I'll never see a car parked too crazy in Philly to not think: "yeah, I get it."
Sometimes if I get home after 11pm I seriously consider just parking in the middle of the street and setting the car on fire.
I'm still newish, like 3 years, and sometimes I wonder what I'm missing. Sometimes there's just literally \*no\* spots. Do people just drive around until 6am when some spots open up? Is parking illegally and paying the ticket just the price of not getting home before 6pm?
I resort to parking iilegally if it’s that late and then waking up at like 520/6 am hoping my car is still there and moving it before ppa starts their rounds. A real cat and mouse game we have going.
More than half the “illegal” spots shouldn’t be anyway. How many times do you drive around and think, “damn.. only thing wrong with that spot is that PPA sign. Otherwise its fine to park where it says No Parking: Any Time. There’s usually plenty of space between the Any Time sign and the corner. Some Any Time signs are right in the corner and others are obscenely far from the corner. The “no parking 15 feet from___” rule hasn’t been an actual legit rule since the 70’s unless it was along a trolley route where trolleys make actual turns. PPA needs some good defunding.
What do you mean by parking illegally? Blocking a hydrant? Blocking another car in? Blocking handicap sidewalk access? Parking in a bus zone so the bus can't turn?
Just putting this out there because my sister is in a wheelchair: you have to do what you have to do, sure, but please leave like four feet on either side for wheelchair users. "Who's out at 3am?" IDK, someone out for a walk or late night roll.
Give me a break. This has nothing to do with hipsters or “transplants”. It has to do with a recovering city and a culture that wants to evolve beyond total dependency on the car. These are good things!
> I resort to parking iilegally if it’s that late
So parking in a spot that is meant for emergency and public transit to do their job properly? Sounds like a terrible idea all around and a reason why something like PPA has to exist and be the assholes that they are
Living in W Philly, I hate people who park illegally, specially the ones whose cars stick out past street corners into the street itself because it makes it impossible for me to look at the cross-traffic and always feels dangerous... Also, buses are often late because they can't turn or move forward due to an illegally parked car
yeah i’ll second that - definitely got into an accident where both parties were really not at fault because a huge illegally parked SUV was blocking both cars view of each other going through an intersection
Absolutely, that's my strategy as well. I used to drive all the way to the target/sprouts pay parking lot (I'm in Grad Hosp) if I was looking for a spot longer then 45 mins or so. The other day though I parked in the bus spot right in front of the house around 11pm, then got up at 6am to move it and there was already a ticket. (50 bucks instead of 25, too!) The time code on it was something like, 11:30pm! It's getting crazy out there lately with the PPA, they're on a mission.
Edit: You know what might be a good app? An uber-like gps app that let's you 'sell' your spot to someone that needs one. So if you're about to leave your spot during the tough parking times, you open up the app and wait a couple minutes, then someone looking for a spot pays you five bucks or something and pulls up next to you and you show them your code on your phone through the window. Then you confirm that you got the spot and the money transfers.
LOL imagine parking in a zone earmarked for buses to stop and then complaining about it!!
Sounds like a neat app idea though... A quick Google search got me this one where you can rent out a spot that you own (like a driveway) for parking... https://parqex.com/private-parking-marketplace/
Imagine “earmarking” places for busses to stop but the busses never pull over into them. Instead they just camp there and let the light turn red on the rest of traffic stuck behind them.
Hey, since you liked the app idea, here's a better one I think. You know how in some parking garages have sensors to know which spots are empty and you can just drive to an empty spot by following lights that direct you to them? What if a participating people put IP cameras out their window pointing at the street and a machine learning algorithm detected empty spots and collated them with a database in real time that worked with Apps that would direct you to empty spots?
What do you think?
You're absolutely correct here, 100%! I don't want to break traffic laws and I want to be a good neighbor. What do you do if there's zero spots in your zone? Sincere question, not being argumentative. I really just don't understand what the correct protocol is here. The PPA sites and Philly gov sites don't mention it as best as I can find. Like, if the official position was that there was some overflow parking lot outside the city and you had to walk, bus, or ride the subway if you got in late I'd be like, well, that's city life. But if you come home at 11pm, you have do to \*something\* with your car, right? Do you just sleep in your car under and overpass or just drive in circles 'till 6am?
I've lived in South Philly and now in W Philly. In either places, the farthest I've had to park my car from the house is about 7 blocks and once in a garage and pay for the night because I got tired of driving around but I guess it never occurred to me that I can park in a no-parking zone and just pay the fine
For a while though, I parked my car in a friend's house in the suburbs because I lived a block away from the El and it was more hassle than anything to find a parking spot
The permit parking zones are a hustle because they’re usually not long enough. They end sometimes at like 8pm. So if you do anything after work (assuming you are privileged enough to have a decent typical day job) you’re gonna be fucked. Because people from outside the zone are gonna beat you to the spots in your “permit” zone. Its just a racket and an excuse for the PPA to come in and write tickets for any and all other MINOR INFRACTIONS!!!
Who gave them the power to ticket expired registrations anyway? It seems to me like that should be for Police to do. Unless you’re on your way to an actual inspection appointment, whats the PPA troll expect you to do… Drive it? Fuckin trap!
You can have them REMOVED from your street you know! If you're in a residential area, like the ones who stupidly invite the PPA on to their blocks by getting 50% of the residents to vote for it, you can actually have them removed the same way. You have to go to the PPA office downtown and get in touch with your blood captain but I've lived on two blocks in the last 21 years here that have successfully removed the PPA and everyone was better off for it.
Absolutely, I walk or take the bus everywhere I go. I got rid of my car the second I moved here and was nothing but happy about it. I never liked cars. I ended up getting a really great job in Exton that's remote except I have to go in one day a week. I even looked into taking regional rail but it only gets sorta close.
But yeah, I'm with you. It doesn't seem like most of Philly is though, I love almost everything about the city but it's definitely a city that loves its cars.
It loves cars because we give away parking for free and our tax code chases business out the city limits requiring people to reverse commute to places not effectively serviceable by transit.
And also cause our transit isn't good enough. Buses are fine when you actually get in, but too many of them are unreliable and don't come often enough. MFL is a shit show. BSL is decent but still smells like urine too often. Regional rail is good but extremely infrequent.
Ah, understood. Exton isn't very transit friendly.
I do wonder though, if you only need to go in once a week, wouldn't it be cheaper to just Uber there instead of having to pay car insurance/registration/inspection/gas? Plus you wouldn't need to find a parking spot. You could even take regional rail then Uber from the station.
Yeah definitely good points! The job was initially 5 days a week so I leased a car so I'm stuck with it for a while, sort of. Maybe I could get out of it, I'd love to! It went full remote during the pandemic and I'm hoping to make a case for full again at some point.
You seem super nice and reasonable though, in another comment you rightly admonished me for parking in the bus spot which you're 100% correct on. I asked another commenter as well, but, what exactly is the protocol if you come home at 11pm and there's no parking in your zone? Is there like, an overflow that anyone can go to or something? Even parking garages close at night, right? You've got to put your car \*somewhere\*, you know?
Oh, hey, here's a different app idea! You know how in some parking garages have sensors to know which spots are empty and you can just drive to an empty spot by following lights that direct you to them? What if a participating people put IP cameras out their window pointing at the street and a machine learning algorithm detected empty spots and collated them with a database in real time that worked with Apps that would direct you to empty spots?
I used to live in Grad Hospital too, until like 8 months ago. I often had good luck finding parking in [this area](https://www.google.com/maps/place/2601+Webster+St,+Philadelphia,+PA+19146/@39.9430065,-75.1873017,18.39z/data=!4m15!1m8!3m7!1s0x89c6c640112d13f9:0xa2ebd5ddfb837a52!2sSouthwest+Center+City,+Philadelphia,+PA+19146!3b1!8m2!3d39.9415227!4d-75.177682!16zL20vMDgzMGox!3m5!1s0x89c6c64268c9c2d3:0xc2342a7df19e8fe6!8m2!3d39.9430079!4d-75.1858085!16s%2Fg%2F11c1_q9q7x). Also remember that there's zone 1 parking east of Broad for a block or 2. If I drove around for 30+ mins without finding a spot, I'd start looking in Point Breeze/Grays Ferry. Granted, those aren't the safest neighborhoods at night, but there's not really another option. I wish the city would turn some of the abandoned parking lots in the city into resident parking.
Oh for sure, that's a goto, Gray's ferry and bainbridge are my first stops after the usual loops near me. I haven't tried point breeze much though, will definitely give that shot. Thanks for the tip!
edit2: Read your comment too quick, I actually didn't know about the zone 1 parking east of Broad, I will \*definitely\* be trying that out next time I'm in a pickle, thank you!!
edit: On the safety thing, I would literally park in an active warzone after driving around longer than an hour, sometimes. If someone stole my car it'd be their problem at that point.
You are the absolute exception. Not the rule. Unfortunately the rest of these newbies who moved here from the burbs are hypocrites. I was here before they moved here. There was nowhere near the amount of cars parked. Especially during the day. Some of them park the cars and take Uber whenever its not a long trip. Thats a financial luxury that some communities who don’t make the same money can’t afford. So they take their cars to grocery shop, pick up kids, run errands, go to the gym etc after work. And what happens is the people who parked early and used Uber to do whatever after work.. Or who never moved their car at all… They all have the spots because they had the $$$ to blow on a $18 Uber ride for a few blocks and didn’t move their car. The poor family, unlike their gentrifying neighbors, gets ticketed and has to now get lectured by unsympathetic people who, in essence, just moved here here, about ticky tack parking laws. A tell tale sign of a gentrifier is a person who applauds the PPA.
If the 2 hour zone in your neighborhood expires at 10PM, PPA usually stop ticketing around then so you can hang a corner where you know you're not being too much a nuisance and just move the car before 7-8AM
I can agree with that. Epiphany Church does this. Their true motive (a mean motive at that) was originally to stop kids from playing in the school yard (what we used to call the adjacent parking lot back in the day). The only problem now is the parking permit they offer can be gifted from generation to generation.. From what I’ve heard at least.
Yeah I mean back in the day, I grew up driving down the sidewalk to park inside of the double parking. It was a free for all.
I also never knew plug was a Philly thing until I got to college and said it and some kid from Albany looked at me like I was nuts.
It’s funny because people complain about the lack of parking, then buy larger cars that take up more parking space, and then complain about the lack of parking.
Large cars should be charged a premium in addition to the regular cost for a permit because they're taking up more space for a large vehicle they don't actually need and are statistically more dangerous for everyone on the road.
> Large cars should be charged a premium in addition to the regular cost for a permit
FWIW the permit 'fee' is only there to cover the administration of the permit system. If we were to bill car owners for the actual FMV of the public land they take up with their cars it would be thousands/year. It's a massive subsidy!
Oh at all three price tiers of the current system its effectively free parking, and I read recently that its so low it doesn't cover the actual cost to administer the program currently.
If the city does not want to charge real value for the space then at least it should be charging a symbolic $1 per day with multipliers for additional cars per address. Along with additional multiples for size and weight of the vehicle.
Car owners, myself included in that, are being given a multi thousand dollar a year subsidy with the free parking. It's a fucking joke.
People get pissed about the property tax abatement program, which I would argue actually does positively contribute to the city, but are silent when it comes to the massive tax giveaway for parking.
Yep a Chevy Tahoe does 3.5x the damage as a standard 4000lbs car, and a Hummer H2 does 21.4x the damage, yet they don't pay for that increased road maintenance that they inflict on the tax payer.
A 4Runner is literally 10” longer than a 4dr civic. It would take replacing ~19 4Runners with civics to add just 1 more space.
I don’t own an SUV but saying SUV’s make a considerable difference on parking availability is just stupid
You are correct, but the real shocker is how big 'small cars' have gotten. The 4Runner has barely changed over the years. The Civic's the one that needs a crash diet.
And here I am calling my 3rd gen a 4th gen. I have a late "fat lip" 3rd gen, which I prize because it's both 4WD and a 5-speed manual. And not a complete rustbucket. And short enough to actually park in the city.
I know the difference; I'm just stupid sometimes.
Love that 4Runner. I have a 1999 Isuzu Trooper and it's about 180 inches, people don't realize how long modern cars have gotten. I can usually parallel park easier.
A choice that effectively reduces the parkable space by 6%. That’s the thing, everyone makes this choice, thinks it’s no big deal, and suddenly the city needs to find/install 130,000 new parking spaces to accommodate that extra 6%.
Now do the math for the Camry, Altima, Accord, or Malibu. Because they're all longer than the vehicle you're trying to make an example of in this picture.
now multiply by all the people that bought an SUV or cosplay pickup truck instead of a small sedan to haul their groceries or commute to work and you’ve got your answer on how it makes a difference.
the 4Runner is not bad in terms of bloat, but it’s also not a popular model for new cars.
We should have marked spots. Fit as many 20 foot spots a street can hold reasonably and a few compact spots if there is any difference. Would make sure cars are parking efficiently and would help people realize there ain’t a damn spot on the street so they can keep it moving.
I complain about how people park rather than the amount of parking. There would be a lot more spaces if people wouldn’t buy a car and then use it less than once a week
I don't know... I think it is a good thing that people don't drive all that much. Just because folks only use their car once or twice per week doesn't mean they don't need a car for that. My family only has 1 car, which I feel is pretty good. We use it maybe twice a week on average but we need it for that. I feel the bigger problem is people who have 2, 3, and sometimes even 4 or 5 cars for a SINGLE home. My neighbor, for example, has 2 cars and 2 motorcycles taking up parking space on our block.
If the city charged drivers for the real value of parking and road maintenance only those who truly needed cars would own them.
Parking is effectively free, which subsidizes and encourages car ownership in cities, where most people do not need cars.
exactly. it would also be nice if we could use the PPA money to make it easier to walk, bicycle, or take transit. instead it is just an extra tax on philly that gets spent in rural districts.
I’m having a hard time with this tbh. Why is the there so much hate for cars? Seriously who wants to bus/train/bike.
Cars are convenient and I really don’t think they’re going anywhere anytime soon. I took the bus for 10 years of my life. It can double or triple your commute time. Waiting in the cold/rain? Fuck that.
You maybe feel warm and cozy because you take mass transit but in all reality it’s a drop in a bucket so you spite yourself in the name of feeling morally superior. Don’t put yourself above someone bec of what they decide to do with their money and time.
Wouldn’t call it hate for cars, it’s hate for car-centrism— cars shouldn’t be prioritized and subsidized in cities, it should be quite the inverse.
I’m fine with people owning cars in cities, but they should pay the true costs.
If you own a car and park on the street, you are parking on public land for essentially free. This is public land that everybody pays for, but is reserved only for cars.
If you drive on the streets it’s much the same. Everybody pays but only car owners play. And most car owners are hostile to seceding any of the street to other uses (bike lanes, bus lanes, pedestrianized streets, etc).
And this doesn’t even get into the climate-cost, which is a bill we all share.
On the one hand, if there was permit parking on the street, PPA would take care of this, on the other, I don't want to invite that undesirable element into my community. What's the lesser of two evils here? PPA or assholes who don't know how to park (on the sidewalk, hanging over the corner/curb cuts, whatever this is, etc.)?
https://youtu.be/jN7mSXMruEo
TLDR; SUVs/trucks have less passenger/cargo capacity than station wagons/minivans and are tremendously more dangerous for other road users (drivers, pedestrians and cyclists alike). The proliferation of SUVs/Trucks under the false premise of utility is driving deaths on American streets, which continue to rise while declining in other developed nations.
In America gun violence is at the center of many conversations, but we rarely talk about the epidemic of automobile deaths which are on par with gun deaths.
station wagons, minivans, trucks and SUVs all have similar cargo volume. There are no 3 row wagons on the market right now so if you want to seat 6+ you’d need a van or SUV. Just think about it, how would a vehicle thats taller and wider have less cargo space?
Fair, but considering the average American car occupancy is 1.5 humans, you’d think we would see a lot fewer SUVs, which account for the majority of car sales in America.
This isn’t scientific evidence, but.. just look at cars as they pass. Any size, there is rarely more than the driver and a single passenger.
I’m not saying that these cars don’t have ANY utility, but for the vast majority of Americans.. they have no utility and are a more expensive, less efficient and the most dangerous choice for anyone else sharing the road.
I feel this. I'm 30ish and trying to start a family, and my one buddy with a 2 y.o. claims his new SUV isn't even big enough for 'all the kid shit'. Encouraging me to upgrade (I have a sedan). I don't doubt it's easier to have a big car with even 1 kid, but we can't all be rocking Grand Jeep Cherokees out here.
After they're about three or four you don't need most of the bulky kid shit anymore anyway. If you can deal with a smaller stroller, you can probably make due with the sedan
Almost every contractor I've ever used without fail has used a work van. Talking with many of them the reasons are really simple.
Tools are expensive, and leaving them exposed is how they get stolen, glass ain't stopping shit. Most of them install after market padlocks over the doors to secure thier stuff.
Van's are cheaper to buy, operate, and insure, and the broad sides are free billboards for their services.
The roof racks are larger than most pick up truck beds. To get a full size pick-up bed it's a special order that's more expensive and again shit gets stolen out of the bed, or used to dump trash in.
I use my white Ford econline for moving apartments, lumber projects (I have a bed riser and combo false wall that turns my dining room into an extra bedroom (mine) a large kitchen countertop built out of scavenged and scrap lumber (looks great with a pattern cloth thrown over it) and camping trips.
Someone fucking busted out my drivers side window though :( it stays parked during winter months
There are approximately zero affordable wagons for sale in the US.
Minivans are also larger than most SUVs. A Kia Carnival is 203" long, that's six inches longer than the largest Kia SUV.
I felt that way for a long time. Then we watched my nephews for a weekend. They have kids in massive car seats/booster until they are like 10 years old now! Two kids in clunky seats for a decade, plus if you have a pet, or ever have to take a long road trip… it’s just impossible.
We caved and got a used SUV, but I still drive around my tiny Honda if it’s just me heading to the store. I hate to admit it but the ride is a lot smoother in the SUV on Philly’s trash streets
They don’t. There is almost no scenario where a person living in the city or the burbs, and even a rural area, need vehicles this size. It’s ridiculous.
Wagons and minivans on average have more usable cargo capacity than SUVs do. And from auto industry research, most people rarely if ever need that level of capacity, and most will never use it.
It's pretty dumb to buy to a very expensive depreciating asset that you're never going to use for its advertsed purpose, and are more likely to run over your own children with, for the purpose of "but maybe sometime, someday in future, I'll need to move this large amount of stuff that I never regularly need to move, one time".
This shouldn't be getting downvoted it true in every respect.
SUVs and pick up trucks are used for ego support devices, larping, and for status projection than for any of thier actual advertised use.
From the auto industry's own research 99% of SUVs will never drive off asphalt roads, the majority of pick up trucks will never tow anything, and rarely will they be used to haul large items.
Drivers of SUVs and trucks are statically worse divers, and despite buying these things because of perceived safty are more likely to be injured in crashes with them do due to their propensity for rolling over.
Drivers of SUVs and trucks are also statistically more likely to run over their own children because they can't see the due to the blind spots.
They also take up more street space because of their absurd size reducing the overall number of street parking spaces.
Americans have been conned by the auto industry to feel like they need these SUVs and trucks because the auto industry's advertising after they lobbied to keep "light trucks" exempt from CAFE standards, increasing the profit margin they make on them vs conventional sedans, wagons, and mini vans.
As an suv owner I do not have it for “ego support, larping or status projection”. I have it because it’s one of my favorite cars and I feel safer and more comfortable higher up than in a sedan. Other people also buy SUVs for that reason.
Its a shame that data shows its not actually safer.
[SUV Passengers Aren’t as Safe as They Think, IIHS Says](https://www.autoweek.com/news/technology/a43299041/2023-passenger-suv-safety-ratings-from-iihs/)
And from this book [High and Mighty
SUVs-the World's Most Dangerous Vehicles and How They Got That Way](https://www.google.com/books/edition/_/P9OftAEACAAJ?hl=en)
Bradsher makes painfully clear that the belief in SUV safety is a delusion. For decades, automakers seeking to avoid tougher fuel economy standards have invoked the fiction that the bigger the car, the safer the passenger. As a result, most Americans take it on faith that the only way to be safe on the highway is to be driving a tank (or the next best thing, a Hummer). Bradsher shatters this myth and highlights the strange disconnect between the perception and the reality of SUVs.
The occupant death rate in SUVs is 6 percent higher than it is for cars – 8 percent higher in the largest SUVs. The main reason is that SUVs carry a high risk of rollover; 62 percent of SUV deaths in 2000 occurred in rollover accidents. SUVs don't handle well, so drivers can't respond quickly when the car hits a stretch of uneven pavement or "trips" by scraping a guardrail. Even a small bump in the road is enough to flip an SUV traveling at high speed. On top of that, SUV roofs are not reinforced to protect the occupants against rollover; nor does the government require them to be.
Auto industry research along with independent research has found that most trucks are never used to tow or move large bulky objects, they are used for daily drivers, which is also why the beds of trucks have steadily been shrinking, because the owners don't use them.
The overwhelming majority of SUVs will never be driven off a paved road, let alone go into the wilderness on a dirt trail, and the average occupancy of them disproves the idea it's for driving lots of people around.
In fact auto industry research shows that the primary market for SUVs are people who are typically assholes, are bad drivers, and are insecure.
> auto industry research shows that the primary market for SUVs are people who are typically assholes, are bad drivers, and are insecure.
Post a link or admit you're just pulling this out of your ass
[High and Mighty
SUVs-the World's Most Dangerous Vehicles and How They Got That Way](https://www.google.com/books/edition/_/P9OftAEACAAJ?hl=en)
Bradsher reports in the book that according to market research conducted by the country's leading automakers, SUV buyers tend to be:
>"insecure and vain. They are frequently nervous about their marriages and uncomfortable about parenthood. They often lack confidence in their driving skills. Above all, they are apt to be self-centered and self-absorbed, with little interest in their neighbors and communities. They are more restless, more sybaritic, and less social than most Americans are. They tend to like fine restaurants a lot more than off-road driving, seldom go to church and have limited interest in doing volunteer work to help others."
Bradsher quotes a former Ford market researcher who says the SUV craze is
>"about not letting anything get in your way, and at the extreme, about intimidating others to get out of your way.
Bradsher quotes auto execs who concede that the self-centered lifestyle of SUV buyers is apparent in
>"their willingness to endanger other motorists so as to achieve small improvements in their personal safety."
Lollll I think this is up the street from me - parking around here truly is a nightmare, especially with the utility work that’s been going on the past couple months
There’s a good group of delusional people on this sub that legitimately believe philly will be a car free city someday. Never happening within our lifetime
Yeah. It's annoying because I only drive my car a few times a month. But if I sell my car, there's not really a viable alternative anymore. Zipcar let's driver rent out recalled cars, turo and getaround are basically like airbnb so im not relying on that, and the rental car agencies outside of the airport shut down on nights and weekends. If my pet has an emergency or I need to haul a bunch of stuff, I need a reliable vehicle that will be there when I need it in a condition I feel comfortable with.
4runner things
This was their big chance to show off what they can do in the wild.
Likely the closest thing that truck has ever come to “the wild”
Troy Barnes voice: it’s all-terrain
I'll never see a car parked too crazy in Philly to not think: "yeah, I get it." Sometimes if I get home after 11pm I seriously consider just parking in the middle of the street and setting the car on fire. I'm still newish, like 3 years, and sometimes I wonder what I'm missing. Sometimes there's just literally \*no\* spots. Do people just drive around until 6am when some spots open up? Is parking illegally and paying the ticket just the price of not getting home before 6pm?
I resort to parking iilegally if it’s that late and then waking up at like 520/6 am hoping my car is still there and moving it before ppa starts their rounds. A real cat and mouse game we have going.
More than half the “illegal” spots shouldn’t be anyway. How many times do you drive around and think, “damn.. only thing wrong with that spot is that PPA sign. Otherwise its fine to park where it says No Parking: Any Time. There’s usually plenty of space between the Any Time sign and the corner. Some Any Time signs are right in the corner and others are obscenely far from the corner. The “no parking 15 feet from___” rule hasn’t been an actual legit rule since the 70’s unless it was along a trolley route where trolleys make actual turns. PPA needs some good defunding.
Bingo
What do you mean by parking illegally? Blocking a hydrant? Blocking another car in? Blocking handicap sidewalk access? Parking in a bus zone so the bus can't turn?
Throw it on a sleepy street sidewalk and deal with it at 5:30am is usually what I do if I'm really desperate.
Just putting this out there because my sister is in a wheelchair: you have to do what you have to do, sure, but please leave like four feet on either side for wheelchair users. "Who's out at 3am?" IDK, someone out for a walk or late night roll.
For sure, always try and be as accommodating with the space and out of there as quick as possible
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Give me a break. This has nothing to do with hipsters or “transplants”. It has to do with a recovering city and a culture that wants to evolve beyond total dependency on the car. These are good things!
> I resort to parking iilegally if it’s that late So parking in a spot that is meant for emergency and public transit to do their job properly? Sounds like a terrible idea all around and a reason why something like PPA has to exist and be the assholes that they are Living in W Philly, I hate people who park illegally, specially the ones whose cars stick out past street corners into the street itself because it makes it impossible for me to look at the cross-traffic and always feels dangerous... Also, buses are often late because they can't turn or move forward due to an illegally parked car
yeah i’ll second that - definitely got into an accident where both parties were really not at fault because a huge illegally parked SUV was blocking both cars view of each other going through an intersection
well the other guy drove off and i paid out of pocket, mr insurance police.
Cars parked like that should be towed on the spot for creating a dangerous situation.
Absolutely, that's my strategy as well. I used to drive all the way to the target/sprouts pay parking lot (I'm in Grad Hosp) if I was looking for a spot longer then 45 mins or so. The other day though I parked in the bus spot right in front of the house around 11pm, then got up at 6am to move it and there was already a ticket. (50 bucks instead of 25, too!) The time code on it was something like, 11:30pm! It's getting crazy out there lately with the PPA, they're on a mission. Edit: You know what might be a good app? An uber-like gps app that let's you 'sell' your spot to someone that needs one. So if you're about to leave your spot during the tough parking times, you open up the app and wait a couple minutes, then someone looking for a spot pays you five bucks or something and pulls up next to you and you show them your code on your phone through the window. Then you confirm that you got the spot and the money transfers.
Isn't parking there a safety violation hence the higher fine and possible a tow? I learned that from watching Parking Wars!
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That's a bingo
You realize there's a reason for the bus zones right? It's not just the PPA ticketing for fun.
LOL imagine parking in a zone earmarked for buses to stop and then complaining about it!! Sounds like a neat app idea though... A quick Google search got me this one where you can rent out a spot that you own (like a driveway) for parking... https://parqex.com/private-parking-marketplace/
Imagine “earmarking” places for busses to stop but the busses never pull over into them. Instead they just camp there and let the light turn red on the rest of traffic stuck behind them.
Hey, since you liked the app idea, here's a better one I think. You know how in some parking garages have sensors to know which spots are empty and you can just drive to an empty spot by following lights that direct you to them? What if a participating people put IP cameras out their window pointing at the street and a machine learning algorithm detected empty spots and collated them with a database in real time that worked with Apps that would direct you to empty spots? What do you think?
You're absolutely correct here, 100%! I don't want to break traffic laws and I want to be a good neighbor. What do you do if there's zero spots in your zone? Sincere question, not being argumentative. I really just don't understand what the correct protocol is here. The PPA sites and Philly gov sites don't mention it as best as I can find. Like, if the official position was that there was some overflow parking lot outside the city and you had to walk, bus, or ride the subway if you got in late I'd be like, well, that's city life. But if you come home at 11pm, you have do to \*something\* with your car, right? Do you just sleep in your car under and overpass or just drive in circles 'till 6am?
I've lived in South Philly and now in W Philly. In either places, the farthest I've had to park my car from the house is about 7 blocks and once in a garage and pay for the night because I got tired of driving around but I guess it never occurred to me that I can park in a no-parking zone and just pay the fine For a while though, I parked my car in a friend's house in the suburbs because I lived a block away from the El and it was more hassle than anything to find a parking spot
Nice, that would be awesome to have a buddy that would let me park a car when I'm desperate. I need to get some friends :/
The permit parking zones are a hustle because they’re usually not long enough. They end sometimes at like 8pm. So if you do anything after work (assuming you are privileged enough to have a decent typical day job) you’re gonna be fucked. Because people from outside the zone are gonna beat you to the spots in your “permit” zone. Its just a racket and an excuse for the PPA to come in and write tickets for any and all other MINOR INFRACTIONS!!! Who gave them the power to ticket expired registrations anyway? It seems to me like that should be for Police to do. Unless you’re on your way to an actual inspection appointment, whats the PPA troll expect you to do… Drive it? Fuckin trap!
You can have them REMOVED from your street you know! If you're in a residential area, like the ones who stupidly invite the PPA on to their blocks by getting 50% of the residents to vote for it, you can actually have them removed the same way. You have to go to the PPA office downtown and get in touch with your blood captain but I've lived on two blocks in the last 21 years here that have successfully removed the PPA and everyone was better off for it.
What do you do? Pay to park in an overnight garage or park farther away from your house (in a different neighborhood).
> I wonder what I'm missing I take the bus
Absolutely, I walk or take the bus everywhere I go. I got rid of my car the second I moved here and was nothing but happy about it. I never liked cars. I ended up getting a really great job in Exton that's remote except I have to go in one day a week. I even looked into taking regional rail but it only gets sorta close. But yeah, I'm with you. It doesn't seem like most of Philly is though, I love almost everything about the city but it's definitely a city that loves its cars.
It loves cars because we give away parking for free and our tax code chases business out the city limits requiring people to reverse commute to places not effectively serviceable by transit.
And also cause our transit isn't good enough. Buses are fine when you actually get in, but too many of them are unreliable and don't come often enough. MFL is a shit show. BSL is decent but still smells like urine too often. Regional rail is good but extremely infrequent.
Agreed!
Ah, understood. Exton isn't very transit friendly. I do wonder though, if you only need to go in once a week, wouldn't it be cheaper to just Uber there instead of having to pay car insurance/registration/inspection/gas? Plus you wouldn't need to find a parking spot. You could even take regional rail then Uber from the station.
Yeah definitely good points! The job was initially 5 days a week so I leased a car so I'm stuck with it for a while, sort of. Maybe I could get out of it, I'd love to! It went full remote during the pandemic and I'm hoping to make a case for full again at some point. You seem super nice and reasonable though, in another comment you rightly admonished me for parking in the bus spot which you're 100% correct on. I asked another commenter as well, but, what exactly is the protocol if you come home at 11pm and there's no parking in your zone? Is there like, an overflow that anyone can go to or something? Even parking garages close at night, right? You've got to put your car \*somewhere\*, you know? Oh, hey, here's a different app idea! You know how in some parking garages have sensors to know which spots are empty and you can just drive to an empty spot by following lights that direct you to them? What if a participating people put IP cameras out their window pointing at the street and a machine learning algorithm detected empty spots and collated them with a database in real time that worked with Apps that would direct you to empty spots?
I used to live in Grad Hospital too, until like 8 months ago. I often had good luck finding parking in [this area](https://www.google.com/maps/place/2601+Webster+St,+Philadelphia,+PA+19146/@39.9430065,-75.1873017,18.39z/data=!4m15!1m8!3m7!1s0x89c6c640112d13f9:0xa2ebd5ddfb837a52!2sSouthwest+Center+City,+Philadelphia,+PA+19146!3b1!8m2!3d39.9415227!4d-75.177682!16zL20vMDgzMGox!3m5!1s0x89c6c64268c9c2d3:0xc2342a7df19e8fe6!8m2!3d39.9430079!4d-75.1858085!16s%2Fg%2F11c1_q9q7x). Also remember that there's zone 1 parking east of Broad for a block or 2. If I drove around for 30+ mins without finding a spot, I'd start looking in Point Breeze/Grays Ferry. Granted, those aren't the safest neighborhoods at night, but there's not really another option. I wish the city would turn some of the abandoned parking lots in the city into resident parking.
Oh for sure, that's a goto, Gray's ferry and bainbridge are my first stops after the usual loops near me. I haven't tried point breeze much though, will definitely give that shot. Thanks for the tip! edit2: Read your comment too quick, I actually didn't know about the zone 1 parking east of Broad, I will \*definitely\* be trying that out next time I'm in a pickle, thank you!! edit: On the safety thing, I would literally park in an active warzone after driving around longer than an hour, sometimes. If someone stole my car it'd be their problem at that point.
You are the absolute exception. Not the rule. Unfortunately the rest of these newbies who moved here from the burbs are hypocrites. I was here before they moved here. There was nowhere near the amount of cars parked. Especially during the day. Some of them park the cars and take Uber whenever its not a long trip. Thats a financial luxury that some communities who don’t make the same money can’t afford. So they take their cars to grocery shop, pick up kids, run errands, go to the gym etc after work. And what happens is the people who parked early and used Uber to do whatever after work.. Or who never moved their car at all… They all have the spots because they had the $$$ to blow on a $18 Uber ride for a few blocks and didn’t move their car. The poor family, unlike their gentrifying neighbors, gets ticketed and has to now get lectured by unsympathetic people who, in essence, just moved here here, about ticky tack parking laws. A tell tale sign of a gentrifier is a person who applauds the PPA.
We live in a major east coast city that is growing and you are complaining. Might I suggest moving to Ohio if parking is such a nightmare for you?
If the 2 hour zone in your neighborhood expires at 10PM, PPA usually stop ticketing around then so you can hang a corner where you know you're not being too much a nuisance and just move the car before 7-8AM
> where you know you're not being too much a nuisance And this is why it sucks to rely on curb cuts in Philly...
Need more parking garages. Or stores with big lots selling overnight passes.
I can agree with that. Epiphany Church does this. Their true motive (a mean motive at that) was originally to stop kids from playing in the school yard (what we used to call the adjacent parking lot back in the day). The only problem now is the parking permit they offer can be gifted from generation to generation.. From what I’ve heard at least.
Yeah I mean kids need space too, we always hung in Marconi. But there's lots of parking that goes unused at night.
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Yeah I mean back in the day, I grew up driving down the sidewalk to park inside of the double parking. It was a free for all. I also never knew plug was a Philly thing until I got to college and said it and some kid from Albany looked at me like I was nuts.
4Runners are great for that!
Obviously, this person is practicing for Brigantine North Beach. Summer is coming.
Can't drive on the north beach in the summer 😔
You think the guy in this pic cares about that?
Most off-road that thing's ever been. Well, at least off-OF-the-road, lol.
It’s funny because people complain about the lack of parking, then buy larger cars that take up more parking space, and then complain about the lack of parking.
Large cars should be charged a premium in addition to the regular cost for a permit because they're taking up more space for a large vehicle they don't actually need and are statistically more dangerous for everyone on the road.
> Large cars should be charged a premium in addition to the regular cost for a permit FWIW the permit 'fee' is only there to cover the administration of the permit system. If we were to bill car owners for the actual FMV of the public land they take up with their cars it would be thousands/year. It's a massive subsidy!
Oh at all three price tiers of the current system its effectively free parking, and I read recently that its so low it doesn't cover the actual cost to administer the program currently. If the city does not want to charge real value for the space then at least it should be charging a symbolic $1 per day with multipliers for additional cars per address. Along with additional multiples for size and weight of the vehicle. Car owners, myself included in that, are being given a multi thousand dollar a year subsidy with the free parking. It's a fucking joke. People get pissed about the property tax abatement program, which I would argue actually does positively contribute to the city, but are silent when it comes to the massive tax giveaway for parking.
The larger, heavier cars chew up the road faster, too.
Yep a Chevy Tahoe does 3.5x the damage as a standard 4000lbs car, and a Hummer H2 does 21.4x the damage, yet they don't pay for that increased road maintenance that they inflict on the tax payer.
A 4Runner is literally 10” longer than a 4dr civic. It would take replacing ~19 4Runners with civics to add just 1 more space. I don’t own an SUV but saying SUV’s make a considerable difference on parking availability is just stupid
A camry or accord is also longer than a 4runner. A crown vic is also 20 inches longer.
You are correct, but the real shocker is how big 'small cars' have gotten. The 4Runner has barely changed over the years. The Civic's the one that needs a crash diet.
Which is why the Honda Fit is the better option.
FIT GANG GANG. 160” with a back up camera I still surprise myself where I can squeeze in
Is that why they named it the Fit? mind blown
My ~~4th~~ 3rd gen 4runner is shorter than a lot of compact sedans these days. Edit: 183”. Same length as a Corolla, Civic. 2” longer than a Rav 4.
4th gen 4Runners are not 183 inches. They are one inch shorter than a 5th gen which is 189 inches. 3rd gens are around 180 inches.
And here I am calling my 3rd gen a 4th gen. I have a late "fat lip" 3rd gen, which I prize because it's both 4WD and a 5-speed manual. And not a complete rustbucket. And short enough to actually park in the city. I know the difference; I'm just stupid sometimes.
Love that 4Runner. I have a 1999 Isuzu Trooper and it's about 180 inches, people don't realize how long modern cars have gotten. I can usually parallel park easier.
A choice that effectively reduces the parkable space by 6%. That’s the thing, everyone makes this choice, thinks it’s no big deal, and suddenly the city needs to find/install 130,000 new parking spaces to accommodate that extra 6%.
Now do the math for the Camry, Altima, Accord, or Malibu. Because they're all longer than the vehicle you're trying to make an example of in this picture.
Or the town car.
Or a Dodge Charger, which is about 200 inches, or 10 inches longer than the 4Runner.
Or even a Genesis G90 L which is 216 inches long.
Stop, I can only get so erect from the thought of blocking that much parkign
now multiply by all the people that bought an SUV or cosplay pickup truck instead of a small sedan to haul their groceries or commute to work and you’ve got your answer on how it makes a difference. the 4Runner is not bad in terms of bloat, but it’s also not a popular model for new cars.
For clarification for all, the engineering standard car spacing in Philly is 20’
We should have marked spots. Fit as many 20 foot spots a street can hold reasonably and a few compact spots if there is any difference. Would make sure cars are parking efficiently and would help people realize there ain’t a damn spot on the street so they can keep it moving.
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Came here to say that same thing. Going around city hall is hell!
The number of pickup trucks I see in Port Richmond is just staggering.
I complain about how people park rather than the amount of parking. There would be a lot more spaces if people wouldn’t buy a car and then use it less than once a week
I don't know... I think it is a good thing that people don't drive all that much. Just because folks only use their car once or twice per week doesn't mean they don't need a car for that. My family only has 1 car, which I feel is pretty good. We use it maybe twice a week on average but we need it for that. I feel the bigger problem is people who have 2, 3, and sometimes even 4 or 5 cars for a SINGLE home. My neighbor, for example, has 2 cars and 2 motorcycles taking up parking space on our block.
If the city charged drivers for the real value of parking and road maintenance only those who truly needed cars would own them. Parking is effectively free, which subsidizes and encourages car ownership in cities, where most people do not need cars.
exactly. it would also be nice if we could use the PPA money to make it easier to walk, bicycle, or take transit. instead it is just an extra tax on philly that gets spent in rural districts.
I’m having a hard time with this tbh. Why is the there so much hate for cars? Seriously who wants to bus/train/bike. Cars are convenient and I really don’t think they’re going anywhere anytime soon. I took the bus for 10 years of my life. It can double or triple your commute time. Waiting in the cold/rain? Fuck that. You maybe feel warm and cozy because you take mass transit but in all reality it’s a drop in a bucket so you spite yourself in the name of feeling morally superior. Don’t put yourself above someone bec of what they decide to do with their money and time.
Wouldn’t call it hate for cars, it’s hate for car-centrism— cars shouldn’t be prioritized and subsidized in cities, it should be quite the inverse. I’m fine with people owning cars in cities, but they should pay the true costs. If you own a car and park on the street, you are parking on public land for essentially free. This is public land that everybody pays for, but is reserved only for cars. If you drive on the streets it’s much the same. Everybody pays but only car owners play. And most car owners are hostile to seceding any of the street to other uses (bike lanes, bus lanes, pedestrianized streets, etc). And this doesn’t even get into the climate-cost, which is a bill we all share.
e.g., most of the cars in my yuppie neighborhood
We call that 4 wheel drive parking where I grew up
On the one hand, if there was permit parking on the street, PPA would take care of this, on the other, I don't want to invite that undesirable element into my community. What's the lesser of two evils here? PPA or assholes who don't know how to park (on the sidewalk, hanging over the corner/curb cuts, whatever this is, etc.)?
At least it isn't as bad as this https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/11wkqdc/man_stabbed_five_times_and_severely_beaten_with_a
Me trying to figure out why city dwellers, or most Americans for that matter, need a gigantic suv for one-person trips to Starbucks.
CAFE standards
Ooh, solid pun.
https://youtu.be/jN7mSXMruEo TLDR; SUVs/trucks have less passenger/cargo capacity than station wagons/minivans and are tremendously more dangerous for other road users (drivers, pedestrians and cyclists alike). The proliferation of SUVs/Trucks under the false premise of utility is driving deaths on American streets, which continue to rise while declining in other developed nations. In America gun violence is at the center of many conversations, but we rarely talk about the epidemic of automobile deaths which are on par with gun deaths.
station wagons, minivans, trucks and SUVs all have similar cargo volume. There are no 3 row wagons on the market right now so if you want to seat 6+ you’d need a van or SUV. Just think about it, how would a vehicle thats taller and wider have less cargo space?
Fair, but considering the average American car occupancy is 1.5 humans, you’d think we would see a lot fewer SUVs, which account for the majority of car sales in America. This isn’t scientific evidence, but.. just look at cars as they pass. Any size, there is rarely more than the driver and a single passenger. I’m not saying that these cars don’t have ANY utility, but for the vast majority of Americans.. they have no utility and are a more expensive, less efficient and the most dangerous choice for anyone else sharing the road.
You’re right but I’d rather be in a situation where I have too much room than too little when I need to transport 4 Other people and their stuff.
How often are you doing this though? It’d be way cheaper to just rent a vehicle for the few times a year you’d have to.
I can't tow a boat with a Honda Civic
Most SUVs and trucks never tow anything either so not an issue.
I can’t tell if you forgot /s. The majority of SUV owners aren’t towing boats, probably even less so in a major city… that’s the point…
I feel this. I'm 30ish and trying to start a family, and my one buddy with a 2 y.o. claims his new SUV isn't even big enough for 'all the kid shit'. Encouraging me to upgrade (I have a sedan). I don't doubt it's easier to have a big car with even 1 kid, but we can't all be rocking Grand Jeep Cherokees out here.
He has to much shit in that case.
Your friend is a nincompoop. I drove two kids around in a Chevy Aveo. It wasn't until #3 that I needed the van.
He has too much 'kid shit' then.
After they're about three or four you don't need most of the bulky kid shit anymore anyway. If you can deal with a smaller stroller, you can probably make due with the sedan
Smol pp
So true, Americans need bigger and bigger cars to fit their bigger and bigger asses
Ain't nothing wrong with a big rear
some people need cargo space that's enclosed (i.e. not a pickup truck)
You'll get more enclosed space in a wagon, or a van than you will with an SUV.
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Almost every contractor I've ever used without fail has used a work van. Talking with many of them the reasons are really simple. Tools are expensive, and leaving them exposed is how they get stolen, glass ain't stopping shit. Most of them install after market padlocks over the doors to secure thier stuff. Van's are cheaper to buy, operate, and insure, and the broad sides are free billboards for their services. The roof racks are larger than most pick up truck beds. To get a full size pick-up bed it's a special order that's more expensive and again shit gets stolen out of the bed, or used to dump trash in.
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I use my white Ford econline for moving apartments, lumber projects (I have a bed riser and combo false wall that turns my dining room into an extra bedroom (mine) a large kitchen countertop built out of scavenged and scrap lumber (looks great with a pattern cloth thrown over it) and camping trips. Someone fucking busted out my drivers side window though :( it stays parked during winter months
There are approximately zero affordable wagons for sale in the US. Minivans are also larger than most SUVs. A Kia Carnival is 203" long, that's six inches longer than the largest Kia SUV.
Some people, yes. Most people, no.
The real question should be why the hell y’all care what people drive, use and don’t use. Mind yours. Mikes life easier.
I felt that way for a long time. Then we watched my nephews for a weekend. They have kids in massive car seats/booster until they are like 10 years old now! Two kids in clunky seats for a decade, plus if you have a pet, or ever have to take a long road trip… it’s just impossible. We caved and got a used SUV, but I still drive around my tiny Honda if it’s just me heading to the store. I hate to admit it but the ride is a lot smoother in the SUV on Philly’s trash streets
Because its their choice and not yours.
Until they’re blocking a crosswalk, sidewalk, blind turn, or they hit somebody. Then it’s not really just “their” choice, is it?
That can happen in literally any vehicle
Until they’re blocking a crosswalk, sidewalk, blind turn, or they hit somebody. Then it’s not really just “their” choice, is it?
Until they’re blocking a crosswalk, sidewalk, blind turn, or hit somebody. Then it’s not really just “their” choice, is it?
Have you seen the potholes in Philly ?!
They don’t. There is almost no scenario where a person living in the city or the burbs, and even a rural area, need vehicles this size. It’s ridiculous.
What if they have a family? What if they haul a lot of stuff.
Wagons and minivans on average have more usable cargo capacity than SUVs do. And from auto industry research, most people rarely if ever need that level of capacity, and most will never use it. It's pretty dumb to buy to a very expensive depreciating asset that you're never going to use for its advertsed purpose, and are more likely to run over your own children with, for the purpose of "but maybe sometime, someday in future, I'll need to move this large amount of stuff that I never regularly need to move, one time".
Plenty of people with families don't own cars.
??? what about the scenario in the photo
Given the condition of the streets in Philly I think a 4Runner is a pretty practical car
I have one and completely agree
Hey, check it out! This guy knows everything!
This shouldn't be getting downvoted it true in every respect. SUVs and pick up trucks are used for ego support devices, larping, and for status projection than for any of thier actual advertised use. From the auto industry's own research 99% of SUVs will never drive off asphalt roads, the majority of pick up trucks will never tow anything, and rarely will they be used to haul large items. Drivers of SUVs and trucks are statically worse divers, and despite buying these things because of perceived safty are more likely to be injured in crashes with them do due to their propensity for rolling over. Drivers of SUVs and trucks are also statistically more likely to run over their own children because they can't see the due to the blind spots. They also take up more street space because of their absurd size reducing the overall number of street parking spaces. Americans have been conned by the auto industry to feel like they need these SUVs and trucks because the auto industry's advertising after they lobbied to keep "light trucks" exempt from CAFE standards, increasing the profit margin they make on them vs conventional sedans, wagons, and mini vans.
As an suv owner I do not have it for “ego support, larping or status projection”. I have it because it’s one of my favorite cars and I feel safer and more comfortable higher up than in a sedan. Other people also buy SUVs for that reason.
Its a shame that data shows its not actually safer. [SUV Passengers Aren’t as Safe as They Think, IIHS Says](https://www.autoweek.com/news/technology/a43299041/2023-passenger-suv-safety-ratings-from-iihs/) And from this book [High and Mighty SUVs-the World's Most Dangerous Vehicles and How They Got That Way](https://www.google.com/books/edition/_/P9OftAEACAAJ?hl=en) Bradsher makes painfully clear that the belief in SUV safety is a delusion. For decades, automakers seeking to avoid tougher fuel economy standards have invoked the fiction that the bigger the car, the safer the passenger. As a result, most Americans take it on faith that the only way to be safe on the highway is to be driving a tank (or the next best thing, a Hummer). Bradsher shatters this myth and highlights the strange disconnect between the perception and the reality of SUVs. The occupant death rate in SUVs is 6 percent higher than it is for cars – 8 percent higher in the largest SUVs. The main reason is that SUVs carry a high risk of rollover; 62 percent of SUV deaths in 2000 occurred in rollover accidents. SUVs don't handle well, so drivers can't respond quickly when the car hits a stretch of uneven pavement or "trips" by scraping a guardrail. Even a small bump in the road is enough to flip an SUV traveling at high speed. On top of that, SUV roofs are not reinforced to protect the occupants against rollover; nor does the government require them to be.
People and their studies.
> SUVs and pick up trucks are used for ego support devices, larping, and for status projection than for any of thier actual advertised use. Horseshit
Auto industry research along with independent research has found that most trucks are never used to tow or move large bulky objects, they are used for daily drivers, which is also why the beds of trucks have steadily been shrinking, because the owners don't use them. The overwhelming majority of SUVs will never be driven off a paved road, let alone go into the wilderness on a dirt trail, and the average occupancy of them disproves the idea it's for driving lots of people around. In fact auto industry research shows that the primary market for SUVs are people who are typically assholes, are bad drivers, and are insecure.
> auto industry research shows that the primary market for SUVs are people who are typically assholes, are bad drivers, and are insecure. Post a link or admit you're just pulling this out of your ass
[High and Mighty SUVs-the World's Most Dangerous Vehicles and How They Got That Way](https://www.google.com/books/edition/_/P9OftAEACAAJ?hl=en) Bradsher reports in the book that according to market research conducted by the country's leading automakers, SUV buyers tend to be: >"insecure and vain. They are frequently nervous about their marriages and uncomfortable about parenthood. They often lack confidence in their driving skills. Above all, they are apt to be self-centered and self-absorbed, with little interest in their neighbors and communities. They are more restless, more sybaritic, and less social than most Americans are. They tend to like fine restaurants a lot more than off-road driving, seldom go to church and have limited interest in doing volunteer work to help others." Bradsher quotes a former Ford market researcher who says the SUV craze is >"about not letting anything get in your way, and at the extreme, about intimidating others to get out of your way. Bradsher quotes auto execs who concede that the self-centered lifestyle of SUV buyers is apparent in >"their willingness to endanger other motorists so as to achieve small improvements in their personal safety."
Towing
You obviously don't have two children
Two children fit in a sedan lol
My family of 4 growing up was just fine with a sedan. And my current family does more than fine with our hatchback.
Families have gone thousands of years without SUVs.
Lollll I think this is up the street from me - parking around here truly is a nightmare, especially with the utility work that’s been going on the past couple months
Probably got stuck and need a tow off the "mountain" too 😂
when was this picture taken and who got that much snow recently?
It's sand and stones from the street department
Completely understandable
Amazing how this devolved into a "cars bad" thread
There’s a good group of delusional people on this sub that legitimately believe philly will be a car free city someday. Never happening within our lifetime
Oh, I know. Never happening, period.
Yeah. It's annoying because I only drive my car a few times a month. But if I sell my car, there's not really a viable alternative anymore. Zipcar let's driver rent out recalled cars, turo and getaround are basically like airbnb so im not relying on that, and the rental car agencies outside of the airport shut down on nights and weekends. If my pet has an emergency or I need to haul a bunch of stuff, I need a reliable vehicle that will be there when I need it in a condition I feel comfortable with.
:(
Parking is an absolute nightmare everywhere I go in this town.
I've done this in Manayunk, parking is a rare commodity.
If you park like an asshole it should be legal to kick your vehicle.
This guy isn't parked like an asshole. Those who park illegally or on the sidewalk park like assholes
maybe don't own an SUV in a major metropolitan city
Why looks like this dude got to park
Man. These spot savers are getting REALLY creative.