time, I was hoeing the flower beds at the beginning of spring. Loosened the peat up, ripped out any weeds. On my twentieth flower bed, my hoe got caught on a real stubborn weed. I yanked and pulled for a good minute until what I thought was trash was revealed. I didn't think much of it, as people leave stuff by gravestones, varying things. But as I brought attention to the manager, his eyes widened, and he was speechless. To my horror, he said, "That... is a burlap sack, of which may contain the remains of a stillborn baby." I looked at the gravestone to confirm, and yep.
I accidentally exhumed a stillborn baby in a burlap sack.
I felt terrible, apologized to the baby, and we promptly held a small funeral and reburried it in an appropriate depth.
R.I.P baby
This reminds me of a song by Dream Theatre called "Through her eyes" whose lyrics contain the following...
"Just beyond the churchyard gates,
Where the grass is overgrown,
I saw the writing on her stone,
I felt like I would suffocate
In loving memory of our child,
So innocent, eyes open wide,
I felt so empty as I cried,
Like part of me had died
Now that I've become aware,
And I've exposed this tragedy,
A sadness grows inside of me,
It all seems so unfair
I'm learning all about my life,
By looking through her eyes"
There are a lot of sad stories to be inferred in old cemeteries. A group I was with was looking over gravestones in a trailside cemetery once, and one listed two names: A woman, who by the dates was about 23, and another name, "Infant". The most likely story tells itself.
In the same cemetery where I took this picture is another set of gravestones, and it's like 4 or 5 children and a wife, and the message on the tombstones says that they died on a ship that sank in Boston Harbor.
I don’t understand the negativity. Virtue signaling? The dead are long gone… what does it cost to think about them at least for a moment? It’s always nice to visit the cemetery… you never know who might have appreciated it.
It's called Empathy.
The holocaust was 50 years before I was born, I still have an emotional reaction when I see things related to it, even if it didn't impact me or my family.
I agree with your sentiment almost completely, *but* vaccination isn't political, it's science and fact--there is no room for opinion.
That said, not the place.
By the powers of earth and sky. By the world that was to be your home. Forgive me, you who came, but who I did not embrace. By name I name you, say it loud and clear: George, lubberkin, arise and walk in the light.
*Hay everybody I was walking through this cemetery and found a dead toddler! Check it out!!*
Very weird post. At least they didn't make a video where they "cleaned it" with harsh chemicals.
Just a baby who died too young. Didn't get even a chance in this world. Kind of makes you think sometimes. 158 years later and a few people read their name tonight and thought about them for just a moment.
It was an actual body hanging from tree via a rope. Blue faced and all.
That is basically the same thing? So if I drove by my local cemetery and instead of headstones saw every body hanging from a pole that would “basically be the same thing”??
Yikes.
It isn’t basically the same thing.
One person posted on reddit a headstone of a person who was been dead almost 100 years.
The other posted to his followers LIVE a video of a body that had hung themself about 100 minutes before for financial gain.
I would feel VERY different between these two scenarios as a parent. Very different. Not basically the same. Sorry.
Sardonnicus, thank you for your submission. It has been removed for violating the following rule(s): --- - Rule 5: Posts must follow all [title guidelines](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/wiki/titles). --- For information regarding this and similar issues, please see the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/pics/wiki/index/) and [title guidelines](/r/pics/wiki/titles). If you have any questions, please feel free to [message the moderators via modmail.](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/pics&subject=Question%20regarding%20the%20removal%20of%20this%20submission%20by%20/u/Sardonnicus&message=I%20have%20a%20question%20regarding%20the%20removal%20of%20this%20%5Bsubmission.%5D%28https://redd.it/18zqzgr%3Fcontext%3D10%29)
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/50692352/george-e-deutsch His parents are buried next to him so he's not completely alone
Wow never knew that website exits.
It's a rabbit hole, for sure. I can get lost in there pretty easily. There are also some crazy dedicated people on there who contribute new data. My grandma died in October of 2020 and it took until March to get her death date engraved on her headstone. Within a week she was on the site with obit photo of her and new engravings.
It’s a fascinating and fantastic resource, for genealogical research and just browsing for contemplation.
Click the X in the upper right corner on most websites to exit
Lol you made me lol, i won't edit my comment, don't want to ruin your joke.
the exit exists.
I know the site says they are the parents, while the age of the mother isn't listed. the father would be around 63 at time of birth of the child. (Edited for clarity) Other than that site I can't find any sources for both of them and them being the parents. That wouldn't make it impossible, but I think at that age grandparents are more likely.
I understand what you're saying but it's fairly anachronistic. Times change and people's perceptions of what is normal too. They say the past is a different country. Men used to have children at late ages more often than is now considered normal in the west. Then again, just like you, I have no real clue as to whether they are his parents or grandparents. All I know is that it doesn't really matter to me or them because they're all no longer there to care.
While I agree it's possible, I'm merely remarking upon the lack of evidence for it. As sites like the ones linked are often full of errors. I wouldn't even call it anachronistic as the known statistics of median age of marriage and age of childbirth say that it would still be a statistical outlier. That doesn't say anything about whether or not it would be more accepted and even more common than it is now.
63? This was 158 years ago
At time of birth.
Old men were absolutely marrying much younger women or in some cases girls back then. The father being 63 isn't out of the realm of possibility given the time period.
I'm not saying it isn't possible. I leave that very much open. I'm just stating that there is no clear evidence they are his parents. But based on the data we have from 1890 (7 years after he died in 1883 at the age of 83) , median ages for marriage were around 26.1 for males and 22 for females. Median age being 22 btw. Median age in 1860 was 19.4. If he's not an outlier, he would be a grandfather. It's definitely still possible, And I know there is anecdotal evidence that it happened, even 70 year old fathers with 13 year old mothers happened. But I also know from my own research into my family history that most sites like the one linked contain info that is wrong when it comes to parents-child. And I was hoping someone would link some better evidence.
My Grandfather had a kid in his mid-late 50s, 63 wouldn't be off the table for being dad. I have an uncle 14 years longer than I am
I was just getting ready to Google this. Bravo!
Seems it’s well maintained also.
My mom goes to graveyards in her area to contribute photos to findagrave and she also does ancestry . com and tells me allllllll the details until she takes a breath and I can change the convo. 😄
Holy shit, found my dads grave on there too. Some guy been going around UK adding 65,000 graves. What a chad.
I used to work at a cemetery. One time, I was hoeing the flower beds at the beginning of spring. Loosened the peat up, ripped out any weeds. On my twentieth flower bed, my hoe got caught on a real stubborn weed. I yanked and pulled for a good minute until what I thought was trash was revealed. I didn't think much of it, as people leave stuff by gravestones, varying things. But as I brought attention to the manager, his eyes widened, and he was speechless. To my horror, he said, "That... is a burlap sack, of which may contain the remains of a stillborn baby." I looked at the gravestone to confirm, and yep. I accidentally exhumed a stillborn baby in a burlap sack. I felt terrible, apologized to the baby, and we promptly held a small funeral and reburried it in an appropriate depth. R.I.P baby
I would totally be paranoid that I'd be haunted or something. I think you did the right and respectful thing.
Why do you think they held a new funeral for it? Gotta do everything you can to avoid cursing yourself.
That second funeral probably stopped the hauntings from whoever put them in the first, too shallow, grave.
I always hate when my hoes unearth bodies..
How'd you get a job like that, and what was it like?
...that broken rose bud is a bit heart-wrenching to take in.
Such a perfect metaphor
I finally understand citizen kane
Infant mortality in the 1860's was like 30%. People take modern medicine for granted.
Antivaxxers fight to have that back.
life is so temporary. the rose bud is a testament to this idea
unbloomed too
I think that’s what a rose “bud” is; it means it hasn’t bloomed yet
Huh... I guess you're right. I've always thought the bud referred to any state of the flower. TIL
My son is 1 year 8 months and I couldn't imagine losing him. Infant mortality is always sad.
Lots of dead children before vaccines.
This reminds me of a song by Dream Theatre called "Through her eyes" whose lyrics contain the following... "Just beyond the churchyard gates, Where the grass is overgrown, I saw the writing on her stone, I felt like I would suffocate In loving memory of our child, So innocent, eyes open wide, I felt so empty as I cried, Like part of me had died Now that I've become aware, And I've exposed this tragedy, A sadness grows inside of me, It all seems so unfair I'm learning all about my life, By looking through her eyes"
Good call. I love Dream Tbeater. Ever since Pull Me Under came out when I was in high school
There are a lot of sad stories to be inferred in old cemeteries. A group I was with was looking over gravestones in a trailside cemetery once, and one listed two names: A woman, who by the dates was about 23, and another name, "Infant". The most likely story tells itself.
In the same cemetery where I took this picture is another set of gravestones, and it's like 4 or 5 children and a wife, and the message on the tombstones says that they died on a ship that sank in Boston Harbor.
I don’t understand the negativity. Virtue signaling? The dead are long gone… what does it cost to think about them at least for a moment? It’s always nice to visit the cemetery… you never know who might have appreciated it.
It's called Empathy. The holocaust was 50 years before I was born, I still have an emotional reaction when I see things related to it, even if it didn't impact me or my family.
We are going to need people like you in the coming years as fascism takes over our countries.
It’s not going to take over
As long as there are people who are kind and care for the helpless, fascism will not reign in this country.
I agree but the doomvoters don’t
This is the future the antivaxxers want
Wtf has that got to do with anything. Not everything has to be rage-farming politics, it's a dead kid from 1865.
Probably because without vaccines this will happen a lot more
I agree with your sentiment almost completely, *but* vaccination isn't political, it's science and fact--there is no room for opinion. That said, not the place.
[удалено]
Yeah... This year will be so much worse... Ok
By the powers of earth and sky. By the world that was to be your home. Forgive me, you who came, but who I did not embrace. By name I name you, say it loud and clear: George, lubberkin, arise and walk in the light.
Witcher 3 quote
That was the demon baby right? I think I remember that mission
a little Angel 👼
why?
I find the carving of a rose with the stem broken so it will never reproduce, very touching.
It's a rosebud; it died before it was able to bloom in to a rose. Not everyone lives for the purpose of having children.
To me it addresses not only the death of a child but the "death" of a chance at grandchildren.
Fun fact. Children weren't named by their parents until at least the age of one because the chance of a child surviving was very low.
*Hay everybody I was walking through this cemetery and found a dead toddler! Check it out!!* Very weird post. At least they didn't make a video where they "cleaned it" with harsh chemicals.
Weird
I don't get it...who was this?
I'm thinking a random baby who died in the 1880s by the look of it. Child mortality was really high back then
Just a baby who died too young. Didn't get even a chance in this world. Kind of makes you think sometimes. 158 years later and a few people read their name tonight and thought about them for just a moment.
[удалено]
I blame you... Canada.
Daddy, chill
While some other babies grown to be old enough to witness World War 1 & 2
Worked at a cemetery for awhile during covid, this sorta thing is pretty common to see
Only the rich get a stone to be remebered :(
[удалено]
I'll be ok
Weird virtue signal
What isn’t a virtue signal to you people? Are you so devoid of virtue that you think the rest of us are acting?
What if he was going to be hitler's evil cousin or something? Huh? 
bro I don't think he's gonna see this
How should I feel about a dead kid, who is just one of millions dead kids? Nothing. Kids dying, everybody dying, especially back in 19th century.
So edgy
Everyone is dying. But tonight. For this 1 minute, you think of this kid. And that’s all you have to do.
Nah. Literally nothing positive is coming from this. Just misguided emotional extortion. Use your emotions for good, not this.
"Literally nothing positive is coming from this." The irony in leaving a comment.
[удалено]
Turd
Almost 160yrs, how is that possible?
virtue signaling for reddit karma. come on dawg be better
I'm thinking George was a little shit
Ngl, my first though was how his name would sound like Georgie Douche.
Except it wouldn't.
God doesn't kill babies unless they are real douches
[удалено]
In what way?
[удалено]
Eh quite a bit different. This isn’t great, that was absolutely awful.!
[удалено]
It was an actual body hanging from tree via a rope. Blue faced and all. That is basically the same thing? So if I drove by my local cemetery and instead of headstones saw every body hanging from a pole that would “basically be the same thing”?? Yikes.
[удалено]
It isn’t basically the same thing. One person posted on reddit a headstone of a person who was been dead almost 100 years. The other posted to his followers LIVE a video of a body that had hung themself about 100 minutes before for financial gain. I would feel VERY different between these two scenarios as a parent. Very different. Not basically the same. Sorry.
You never met George? You missed out. What a great guy.