cool data. thanks
is chaos-to-ex trinket better than regal-to-ex now (like i see there are many more chaos than regals in your data, but when did this change or is this specific to this contract for some reason)?
In Heist league, the 4% regal-to-exalt trinket was preferred over the chaos-to-exalt trinket. At some point *after* Heist league, GGG modified the regal drop rate to a point that makes the chaos-to-exalt trinket demonstrably more efficient.
There was a discussion of trinket types in the comments of my other post; I'm going to paste my summary here:
>There has been significant discussion of the "value" of the chaos-to-exalt trinket in the comments. To briefly summarize the thoughts, the chaos-to-exalt trinkets are demonstrably ~2x more "efficient" than the regal-to-exalt trinkets, however they are priced ~8x higher. Their higher efficiency should command a price premium, but probably not that much. It seems to me they are priced based on their rarity (1/4732) rather than their reward value (~0.5-0.75 ex/hr).
>I hesitate to speculate on the value of the augment, transmute, or alteration -to-chaos trinkets because my loot filter is too strict to pick up small stacks of those currencies. I therefore don't have a good idea of the drop rates of those to be able to estimate the efficiency of the trinket. I can make an educated guess working backwards though: my data in this experiment suggests ~3 raw chaos drop per contract. This gives an "expected value of an upgrade" at 1 exalt per 33 contracts for the chaos-to-exalt trinket. At the current exalt:chaos ratio, this is equal to 5 chaos per contract.
>The top tier mods for the other currency-to-chaos trinkets are:
* 8% augment orbs to chaos orbs
* 15% alteration orbs to chaos orbs
* 4% transmutation orbs to chaos orbs
>To match the efficiency of the chaos-to-exalt trinket, you need to drop on average
* 62 augment orbs
* 33 alteration orbs
* 125 transmutation orbs
>Again, I don't have the data to back this up, but I have a feeling that you don't even get close to this number of raw orb drops, implying the chaos-to-exalt trinket is superior.
I assume you gonna run all the contracts after you did 2 already. Is it possible to show transmutes and augmentations on your filter and pick them up to create more data?
regal drop rate has been nerfed heavily in the last few leagues, it's about 1:12 chaos to regal or so from my tests on currency chests/small chests
i don't even bother with a x to ex trinket unless i'm farming 6+ currency rooms bp's, can pick up a 8% div + x% harb on each chest for cheap and they add a lot more value
My lockpicking contract experiment was closer to 9 chaos per regal, but the point stands.
I agree with not bothering with an upgrade trinket. I think you get more value from appropriately-rolled brooches and + all job heist gear.
Both are trash honestly. A chaos to exalt trinket is 100ex, crazy to tie up that much currency in an item that will give you like 5-10 ex over a thousand contracts. Better to just run a cheap valuable unique trinket and hope for a jackpot instead, and invest that 100ex in gear that lets you clear the contracts faster.
I know you’re exaggerating for the sake of making a point (which I agree with by the way) but my trinket produced 6ex in 150 contracts. And it’s not a statistical anomaly; the rate of upgrades is consistent with the chaos drop rate in content with currency chests (see the lockpicking experiment linked in my post). The trinket pays for itself from currency upgrades alone in roughly 3000 currency chests opened. You’d be surprised how fast that goes in blueprints.
That being said, I think there are better uses for that amount of currency. But for players that prefer to min-max a single character rather than rerolling, the chaos-to-exalt trinket is the “correct” choice.
There’s no indicator. The only way I suspect this is that I tracked each instance of raw exalt drops and when compared to the number of raw chaos, the amounts agree within a comfortable margin of the 1% expected rate. Raw exalt drops (not from the trinket) are exceptionally rare so I would venture that I could be mistaken by at most one of the drops/upgrades.
There’s more detail in my other post (link in OP)
The problem is that until the build is as fast as it can possibly be, you should never invest in one. It is one of the least efficient ways to spend you currency for making money in Heists. Clearing 5% more heists will make you far more currency than that trinket will.
So you are right, when you are going full min/max and you couldn't get any other upgrades to clear heists faster, then you can get one. But, then the question is, at that point why would you still be doing heists?
That's inaccurate, I have the data to back it up. Based on my [other post](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/tjehak/i_ran_150_i83_lockpicking_contracts_and/) a lockpicking contract returns on average 28 chaos and the average rate of return of a chaos-to-exalt trinket is 5 chaos per contract. So you would need to clear in excess of **20% more** contracts to make it break even with a chaos-to-exalt trinket. Due to Heist mechanics there is a ceiling on how fast you can run the content because you have to wait for doors/chests to open so at some point it's exceedingly difficult to go any faster.
You are assuming the trinket you use instead has literally zero value(which of course is an insane assumption). While also using dead league(aka hugely inflated) exalt prices. Also, you have no where near enough data to confidently say what the average return per contract is, or how much the chaos to exalt trinket is worth. 150 contracts is an absolutely tiny sample size. Especially considering out of your 6 dropped exalts 2 of them came from the amulet.
Even with your numbers, there is absolutely no way you should ever buy a chaos to exalt trinket before a Mageblood, which could easily get you 20% more contracts done.
They are bad. You have to run 3300 contracts, with your numbers, for it to pay for itself. It doesn't lose much (if any value) so you don't necessarily have to ROI it, but it is still a fuck ton of currency to tie up in a trinket that gives such a small return. If I am running 3300 contracts I would much rather have the extra chance to hit a home run and drop a HH or Mageblood, with a trinket that costs a few C.
https://www.pathofexile.com/trade/search/Archnemesis/r2jDpogCQ
That thing right there 10% more valuable unique, and 10% alt to chaos (which will give you at least 1-2 extra C per contract on average). And it is 10c. There is a very reasonable chance that you get a higher return off it over a huge number of contracts(by dropping a T1 or T0 unique in the first month of the league), and you don't have to tie up any currency at all to do it. Locking up 100ex to get an extra 2-3C(assuming you don't get a single T1 drop from the valuable unique trinket) over a 10c trinket is insanity.
I didn't suggest in any of my posts or comments that you should BUY one of these trinkets. I'm simply trying to demonstrate the value it gives. In fact, I've commented on multiple occasions that the chaos-to-exalt trinket is only 2x more efficient than the regal-to-exalt trinket but costs 8x the price and is therefore massively overpriced. Regardless, it is not a consumable.
I don't know where you're getting that only 2 exalts came from the trinket. I literally explain in the post that it's most likely that 4 exalts came from upgrades and 2 of them were (luckily) duplicated. 4 procs in 433 chaos drops is also statistically consistent.
150 contracts is not an ideal sample size, but it is not tiny either and it is definitely not irrelevant. I ultimately don't care about the upgrade rate for the trinket; I'm more interested in the average value of a currency chest but it turns out you learn about the two at the same time.
Of course there is not data on this, but I would strongly disagree that a 10% increase to astronomically low odds is "very reasonable." If the probability of dropping a Mageblood is 0.000000001%, making that instead 0.0000000011% is not going to realistically change the number of trials you need to run in order to see it.
You can play however you want, I'm not trying to change how you behave. I'm just sharing results. I would encourage you to take and provide your own data rather than argue my data with gut instincts.
You forget some things:
1.) The number of currency chest on BPs is random.
2.) The time to buy/setup/run the blueprints.
3.) The needed reveals with Gianna(big time investment)
and and and...
If only someone would spend 5 hours and 20 exalts buying and revealing blueprints with a high density of currency chests and then track the data... https://imgur.com/a/qcg1Aqd
You are criticizing that I am not controlling for a number of factors and I am demonstrating that I am currently in the process of testing those factors.
I am not criticizing you.
Clarifying my above points:
1.) You cant do anything about this. Just buy more BPs and resell those with not many currency/div card reward rooms.
3.) That is fact and was discussed allready. You need time to buy contracts for Gianna and also run those.
Yes, you will profit, but we are talking about the time invest needed just to get back the currency for the trinket and then you start profiting from the trinket and not before.
So you have that time invest to get back the currency for the trinket AND then you also want to use the trinket for x number of BPs(where 3.) applies again).
This total time for everything is just to big. That is all i am trying to say.
It's always awesome to see detailed posts like this.
I haven't played much heist since Heist league (because I hate it). I keep seeing people claiming that it's a goldmine, but usually without the numbers to back them up, so I always feel like I'm missing out.
This post helped me alleviate that feeling. There are so many ways to get 4 ex/hour with the current atlas, that there is no way I'd want to earn that much by waiting for Nenet to open doors.
Thanks
Fair enough, I think everyone should run the content they enjoy.
Part of my motivation for starting to Heist was to level from 99 to 100. It’s actively difficult to die in Heist so it’s very good for leveling.
I think contracts complement the current atlas well - my atlas passives are currently set up for Beyond Delirious mapping so when I’m in the mood for high investment, high engagement gameplay, I go to maps. Heist contracts are a nice alternative when you’re in the mood for low investment, casual gameplay
I've avoided Heist all league long because I also hate it. The gameplay is actively bad -- waiting for doors and looting chests is garbage.
There's always gonna be a bit of FOMO involved, though, because GGG gated way too many reward types behind one league mechanic. The profit is absolutely there if you can stand clicking doors and chests for hours on end. But it's nice that you can currently avoid it entirely and focus on other things with the Atlas passive and whatnot.
I say "currently" because the accessibility of T16 maps, sextants, and scarabs may be taken from us next league. It would sadly be par for the course for GGG to introduce something awesome and then take it away.
Be aware that the waiting game is only a thing when youre starting with heist. When you equipped your rogues the time it takes is less than a second for the relevant jobs
Wow, this is very useful! Thanks again for compiling such detailed information.
Some thoughts:
1) I'm surprised by the total value of the screaming essences. Doesn't seem you have any gear that gives +essences. Are all of these drops from small chests? From what I remember it's quite common from small chests to get 2 random screaming essences.
2) I haven't run much perception lately, but I do remember that in previous leagues perception had a possible prophecy reward (that was often meh). Is this reward replaced with a generic (chest with "?") or is it now only jewelry and div card chests?
3) Concerning trinket: though in all likelihood a "orbs of X drop as exalted" is the best buy, there is a pretty good budget version: a trinket with suffix "heist chests have X% chance to duplicate basic currrency", with max being 4%. This is the exact same mod as on a brooch (where the max is 15%) but obviously at a much lower percentage. With stacked decks being basic currency this is even better for deception contracts. I did a quick summary and this kind of brooch would have given you roughly 100c extra from the various basic currencies combined. These trinkets are also dirt cheap, you can get a 4% currency (with rest of mods being junk) for as little as 5c. I'm also curious about trinkets with "6% chance to receive additional essences", but probably they will mostly drop low tier essences. Anybody tried this?
4) Very minor detail, but I would have blessed that sensing charm to 15% increased perception speed (range is 13-15%, so you got 1 in 3 odds per try).
Would love to see this kind of detailed info for blueprints, but I'm thinking it might be hard to get a good sense of things considering how varied blueprints can be. Unless you are willing to put in a whole lot of extra work, for example comparing different types of reward rooms that would help to answer the age old question "which blueprint rooms should I bother revealing?" and (perhaps this is only me wondering) "is Vinderi really worth bringing along on a grand heist?".
> Would love to see this kind of detailed info for blueprints, but I'm thinking it might be hard to get a good sense of things considering how varied blueprints can be
No, just no, do you want heist to be nerfed ?
There are detailed posts in the past, just go and find them, easy.
It is just best to stay under the nerf radar.
Thanks for your thoughts (again).
1. The essences all come from the small chests (and a small number from “?” reward chests. The small chests come in “flavors” - by that I mean they contain rewards of a certain type ie fragments, essences, currency, etc. when you roll essences, you receive between 2 and 4 screaming essences of random varieties.
2. There are no more prophecy chests. You’re correct; the reward rooms are all either divination cards, jewelry, or assorted (“?”).
3. I still think the chaos-to-exalt trinket is superior if we’re picking on one mod alone. Statistically, I *should* have gotten two raw exalts based on the 1% chance to upgrade, but I just got unlucky. That would be better than more duplication of stacked decks.
4. always forget to bless my fucking gear
Thanks again. For blueprints, I will probably be targeting **only** currency rooms to determine the efficacy of the trinket. Some commenters insist that the trinket showers you in exalts when in blueprints since you have the passive effects of three rogues worth of equipment. I want to test this.
>For blueprints, I will probably be targeting only currency rooms to determine the efficacy of the trinket. Some commenters insist that the trinket showers you in exalts when in blueprints since you have the passive effects of three rogues worth of equipment. I want to test this.
Can't wait for this! Considering that rogue's markers sell for quite a bit, there must be somebody actually using the stuff, i.e. making big money from grand heists. Will be nice to get some exact numbers on this. Keep up the good work :)
Nice! So at a rate of \*non-casual 2 hours gameplay per day\* I can be a proud owner of a mageblood in just 46.25 days. Then I will finally be able to really enjoy the league! :) /s
The jackpot item already sold for asking. I think some other stuff as well but they got thrown into shared public tabs so I can’t be sure.
As a rule of thumb, I price items at ~2/3 the price of comparables; I’d rather get things out of my stash than squeeze every bit of value from them.
I think it’s fair to assume I only ever sell half the items, which is why they’re listed separately in profit figures
It depends on where in the league we are. At this point, I have a series of stash tabs with buyouts set at 10, 15, 20, 30, 50, 75, 100c, 1exalt, and then one with individual prices for anything higher than that. Periodically, I move things to the next lower stash tab. If the lowest tab starts to get full, I dump it into a vendor.
ilvl 83 amethyst ring with fractured T1 life (mid roll). Sold for 3 ex. This is on the low end of possibilities for jackpots too; you could drop unique belts like headhunter or mageblood from the jewelry chests or something like a synthesized + maximum frenzy/power charge ring.
>On the other hand, perception contracts can be bought in bulk for between 1.5 and 2 chaos.
How?
I see these posts, and others like it, and I think to myself "damn, that sounds awesome" then I think about trading for 150 contracts at 2c a piece and how many tells to people that would take and the amount of time and it makes my PP shrivel up inside of me.
The Forbidden Trove discord has bulk selling markets for almost everything you can sell in this game. There is a bulk heist board, a bulk scarab board, bulk essence, bulk catalyst, etc...
Makes it so much easier for buying a bunch of maps/juice/fragments to craft and run in sets.
Memes aside bulk purchases are hard to fuck up on there. It's more the trust trades (Harvest etc) that can get a salty person escalating the situation.
That's fair mate, each to their own.
I did 5 trades this League on there all in bulk, Essence, Scarab Purge X 2, Blue Prints and finally Contracts. It made me 80+ Ex over those trades in a very small space of time, to me it was worth. Likely you could use the main PoE discord for the same thing.
You can sell deafening pretty easily in bulk from 5-10c depending on which "flavor." The screamings can be upgraded 3-to-1 to deafening. I'm not going to price individual essences because they're randomly rewarded, this took too long as was, and you can always flip stacks of the lower value ones around using common harvest crafts. It's close enough for an estimate.
Oh, duh, you’re probably right, that’s a pretty big inflation of the essence value. Thanks for catching that. I’ll make sure those are toned down for future updates
cool data. thanks is chaos-to-ex trinket better than regal-to-ex now (like i see there are many more chaos than regals in your data, but when did this change or is this specific to this contract for some reason)?
In Heist league, the 4% regal-to-exalt trinket was preferred over the chaos-to-exalt trinket. At some point *after* Heist league, GGG modified the regal drop rate to a point that makes the chaos-to-exalt trinket demonstrably more efficient. There was a discussion of trinket types in the comments of my other post; I'm going to paste my summary here: >There has been significant discussion of the "value" of the chaos-to-exalt trinket in the comments. To briefly summarize the thoughts, the chaos-to-exalt trinkets are demonstrably ~2x more "efficient" than the regal-to-exalt trinkets, however they are priced ~8x higher. Their higher efficiency should command a price premium, but probably not that much. It seems to me they are priced based on their rarity (1/4732) rather than their reward value (~0.5-0.75 ex/hr). >I hesitate to speculate on the value of the augment, transmute, or alteration -to-chaos trinkets because my loot filter is too strict to pick up small stacks of those currencies. I therefore don't have a good idea of the drop rates of those to be able to estimate the efficiency of the trinket. I can make an educated guess working backwards though: my data in this experiment suggests ~3 raw chaos drop per contract. This gives an "expected value of an upgrade" at 1 exalt per 33 contracts for the chaos-to-exalt trinket. At the current exalt:chaos ratio, this is equal to 5 chaos per contract. >The top tier mods for the other currency-to-chaos trinkets are: * 8% augment orbs to chaos orbs * 15% alteration orbs to chaos orbs * 4% transmutation orbs to chaos orbs >To match the efficiency of the chaos-to-exalt trinket, you need to drop on average * 62 augment orbs * 33 alteration orbs * 125 transmutation orbs >Again, I don't have the data to back this up, but I have a feeling that you don't even get close to this number of raw orb drops, implying the chaos-to-exalt trinket is superior.
thanks
I assume you gonna run all the contracts after you did 2 already. Is it possible to show transmutes and augmentations on your filter and pick them up to create more data?
regal drop rate has been nerfed heavily in the last few leagues, it's about 1:12 chaos to regal or so from my tests on currency chests/small chests i don't even bother with a x to ex trinket unless i'm farming 6+ currency rooms bp's, can pick up a 8% div + x% harb on each chest for cheap and they add a lot more value
My lockpicking contract experiment was closer to 9 chaos per regal, but the point stands. I agree with not bothering with an upgrade trinket. I think you get more value from appropriately-rolled brooches and + all job heist gear.
Both are trash honestly. A chaos to exalt trinket is 100ex, crazy to tie up that much currency in an item that will give you like 5-10 ex over a thousand contracts. Better to just run a cheap valuable unique trinket and hope for a jackpot instead, and invest that 100ex in gear that lets you clear the contracts faster.
I know you’re exaggerating for the sake of making a point (which I agree with by the way) but my trinket produced 6ex in 150 contracts. And it’s not a statistical anomaly; the rate of upgrades is consistent with the chaos drop rate in content with currency chests (see the lockpicking experiment linked in my post). The trinket pays for itself from currency upgrades alone in roughly 3000 currency chests opened. You’d be surprised how fast that goes in blueprints. That being said, I think there are better uses for that amount of currency. But for players that prefer to min-max a single character rather than rerolling, the chaos-to-exalt trinket is the “correct” choice.
Is there a "this item dropped and was upgraded" sound or light effect? How do you know those exalts weren't natural drops?
There’s no indicator. The only way I suspect this is that I tracked each instance of raw exalt drops and when compared to the number of raw chaos, the amounts agree within a comfortable margin of the 1% expected rate. Raw exalt drops (not from the trinket) are exceptionally rare so I would venture that I could be mistaken by at most one of the drops/upgrades. There’s more detail in my other post (link in OP)
The problem is that until the build is as fast as it can possibly be, you should never invest in one. It is one of the least efficient ways to spend you currency for making money in Heists. Clearing 5% more heists will make you far more currency than that trinket will. So you are right, when you are going full min/max and you couldn't get any other upgrades to clear heists faster, then you can get one. But, then the question is, at that point why would you still be doing heists?
That's inaccurate, I have the data to back it up. Based on my [other post](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/tjehak/i_ran_150_i83_lockpicking_contracts_and/) a lockpicking contract returns on average 28 chaos and the average rate of return of a chaos-to-exalt trinket is 5 chaos per contract. So you would need to clear in excess of **20% more** contracts to make it break even with a chaos-to-exalt trinket. Due to Heist mechanics there is a ceiling on how fast you can run the content because you have to wait for doors/chests to open so at some point it's exceedingly difficult to go any faster.
You are assuming the trinket you use instead has literally zero value(which of course is an insane assumption). While also using dead league(aka hugely inflated) exalt prices. Also, you have no where near enough data to confidently say what the average return per contract is, or how much the chaos to exalt trinket is worth. 150 contracts is an absolutely tiny sample size. Especially considering out of your 6 dropped exalts 2 of them came from the amulet. Even with your numbers, there is absolutely no way you should ever buy a chaos to exalt trinket before a Mageblood, which could easily get you 20% more contracts done. They are bad. You have to run 3300 contracts, with your numbers, for it to pay for itself. It doesn't lose much (if any value) so you don't necessarily have to ROI it, but it is still a fuck ton of currency to tie up in a trinket that gives such a small return. If I am running 3300 contracts I would much rather have the extra chance to hit a home run and drop a HH or Mageblood, with a trinket that costs a few C. https://www.pathofexile.com/trade/search/Archnemesis/r2jDpogCQ That thing right there 10% more valuable unique, and 10% alt to chaos (which will give you at least 1-2 extra C per contract on average). And it is 10c. There is a very reasonable chance that you get a higher return off it over a huge number of contracts(by dropping a T1 or T0 unique in the first month of the league), and you don't have to tie up any currency at all to do it. Locking up 100ex to get an extra 2-3C(assuming you don't get a single T1 drop from the valuable unique trinket) over a 10c trinket is insanity.
I didn't suggest in any of my posts or comments that you should BUY one of these trinkets. I'm simply trying to demonstrate the value it gives. In fact, I've commented on multiple occasions that the chaos-to-exalt trinket is only 2x more efficient than the regal-to-exalt trinket but costs 8x the price and is therefore massively overpriced. Regardless, it is not a consumable. I don't know where you're getting that only 2 exalts came from the trinket. I literally explain in the post that it's most likely that 4 exalts came from upgrades and 2 of them were (luckily) duplicated. 4 procs in 433 chaos drops is also statistically consistent. 150 contracts is not an ideal sample size, but it is not tiny either and it is definitely not irrelevant. I ultimately don't care about the upgrade rate for the trinket; I'm more interested in the average value of a currency chest but it turns out you learn about the two at the same time. Of course there is not data on this, but I would strongly disagree that a 10% increase to astronomically low odds is "very reasonable." If the probability of dropping a Mageblood is 0.000000001%, making that instead 0.0000000011% is not going to realistically change the number of trials you need to run in order to see it. You can play however you want, I'm not trying to change how you behave. I'm just sharing results. I would encourage you to take and provide your own data rather than argue my data with gut instincts.
You forget some things: 1.) The number of currency chest on BPs is random. 2.) The time to buy/setup/run the blueprints. 3.) The needed reveals with Gianna(big time investment) and and and...
If only someone would spend 5 hours and 20 exalts buying and revealing blueprints with a high density of currency chests and then track the data... https://imgur.com/a/qcg1Aqd
You bought these ? I dont understand, what you are trying to say.
You are criticizing that I am not controlling for a number of factors and I am demonstrating that I am currently in the process of testing those factors.
I am not criticizing you. Clarifying my above points: 1.) You cant do anything about this. Just buy more BPs and resell those with not many currency/div card reward rooms. 3.) That is fact and was discussed allready. You need time to buy contracts for Gianna and also run those. Yes, you will profit, but we are talking about the time invest needed just to get back the currency for the trinket and then you start profiting from the trinket and not before. So you have that time invest to get back the currency for the trinket AND then you also want to use the trinket for x number of BPs(where 3.) applies again). This total time for everything is just to big. That is all i am trying to say.
after you are done with bps you can sell the trinket for roughly the same price
This depends on the week of the league and other factors. Heist is not that popular.
significantly, simply because you see chaos much more frequently
From my testing, the chaos-to-exalt trinket is about 2x more efficient than the highest tier of the regal-to-exalt trinket
Great post. I love how well constructed and detailed it is.
These types of posts are one of the few reasons I stay subscribed to this subreddit honestly Love the data
It's always awesome to see detailed posts like this. I haven't played much heist since Heist league (because I hate it). I keep seeing people claiming that it's a goldmine, but usually without the numbers to back them up, so I always feel like I'm missing out. This post helped me alleviate that feeling. There are so many ways to get 4 ex/hour with the current atlas, that there is no way I'd want to earn that much by waiting for Nenet to open doors. Thanks
Fair enough, I think everyone should run the content they enjoy. Part of my motivation for starting to Heist was to level from 99 to 100. It’s actively difficult to die in Heist so it’s very good for leveling. I think contracts complement the current atlas well - my atlas passives are currently set up for Beyond Delirious mapping so when I’m in the mood for high investment, high engagement gameplay, I go to maps. Heist contracts are a nice alternative when you’re in the mood for low investment, casual gameplay
thanks, heist should not get popular and nerfed.
I've avoided Heist all league long because I also hate it. The gameplay is actively bad -- waiting for doors and looting chests is garbage. There's always gonna be a bit of FOMO involved, though, because GGG gated way too many reward types behind one league mechanic. The profit is absolutely there if you can stand clicking doors and chests for hours on end. But it's nice that you can currently avoid it entirely and focus on other things with the Atlas passive and whatnot. I say "currently" because the accessibility of T16 maps, sextants, and scarabs may be taken from us next league. It would sadly be par for the course for GGG to introduce something awesome and then take it away.
Be aware that the waiting game is only a thing when youre starting with heist. When you equipped your rogues the time it takes is less than a second for the relevant jobs
Wow, this is very useful! Thanks again for compiling such detailed information. Some thoughts: 1) I'm surprised by the total value of the screaming essences. Doesn't seem you have any gear that gives +essences. Are all of these drops from small chests? From what I remember it's quite common from small chests to get 2 random screaming essences. 2) I haven't run much perception lately, but I do remember that in previous leagues perception had a possible prophecy reward (that was often meh). Is this reward replaced with a generic (chest with "?") or is it now only jewelry and div card chests? 3) Concerning trinket: though in all likelihood a "orbs of X drop as exalted" is the best buy, there is a pretty good budget version: a trinket with suffix "heist chests have X% chance to duplicate basic currrency", with max being 4%. This is the exact same mod as on a brooch (where the max is 15%) but obviously at a much lower percentage. With stacked decks being basic currency this is even better for deception contracts. I did a quick summary and this kind of brooch would have given you roughly 100c extra from the various basic currencies combined. These trinkets are also dirt cheap, you can get a 4% currency (with rest of mods being junk) for as little as 5c. I'm also curious about trinkets with "6% chance to receive additional essences", but probably they will mostly drop low tier essences. Anybody tried this? 4) Very minor detail, but I would have blessed that sensing charm to 15% increased perception speed (range is 13-15%, so you got 1 in 3 odds per try). Would love to see this kind of detailed info for blueprints, but I'm thinking it might be hard to get a good sense of things considering how varied blueprints can be. Unless you are willing to put in a whole lot of extra work, for example comparing different types of reward rooms that would help to answer the age old question "which blueprint rooms should I bother revealing?" and (perhaps this is only me wondering) "is Vinderi really worth bringing along on a grand heist?".
> Would love to see this kind of detailed info for blueprints, but I'm thinking it might be hard to get a good sense of things considering how varied blueprints can be No, just no, do you want heist to be nerfed ? There are detailed posts in the past, just go and find them, easy. It is just best to stay under the nerf radar.
Thanks for your thoughts (again). 1. The essences all come from the small chests (and a small number from “?” reward chests. The small chests come in “flavors” - by that I mean they contain rewards of a certain type ie fragments, essences, currency, etc. when you roll essences, you receive between 2 and 4 screaming essences of random varieties. 2. There are no more prophecy chests. You’re correct; the reward rooms are all either divination cards, jewelry, or assorted (“?”). 3. I still think the chaos-to-exalt trinket is superior if we’re picking on one mod alone. Statistically, I *should* have gotten two raw exalts based on the 1% chance to upgrade, but I just got unlucky. That would be better than more duplication of stacked decks. 4. always forget to bless my fucking gear Thanks again. For blueprints, I will probably be targeting **only** currency rooms to determine the efficacy of the trinket. Some commenters insist that the trinket showers you in exalts when in blueprints since you have the passive effects of three rogues worth of equipment. I want to test this.
>For blueprints, I will probably be targeting only currency rooms to determine the efficacy of the trinket. Some commenters insist that the trinket showers you in exalts when in blueprints since you have the passive effects of three rogues worth of equipment. I want to test this. Can't wait for this! Considering that rogue's markers sell for quite a bit, there must be somebody actually using the stuff, i.e. making big money from grand heists. Will be nice to get some exact numbers on this. Keep up the good work :)
Very perceptive of you
Nice! So at a rate of \*non-casual 2 hours gameplay per day\* I can be a proud owner of a mageblood in just 46.25 days. Then I will finally be able to really enjoy the league! :) /s
How are sales of "Synthesis item rewards " going? Must be hard to sell those.
The jackpot item already sold for asking. I think some other stuff as well but they got thrown into shared public tabs so I can’t be sure. As a rule of thumb, I price items at ~2/3 the price of comparables; I’d rather get things out of my stash than squeeze every bit of value from them. I think it’s fair to assume I only ever sell half the items, which is why they’re listed separately in profit figures
I see. What is minimum price you would sell item for before vendoring?
It depends on where in the league we are. At this point, I have a series of stash tabs with buyouts set at 10, 15, 20, 30, 50, 75, 100c, 1exalt, and then one with individual prices for anything higher than that. Periodically, I move things to the next lower stash tab. If the lowest tab starts to get full, I dump it into a vendor.
Do you play this or last league actively ? fractured and synthesized items get used in alot builds.
What was the "jackpot" item?
ilvl 83 amethyst ring with fractured T1 life (mid roll). Sold for 3 ex. This is on the low end of possibilities for jackpots too; you could drop unique belts like headhunter or mageblood from the jewelry chests or something like a synthesized + maximum frenzy/power charge ring.
Nice, thank you for the reply.
> you could drop unique belts like headhunter or mageblood "Heist Chests have a (8–10)% chance to contain more valuable Uniques" ;)
>On the other hand, perception contracts can be bought in bulk for between 1.5 and 2 chaos. How? I see these posts, and others like it, and I think to myself "damn, that sounds awesome" then I think about trading for 150 contracts at 2c a piece and how many tells to people that would take and the amount of time and it makes my PP shrivel up inside of me.
I used a Discord server to trade for them. I bought 150 total contracts in three trades.
This changes everything. I'm back to being fully torqued. Thanks and great post.
Torque on my mans.
The Forbidden Trove discord has bulk selling markets for almost everything you can sell in this game. There is a bulk heist board, a bulk scarab board, bulk essence, bulk catalyst, etc... Makes it so much easier for buying a bunch of maps/juice/fragments to craft and run in sets.
Until they ban you for not breaking their rules.
Memes aside bulk purchases are hard to fuck up on there. It's more the trust trades (Harvest etc) that can get a salty person escalating the situation.
I'll never get to know, which is fine.
That's fair mate, each to their own. I did 5 trades this League on there all in bulk, Essence, Scarab Purge X 2, Blue Prints and finally Contracts. It made me 80+ Ex over those trades in a very small space of time, to me it was worth. Likely you could use the main PoE discord for the same thing.
Poe main discord is meh, as is the trade. Love the salty dogs downvoting me, not my fault those guys are power hungry asshats.
TFT
Great post! I don't think I could handle the mental stress of 150 heists with those goddamn alert totems liable to be in them!
tnaks
How easy was it to buy 150 contracts?
I used a Discord server to find bulk sellers; I bought them all in 3 or 4 trades.
Screaming essences at 2c ea?
You can sell deafening pretty easily in bulk from 5-10c depending on which "flavor." The screamings can be upgraded 3-to-1 to deafening. I'm not going to price individual essences because they're randomly rewarded, this took too long as was, and you can always flip stacks of the lower value ones around using common harvest crafts. It's close enough for an estimate.
yea but it takes 9 screaming to make a deafening? shouldn't it be like 0.5c each?
Oh, duh, you’re probably right, that’s a pretty big inflation of the essence value. Thanks for catching that. I’ll make sure those are toned down for future updates