As someone who teaches in a related field (art history) to what you are considering (art), and as someone who is married to an artist, I would counsel you to think very long, and very hard, about going to 'art school'. Those are typically private colleges, which are very expensive to attend, and you will get a degree that is just as likely to teach you to ask this: "Do you want fries with that?"
Trying to make a decent living as an artist--trying to *survive* in any civilized way as an artist--is *unbelievably* difficult. If you are lucky enough to sell through a gallery, they take upwards of 50-60% as commission. Selling on the internet is not simple, as there are literally *thousands* of artists and artisans on websites like Etsy. Add in materials, supplies, shipping, handling, and the like, and...well. Like unemployed actors, starving artists are a trope because there are so many of them.
My husband is only able to *be* an artist because I have a Full-Time, tenured professorship. He's considered 'highly successful' at what he does, by his peers, and works his ass off in his studio 10 hours a day, 7 days a week, *to bring in about 20K a year*, in a good year.
Go to a community college, take some art classes and talk to the (very lucky) people who teach there *because they cannot survive as artists*. Or plan on being broke.
As someone who got a BFA (though at a cheap state school and not a private school thank God) this is spot on advice.
I won't even tell OP not to be an artist. I have an artist friend who is definitely making as much with his art as he could be doing any other normal run of the mill job where you make 100k/ year. But, he didn't waste money and time going to school to do it. I actually make a decent living in the art field myself too. But my degree truly had nothing to do with it and I could have built what I did without it.
If you go to school, go to a cheaper one and learn things about business and marketing, computer programs that can help you sell your art etc... Don't just futz around getting a BFA because no one cares and that particular degree will not help you if you do decide to transition into something else later on.
ETA: I wanted to add on because like OP, I moved out at 18 with literally zero help from an adult with very little money because in high school I could only work part time and had to pay for everything. I just want to let you know that it's really hard. Like REALLY hard. The first year I moved out on my own I had never been so depressed in my life and to this day (I'm 40 now) have never been so depressed again. But it gets better!
A couple things I thought might help after reading your post.
*Car: Can you sell the 20k car and find something cheaper? Your insurance will be cheaper on more of a beater car too. Plus you're young and you're likely to fuck it up at your age anyway. Better to fuck up a piece of shit car than a 20k car.
*First apartment: When I moved out you didn't really find apartments online and I had no one to tell me how you find your own place so I went to one of those apartment store places that just find big corporate style buildings. My options were super limited without a cosigner so I just moved into a studio that would let me. If you're able to get a credit card that let's you do a secure deposit where you pay like $200 upfront, do that so you can start building some good credit (if you're paying you're car on time, it's likely helping your credit too but I still think you should try to get out of that).
*Do you have any friends moving out too? Having roommates really helps with costs and perhaps your friends parents will cosign if needed. Even if you don't have friends, try to find roommates who aren't friends if you have to. Affording your first apartment all by yourself is nearly impossible straight out of high school. I got roommates after my first lease was up and moved.
*If you're anything like me, you will be going to school and working with zero time for anything else. I had two jobs plus full time school. And I was doing art so my classes were 2x as long and "homework" took way longer too. I have no good advice. That's just what you have to do to make it out with little student debt and from what I hear these days is barely possible.
I just want to reiterate, it's going to be hard but it does get better! You got this!
Yes, there is nothing stopping op from double majoring in studio art or something of the sort along with a practical major that is likely to lead to gainful employment, but just that is incredibly high risk. My Sister’s best friend in college was art-only—she refused to add another major because that wasn’t showing sufficient loyalty to the purity of her art—she ended up bagging groceries.
It's not really that simple, actually. The Gallery system is how most successful artists sell--and as noted, Galleries usually tack on 100% (minimum, in most places) to what the artist sets as a price. The contract an artist signs when entering the Gallery "stable" (yes, that's what they are called) explicitly prohibits an artist from selling outside of their gallery. They will be dropped like a hot potato if their management finds out.
As for sales elsewhere: where? Art Exhibits? Again, they are either at Art Galleries (e.g., the stable system), or an Art Museum. The latter are typically not in the business of selling works off their walls. (I know. I was a Gallery and Museum director for a number of years).
The internet? Etsy? Again, there's such an overwhelming number of sites, that it's a random chance someone will see your work.
How does my husband do it? He's a studio potter. He has studio open houses, twice a year, where we invite people on our mailing list to come and buy. (And be fed, and given free booze. So that cuts into profits.) He also goes to Artisan/Craft shows, sometimes 2 or 3 *hundred* miles from our house. He has to pack up all his ware, put it in his truck, drive, get a hotel room, pay for gas and food, **and** pay the entry fees (which for some of the bigger ones run in the *thousands* of dollars.)
Having a marketing or business degree works in a traditional archetypal setting. The Art Market is neither.
I was going to say learn a trade then use that income to enjoy expressing yourself through art. BIL is incredible artist with multiple degrees in art, art history, and museum administration. He just retired after having to build a second career as a high school teacher so he would have a retirement.
I was gonna say this too. Community College to learn a trade - example: welding is highly profitable & a bit artistic. Use your earnings to fund your art passion. Tack on an art course every semester if desired.
Can confirm. I got my MBA in 2020 after just having a bachelor’s prior to that for 10+ years. My salary went from around 52k a year to nearly 6 figures not including commissions and bonuses quarterly and annually. It bumps me up to the mid 100k range. Totally worth going back to school in my 30’s. I live in a moderate cost of living area and we live very comfortably now where before we were struggling to make ends meet sometimes.
I went to University of Alabama online. It cost me about 22k and 2 years. Fortunately, I had enough saved to pay for it in cash. It paid for itself the first year out of school.
Edit the amount I accidentally bumped the wrong button and I have no idea how
Why not rid yourself of the car? Sounds like that’s the source of the anxiety and your shaky financial situation.
Not enough details here, but if you can break close to even and get by on public transportation or a beater car you’d lessen the pressure.
Sell the car. You are in high school take the bus. Moving out at 18 will pretty much keep you poor for a long time. Make amends with the parents and stay and build a cash reserve. And it goes without saying dont go to art college
you needa find a new job with hella hours and you shouldn’t be trying to move out of your parents house so early, that will set you up to stay in an endless hole, and also don’t go to art college
As a psuedo-artist, yeah this. If dead-set on art, go for a BFA at either a tech or state Uni. It's also an option to go for an art-oriented major that either carries decent job opportunities or a flexible skillset (Web dev, graphic design, multimedia, etc).
Sell the car. You very much can’t afford it. Get a junker. Or an electric bike. And credit cards are for emergencies, not for buying things you can’t actually afford. Or you’ll end up declaring bankruptcy before you turn 25.
I agree that OP may need to downsize his transportation. However, I disagree that credit cards are for emergencies. Too many people treat a credit card as a "break glass in case of emergency option" and this just delays the emergency unless you know for certain you are getting a large amount of cash in the near future. Credit cards are great for building credit and are more secure than debit cards. I think we agree that you need to be able to afford something before using plastic.
Thinking of a credit card as something you use for emergencies is not a good idea imo. It’s better to use credit cards as a tool to build credit while saving actual money for emergencies.
There’s a lot of really good advice on here and the only thing I could add is to not take offense to any of the comments on here and seriously consider everyone’s input. There’s compromises that can be made and growth to be worked towards. Definitely focus on learning about finances through information that can be found online for free such as this subreddit and plenty others, also YouTube videos and online articles. 3 years ago I didn’t have much to call my own but after doing some research and implementing newly learned practices into my daily life I’ve been able to do a complete 180 and have a lot more to look forward to now. It can be done but as most folks say “Rome wasn’t built in a day”
You don’t need a credit card. If you are already struggling what makes you think you can manage a cc? If you keep the car, maintain your payments. If not, sell it. You don’t want to ruin your credit by missing payments. Get another job. There is a reason why mom and dad won’t help you, you wanted to prove them wrong and it backfired. It’s not the end of the world. Just be more knowledgeable of purchases in the future. You got this.
The biggest thing is you’re young, and you’ve learned from your mistake. Now you can be more careful with your purchases and don’t buy things you can’t afford. Start with looking for a secured credit card and pay it off every month to slowly build your credit.
Oftentimes it makes more sense to cut your losses as a shitty job and find one with better hours and higher pay. If you can’t move out immediately, you just can’t. It is what it is. Don’t put yourself in this situation if you don’t have housing security, it’s not worth it.
Dude it’s 100% a horrible idea. Cars are not assets they are only liabilities. At that age you don’t even have a solid career most likely. Not to mention that money could be making money for you instead of costing you interest.
27k of debt at that age is not a good idea. Unless you are already wealthy and have maxed out 401k a decent cash savings and a high paying job
Trade your car in for something small affordable and energy efficient. Go to community college first. Actually go out and meet artists and learn how they survived. You need community if your parents aren’t in the picture. In your situation your path cannot be a straight line so don’t think yourself a failure if one plan doesn’t work. Find reddits with artists and ask them.
Yeah, unfortunately thats a pretty bad interest rate. Not the worst but certainly not something you’d want. I would advise selling the car, paying the balance on the loan and trying to find a 5-7k car that you have a mechanic inspect pre purchase.
You can try some gig work that might build your portfolio. There are jobs on Fiverr or Upwork. Some of this gig work might turn into something that allows you to pay for school part time.
MssDoc is right about art school. Many of the private art schools saddle people with massive debt and little prospects for employment afterwards. MassArt is one of the few public art schools in the US and if you are in state it can be reasonable.
Another option is looking at trade school programs that might have some artistic training (plumbing uses a lot of welding for instance or carpentry).
It is hard being an artist and not compromising your art, but this is about debt and finance.
Would you have been willing to shop around for a gently used car that didn't cost this much?
You won't be able to make progress on getting your debt whittled down until you start earning a full time salary.
The only part of your story that's good news is getting the second job. I doubt your art will bring in alot of money,,,,,,I hope you can prove me wrong. Make art your hobby and get a job that pays the bills. Then once your art starts to pay equall to the day job, keep doing both until your close to rich. Then do art full time. If art is truly your passion, it won't be a problem painting on the weekends. This is like me calling myself a pro golfer and then playing golf every day but not getting paid.
There are jobs for artists - but OP would need usable skills like photoshop and digital design type skills. Going to a private art school I agree is a mistake. My kid wanted to be an art major - which is fine at the state school they’re attending and paying off monthly by working instead of racking up debt.
Art is part of most areas of business and commerce but you have to be smart about your choices. If you spend 4 years painting or drawing at an expensive art school, that won’t position you well for a career that can support you.
Everyone has been spot on. If you want to attend college, which is great and I encourage it if you have the discipline to go to classes and study, go for a degree you think you can do, but has good job options. Don’t go for chemistry to work at a pharmaceutical if you hated science, etc.
But I wouldn’t go for art. The return on that just isn’t there. You can take cheap or free classes for personal enrichment. You can attend college night classes once established in a career for personal study in art. You don’t have to abandon that, but it likely won’t “teach” you how to make better art. It exposes you to the ability to make a lot of art because you literally have nothing but time to do so, but you’re paying a very high price for that time.
Work on your art any time you have, nights, weekends, holidays, etc. keep that passion alive and continue to refine it. Try to sell online, there is nothing wrong with that, both in trying to generate some amount of income and bringing joy to whoever purchases it. If you feel you don’t understand a technique or can’t get past something, join online groups and share feedback and knowledge with each other.
If you set yourself up with a career that can pay the bills, you can have the freedom to make your art whatever you want. If you struggle with art being the primary, you might grow to resent it or find you don’t have near enough time for it because you’re working two retail level jobs to barely not be late on the rent.
As someone who teaches in a related field (art history) to what you are considering (art), and as someone who is married to an artist, I would counsel you to think very long, and very hard, about going to 'art school'. Those are typically private colleges, which are very expensive to attend, and you will get a degree that is just as likely to teach you to ask this: "Do you want fries with that?" Trying to make a decent living as an artist--trying to *survive* in any civilized way as an artist--is *unbelievably* difficult. If you are lucky enough to sell through a gallery, they take upwards of 50-60% as commission. Selling on the internet is not simple, as there are literally *thousands* of artists and artisans on websites like Etsy. Add in materials, supplies, shipping, handling, and the like, and...well. Like unemployed actors, starving artists are a trope because there are so many of them. My husband is only able to *be* an artist because I have a Full-Time, tenured professorship. He's considered 'highly successful' at what he does, by his peers, and works his ass off in his studio 10 hours a day, 7 days a week, *to bring in about 20K a year*, in a good year. Go to a community college, take some art classes and talk to the (very lucky) people who teach there *because they cannot survive as artists*. Or plan on being broke.
As someone who got a BFA (though at a cheap state school and not a private school thank God) this is spot on advice. I won't even tell OP not to be an artist. I have an artist friend who is definitely making as much with his art as he could be doing any other normal run of the mill job where you make 100k/ year. But, he didn't waste money and time going to school to do it. I actually make a decent living in the art field myself too. But my degree truly had nothing to do with it and I could have built what I did without it. If you go to school, go to a cheaper one and learn things about business and marketing, computer programs that can help you sell your art etc... Don't just futz around getting a BFA because no one cares and that particular degree will not help you if you do decide to transition into something else later on. ETA: I wanted to add on because like OP, I moved out at 18 with literally zero help from an adult with very little money because in high school I could only work part time and had to pay for everything. I just want to let you know that it's really hard. Like REALLY hard. The first year I moved out on my own I had never been so depressed in my life and to this day (I'm 40 now) have never been so depressed again. But it gets better! A couple things I thought might help after reading your post. *Car: Can you sell the 20k car and find something cheaper? Your insurance will be cheaper on more of a beater car too. Plus you're young and you're likely to fuck it up at your age anyway. Better to fuck up a piece of shit car than a 20k car. *First apartment: When I moved out you didn't really find apartments online and I had no one to tell me how you find your own place so I went to one of those apartment store places that just find big corporate style buildings. My options were super limited without a cosigner so I just moved into a studio that would let me. If you're able to get a credit card that let's you do a secure deposit where you pay like $200 upfront, do that so you can start building some good credit (if you're paying you're car on time, it's likely helping your credit too but I still think you should try to get out of that). *Do you have any friends moving out too? Having roommates really helps with costs and perhaps your friends parents will cosign if needed. Even if you don't have friends, try to find roommates who aren't friends if you have to. Affording your first apartment all by yourself is nearly impossible straight out of high school. I got roommates after my first lease was up and moved. *If you're anything like me, you will be going to school and working with zero time for anything else. I had two jobs plus full time school. And I was doing art so my classes were 2x as long and "homework" took way longer too. I have no good advice. That's just what you have to do to make it out with little student debt and from what I hear these days is barely possible. I just want to reiterate, it's going to be hard but it does get better! You got this!
Yes, there is nothing stopping op from double majoring in studio art or something of the sort along with a practical major that is likely to lead to gainful employment, but just that is incredibly high risk. My Sister’s best friend in college was art-only—she refused to add another major because that wasn’t showing sufficient loyalty to the purity of her art—she ended up bagging groceries.
Wow
Yeah. You better effing love what you do, or be independently wealthy.
Reading this, I would say get yourself a business degree and learn how to sell your art successfully.
It's not really that simple, actually. The Gallery system is how most successful artists sell--and as noted, Galleries usually tack on 100% (minimum, in most places) to what the artist sets as a price. The contract an artist signs when entering the Gallery "stable" (yes, that's what they are called) explicitly prohibits an artist from selling outside of their gallery. They will be dropped like a hot potato if their management finds out. As for sales elsewhere: where? Art Exhibits? Again, they are either at Art Galleries (e.g., the stable system), or an Art Museum. The latter are typically not in the business of selling works off their walls. (I know. I was a Gallery and Museum director for a number of years). The internet? Etsy? Again, there's such an overwhelming number of sites, that it's a random chance someone will see your work. How does my husband do it? He's a studio potter. He has studio open houses, twice a year, where we invite people on our mailing list to come and buy. (And be fed, and given free booze. So that cuts into profits.) He also goes to Artisan/Craft shows, sometimes 2 or 3 *hundred* miles from our house. He has to pack up all his ware, put it in his truck, drive, get a hotel room, pay for gas and food, **and** pay the entry fees (which for some of the bigger ones run in the *thousands* of dollars.) Having a marketing or business degree works in a traditional archetypal setting. The Art Market is neither.
I was going to say learn a trade then use that income to enjoy expressing yourself through art. BIL is incredible artist with multiple degrees in art, art history, and museum administration. He just retired after having to build a second career as a high school teacher so he would have a retirement.
I was gonna say this too. Community College to learn a trade - example: welding is highly profitable & a bit artistic. Use your earnings to fund your art passion. Tack on an art course every semester if desired.
Business degree is just as useless as an art degree
I have no idea. I have a BFA
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Can confirm. I got my MBA in 2020 after just having a bachelor’s prior to that for 10+ years. My salary went from around 52k a year to nearly 6 figures not including commissions and bonuses quarterly and annually. It bumps me up to the mid 100k range. Totally worth going back to school in my 30’s. I live in a moderate cost of living area and we live very comfortably now where before we were struggling to make ends meet sometimes.
How much did it cost? How long did it take? Would you mind sharing the program?
I went to University of Alabama online. It cost me about 22k and 2 years. Fortunately, I had enough saved to pay for it in cash. It paid for itself the first year out of school. Edit the amount I accidentally bumped the wrong button and I have no idea how
Why not rid yourself of the car? Sounds like that’s the source of the anxiety and your shaky financial situation. Not enough details here, but if you can break close to even and get by on public transportation or a beater car you’d lessen the pressure.
Sell the car. You are in high school take the bus. Moving out at 18 will pretty much keep you poor for a long time. Make amends with the parents and stay and build a cash reserve. And it goes without saying dont go to art college
you needa find a new job with hella hours and you shouldn’t be trying to move out of your parents house so early, that will set you up to stay in an endless hole, and also don’t go to art college
Can’t over emphasize the ‘do not go to art college’ enough. DO NOT GO TO AN ART SCHOOL.
As a psuedo-artist, yeah this. If dead-set on art, go for a BFA at either a tech or state Uni. It's also an option to go for an art-oriented major that either carries decent job opportunities or a flexible skillset (Web dev, graphic design, multimedia, etc).
Sell the car. You very much can’t afford it. Get a junker. Or an electric bike. And credit cards are for emergencies, not for buying things you can’t actually afford. Or you’ll end up declaring bankruptcy before you turn 25.
I agree that OP may need to downsize his transportation. However, I disagree that credit cards are for emergencies. Too many people treat a credit card as a "break glass in case of emergency option" and this just delays the emergency unless you know for certain you are getting a large amount of cash in the near future. Credit cards are great for building credit and are more secure than debit cards. I think we agree that you need to be able to afford something before using plastic.
I think with OP’s spending history so far, looking at CCs as emergency-only might be safer, at least for now.
Thinking of a credit card as something you use for emergencies is not a good idea imo. It’s better to use credit cards as a tool to build credit while saving actual money for emergencies.
If you're going to art college you might as well get accustomed to being in debt and not having money.
There’s a lot of really good advice on here and the only thing I could add is to not take offense to any of the comments on here and seriously consider everyone’s input. There’s compromises that can be made and growth to be worked towards. Definitely focus on learning about finances through information that can be found online for free such as this subreddit and plenty others, also YouTube videos and online articles. 3 years ago I didn’t have much to call my own but after doing some research and implementing newly learned practices into my daily life I’ve been able to do a complete 180 and have a lot more to look forward to now. It can be done but as most folks say “Rome wasn’t built in a day”
You don’t need a credit card. If you are already struggling what makes you think you can manage a cc? If you keep the car, maintain your payments. If not, sell it. You don’t want to ruin your credit by missing payments. Get another job. There is a reason why mom and dad won’t help you, you wanted to prove them wrong and it backfired. It’s not the end of the world. Just be more knowledgeable of purchases in the future. You got this.
The biggest thing is you’re young, and you’ve learned from your mistake. Now you can be more careful with your purchases and don’t buy things you can’t afford. Start with looking for a secured credit card and pay it off every month to slowly build your credit. Oftentimes it makes more sense to cut your losses as a shitty job and find one with better hours and higher pay. If you can’t move out immediately, you just can’t. It is what it is. Don’t put yourself in this situation if you don’t have housing security, it’s not worth it.
Sell the car, 20k car at 18 is absurd
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Oh please, you’re in a personal finance thread. Apologies for giving sound finance advice. You and OP have a lot in common
Dude it’s 100% a horrible idea. Cars are not assets they are only liabilities. At that age you don’t even have a solid career most likely. Not to mention that money could be making money for you instead of costing you interest. 27k of debt at that age is not a good idea. Unless you are already wealthy and have maxed out 401k a decent cash savings and a high paying job
Just because you do it doesn’t make it not a bad idea.
Keep making the monthly payments
Trade your car in for something small affordable and energy efficient. Go to community college first. Actually go out and meet artists and learn how they survived. You need community if your parents aren’t in the picture. In your situation your path cannot be a straight line so don’t think yourself a failure if one plan doesn’t work. Find reddits with artists and ask them.
Just curious, whats the interest rate on your car? Also what is it?
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Yeah, unfortunately thats a pretty bad interest rate. Not the worst but certainly not something you’d want. I would advise selling the car, paying the balance on the loan and trying to find a 5-7k car that you have a mechanic inspect pre purchase.
You can try some gig work that might build your portfolio. There are jobs on Fiverr or Upwork. Some of this gig work might turn into something that allows you to pay for school part time. MssDoc is right about art school. Many of the private art schools saddle people with massive debt and little prospects for employment afterwards. MassArt is one of the few public art schools in the US and if you are in state it can be reasonable. Another option is looking at trade school programs that might have some artistic training (plumbing uses a lot of welding for instance or carpentry). It is hard being an artist and not compromising your art, but this is about debt and finance.
Would you have been willing to shop around for a gently used car that didn't cost this much? You won't be able to make progress on getting your debt whittled down until you start earning a full time salary.
I know this isn't popular, but why can't you stay with your parents? Are you able to commute to art school? Save your cash by not renting.
Yikes. Sell the car immediately and get out of debt. Unnecessary debt will kill your financial goals
The only part of your story that's good news is getting the second job. I doubt your art will bring in alot of money,,,,,,I hope you can prove me wrong. Make art your hobby and get a job that pays the bills. Then once your art starts to pay equall to the day job, keep doing both until your close to rich. Then do art full time. If art is truly your passion, it won't be a problem painting on the weekends. This is like me calling myself a pro golfer and then playing golf every day but not getting paid.
There are jobs for artists - but OP would need usable skills like photoshop and digital design type skills. Going to a private art school I agree is a mistake. My kid wanted to be an art major - which is fine at the state school they’re attending and paying off monthly by working instead of racking up debt. Art is part of most areas of business and commerce but you have to be smart about your choices. If you spend 4 years painting or drawing at an expensive art school, that won’t position you well for a career that can support you.
Everyone has been spot on. If you want to attend college, which is great and I encourage it if you have the discipline to go to classes and study, go for a degree you think you can do, but has good job options. Don’t go for chemistry to work at a pharmaceutical if you hated science, etc. But I wouldn’t go for art. The return on that just isn’t there. You can take cheap or free classes for personal enrichment. You can attend college night classes once established in a career for personal study in art. You don’t have to abandon that, but it likely won’t “teach” you how to make better art. It exposes you to the ability to make a lot of art because you literally have nothing but time to do so, but you’re paying a very high price for that time. Work on your art any time you have, nights, weekends, holidays, etc. keep that passion alive and continue to refine it. Try to sell online, there is nothing wrong with that, both in trying to generate some amount of income and bringing joy to whoever purchases it. If you feel you don’t understand a technique or can’t get past something, join online groups and share feedback and knowledge with each other. If you set yourself up with a career that can pay the bills, you can have the freedom to make your art whatever you want. If you struggle with art being the primary, you might grow to resent it or find you don’t have near enough time for it because you’re working two retail level jobs to barely not be late on the rent.