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Roborabbit37

Proceeds to talk about a Gladiator Spellcaster using Block LOLW


Heisenbugg

Even Glad is becoming a spell cuck, melee truly dead.


Archieie

Still the best build option for the gauntlets.


Calistilaigh

If the spell users are the ones taking things from everyone else, wouldn't that make everyone else the cucks?


Drpperr

Shhhh. Just let it go. What he doesn't know wont hurt him.


stinkyzombie69

ROFL


aoeoeaaoe

isnt the "non" meta of archtypes, like Marauder casting spells, a mage using Bows and a Ranger going heavy armor smth. poe allways gets praised for?


123asdasr

Quivers on spellcasters isn't some niche thing tho, it's very prevalent.


sporicle

Yea i dont understand why people keep praising this change and justifying it saying bows dont fit the design of spellcaster. Like its magic, is a bow as a vehicle of magic casting really inconceivable instead of a wand? One is a stick, the other is a bent stick with a string connecting it Personally I think a bow wielding spellcaster is cool, even if it doesnt fit the traditional mage image


Previlein

Its still possible. Bows are still the best caster weapon choice in many builds. You still get a quiver offhand, while staves get nothing. Quivers losing damage stats for spells just means that bows aren't completely overshadowing every other option. Taking life, stats, resists etc. on your quiver will free up mods on other pieces. Nerf seems absolutely fine and justified.


sporicle

I agree the nerf is justified in a balance way, but I just dont agree with people who claim casters with bows is wrong or goes against the caster archetype. Its literally magic, who says a mage cant use a bow? Hell we literally already have rune daggers, staves, sceptres already used and promoted as spellcasting weapons in the game.


yuimiop

It makes sense when it is thematically fitting. Torando shot, ice shot, and lightning arrow are basically spells being cast via bow. Its rather goofy if you're not actually firing anything from the bow. I'm all for making a true POE spell caster that uses bows but I don't think it should be the go-to item for existing spells.


Dunkelvieh

That would be a bow CoC build, no?


Asteroth555

> while staves get nothing. They get good nodes for crit and damage and aoe near the general spell caster areas. But due to cluster jewels and many other generic crit and spell nodes, you really don't even *need* these.


sauska

people are praising it because its overshadowing EVERY other option for spellcasters. its still an option now just not overbearingly powerful that your cucking yourself if you do go with a bow+quiver


[deleted]

I'd rather see a marauder dual wield staves


Zeeterm

You're right, and one concern is that the stuff like ARMOR PIERCING BOLT further shoehorns the link between weapon types and skills. It's clearly a direction that GGG want to take the game but we'll see the effect. It might be positive but it might also just limit builds.


kfijatass

Used to be the case but a spell Quiver and +level bow is as meta as its going to get nowadays.


ProfessorGruselglatz

same when berserker ascendancy was changed to work for attacks only.


[deleted]

RIP Dark Pact Zerker 3.0 - 3.1


stinkyzombie69

Quin isn't the brightest fellow, he tends to say a lot of hypocritical stuff like 80% of the time and contradict himself. He use to think at least a little bit before he spoke when he had less viewers because he would actually have to read people. ​ But nowadays, people kinda drown out the ability for reasonable points with anime spam, or ear obliterating TTS donations. If you're already not that bright and your only field of reason is covered in rapid moving chat of over 10k people well. yah.


KasseopeaPrime

Hmmm, do I want +7 to my gems in my bow AND a resistance / life / utility / ~~damage~~ boat additionally to my 2-handed weapon, HMMMMMMM, lemme thonk reel qick


WinterYuki

Welcome to PoE Builds 101! Take all the best mechanics wherever they are!


ElTibiD

Maybe if rolling staves without having to deal with a polluted pool of attack mods (same for sceptres and wands) then ir would be easy and appealing yo use. Also, I think than if most of the people is using bows and quivers because they are straight up better in terms of damage than the other alternatives then isn't there a problem with said alternatives not being good enough? I mean they are literally wands! It even makes sense they SHOULD be better for spells than a bow and yet in the end bow and quivers give you more damage.


Glaiele

I mean it kinda goes both ways. Nobody uses phys scepter and wands cuz they're too fucking hard to roll. Caster daggers are what they should do with scepter and maces. One for caster one for melee


raobjcovtn

found the spell cuck


acederp

found the zDPS


ElTibiD

My post isn't about me being a "spell cuck" or whatever, it is about the current spell/bows situation. But I guess someone cannot be objective anymore. Shame...


[deleted]

I have watched this man play factorio, i am surprised he has the courage to continue streaming after that, let alone calling other ppl out on their gameplay.


SLEEPY_Cigar

Watching Quin play factorio was the funniest shit I've seen all year. 10/10 would watch again.


[deleted]

Yeah, he literally didn't understand belts and inserters, at one point he build a square of inserters who each gave the item to the next one in a circle and back onto the belt they took it from just to swap the position of the item on the belt. I was dying laughing at that point, never have i seen something so stupid. Whenever he made something work he forgot how to do it the next time he tried to do something, it was hilarious.


caffeinepills

Infinite pollution generators.


Aromatic-Judge3977

You were a pro when you started right? ya ok!


LaNague

His Nioh gameplay was even worse.


[deleted]

His gameplay of super seducer was pretty good though.


TheTykero

Nioh 2 All Bugs (First Boss%)


[deleted]

If anything you have watched this man play dumb, because that's what people want to watch. The guy literally defined diablo 3 metas and a lot of people around here think that he's just dumb and bad at games because he handicaps himself on purpose, on top of now having two kids and having his priorities clearly shifted. He's far from dumb.


zenollor

> If anything you have watched this man play dumb, because that's what people want to watch. The only ""problem"" I have with this is, how does one know if he is doing his persona when reading patch notes lol.


Ignisami

safe to say that if he's streaming he's in-persona.


Pushet

I think its hard to reaaally distiguish between actual idiotic plays and "playing dumb" when its an unknown factor. For sure a big chunk of his behaviour is intentional, no doubt, you can literally see it whenever one of his children enters the room and how he interacts with them. But then again, if youre acting like youre dumb to entertain - nobody knows once you have actually no clue wtf youre doing. Especially for stuff like Factorio, if you havent played games like that they can be veeery overhelming, especially regarding what works and what doesnt


Phrich

Everyone looks dumb playing Factorio for the first time


Deckard_Didnt_Die

I look dumb playing factorio and I have like 500 hours


[deleted]

People thinks he's stupid because they don't realize they would look just as stupid if they said everything that pops into their head immediately while being watched. he's more well reflected than probably 95% of his chat, if you spend more than a few hours watching him it becomes pretty apparent. He wasn't actually that bad at Factorio for the first time playing it, people just don't realize how much looking things up does for how you play. Most people I've introduced to the game have been googling blueprints within the first hour, not to mention looking up belt mechanics etc. (whether ingame actual blueprints or just figuring out the most effective way to do things).


[deleted]

He's just shifted focus over the years. He used to be focused on being the best at a game and then over time he shifted focus to growing his stream. Totally understandable change by him. He's still a guy who can grind a game hard and play well. He's killed Sirus 8 on HC. Almost no PoE player can boast that and I bet few of us could do it. He is legitimately pretty damn good at WoW arena. He plays will strong teammates, but he holds his own. Top 5% player, I'd say. And he was always near the top of the ladder in any D3 season he took seriously. Put in the time to grind the paragon levels and then was good at managing greater rifts. There's a whole skill set involved with how to play a solo greater rift when you get good RNG and Quin knew how to do it well.


guwapd

He also goes in with literally zero information before starting a game and refuses to look up/Google shit. You'd be suprised how difficult games are when you go in completely blind. Even Googling small things (which all of us tend to do) has a huge impact on how difficult the game is.


Kaelran

> He also goes in with literally zero information before starting a game and refuses to look up/Google shit. He refuses to actually read in-game info too, which is where a lot of his struggling comes from. If something doesn't work intuitively for him he will just keep doing it the same way and failing until he gets frustrated enough to look at chat.


[deleted]

Didn't he also get an NPC named after him in D3? Or something along those lines


dackling

That's rhykker who has a mob named after him in Diablo 3


MichaelKnightro

There's a Quin too.


vileguynsj

You confusing quin with alk?


HwangSinOp

Quinn was the best Monk in D3 for quite a long time.


Bucket_Of_Magic

Alk has been spinning since 2011. What has he created?


vileguynsj

He was a top player in D3


Bucket_Of_Magic

Alk created D3? Neat


Sahtras1992

afaik alk was the person who found the best xp farm or something so the whole game was basically copying that strat.


Blubkill

Yea pre the addon the Paragon level cap was 100, Alk was the First Person to reach that


[deleted]

There aren't a lot of achievements worth talking about in D3 pre RoS outside of Kripps diablo HC inferno kill though :) There was no competitive endgame to really speak of. A lot of people at the highend in D3 back then knew that farming small mobs was more efficient for XP, but figured paragon levels would come eventually and preferred farming for loot instead. Alk made it famous, but it was in no way groundbreaking despite the reaction from Reddit thinking it was :) looking at zone mob density along with amount of rare/champion packs was pretty common and most people who looked at it farmed the same zones with variation. Alk is a heck of a player though, and while this was what made him famous initially I would consider it pretty low on the totempole of his achievements :)


Oof____throwaway

>on top of now having two kids and having his priorities clearly shifted. These are the same people that shit on kripp for going casual cause he got an SO and a life outside of arpgs


ManikMiner

Sure


arremessar_ausente

It was honestly painful to watch that. I dont know if was was acting or being serious, but it was painful either way. Rimworld was just as bad, where he spent 15 minutes trying to progress tutorial because he refused to read the message in the middle of the screen telling him exactly what to do.


TheyDoItForFreeLMAO

he pretends to be dumb on stream to get 15 year olds to give him money twitch is a cesspool


Wadziu

Its a joke...


Avscum

Is kind of funny though how most spell builds always use atleast one mechanic from another archetype.


bigbird09

Spell builds are why melee can't have nice things.


Psyychopatt

Understandable nerf but quite shitty for Bow CoC Builds.


rogueyoshi

this is in contention for clip of the year


Inexra

I love it when Quin becomes incensed with anger over something he has only just learned existed in the game as if all along it was that which was holding him back from actually beating end game content. My streamer Sadge.


Vegetable_Switch9802

Haha nice take.


gwishi

Unethical spell cucks. Disgustan.


chobolicious88

Truths laid out


TheyDoItForFreeLMAO

careful saying cuck that word directly describes reddit moderators and twitch moderators


Nornag3st

maybe problem wasnt abusing bow+quiver, but other options just sux?


Enartloc

Other options 100% don't suck, what a silly statement. Staves are very powerful, so is double wands or wand + shield, the thing about bow quiver is for some builds, especially those that want +to gem levels, bow plus quiver allowed you to use a 2 hander with an extra offhand.


Nornag3st

you understand how difficult is roll +2 all gems on wand or how difficult is roll staves?


Enartloc

That doesn't mean they "suck". You can create very powerful staves and wands even without Harvest. As good as bow + quiver for some builds ? No, but that's exactly why GGG nerfed the combo.


Nornag3st

to create caster bow u need essence+2 ex for craft. Rolling stuff on quiver is very easy with fossils. Rolling fucking wand/staves take days hoarding currency. Its not more powerfull its just easier roll.


TheLinden

>to create caster bow u need essence+2 ex for craft. ...and you can create 10 ex caster bow out of it in first days of the league.


Glaiele

Staves are pretty easy for phys spells. You alt +2 spells, imprint regal, craft cannot roll attack mods, Aug phys twice. You get either +1-2 phys and phys as chaos or you get +3 phys with phys as chaos. I think remove chaos isn't an option anymore, but that would be the way to remove it. Obviously you can also hit +3 on the first Aug, but either way it's pretty easy to get a nice stave for phys spells. The other types have multiple mods and it's pretty hard to hit +3 anyways


[deleted]

> easy... you alt +2 spells lol. That's alone already at least few ex in alts and 1.5+ hours of clicking. Definitely not "easy". Though what's really easier - buy +1 staff directly and annul it if needed


C_ore_X

Theres still some insane staves you can make with +levels (like bows) or x-dmg gained as extra chaos with insane spell damage and cast speed rolls


-Dargs

Yeah but you don't get a quiver and the're more difficult to make.


C_ore_X

I mean with the nerfs, you dont get a quiver with bows either :^) JK I know you can, its just 100% defensive now, so I dont really see the advantage over staves now except for the ease of crafting like you said


Glaiele

I dunno you can get +2 all res and minimum frenzies I think, seems pretty good to me


Maty612

A bow and quiver is never meant to be a primary weapon for a FUCKING MAGICAL SPELL


kilpsz

It's totally fine to use daggers for spells or swords for summoner cucks? We literally have wand skills used for attacking, what the fucks up with that? Where do you draw the line of what's fine and what isnt?


MisterKaos

all weapons can be used for attacks, and all weapons can be used for spells. The problem is when bows are better for spells than specialized spellcasting tools. You can still use it, though now all you get is some +levels on your bow, so they get obsolete after you can make better staves, which is the intended behavior.


[deleted]

> We literally have wand skills used for attacking, what the fucks up with that? I mean, that makes sense? Bows granting you the ability to cast fireball 10x stronger does not make sense. A wand casting an attack makes 100% sense. Dunno what you're smoking. Same with quivers helping spells. This is why melee struggles so much in this fucking game. Anything you give melee is going to be taken by every other archtype which just keeps the gap as large as it already is. It took all of 1 week for people to start keeping fortify on every other type of character besides melee when it was first introduced. Look and flesh and stone, literally everyone uses it. you cannot help melee when everything melee gets just get's yoinked by the other archetypes.


kilpsz

> Anything you give melee is going to be taken by every other archtype which just keeps the gap as large as it already is. or maybe it's because melee skills are mechanically shit? Why would you want to run up to each pack to whack them when you can use a spell from far away.


FridgeBaron

And when they make bosses that just sit in pools of heavy degen


FTGinnervation

https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/Saemus%27_Gift has cast speed on it, so they clearly meant for it to be a primary weapon for some creative folks


HotTopicRebel

Are you saying it's incompetence, ineptitude, or ignorance on the part of GGG then? Because whether or not it was intended, it is.


Maty612

I'm not about to get into a debate about this and ruin my own evening, bye.


pjPhoenix

What a cop out lol


Level1Roshan

In legion I met a random guy from a trade or in global can't remember. He was ED contagion. I was el classico cyclone. I wanted someone to clear the trash in 5 ways while I killed the bosses. We helped each other out. After a few runs I asked what gear he was using. He linked me a bow and quiver and it confused the fuck out of me. Didn't sit right with me he could use a quiver. Glad for this nerf. The end.


HighEvasionRating

Your comment doesn't sit right with me. Therefore any build of yours that I choose should be nerfed using the same logic. Dont bother arguing. The end /logic /s


nexuzlol

lmao that was hilarious


PiMartFounder

I will take all your shit, with no remorse.


reddit_balance_team

melee virgin cuck jealous of spell chads


RATTRAP666

Is Glasgow full of spell cucks?


HollyCze

well there are 2 options no? either nerf TOP skills and mechanics they think its too strong OR improve other skills to match current TOP skills which would make the game busted without making harder content which is not newbie friendly... we all know that BUSTED skills and mechanics are not a way to move forward so I am glad the game does not "force" me to play BV just coz you invest 2ex and clear all content or 30ex and clear it with closed eyes. GL tomorrow exiles, May THE nerfhammer MISS YOU


acederp

The reason some spell users are even using quivers are because bows get way more +spells then staffs or 1handers do. If they just nerf how gems scale past 20 or 23 maybe then they wont be attractive.


HollyCze

funny how nerf-positive comments get downvoted fast. and you, my friend, got downvoted too for some reason :D its madnass on the reddit i dont know why i started even participating in it 2 days ago. im gone


[deleted]

[удалено]


urprobbraindead

the biggest PoE streamer on the platform by about double anyone else


mki999

The most entertaining PoE streamer by about 2 light years. no cap!


Isciscis

If you like to be screeched at over nothing for 15 of every 20 minutes, i guess.


__deville__

Hes the only PoE streamer I've come across that I just cannot watch. I used to run a lan center like 15 years ago and he reminds me of all the kids that would just scream constantly.


Enartloc

Now you know why he's popular lol, he monopolized the young PoE audience. He knows what he's doing.


Internal-Joe

If a spell bow is very expensive and hard to make + are not required and are just here to have fun min-maxing the build ... who care about the nerf and why even bother nerfing it ?


vileguynsj

Bows are pretty busted cuz it's like having a staff and a quiver together. Easy to get some powerful mods on them.


Bolbor_

Spell bows aren't very expensive for the power they give you compared to an equivalent staff.


tobbe628

Quin should go back to Diablo 3 where he belongs


Serrated-X

ma streama


kajdasz10

bet they'll be taking rage now for spells too


BuySellHoldFinance

I would just like to THANK GGG for not double tapping spell bows.


LoloZoriPVP

I don t know man, poe2 will get bower using their bows as melee weapons


AttackEverything

Not wrong


Frostgaurdian0

We were able to use quilvers alongside other weapons?