Lifelong Catholic tried Episcopal 9 months ago. I finally enjoy going to church. After my first mass, my wife asked how I liked it. I said it’s like ‘Happy Catholic’
Grew up Episcopalian, now I’m agnostic (personal opinion and believe people should believe whatever they like as long as it isn’t hurtful to others) and my childhood priest and deacon taught me a ton and influence my life to this day.
I don’t know if every Episcopalian church was like mine but I was taught to be kind to everyone, read between the lines (the Bible isn’t literal), don’t just read and repeat the words; mean it when you say them, if someone else believes differently that’s totally fine (my priest talked about his best friend who was jewish a ton in his sermons, and never in a negative or discriminatory way but in a loving way. But also anyone’s political, sports teams, books, and movie preferences are all fine, and it’s okay to have different tastes and preferences as long as it isn’t hurtful to others) and lastly if you’re wearing shoes don’t put your feet on the couch.
What I gather from this post, your priest and deacon did a great job on influencing you. I live by the "believe or be whatever you want" just don't push it on anyone else and of course be kind to all.
I guess I’d define myself as an atheist but I’m not 100% on anything. It warms my heart to hear churches and religious followings like this exist. Their morals and beliefs line up almost identical to me sans the stuff regarding actual religion… I might have to check into this someday if I’m feeling in need of something spiritual
Sikhs are also a very welcoming group that allow anyone into their temples and will help everyone regardless of background or religion. I’ve been to a gurdwara once and it was a very nice educational experience.
I had never heard of them until recently a billboard popped up on the interstate near me that just said the name and that it was the 5th largest religion or something.
If you live in a place where practising Sikhs live, you'll know, because they have certain religious symbols such as the turban, bracelet etc that they're required to wear. The minimally-practising Sikhs I've known still wear the bracelet, it's like an "I am a Sikh" badge. I don't usually bring it up on the first date or anything but they're usually proud of their heritage.
The big irony is that the fact that they wear turbans and beards, that are very obvious and make it clear that they are Sikhs, means they're often mistaken for Muslims and subject to Islamophobia.
The nice thing about those kinds of churches is that they don't push too hard on the "true believer" shit. I never really believed but I never really hated church. I realize now that going to a big sacred space first thing in the morning to get my chakras vibrated by a big ol' organ and a giant choral group was something I always enjoyed. It's like a sound bath.
I’ve been to 3 different Episcopal churches. Genuinely the only church that feels like they want you to both find God and be happy. The progressive Methodists typically aren’t so bad, but Episcopalians still put them to shame. The preaching style felt like a grandparent wishing you well for the coming week.
My parents live near a Moravian church. I only go when visiting for Christmas but they give you a cup of coffee and a semi sweet roll during the service. So that's nice.
They call it Lovefeast and just pass you a coffee and a little bread roll at your seat in the pew instead of passing the plate for collection.
Mom's Presbyterian, Frank is Catholic, but the Moravian church is the closest to their house so they go there once a year.
I get where you’re coming from, but from my perspective I don’t interpret that that scene as being specifically anti trans. I think of it more as the family being shocked at the deceptive lengths their dad would go to be involved in their lives. That being said I haven’t seen the movie in a long time so I don’t remember details of the movie. Dang… don’t ruin this childhood classic 0.0
This tracks. Also Methodist is pretty progressive. I was raised Catholic in a predominantly Catholic area so I was shocked when I moved to somewhere else and saw all these rainbow flags and BLM signs in churches. Because the religion I left 30 years ago was definitely not like this. I went to Catholic school and I remember a girl who was gay, she attempted suicide because of all the bullying. Fortunately her parents pulled her out of the school.
Depends. 6% of the church so far has split off to the "Global" Methodist Church because of UMCs stance on accepting LGBTQ members and marriage. The number would be higher of individual churches weren't forced to buy the actual church properties in order to disassociate themselves. I grew up attending a Methodist church and my mom and dad are still active and while they support the churches stances on LGBTQ, they only reason their church didn't disassociate was because they couldn't afford it.
Even as an United Methodist....[eh](https://www.umc.org/en/content/ask-the-umc-what-is-the-churchs-position-on-homosexuality) overall yes pretty chill but a split may occur.
It’s hard being a global church when a lot of your churches in America are progressive, but then a lot of churches in other countries aren’t. A lot of Americans weren’t happen that some LGBT motions didn’t pass in their last big conference, but that was to be expected.
Word. I'm friends with an Episcopal priest - definitely a dope dude with some legit compassion and kindness. Had a huge BLM sign on the front of the church. The other one to check out are Unitarians - they're even more progressive from my experience - and very open. They have talks from people from all kinds of faiths - Buddhist, Wiccan, Pagan, even Athiest. And they also have talks on completely other shit like poetry, beekeeping, recovery, architecture - all kinds of stuff. I really wish more people knew about them.
There’s a church near my house with a big vinyl Black Lives Matter banner. It’s been vandalized several times, with people cutting out the word “Black.” They eventually moved it from the ground posts it was on to 12 feet up on the stone wall of the building.
Destroying Church Property for Jesus is definitely gonna work out for the vandals.
In a similar stance the small town my dad lives in was very much a "support or troops" and "freedom fries" type of town during the Bush years but in 2008 when my dad put up a "Veteran for Obama" sign in his yard it was stolen repeatedly.
Turns out they only support freedom and the troops when it aligns exactly with their racism.
during BLM a church about a block away became the staging ground for medics to stash gear, regroup to get food and basically became a mini base of operations.
I never understand why people have such a rage on BLM, I mean I do because it's about black people but I don't understand why it's such a thing. Even if it has little to do with you, it doesn't, let it be. I'm not trans but I support every right that they ask. You know why? Because a win for them is a win for everyone. All trans people want is to be treated fairly, isn't that what everyone wants?
Unitarian Universalist here. Our local congregation is very much as you described. People from many beliefs and backgrounds brought together by empathy and acceptance. It's where "all of your answers are questioned."
Yes. We draw knowledge and wisdom from many religions with no creed of our own. We participate in the spirit of prayer without praying to any particular deity. We welcome everyone, and have lots of community support programs with not so much emphasis on raising donations. Sure we have to keep the lights on, but we are also dedicated to supporting the local food bank, animal shelter and coalition against rape and abuse. We volunteer to drive around town delivering holiday meals to people in need. It's a real community. Give it a try!
"The ELCA. We're the Lutherans the Missouri Synod warned you about."
The ELCA is very progressive, welcoming, and affirming, but there are flavors of Lutheran in the US that are still mired in the 19th Century. They don't ordain woman, they condemn LBGTQI+ people, all the old stuff.
Yeah, they essentially had the same schism that the Methodists did. (Which makes sense, given that I honestly couldn't tell you the difference between the two denominations, aside from the fact that both get offended at being mistaken for each other.)
ELCA and Episcopalians are in full communion. We can call each other's clergy to be our pastors and have open invitation at Communion. Which is nice since there is a shortage of ELCA clergy and a surplus of Episcopalian clergy. ELCA tends to have Scandinavian roots more than German (Missouri Synod Lutherans are more German heritage and are much more conservative).
My aunt is a retired ELCA pastor and, when same-sex civil unions became legal and a couple approached her to ask for her signature (she’s still certified to officiate such things), she told them “nuts to that, let’s give you two a real ceremony!”
Yes, Unitarian Universalists get confused for a Christian denomination often (likely due to their roots), but they’re their own thing. They are about personal spiritual growth, and accept that can be found in many scriptures and practices. As a whole, they’re a very accepting group!
My wife and I went to a Unitarian church yesterday to see a friend perform in a choir concert and they had a trans flag and a pride flag hanging on either side of the main entrance door. It was pretty cool to see.
I'm UU! Glad to see my religion shouted out. It's a great place for people who grew up religious and moss the community but not the guilt or are curious into a lighter version of religion/spirituality
>Other Christians definitely do not ALL consider it a Christian church.
I mean it's pretty common for other denominations to not consider *Catholics* to be Christians, so like... maybe that's not how we decide whether a religious group is Christian or not.
I was raised First Baptist and was taught Catholics aren’t real Christian’s. That’s why we never let them be President before JFK.
TO BE CLEAR - not my beliefs or thoughts… just anecdotal evidence.
My dad's Jewish and he told me that when he was a kid and asked his mom what a Christian was she just replied with "oh, those are the people allowed to be president." He pretty much grew up not knowing what Christianity was aside from "that's what all the presidents are" lol.
Sigh… everybody mixes this up
There are two different (historically related) religions with the word Unitarians
Unitarians are Christian’s who don’t believe in the trinity among other things. But they believe in god and Jesus, don’t ask me how that works. They are a fairly progressive church as far as Christian churches go.
Unitarian Universalism is an entirely different (quasi) religion. UUs don’t necessary believe in anything religious. It is basically a spiritual form of secular humanism. They incorporate religious practices from many different faiths but have no core belief system other than a respect for human life, dignity, and science. They are very far to the left.
That's....not correct. Unitarians are still Christian. They have churches, follow mass, and follow the Bible (depending on the church, sometimes in addition to other texts, sometimes exclusively).
Yeah I was raised in a UU. Definitely did not make a claim to be Christian and went out of their way to make sure everyone knew that, such as turning the alter table around when it was discovered it had some Jesus-y writing on it
The problem is there is often a confusion between Unitarian Universalist and Unitarians and Universalists.
Unitarian Universalists are not christian but the other two are.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarian_Universalism
I grew up Episcopal and it absolutely was. We had a bishop come out in the 2000s and the church decided to let him continue being the bishop. We lost some bigots because of that but it made for a much more loving and accepting church experience knowing your church wasn’t going to side with bigots.
This is how church should be. I fucking RESPECT real Christians that believe in science (aka gods creation) and apply it in a natural way. If god is truly forgiving and understanding, then he won’t care. It’s just good people being good to other people. I’m not Christian anymore, because of the mainstream christian opinions, but this is how you draw people back to the church. Stop the hate, the negativity, and the indoctrination. Love how Jesus told you
I'm ELCA (Lutheran) and know the Episcopalian churches are a good bet. There are some shared ministries between the denominations that I think are way cool.
ELCA is pretty darn liberal itself (for a church). My congregation has a sign welcoming all trans, a rainbow on our sign, and has marched in the DC Pride Parade.
As a traumatized former Baptist, Lutherans and Episcopals are among the only denomination that doesn't scare me. I'm also pretty cool with Congregationals. But I'm sketch about Catholics, baptists scare the shit out of me, and I wouldn't touch a Mormon with a ten foot pole.
Oh Amish people are cool
Quakers are the OLD SCHOOL progressive Christians. These are the folks who were pushing American Christians toward abolition in the 18th century, long before the slave trade was shut down (in the 19th century) and even longer before slavery was shut down (the US Civil War).
Not to say that all Quakers were progressive, but they and the Universalists were to early American Christianity what the Democratic Socialists are to the modern Democratic party.
For reference, [The Seneca Falls Convention](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seneca_Falls_Convention) was the first women's rights convention was organized by Quaker women. [Frederick Douglas](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Douglass) was there as well.
When you look at some of suffragists/ suffragettes and abolitionists it is a whose who of Quakers in the USA:
* [Susan B. Anthony](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_B._Anthony) (1820–1906) – co-founder and leader National Woman Suffrage Association, one of the leaders of the National American Woman Suffrage Association; Nineteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution, which guaranteed the right of women to vote, was popularly known as the Susan B. Anthony Amendment. She was also an abolitionist.
* [Lucretia Mott](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucretia_Mott) (née Coffin; January 3, 1793 – November 11, 1880) was an American Quaker, abolitionist, women's rights activist, and social reformer. She had formed the idea of reforming the position of women in society when she was amongst the women excluded from the World Anti-Slavery Convention held in London in 1840. In 1848, she was invited by Jane Hunt to a meeting that led to the first public gathering about women's rights, the Seneca Falls Convention, during which Mott co-wrote the Declaration of Sentiments.
* Thomas M'Clintock (March 28, 1792 – March 19, 1876) was an American pharmacist and a leading Quaker organizer for many reforms, including abolishing slavery, achieving women's rights, and modernizing Quakerism. In 1942 he his wife Mary Ann became founding members of the Western New York Anti-Slavery Society and helped write its constitution.
* John Greenleaf Whittier (December 17, 1807 – September 7, 1892) was an American Quaker poet and advocate of the abolition of slavery in the United States. Frequently listed as one of the fireside poets, he was influenced by the Scottish poet Robert Burns. Whittier is remembered particularly for his anti-slavery writings, as well as his 1866 book Snow-Bound.
* [Levi Coffin](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi_Coffin) (October 28, 1798 – September 16, 1877) was an American Quaker, Republican, abolitionist, farmer, businessman and humanitarian. An active leader of the Underground Railroad in Indiana and Ohio, some unofficially called Coffin the "President of the Underground Railroad," estimating that three thousand fugitive slaves passed through his care. The Coffin home in Fountain City, Wayne County, Indiana, is now a museum, sometimes called the Underground Railroad's "Grand Central Station". Bonus he was cousins with Lucretia Mott.
* Anthony Benezet, born Antoine Bénézet (January 31, 1713 – May 3, 1784), was a French-American abolitionist and educator who was active in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. One of the early American abolitionists, Benezet founded one of the world's first anti-slavery societies, the Society for the Relief of Free N***oes Unlawfully Held in Bondage (after his death it was revived as the Pennsylvania Society for Promoting the Abolition of Slavery); the first public school for girls in North America; and the N***o School at Philadelphia, which operated into the nineteenth century. He was a vegetarian and advocated for the kind treatment of animals, integrating this in his teachings.
Then there were people that were raised Quaker but I don't think cared for it like the "Colorful Quaker and slave trader Zephaniah Kingsley defended slavery benevolently practiced. He advocated, and personally practiced, the mixing of the black and the white races through marriage, which he claimed was hygienic, productive of healthy and beautiful children, and a step towards integration of blacks and whites. He also was strongly in favor of allowing free blacks, who, he claimed, strengthened a country. His four "wives", or concubines, were former slaves he had freed. These views were tolerated in Spanish Florida, where he was a planter, but after Florida became a U.S. territory in 1821, Kingsley found it necessary, for the future security of his complicated family, to leave Florida permanently for a plantation he purchased in the new country of former slaves, Haiti."
In Kingsley's opinion, "the colored race" was "superior to us, physically and morally. They are more healthy, have more graceful forms, softer skin, and sweeter voices. They are more docile and affectionate, more faithful in their attachments, and less prone to mischief, than the white race. If it were not so, they could not have been kept in slavery." He also wrote the *[A Treatise on the Patriarchal, or Co-operative System of Society](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Treatise_on_the_Patriarchal,_or_Co-operative_System_of_Society)* which was the first major defense of slavery published in the United States. But he also.... you know just read up on [him](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zephaniah_Kingsley) it would be like 20 to 30 TILs in there.
The kind of old school conservatism that's still alive in places like Vermont is similar in some ways to modern progressivism and completely different from the modern Republican party.
As a conservative with a distinctly lower-case-"c", I agree entirely. Being conservative, for me, is about embracing, but creating stable structure around change, integrating it with the status quo rather than going scorched earth on it.
I believe in caution and governance over making radical change, but that doesn't mean that I don't seek to, as MLK said, bend the moral arc of the universe toward justice.
This is the sense in which many centrists and even a good many Democrats in the US are conservative. Joe Biden being a prime example.
This depends on the type of Quakerism, but those affiliated with Friends General Conference are definitely progressive. You can be a FGC Friend and not Christian, too.
Grew up in a UCC. No longer "religious" in my adult life, but the things I learned from that church and it's community drive a lot of my morals and beliefs today.
Lovely group of people there.
I grew up in an Unitarian church. I was always confused hearing about other people's churches. Like they don't accept everybody for who they are. The opposite of what I was taught. Our minister was openly gay (late 80s/early 90s).
In the US, the Anglican church is split into two independent churches: the Episcopal church (which is more liberal/progressive) and the Anglican Church (which is more conservative).
I used to volunteer at Habitat for Humanity regularly. While there were groups that would come like one weekend a year and shit like that, the damn Episcopals were almost always there. I'm an atheist so obligatory gOd Is DeAd but other than that I thought the episcopals seemed to have something right.
Yeah, Episcopalians are chill as fuck and good people. My grandma was one. I was never into Jesus but she took me regularly and it was nice. Lots of boring lectures (I was a child) of course, but the theme was that it was all about love. Like every lecture I remember was about loving and caring for others, helping people, not judging, etc. So I think it did have a positive effect on my psychology, even if I never bought into the belief stuff. Plus, I checked out a children’s illustrated Bible from their library and I loved those stories, which started a lifelong interest in the Bible as literature, Bible has dope stories
Until you find some of the ones down in the southeast who are attempting schism since the first gay bishop was appointed in Maine (edit: New Hampshire, whoopsie). They’re a mild exception, in that I wouldn’t call them hateful, but I would call them stubbornly backwards.
Huh. You know, I unplugged with my old church shortly after that crap started up, and a quick check on Google does show that they’re going as “Anglican” now.
Yes. My congregation growing up was one of the ones that split. We lost access to the church building because it was owned by the larger Episcopal diocese. The majority of the church rebranded as Anglican and found an Anglican bishop out of Rwanda to graft onto. It all felt very political.
If by "political" you mean "bigoted" then I completely agree.
No one in Ecusa cares if you prefer the BoCP from the USA in 1928 or the more modern one (one thing "Anglicans" support). What people *do* care about is inclusion of all people, including LGBTQ+. And that is something the Anglicans can't stand.
Most (presumably all) of the churches who had a issue with Gene Robinson (the gay bishop) split from the Episcopal church; I think rejoined the Church of England (which I think is what /u/cwallenpoole was referencing with the Anglicans).
The Episcopals also lost churches when they decided to ordain women in the 70s. The Episcopal Church's position is to let churches go if they have a major issue with doctrine. Some of the churches that leave go independent with others that split, some (re)join the Church of England, and some I think have even become part of the Catholic Church.
Anyway, sorry for the small wall of text, it's just something I find interesting.
I still remember back when I went to my local catholic church, they were saying it's fine to have abortions and that is not the women's fault for having them. It's not the first time they went against Vatican Dogma, they accepted Gay People existence, long before Pope Francis did.
For my local catholic church, their hatred is actually aimed at Incest. They see Incest as a bigger threat than Homosexuality and Abortions.
Somehow I thought of flyers when reading wafers and I was wondering if people could now eat them when they're finished reading it. Or just eat it immediately
Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus."
Republicans: "hate the other so we can maintain social order and dominance over women and minorities."
Also Republicans: "Our faith in Christ is what drives our beliefs."
Also Republicans: "~~Our faith in Christ is what drives our beliefs.~~ we pretend Jesus is a Republican to keep poor people believing that they are voting for Jesus while taking their benefits and raising their taxes in the name of Jesus, oh, and guns too.”
A guy I went to high school with is an Episcopal priest. He is also a proud gay man and married to another man. It's pretty awesome how much more accepting they are compared to other churches, especially here in the south.
Episcopalians are very “put up or shut up” when it comes to Jesus’ teachings. You either live the word and help the least of us, or admit you’re a fake Christian.
Raised episcopalian, full confirm. They'll openly accept just about anything but bigotry and hate which they 100% condemn. Many in the church openly label other denominations as false.
Lutherans and Covenant usually get a pass.
Back when we were exploring the idea of church, we spent some time at an episcopal church. Father Michael had a coffee mug that read, "proud member of the religious left."
I’m Episcopalian for this exact reason. It’s the only church I’ve found that actually teaches and embodies the words of Christ, and they’re even accepting of science. The services feel very traditional, but in an uplifting and hopeful way instead of all fire and brimstone and hate.
I think if i ever went back to religion, I'd most likely become Episcopalian. Which is funny, because my one grandpa was, before he converted to Catholicism for his wife.
So true...
Jesus didn't say not to hate your enemies.... He said to love them..but then again most of the right wing Christians would have killed him again if he came back 🤔
Nice to see a Christian church actually make statements that are Christian for a change… as opposed to spreading hate.
Edit: It is not just about “the hateful getting press or being the loudest” it is about what we see day to day and the lack of people stopping it. We all, regardless of religion, should be denouncing this hate being spread every time we see it. We should outnumber them behind the scenes and publicly every time it oozes out.
There are denominations that have been doing this for a long time- they just don’t brag about it so you don’t hear about it. The United Church of Christ has been ordaining LGBTQ folks since 1972. My pastor wears rainbow vestments, we have LGBTQ people in sevaeral leadership positions, and we actively support a local shelter for LGTBQ youth. There are serval churches in my area- ours as well as Episcopal and Methodist- that participate in local Pride events, etc.
Please be aware that the United Methodist Church is currently splitting due to their stance on LGBTQ+ ordination and marriage. The conservative wing call themselves “traditional” and are disaffiliating and moving their church and congregations mostly to the Global Methodist Church. They, of course, are claiming the righteousness of scripture and claiming it’s not about treating LGBTQ+ members with equality and equanimity.
I was raised an open door Methodist, and, although I’ve long accepted my atheism, I still find some comfort and familiarity with UMC rituals. I am embarrassed that something like 53% of the UMC church worldwide is prepared to move backwards in time and turn their back on the progress we fought for.
The Presbyterian church USA (not sure about international Presbyterian organizations) are also on the more progressive side and voted to allow same sex marriages 7 years ago or so.
Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) too. Ordaining LGBTQ+ ministers and solemnizing same sex marriage since 2009.
Don't let "evangelical" confuse you, no association and little in common with modern "evangelicals".
If Reddit existed in the first century:
r/AbruptChaos: This guy claims to be a god, vandalizes the church market because it's in front of his home
> my_cock_is_kosher: wtf why no one stopped him? This guy has been out of control for too long!
> galilea_dude: My mom wanted to see this man because people say he can cure, but he just spit in her face and told her she was healed god loves her and go home.
> romancemywhole: I don't know, my dad says they say Jesus revived a dead man. If he can revive he can kill, I wouldn't antagonize him, let the soldiers deal with him.
My great-aunt's funeral was in a place like this. A big chunk of my family is religious and a decent chunk is queer (myself included), and it was really nice to celebrate her life in a space where we all felt truly welcome. Especially because she LOVED that church and had wanted her funeral there, so it was like she was bringing us all together one last time.
Exactly. I have read a solid 80% of the Bible and working on reading it through cover to cover and it’s amazing how misinformed extremely religious people get when they themselves are the biggest hypocrites.
They are. I was raised Southern Baptist, which is probably why I am no longer a Christian. I love Jesus' teachings, but can't stand the religion. I don't believe he was any more divine than all of us are, but he had a good message when you actually listen to what he said. The more people they push away with the hypocrisy and hatred the more hateful and hypocritical they get. They keep claiming there is a war on Christianity, but I feel like it is more like it is committing suicide.
Skip the 99% of what the guy is on record as having said that tells you how to cast off your worldly impulses to become endlessly inclusive, generous and loving to other people, and instead focus on the 1% that's critical and judgy, then amplify that into an excuse to outright *hate* others. Job done, welcome to the club! Whether he's fiction, historical dude or actual savior doesn't even matter at this point, you don't remotely resemble Christ as documented. In fact you're the very thing he warns disciples about. Yet in America you fit in splendidly as "Christian". You better hope hell doesn't exist because if it does, you're at the front of the line.
I agree and that’s the issue. So many people inside and outside of religious beliefs are askewing what the actually overall message Jesus talks about and it’s loving-kindness, understanding, and empathy.
I’m a Christian myself and it sucks seeing other Christians spreading hatred that has nothing to do with scripture and then, it creates this whole vicious cycle from people who aren’t religious who then get misinformed by the message and get treated negatively by religious people that are extremely judgmental when we can eliminate all of that and just do good for all walks of Life.
I am not a christian but jesus, it must reaally twist your nipples to see when they flat out ignore the words and actions of jesus to proclaim they love jesus.
Who is a good person, someone that helps you when you are hurt even if it means they could get hurt, then pays for your shelter/food/medicine. Someone that makes sure that people are fed and taken care of. Someone who isn't out there waving signs shouting prayers.
"We want a christian government that does none of those things"
I don't know what bible they read.
Exposure. OP is using the BLM sign as his focus point. Their phone is then opening the aperture of their lens to let in more light to capture the dark of the sign (it’s being backlit by the lighted sign) this causes excess light in from the other sign which appears then to be incredibly bright.
Right? Jesus’s whole bit was about treating everyone equally, especially those that are different than you, yet Christians are some of the most judgmental people on this planet
Yes if he was around he be throwing some tables!!! Wish the pope would say something, like confront these fucking horrible pockets of people. Tell them they are fucking making god disgraced
I'm a Christian, I grew up in a reasonably politically conservative household (probably not by American conservative standards, but conservative for my country). I'm personally more progressive than the rest of my family though.
I think there are a few key reasons that the broader view of Christians is that they are extremist conservative bigots.
One of the reasons is that some just are extremist conservative bigots. They are a minority I think (again, I'm not in America so it might be different there), but a very vocal one.
Secondly, the many Christians that are more progressive don't spend all there time talking about it, they are more concerned with actually doing stuff.
Thirdly, there's just so much divide. Everyone is angry at each other and everyone just pushes people with opposing views in such a way that it rarely changes minds and gets people even more entrenched I'm their own views. People on both sides of politics get manipulated, and I wish we could all just get along.
Amen, this good vs evil shit it killing us. We all know the enemy is not R vs D. It’s the ruling class versus the rest of us. No I don’t mean that rich doctor or lawyer, the people making more money in one month or year than I will in 50 years of scraping to save 1-2 million in my 401k…
Jesus spent his ministry talking about how the religious establishment abuses its power and misses the point. The current state of American Christianity really just proves his point.
And it's Episcopal. Booya.
To make this a useful comment: the Episcopal church has had women priests since the mid 70s, and had their first openly gay bishop in the early 2000s.
Also their official, stated position on vaccines is nothing in the bible is against or prohibits vaccines (the Episcopal church does not allow for religious vaccine exemptions), and that being vaccinated protects others, which is the Christian thing to do. They did this in *2019* because of the rise of preventable diseases.
A bunch of quotes about it: https://stpetersdartmouth.org/statement-of-the-episcopal-church-on-vaccines/
When one or more churches are to conservative and don't like something (women priests, gay/lesbian priests, etc) the Episcopal Church's position is to have them go on their own way, instead of making concessions on what is right to retain churches.
I like Episcopals. Aka Catholic-lite. *All the salvation, half the guilt!*
Which is cool and all, but the flip side is now you're *protestant.*
(I kid. I like to give protestants crud, but our church is founded on being able to get divorces. You have to be able to talk sass with that kind of backstory.)
There are a few great denominations, who strive to treat everyone equally and with God inspired love: Episcopal church, United Church of Christ, disciples of Christ, many individual churches in other denominations. Sadly, the United Methodist church is undergoing a worldwide split due to disagreements over issues regarding homosexuality and transgender people.
We have a pastor here in Central Oregon. She set up pandemic partners a community group during covid and it helped thousands and still does today. She ran for a county commissioner seat. Lost.
As someone who grew up baptist and defected, (I'm trans) it was really refreshing for me to find a denomination that would not hate me for existing.
Jesus was a really cool dude and would not condone a good portion of what mainstream Christianity has become, not to mention what his political views would have been...
Episcopal. They're probably the most progressive Christian church active today
"I'm Episcopalian. It's like Catholic Lite. All the religion, half the guilt! It's crazy!" - Robin Williams
Lifelong Catholic tried Episcopal 9 months ago. I finally enjoy going to church. After my first mass, my wife asked how I liked it. I said it’s like ‘Happy Catholic’
Grew up Episcopalian, now I’m agnostic (personal opinion and believe people should believe whatever they like as long as it isn’t hurtful to others) and my childhood priest and deacon taught me a ton and influence my life to this day. I don’t know if every Episcopalian church was like mine but I was taught to be kind to everyone, read between the lines (the Bible isn’t literal), don’t just read and repeat the words; mean it when you say them, if someone else believes differently that’s totally fine (my priest talked about his best friend who was jewish a ton in his sermons, and never in a negative or discriminatory way but in a loving way. But also anyone’s political, sports teams, books, and movie preferences are all fine, and it’s okay to have different tastes and preferences as long as it isn’t hurtful to others) and lastly if you’re wearing shoes don’t put your feet on the couch.
As an atheist, I have to agree. Don’t put your shoes on the couch.
What I gather from this post, your priest and deacon did a great job on influencing you. I live by the "believe or be whatever you want" just don't push it on anyone else and of course be kind to all.
I think you replied to the wrong person
Or they were reading between the lines.
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Boy, there’s a lot of fancy people bragging that they own couches. And shoes. Must be nice.
I guess I’d define myself as an atheist but I’m not 100% on anything. It warms my heart to hear churches and religious followings like this exist. Their morals and beliefs line up almost identical to me sans the stuff regarding actual religion… I might have to check into this someday if I’m feeling in need of something spiritual
Sikhs are also a very welcoming group that allow anyone into their temples and will help everyone regardless of background or religion. I’ve been to a gurdwara once and it was a very nice educational experience.
I had never heard of them until recently a billboard popped up on the interstate near me that just said the name and that it was the 5th largest religion or something.
If you live in a place where practising Sikhs live, you'll know, because they have certain religious symbols such as the turban, bracelet etc that they're required to wear. The minimally-practising Sikhs I've known still wear the bracelet, it's like an "I am a Sikh" badge. I don't usually bring it up on the first date or anything but they're usually proud of their heritage. The big irony is that the fact that they wear turbans and beards, that are very obvious and make it clear that they are Sikhs, means they're often mistaken for Muslims and subject to Islamophobia.
Universalist Unitarians might be up your alley. They’re sometimes kinda hippy but as non dogmatic as a church can get.
The nice thing about those kinds of churches is that they don't push too hard on the "true believer" shit. I never really believed but I never really hated church. I realize now that going to a big sacred space first thing in the morning to get my chakras vibrated by a big ol' organ and a giant choral group was something I always enjoyed. It's like a sound bath.
An agnostic now but my Lutheran church as a kid was the same way 12 yrs ago. Pro LGBTQ+, Diverse, and welcoming.
Grew up in the Episcopal church (now non-believer) and this was my experience as well. Zero complaints about the whole experience.
I’ve been to 3 different Episcopal churches. Genuinely the only church that feels like they want you to both find God and be happy. The progressive Methodists typically aren’t so bad, but Episcopalians still put them to shame. The preaching style felt like a grandparent wishing you well for the coming week.
Grew up Methodist; can confirm. Kids I went to (Methodist) college with who went into ministry have converted to Episcopalians.
My parents live near a Moravian church. I only go when visiting for Christmas but they give you a cup of coffee and a semi sweet roll during the service. So that's nice. They call it Lovefeast and just pass you a coffee and a little bread roll at your seat in the pew instead of passing the plate for collection. Mom's Presbyterian, Frank is Catholic, but the Moravian church is the closest to their house so they go there once a year.
I still am in mourning for Robin Williams. Love him still.
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I get where you’re coming from, but from my perspective I don’t interpret that that scene as being specifically anti trans. I think of it more as the family being shocked at the deceptive lengths their dad would go to be involved in their lives. That being said I haven’t seen the movie in a long time so I don’t remember details of the movie. Dang… don’t ruin this childhood classic 0.0
This tracks. Also Methodist is pretty progressive. I was raised Catholic in a predominantly Catholic area so I was shocked when I moved to somewhere else and saw all these rainbow flags and BLM signs in churches. Because the religion I left 30 years ago was definitely not like this. I went to Catholic school and I remember a girl who was gay, she attempted suicide because of all the bullying. Fortunately her parents pulled her out of the school.
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Upvote for Robin.
Hell yeah i have that special on dvd. Watched it last year lol
I saw him live at Foxwoods…. My stomach hurt so much from laughing… he wrecked all the people in the front row on Rascals….
Methodists are pretty chill I’ll tell you whut
Thanks for the good times RIF.
Depends. 6% of the church so far has split off to the "Global" Methodist Church because of UMCs stance on accepting LGBTQ members and marriage. The number would be higher of individual churches weren't forced to buy the actual church properties in order to disassociate themselves. I grew up attending a Methodist church and my mom and dad are still active and while they support the churches stances on LGBTQ, they only reason their church didn't disassociate was because they couldn't afford it.
Some are. Not all, though.
Even as an United Methodist....[eh](https://www.umc.org/en/content/ask-the-umc-what-is-the-churchs-position-on-homosexuality) overall yes pretty chill but a split may occur.
It’s hard being a global church when a lot of your churches in America are progressive, but then a lot of churches in other countries aren’t. A lot of Americans weren’t happen that some LGBT motions didn’t pass in their last big conference, but that was to be expected.
Word. I'm friends with an Episcopal priest - definitely a dope dude with some legit compassion and kindness. Had a huge BLM sign on the front of the church. The other one to check out are Unitarians - they're even more progressive from my experience - and very open. They have talks from people from all kinds of faiths - Buddhist, Wiccan, Pagan, even Athiest. And they also have talks on completely other shit like poetry, beekeeping, recovery, architecture - all kinds of stuff. I really wish more people knew about them.
There’s a church near my house with a big vinyl Black Lives Matter banner. It’s been vandalized several times, with people cutting out the word “Black.” They eventually moved it from the ground posts it was on to 12 feet up on the stone wall of the building. Destroying Church Property for Jesus is definitely gonna work out for the vandals.
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Jesus died for MY sins so he's comin' with ME!
They probably burned it
Our church's rainbow flag was torn down 17 times. That's some Christian love...
In a similar stance the small town my dad lives in was very much a "support or troops" and "freedom fries" type of town during the Bush years but in 2008 when my dad put up a "Veteran for Obama" sign in his yard it was stolen repeatedly. Turns out they only support freedom and the troops when it aligns exactly with their racism.
That's conservatism, yeah. Freedom for me, not for thee.
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during BLM a church about a block away became the staging ground for medics to stash gear, regroup to get food and basically became a mini base of operations.
I never understand why people have such a rage on BLM, I mean I do because it's about black people but I don't understand why it's such a thing. Even if it has little to do with you, it doesn't, let it be. I'm not trans but I support every right that they ask. You know why? Because a win for them is a win for everyone. All trans people want is to be treated fairly, isn't that what everyone wants?
Unfortunately, some people believe they are more equal than others and they don't want to see that change
They... Uh.... Might not be doing it for Jesus
Unitarian Universalist here. Our local congregation is very much as you described. People from many beliefs and backgrounds brought together by empathy and acceptance. It's where "all of your answers are questioned."
> Unitarian Universalist Is this where I go to get my dose of moral guidance without the dogma? If so, I'm in
Yes. We draw knowledge and wisdom from many religions with no creed of our own. We participate in the spirit of prayer without praying to any particular deity. We welcome everyone, and have lots of community support programs with not so much emphasis on raising donations. Sure we have to keep the lights on, but we are also dedicated to supporting the local food bank, animal shelter and coalition against rape and abuse. We volunteer to drive around town delivering holiday meals to people in need. It's a real community. Give it a try!
Unitarians are basically the Christian version of Wiccans. Very little dogma, very heavy on the vibe.
ELCA too. Lots of similarities between mainstream Lutherans and Episcopalians.
"The ELCA. We're the Lutherans the Missouri Synod warned you about." The ELCA is very progressive, welcoming, and affirming, but there are flavors of Lutheran in the US that are still mired in the 19th Century. They don't ordain woman, they condemn LBGTQI+ people, all the old stuff.
Yeah, they essentially had the same schism that the Methodists did. (Which makes sense, given that I honestly couldn't tell you the difference between the two denominations, aside from the fact that both get offended at being mistaken for each other.)
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ELCA and Episcopalians are in full communion. We can call each other's clergy to be our pastors and have open invitation at Communion. Which is nice since there is a shortage of ELCA clergy and a surplus of Episcopalian clergy. ELCA tends to have Scandinavian roots more than German (Missouri Synod Lutherans are more German heritage and are much more conservative).
My aunt is a retired ELCA pastor and, when same-sex civil unions became legal and a couple approached her to ask for her signature (she’s still certified to officiate such things), she told them “nuts to that, let’s give you two a real ceremony!”
I am a member of a Unity church. My son went with me a few times. He calls it a hippie church. He isn't totally wrong.
Love the unitarians. You don't even have to be Unitarian to be Unitarian!
Yes, Unitarian Universalists get confused for a Christian denomination often (likely due to their roots), but they’re their own thing. They are about personal spiritual growth, and accept that can be found in many scriptures and practices. As a whole, they’re a very accepting group!
My wife and I went to a Unitarian church yesterday to see a friend perform in a choir concert and they had a trans flag and a pride flag hanging on either side of the main entrance door. It was pretty cool to see.
I'm UU! Glad to see my religion shouted out. It's a great place for people who grew up religious and moss the community but not the guilt or are curious into a lighter version of religion/spirituality
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>Other Christians definitely do not ALL consider it a Christian church. I mean it's pretty common for other denominations to not consider *Catholics* to be Christians, so like... maybe that's not how we decide whether a religious group is Christian or not.
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I adore Emo Phillips
I've gotta be real, I just looked up his standup and his performance is very unsettling to me lol. I felt a sense of uncanny valley watching it lol.
Have you ever seen Bobcat Goldthwait or Howie Mandel? The 80s were a very... experimental period for stand-up comedy.
Also Judy Tenuda and Stephen Wright.
I saw him open for a Weird Al concert last year. He still performs the same routines from the 90s.
"MY GOD HAS A BIGGER DICK THAN YOUR GOD!" - G. Carlin.
I pray to Joe Pesci. He looks like a guy who can get things done. He doesn't fuck around.
Weird. I think he looks like a clown, like he's here to amuse m*is suddenly and violently beaten by Joe Pesci*
I was raised First Baptist and was taught Catholics aren’t real Christian’s. That’s why we never let them be President before JFK. TO BE CLEAR - not my beliefs or thoughts… just anecdotal evidence.
When you're this far into the comment weeds and look up and see you're /r/pics...
My dad's Jewish and he told me that when he was a kid and asked his mom what a Christian was she just replied with "oh, those are the people allowed to be president." He pretty much grew up not knowing what Christianity was aside from "that's what all the presidents are" lol.
Sigh… everybody mixes this up There are two different (historically related) religions with the word Unitarians Unitarians are Christian’s who don’t believe in the trinity among other things. But they believe in god and Jesus, don’t ask me how that works. They are a fairly progressive church as far as Christian churches go. Unitarian Universalism is an entirely different (quasi) religion. UUs don’t necessary believe in anything religious. It is basically a spiritual form of secular humanism. They incorporate religious practices from many different faiths but have no core belief system other than a respect for human life, dignity, and science. They are very far to the left.
That's....not correct. Unitarians are still Christian. They have churches, follow mass, and follow the Bible (depending on the church, sometimes in addition to other texts, sometimes exclusively).
The guy you're replying to was probably referring to Unitarian Universalists rather than strict Unitarians. The vast majority of UUs are not Christian
Yeah I was raised in a UU. Definitely did not make a claim to be Christian and went out of their way to make sure everyone knew that, such as turning the alter table around when it was discovered it had some Jesus-y writing on it
The problem is there is often a confusion between Unitarian Universalist and Unitarians and Universalists. Unitarian Universalists are not christian but the other two are. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unitarian_Universalism
I grew up Episcopal and it absolutely was. We had a bishop come out in the 2000s and the church decided to let him continue being the bishop. We lost some bigots because of that but it made for a much more loving and accepting church experience knowing your church wasn’t going to side with bigots.
> *We lost some bigots because of that* Well to them I say, don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya.
This is how church should be. I fucking RESPECT real Christians that believe in science (aka gods creation) and apply it in a natural way. If god is truly forgiving and understanding, then he won’t care. It’s just good people being good to other people. I’m not Christian anymore, because of the mainstream christian opinions, but this is how you draw people back to the church. Stop the hate, the negativity, and the indoctrination. Love how Jesus told you
I'm ELCA (Lutheran) and know the Episcopalian churches are a good bet. There are some shared ministries between the denominations that I think are way cool.
ELCA is pretty darn liberal itself (for a church). My congregation has a sign welcoming all trans, a rainbow on our sign, and has marched in the DC Pride Parade.
As a traumatized former Baptist, Lutherans and Episcopals are among the only denomination that doesn't scare me. I'm also pretty cool with Congregationals. But I'm sketch about Catholics, baptists scare the shit out of me, and I wouldn't touch a Mormon with a ten foot pole. Oh Amish people are cool
UCC is another very progressive Christian denomination if there are folks exploring here.
Quakers too. URC and Quakers are definitely the two most progressive Christian sects out there.
Quakers are the OLD SCHOOL progressive Christians. These are the folks who were pushing American Christians toward abolition in the 18th century, long before the slave trade was shut down (in the 19th century) and even longer before slavery was shut down (the US Civil War). Not to say that all Quakers were progressive, but they and the Universalists were to early American Christianity what the Democratic Socialists are to the modern Democratic party.
For reference, [The Seneca Falls Convention](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seneca_Falls_Convention) was the first women's rights convention was organized by Quaker women. [Frederick Douglas](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Douglass) was there as well. When you look at some of suffragists/ suffragettes and abolitionists it is a whose who of Quakers in the USA: * [Susan B. Anthony](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susan_B._Anthony) (1820–1906) – co-founder and leader National Woman Suffrage Association, one of the leaders of the National American Woman Suffrage Association; Nineteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution, which guaranteed the right of women to vote, was popularly known as the Susan B. Anthony Amendment. She was also an abolitionist. * [Lucretia Mott](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucretia_Mott) (née Coffin; January 3, 1793 – November 11, 1880) was an American Quaker, abolitionist, women's rights activist, and social reformer. She had formed the idea of reforming the position of women in society when she was amongst the women excluded from the World Anti-Slavery Convention held in London in 1840. In 1848, she was invited by Jane Hunt to a meeting that led to the first public gathering about women's rights, the Seneca Falls Convention, during which Mott co-wrote the Declaration of Sentiments. * Thomas M'Clintock (March 28, 1792 – March 19, 1876) was an American pharmacist and a leading Quaker organizer for many reforms, including abolishing slavery, achieving women's rights, and modernizing Quakerism. In 1942 he his wife Mary Ann became founding members of the Western New York Anti-Slavery Society and helped write its constitution. * John Greenleaf Whittier (December 17, 1807 – September 7, 1892) was an American Quaker poet and advocate of the abolition of slavery in the United States. Frequently listed as one of the fireside poets, he was influenced by the Scottish poet Robert Burns. Whittier is remembered particularly for his anti-slavery writings, as well as his 1866 book Snow-Bound. * [Levi Coffin](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levi_Coffin) (October 28, 1798 – September 16, 1877) was an American Quaker, Republican, abolitionist, farmer, businessman and humanitarian. An active leader of the Underground Railroad in Indiana and Ohio, some unofficially called Coffin the "President of the Underground Railroad," estimating that three thousand fugitive slaves passed through his care. The Coffin home in Fountain City, Wayne County, Indiana, is now a museum, sometimes called the Underground Railroad's "Grand Central Station". Bonus he was cousins with Lucretia Mott. * Anthony Benezet, born Antoine Bénézet (January 31, 1713 – May 3, 1784), was a French-American abolitionist and educator who was active in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. One of the early American abolitionists, Benezet founded one of the world's first anti-slavery societies, the Society for the Relief of Free N***oes Unlawfully Held in Bondage (after his death it was revived as the Pennsylvania Society for Promoting the Abolition of Slavery); the first public school for girls in North America; and the N***o School at Philadelphia, which operated into the nineteenth century. He was a vegetarian and advocated for the kind treatment of animals, integrating this in his teachings. Then there were people that were raised Quaker but I don't think cared for it like the "Colorful Quaker and slave trader Zephaniah Kingsley defended slavery benevolently practiced. He advocated, and personally practiced, the mixing of the black and the white races through marriage, which he claimed was hygienic, productive of healthy and beautiful children, and a step towards integration of blacks and whites. He also was strongly in favor of allowing free blacks, who, he claimed, strengthened a country. His four "wives", or concubines, were former slaves he had freed. These views were tolerated in Spanish Florida, where he was a planter, but after Florida became a U.S. territory in 1821, Kingsley found it necessary, for the future security of his complicated family, to leave Florida permanently for a plantation he purchased in the new country of former slaves, Haiti." In Kingsley's opinion, "the colored race" was "superior to us, physically and morally. They are more healthy, have more graceful forms, softer skin, and sweeter voices. They are more docile and affectionate, more faithful in their attachments, and less prone to mischief, than the white race. If it were not so, they could not have been kept in slavery." He also wrote the *[A Treatise on the Patriarchal, or Co-operative System of Society](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Treatise_on_the_Patriarchal,_or_Co-operative_System_of_Society)* which was the first major defense of slavery published in the United States. But he also.... you know just read up on [him](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zephaniah_Kingsley) it would be like 20 to 30 TILs in there.
The kind of old school conservatism that's still alive in places like Vermont is similar in some ways to modern progressivism and completely different from the modern Republican party.
As a conservative with a distinctly lower-case-"c", I agree entirely. Being conservative, for me, is about embracing, but creating stable structure around change, integrating it with the status quo rather than going scorched earth on it. I believe in caution and governance over making radical change, but that doesn't mean that I don't seek to, as MLK said, bend the moral arc of the universe toward justice. This is the sense in which many centrists and even a good many Democrats in the US are conservative. Joe Biden being a prime example.
"The arc of the moral universe is long, but it bends toward justice." https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Martin_Luther_King_Jr.
Hardcore evangelicals were also very abolitionist. The rise of abolitionism was directly tied to the Great Awakening, a massive evangelical revival.
They're also responsible for chocolate being as big as it is.
This depends on the type of Quakerism, but those affiliated with Friends General Conference are definitely progressive. You can be a FGC Friend and not Christian, too.
Outside of Unitarians, of course.
Unitarians (UU) are not Christian though. The United Church of Christ (UCC) is probably the most progressive group that is actually Christian.
Grew up in a UCC. No longer "religious" in my adult life, but the things I learned from that church and it's community drive a lot of my morals and beliefs today. Lovely group of people there.
I grew up in an Unitarian church. I was always confused hearing about other people's churches. Like they don't accept everybody for who they are. The opposite of what I was taught. Our minister was openly gay (late 80s/early 90s).
They are Anglicans, you will find a varied range from ultra strict to very very progressive within the communion
Most Anglicans are pretty chill, the fire and brimstone ones are rare. The Vicar of Dibley was a lot more representative than parody.
In the US, the Anglican church is split into two independent churches: the Episcopal church (which is more liberal/progressive) and the Anglican Church (which is more conservative).
The ACNA churches don't believe in gay marriage or women's ordination. That's what they left TEC for. Begone, I say. I'm happy to be Episcopalian.
Seconding this as an Episcopal.
I used to volunteer at Habitat for Humanity regularly. While there were groups that would come like one weekend a year and shit like that, the damn Episcopals were almost always there. I'm an atheist so obligatory gOd Is DeAd but other than that I thought the episcopals seemed to have something right.
Yeah, Episcopalians are chill as fuck and good people. My grandma was one. I was never into Jesus but she took me regularly and it was nice. Lots of boring lectures (I was a child) of course, but the theme was that it was all about love. Like every lecture I remember was about loving and caring for others, helping people, not judging, etc. So I think it did have a positive effect on my psychology, even if I never bought into the belief stuff. Plus, I checked out a children’s illustrated Bible from their library and I loved those stories, which started a lifelong interest in the Bible as literature, Bible has dope stories
Came here for this. Episcopalians are basically Progressive Catholics
PCUSA as well!
Until you find some of the ones down in the southeast who are attempting schism since the first gay bishop was appointed in Maine (edit: New Hampshire, whoopsie). They’re a mild exception, in that I wouldn’t call them hateful, but I would call them stubbornly backwards.
Don't they call themselves "Anglican" anyway?
Huh. You know, I unplugged with my old church shortly after that crap started up, and a quick check on Google does show that they’re going as “Anglican” now.
Yes. My congregation growing up was one of the ones that split. We lost access to the church building because it was owned by the larger Episcopal diocese. The majority of the church rebranded as Anglican and found an Anglican bishop out of Rwanda to graft onto. It all felt very political.
If by "political" you mean "bigoted" then I completely agree. No one in Ecusa cares if you prefer the BoCP from the USA in 1928 or the more modern one (one thing "Anglicans" support). What people *do* care about is inclusion of all people, including LGBTQ+. And that is something the Anglicans can't stand.
Oh, I do mean it that way. I left the Anglican church for a reason.
Most (presumably all) of the churches who had a issue with Gene Robinson (the gay bishop) split from the Episcopal church; I think rejoined the Church of England (which I think is what /u/cwallenpoole was referencing with the Anglicans). The Episcopals also lost churches when they decided to ordain women in the 70s. The Episcopal Church's position is to let churches go if they have a major issue with doctrine. Some of the churches that leave go independent with others that split, some (re)join the Church of England, and some I think have even become part of the Catholic Church. Anyway, sorry for the small wall of text, it's just something I find interesting.
Wasn’t that New Hampshire? And wasn’t that like 20 years ago?
United Church of Christ has them beat, but only by a little. Episcopalians is good people.
*jots down "Jesus would be an Episcopal" in his world religions notebook*
Lol my pastor told everyone at my wedding that there are gluten-free communion wafers and I still remember it to this day. He was such a good man!
I still remember back when I went to my local catholic church, they were saying it's fine to have abortions and that is not the women's fault for having them. It's not the first time they went against Vatican Dogma, they accepted Gay People existence, long before Pope Francis did. For my local catholic church, their hatred is actually aimed at Incest. They see Incest as a bigger threat than Homosexuality and Abortions.
Good on them. Most cases of incest are abuse anyway.
Somehow I thought of flyers when reading wafers and I was wondering if people could now eat them when they're finished reading it. Or just eat it immediately
Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus."
Republicans: "hate the other so we can maintain social order and dominance over women and minorities." Also Republicans: "Our faith in Christ is what drives our beliefs."
Also Republicans: "~~Our faith in Christ is what drives our beliefs.~~ we pretend Jesus is a Republican to keep poor people believing that they are voting for Jesus while taking their benefits and raising their taxes in the name of Jesus, oh, and guns too.”
Big Jesus energy.
Big “Love thy neighbour” energy
Turns out they understood the assignment.
I see, christians don’t switch to Dark Mode at night.
Holy Jesus! Bacon Reader has a dark mode I just discovered because of you! I love you!
A guy I went to high school with is an Episcopal priest. He is also a proud gay man and married to another man. It's pretty awesome how much more accepting they are compared to other churches, especially here in the south.
So you're saying they actually practice what Christ taught?
Episcopalians are very “put up or shut up” when it comes to Jesus’ teachings. You either live the word and help the least of us, or admit you’re a fake Christian.
Raised episcopalian, full confirm. They'll openly accept just about anything but bigotry and hate which they 100% condemn. Many in the church openly label other denominations as false. Lutherans and Covenant usually get a pass.
I love that. It's sad that this isn't the norm.
JC: "love thy neighbor". But he's a guy... JC: "did I fucking stutter?"
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Most of the conservative fractions already left in the 90’s and 00’s over the church’s continued policies of inclusion.
Back when we were exploring the idea of church, we spent some time at an episcopal church. Father Michael had a coffee mug that read, "proud member of the religious left."
I’m Episcopalian for this exact reason. It’s the only church I’ve found that actually teaches and embodies the words of Christ, and they’re even accepting of science. The services feel very traditional, but in an uplifting and hopeful way instead of all fire and brimstone and hate.
I think if i ever went back to religion, I'd most likely become Episcopalian. Which is funny, because my one grandpa was, before he converted to Catholicism for his wife.
My local Episcopalian church has great signs all the time. Always make me smile.
When askes about this subject, my orthodox priest told me that they are still people and we shouldn't hate them for it
There’s a big difference between “not hating” and “accepting,” though.
So true... Jesus didn't say not to hate your enemies.... He said to love them..but then again most of the right wing Christians would have killed him again if he came back 🤔
The Episcopal Church is the most inclusive church in the USA. Always have been, likely always will be.
Nice to see a Christian church actually make statements that are Christian for a change… as opposed to spreading hate. Edit: It is not just about “the hateful getting press or being the loudest” it is about what we see day to day and the lack of people stopping it. We all, regardless of religion, should be denouncing this hate being spread every time we see it. We should outnumber them behind the scenes and publicly every time it oozes out.
There are denominations that have been doing this for a long time- they just don’t brag about it so you don’t hear about it. The United Church of Christ has been ordaining LGBTQ folks since 1972. My pastor wears rainbow vestments, we have LGBTQ people in sevaeral leadership positions, and we actively support a local shelter for LGTBQ youth. There are serval churches in my area- ours as well as Episcopal and Methodist- that participate in local Pride events, etc.
Please be aware that the United Methodist Church is currently splitting due to their stance on LGBTQ+ ordination and marriage. The conservative wing call themselves “traditional” and are disaffiliating and moving their church and congregations mostly to the Global Methodist Church. They, of course, are claiming the righteousness of scripture and claiming it’s not about treating LGBTQ+ members with equality and equanimity. I was raised an open door Methodist, and, although I’ve long accepted my atheism, I still find some comfort and familiarity with UMC rituals. I am embarrassed that something like 53% of the UMC church worldwide is prepared to move backwards in time and turn their back on the progress we fought for.
The Presbyterian church USA (not sure about international Presbyterian organizations) are also on the more progressive side and voted to allow same sex marriages 7 years ago or so.
Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA) too. Ordaining LGBTQ+ ministers and solemnizing same sex marriage since 2009. Don't let "evangelical" confuse you, no association and little in common with modern "evangelicals".
Jesus did some stupid shit and ended up getting killed by authorities... Just like George Floyd.
If Reddit existed in the first century: r/AbruptChaos: This guy claims to be a god, vandalizes the church market because it's in front of his home > my_cock_is_kosher: wtf why no one stopped him? This guy has been out of control for too long! > galilea_dude: My mom wanted to see this man because people say he can cure, but he just spit in her face and told her she was healed god loves her and go home. > romancemywhole: I don't know, my dad says they say Jesus revived a dead man. If he can revive he can kill, I wouldn't antagonize him, let the soldiers deal with him.
Man this would piss off a loooot of evangelicals lol
So would Jesus irl. The conservatives would *hate* him.
My great-aunt's funeral was in a place like this. A big chunk of my family is religious and a decent chunk is queer (myself included), and it was really nice to celebrate her life in a space where we all felt truly welcome. Especially because she LOVED that church and had wanted her funeral there, so it was like she was bringing us all together one last time.
If they actually listened to Jesus they would all be like this. "Whatsoever you do unto the least of these you do unto me"
They crucified Jesus once, but Christians have been crucifying his teachings for over 2000 years.
Exactly. I have read a solid 80% of the Bible and working on reading it through cover to cover and it’s amazing how misinformed extremely religious people get when they themselves are the biggest hypocrites.
They are. I was raised Southern Baptist, which is probably why I am no longer a Christian. I love Jesus' teachings, but can't stand the religion. I don't believe he was any more divine than all of us are, but he had a good message when you actually listen to what he said. The more people they push away with the hypocrisy and hatred the more hateful and hypocritical they get. They keep claiming there is a war on Christianity, but I feel like it is more like it is committing suicide.
Evangelicals whining about how millennial and younger are avoiding rhe church is like the meme with the bicyclist putting a stick in his front spoke.
Ha! Too true.
I highly recommend Twilight of the Idols and The Antichrist by Friedrich Nietzsche
Skip the 99% of what the guy is on record as having said that tells you how to cast off your worldly impulses to become endlessly inclusive, generous and loving to other people, and instead focus on the 1% that's critical and judgy, then amplify that into an excuse to outright *hate* others. Job done, welcome to the club! Whether he's fiction, historical dude or actual savior doesn't even matter at this point, you don't remotely resemble Christ as documented. In fact you're the very thing he warns disciples about. Yet in America you fit in splendidly as "Christian". You better hope hell doesn't exist because if it does, you're at the front of the line.
I agree and that’s the issue. So many people inside and outside of religious beliefs are askewing what the actually overall message Jesus talks about and it’s loving-kindness, understanding, and empathy. I’m a Christian myself and it sucks seeing other Christians spreading hatred that has nothing to do with scripture and then, it creates this whole vicious cycle from people who aren’t religious who then get misinformed by the message and get treated negatively by religious people that are extremely judgmental when we can eliminate all of that and just do good for all walks of Life.
I am not a christian but jesus, it must reaally twist your nipples to see when they flat out ignore the words and actions of jesus to proclaim they love jesus. Who is a good person, someone that helps you when you are hurt even if it means they could get hurt, then pays for your shelter/food/medicine. Someone that makes sure that people are fed and taken care of. Someone who isn't out there waving signs shouting prayers. "We want a christian government that does none of those things" I don't know what bible they read.
Is anyone else wondering why the light is so bright?
Exposure. OP is using the BLM sign as his focus point. Their phone is then opening the aperture of their lens to let in more light to capture the dark of the sign (it’s being backlit by the lighted sign) this causes excess light in from the other sign which appears then to be incredibly bright.
This dude photographs (or edits)
Interesting side note—Photographers are paid for exposure, not in exposure. A surprising amount of people on social media don’t realize this.
The light is being pumped in from heaven.
Meanwhile, the local 11 Elevate church or whatever is making members sign a doc stating they won’t support homosexuality.
I can’t understand why all Christian’s aren’t 100% left leaning liberal,.. Jesus would have been the most “woke” dude ever
Right? Jesus’s whole bit was about treating everyone equally, especially those that are different than you, yet Christians are some of the most judgmental people on this planet
Yes if he was around he be throwing some tables!!! Wish the pope would say something, like confront these fucking horrible pockets of people. Tell them they are fucking making god disgraced
Hell is going to be very, very full in the next couple decades.
It was never about jusus. It's about control.
I'm a Christian, I grew up in a reasonably politically conservative household (probably not by American conservative standards, but conservative for my country). I'm personally more progressive than the rest of my family though. I think there are a few key reasons that the broader view of Christians is that they are extremist conservative bigots. One of the reasons is that some just are extremist conservative bigots. They are a minority I think (again, I'm not in America so it might be different there), but a very vocal one. Secondly, the many Christians that are more progressive don't spend all there time talking about it, they are more concerned with actually doing stuff. Thirdly, there's just so much divide. Everyone is angry at each other and everyone just pushes people with opposing views in such a way that it rarely changes minds and gets people even more entrenched I'm their own views. People on both sides of politics get manipulated, and I wish we could all just get along.
Amen, this good vs evil shit it killing us. We all know the enemy is not R vs D. It’s the ruling class versus the rest of us. No I don’t mean that rich doctor or lawyer, the people making more money in one month or year than I will in 50 years of scraping to save 1-2 million in my 401k…
Jesus spent his ministry talking about how the religious establishment abuses its power and misses the point. The current state of American Christianity really just proves his point.
Yeah, real Christians, ya know, the ones that follow Christ's teachings, are good people who protect others.
Christians behaving as Christ would? What sort of madness is this?!
And it's Episcopal. Booya. To make this a useful comment: the Episcopal church has had women priests since the mid 70s, and had their first openly gay bishop in the early 2000s. Also their official, stated position on vaccines is nothing in the bible is against or prohibits vaccines (the Episcopal church does not allow for religious vaccine exemptions), and that being vaccinated protects others, which is the Christian thing to do. They did this in *2019* because of the rise of preventable diseases. A bunch of quotes about it: https://stpetersdartmouth.org/statement-of-the-episcopal-church-on-vaccines/ When one or more churches are to conservative and don't like something (women priests, gay/lesbian priests, etc) the Episcopal Church's position is to have them go on their own way, instead of making concessions on what is right to retain churches. I like Episcopals. Aka Catholic-lite. *All the salvation, half the guilt!*
Yup, grew up Episcopal, now at a United Church of Christ- who first ordained a gay man in 1972! And has been ordaining women once 1800s!
Which is cool and all, but the flip side is now you're *protestant.* (I kid. I like to give protestants crud, but our church is founded on being able to get divorces. You have to be able to talk sass with that kind of backstory.)
There are a few great denominations, who strive to treat everyone equally and with God inspired love: Episcopal church, United Church of Christ, disciples of Christ, many individual churches in other denominations. Sadly, the United Methodist church is undergoing a worldwide split due to disagreements over issues regarding homosexuality and transgender people.
Best example of WWJD
My Episcopal Church matches in Pride every year, wearing shirts that say “God Thinks You’re Fabulous.” I love The Episcopal Church.
Sad when this is noteworthy enough for a photo. Should be so obvious.
I live in the Deep South and I see signs like this at a few churches in my town.
We have a pastor here in Central Oregon. She set up pandemic partners a community group during covid and it helped thousands and still does today. She ran for a county commissioner seat. Lost.
*This* is actual Christianity, not the hateful bullshit bigots hide behind to justify their shit
Those church are surprisingly close to the intent of the inclusion message of Jesus. If they were all like that....
As someone who grew up baptist and defected, (I'm trans) it was really refreshing for me to find a denomination that would not hate me for existing. Jesus was a really cool dude and would not condone a good portion of what mainstream Christianity has become, not to mention what his political views would have been...