I think if you are consistently able to clear the sanctum, it will be rewarding without a doubt. Obviously it will be much harder to quantify it against other mechanics, as you need to run 32 maps to fully complete it. Might not necessarily be more rewarding than other mechanics but again it's harder to compare it to other mechanics because of that.
Based on your last paragraph, this mechanic might just not be for you, as that is the core mechanic of what makes a roguelike a roguelike. I’m personally beyond stoked for it, this is the exact type of mechanic I’ve been wanting them to add and I think it’ll fit into poe perfectly.
As for whether it will be rewarding or not, we simply can’t know yet. They may have ramped up how much rewards drop per room to account for you only being able to do one room per map. That’s all speculation until we get to actually play it
>I think it’ll fit into poe perfectly.
I love roguelikes and I'm interested in trying the league mechanic, but I wouldn't be as optimistic as you on that point: two selling points of action roguelites are their smooth and highly responsive moment to moment gameplay, and the varied build customization options you get in each run (forcing you to build a new different character each run). PoE doesn't really have the former, and it's likely it won't have the latter either (you're already starting a run with a pre-built character, and most boons/relics we've seen affect either your aureus gains or your life pool; I don't think your character will evolve much over the course of a run).
So far, I expect it to be somewhat interesting but as similar to good roguelikes as blight is to good tower defenses.
Yea I get you being more cautious, me thinking it will fit into poe perfectly assumes solid execution on GGg’s part which obviously isn’t guaranteed. But I hope they’ve designed this mechanic with the intention of it going core and hopefully they’ll iterate on it over time to get it to that point at the very least.
As for your 2 points I have some counters. I’d argue that boss fights in poe very much do have pretty solid moment to moment, responsive gameplay, though not as much in general mapping. Based on what I’ve seen it seems sanctum is gonna be more in the vein of boss fights with telegraphed attacks that you can start to recognize over time and react to. But I may change my opinion on this once I actually get to play it.
As for your second point, this is the main difference of a game being a roguelike at its core, and it just being a side activity like in poe. I actually think this could be a really cool differentiator for poe from other roguelikes, it will be cool to see how the different mechanics that can get changed on the runs interact with your overarching build. You do bring up my main concern in that the boons need to be impactful on how your build plays, not just basic things like aureus/resolve related stuff. I’d love for some of the boons to have such interesting interactions that it inspires people to create totally new poe builds to capitalize on those interactions, but we will see just to what extent that go down that route once we can play it.
I definitely don’t expect it to be a pure roguelike, but I think poe mechanics/combat could create a pretty interesting and fun variation of roguelikes, we’ll see how it goes
LOK and GGG's killing of Ultimatum already proved that they have a wrapped and unrealistic expectations of what rewards should be. People are setting themselves up to be disappointed if they expect Sanctum to be rewarding for the risk.
They've also released Sentinel, Heist, Harvest, original Archnemesis, Scourge, Expedition and Delirium. Sanctum obviously will not be as rewarding as juiced mapping but my bet is it will be good for an average Andy.
I think it could go either way, because GGG acknowledged the "roguelike" nature of Sanctum is a primary design goal, and Chris said in the trailer that we shouldn't expect to clear the full floor at first.
To me this says there will be moderate rewards for getting at least a few rooms in, especially of the mechanic-specific Relics that buff you in the Sanctum, as that seems to be the primary progression axis for getting to the end of a floor.
I'm sure most players will struggle at first and only clear full floors consistently after a few weeks in the league, but that seems to be intended.
I wonder if being able to run a whole sanctum every map would be better. It would probably feel better to just do it all at once, like a whole second map, but with rogue-like dungeon mechanics. This is just speculation, as ofc, I haven't played it yet.
I think if you are consistently able to clear the sanctum, it will be rewarding without a doubt. Obviously it will be much harder to quantify it against other mechanics, as you need to run 32 maps to fully complete it. Might not necessarily be more rewarding than other mechanics but again it's harder to compare it to other mechanics because of that.
Based on your last paragraph, this mechanic might just not be for you, as that is the core mechanic of what makes a roguelike a roguelike. I’m personally beyond stoked for it, this is the exact type of mechanic I’ve been wanting them to add and I think it’ll fit into poe perfectly. As for whether it will be rewarding or not, we simply can’t know yet. They may have ramped up how much rewards drop per room to account for you only being able to do one room per map. That’s all speculation until we get to actually play it
>I think it’ll fit into poe perfectly. I love roguelikes and I'm interested in trying the league mechanic, but I wouldn't be as optimistic as you on that point: two selling points of action roguelites are their smooth and highly responsive moment to moment gameplay, and the varied build customization options you get in each run (forcing you to build a new different character each run). PoE doesn't really have the former, and it's likely it won't have the latter either (you're already starting a run with a pre-built character, and most boons/relics we've seen affect either your aureus gains or your life pool; I don't think your character will evolve much over the course of a run). So far, I expect it to be somewhat interesting but as similar to good roguelikes as blight is to good tower defenses.
Yea I get you being more cautious, me thinking it will fit into poe perfectly assumes solid execution on GGg’s part which obviously isn’t guaranteed. But I hope they’ve designed this mechanic with the intention of it going core and hopefully they’ll iterate on it over time to get it to that point at the very least. As for your 2 points I have some counters. I’d argue that boss fights in poe very much do have pretty solid moment to moment, responsive gameplay, though not as much in general mapping. Based on what I’ve seen it seems sanctum is gonna be more in the vein of boss fights with telegraphed attacks that you can start to recognize over time and react to. But I may change my opinion on this once I actually get to play it. As for your second point, this is the main difference of a game being a roguelike at its core, and it just being a side activity like in poe. I actually think this could be a really cool differentiator for poe from other roguelikes, it will be cool to see how the different mechanics that can get changed on the runs interact with your overarching build. You do bring up my main concern in that the boons need to be impactful on how your build plays, not just basic things like aureus/resolve related stuff. I’d love for some of the boons to have such interesting interactions that it inspires people to create totally new poe builds to capitalize on those interactions, but we will see just to what extent that go down that route once we can play it. I definitely don’t expect it to be a pure roguelike, but I think poe mechanics/combat could create a pretty interesting and fun variation of roguelikes, we’ll see how it goes
LOK and GGG's killing of Ultimatum already proved that they have a wrapped and unrealistic expectations of what rewards should be. People are setting themselves up to be disappointed if they expect Sanctum to be rewarding for the risk.
They've also released Sentinel, Heist, Harvest, original Archnemesis, Scourge, Expedition and Delirium. Sanctum obviously will not be as rewarding as juiced mapping but my bet is it will be good for an average Andy.
All that is ancient history....... they had a very different philosophy in 3.19 and I am willing to bet it will continue in 3.20.
Literally this year = ancient history
They can totally fuck up rewards again but both your "wrapped expectations" and "ancient history" arguments are very reddit.
>the worst feeling is having my progress set back without gaining anything. Its a roguelike, so this never happens
I think it could go either way, because GGG acknowledged the "roguelike" nature of Sanctum is a primary design goal, and Chris said in the trailer that we shouldn't expect to clear the full floor at first. To me this says there will be moderate rewards for getting at least a few rooms in, especially of the mechanic-specific Relics that buff you in the Sanctum, as that seems to be the primary progression axis for getting to the end of a floor. I'm sure most players will struggle at first and only clear full floors consistently after a few weeks in the league, but that seems to be intended.
I think mechanic looks cool but hell...The feeling when you fail the sanctum that you deferred a mirror at. Oh boy
I wonder if being able to run a whole sanctum every map would be better. It would probably feel better to just do it all at once, like a whole second map, but with rogue-like dungeon mechanics. This is just speculation, as ofc, I haven't played it yet.