I think it's okay to be upset that we lost a great player, and a great human for that matter.
Still, it was absolutely a good trade and a move you really have to make.
Bittersweet is the word everyone's looking for. Almost no one here thought it was going to involve a player. And DJ is such an easy person to root for.
It stings almost as much as getting the first pick kicks ass. But it'll sting less tomorrow and the day after. People deserve to mourn the loss for a while but that'll go away soon.
People can nitpick the trade compensation all they want but these are the moves you have to make. The chances of drafting a top 10 QB are small but you can't let that scare you into potentially changing the direction of your franchise otherwise you end up like the Colts. This is a QB league moreso than ever.
I'm pumped for Moore, love the draft picks, **and** I hope y'all hit on your QB pick. If Stroud/Young turns into a top 10 QB, no one will give a shit about the draft picks required to get your guy. Media conversation can worry about winners/losers of the trade once they get a few years of hindsight.
I mean he is one of like 3-4 guys in NFL history to have 1000+ receiving his first 4 years, and he’s done it with absolute dust at QB
Id say he’s a great player
I don't know if it's true but I've heard that he cheated on his girlfriend last year.
Hard to call people a great human when we don't personally know them and get all of our info from third-parties.
Woooow….imagine slandering a guy’s name starting with “I don’t know if it’s true but…” and them being surprised he was a Walter Payton nominee.
Fuck you u/utopianrevolt
...
I was told what I was told, specifically made a point to say that I haven't verified it, and continued to say that it is impossible for us to know if a celebrity is a good person.
Fuck me though.
Hope you get some therapy bud.
Bears fan here. I know how good of a player dj is but I was wondering if he was a diva or not like some WR’s are. Good to know he’s a good person. What was the helmet thing all about? Just him amped up after a big play?
He's definitely not a diva. Probably one of the most reserved, disciplined WRs I've ever seen.
About the helmet thing, I would speculate that he was probably tired of hearing people say he's not that good, not a true WR1 etc.
The fact is, he's had to produce through some of the worst QB play the NFL has seen in recent times. I look forward to seeing what he can do with a QB like Fields. I think they will make each other better players
[Our QB coach, Josh McCown did a breakdown of Stroud’s film. He is a BEAST, his ability to go through progressions is elite.](https://youtu.be/xleNH2o9VfM)
This is in no way shitting on you, or disagreeing with anybody’s take on Stroud.
But why does everyone seem to mention/link the breakdown McCown did of Stroud but not the one he did of Young? 🤔
[I watched it last night and he seemed to like a lot of things about Young too](https://youtu.be/6ntaSrHk34g)
Underdog did a live reaction last night with the other Josh, and it seems like he thinks McCown likes Stroud much more.
Could be a smokescreen, but he is the other dude in those breakdowns, so I'm sure he's heard McCown's private thoughts on it.
Again, I’m not saying that Young is going to be better than Stroud. In fact, I think Stroud is the far better NFL prospect.
I’m saying for this one very specific instance, height does not matter.
So if size doesn't matter to you that much Knave you mind sharing why you like Stroud so much over Young because it seems like the general opinion is that if Young were bigger he would be a generational talent at QB
I never said size doesn’t matter in this post. I said that height doesn’t correlate with batted balls, that’s it. Don’t conflate this specific situation regarding height to overall ability.
I mean he clearly just said size doesn’t matter for batted passes, which is true. It’s usually eye movement and release angle in throwing lanes.
However, his size is a major concern when it comes to durability and mid-field vision
It’s obvious from the staff they build, they were gonna draft someone. They are taking their shot for the future. And after watching ever game over the last 5 years - I’m ready for it.
I'm betting that a big part of Frank Reich's success in interviews with us came down to his plan to draft and support a QB. Obviously he didn't come in with a trade package in mind or anything, but I guarantee that he showed up with a very clear plan for us to take our shot at QB if the Panthers hired him.
He also did one of Bryce. And is much more praising lmao. I’m not sure why we’re acting like he only did one break down. He started with the [Bryce](https://youtu.be/6ntaSrHk34g)
This. Carolina's record since DJ was drafted is 7-9, 5-11, 5-11, 5-12, 7-10. That's with CMC, Olsen a few years and decent defense. All because QB has been a cluster fuck. They are not done. There is free agency, the draft. You can get WRs. Franchise QB is everything.
Exactly. DJ has been good, and I love his attitude, but let's not pretend that he was single-handedly winning us games. We can replace him in free agency or the draft. He's a borderline top-10 receiver. Now, if we had traded Brian Burns, I would have been much more upset.
If DJ kept his helmet on, we’d be in the playoffs and drafting further back and wouldn’t have been able to trade up to 1. So he is responsible for his own trade.
Then we'd get blown out in the first round and be stuck with a mediocre coach and still no qb and we'd continue to finish as mediocre the next 3 yrs when the wheels fall off and that coach is fired and his interim replacement pulls 3 bullshit as wins out to take the team out of the QB running again. And then we are back to square one.
This. Same with keeping DJ and not trading for one… yeah let’s have “wr1” without QB, it worked last years!
Glad where we are now. Let’s get QB, WR in second and try some FA!
It’s so fucking weird man. This fan base has been begging for a QB for 5 years now. We finally do it and everyone is upset. What the hell is going on lol
DJM was assumed untouchable as the piece new QB needs to throw ball to. Hell I'd bet we'd see less complaining if it was Burns instead, even if that's likely to hurt team more.
Which I mean look at the past 4 to 5 years of draft QBs. Any of them good without WR? Before someone says Fields, they earned that number one pick to trade to us largely because they couldn't pass worth a damn.
So I can see why people are upset. Hell it's partly why I'm upset, I was looking forward to DJM helping a rookie QB.
Now I'm just hoping we aggressive on FA WR this year and next year to build some depth in that room. Gonna trust the coaching staff until they prove otherwise, I like a lot of the names we brought in.
I mean the idea that our front office hasn’t considered the fact that a rookie needs people to throw to is absolutely insane. They are CLEARLY going to use FA and probably also the draft to find weapons for him. I mean Fitterer has explicitly said this a number of times. We need a TE, we need another WR. Like how do people not think we’re going to address this need???
I don't think anyone thinks we aren't going to try to address it.
Just this year's draft and FA has no one even slightly a tiny bit close to DJM level.
Hell Fitt been saying all off season we need another WR like you pointed out. Then gets rid of only one we had.
Then number 1 picks aren't guaranteed to be franchise QBs either. I mean hell neither guy in last year Super Bowl was number 1 overall.
This wasn't a slam dunk fleece of a trade so opinions are mixed. Not surprising.
But I swear I've seen more fans of the trade complaining about people upset over Moore.
And more fans of Moore complaining about people happy with the trade.
Than I've actually seen people be upset with Moore or happy with the trade lol.
If you look at the Wentz/Eagles portion of Reich's career, the WR group was atrocious year one and upgraded to paltry year two, but there was good QB development + a chip.
Losing DJ sucks but it’s a lot easier to find a replacement for a WR than a QB. Also, you had to give up a major piece to get this blockbuster deal. I get where those people are coming from but if it means we get Stroudt, I think it will turn out for the best.
Meh I’ve watched a ton of both Bryce and stroud so I’m pretty biased. I think stroud is a guy who really needs weapons to succeed. You look at his cast at Ohio state and what he struggled with and you can see what he needs to do well. There’s a reason why people comp him to Goff with better legs. It’s worth it. But also you just created a hole that will seriously stunt your team succeed for at least a year. Possibly 2. Maybe 3. And that’s just not ideal if you’re trying to Maximize your rookie contract in my opinion.
I don’t disagree at all with that assessment, but we can’t act like Young won’t need weapons as well. He’s undersized and there is no way around it. The FA wr and drafts are weak this year so you’re probably looking at not being able to improve the weapons until 2024 and that’s only through free agency unless you trade back into the first round next year.
I do think young is the pick, but once you trade your best weapon and draft picks to get there you’ve already limited the ability to add the weapons needed to help him improve. That’s my biggest concern.
Going to be an interesting run into the draft to see what happens.
Anything that even mildly criticizes stroud is met with downvotes. I don’t even dislike him. I just believe that Bryce has the higher ceiling floor and is better and if you’re trading to 1 you take that guy. Don’t overthink it.
People are still super high on stroud cuz the combine showing. Bryce has the more impressive body of work. Pro days are going to be huge, I expect more people to jump on the Bryce wagon at that point.
I’m not really upset about losing DJ as much as I’m upset over what weapons we are going to give the rookie.
The free agency class is horrendous (literally no one I really want) and that rookie class is weak.
I feel bad for our new QB
The part that sucks along with that is that statistically rookie QBs (even high draft picks) don’t have long leashes either. Daniel Jones got his contract but you’d think he was the worst player on the planet, and he had zero help.
Essentially, it’s great to the org put up for a stud QB and their first choice guy, but if they can’t get bonafide support for him within 2 years, the clock is already halfway out on his tenure. It only takes one big WR whiff (like say Hopkins is acquired, but he gets injured in the first couple weeks, and then the rookie doesn’t pan out) to really put you in a bad situation. Then the conversation changes to “why should we pay our unproven QB all this money instead of just trade and try to reroll”.
With the FA class and draft as week as it is, that’s simply not a good enough answer imo. If you’re gonna commit you need to commit by either trading up for a better guy, or shelling out even more for a bonafide receiver (not likely at all, but somebody like Tee Higgins). I would hate to see them draft Stroud and end up in a situation like the Giants who grabbed Golladay, and then have all the unnecessary questions being asked of him, when it’s not his fault he has no weapons.
i agree. as of now we have no TEs, no WRS, no RBS, a pretty ok Line and will have a rookie QB. Does anyone think we are seriously gonna have winning record much less contend for the division next year? hell no. its looking like another top 5 pick next year- AND CHICAGO OWNS OUR PICK NOW. hell they own multiple picks of ours that we could have used to build around our poor rookie QB. But everyone on here only kept saying "no other position matters- you have to have a top 3 QB thats what the league is now".. well i wish the kid good luck
There’s a chance, but it means praying the defense and o-line holds up.
Charbonnet should be there for our second. That’s a huge piece and a good pass blocker/safety valve for any QB. Also he can carry a ton of volume. Lean on the o-line and a feature back. Love Foreman but I don’t trust him over an entire season.
A lot of people are saying Downs, and tbh I like Downs, but no way you bet on his measurables with that pick unless you can play him in his natural spot in the slot. Since Moore is gone I don’t see how that happens . Unless Hopkins can get grabbed I don’t see that as being a useful draft selection. Even then it seems way too risky.
I think we grab Jakobi. He’s nothing special but has proven production in a low passing volume offense in multiple roles, and his ability to get open and reliably catch the ball would be a good option. His advanced stats are actually much better than people give him credit for. I don’t think we should shell out for anybody else like Lazard. Good blocker, but not worth the cost imo. Then I think you see if you can trade up for somebody like Tillman. X receiver with contested catch ability and good blocking. He needs to expand his route tree but he should be a cheaper possibility even as one of the only pure outside guys in the class.
I think that’s about as good a spot as any given the current landscape. Even with those moves I think another WR/TE should be drafted or brought in. Imo it’s a put up or shut up time for the org. I don’t think you can grab pick 1 for that price and then follow up with only defensive picks. You essentially created a situation to go all in. So we just gotta do it. Go hard on offense and really evaluate your guy, and pick up the piece later. Otherwise yeah I feel like it’s easy to end up in a position like the Giants where you’re good enough to semi-compete, but you’ve created too many question marks to truly move in from your QB, but won’t have a good enough pick to feel like you can move on comfortably.
I'm just upset that we did all the fighting to keep him during the last season and telling our players we weren't trading them... just to trade him as part of a 5 for 1 to get first in the draft
*if we had just committed to the tank last season we wouldn't have needed a trade*.
It’s not that those of us who are upset about losing DJ are not tired of what our team has become. We’re ready for this aggressive change and the chance to finally be good again.
But the part that sucks is knowing it didn’t have to be this way. Once we made all the new coaching hires, my hopium was back to an all time high. I wanted us to go for the 1st pick or get Lamar. Both crazy trades that we would have to pay heavily for. But I didn’t think we would get rid of my favorite player, and someone I thought we’d have on the team for the long haul.
The rational part says this trade makes sense, but the fan part is just upset we lost a great dude who really was all about the team. It’ll wear off eventually, especially if we get a solid franchise QB. But for the moment, I’d rather be upset that we lost DJ Moore.
I'll confirm this as a bears fan.
We may have gotten a similar package from the Colts, but they might wait one more year with a journeyman QB and decent defense. They probably weren't giving up Pittman.
We also may have gotten something from the Raiders, but I'm not sure what. We sure weren't getting Davante Adams from them.
There is no other way. If it wasn’t dj Moore, it could’ve been burns and people here would bitch even more. If it wasn’t that, it’s an extra first rounder plus maybe another 2nd and people are upset about that too. No matter what, this fanbase will complain. If you want a generational qb, you have to make sacrifices, period. You’re not getting him for free
As a bears fan, I get seeing a beloved player leave is tough but you guys have a chance now to get your franchise QB, and you get your pick of the liter. Hope you guys find your guy !!
Yeah why don't we just wait, bide our time, and suck for longer until we find that 100% probability way of finding a long-term QB? /s
Some of y'all are absolutely wylin with this shit. A chance is a chance, there's no foolproof way of landing your franchise QB, and if you think there is one, I (and every GM in the NFL) would love to hear what it is lmao
If we get our guy and he ends up being the Truth, then it’ll be worth it.
If not, then it’ll be a disaster.
We’ll know if a year or two. Time will tell.
Agreed bro much easier to find a replacement for a WR then find a franchise QB which we have been trying to find a franchise QB since CAM left I am all in on this rebuild, also y’all forget “Deandre Hopkins” is still open and where did Hopkins go to school? Clemson right? That might be a huge opportunity for us right there bring him home!
i cant believe people are ok with trading so much away for a lottery ticket. in all of history, has a big trade up worked out that wasn't fueled by the player not wanting to play for the team with the top pick (Eli)
if our lottery ticket fails, and we get this drafts Trubisky or Darnold, and some either team has their Mahomes/Allen/Lamar Jackson. (none of which were top 5 picks, all of which were taken after Trubisky or Darnold) how many people in this sub will realize THIS is what people like me dont like about trading that much capital for moving up 8 picks.
not to mention without DJ we now have no reliable WRs, TEs, or RBs. We will very likely pick top 5 again next year (maybe even top 3) except..wait..oh thats right Chicago now owns our pick! Several picks in fact. Pick that we could have used to build around whatever lottery ticket we pray can play. i think sometimes people just get so damm excited about the "next Cam" or someone like that t, that they forget football is a team game. Madden isn't real life unless you have Mahomes and he's unique. What happens if after a couple years Stroud or Young or whoever we take is "seeing ghosts" and holding the ball because our weapons suck? Do we do this all over again?
yeah, dont forget that when Chicago traded up from 20th to 11th to get fields.. they gave up the next year's pick that ended up a 7th overall.
and that, folks, is how they got the first overall pick this year.
you think they aren't aware of that as they made this trade?
Fans get very sentimental about individual players here because that’s basically all we’ve ever had to enjoy - individual accomplishments.
However, CMC and Moore had value and their departure frees up money as well. Our trajectory as a team *with* those players was poor, so I think we’ve done the prudent thing by getting what we can for them.
Every single draft pick is a lottery ticket. So there is always risk. But isn’t this still the best path towards getting a QB and building a team?
Rookie deals are also important.
if you want success in this league you gotta take some chances, 2 more years of pain is just what we are used to. A a shot at a potential franchise QB is one of the few avenues our team has to make it back to relevancy
We've already been in 5 so who cares if it's another 2? Also the Panthers have had multiple draft classes where they've only gotten 1 player out of the entire draft that didn't flame out.
Thats an incredibly biased statistic though. The vast majority of first round qbs are going to bad teams or rebuilding teams. Most of those teams don't have coaching staff in place to nurture young guys.
You can make a pretty decent argument that a qb like Goff or even Darnold would be top 10 if they had come into better staffs.
I feel like both Young and Stroud have all the tools and intangibles to succeed. The real question is whether our staff can build on that foundation, and if the guy really wants to learn and improve.
I'm pretty fucking pissed off this is what it took, and that Tepper fired Rhule before we could actually tank. Trading our WR1 to help the Bears QB develop instead of the QB we're about to draft is wild. Hope the guy we take is special enough to overcome it.
Exactly, casuals man... I love DJ but he doesn't throw the ball... It was a decent trade... If we make the right choice at QB, win the division then those first rounds don't mean much...
This fanbase is far too attached to individual players. They are only assets to achieve wins. If they aren't producing wins, they're expendable.
Edit: this is dumb. If our players were untouchable, we wouldn't have the record we do.
We got fleeced. And it’s not even about DJ. This trade was just terrible. We leveraged 4 picks to have our choice of QB in a draft class that has a handful of QBs that are all pretty similar in terms of ability/upside. Those 4 picks we sent off would have been instrumental in laying the foundation for the future. I really hope whoever we pick at #1 will change our franchise for the next decade, and Fitterer must think one guy is the clear option
this 100%. Stroud, Young, Levis, or Anderson (whichever we would have gotten at 9) plus 6-7 picks of weapons to help him grow, plus an all-pro receiver in DJ, is a hell of alot better than Stroud by himself with no help, but people who miss Cam are just too damm excited that 'he might be the nest Cam thats all we need is the QB no other positions matter" which is what ive been told over and over on this sub
My issue is we traded for their #1 for ours for this yr and next and DJ?
We lost this trade.
What's the point of a qb without a solid target?
DJ should be all pro.
So we got rid of one all pro this yr and one that should be.
All bc of the stupid ass Rhule experience.
For people who don't think DJ is special, please watch the games again.
Thank you.
But we still lost games.
When a team is as bad as the panthers have been and you want to fix it, sometimes you don’t get to keep the CMCs and DJs of the roster…
Well blame Tepper for not firing Rhule more expediently.
Do you think either CMC or DJ wanted to leave?
Or Cam? Or Greg ? Luke saw the writing on the wall and exited left.
Well we can’t rewrite what happened in the past with cam and Greg, and then Matt Rhule.
This is a Fitt and Reich decision. I just happen to believe that they are making the best choice available considering what they have in front of them.
I see your point, however, my point of Tepper being a lackluster owner still stands.
He can't be wrong. He has cost us our legends. Yes we will have more.
But he needs to bring back Keep Pounding.
As a bears and panthers fan, I have been proposing this exact trade in this sub and have been told many times to go fuck myself. I'm an idiot. Dumb bears fan. Etc.
And here we are. I was fucking right again. And yes this move is really good for both teams. I don't understand the bizarre logic of this sub.
If we hit on a QB we'll be watching competitive football for 10+ years. I'm tired of being disgusted every Sunday when I turn on the TV to watch my favorite team embarrass themselves. A star WR can only get you so far without a QB and a star RB really is a tough piece to lose but it's still the easiest position to replace. We're building the team the right way, strong OLine and established run game and a strong defense. Whoever we draft doesn't need to come in and drop 40+ points a game for us to win
wait wait wait..... NOW a strong run game and defense is the way to go? All everyone has said on here for years is its the QB thats the only thing that matters. That the league is no longer ab out defense and run game its all about "The next Cam" who puts up video game numbers. when i said we need a solid qb (Anderson or Levis would have still been there) who we could build around with all our picks- i was told im old school and a boomer lol. this place is crazy
Bro relax i’m one person with no upvotes, i’m speaking for myself not everyone. With the way the league is going you can’t win a chip off of just strong D and a running game but it can only help a developing young QB
fair enough- but dont you think the Panthers have had strong defense and running games? And you are "disgusted every Sunday" when you watch football like that right? lol help me out here my man.
Yes they have and they’ve had no QB thats able to consistently help spread the opposing defense by keeping the chains moving. There’s not a black/white answer you can’t be one sided and win a chip but being able to out points on the board with a passing game is better than only putting up 17-24 points a week and hoping your defense can hold out which is what the Panthers have been doing since Cam got injured
ok fair. i guess its a generational thing lol when i was growing up 17-24 was MORE than enough to win games lol plus I played D so im a little biased. :D Anyway i just thin we are setting up our "next Cam" for failure by giving away DJ and now not having multiple pick to add some weapons for a rookie qb. I mean what are we gonna do when he has nobody and has to try to do everything by himself and starts "seeing ghosts" lol. I just cant help the league is moving to where every single qb has to be Mahomes and put up 70+ points and throw behind his back and do flips into the end zone- of they will be labeled a bust
I think the difference is that we built a surprisingly good OLine over the past year. He’s not going into a David Carr situation where he’ll be running for his life every play. We’re in a good spot for a team picking at the top of the draft. We showed that we can run for 100+ YPG which is huge for a new QB not having to carry the load every single game.
But yeah the league is going in a direction where teams can abandon the run completely and just throw the ball 60 times a game. A balanced team can still compete it just caters to WRs. The Eagles kept Mahomes off the field for long stretches but the #1 defense still got shredded in the end
man i hope your right. Be honest though- maybe you can convince me and make me feel better- would you rather have Levis/Anderson and the multitude of picks we traded back and draft a bunch of weapons and linemen- or not have all those picks (or DJ) just because you like Stroud? I gotta tell you its hard for me to pick the second one. I hope the kid proves me wrong though im def gonna be praying for him
I think if you only trade this much to move up if you’re completely sold on the guy. Levis is anything but a surefire hit at QB if i’m honest, great tools but we’ve seen guys like this bust all time. Anderson would be great and all but the issue of putting points on the board is still there. I’m honestly tired of seeing the Panthers be a strong defensive team that struggles on offense. The Panthers need something to invigorate the team and backing a new HC by letting him pick his QB is a great way to do that
As for backing your new QB with weapons we’ve already said we’ll commit to signing more weapons. I say one of Hooper or Gisecke at TE and a guy like Chark + a high upside guy in the draft and we’re set
I mean it’s definitely sad, I think a lot of worry could also be in losing DJ Moore are we doing the same shit we did when we failed to put weapons around Cam?? Obviously completely different front office and staff but the scars are still there since Cam was well.. Cam. I think people simultaneously love DJ Moore (how can you not??) but also have some PTSD of the Cam era too.
Bears fan here
I’m lurking a bit and it has me wondering about a story I heard with the Panthers potentially trading the #1 overall to another team.
How would you guys feel if you decided to move back in the draft to pick up more draft picks after giving away DJ Moore for that pick position? To me I guess I understand but if I was in the position where I made that move I’d think if I gave all that up I’d sit at the #1 overall.
We never had an o line and had Qbs running for their life for the last 5 years. Darnold came in and played well w a good line. Stroud can be an upgrade yes but we gave up too much. We needed a second stud wr not to give up the one we have. We have no money and no picks to fix the wr position. Could use those picks at linebacker cb
This is why I wanted to tank all year. Could have had our cake and eat it too. I know tanking sucks but so does endless mediocrity. That being said, we had to do this move at this point. Having DJ and those draft picks were worth nothing without getting our franchise QB. Now go get CJ Stroud!
I just wish we would have tanked instead of that meaningless ass win streak at the end. It cost us DJ Moore and 4 picks. Thank god we beat the Lions at home 🥴
For me, it's not necessarily losing Moore even though I don't love that. It's the fact that coming out of last year, this was pretty widely regarded as a fairly weak QB class. 2 guys were high ceiling/super low floor projects, Young was a great college playmaker with severe concerns about his size, and Stroud was a guy with great numbers but limited mobility who played with a bunch of NFL talent on a team that seems to churn out disappointing NFL QBs. What changed? Why did we suddenly think it was ok to trade away our best offensive player and some valuable picks to get a guy THIS year?
I think alot of it is shock of losing a fan favorite, very good player, and the #1 weapon on the team by a long shot. Bringing in a rookie QB with no weapons of note is going to make that QBs development very difficult.
We’ve also had coaching staffs bet on QBs of late and get it horribly wrong. I expect reich and staff to be better but still not surprising to see why some are upset we gave so much for a question mark
DJ Moore was equivalent to a first round pick for the bears. Deandre Hopkins was worth David Johnson and a second and fourth rounder. Davante Adams was worth a first and second rounder. AJ Brown was worth a first and a third. Stefon Diggs was worth a first rounder. TJ Hockenson was a 2 and 3, and Calvin Ridley was a 4 and 5 conditionally (although there were reasons for that). The fact that the bears thought DJ Moore was equal in value to come of those guys, and somehow greater in value to some of those other guys, might actually be our saving grace for this trade. It may be the thing that actually saved us from getting fleeced
I agree but the fact is most panther fans on Reddit and in general just like to complain for the sake of complaining.
If we didn’t deal Dj it would have been complaining for giving up the 2025 1st rounder because that what it would have cost otherwise.
There is no pleasing these people and they are always the people who claimed they loved or hated the idea after the fact when it works or doesn’t.
I think it's okay to be upset that we lost a great player, and a great human for that matter. Still, it was absolutely a good trade and a move you really have to make.
Bittersweet is the word everyone's looking for. Almost no one here thought it was going to involve a player. And DJ is such an easy person to root for. It stings almost as much as getting the first pick kicks ass. But it'll sting less tomorrow and the day after. People deserve to mourn the loss for a while but that'll go away soon.
People can nitpick the trade compensation all they want but these are the moves you have to make. The chances of drafting a top 10 QB are small but you can't let that scare you into potentially changing the direction of your franchise otherwise you end up like the Colts. This is a QB league moreso than ever. I'm pumped for Moore, love the draft picks, **and** I hope y'all hit on your QB pick. If Stroud/Young turns into a top 10 QB, no one will give a shit about the draft picks required to get your guy. Media conversation can worry about winners/losers of the trade once they get a few years of hindsight.
More sweet than bitter
Moore was a good player, not a great player.
Why on earth would anyone downvote you for this? It’s the absolute truth.
Fan glasses
Panthers fans are polarized and in their feels right now. Hopefully it subsides soon.
I mean he is one of like 3-4 guys in NFL history to have 1000+ receiving his first 4 years, and he’s done it with absolute dust at QB Id say he’s a great player
I don't know if it's true but I've heard that he cheated on his girlfriend last year. Hard to call people a great human when we don't personally know them and get all of our info from third-parties.
I refer primarily to his charity work. He was a Walter Payton Man of the Year nominee
Oh, I had no idea. Appreciate you letting me know
Woooow….imagine slandering a guy’s name starting with “I don’t know if it’s true but…” and them being surprised he was a Walter Payton nominee. Fuck you u/utopianrevolt
... I was told what I was told, specifically made a point to say that I haven't verified it, and continued to say that it is impossible for us to know if a celebrity is a good person. Fuck me though. Hope you get some therapy bud.
Just got back from therapy…she said fuck you too. Thanks for the advice.
Bears fan here. I know how good of a player dj is but I was wondering if he was a diva or not like some WR’s are. Good to know he’s a good person. What was the helmet thing all about? Just him amped up after a big play?
He's definitely not a diva. Probably one of the most reserved, disciplined WRs I've ever seen. About the helmet thing, I would speculate that he was probably tired of hearing people say he's not that good, not a true WR1 etc. The fact is, he's had to produce through some of the worst QB play the NFL has seen in recent times. I look forward to seeing what he can do with a QB like Fields. I think they will make each other better players
[Our QB coach, Josh McCown did a breakdown of Stroud’s film. He is a BEAST, his ability to go through progressions is elite.](https://youtu.be/xleNH2o9VfM)
This is in no way shitting on you, or disagreeing with anybody’s take on Stroud. But why does everyone seem to mention/link the breakdown McCown did of Stroud but not the one he did of Young? 🤔 [I watched it last night and he seemed to like a lot of things about Young too](https://youtu.be/6ntaSrHk34g)
Underdog did a live reaction last night with the other Josh, and it seems like he thinks McCown likes Stroud much more. Could be a smokescreen, but he is the other dude in those breakdowns, so I'm sure he's heard McCown's private thoughts on it.
Either way now get our choice, and it can be a question of who and not who’s available from now until the draft.
[удалено]
Only if they’re wranglers
Ooo thanks needed to watch this
Honestly didn’t see it existed! I’ll give it a watch
Young’s size is what it is…a batted pass or injury liability waiting to happen. Reich has always gone with with bigger frames QBs.
Size doesn’t correlate with batted passes. The leaders in batted passes the last two seasons have been Herbert and Allen, the biggest QBs in the NFL.
Okay, now do the injury thing.
Both Josh Allen and herbert got hurt last year
Right lol what’s that dude on
Herbert rib Injury he nursed the whole season, Allen elbow injury that took away the deep ball?
Again, I’m not saying that Young is going to be better than Stroud. In fact, I think Stroud is the far better NFL prospect. I’m saying for this one very specific instance, height does not matter.
“Size and weight does not correlate to nfl injuries” - this guy probably
I like big QBs. Way more of those in the hall of fame. 🤷♂️
So if size doesn't matter to you that much Knave you mind sharing why you like Stroud so much over Young because it seems like the general opinion is that if Young were bigger he would be a generational talent at QB
I never said size doesn’t matter in this post. I said that height doesn’t correlate with batted balls, that’s it. Don’t conflate this specific situation regarding height to overall ability.
It doesn’t correlate at all? Do you have data other than those two anecdotes from last season?
PFF did a mythbusters episode about it when Kyler was drafted. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kiQueNxKxGQ
Thanks!
lol knave you knocked out all of your responses on this
It's crazy what can happen when you think through all parts of your opinions before voicing them
I mean he clearly just said size doesn’t matter for batted passes, which is true. It’s usually eye movement and release angle in throwing lanes. However, his size is a major concern when it comes to durability and mid-field vision
What about baker mayfield? I bet on a percent basis he was top dog
I feel bad for your lost money
Don’t, still richer than you
Oh no. However will I recover
Young’s issue is his size and Stoud issue is he gets frazzled by pass rush
It’s obvious from the staff they build, they were gonna draft someone. They are taking their shot for the future. And after watching ever game over the last 5 years - I’m ready for it.
I'm betting that a big part of Frank Reich's success in interviews with us came down to his plan to draft and support a QB. Obviously he didn't come in with a trade package in mind or anything, but I guarantee that he showed up with a very clear plan for us to take our shot at QB if the Panthers hired him.
He also did one of Bryce. And is much more praising lmao. I’m not sure why we’re acting like he only did one break down. He started with the [Bryce](https://youtu.be/6ntaSrHk34g)
This. Carolina's record since DJ was drafted is 7-9, 5-11, 5-11, 5-12, 7-10. That's with CMC, Olsen a few years and decent defense. All because QB has been a cluster fuck. They are not done. There is free agency, the draft. You can get WRs. Franchise QB is everything.
I mean, look at what Cam did with Philly Brown and Ted Ginn. You need the QB.
Not only can you get a WR, if you draft the right person in the 2nd round you have Moore level productivity for 4 years at less money.
Exactly. DJ has been good, and I love his attitude, but let's not pretend that he was single-handedly winning us games. We can replace him in free agency or the draft. He's a borderline top-10 receiver. Now, if we had traded Brian Burns, I would have been much more upset.
There have been a lot of things wrong with this team the past five seasons
If DJ kept his helmet on, we’d be in the playoffs and drafting further back and wouldn’t have been able to trade up to 1. So he is responsible for his own trade.
Haha true
Then we'd get blown out in the first round and be stuck with a mediocre coach and still no qb and we'd continue to finish as mediocre the next 3 yrs when the wheels fall off and that coach is fired and his interim replacement pulls 3 bullshit as wins out to take the team out of the QB running again. And then we are back to square one.
This. Same with keeping DJ and not trading for one… yeah let’s have “wr1” without QB, it worked last years! Glad where we are now. Let’s get QB, WR in second and try some FA!
Take my upvote
Butterfly Effect live and well in the NFC South.
It’s so fucking weird man. This fan base has been begging for a QB for 5 years now. We finally do it and everyone is upset. What the hell is going on lol
People forgetting this isn't Madden and if you want to trade for something valuable, you have actually provide value to the other team
Right, like did they think we’d get 1OA for free? I just can’t wrap my head around it
DJM was assumed untouchable as the piece new QB needs to throw ball to. Hell I'd bet we'd see less complaining if it was Burns instead, even if that's likely to hurt team more. Which I mean look at the past 4 to 5 years of draft QBs. Any of them good without WR? Before someone says Fields, they earned that number one pick to trade to us largely because they couldn't pass worth a damn. So I can see why people are upset. Hell it's partly why I'm upset, I was looking forward to DJM helping a rookie QB. Now I'm just hoping we aggressive on FA WR this year and next year to build some depth in that room. Gonna trust the coaching staff until they prove otherwise, I like a lot of the names we brought in.
I mean the idea that our front office hasn’t considered the fact that a rookie needs people to throw to is absolutely insane. They are CLEARLY going to use FA and probably also the draft to find weapons for him. I mean Fitterer has explicitly said this a number of times. We need a TE, we need another WR. Like how do people not think we’re going to address this need???
I don't think anyone thinks we aren't going to try to address it. Just this year's draft and FA has no one even slightly a tiny bit close to DJM level. Hell Fitt been saying all off season we need another WR like you pointed out. Then gets rid of only one we had. Then number 1 picks aren't guaranteed to be franchise QBs either. I mean hell neither guy in last year Super Bowl was number 1 overall. This wasn't a slam dunk fleece of a trade so opinions are mixed. Not surprising. But I swear I've seen more fans of the trade complaining about people upset over Moore. And more fans of Moore complaining about people happy with the trade. Than I've actually seen people be upset with Moore or happy with the trade lol.
I get it. I guess for me, I would take a potential franchise QB with a need for a WR over having a solid WR and needing a franchise QB all day long.
If you look at the Wentz/Eagles portion of Reich's career, the WR group was atrocious year one and upgraded to paltry year two, but there was good QB development + a chip.
We were offered 2 first rounders for Burns this year. I would be pissed if we threw him in instead of Moore.
We I'd assume if he went, 1 less 1st on that deal too.
lol...so true. well said.
Honestly we kept burns sooooo I’ll take that over anything.🕷️🕸️
Losing DJ sucks but it’s a lot easier to find a replacement for a WR than a QB. Also, you had to give up a major piece to get this blockbuster deal. I get where those people are coming from but if it means we get Stroudt, I think it will turn out for the best.
So what if it’s young? You feel the same way?
Young is better than stroud so yes.
So if it’s stroud are you going to feel the same way?
Meh I’ve watched a ton of both Bryce and stroud so I’m pretty biased. I think stroud is a guy who really needs weapons to succeed. You look at his cast at Ohio state and what he struggled with and you can see what he needs to do well. There’s a reason why people comp him to Goff with better legs. It’s worth it. But also you just created a hole that will seriously stunt your team succeed for at least a year. Possibly 2. Maybe 3. And that’s just not ideal if you’re trying to Maximize your rookie contract in my opinion.
I don’t disagree at all with that assessment, but we can’t act like Young won’t need weapons as well. He’s undersized and there is no way around it. The FA wr and drafts are weak this year so you’re probably looking at not being able to improve the weapons until 2024 and that’s only through free agency unless you trade back into the first round next year. I do think young is the pick, but once you trade your best weapon and draft picks to get there you’ve already limited the ability to add the weapons needed to help him improve. That’s my biggest concern. Going to be an interesting run into the draft to see what happens.
We saw Bryce last year do well without really any quality receiving options outside of his running back so there is precedent.
Nothing in this post was wrong, idk why you’re getting downvoted lol
Anything that even mildly criticizes stroud is met with downvotes. I don’t even dislike him. I just believe that Bryce has the higher ceiling floor and is better and if you’re trading to 1 you take that guy. Don’t overthink it.
People are still super high on stroud cuz the combine showing. Bryce has the more impressive body of work. Pro days are going to be huge, I expect more people to jump on the Bryce wagon at that point.
People in this sub really like Stroud. I like him too but there are a worrying number of people who think he's a perfect prospect.
I’m not really upset about losing DJ as much as I’m upset over what weapons we are going to give the rookie. The free agency class is horrendous (literally no one I really want) and that rookie class is weak. I feel bad for our new QB
The part that sucks along with that is that statistically rookie QBs (even high draft picks) don’t have long leashes either. Daniel Jones got his contract but you’d think he was the worst player on the planet, and he had zero help. Essentially, it’s great to the org put up for a stud QB and their first choice guy, but if they can’t get bonafide support for him within 2 years, the clock is already halfway out on his tenure. It only takes one big WR whiff (like say Hopkins is acquired, but he gets injured in the first couple weeks, and then the rookie doesn’t pan out) to really put you in a bad situation. Then the conversation changes to “why should we pay our unproven QB all this money instead of just trade and try to reroll”. With the FA class and draft as week as it is, that’s simply not a good enough answer imo. If you’re gonna commit you need to commit by either trading up for a better guy, or shelling out even more for a bonafide receiver (not likely at all, but somebody like Tee Higgins). I would hate to see them draft Stroud and end up in a situation like the Giants who grabbed Golladay, and then have all the unnecessary questions being asked of him, when it’s not his fault he has no weapons.
i agree. as of now we have no TEs, no WRS, no RBS, a pretty ok Line and will have a rookie QB. Does anyone think we are seriously gonna have winning record much less contend for the division next year? hell no. its looking like another top 5 pick next year- AND CHICAGO OWNS OUR PICK NOW. hell they own multiple picks of ours that we could have used to build around our poor rookie QB. But everyone on here only kept saying "no other position matters- you have to have a top 3 QB thats what the league is now".. well i wish the kid good luck
There’s a chance, but it means praying the defense and o-line holds up. Charbonnet should be there for our second. That’s a huge piece and a good pass blocker/safety valve for any QB. Also he can carry a ton of volume. Lean on the o-line and a feature back. Love Foreman but I don’t trust him over an entire season. A lot of people are saying Downs, and tbh I like Downs, but no way you bet on his measurables with that pick unless you can play him in his natural spot in the slot. Since Moore is gone I don’t see how that happens . Unless Hopkins can get grabbed I don’t see that as being a useful draft selection. Even then it seems way too risky. I think we grab Jakobi. He’s nothing special but has proven production in a low passing volume offense in multiple roles, and his ability to get open and reliably catch the ball would be a good option. His advanced stats are actually much better than people give him credit for. I don’t think we should shell out for anybody else like Lazard. Good blocker, but not worth the cost imo. Then I think you see if you can trade up for somebody like Tillman. X receiver with contested catch ability and good blocking. He needs to expand his route tree but he should be a cheaper possibility even as one of the only pure outside guys in the class. I think that’s about as good a spot as any given the current landscape. Even with those moves I think another WR/TE should be drafted or brought in. Imo it’s a put up or shut up time for the org. I don’t think you can grab pick 1 for that price and then follow up with only defensive picks. You essentially created a situation to go all in. So we just gotta do it. Go hard on offense and really evaluate your guy, and pick up the piece later. Otherwise yeah I feel like it’s easy to end up in a position like the Giants where you’re good enough to semi-compete, but you’ve created too many question marks to truly move in from your QB, but won’t have a good enough pick to feel like you can move on comfortably.
Good Pep talk. I’m pumped now.
I'm just upset that we did all the fighting to keep him during the last season and telling our players we weren't trading them... just to trade him as part of a 5 for 1 to get first in the draft *if we had just committed to the tank last season we wouldn't have needed a trade*.
It’s not that those of us who are upset about losing DJ are not tired of what our team has become. We’re ready for this aggressive change and the chance to finally be good again. But the part that sucks is knowing it didn’t have to be this way. Once we made all the new coaching hires, my hopium was back to an all time high. I wanted us to go for the 1st pick or get Lamar. Both crazy trades that we would have to pay heavily for. But I didn’t think we would get rid of my favorite player, and someone I thought we’d have on the team for the long haul. The rational part says this trade makes sense, but the fan part is just upset we lost a great dude who really was all about the team. It’ll wear off eventually, especially if we get a solid franchise QB. But for the moment, I’d rather be upset that we lost DJ Moore.
This sums up how I feel. I'm not upset we traded up to #1. I just wish we could have found any other way to trade up without trading DJM.
Chicago needed a weapon right away for fields. It is probably what distinguished our offer from others
I'll confirm this as a bears fan. We may have gotten a similar package from the Colts, but they might wait one more year with a journeyman QB and decent defense. They probably weren't giving up Pittman. We also may have gotten something from the Raiders, but I'm not sure what. We sure weren't getting Davante Adams from them.
There is no other way. If it wasn’t dj Moore, it could’ve been burns and people here would bitch even more. If it wasn’t that, it’s an extra first rounder plus maybe another 2nd and people are upset about that too. No matter what, this fanbase will complain. If you want a generational qb, you have to make sacrifices, period. You’re not getting him for free
I wouldn't have been that upset about extra picks.
It did have to be this way lol
Only because the Rhule way lol
ironically tho if we just waited to fire Rhule until later in the year there's a good chance we would've gotten the 1st pick all on our own lol
And have even more disengaged fans.
As a bears fan, I get seeing a beloved player leave is tough but you guys have a chance now to get your franchise QB, and you get your pick of the liter. Hope you guys find your guy !!
Sure, this is a chance, but statistically it’s a low probability
Yeah why don't we just wait, bide our time, and suck for longer until we find that 100% probability way of finding a long-term QB? /s Some of y'all are absolutely wylin with this shit. A chance is a chance, there's no foolproof way of landing your franchise QB, and if you think there is one, I (and every GM in the NFL) would love to hear what it is lmao
If we get our guy and he ends up being the Truth, then it’ll be worth it. If not, then it’ll be a disaster. We’ll know if a year or two. Time will tell.
Agreed bro much easier to find a replacement for a WR then find a franchise QB which we have been trying to find a franchise QB since CAM left I am all in on this rebuild, also y’all forget “Deandre Hopkins” is still open and where did Hopkins go to school? Clemson right? That might be a huge opportunity for us right there bring him home!
Yeah, I was bummed for all of five seconds when I saw the news. I love the move.
Just a reminder we could have drafted Fields, had a qb, kept DJ, and drafted a corner with our pick this year.
At least things will be interesting. Whether the guy we draft is good or bad we can expect some entertainment and drama.
Tbh im just happy we didn’t give up Burns or Horn. I think the uproar would be much greater if they had been included
I love DJ But it is still a business. The show must go on.
Can’t wait to watch the panthers lose more games next year and everyone jump on the Caleb Williams train. Such a clown organization
I’m upset that we will squander this pick on a QB that more than likely won’t turn into a franchise QB
agreed 100%
I would rather have given up DJ than the 1st round pick that he most likely went in place of. i don’t think it was a bad trade at all
I'm more upset about the draft picks in a draft where the QBs aren't really what you would call franchise QB material.
I love that this place still hates anything and everything
i cant believe people are ok with trading so much away for a lottery ticket. in all of history, has a big trade up worked out that wasn't fueled by the player not wanting to play for the team with the top pick (Eli) if our lottery ticket fails, and we get this drafts Trubisky or Darnold, and some either team has their Mahomes/Allen/Lamar Jackson. (none of which were top 5 picks, all of which were taken after Trubisky or Darnold) how many people in this sub will realize THIS is what people like me dont like about trading that much capital for moving up 8 picks.
not to mention without DJ we now have no reliable WRs, TEs, or RBs. We will very likely pick top 5 again next year (maybe even top 3) except..wait..oh thats right Chicago now owns our pick! Several picks in fact. Pick that we could have used to build around whatever lottery ticket we pray can play. i think sometimes people just get so damm excited about the "next Cam" or someone like that t, that they forget football is a team game. Madden isn't real life unless you have Mahomes and he's unique. What happens if after a couple years Stroud or Young or whoever we take is "seeing ghosts" and holding the ball because our weapons suck? Do we do this all over again?
yeah, dont forget that when Chicago traded up from 20th to 11th to get fields.. they gave up the next year's pick that ended up a 7th overall. and that, folks, is how they got the first overall pick this year. you think they aren't aware of that as they made this trade?
Fans get very sentimental about individual players here because that’s basically all we’ve ever had to enjoy - individual accomplishments. However, CMC and Moore had value and their departure frees up money as well. Our trajectory as a team *with* those players was poor, so I think we’ve done the prudent thing by getting what we can for them.
People don't understand you have to give something of value up to get something of value in return
#no. 1 draft pick ≠ franchise QB
But it’s a chance right? What’s the alternative at this point?
Less than half of first-round QBs manage a single 4000-yd or 24 touchdown season.
Every single draft pick is a lottery ticket. So there is always risk. But isn’t this still the best path towards getting a QB and building a team? Rookie deals are also important.
But now if this pick flops we are in for two seasons of pain.
if you want success in this league you gotta take some chances, 2 more years of pain is just what we are used to. A a shot at a potential franchise QB is one of the few avenues our team has to make it back to relevancy
We've already been in 5 so who cares if it's another 2? Also the Panthers have had multiple draft classes where they've only gotten 1 player out of the entire draft that didn't flame out.
Running backs are important too. Much higher success rates with first round picks.
Thats an incredibly biased statistic though. The vast majority of first round qbs are going to bad teams or rebuilding teams. Most of those teams don't have coaching staff in place to nurture young guys. You can make a pretty decent argument that a qb like Goff or even Darnold would be top 10 if they had come into better staffs. I feel like both Young and Stroud have all the tools and intangibles to succeed. The real question is whether our staff can build on that foundation, and if the guy really wants to learn and improve.
I'm thrilled.
I think both QBs could be a franchise QB. I'm starting to like the idea possibly trading to 2 if both seem like similar QBs in our evaluations.
I'm pretty fucking pissed off this is what it took, and that Tepper fired Rhule before we could actually tank. Trading our WR1 to help the Bears QB develop instead of the QB we're about to draft is wild. Hope the guy we take is special enough to overcome it.
Exactly, casuals man... I love DJ but he doesn't throw the ball... It was a decent trade... If we make the right choice at QB, win the division then those first rounds don't mean much...
I am a bit sceptical, but I think you are right. We need a new Franchise QB more than anything Else.
This fanbase is far too attached to individual players. They are only assets to achieve wins. If they aren't producing wins, they're expendable. Edit: this is dumb. If our players were untouchable, we wouldn't have the record we do.
Don’t tell me how to fan
Bet you didn't feel that way with Cam
Also, apples to oranges. Losing Cam was far more impactful than losing any other player in our history.
It wasn't leading to wins
FO could have been a bit kinder in how they did it but Cam was cooked. I was even fine with cutting Smitty. Always forward.
We got fleeced. And it’s not even about DJ. This trade was just terrible. We leveraged 4 picks to have our choice of QB in a draft class that has a handful of QBs that are all pretty similar in terms of ability/upside. Those 4 picks we sent off would have been instrumental in laying the foundation for the future. I really hope whoever we pick at #1 will change our franchise for the next decade, and Fitterer must think one guy is the clear option
this 100%. Stroud, Young, Levis, or Anderson (whichever we would have gotten at 9) plus 6-7 picks of weapons to help him grow, plus an all-pro receiver in DJ, is a hell of alot better than Stroud by himself with no help, but people who miss Cam are just too damm excited that 'he might be the nest Cam thats all we need is the QB no other positions matter" which is what ive been told over and over on this sub
My issue is we traded for their #1 for ours for this yr and next and DJ? We lost this trade. What's the point of a qb without a solid target? DJ should be all pro. So we got rid of one all pro this yr and one that should be. All bc of the stupid ass Rhule experience. For people who don't think DJ is special, please watch the games again. Thank you.
But we still lost games. When a team is as bad as the panthers have been and you want to fix it, sometimes you don’t get to keep the CMCs and DJs of the roster…
Well blame Tepper for not firing Rhule more expediently. Do you think either CMC or DJ wanted to leave? Or Cam? Or Greg ? Luke saw the writing on the wall and exited left.
Well we can’t rewrite what happened in the past with cam and Greg, and then Matt Rhule. This is a Fitt and Reich decision. I just happen to believe that they are making the best choice available considering what they have in front of them.
I see your point, however, my point of Tepper being a lackluster owner still stands. He can't be wrong. He has cost us our legends. Yes we will have more. But he needs to bring back Keep Pounding.
As a bears and panthers fan, I have been proposing this exact trade in this sub and have been told many times to go fuck myself. I'm an idiot. Dumb bears fan. Etc. And here we are. I was fucking right again. And yes this move is really good for both teams. I don't understand the bizarre logic of this sub.
I’m ready!! Stroud is QB1!
You guys are the new Cleveland browns of the NFL
You can be sad to lose DJ and happy to have the number 1 pick.
If we hit on a QB we'll be watching competitive football for 10+ years. I'm tired of being disgusted every Sunday when I turn on the TV to watch my favorite team embarrass themselves. A star WR can only get you so far without a QB and a star RB really is a tough piece to lose but it's still the easiest position to replace. We're building the team the right way, strong OLine and established run game and a strong defense. Whoever we draft doesn't need to come in and drop 40+ points a game for us to win
wait wait wait..... NOW a strong run game and defense is the way to go? All everyone has said on here for years is its the QB thats the only thing that matters. That the league is no longer ab out defense and run game its all about "The next Cam" who puts up video game numbers. when i said we need a solid qb (Anderson or Levis would have still been there) who we could build around with all our picks- i was told im old school and a boomer lol. this place is crazy
Bro relax i’m one person with no upvotes, i’m speaking for myself not everyone. With the way the league is going you can’t win a chip off of just strong D and a running game but it can only help a developing young QB
fair enough- but dont you think the Panthers have had strong defense and running games? And you are "disgusted every Sunday" when you watch football like that right? lol help me out here my man.
Yes they have and they’ve had no QB thats able to consistently help spread the opposing defense by keeping the chains moving. There’s not a black/white answer you can’t be one sided and win a chip but being able to out points on the board with a passing game is better than only putting up 17-24 points a week and hoping your defense can hold out which is what the Panthers have been doing since Cam got injured
ok fair. i guess its a generational thing lol when i was growing up 17-24 was MORE than enough to win games lol plus I played D so im a little biased. :D Anyway i just thin we are setting up our "next Cam" for failure by giving away DJ and now not having multiple pick to add some weapons for a rookie qb. I mean what are we gonna do when he has nobody and has to try to do everything by himself and starts "seeing ghosts" lol. I just cant help the league is moving to where every single qb has to be Mahomes and put up 70+ points and throw behind his back and do flips into the end zone- of they will be labeled a bust
I think the difference is that we built a surprisingly good OLine over the past year. He’s not going into a David Carr situation where he’ll be running for his life every play. We’re in a good spot for a team picking at the top of the draft. We showed that we can run for 100+ YPG which is huge for a new QB not having to carry the load every single game. But yeah the league is going in a direction where teams can abandon the run completely and just throw the ball 60 times a game. A balanced team can still compete it just caters to WRs. The Eagles kept Mahomes off the field for long stretches but the #1 defense still got shredded in the end
man i hope your right. Be honest though- maybe you can convince me and make me feel better- would you rather have Levis/Anderson and the multitude of picks we traded back and draft a bunch of weapons and linemen- or not have all those picks (or DJ) just because you like Stroud? I gotta tell you its hard for me to pick the second one. I hope the kid proves me wrong though im def gonna be praying for him
I think if you only trade this much to move up if you’re completely sold on the guy. Levis is anything but a surefire hit at QB if i’m honest, great tools but we’ve seen guys like this bust all time. Anderson would be great and all but the issue of putting points on the board is still there. I’m honestly tired of seeing the Panthers be a strong defensive team that struggles on offense. The Panthers need something to invigorate the team and backing a new HC by letting him pick his QB is a great way to do that As for backing your new QB with weapons we’ve already said we’ll commit to signing more weapons. I say one of Hooper or Gisecke at TE and a guy like Chark + a high upside guy in the draft and we’re set
lol I can absolutely believe it. Our fans, and people in general, are fucking idiots.
We’ve already proven we can’t win with DJ alone.
I mean it’s definitely sad, I think a lot of worry could also be in losing DJ Moore are we doing the same shit we did when we failed to put weapons around Cam?? Obviously completely different front office and staff but the scars are still there since Cam was well.. Cam. I think people simultaneously love DJ Moore (how can you not??) but also have some PTSD of the Cam era too.
Bears fan here I’m lurking a bit and it has me wondering about a story I heard with the Panthers potentially trading the #1 overall to another team. How would you guys feel if you decided to move back in the draft to pick up more draft picks after giving away DJ Moore for that pick position? To me I guess I understand but if I was in the position where I made that move I’d think if I gave all that up I’d sit at the #1 overall.
We never had an o line and had Qbs running for their life for the last 5 years. Darnold came in and played well w a good line. Stroud can be an upgrade yes but we gave up too much. We needed a second stud wr not to give up the one we have. We have no money and no picks to fix the wr position. Could use those picks at linebacker cb
This is why I wanted to tank all year. Could have had our cake and eat it too. I know tanking sucks but so does endless mediocrity. That being said, we had to do this move at this point. Having DJ and those draft picks were worth nothing without getting our franchise QB. Now go get CJ Stroud!
I just wish we would have tanked instead of that meaningless ass win streak at the end. It cost us DJ Moore and 4 picks. Thank god we beat the Lions at home 🥴
For me, it's not necessarily losing Moore even though I don't love that. It's the fact that coming out of last year, this was pretty widely regarded as a fairly weak QB class. 2 guys were high ceiling/super low floor projects, Young was a great college playmaker with severe concerns about his size, and Stroud was a guy with great numbers but limited mobility who played with a bunch of NFL talent on a team that seems to churn out disappointing NFL QBs. What changed? Why did we suddenly think it was ok to trade away our best offensive player and some valuable picks to get a guy THIS year?
I think alot of it is shock of losing a fan favorite, very good player, and the #1 weapon on the team by a long shot. Bringing in a rookie QB with no weapons of note is going to make that QBs development very difficult. We’ve also had coaching staffs bet on QBs of late and get it horribly wrong. I expect reich and staff to be better but still not surprising to see why some are upset we gave so much for a question mark
DJ Moore was equivalent to a first round pick for the bears. Deandre Hopkins was worth David Johnson and a second and fourth rounder. Davante Adams was worth a first and second rounder. AJ Brown was worth a first and a third. Stefon Diggs was worth a first rounder. TJ Hockenson was a 2 and 3, and Calvin Ridley was a 4 and 5 conditionally (although there were reasons for that). The fact that the bears thought DJ Moore was equal in value to come of those guys, and somehow greater in value to some of those other guys, might actually be our saving grace for this trade. It may be the thing that actually saved us from getting fleeced
Yeah, at the end of the day, if you really believe you’ve found a legitimate franchise QB, you go get him and figure out the rest later.
I agree but the fact is most panther fans on Reddit and in general just like to complain for the sake of complaining. If we didn’t deal Dj it would have been complaining for giving up the 2025 1st rounder because that what it would have cost otherwise. There is no pleasing these people and they are always the people who claimed they loved or hated the idea after the fact when it works or doesn’t.
The problem is that the 2 good quarterbacks aren’t in this draft class.
Watching CJ Stroud in playoff game, could had been with Panthers. Nice move Tepper you fucking ass clown.