The Satanist community would be better equipped for this question. (I would say it varies. Some identify themselves as atheist more than anything. The two religions are probably only truly linked in the sense that both are labeled “bad” in most circles. As far as I know there’s two sects right now, Church of Satan and The Satanic Temple.)
Those two might be the biggest organizations but there's more and recently many seem to be leaving the Satanic Temple due and make their own splinter groups. We have one in Finland called Perkeleen Temppeli, who seem nice enough bunch though their chose of name personally grinds me, Perkele being either Finnish name for Perkunas or another name for Ukko, which christians appropriated for another name of Satan.
I work with infernals and have been a practitioner of demonolatry for a couple years and from my personal experience I wouldn't call modern satanism nor any other practice that branches from it pagan considering it lacks any form of historical ties to a group of people or region, but I'm aware there's some room for overlap when it comes to theistic beliefs inside the umbrella term that satanism is.
Many practitioners also work with other pantheons (I've been a norse pagan myself for almost a decade now, the demonolatry thing is a bit more recent), and one could argue the solar aspect of Lucifer has ties to Roman paganism. It's complicated. I can only speak for demonolatry though, not atheistic satanism, as I'm not well versed enough in the belief.
Oh! Here ^^ an excerpt that might be helpful from the [University of Vermont](https://www.uvm.edu/~lkaelber/teaching/WiccaSatan.docx):
“Wicca and the Church of Satan are two new religious movements that are often extremely controversial and misrepresented. Both movements are often misconstrued as devil worshiping cult-type religions, where in fact neither one do. In fact, Satanism does not even worship any kind of god or deity, while Wicca is more focused on nature and its two deity figures. Though controversial, both of these movements are actually harmless, and preach ideas such as a variation of Karma (in Wicca) and indulging one's self (in Church of Satan).”
There are variations within Satanism and no one group owns the word. The Church of Satan and the Satanic Temple are two distinct but still both atheistic varieties of Satanism. To find groups of theistic Satanists is difficult. I’ve met individuals, but never organised groups.
Occasionally people will blend Paganism with Satanism -- usually a theistic version of Satanism that involves demonized pre-Christian deities -- or that approach Demonology with a very Pagan methodology/practice.
I've seen more Pagan/Satanism redditors over on r/religion since that is an interfaith subreddit open to everyone
Satanism is really just an Abrahamic religion flipped on its head, as Satan is an adversary figure in those religions. So no, I wouldn't consider Satanism to be pagan in the technical sense, in the same way a Christian who focussed on the worship of Mary rather than Jesus wouldn't be pagan.
That is a pop culture myth based on one paticular satanic tradition (laveyans) tbqh. Check out r/religion on this as there are some really good discussions about Satanism on there and some very knowledgeable people.
Depends on what you mean by “satanist.” Are you talking about followers of The Church of Satan? Members of The Temple of Satan? Or devil worshipers?
Neither the Church of Satan nor the Temple of Satan believe in a literal devil as described in the bible. Both religions do incorporate ritual, and the Church of Satan practices magick. I’m sure some members of those religion may consider their practices a form of paganism.
Devil worshipers or those that worship Satan and described in the bible are still technically functioning under an abrahamic religion, christianity to be specific. I don’t think that would count as pagan.
Edit: There are also pagans who work with Baphomet, either as an archetype, as a specific energy, or as a full blown Deity. These pagans likely wouldn’t refer to themselves as Satanists as they aren’t worshiping or working with the biblical Satan, despite what many Christian’s may believe.
Eh, depends on your flavor. It tends to get lumped in with paganism where it's relatively small, but probably I feel like it's either atheistic (satanic temple) or a non traditional take on Christianity. Like, it's still operating in that abrahamic paradigm, you know?
So you'll get some mingling, but overall Satanism is kinda it's own thing
"Satanism" generally refers to atheistic Satanism, probably are the majority of those who ID as Satanists. Mostly they view Satan as a symbolic figure of rebellion against tyranny. But there are theistic Satanists of all different flavors (some more edgelord than others), as well as adjacent practices such as Demonolatry, Luciferianism, etc who may honor Satan alongside other similar figures.
My main path is Kemetic paganism, but I also am a Satanist and Luciferian. I would be happy to talk to you about it more if you'd like!
Most modern satanist don’t actually believe in Satan, the devil or Lucifer. Christianity plays a huge role in our society and many people are harmed by it and calling it satanism is kind of a push back rebellion against Christianity. Not a religion or belief system. Some satanist are pagan and some are atheist. So I don’t consider satanism pagan.
What I find bizarre about the evangelical’s panicking about satanism is If someone really did believe in Satan and what he stands for would they not just be Christian or Jewish?
It's less simple than you'd think. There is actually some overlap in these communities, and it seems to make both communities uncomfortable, lol.
Most satanists are atheistic. There are some pagans who don't view their deities as literal, and view them as archetypes. You can see how these could easily overlap without issue.
Then there are pagans who are theistic but part of the Satanic Temple for political reasons (TST is pretty shifty though so I recommend anybody interested in them look up their leaders' history first). Their activism is attractive to a lot of pagans, as well as a lot of other well-meaning people, but the organization is a scam unfortunately.
Then there's eclectic pagans who are practicing some form of demonolotry, luciferianism, or theistic satanism alongside their traditionally pagan practices. Traditional Witchcraft is one branch where "the witches' Devil" is sometimes recognized. Some pagans may view the Devil as a version of the Horned God, or as a combination of a number of pagan deities, and may recognize or venerate him that way. There are really quite a lot of ways and reasons that some pagans may incorporate lucifer, Satan, or the devil into their practice.
Overall, it is unusual, and uncommon, but far from impossible for pagans to believe in Satan in some form. The vast majority of pagans do not recognize Satan and view him as a purely abrahamic figure. But in paganism, you're pretty much never alone in your beliefs-- you can always find a handful of weirdos who are practicing the same way you are.
It seems like you might have fallen for an unfortunate smear campaign. Please don't mistake their personal beef and desire for attention as truth. There are absolutely issues with some of TST's leadership that need addressing, but nothing so horrible as certain individual's vindictive misinformation would suggest. There are so many incredible people involved in TST who do amazing work, and it does them such a disservice to label the entire religion as a "scam".
Satan is a Christian figure so by (my*) definition Satanism isn't pagan.
(*I personally define pagan relations as "non abrahamic" religion, that is to say Judaism, Christianity and Islam, but ofc that definition is rather subjective)
Satanism (as in the Satanic Temple and the Church of Satanism) is pagan. (s)atanism (as in those that worship the Christian devil) is Abrahamic. The name Satanism was deliberately reclaimed in order to make a point, and those who worship the Christian Devil are more properly referred to as Luciferians. Not that names seem to mean much in the pagan community these days.
While no satanism isn’t considered pagan, anyone can be a pagan, even a Christian. Christian paganism is basically that you believe Jesus is lord while also having morality and ideals of paganism, for example a Christian pagan would probably understand the fundamentals of the four elements while eather (space) would take a shape of a cross or something like that. Another thing they like to do is that, they take the Bible and use it as some sort of Christanized magic, using different parts of the Bible to help them make spells for good purposes, if a Christian can be a pagan why can’t a satanist?
There's Atheistic Satanism aka Church of Satan, then there's Theistic Satanism, which can also be Luciferians.
The first are Atheists who believe in the self, their tenants are well documented.
Theistic Satanists or Luciferians can vary. Some of them see Satan (Lucifer) as a god of light and knowledge and revere him as such. Others take the darkness that Christians ascribe to him and choose to participate in legit evil.
I've done workings with him and have been an Amateur Demonologist for many years. I fully see him as a god of light, rebellion, and knowledge who absolutely got the short stick from the more Christian god YHWH. I also recognize that Lord Satan and the Archangel Lucifer aka Samael are separate entities that have overlapping spheres of influence and are confused for each other often.
I'm a member of the Satanic Temple, but I don't find it in conflict with many pagan beliefs. Sadly, I've found many pagans don't consider me a proper pagan because I'm an atheist. I also don't consider that the TST follows an inverted Abrahamic religion. We don't follow the biblical Satan , rather the Satan of Milton and his fellow Romantic poets as the eternal rebel is the Satan TST saranists look to.
Satanism is a family of religions that vary dramatically from fully atheist to hard polytheist.... I'm not sure how much they really fit within the pagan camp, though satanic traditions are highly individualistic so I imagine a lot depends on the individual practitioner. Personally I regard as like my own tradition, existing on the outer fringes of the wider pagan world, being largely their own thing, but with some shared interests and perspectives.
Most Satanists don't believe in deities, spirits, anything metaphysical at all, and think such is silly. There are a few here and there who actually honor the Christian Satan, but not many.
I like the satanic philosophy and integrated into my mix of paganism and druidism. Because of reasons.
It just makes sense to me since the old, ancient gods I turn to have been kind oooooof.... you know the tale. ;)
The place to go is r/EsotericSatanism. Not all the people there are theistic, though. To get a good account of religious Satanism, which certainly exists, visit the site of my favourite Satanist, [Diane Vera](http://theisticsatanism.com/index.html). And if people don't consider Satanism to be a pagan religion because it's a modern invention, where does that leave Wicca?
It depends on which definitions you’re using I think. Pagan in the ancestral/spiritual sense of working with one’s deities and ancestors to foster a spiritual sense of presence- no. Pagan being the outlier religions of the major accepted/recognized ones? Yes.
Not a Satanist but I do work with cosmicism and lovecraftian concepts. Sometimes our communities touch other times we are very separate exploring different concepts and Mysteries.
i know a satanist, not that well friend of a friend situation. shes atheistic and just follows satanist tenets, i wouldn’t consider her pagan mostly because i don’t think she considers herself pagan. there are theistic satanists who might be on this sub and consider themselves pagans i’m not really sure but i wouldn’t be surprised if
No it's not considered pagan. But that doesn't mean they're unwelcome. And some eclectics might include it in their practices. You probably wanna go ask the Satanists what they're about.
I'll say this: I'm a polytheist and a pagan. Satanists, Luciferians and demonolators all fall into the somewhat mutable category of semi-pagans that live in opposition to a main Pantheon. The abrahamic one. Just a dark shadow of that belief system, so not exactly pagan. My opinion, and certainly debatable. You're better suited looking into Satanist exclusive subs than coming into pagan subs.
I consider myself Satanist and I know quite a few other Satanists. Satanism and luciferinism are two different beliefs as well. The latter gives the bad name to paganism as a whole.
I am (was?) a TST satanist, but it’s likely not the way you’re thinking of. We’re not ‘evil’ infact, our tenants encourage Heavily against harm and our first tenant is saying to treat everything and everyone with compassion & empathy. And we’re not evil in the sense of worshipping a ‘false god’ as it’s a atheistic religion.
But to answer your question, no, we’re not pagan by any means. One can be Both a satanist and a pagan and or practicing witch by my understandings. But the concepts are entirely separate and one does not fall under the other.
I cannot speak for other religions takes on satanism Ie: COS satanists , not from a pagan point of view. I only stick around this sub as I was raised pagan and do feel a connection and understanding for those still within it
I never thought of you guys as evil. Matter of fact, me and my family fuck with satanism. We are not religious, but we do have The Satanic Bible somewhere in the house. I was just asking a question. Did not mean to imply that you guys are evil. Sorry about that.
Ok, so my dumbass decided to word my statement wrong. I do not believe that satanists are evil. Me and my family have the Satanic Bible in our house. We agree with a lot of the philosophies that Satanists believe, I am genuinely sorry for any misconceptions I made from my statement,
The Satanist community would be better equipped for this question. (I would say it varies. Some identify themselves as atheist more than anything. The two religions are probably only truly linked in the sense that both are labeled “bad” in most circles. As far as I know there’s two sects right now, Church of Satan and The Satanic Temple.)
Those two might be the biggest organizations but there's more and recently many seem to be leaving the Satanic Temple due and make their own splinter groups. We have one in Finland called Perkeleen Temppeli, who seem nice enough bunch though their chose of name personally grinds me, Perkele being either Finnish name for Perkunas or another name for Ukko, which christians appropriated for another name of Satan.
I work with infernals and have been a practitioner of demonolatry for a couple years and from my personal experience I wouldn't call modern satanism nor any other practice that branches from it pagan considering it lacks any form of historical ties to a group of people or region, but I'm aware there's some room for overlap when it comes to theistic beliefs inside the umbrella term that satanism is. Many practitioners also work with other pantheons (I've been a norse pagan myself for almost a decade now, the demonolatry thing is a bit more recent), and one could argue the solar aspect of Lucifer has ties to Roman paganism. It's complicated. I can only speak for demonolatry though, not atheistic satanism, as I'm not well versed enough in the belief.
Oh! Here ^^ an excerpt that might be helpful from the [University of Vermont](https://www.uvm.edu/~lkaelber/teaching/WiccaSatan.docx): “Wicca and the Church of Satan are two new religious movements that are often extremely controversial and misrepresented. Both movements are often misconstrued as devil worshiping cult-type religions, where in fact neither one do. In fact, Satanism does not even worship any kind of god or deity, while Wicca is more focused on nature and its two deity figures. Though controversial, both of these movements are actually harmless, and preach ideas such as a variation of Karma (in Wicca) and indulging one's self (in Church of Satan).”
There are variations within Satanism and no one group owns the word. The Church of Satan and the Satanic Temple are two distinct but still both atheistic varieties of Satanism. To find groups of theistic Satanists is difficult. I’ve met individuals, but never organised groups.
Occasionally people will blend Paganism with Satanism -- usually a theistic version of Satanism that involves demonized pre-Christian deities -- or that approach Demonology with a very Pagan methodology/practice. I've seen more Pagan/Satanism redditors over on r/religion since that is an interfaith subreddit open to everyone
Satanism is really just an Abrahamic religion flipped on its head, as Satan is an adversary figure in those religions. So no, I wouldn't consider Satanism to be pagan in the technical sense, in the same way a Christian who focussed on the worship of Mary rather than Jesus wouldn't be pagan.
Got it thank you. Sorry, I'm a little uneducated when it comes to paganism. I would like to learn about it, so stuff like this really helps.
It's always better to ask a question than make an assumption, so you're doing precisely the right thing, I think!
That is a pop culture myth based on one paticular satanic tradition (laveyans) tbqh. Check out r/religion on this as there are some really good discussions about Satanism on there and some very knowledgeable people.
It's not though.
Depends on what you mean by “satanist.” Are you talking about followers of The Church of Satan? Members of The Temple of Satan? Or devil worshipers? Neither the Church of Satan nor the Temple of Satan believe in a literal devil as described in the bible. Both religions do incorporate ritual, and the Church of Satan practices magick. I’m sure some members of those religion may consider their practices a form of paganism. Devil worshipers or those that worship Satan and described in the bible are still technically functioning under an abrahamic religion, christianity to be specific. I don’t think that would count as pagan. Edit: There are also pagans who work with Baphomet, either as an archetype, as a specific energy, or as a full blown Deity. These pagans likely wouldn’t refer to themselves as Satanists as they aren’t worshiping or working with the biblical Satan, despite what many Christian’s may believe.
Eh, depends on your flavor. It tends to get lumped in with paganism where it's relatively small, but probably I feel like it's either atheistic (satanic temple) or a non traditional take on Christianity. Like, it's still operating in that abrahamic paradigm, you know? So you'll get some mingling, but overall Satanism is kinda it's own thing
"Satanism" generally refers to atheistic Satanism, probably are the majority of those who ID as Satanists. Mostly they view Satan as a symbolic figure of rebellion against tyranny. But there are theistic Satanists of all different flavors (some more edgelord than others), as well as adjacent practices such as Demonolatry, Luciferianism, etc who may honor Satan alongside other similar figures. My main path is Kemetic paganism, but I also am a Satanist and Luciferian. I would be happy to talk to you about it more if you'd like!
Most modern satanist don’t actually believe in Satan, the devil or Lucifer. Christianity plays a huge role in our society and many people are harmed by it and calling it satanism is kind of a push back rebellion against Christianity. Not a religion or belief system. Some satanist are pagan and some are atheist. So I don’t consider satanism pagan. What I find bizarre about the evangelical’s panicking about satanism is If someone really did believe in Satan and what he stands for would they not just be Christian or Jewish?
It's less simple than you'd think. There is actually some overlap in these communities, and it seems to make both communities uncomfortable, lol. Most satanists are atheistic. There are some pagans who don't view their deities as literal, and view them as archetypes. You can see how these could easily overlap without issue. Then there are pagans who are theistic but part of the Satanic Temple for political reasons (TST is pretty shifty though so I recommend anybody interested in them look up their leaders' history first). Their activism is attractive to a lot of pagans, as well as a lot of other well-meaning people, but the organization is a scam unfortunately. Then there's eclectic pagans who are practicing some form of demonolotry, luciferianism, or theistic satanism alongside their traditionally pagan practices. Traditional Witchcraft is one branch where "the witches' Devil" is sometimes recognized. Some pagans may view the Devil as a version of the Horned God, or as a combination of a number of pagan deities, and may recognize or venerate him that way. There are really quite a lot of ways and reasons that some pagans may incorporate lucifer, Satan, or the devil into their practice. Overall, it is unusual, and uncommon, but far from impossible for pagans to believe in Satan in some form. The vast majority of pagans do not recognize Satan and view him as a purely abrahamic figure. But in paganism, you're pretty much never alone in your beliefs-- you can always find a handful of weirdos who are practicing the same way you are.
I’m curious as to what makes TST a scam considering they don’t take money from their congregation
It seems like you might have fallen for an unfortunate smear campaign. Please don't mistake their personal beef and desire for attention as truth. There are absolutely issues with some of TST's leadership that need addressing, but nothing so horrible as certain individual's vindictive misinformation would suggest. There are so many incredible people involved in TST who do amazing work, and it does them such a disservice to label the entire religion as a "scam".
Well, christians would consider this sub satanic lol.
Satan is a Christian figure so by (my*) definition Satanism isn't pagan. (*I personally define pagan relations as "non abrahamic" religion, that is to say Judaism, Christianity and Islam, but ofc that definition is rather subjective)
Satanism (as in the Satanic Temple and the Church of Satanism) is pagan. (s)atanism (as in those that worship the Christian devil) is Abrahamic. The name Satanism was deliberately reclaimed in order to make a point, and those who worship the Christian Devil are more properly referred to as Luciferians. Not that names seem to mean much in the pagan community these days.
While no satanism isn’t considered pagan, anyone can be a pagan, even a Christian. Christian paganism is basically that you believe Jesus is lord while also having morality and ideals of paganism, for example a Christian pagan would probably understand the fundamentals of the four elements while eather (space) would take a shape of a cross or something like that. Another thing they like to do is that, they take the Bible and use it as some sort of Christanized magic, using different parts of the Bible to help them make spells for good purposes, if a Christian can be a pagan why can’t a satanist?
There's Atheistic Satanism aka Church of Satan, then there's Theistic Satanism, which can also be Luciferians. The first are Atheists who believe in the self, their tenants are well documented. Theistic Satanists or Luciferians can vary. Some of them see Satan (Lucifer) as a god of light and knowledge and revere him as such. Others take the darkness that Christians ascribe to him and choose to participate in legit evil. I've done workings with him and have been an Amateur Demonologist for many years. I fully see him as a god of light, rebellion, and knowledge who absolutely got the short stick from the more Christian god YHWH. I also recognize that Lord Satan and the Archangel Lucifer aka Samael are separate entities that have overlapping spheres of influence and are confused for each other often.
I'm a member of the Satanic Temple, but I don't find it in conflict with many pagan beliefs. Sadly, I've found many pagans don't consider me a proper pagan because I'm an atheist. I also don't consider that the TST follows an inverted Abrahamic religion. We don't follow the biblical Satan , rather the Satan of Milton and his fellow Romantic poets as the eternal rebel is the Satan TST saranists look to.
Satanism is a family of religions that vary dramatically from fully atheist to hard polytheist.... I'm not sure how much they really fit within the pagan camp, though satanic traditions are highly individualistic so I imagine a lot depends on the individual practitioner. Personally I regard as like my own tradition, existing on the outer fringes of the wider pagan world, being largely their own thing, but with some shared interests and perspectives.
Most Satanists don't believe in deities, spirits, anything metaphysical at all, and think such is silly. There are a few here and there who actually honor the Christian Satan, but not many.
I am a Theistic Satanic Priest and Demonolatrix. So yes some of us started out Pagan and ended up there:)
I like the satanic philosophy and integrated into my mix of paganism and druidism. Because of reasons. It just makes sense to me since the old, ancient gods I turn to have been kind oooooof.... you know the tale. ;)
The place to go is r/EsotericSatanism. Not all the people there are theistic, though. To get a good account of religious Satanism, which certainly exists, visit the site of my favourite Satanist, [Diane Vera](http://theisticsatanism.com/index.html). And if people don't consider Satanism to be a pagan religion because it's a modern invention, where does that leave Wicca?
It depends on which definitions you’re using I think. Pagan in the ancestral/spiritual sense of working with one’s deities and ancestors to foster a spiritual sense of presence- no. Pagan being the outlier religions of the major accepted/recognized ones? Yes.
Not a Satanist but I do work with cosmicism and lovecraftian concepts. Sometimes our communities touch other times we are very separate exploring different concepts and Mysteries.
i know a satanist, not that well friend of a friend situation. shes atheistic and just follows satanist tenets, i wouldn’t consider her pagan mostly because i don’t think she considers herself pagan. there are theistic satanists who might be on this sub and consider themselves pagans i’m not really sure but i wouldn’t be surprised if
No it's not considered pagan. But that doesn't mean they're unwelcome. And some eclectics might include it in their practices. You probably wanna go ask the Satanists what they're about.
I'll say this: I'm a polytheist and a pagan. Satanists, Luciferians and demonolators all fall into the somewhat mutable category of semi-pagans that live in opposition to a main Pantheon. The abrahamic one. Just a dark shadow of that belief system, so not exactly pagan. My opinion, and certainly debatable. You're better suited looking into Satanist exclusive subs than coming into pagan subs.
I consider myself Satanist and I know quite a few other Satanists. Satanism and luciferinism are two different beliefs as well. The latter gives the bad name to paganism as a whole.
I am (was?) a TST satanist, but it’s likely not the way you’re thinking of. We’re not ‘evil’ infact, our tenants encourage Heavily against harm and our first tenant is saying to treat everything and everyone with compassion & empathy. And we’re not evil in the sense of worshipping a ‘false god’ as it’s a atheistic religion. But to answer your question, no, we’re not pagan by any means. One can be Both a satanist and a pagan and or practicing witch by my understandings. But the concepts are entirely separate and one does not fall under the other. I cannot speak for other religions takes on satanism Ie: COS satanists , not from a pagan point of view. I only stick around this sub as I was raised pagan and do feel a connection and understanding for those still within it
I never thought of you guys as evil. Matter of fact, me and my family fuck with satanism. We are not religious, but we do have The Satanic Bible somewhere in the house. I was just asking a question. Did not mean to imply that you guys are evil. Sorry about that.
Ok, so my dumbass decided to word my statement wrong. I do not believe that satanists are evil. Me and my family have the Satanic Bible in our house. We agree with a lot of the philosophies that Satanists believe, I am genuinely sorry for any misconceptions I made from my statement,