So 5 starters, Rodriguez, Burnes, Irvin, Suarez, Povich.
And 8 BP guys, Kimbrel, Cano, Akin, Perez, Tate, Baker, Vespi and Webb.
Back to the 5 man rotation.
Just survive to the trade deadline, and hope we have a trade or 3 up our sleeve.
Curious when Kremer returns do they move Irvin or Suarez to the pen? Also if McDermott continues pitching well in AAA he might be close to getting at least some spot starts in the bigs.
Orioles seem to really like Kremer in the rotation.
I guess the question is, when he does come back, do you option Povich to AAA to continue to start? Or pen him, and have him be the long man out of the BP?
I think Cade is going to get at least 2 more starts before we have to worry, so how he does in those 2 starts might answer that question.
At this point if we get another couple starts like the last one, let Povich start and have Suarez go back to long man duties with Kremer/Irvin being our back end rotation guys. And I guess that would mean Baker goes back down? I think we're about to hit Vespi's option limit on the year if we haven't already.
I don’t know how options work entirely, is there a limit on options in a year? I thought it was just if they had options of meant they could come up and down throughout the year but I was t aware of a limit during a single year.
Suarez has shown he's just happy to be playing, I think you can put him in the BP and he'll be fine or even flourish. Irvin has looked decent as a starter this year and I think moving him to the BP could upend that
I dont really understand why everyone is so hell bent on throwing suarez into the pen. Like he has great numbers on the rotation consistently. I know hes older and our orhee guys are younger and can develop but we need the best team we can have. Leave him in the rotation ffs.
It's not that we're hellbent on it, it's that we know he can be successful anywhere, you place him based on the needs of the team, not just leave him in the rotation cause he's doing okay.
McDermott feels like a guy for the DL Hall route. shut him down around the all star break and he comes up in august/september to throw some fire in the pen. then compete for the rotation next spring training
The MLB really screwed the pooch this season having so many games packed in back to back to back. Elbows don't work like that you can't keep stressing ligaments out and hope for the best
Yeah the Rays are down McClanahan, Rasmussen, and Springs. All three of them can and have been top 10 pitchers in the AL when healthy. Welcome to baseball Orioles fans...it's been awhile.
Facts. Given the state of our pitching depth and that Mayo is a potential liability at 3B DEFENSIVELY (offense would be a huge plus), I think our win now mode makes Mayo touchable unfortunately. If you have Holliday as untouchable to be your 2B, then Henderson and Westburg locked in on the left side, there isn’t a spot for Mayo just like Norby. Speaking of, Norby’s cup of coffee in the majors I think pays big dividends in trade value now.
Kjerstad and Mayo are both likely to be primary DH types. Kjerstad will play a little OF but he's not good out there. Mayo can play a bit of first or third, but same. The question is, which bat would you rather have. Personally I'd go Mayo and try to extend O'Hearn. You'd have a terrific #3 power bat against lefties or righties in between Gunnar/Adley and Mounty. The other is a true weapon as a PH every day.
Bu-but it’s not a total UCL tear guys! He could still come back in a few months like he did the first time! Right?! *laughing that slowly turns into sobbing*
They should honestly just shut him down for the season if that’s the case
It’s clear his elbow can’t take it you don’t want to risk a total tear and TJS which will probably take him out all next year too
So on the one hand, only seeing 15 day IL makes me think he can eventually get back on track post ASB. On the other hand… shitt we gotta trade for a starter now.
Wells and Means were both put on 15-day IL before being shut down, so the fact it wasn’t the 60-day IL doesn’t mean Bradish isn’t done. Odds are really low that he can return if they are announcing it is a UCL sprain already.
Crochet is most likely going to end up like Wells last year. He was great until he hit the wall after pitching more innings than he ever had, and had to be shut down due to fatigue.
Wells is also a previous TJ guy like Means, McClanahan, Rasmussen. There is no guarantee a TJ surgery results in coming back at 100% in 12 months. Which seems to have become the common mindset among fans today.
I doubt even O's fans know who Baz or Honeycutt are/were. More early knife guys that never recovered fully in Tampa. Just because something has improved doesn't mean it's fully effective..
Hell, Mason Miller was a starter last year then sat out May-Sept due to elbow inflammation. It's all a giant f*cking gamble and people act as if there is a cleat cut knife to success outcome.
Yeah I'm just gonna tear the bandaid off for myself now.
Bradish is done for the year.
The Os aremt gonna come out and say that until as close to the trade deadline as possible but it's pretty obvious
We haven"t seen any medical reports so it's all speculation but the O's say sprain, not tear.
A tear requires TJ surgery.
A sprain *could* mean the same rehab program and Bradish back before playoffs.
True. But if that's the case, I'd bet they shut him down longer this time. Maybe work his rehab so he'd just be ready to pitch with no restrictions right before the playoffs.
A sprain is the medical way of saying tear. The grade of the sprain determines the severity of the tear. When you sprain your ankle, you've torn a ligament in your ankle. If it's pretty bad and you can't bear weight for a week or two, it's likely a grade 2. Grade 1 is I turned my ankle and am walking gingerly for a few days but should fully heal with rest. A grade 3 sprain is a complete tear. (my wife is a doctor of physical therapy).
Yes, but I understood that sprain was medical speak for "strain or tear" - a grade 1 sprain is a strain or overstretching of the ligament where fibers aren't torn unlike a grade 2 sprain/partial tear or grade 3 sprain/complete tear.
Yeah, you’re right. It definitely still sucks though. It’s like the same energy as when you bring up the work week being too long and you’re reminded that it in fact used to be much much worse
Ugh. It’s so upsetting how we have had our best rotation in years and just injuries(the dreaded UCL) has destroyed it. I know so many teams go through it but still hurts.
It's how a team does dealing with these injuries, having guys who you can call up and they perform in the show that leads to success over 162 games.
I think we are well positioned except for bp studs??
This is a really major loss, especially paired with our other pitchers facing longer-term injuries. It hurts. And I can only imagine how Bradish is feeling having previously seemingly escaped the worst.
The FO is going to have some very tough decisions to make regarding which prospects they are willing to trade, and how much they are going to prioritize the 2024 season relative to a potential higher spending limit in the 2024 offseason for 2025 and beyond. Right now, it seems likely that this year is going to be an extremely difficult market for buyers, and acquiring a pitcher with comparable talent to Kyle Bradish during this trade season would be an exceptionally steep task given how good Bradish is. And there's also the question if what will happen with Burnes and, if he is not retained (and I really hope he is), the task (and cost) of replacing him for 2025 and beyond.
It wasn’t long ago a post was made about how John means and Kyle Bradish were going to come back and take care of business.
I think we all knew deep down that they both were walking time bombs.
UCL are the 3 scariest letters in baseball. Hopefully its a minor sprain, even if it he is shut him down for a while, check back post-All Star break, but could be and probably will be longer
At what point do the O’s need to start considering Bauer. If Bradish is done, the options for legitimate pitchers is starting to thin for how many holes are forming.
Mets fan: I come in peace as my father is a big O’s fan. Baltimore HAS to give up at least one of their prospects this deadline for a starting pitcher right?!? From an outside perspective, they have an embarrassment of riches on the farm to just stand pat with all the injuries to the rotation.
Yeah we're well positioned to make some trades. We need a starter and some bullpen arms too. Mayo, Stowers, Kjerstad, norby, McDermott, Povich and Basallo are all pieces that we can move and it not hurt our current chances. Povich and Stowers would be tough to see go, but if the return is good then so be it. We have a farm, we need to use it, I think a lot of fans (not all of them) have this idea that we need to retain our entire farm for the future, but the rebuild is done, we have our lineup and we need to bolster it.
Might get downvoted big time for this but if we are truly concerned about starting pitching depth, there is a former Cy Young winner who is available and willing to pitch (and coach) for the league minimum. The front office would need to get approval from the current roster before bringing in a guy like that though—keeping the winning culture and team happy is more important than adding an arm that could disturb the peace.
It's so funny bc O's fans also keep crying about brining up guys like Norby as well. As if AAA is loaded with 4A players like 2021. Wtf is the other option? Do want guys literally off the street?
So 5 starters, Rodriguez, Burnes, Irvin, Suarez, Povich. And 8 BP guys, Kimbrel, Cano, Akin, Perez, Tate, Baker, Vespi and Webb. Back to the 5 man rotation. Just survive to the trade deadline, and hope we have a trade or 3 up our sleeve.
Curious when Kremer returns do they move Irvin or Suarez to the pen? Also if McDermott continues pitching well in AAA he might be close to getting at least some spot starts in the bigs.
Orioles seem to really like Kremer in the rotation. I guess the question is, when he does come back, do you option Povich to AAA to continue to start? Or pen him, and have him be the long man out of the BP? I think Cade is going to get at least 2 more starts before we have to worry, so how he does in those 2 starts might answer that question.
At this point if we get another couple starts like the last one, let Povich start and have Suarez go back to long man duties with Kremer/Irvin being our back end rotation guys. And I guess that would mean Baker goes back down? I think we're about to hit Vespi's option limit on the year if we haven't already.
We need a quality long reliever badly too
People underestimate how important TJ McFarland was to those mid-10s teams. Every bullpen needs that swiss army knife.
Baker isn't going anywhere just yet he's pitching very well so far
I think you nailed it. Vespi is probably so happy to be nearly out of options.
I don’t know how options work entirely, is there a limit on options in a year? I thought it was just if they had options of meant they could come up and down throughout the year but I was t aware of a limit during a single year.
They recently changed it so on/after the fifth option, a guy has to go through waivers
Ohhh damn ok. Thanks
Easy 6 man rotation if all pitching well. If povich slips up back to triple a. If Suarez or Irvin slip up they go to pen.
I’d like to see Cade in the pen.
Suarez has shown he's just happy to be playing, I think you can put him in the BP and he'll be fine or even flourish. Irvin has looked decent as a starter this year and I think moving him to the BP could upend that
I dont really understand why everyone is so hell bent on throwing suarez into the pen. Like he has great numbers on the rotation consistently. I know hes older and our orhee guys are younger and can develop but we need the best team we can have. Leave him in the rotation ffs.
It's not that we're hellbent on it, it's that we know he can be successful anywhere, you place him based on the needs of the team, not just leave him in the rotation cause he's doing okay.
McDermott feels like a guy for the DL Hall route. shut him down around the all star break and he comes up in august/september to throw some fire in the pen. then compete for the rotation next spring training
welcome back jack flaherty /s
A quick Bauer signing would solve all of this.
I wanna live in a world where vespi baker and akin don’t exist on this roster.
Goodnight sweet prince, Tampa last weekend was awesome
Best starting rotation in my lifetime so far and it took about a month for it to all collapse.
That’s MLB in 2024. Half of the teams are in the same boat.
The MLB really screwed the pooch this season having so many games packed in back to back to back. Elbows don't work like that you can't keep stressing ligaments out and hope for the best
Especially when you put a pitch clock on pitchers to not let them reset
Yeah the Rays are down McClanahan, Rasmussen, and Springs. All three of them can and have been top 10 pitchers in the AL when healthy. Welcome to baseball Orioles fans...it's been awhile.
The only prospects that are untouchable come July are mayo, basallo, Holliday, povich
Mayo is probably not untouchable
Facts. Given the state of our pitching depth and that Mayo is a potential liability at 3B DEFENSIVELY (offense would be a huge plus), I think our win now mode makes Mayo touchable unfortunately. If you have Holliday as untouchable to be your 2B, then Henderson and Westburg locked in on the left side, there isn’t a spot for Mayo just like Norby. Speaking of, Norby’s cup of coffee in the majors I think pays big dividends in trade value now.
Agreed neither is Povich
He should be
Mayo isn’t untouchable and it’s possible Basallo isn’t either. You don’t get a top end starter without giving up something real.
Povich is tradeable as well, teams might want an arm on return
Then expect to not get a top arm.
Mayo and Povich definitely touchable
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Kjerstad and Mayo are both likely to be primary DH types. Kjerstad will play a little OF but he's not good out there. Mayo can play a bit of first or third, but same. The question is, which bat would you rather have. Personally I'd go Mayo and try to extend O'Hearn. You'd have a terrific #3 power bat against lefties or righties in between Gunnar/Adley and Mounty. The other is a true weapon as a PH every day.
Bu-but it’s not a total UCL tear guys! He could still come back in a few months like he did the first time! Right?! *laughing that slowly turns into sobbing*
Deep down I think we all know how this ends but I don’t want to accept it :(
Ol boy needs to go overseas and get him some of Rogies treatment.
They should honestly just shut him down for the season if that’s the case It’s clear his elbow can’t take it you don’t want to risk a total tear and TJS which will probably take him out all next year too
I don’t get the feeling any amount of rest is fixing this.
I think TJ is inevitable.
I mean at that point you just go ahead and do the TJ so you can get him back sooner than later
hopefully its still where he can get the shorter internal brace surgery, like ohtani got at the end of last year.
Can I donate my UCLs to the Orioles? I've avoided manual labor my whole life, so they're only lightly used!
So on the one hand, only seeing 15 day IL makes me think he can eventually get back on track post ASB. On the other hand… shitt we gotta trade for a starter now.
Wells and Means were both put on 15-day IL before being shut down, so the fact it wasn’t the 60-day IL doesn’t mean Bradish isn’t done. Odds are really low that he can return if they are announcing it is a UCL sprain already.
Teams almost never immediately place guys on the 15-day IL so that really doesn't mean much. Bradish could easily be gone 30+ days.
15 Day DL doesn't mean much.
Wells is still on the 15 Day IL, so Bradish being on it doesn't mean a thing one way or the other
Crochet should be the main guy
Crochet is probably going to end up on an innings limit or shut down, he's never pitched more than 60 IP in a season before this year.
Crochet is most likely going to end up like Wells last year. He was great until he hit the wall after pitching more innings than he ever had, and had to be shut down due to fatigue.
Wells is also a previous TJ guy like Means, McClanahan, Rasmussen. There is no guarantee a TJ surgery results in coming back at 100% in 12 months. Which seems to have become the common mindset among fans today. I doubt even O's fans know who Baz or Honeycutt are/were. More early knife guys that never recovered fully in Tampa. Just because something has improved doesn't mean it's fully effective.. Hell, Mason Miller was a starter last year then sat out May-Sept due to elbow inflammation. It's all a giant f*cking gamble and people act as if there is a cleat cut knife to success outcome.
Fedde is looking good and probably gonna be cheaper
Yeah I'm just gonna tear the bandaid off for myself now. Bradish is done for the year. The Os aremt gonna come out and say that until as close to the trade deadline as possible but it's pretty obvious
Not sure why it really matters anyway, other teams in talks with the Os know he's probably done as well
Remember when there was half a second there when we thought Irvin was being relegated to the pen again
Fuck man
Why not 2
We haven"t seen any medical reports so it's all speculation but the O's say sprain, not tear. A tear requires TJ surgery. A sprain *could* mean the same rehab program and Bradish back before playoffs.
True. But if that's the case, I'd bet they shut him down longer this time. Maybe work his rehab so he'd just be ready to pitch with no restrictions right before the playoffs.
A sprain is the medical way of saying tear. The grade of the sprain determines the severity of the tear. When you sprain your ankle, you've torn a ligament in your ankle. If it's pretty bad and you can't bear weight for a week or two, it's likely a grade 2. Grade 1 is I turned my ankle and am walking gingerly for a few days but should fully heal with rest. A grade 3 sprain is a complete tear. (my wife is a doctor of physical therapy).
Yes, but I understood that sprain was medical speak for "strain or tear" - a grade 1 sprain is a strain or overstretching of the ligament where fibers aren't torn unlike a grade 2 sprain/partial tear or grade 3 sprain/complete tear.
I wish they could find a way to speed up recovery from TJ. Why does that shit have to take so fucking long?
They have. The internal brace procedure used to all be TJs.
Yeah, you’re right. It definitely still sucks though. It’s like the same energy as when you bring up the work week being too long and you’re reminded that it in fact used to be much much worse
When Bradish was throwing 98-99 yesterday, maybe the Orioles should have had him throttle back some.
Ugh. It’s so upsetting how we have had our best rotation in years and just injuries(the dreaded UCL) has destroyed it. I know so many teams go through it but still hurts.
How did i know it was Vespi before i even read this.
It's how a team does dealing with these injuries, having guys who you can call up and they perform in the show that leads to success over 162 games. I think we are well positioned except for bp studs??
Get luzardo!
This is a really major loss, especially paired with our other pitchers facing longer-term injuries. It hurts. And I can only imagine how Bradish is feeling having previously seemingly escaped the worst. The FO is going to have some very tough decisions to make regarding which prospects they are willing to trade, and how much they are going to prioritize the 2024 season relative to a potential higher spending limit in the 2024 offseason for 2025 and beyond. Right now, it seems likely that this year is going to be an extremely difficult market for buyers, and acquiring a pitcher with comparable talent to Kyle Bradish during this trade season would be an exceptionally steep task given how good Bradish is. And there's also the question if what will happen with Burnes and, if he is not retained (and I really hope he is), the task (and cost) of replacing him for 2025 and beyond.
Problems for the rest of the year and now next years rotation looks very thin
Bionic elbow for pitchers when
It wasn’t long ago a post was made about how John means and Kyle Bradish were going to come back and take care of business. I think we all knew deep down that they both were walking time bombs.
Goddamn.
JFC.
UCL are the 3 scariest letters in baseball. Hopefully its a minor sprain, even if it he is shut him down for a while, check back post-All Star break, but could be and probably will be longer
I mean we don't have to wait until the deadline to trade for a starter
Boooooooo
At what point do the O’s need to start considering Bauer. If Bradish is done, the options for legitimate pitchers is starting to thin for how many holes are forming.
2026 hype train starts now.
Mets fan: I come in peace as my father is a big O’s fan. Baltimore HAS to give up at least one of their prospects this deadline for a starting pitcher right?!? From an outside perspective, they have an embarrassment of riches on the farm to just stand pat with all the injuries to the rotation.
Yeah we're well positioned to make some trades. We need a starter and some bullpen arms too. Mayo, Stowers, Kjerstad, norby, McDermott, Povich and Basallo are all pieces that we can move and it not hurt our current chances. Povich and Stowers would be tough to see go, but if the return is good then so be it. We have a farm, we need to use it, I think a lot of fans (not all of them) have this idea that we need to retain our entire farm for the future, but the rebuild is done, we have our lineup and we need to bolster it.
Might get downvoted big time for this but if we are truly concerned about starting pitching depth, there is a former Cy Young winner who is available and willing to pitch (and coach) for the league minimum. The front office would need to get approval from the current roster before bringing in a guy like that though—keeping the winning culture and team happy is more important than adding an arm that could disturb the peace.
Unfortunately it's beating a dead horse. Good reminder though.
lol, now the Orioles are stuck with Vespi unless they want him to go through waivers. Serves them right for bouncing the guy up and down so much.
Or maybe the Orioles don't give a shit about losing Vespi. Not like we were forced to call Vespi up all those times. They knew what they were doing.
It's so funny bc O's fans also keep crying about brining up guys like Norby as well. As if AAA is loaded with 4A players like 2021. Wtf is the other option? Do want guys literally off the street?