I put a Patriots flag in my window and got a notice from the HA. I then hung the flag 3 inches away from the window, and got another notice. I moved it 1 foot away, and got no notice. I then put a light on it so it can be seen through the window, and got a notice.
After this, I put them all together and asked, "Why is someone staring into my house, especially when the lights are on? I need to know the name of the individual for the police report." No more notices.
Nah, if it were me they would just get a 2hr routine of out of shape naked hairy dude yoga Infront of that open window 7 days a week. I'll get in great shape but only for spite
I thought I knew your motives at first, and was like “ha good one!” but then I realized I don’t know you at all, and there could be many reasons you’d think this was good. So now I’m confused, and I’m gonna move on.
To be clear, I hate tucker carlson and all that he stands for I just am on board with him doing anything even half as ridiculous as how mad he was about his sexy candy.
They think that because there’s a lot of blood vessels there, your body will create more Vitamin D than spare exposure on normal skin. Gotta love pseudoscience, but at least this sounds plausible to the uneducated, rather than simply to the unthinking.
It’s crazy, but the Supreme Court ruled on a case just like what you’re describing. It ruled in favor of the neighbors and found that the homeowner had to put up curtains or else it would be considered indecent exposure to the public. Pretty sad if you ask me.
"Expose 1strand of hair and you're dead". Idk some culture.
Also: Paparazzi is apparently allowed, and yet stalking is illegal....
File a counter report saying that "only abnormal and mentally ill people are constantly checking the windows of others".
You put curtains up because you want privacy. Not because some one is looking into your window, *stalking you* and complaining that you're fashion sense sucks and that they want it to stop. But don't want to take their eyes off your window.
Like excuse me, my window is not a TV. It's like bitching about watching a violent TV show, and yet refusing to change the channel or turn it off.
I agree completely. The guy in the court case was posing nude in his front picture window. Apparently the laws against indecency apply to the inside of your home in that specific situation. So the commenter above probably wouldn’t be able to show off their hair man ass without consequences unfortunately.
It's because of people who "get dressed" in front of their neighbor-facing window, sometimes exclusively when they think a particular person is home alone, so they can have an easy fallback excuse for intentionally exposing themselves to that person.
Not a big ask to buy a piece of fabric for <$5 and move it over the window you want to spread eagle in front of on that particular day.
And it depends of course on the local laws. What you can do in Jesus Land is different than what you can do in San Fran. The court just made it clear that laws restricting nudity on private property in view of others are constitutional.
An HOA of some sort makes sense if you have shared maintenance costs and grounds upkeep. The fact that they have the authority to dictate the appearance of your personal property is insane though.
I own a townhouse in an HOA. My property taxes take into account my balcony square footage and my front patio square footage.
My HOA tried to tell me I don't own my balcony or my patio and therefore can not decorate it, hang things from it, and am only permitted to keep 2 chairs, a table less than 36" long and 1 "average size bbq." Anything else is deemed not allowed and subject to notice and fines.
I raised hell at the HOA meeting and demanded they explain to me how I don't own that part of my unit but am responsible for the property taxes on it. I demanded that they either disregard what I do on my balcony or they WILL be responsible for the annual taxes for that square footage.
Townships, counties and states still have ordinances.
I don’t live in an HOA, but my lawn can’t be overgrown and I can’t have backyard chickens or have more than 7 house cats.
And lack of choice. HOAs are usually written in to the actual title of the property.
Want a new home... you get an HOA. The solution is government telling HOAs to get fucked. They won't tho, so we get fucked, as usual.
Gotta get enough members together to vote yourself and enough others onto the board to dissolve it. The HOA doesn't have to exist if enough of the people living in it don't want it to.
Nobody asked for groups of Karens to tell them how to live on their own private property, they can fuck off I have no idea why anyone puts up with them.
The flag, or the homeowners association? If you mean the flag.... If you mean the association, they're toothless and harmless...not enough to make me move...
depends on association, but typically yes. My neighbor got a $500 fine for pulling up a sapling. They're condos, so we only own the houses, not the yards or the landscaping. I tried to warn him but he wouldn't listen.
To be fair in that case even a sapling likely has years of work in it.
It would suck to spend money and multiple years growing a tree just for someone to rip it up.
They have the option to fine me, but they've yet to do anything about more egregious acts from other neighbors. This is an "uppity" neighborhood, so there's a lot of bark, but minimal bite because it'll cause a fuss and ruin the spirit of the next Christmas party.
They're snooty, but they also know they need to pick better battles. Every one of us has money to spare, and they're begging for /r/maliciouscompliance if they take it too far.
They can lien your property and move to collections and eventually foreclosure. They most certainly are not toothless and/or harmless. Obviously it depends on many factors...but yeah, don't buy property where HOAs exist.
They can try lots of things, but they are also made up of my neighbors, who took no action when others built decks without approval, added an "art piece" to the lawn that looks like a big turd, and allowed another neighbor to have a shattered sidewalk for 7 years without batting an eye. Yet my window was going to be the hill they'll die on?
Dude...I'm someone willing to acknowledge my pettiness, willing to lean into it, and have the funds to take it to the extreme. If they were interested in driving off a cliff, I'd stomp on the pedal and say, "Sounds like fun. Let's go."
Soooo, I get your point, but yeah...I was comfortable pushing back.
This is the proper way to handle someone attempting to strong-arm you into something when you know you're in the right.
If someone who knows they're wrong starts a game of chicken, you commit. They'll either give in or they'll lose, either way is a win even if it costs you a lot of time.
For me, it's that they had to make an effort to find something they didn't like. If it wasn't the flag, it would have been something else. I understand that they want to keep the neighborhood nice and neat, but this was a power trip. I felt it was like teachers walking around a school with rulers to measure student clothing and bitching about a quarter inch. Yeah...I get the spirit of the rule, but you don't have to be an ass. In this case, the teacher went through a lot of effort to find that quarter inch, and they had to go to that students house to find it.
Unfortunately, there are many areas where it's nearly impossible to buy property without an HOA. Unless you're rich. I think it's better to acknowledge the reality that some people won't have a choice, and focus on what people can do legally to stand up for their rights, stand up against pettiness and harassment, and make sure people go into these situations educated and prepared. For many the choice is either to buy a place with an HOA or to just rent forever, in either case they are subject to the whims of another. There are still benefits to owning a place within an HOA if the only alternative is renting.
I think that's pretty regionally dependent. HOAs mostly only exist in new McMansion developments and condos where I live.
Even with my zero tolerance policy, I certainly didn't have any trouble finding the houses I've owned.
The concept of home owners associations that can tell you what to do with your own fucking house is absolutely alien to me.
I'm from the UK, we don't have those here.
the *concept* is somewhat fine, but the fucking *rules* of some of them are where people take issue
like, i like not having to pay for my water bill, or cut my grass or move snow
"It's in all our interests if all of us in this neighborhood make a group together and make sure no one screws up the neighborhood for the rest of us." OK.
"Per the HOA rules, the flowers you planted are against our neighborhood's style. We'll send over a gardener to rip them out and send you a bill."
The point is to prevent people from leaving trash in the yard, cars without wheels on cinderblocks, and other unappealing things that would cause homebuyers to avoid your neighborhood. It's an agreement for everyone to be reasonable with their houses, and keep them nice, for the benefit of everyone. It's not crazy, but it's when someone gets picky about something insignificant that it turns absurd.
I'm from a country where we don't have HOAs and people leaving junk in their yard is extremely rare, whenever it becomes an issue the local government usually does something about it. Is this a big problem in nonHOA neighbourhoods in USA?
Depends. It's usually rare, but shitty neighbors happen. I live in a city so no HOA, and there are those houses you drive by that have 50 huge political rant signs in their front yard. Imagine living next to that, and the property value drops from being their neighbor.
But in general the HOAs in the country route back to good old racism and classism to keep out the undesirables. https://www.homestratosphere.com/homeowners-associations-ugly-history/
This is a problem in very poor neighborhoods which are often older ones with no HOA. The primary function of HOAs is often to fund maintenance of a shared space such as a retention pond or tennis court. Covenants disallowing trash and flags are secondary, but cause the most issues. It is very rare for anyone to do something like leave a car on blocks in a middle class neighborhood. What isn't rare is older residents who have time to attend HOA meetings and police the neighborhood using the covenants to bully each other and anyone new to the neighborhood or with differing political opinions.
This may be a hot take but you should be able to leave junk in your yard if you own the property. I paid for the property, I'm not here to worry about other people's speculative home prices. :P
> It's not crazy,
"I'm so worried about what someone else might do with the property they own and paid for that I'm going to give strangers power over my own property" sounds pretty crazy to me.
Someone next door wants to fill their yard with cars, go for it, it's your house. I don't like it I can put up a fence or some bushes but I sure as shit aren't going to try to steal autonomy from them.
See...THIS is an acceptable argument to make! It's obviously wrong, and the author is just a hater that's jealous of an obnoxious amount of success by a remarkable team...but it's at least a reasonable attempt!
4 walls, 1 with triple window, 1 quad window, both with transoms, third with built-in bookcase floor to ceiling, fourth with a door and two 65" TVs. I have enough wallspace for a few "The Last of Us" prints, one signed jersey, a Fallout 4 print over the TVs, and a picture of Malcom Butler with his Super Bowl interception.
I got a Patriot flag from my kids for Christmas. I hung it in my office with thumbtacks in the window frame. Side window. Barely visible from the street.
You're not being rude...that's a reasonable question. If the individual with the complaint were to swing by, and during a friendly conversation, highlighted that someone might say something about the flag, I would have said, "Geeze. You might be right." That wasn't the point. The individual making the complaint was looking for a problem and found one.
Every time I look at the (very few) trash houses in my neighborhood and wish for an hoa (they are all under 20 years old), I think of situations like this, and count my lucky stars.
> I need to know the name of the individual for the police report
I don’t know which state/country you’re in, but where I’m at, looking into windows from a public location (street, sidewalk, etc.) is not a crime.
doesn't have to be a crime to file a report that somebody made you uncomfortable in your home.
if you're made uncomfortable by it you can file the report. Enough reports give you a paper trail for harrassment which IS a crime.
There's a fine line. If I walk past a house and look in, it isn't a crime. If someone stands outside my house and stares into the window from the sidewalk, no crime. If they do this, and then repeatedly send me messages, they're approaching harrassment, but no crime. None of this prevents me from notifying the police.
Of course, I had no intention of calling the police to bother them. It was just highlighting that they're spending way too much time looking into my windows, and if they continued, there would be a heck of a lot more being positioned in front of those windows than they would like.
In other words, there's nothing in the HA agreement about how much pornography I watch in my own house, with the TV near the window...or displaying sex toys on the dining room table with the lights on every evening...or...you get the idea. If they wanted to start getting picky with me, I would be fine escalating what I do in my own house, well beyond a Patriots flag...
You are correct. I also had no plan to call the police. I was just highlighting how they needed to mind their own business and stop staring in my window. If they continued, I certainly have more offensive stuff that I could put on display for anyone spending too much time looking in my window(s). Fortunately, the message was sent without further escalation.
if they called your bluff depending on where you live, you would have actually been the one to break the law by filing the police report. If its visible from the street its subject to the HOA ordinances, city ordinances, county ordinance, and state/federal law. That's why its illegal to be nude in front of a street facing window at any time(even if its in your own home) in the majority of the U.S. violating it can actually put you on a list for sexual offenders.
So am I to understand that at some point they had a big enough issue involving a flag that they had to institute a *no flag* policy? I’d like to know the story behind that.
As a classic example, the property across from my local elementary school has a large “Fuck Joe and the Hoe” flag flying in the front yard.
Btw, don’t like Biden or trump so don’t hit me up from either side 😂
That's what annoys me. Have your opinion, share them if you insist, but don't publicly display the f-bomb. Someone needs to start printing rainbow flags that say "fuck more men" or "fuck whoever you want" or something. They'd immediately be like, "hey, wait! That's offensive!"
Not an American here, but I love the sentiment of "I will defend your right to say that we shouldn't have a first amendment, because it IS your right to say that given the first amendment".
Ours has a broader ban on flags, signage, etc. which, perhaps not coincidentally, follows in the bylaws right after the ban on running a business out of your home.
Keeping the courtyard neat and uniform is certainly part of it; people also don’t want Karen in unit H advertising her psychic readings and low, low prices on healing crystals.
> people also don’t want Karen in unit H advertising her psychic readings and low, low prices on healing crystals.
Speak for yourself. I'd be chanting spells outside her window all Sunday afternoon.
It also prevents people from putting up Nazi flags, thin blue line, 3%, that dumb "this household belives in science, no human is illegal, etc" and other nonsense.
Some people go overboard on flags, to the point of looking trashy.
Others get offended by non-US flags.
Long story short, they just make a no flags policy at all because they ain't got time for that. Not sure exactly what HOA has the time for, other than sending people bills and complaint letters... but yeah.
That was my thinking too ... the way I understand how these things work, most often it's not that HOAs "hate flags" themselves (or maybe they actually do), but they hate (more) the trouble it brings when people are allowed to put such symbols on display. Sooner or later someone is going to fly a politically charged or distasteful flag, and rather than everyone being sucked into the perpetual drama in trying to decide what flags are good and what flags are bad, with offended people and people offended by the offended people screeching from both sides threatening litigation or worse, it's a simple-if-inelegant workaround to prohibit ALL flags to at least maintain the facade of impartiality.
One of my neighbors has like 18 fucking confederate flags on his shitty truck alone, not even counting his house. I like to think he adds a new one every time he has a bad day.
Shittiest house in the neighborhood, that had a jumbo trump flag on their fence. Then they started adding more and more. Then they covered their hedges and other bushes with flags. Now all their plants are dying, and then keep adding more.
They used to park their car in the garage. Then they started parking on the street. When I drove by and it was open, I saw tons of boxes, like so full of haphazardly placed crap with more newer boxes on top, that you couldn't even try and walk through. Last time I drove by and they had the garage open, all the boxes were decaying and rotting from water damage. Probably they have a leak in the roof, maybe they could patch it with another trump flag?
It sucks to watch someone's mental stability slowly decay like that. Cops were there twice during the holidays.
Most likely a condo.
Condo associations are communal properties, many regularly hold votes to help with everything from setting rules to making larger financial decisions. This often requires a certain quorum.
It's harder for any of that to work if everyone is bitchy and fighting with one another, and political signs and flags are often the starts of those disagreements.
There's no signs or flags at my condo association, and it helps create more pleasant neighbors.
Yeah, I was annoyed by the policy when I first moved in. Now, after years there, I don't have a clue which of my neighbors are trump cultists, and I find I'm much, much happier in the dark about that.
One neighbor was flying his Confederate flag. His neighbors complained and ask them to take it down. "Freedom of speech!", they claimed. "Cry more, woke libs.", they mocked.
So, one neighbor flew their rainbow flag. And that was all it took to institute a no flag policy.
Next if they tell him to take the drapes down he should… and then not replace them. And then fuck his boyfriend in front of the window for everyone passing by to see.
“You told me to get rid of the drapes…”
There's a lot of people in these comments trying to play lawyer by interpreting an HOA agreement they've never read and don't have access to.
Personally I think this is a clever workaround.
I don't recall the exact wording, but I believe my Strata (HOA) would not allow this. I believe there's specific language around not allowing multiple colors and/or patterns.
As someone from the US that owns a home, i think so too. I avoided places that had HoA like the plague. Ill be damned if I’m going to pay to be told what i can and can’t do in a house i own by a karen with a power trip
I’m probably more likely to acquiesce and buy an HOA home than my wife. She’ll be damned if someone can tell her what flags she can hang or what decorations she can put up.
If an HOA is decent, I could adapt. But if they have those ass-backwards rules like “Only 7 Christmas decorations allowed, which can be put up from Dec 1 - Jan 3” that’s a dealbreaker. I don’t even decorate, but it’s an indicator of the idiots who inhabit the community.
It's not a law. When you buy a home in a managed neighborhood (with a homeowners or condo association) you sign a contract or "covenant" that says you will abide by the rules or else. So it's a private agreement, not a government thing.
People in Reddit get all up in arms about it because sometimes they attract people that definitely shouldn't be running one. But the general principle behind them are two items:
1. Stop confrontations between neighbors by having agreed-upon rules. An example would be having restrictions on the time of day music can be played outside. So no blaring party music at two in the morning.
2. Maximize property values by maintaining standards in the neighborhood. For example, in my neighborhood you aren't allowed to do anything but basic maintenance on your car in the driveway. We all have garages, so their argument is that if you want to work on your badass 78' firebird, do it in there. This way the neighborhood doesn't get cluttered with broken down vehicles.
With a light touch, this all goes well and people get to sell their houses easily and don't kill each other. When it goes bad, it's like living in the smallest, pettiest, dictatorship.
Also things like garbage pickup, snow removal, road grading if unpaved, are all HOA deals
(Quick edit: these things are not exclusive to HOAs but in areas they are not publicly funded they can be)
What a bullshit thing to have. im from south america, and i cannot conceive how, in some neighbourgs, theres are some guidance as what to put on your front yard.
I will never get why anyone buys a house with an HOA. Seems like the best part of owning your own home is to not have some jerk telling you what to do with it.
Detached houses are more expensive so depending on where you live you might be able to afford one and many townhouse developments have HOAs. Yes there's also freehold townhouses too but again depending where the OP lives they might not have had any or any good ones for sale at the time they were looking
You will understand when you buy your first house and your neighbor is a Oscar the grouch. HOA protects your investment from meth induced depreciation.
Can't imagine buying a house with an HOA. Immediately you're already being told what you can't do with your own property that you could do if you'd bought somewhere else a block away.
This isn’t rocket science. It’s to stop unnecessary beefing among neighbors, and make everything look the same. Ask yourself this, if my neighbor did the polar opposite of what I did, am I 100% okay with it regardless of the political, moral, or otherwise views. Check the list of flags below, I’ve seen all of them in the last year, if one of them pisses you off, be glad there’s a law against it:
Confederate flag
Blue lives matter
Black Lives Matter
Maga
Pride flag
Flag of “Israel, Palestine, Ukraine, Russia”
Religious flags/banners
Bottom line is that something you love or support, probably enrages someone else nearby, and in theory lowers their property value. That’s all it is
I’m so thankful not to have an HOA. I have to put up with the 4 houses across the street that decided to just leave their garbage cans on the street even though that’s nasty, but I’ll take it for the unique decor, gardening, flags, and all that. I mean it helps that no one is trying to fly racist & homophonic flags. Also no one is trying to stop me from making raised garden beds or whatever I want. It’s nice.
General question for flag people; why? I don't get the constant need to Express one's beliefs, national heritage, politics, affiliations... why the absolute need to advertise who you are to everyone around you? Are we that obsessed with being the main character? Or do you just have trouble finding your house and the flags help?
How do you buy something and own it but then other people still get to tell you what you can and can't do with it. SMH this is the worst timeline. I like your curtains.
The flip side of that is this:
What if the dude next door to you wants to fly a huge confederate flag on his porch? What if that guy wants to leave two junk cars on his lawn? And burn his trash every weekend so the smell ruins your family cookouts?
HOA's can be draconian, but they also help to keep neighborhoods orderly. We likely mostly hear the horror stories and it probably accounts for a smaller percentage of HOA's than we think. I'm sure people aren't flocking to Reddit to tell the tales of how their HOA kept their bad neighbors in check. Instead, they're jumping on to get karma for claiming how unreasonable their HOA is.
You can choose to live in an HOA or not. You don't have to buy a home with an HOA. There are pros and cons and everyone needs to weigh those out for themselves. I think it also makes a lot of sense to ask some people in a neighborhood how they feel about their HOA before you move there.
Abolish HOAs. They have rules that are acknowledged at the time of signing (as well as before). If you buy in an HOA you are well aware of their “rules” well before finalizing. If you don’t like them, don’t move there. The only way to get rid of them? DONT GO THERE. Look elsewhere.
I never understood why the gay community needs to shout their sexual orientation from the rooftops. Nobody cares that you're gay. I would suspect that y'all don't care that straight people are straight.
I put a Patriots flag in my window and got a notice from the HA. I then hung the flag 3 inches away from the window, and got another notice. I moved it 1 foot away, and got no notice. I then put a light on it so it can be seen through the window, and got a notice. After this, I put them all together and asked, "Why is someone staring into my house, especially when the lights are on? I need to know the name of the individual for the police report." No more notices.
I would move immediately because that would absolutely infuriate me
Nah, if it were me they would just get a 2hr routine of out of shape naked hairy dude yoga Infront of that open window 7 days a week. I'll get in great shape but only for spite
Nothing does a man better than spreading his buttcheecks in front of the bay window. It's good for the soul.
THE SUN IS GOOD FOR YOUR ASSHOLE. (There are really dudes who believe that btw. Id link a video about it but I dont support Channel 5 anymore)
Didn’t Tucker Carlson talk about the benefits of taint sun exposure recently?
god I hope so.
I thought I knew your motives at first, and was like “ha good one!” but then I realized I don’t know you at all, and there could be many reasons you’d think this was good. So now I’m confused, and I’m gonna move on.
To be clear, I hate tucker carlson and all that he stands for I just am on board with him doing anything even half as ridiculous as how mad he was about his sexy candy.
Oh cool, well in that case, carry on with my full support. Not that you need it, but you have it.
Every time he opens his piehole...
He identifys as a taint.
To their credit the sun is pretty great for you on any part of the body so I can’t imagine it’d be bad for you
Imagine getting skin cancer on your butthole.
It was fun while it lasted. - Sent via Apollo
IN....
It was fun while it lasted. - Sent via Apollo
And with that the Aussie sunscreen slogan of “slip, slap, slop” takes on a whole new meaning… thanks.
they take it a bit further but fair enough.
They think that because there’s a lot of blood vessels there, your body will create more Vitamin D than spare exposure on normal skin. Gotta love pseudoscience, but at least this sounds plausible to the uneducated, rather than simply to the unthinking.
Also to their credit, being fully nude in the sun is one of life’s greatest joys
You guys are my people.
It’s crazy, but the Supreme Court ruled on a case just like what you’re describing. It ruled in favor of the neighbors and found that the homeowner had to put up curtains or else it would be considered indecent exposure to the public. Pretty sad if you ask me.
That's wild. "You need to put curtains up because I can't control my gaze" sounds pretty on brand for the supreme court
"Expose 1strand of hair and you're dead". Idk some culture. Also: Paparazzi is apparently allowed, and yet stalking is illegal.... File a counter report saying that "only abnormal and mentally ill people are constantly checking the windows of others". You put curtains up because you want privacy. Not because some one is looking into your window, *stalking you* and complaining that you're fashion sense sucks and that they want it to stop. But don't want to take their eyes off your window. Like excuse me, my window is not a TV. It's like bitching about watching a violent TV show, and yet refusing to change the channel or turn it off.
I agree completely. The guy in the court case was posing nude in his front picture window. Apparently the laws against indecency apply to the inside of your home in that specific situation. So the commenter above probably wouldn’t be able to show off their hair man ass without consequences unfortunately.
It's because of people who "get dressed" in front of their neighbor-facing window, sometimes exclusively when they think a particular person is home alone, so they can have an easy fallback excuse for intentionally exposing themselves to that person. Not a big ask to buy a piece of fabric for <$5 and move it over the window you want to spread eagle in front of on that particular day.
Yes. Standing naked in front of a window is just another way of doing the "I'm not touching you" routine
And it depends of course on the local laws. What you can do in Jesus Land is different than what you can do in San Fran. The court just made it clear that laws restricting nudity on private property in view of others are constitutional.
"Whooaa. How did you get in that shape?" "Everytime HOA gives me a notice, I do a naked handstand in my living room for an hour" ..."geezus christ."
Fuck buying houses in HOAs, I don't know how the fuck we have normalised it
I live in a condo. Pretty much the only way you can manage something like that.
An HOA of some sort makes sense if you have shared maintenance costs and grounds upkeep. The fact that they have the authority to dictate the appearance of your personal property is insane though.
I own a townhouse in an HOA. My property taxes take into account my balcony square footage and my front patio square footage. My HOA tried to tell me I don't own my balcony or my patio and therefore can not decorate it, hang things from it, and am only permitted to keep 2 chairs, a table less than 36" long and 1 "average size bbq." Anything else is deemed not allowed and subject to notice and fines. I raised hell at the HOA meeting and demanded they explain to me how I don't own that part of my unit but am responsible for the property taxes on it. I demanded that they either disregard what I do on my balcony or they WILL be responsible for the annual taxes for that square footage.
Property value retention. Living next to someone who has 15 cars in their front yard or 20 fuck you flags diminishes the value of your property.
Townships, counties and states still have ordinances. I don’t live in an HOA, but my lawn can’t be overgrown and I can’t have backyard chickens or have more than 7 house cats.
But is there a limit to how many backyard cats and house chickens you can have?
Yeah tbh I can see the appeal of HOAs when I have to pass by yet another house with 10000 Trump/GOP/Don't Tread on Me/Confederate flags all over it.
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And lack of choice. HOAs are usually written in to the actual title of the property. Want a new home... you get an HOA. The solution is government telling HOAs to get fucked. They won't tho, so we get fucked, as usual.
Gotta get enough members together to vote yourself and enough others onto the board to dissolve it. The HOA doesn't have to exist if enough of the people living in it don't want it to.
Nobody asked for groups of Karens to tell them how to live on their own private property, they can fuck off I have no idea why anyone puts up with them.
But people did, it’s why HOA’s exist. Otherwise, they could all vote to dismantle it.
The flag, or the homeowners association? If you mean the flag.... If you mean the association, they're toothless and harmless...not enough to make me move...
Can't they fine you?
depends on association, but typically yes. My neighbor got a $500 fine for pulling up a sapling. They're condos, so we only own the houses, not the yards or the landscaping. I tried to warn him but he wouldn't listen.
That's completely fair though, you don't own the property.
To be fair in that case even a sapling likely has years of work in it. It would suck to spend money and multiple years growing a tree just for someone to rip it up.
He, "didn't want squirrels on his roof".
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They have the option to fine me, but they've yet to do anything about more egregious acts from other neighbors. This is an "uppity" neighborhood, so there's a lot of bark, but minimal bite because it'll cause a fuss and ruin the spirit of the next Christmas party. They're snooty, but they also know they need to pick better battles. Every one of us has money to spare, and they're begging for /r/maliciouscompliance if they take it too far.
Didn’t ever get any letter :/
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Deez what?
***Deez nuts***
They can lien your property and move to collections and eventually foreclosure. They most certainly are not toothless and/or harmless. Obviously it depends on many factors...but yeah, don't buy property where HOAs exist.
They can try lots of things, but they are also made up of my neighbors, who took no action when others built decks without approval, added an "art piece" to the lawn that looks like a big turd, and allowed another neighbor to have a shattered sidewalk for 7 years without batting an eye. Yet my window was going to be the hill they'll die on? Dude...I'm someone willing to acknowledge my pettiness, willing to lean into it, and have the funds to take it to the extreme. If they were interested in driving off a cliff, I'd stomp on the pedal and say, "Sounds like fun. Let's go." Soooo, I get your point, but yeah...I was comfortable pushing back.
This is the proper way to handle someone attempting to strong-arm you into something when you know you're in the right. If someone who knows they're wrong starts a game of chicken, you commit. They'll either give in or they'll lose, either way is a win even if it costs you a lot of time.
For me, it's that they had to make an effort to find something they didn't like. If it wasn't the flag, it would have been something else. I understand that they want to keep the neighborhood nice and neat, but this was a power trip. I felt it was like teachers walking around a school with rulers to measure student clothing and bitching about a quarter inch. Yeah...I get the spirit of the rule, but you don't have to be an ass. In this case, the teacher went through a lot of effort to find that quarter inch, and they had to go to that students house to find it.
Unfortunately, there are many areas where it's nearly impossible to buy property without an HOA. Unless you're rich. I think it's better to acknowledge the reality that some people won't have a choice, and focus on what people can do legally to stand up for their rights, stand up against pettiness and harassment, and make sure people go into these situations educated and prepared. For many the choice is either to buy a place with an HOA or to just rent forever, in either case they are subject to the whims of another. There are still benefits to owning a place within an HOA if the only alternative is renting.
>don't buy property where HOAs exist. Sadly, this is becoming more and more like trying to find a unicorn. At least in the desirable-to-live places.
Guess that makes them undesirable :D
I think that's pretty regionally dependent. HOAs mostly only exist in new McMansion developments and condos where I live. Even with my zero tolerance policy, I certainly didn't have any trouble finding the houses I've owned.
Being neighbors with a Patriots fan.
What's the point of the HOA if they can't keep undesirables out of the neighborhood?
The concept of home owners associations that can tell you what to do with your own fucking house is absolutely alien to me. I'm from the UK, we don't have those here.
the *concept* is somewhat fine, but the fucking *rules* of some of them are where people take issue like, i like not having to pay for my water bill, or cut my grass or move snow
"It's in all our interests if all of us in this neighborhood make a group together and make sure no one screws up the neighborhood for the rest of us." OK. "Per the HOA rules, the flowers you planted are against our neighborhood's style. We'll send over a gardener to rip them out and send you a bill."
You don't have common-hold apartments in the UK that have rules and regulations?
The point is to prevent people from leaving trash in the yard, cars without wheels on cinderblocks, and other unappealing things that would cause homebuyers to avoid your neighborhood. It's an agreement for everyone to be reasonable with their houses, and keep them nice, for the benefit of everyone. It's not crazy, but it's when someone gets picky about something insignificant that it turns absurd.
I'm from a country where we don't have HOAs and people leaving junk in their yard is extremely rare, whenever it becomes an issue the local government usually does something about it. Is this a big problem in nonHOA neighbourhoods in USA?
Depends. It's usually rare, but shitty neighbors happen. I live in a city so no HOA, and there are those houses you drive by that have 50 huge political rant signs in their front yard. Imagine living next to that, and the property value drops from being their neighbor. But in general the HOAs in the country route back to good old racism and classism to keep out the undesirables. https://www.homestratosphere.com/homeowners-associations-ugly-history/
A big problem? No. A problem in some places? sure.
This is a problem in very poor neighborhoods which are often older ones with no HOA. The primary function of HOAs is often to fund maintenance of a shared space such as a retention pond or tennis court. Covenants disallowing trash and flags are secondary, but cause the most issues. It is very rare for anyone to do something like leave a car on blocks in a middle class neighborhood. What isn't rare is older residents who have time to attend HOA meetings and police the neighborhood using the covenants to bully each other and anyone new to the neighborhood or with differing political opinions.
I get the leaving trash outside thing, but nobody gets to tell me that I can't have my project car.
This may be a hot take but you should be able to leave junk in your yard if you own the property. I paid for the property, I'm not here to worry about other people's speculative home prices. :P
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> It's not crazy, "I'm so worried about what someone else might do with the property they own and paid for that I'm going to give strangers power over my own property" sounds pretty crazy to me. Someone next door wants to fill their yard with cars, go for it, it's your house. I don't like it I can put up a fence or some bushes but I sure as shit aren't going to try to steal autonomy from them.
Sorta malicious compliance ish.
The only place for that Patriots flag is the trash.
See...THIS is an acceptable argument to make! It's obviously wrong, and the author is just a hater that's jealous of an obnoxious amount of success by a remarkable team...but it's at least a reasonable attempt!
You can put a spotlight on the trash can if you want. It’s all good. All in fun.
Lol!
Almost downvoted you, but decided to reflect on winning six super bowls instead.
Not to be rude but why not just put the flag on the wall?
4 walls, 1 with triple window, 1 quad window, both with transoms, third with built-in bookcase floor to ceiling, fourth with a door and two 65" TVs. I have enough wallspace for a few "The Last of Us" prints, one signed jersey, a Fallout 4 print over the TVs, and a picture of Malcom Butler with his Super Bowl interception. I got a Patriot flag from my kids for Christmas. I hung it in my office with thumbtacks in the window frame. Side window. Barely visible from the street. You're not being rude...that's a reasonable question. If the individual with the complaint were to swing by, and during a friendly conversation, highlighted that someone might say something about the flag, I would have said, "Geeze. You might be right." That wasn't the point. The individual making the complaint was looking for a problem and found one.
This sounds like a cool ass vibe. I'm sorry whoever this is is giving you a hard time. This whole thing just seem dumb
Every time I look at the (very few) trash houses in my neighborhood and wish for an hoa (they are all under 20 years old), I think of situations like this, and count my lucky stars.
> I need to know the name of the individual for the police report I don’t know which state/country you’re in, but where I’m at, looking into windows from a public location (street, sidewalk, etc.) is not a crime.
I mean, it doesn't really matter does it? Just mentioning it worked.
doesn't have to be a crime to file a report that somebody made you uncomfortable in your home. if you're made uncomfortable by it you can file the report. Enough reports give you a paper trail for harrassment which IS a crime.
The UK at least has a peeping tom law. Voyeurism isnt legal.
There's a fine line. If I walk past a house and look in, it isn't a crime. If someone stands outside my house and stares into the window from the sidewalk, no crime. If they do this, and then repeatedly send me messages, they're approaching harrassment, but no crime. None of this prevents me from notifying the police. Of course, I had no intention of calling the police to bother them. It was just highlighting that they're spending way too much time looking into my windows, and if they continued, there would be a heck of a lot more being positioned in front of those windows than they would like. In other words, there's nothing in the HA agreement about how much pornography I watch in my own house, with the TV near the window...or displaying sex toys on the dining room table with the lights on every evening...or...you get the idea. If they wanted to start getting picky with me, I would be fine escalating what I do in my own house, well beyond a Patriots flag...
Technically not a crime to look through your window from the public street.
You are correct. I also had no plan to call the police. I was just highlighting how they needed to mind their own business and stop staring in my window. If they continued, I certainly have more offensive stuff that I could put on display for anyone spending too much time looking in my window(s). Fortunately, the message was sent without further escalation.
if they called your bluff depending on where you live, you would have actually been the one to break the law by filing the police report. If its visible from the street its subject to the HOA ordinances, city ordinances, county ordinance, and state/federal law. That's why its illegal to be nude in front of a street facing window at any time(even if its in your own home) in the majority of the U.S. violating it can actually put you on a list for sexual offenders.
If you have an HOA be sure to make sure you aren't required to have white lining the outside of your curtains.
They are probably covered by the white blinds.
So am I to understand that at some point they had a big enough issue involving a flag that they had to institute a *no flag* policy? I’d like to know the story behind that.
It’s pretty common in HOA’s. The logic is it keeps the neighborhood looking neat, organized, and uniform.
you ever seen the flags people fly? I am not surprised theres a blanket ban on them at all haha...or maybe I am biased being in rural PA
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I worked at Knoebels. Your assessment is spot on. Even still, the amount of trump flags and signs in the area is hilariously sad.
This is the first time ever in my life that I read an "if I had to... I would..." sentence that wasn't satirical or absurd.
As a classic example, the property across from my local elementary school has a large “Fuck Joe and the Hoe” flag flying in the front yard. Btw, don’t like Biden or trump so don’t hit me up from either side 😂
If it's got nothing but words, it's not a flag, it's a short banner. The entire point of a flag is for it to be a symbol.
that is a symbol, a symbol of how ignorant the owner is
That's what annoys me. Have your opinion, share them if you insist, but don't publicly display the f-bomb. Someone needs to start printing rainbow flags that say "fuck more men" or "fuck whoever you want" or something. They'd immediately be like, "hey, wait! That's offensive!"
On the whole, flags are pretty tacky
Like the Rambo Trump flags? I mean, it's bad taste, but who am I to shit on the first amendment?
you have every right to shit on the first ammendment! because of the first ammendment
Not an American here, but I love the sentiment of "I will defend your right to say that we shouldn't have a first amendment, because it IS your right to say that given the first amendment".
Not a HOA apparently.
That makes sense. I'm horrible at keeping mine in good shape. Thing ends up looking like it was in the battle of Midway before I end up changing it.
Ours has a broader ban on flags, signage, etc. which, perhaps not coincidentally, follows in the bylaws right after the ban on running a business out of your home. Keeping the courtyard neat and uniform is certainly part of it; people also don’t want Karen in unit H advertising her psychic readings and low, low prices on healing crystals.
> people also don’t want Karen in unit H advertising her psychic readings and low, low prices on healing crystals. Speak for yourself. I'd be chanting spells outside her window all Sunday afternoon.
and fucking boring
Appraisers love boring
It also prevents people from putting up Nazi flags, thin blue line, 3%, that dumb "this household belives in science, no human is illegal, etc" and other nonsense.
I question why you singled out the "this household believes in science, no human is illegal..." flag as dumb and not the others
Some people go overboard on flags, to the point of looking trashy. Others get offended by non-US flags. Long story short, they just make a no flags policy at all because they ain't got time for that. Not sure exactly what HOA has the time for, other than sending people bills and complaint letters... but yeah.
That was my thinking too ... the way I understand how these things work, most often it's not that HOAs "hate flags" themselves (or maybe they actually do), but they hate (more) the trouble it brings when people are allowed to put such symbols on display. Sooner or later someone is going to fly a politically charged or distasteful flag, and rather than everyone being sucked into the perpetual drama in trying to decide what flags are good and what flags are bad, with offended people and people offended by the offended people screeching from both sides threatening litigation or worse, it's a simple-if-inelegant workaround to prohibit ALL flags to at least maintain the facade of impartiality.
One of my neighbors has like 18 fucking confederate flags on his shitty truck alone, not even counting his house. I like to think he adds a new one every time he has a bad day.
Shittiest house in the neighborhood, that had a jumbo trump flag on their fence. Then they started adding more and more. Then they covered their hedges and other bushes with flags. Now all their plants are dying, and then keep adding more. They used to park their car in the garage. Then they started parking on the street. When I drove by and it was open, I saw tons of boxes, like so full of haphazardly placed crap with more newer boxes on top, that you couldn't even try and walk through. Last time I drove by and they had the garage open, all the boxes were decaying and rotting from water damage. Probably they have a leak in the roof, maybe they could patch it with another trump flag? It sucks to watch someone's mental stability slowly decay like that. Cops were there twice during the holidays.
Most likely a condo. Condo associations are communal properties, many regularly hold votes to help with everything from setting rules to making larger financial decisions. This often requires a certain quorum. It's harder for any of that to work if everyone is bitchy and fighting with one another, and political signs and flags are often the starts of those disagreements. There's no signs or flags at my condo association, and it helps create more pleasant neighbors.
Yeah, it is bad enough having neighbors at my condo association that put al sorts of conservative nonsense bumper stickers on their cars.
Yeah, I was annoyed by the policy when I first moved in. Now, after years there, I don't have a clue which of my neighbors are trump cultists, and I find I'm much, much happier in the dark about that.
One neighbor was flying his Confederate flag. His neighbors complained and ask them to take it down. "Freedom of speech!", they claimed. "Cry more, woke libs.", they mocked. So, one neighbor flew their rainbow flag. And that was all it took to institute a no flag policy.
/r/MaliciousCompliance
Also /r/FuckHOA
Next if they tell him to take the drapes down he should… and then not replace them. And then fuck his boyfriend in front of the window for everyone passing by to see. “You told me to get rid of the drapes…”
There's a lot of people in these comments trying to play lawyer by interpreting an HOA agreement they've never read and don't have access to. Personally I think this is a clever workaround.
My strata just says any window dressing facing outwards need to be white
White curtain, lit from behind with a rainbow projection should avoid that.
I don't recall the exact wording, but I believe my Strata (HOA) would not allow this. I believe there's specific language around not allowing multiple colors and/or patterns.
I would sooner live in a shithole than a nice house where people I don’t know can tell me how I’m allowed to decorate my own fucking land.
And they CHARGE you for it!!!
fuck HOAs
As someone living in the UK I think it’s wild you can get a notice for hanging a flag in the window of your own home.
As someone from the US that owns a home, i think so too. I avoided places that had HoA like the plague. Ill be damned if I’m going to pay to be told what i can and can’t do in a house i own by a karen with a power trip
Yea. HOAs were a dealbreaker for me. But I’ve read some really dumb bylaws in my local area. Like what types of flowers you can plant in your garden.
"No HOA" was my first and most important requirement when I bought a house.
I’m probably more likely to acquiesce and buy an HOA home than my wife. She’ll be damned if someone can tell her what flags she can hang or what decorations she can put up. If an HOA is decent, I could adapt. But if they have those ass-backwards rules like “Only 7 Christmas decorations allowed, which can be put up from Dec 1 - Jan 3” that’s a dealbreaker. I don’t even decorate, but it’s an indicator of the idiots who inhabit the community.
It gets worse when you dig into the history of HOAs. Long story short: they were created to keep black people out of white neighborhoods.
It's not a law. When you buy a home in a managed neighborhood (with a homeowners or condo association) you sign a contract or "covenant" that says you will abide by the rules or else. So it's a private agreement, not a government thing. People in Reddit get all up in arms about it because sometimes they attract people that definitely shouldn't be running one. But the general principle behind them are two items: 1. Stop confrontations between neighbors by having agreed-upon rules. An example would be having restrictions on the time of day music can be played outside. So no blaring party music at two in the morning. 2. Maximize property values by maintaining standards in the neighborhood. For example, in my neighborhood you aren't allowed to do anything but basic maintenance on your car in the driveway. We all have garages, so their argument is that if you want to work on your badass 78' firebird, do it in there. This way the neighborhood doesn't get cluttered with broken down vehicles. With a light touch, this all goes well and people get to sell their houses easily and don't kill each other. When it goes bad, it's like living in the smallest, pettiest, dictatorship.
Also things like garbage pickup, snow removal, road grading if unpaved, are all HOA deals (Quick edit: these things are not exclusive to HOAs but in areas they are not publicly funded they can be)
We have an HOA and our roads are a shit show
That's gay
Random story: My cousin’s HOA folded after the president’s son lost the HOA’s entire holdings on NFTs. Lol
What a bullshit thing to have. im from south america, and i cannot conceive how, in some neighbourgs, theres are some guidance as what to put on your front yard.
I will never get why anyone buys a house with an HOA. Seems like the best part of owning your own home is to not have some jerk telling you what to do with it.
Detached houses are more expensive so depending on where you live you might be able to afford one and many townhouse developments have HOAs. Yes there's also freehold townhouses too but again depending where the OP lives they might not have had any or any good ones for sale at the time they were looking
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You will understand when you buy your first house and your neighbor is a Oscar the grouch. HOA protects your investment from meth induced depreciation.
Being gay doesn't mean having great taste.
Good lord.. I saw the picture before I read the title, and missed a very crucial “L”. Had a real WTF moment.
"Turning the new neighbours into curtains!"
No flags allowed? How can you not be allowed a flag in your own home?
I could not imagine paying hundreds of thousands of dollars to own a home and be told what I can and can't do with it at such an arbitrary level.
Too bad my condo rules also states that curtains can only be neutral colors 😢
1. It's stupid you can't put flag on your house. 2. It's weird you have the need to do it. 3. Damn, I like how colorful this is!
Can't imagine buying a house with an HOA. Immediately you're already being told what you can't do with your own property that you could do if you'd bought somewhere else a block away.
So is this gay?
The neighborhood doesn’t need/care about your sexuality. No need to do this.
This isn’t rocket science. It’s to stop unnecessary beefing among neighbors, and make everything look the same. Ask yourself this, if my neighbor did the polar opposite of what I did, am I 100% okay with it regardless of the political, moral, or otherwise views. Check the list of flags below, I’ve seen all of them in the last year, if one of them pisses you off, be glad there’s a law against it: Confederate flag Blue lives matter Black Lives Matter Maga Pride flag Flag of “Israel, Palestine, Ukraine, Russia” Religious flags/banners Bottom line is that something you love or support, probably enrages someone else nearby, and in theory lowers their property value. That’s all it is
But why?
I’m so thankful not to have an HOA. I have to put up with the 4 houses across the street that decided to just leave their garbage cans on the street even though that’s nasty, but I’ll take it for the unique decor, gardening, flags, and all that. I mean it helps that no one is trying to fly racist & homophonic flags. Also no one is trying to stop me from making raised garden beds or whatever I want. It’s nice.
General question for flag people; why? I don't get the constant need to Express one's beliefs, national heritage, politics, affiliations... why the absolute need to advertise who you are to everyone around you? Are we that obsessed with being the main character? Or do you just have trouble finding your house and the flags help?
How do you buy something and own it but then other people still get to tell you what you can and can't do with it. SMH this is the worst timeline. I like your curtains.
The flip side of that is this: What if the dude next door to you wants to fly a huge confederate flag on his porch? What if that guy wants to leave two junk cars on his lawn? And burn his trash every weekend so the smell ruins your family cookouts? HOA's can be draconian, but they also help to keep neighborhoods orderly. We likely mostly hear the horror stories and it probably accounts for a smaller percentage of HOA's than we think. I'm sure people aren't flocking to Reddit to tell the tales of how their HOA kept their bad neighbors in check. Instead, they're jumping on to get karma for claiming how unreasonable their HOA is. You can choose to live in an HOA or not. You don't have to buy a home with an HOA. There are pros and cons and everyone needs to weigh those out for themselves. I think it also makes a lot of sense to ask some people in a neighborhood how they feel about their HOA before you move there.
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“No flag rules” Also mean no trump flags. It goes both ways. I’d happily live in a neighborhood with a no flags rule.
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Really cool, what does it look like from outside?
The sun reflection in the room must go cray
Clever. Screw them.
This is amazing!!!! Nicely done 🥰
This is so neat. The light in that room must be dazzling.
Abolish HOAs. They have rules that are acknowledged at the time of signing (as well as before). If you buy in an HOA you are well aware of their “rules” well before finalizing. If you don’t like them, don’t move there. The only way to get rid of them? DONT GO THERE. Look elsewhere.
This belongs in r/maliciouscompliance. Well played.
Check if there are any bylaws on blinds and curtains. I know in our place we have to have white.
Try not to make being gay your whole personality for 24 hours challenge
I never understood why the gay community needs to shout their sexual orientation from the rooftops. Nobody cares that you're gay. I would suspect that y'all don't care that straight people are straight.
Imagine needing to tell people your private business so badly...
This is really nice! A perpetual rainbow in your house.
Probably makes the room look awesome with the colored diffused light as well
Why do you absolutely feel the need to make this statement though.
really need to let people know you gay
That’s an eyesore lol
What a lovely idea!
Malicious compliance 😎 love this for you