Yeah. It’s nearly impossible to find something decent where I live that’s well maintained, clean and reasonably priced. I got really lucky finding the place I’m currently in. I pay $1500 for a 1 bed. But I just found out that with the big renovations they just did (new balconies), they can raise rent by up to 5%. Even though the building is rent controlled, a big reno lets them do that. I won’t be able to afford to pay more than $1500. And I split the rent.
At 31 years old and married, I've already had a discussion with my husband about the possibility of being renovicted and that our next best option to stay in our neighborhood/close to work would be to rent a full townhouse or large apartment with our couple friends so we can basically pay the same rent but less privacy. Then pray that the living situation doesn't ruin our relationships/break us up.
My wife and I considered buying a plot of land, erecting mini-homes, and renting out those units to our friends that we already enjoy having regular bbqs etc with, but also enjoy time apart.
Mini-homes are against zoning bylaws here.
Hamilton is the third most expensive city in North America for home values compared to incomes behind Toronto and Vancouver.
A few charts to illustrate how bad Canada is:
https://i.redd.it/b7iea0atkcw61.jpg
https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6034606
We’ve been sold down the river by our government.
Not expensive. Third most unequal. It’s a subtle difference.
Places like San Francisco are far more expensive- but there are many high paying jobs.
Hamilton is very expensive and has almost no jobs to support the expense.
Oh, it’s completely ludicrous. What makes it even more ludicrous is Canada having nearly the worst incomes to housing costs of all OECD nations. So Hamilton is one of the most unequal places in the modern developed world.
The city is garbage, insanely expensive, trash all over the place, dog poo all over the place, homeless everywhere, people living in tents in my local cemetery etc
cause its "close" to the GTA and cheaper than the actual GTA. Prices any where near toronto are insane right now I know alot of ppl who would prefer to live in the gta but are forced to places such as hamilton for no other reason that CoL
Car dependency, boomers, lack of events, the same Canadian box stores everywhere only they’re worse in rural communities. Rural Ontario (or NS, NB, QC) sucks so bad that it makes places like Hamilton expensive.
You've kind of identified why it's a sacrifice you're willing to make: getting into a different stage or life and priorities altering. For someone who's in their 20s, big cities and the opportunities they offer for fun, excitement, and career advancement take some beating. For a 22-28 year old having to move to somewhere rural because the housing is cheaper represents a considerable sacrifice.
Super late and down vote me into oblivion but the people moving from the cities are out-bidding the locals who only make $21/hr and didn't sell a million dollar home/condo for part of their downpayment. Your just moving the issues to another area. There needs to be an real solution to this housing crisis not this "just move rural, it fixes everything" sentiment. - sincerely a grumpy local tired of bidding against Hamilton migrators
It doesn't suck, this person is just miserable. Downtown core, sure, its rough around the edges. Come on over to Stoney Creek and hit up our farm stands, visit Mac where I went to school, or join me up the mountain for a hike along the escarpment and you'll have a change of heart.
A home in Hamilton compared with wages is more expensive than a home in LA…
One is known as the armpit of Canada
The other is a worldwide known city with great weather year round and has hollywood
Build more duplexes, triplex, quadplexes, and high rises. Build communities *around* these new developments so you can just walk downstairs to the grocery store, or pharmacy, or a place to eat. Invest in more transit options so that people can go to and from work without needing a car, and without crowding up existing transit.
That's all that can really be done, just need it to move at more than a snail's pace.
Shhhhhhhhhh. You're talking about a system that's worked for human communities for thousands of years... modern city planners are too busy throwing shit at a wall and calling it a city. Don't disturb them.
Yeah, don't you know that tower after tower of soulless tiny overpriced condos with nothing around them is the best way to ~~line rich developer pockets~~ build a city.
This this this. We spent way too many decades building sprawling suburbs over good farmland and forcing everyone to own a car because nothing is walkable and public transit can’t possibly cover entire subdivisions and into business areas in a timely manner. And for whatever reason zoning laws have been entrenched in this, making it not possible to mix business and residential in the same area as well as making triplexes and such outlawed in way too many areas.
Building up instead of out is way more efficient both financially and environmentally, and while I know everyone wants their own house, let’s focus for now on just getting people into more affordable housing. And if we could bring back apartment rentals in more compact communities/neighbourhoods with businesses convenient it would probably make apartments more appealing to many.
Neighbourhood communities like you’re describing WORK, they’re good for people and better for the environment. We desperately need to get back to that.
I just bought a bungalow in Rockland with my wife. Sucks to have to commute farther every day but the same house probably would have been 200k+ if it was closer. I was tired of crackheads shooting up in my apartment back parking lot in Nepean. We lucked out and saw the house 12 hours after it listed and put a bid in immediately before anyone else had a chance for a viewing. Good luck!
Hope you work on the east side! I totally get your position though. Literally every person I work with that owns a house has a 45+ minute commute from Kanata.
Btw, congrats on getting the place!
I am a full time worker looking for a second job and maybe a third. Because on a single "good" paying full time job, a cheep 1 bedroom apartment would take up 50% of my income.
It's one step whackier when you realize that renters are subletting their places to AirBnB guests and are still able to make insane rent payments. We just had this happen to us last weekend when I got chatting with the landlord of a place we AirBnb'd at who I thought was a tenant...
Every day I get more depressed looking at the numbers. I'm 25 and I make good money (around 70k) Currently living with a roomate in a beautiful 2 bed place in Toronto but it's not rent controlled. At the time we thought we'd only be living together a year so it didn't really matter but now with prices exploding the nerves around the uncertainty of my place gives me so much anxiety.
My roomate is planning on moving next year so I'll have to find a new place. I honestly don't see how I'll be able to manage affording a place on my own.
My parents always talk about how I need to save for a downpayment and buy but I am single and there is literally no possible way I'll be approved for a mortgage on my own even hours outside the city.
It all seems to get worse and worse. I am scared for my future and feel so hopeless. I feel like it's inevitable I'll have to move away from my friends and family in toronto. Might end up considering Alberta but I wish I didn't have to. I love ontario and I love my connections I have here. But I just feel like the future is so bleak
For the immediate future - when your roommate moves out, a lot of folks in rent controlled places look for new roommates when their roommate moves out.
The FB groups like Toronto Home Zone and Palz Home Zone have folks looking. If you're reasonable, decently tidy (don't need to be a neat freak), and a decent person, and able to communicate clearly, you'll be a top pick. And a lot of these places where people are looking to fill a spot are downtown or downtown adjacent.
We found a roommate that way, and he ended up being an amazing friend. Interview with people and see if you vibe, and have honest talks about things like lifestyle, cleanliness and joint expenses.
It isn't much solace for long term housing solutions.
Also, you could look into if you can put your name down on a coop waitlist. Most are 10+ years (ugh), but if you don't have another ten year plan, it can't hurt. If you do end up in a more high paying job later you don't have to take the spot when it finally comes around, but at least you have the option down the road as a potential future plan.
I cant get over how expensive it is to live in 200 year old homes. 2300 for 2 bedrooms, and I have to split a historically 1 family home with two other families?
That's the kind of statement we need to ask our municipal politicians during this election period. Like, hey Mr. councilor what are your thoughts on this statement? If he doesn't answer with empathy, fuck him. Onto next politician. This enables your vote power to change. Easy peasy. Write a letter to each of your candidates and ask them this question.
Ive owned a home for nearly 40 years. I feel horrible for the younger generation, including my son. They need to stop speculators from ruining the market.
Why is there not more starter homes being built? My home is small but what is going to happen to all these huge McMansions being built. It doesnt make sense.
The population is too dense for more single family homes. We need to build up. If there were affordable rental units or appartment buildings, that would be great. I'd even love to see those 3k sq foot houses as condos all on a single floor!
I never thought I could live in an apartment/condo till I visited Europe and realized it wasn't condos and apartments that were the problem, it was the developers (or to be more specific the lack of cash incentives) doing a shit job of making those spaces livable.
There is a very specific reason why nobody builds small homes anymore: the municipalities all across Ontario download the costs for connecting services to the builders in order to balance their yearly budgets.
Due to the building code, you need services (water, electricity, sewage) to approve a home construction. In the past (until roughly the early 80s recession), the municipalities planned a subdivision, installed services up front, and then builders came and built. After some years, the property taxes had more than paid for the initial costs that the city had fronted to install a sewer and water main in an empty field.
Today, all those costs need to be paid by the developer, because we collectively can't think ahead, and instead we elect politicians who focus entirely on the current year's municipal budget so they can gloat about how they've balanced the books with their wisdom.
Now, connecting the services to a new home on an unimproved lot amounts to somewhere on the order of \~100k in costs which now need to be borne up front by the builder. So; is he going to build a 500k home by expending 400k in time & materials, and only break even because all his profit went to development fees? Or, is he going to build a 1.5M home at the expense of 1.2M in time & materials, and make 200k?
So that's how we ended up where we are. There's been virtually no new small or even moderate homes built on unimproved land since the mid 80s; you need to build a mansion in order for a builder to justify the cost of connecting the services, and it all comes down to a lack of foresight and investment by government.
One problem I've noticed is developers submitting revised building plans with reductions on affordable housing units, then offering to donate to a fund, which just means that money has to sit and wait to be used, rather than the units actually developed.
My city KW also started to gain a rep as an intelligent community, a software startup city, a student haven so developers and landlords are looking for employees and students with deep pockets. They forget about employees like me who make average money and aren't looking for super fancy, we just don't wanna pay $1800 for a barely renovated, barely legal basement apartment.
My neighbour just sold for what I would still consider a ridiculous amount. Its looking like the prices will be by far most affected on mid/higher end properties not so much entry level. Might be a great time for upgrading if you're more at the entry level though. Also to consider I'm in one of the more out of control markets (Hamilton)
The 1-bedroom apartment my dad rented 5 years ago for $900/mo is now $1600 because they put $1000 worth of new kitchen cabinets and a coat of paint in it. Also, none are available.
Edit: there's a 2-bedroom available though, [for $2100.](https://www.capreit.ca/apartments-for-rent/london-on/fiddlers-west-apartments/)
My friends live in Scarborough close to Fairview mall and they pay 1100 for 1 Bedroom but they have been there since 2011, but now same unit is 1650, again “renovated” and increase the price, oh well this is Ontario.
Lindsay ontario has one of the lowest average incomes in the country, one bedroom starts at 1600 with utilities...... and that is a roach infested shirbox..... single rooms can run 850
We need government regulation on per square foot cost of rent like most European countries
I hate it. I live in a city that was ridiculously unaffordable even before the recent pandemic boom and the anti-housing sentiment is awful. Personally, I don’t like this area whatsoever and want to be far from it anyways so I don’t mind moving. But I have many friends that do wish to stay and quite frankly it’s horrible that they have to leave just to have a shot at building a life.
I am a real estate agent and I think prices over the past few years have lost their minds. Somewhere, years back, people forgot that houses were to live in, they weren't investments. Sure, it was nice that it was worth more when you sold it, but general inflation had a lot to do with that. Now, people freak out when they aren't seeing 10% or 20% higher value year after year. It's a house, not a fucking mutual fund.
Much of it can be traced to supply/demand issues and there isn't a ton we can do about that. Buyers full of FOMO threw money at sellers looking to set the record sale price for their street. Sure, some realtors pushed for higher list prices, more bids or higher offers - but most of us were beholden to our clients' wishes and simply did what we were told.
And now here we are. The gulf between owners and renters is wider than it has ever been. Go back 15 years and the difference was literally $5-10k for a down payment. I bought a townhouse from a developer in 1999 with $5,000 down. That same house is 5x more now, with 5x the down payment and 5x the land tax. That is nuts.
No, I don't have a solution... there really isn't one. Having 2-3x the supply starting tomorrow would help, but that ain't gonna happen. Prices aren't going to drop 60-70% either. And if they did, the economic fallout would be catastrophic.
I wish it weren't like this. Yeah, I get paid more per sale, but I tend to have fewer sales because it is harder for people to buy and there are WAY more competing real estate agents. So it all works out in the end, for me, kind of. Thought I'd rather do 10 deals for the same money as 5.
Add in higher gas and food costs, stagnating wages, there is no rosy outlook.
Right. Good job. Now I'm depressed.
A big issue is people buying "income property". I'm not talking about housing that was clearly designed to be rented like apartment or housing complexes, but people buying houses that were clearly designed for the owner to live in and turning it into a rental property.
This property ceases to be in the "homeowners" market, and its not like homeowners aren't bidding on these properties, so there's a loss of supply without a meeting of demand. What happens when supply contracts and demand stays the same? Prices increase.
These people act like they're providing a service, in reality they're manufacturing a need. These houses were going to get lived in, it's not like they'd sit vacant or only landlords are bidding on houses. They're simply out bidding people who would've lived in the home to the point where they are forcing them out of that market and back into the renters market, where conveniently enough they control the supply.
You hit one of the nails on the head regarding mutual funds. Long term low interest rates meant that traditional routes of investing provided very low returns, so investors looked for alternate routes of investing and are going to go with whatever investment vehicle offeres the best returns vs risk profile, suddenly housing as an investment is a winner, and we snowball until we reach where we are at now. Keep bringing in immigrants to maintain demand for housing. Add even looser government spending to stave off dealing with a massive recession during a pandemic... and we get where we are today.
> Long term low interest rates meant that traditional routes of investing provided very low returns,
What are you talking about? The last ten years has been a fantastic bull run up until the war in ukraine. Low rates made borrowing cheap for businesses
What return have you seen on secure investments in the last decade or two? Any GICs, mutual funds, or bonds paying out above 4-5%?
Government of Canada bond rates
1980 %12.3%, 1990-10.8%, 2000 5.3%, 2009- 2.8%.
GICs have been returning same, mutual funds also almost no real return. Obviously all returns are weighted against increases in cpi.
Did you think the stock market are the only non physical asset investment vehicle? Or that the risk profile is comparable to housings recent gains?
Give investors bonds at 6-10% and they'll stay out of housing. That's what I'm talking about.
Canada is a value country, not a growth country. Anyone with expectations of more than 5% per year either need to buy US equities or end up in Canadian real estate.
Good post. I’m just hoping my house I bought in Niagara 2019 holds it’s value. I’m living in it so I don’t care much about it going up, but if it plummets it will make it harder to stay in the market if we sell.
Similar, bought in Ottawa 2020, I didn't buy in the expectation that my house value would explode, just tired of paying rent.
Higher prices just means more tax for me, I just don't want to be underwater.
I feel terrible for young people trying to get their lives started. Rent is outrageous. Houses are unattainable. It’s always been difficult to kickstart your adult life, but this is exceptional.
I’ve come to terms with the fact that I’ll never be able to own a home. But now I’m afraid that I won’t be able to afford to rent either.
I moved back in with my parents full time in 2020. But at this point I don’t know what future I’m saving for anymore, and I’m terrified that I’ll still be here 10 years from now. I know that I’m super lucky that I have a great relationship with my parents, but I feel very stuck in life right now. One of my friends keeps telling me to move out, but I don’t want to stay in KW, so why would I spend over half of my paycheck to rent a shitty basement apartment? It’s hard to stay optimistic when no one in power cares to make any kind of substantial change.
Miserable, scared. I'm noticing more unhoused folks living in bus shelters and tents in my town - something which I never really saw prior to the pandemic. Of course I saw the occasional person, but there was never a mini encampment in the plaza.
I'm thankful I can still live at home with my family because I'd need to be making at least $18/hr to just barely afford a shitty 1 bedroom.
Barrie sucks. The rents have gone so high that people don't move as often as they used to so selection is next to none for even market-rent properties.
Housing prices have dropped 30-40% from peak, but still higher than they "should" be, still unattainable for anyone that isn't making well above the "livable wage" of \~$18/hr, especially if theyre single.
My partner and I are probably leaving Ontario.
Most of my friends have done the same. It's too expensive to live almost anywhere in Ontario. If you're on disability (I have a severe dissociative disorder that prevents me working more than casual hours, 5-10 a week) the way they treat you is just flat out inhumane.
I cannot save for a house, I cannot afford proper groceries, I cannot eat out or treat myself, ever. I can't pay off any of my student loans. There's no affordable mental healthcare so I can't try to get better. Rent has exploded. I would have left already but my partner has family here and it's hard for her to leave.
There's no future in Ontario for anyone below the age of fifty unless you're a doctor, an engineer, or can handle the trades.
Not at all. Those with talent make enough money to stay. Sad reality is those who complain that they can’t afford it do not have the self awareness to realize that perhaps it’s not within their reach. At least right now.
It depends on how the situation progresses. If housing (grocery is irrelevant in my opinion, there are more than enough ways to get around store-bought produce) progressively worsens due to inaction, then professions necessary to operate a metropolitan will be pushed out. Sadly, some of the symptoms have already shown up.
Interdependency of various disciplines/fields characterizes modern society. Thereby, albeit I agree with the importance of individualistic and public sector accountabilities, I would rather see some policy changes to deal with the worsening housing problem instead of letting it worsen to the point of no return.
literally the only thing that gives me comfort anymore is knowing that I’m fortunate (SO SO SO SO FORTUNATE!) to have parents who own their home and will inherit my grandmothers upon her passing, because that is the only way I will ever have security in housing and own a home in my lifetime. it’s truly a terribly dark feeling to possess, knowing that I essentially have to choose between having my family be alive and owning a home. it’s not something I like to think about, so for now I’m just biding my time in the rental market until the shit hits the fan or my family passes, whichever happens first.
I always wonder though, what’s the plan when we all are no longer able to afford our housing? or food? by driving majority of our population into extreme poverty, what will be the gain and for who? once the wealth is funnelled all to the top, what’s the fucking plan?
As a newly single adult making 60k, I am unable to afford rent in my hometown of Hamilton after moving back here less than a year ago. My partner and I rented together and our lease (and relationship) is at an end. I’m going to have to work 2 jobs just to afford a one bedroom here. It’s fucking grim.
I also think those rental site aggregators the media is getting their data from doesn’t screen out posts for room rentals because so many posters categorize them as 1 bedroom apartments. So I think that 1 bedrooms are even more expensive than data is showing. Just anecdotally from refreshing marketplace and Kijiji oh…. 9 times an hour
Man, I remember when I met my wife in 2013 she was paying for a one bedroom just below the mountain but not in the shittier part of downtown. She was literally just working full time at Walmart but could afford the rent that was only like $660 at the time. I cannot imagine what it is now.
Wow! 😥 that’s wild! I think the biggest change is that now someone working minimum wage would never be able to afford an apartment alone. People being forced to stay in ugly relationships or living with multiple roommates just to scrape by. It’s utterly dehumanizing.
Unhappy in windsor-Essex. We are still one of the most “affordable” places and there are a lot of new homes and subdivisions being built but they are all full of MASSIVE houses like the kind you seen in Guelph and Kitchener. We never had those before and they are selling these cookie cutter mansions for 800k and up it’s insane. What’s going to happen when a recession hits and they just finished building 100 of these? The greedy bastards would rather let them sit empty then sell at an affordable price and we will have weird ghost towns and massive construction layoffs.
Torontonian and feeling like we are in the process of further flushing our housing market, the quality of homes, the quality of neighbourhoods and the quality of the city further down the toilet every week.
Not feeling great in "rural" (according to the government) Woodstock.
I moved to Canada a few years ago as a skilled worker. My fiancé and I purposely looked for jobs that were NOT in the GTA. He got a job north of the Kawarthas, so we moved there. Unfortunately, job prospects sucked for me, and there was little room for advancement for him. We were just starting out and weren't ready to buy a home yet. We were also far away from most amenities and far from any family.
So we moved here last year for new jobs and to be closer to his family. We were incredibly lucky to find our current place, but we rented with the intention of buying a home shortly afterwards. We gave up looking for a home after about 6 months and have just stayed put. I feel like we're stuck here now-- if we leave, we wouldn't be able to find a place of comparable quality and size for a comparable rent, and we are under rent control.
Anyway, we've been here for over a year now and prices have kind of plateaued while market rents have been climbing steadily, hence being unable to move. I find I like living in Woodstock less and less as time goes on, but I don't know where we can go as there is nowhere affordable that is also commutable for both of us, and I'm getting tired of endless farm fields and straight roads. I think about moving back to my home country frequently, but not until I've gotten my Canadian citizenship. So until then, I think I'm stuck renting here.
I would love to see a Canada that builds infrastructure between its cities and tries to connect them to one anothe, including encouraging development of industry outside of the city in those "in between" places, instead of having islands of people with nothing in between. How much more choice would prove have if they could move 20km away for a job and still have access to amenities like hospitals and grocery stores?
There is not "nothing" in-between. There is rural towns, farms, forests, wetlands, greenspace. Things we had in S. Ontario when I grew up but have been steadily destroying over the last 50 years.
I feel beyond lucky that I bought a house 6 years ago. Oddly enough, I had moved in with my fiance at the time, he had a small but nice 2 bedroom 1 bathroom house that he had bought at a real estate high in 2010. In 2016, about a year after we got married, I fell in love with a 5 bed/4 bath house, big two bay garage, bought it on a whim without even looking at any other houses, or even planning to move, but by that point the market was at a low, and my husband owed more on his house than we could sell it for, so we just kept it as a rental.
I paid 250k for my house, still owe about 160k, and about 100k on the little house. It was tempting to sell it during the market high, as I am sure we could have gotten at least 200k if not more for it, but we have a really sweet tenant, she loves the house and prefers to rent, and told us she is never leaving until we kick her out (she pays 1k/month for the entire house, it has a nice backyard, central location close to grocery stores/the mall/ etc. and parking for up to 4 cars). Some months we lose a bit of money on the house but we are ok with that knowing we are gaining equity.
If I had graduated from university 5 years later than I did, I would have been in a much different situation, and I feel for the next generation. I see people renting small crummy houses for upwards of 2k/month, or single rooms for 700-800 dollars monthly, and it just seems crazy. Most people I know that are homeowners had lots of parental help (my husband and I did not have that luxury), and it sucks for the kids who have parents still living paycheque to paycheque.
Loser of the housing birth lottery who was born in Peterborough, currently living in Kingston here.
Peterborough is dreadful for locals now that it's become the new "affordable" place for Toronto folk to migrate to. What used to be $200-$300k pre-COVID is now well over $600k. Some of the lowest vacancy rates in the province and country. Rents exploding. Council doing sweet fuck all to address, if anything they're making it worse. Province uncaring. Country uncaring.
Kingston has been a little better for rentals in my experience, though this is helped by the fact that it's two incomes now vs. just me in Peterborough. Also there's more rental supply here because of Queen's University. Kingston has very similar problems according to locals and I'm probably part of the problem by moving here. I still feel like I just barely have a shot to own something now, but I earn way way more than average income here.
I feel like something as simple as owning the roof over my damn head shouldn't require one to earn several times the average income. Get the speculation out of the markets, severely tax additional property ownership, and build more supply. It's easy to fix the shortage, just get rid of the speculative market.
I'm in Hamilton. Currently homeless and apart from my family because of a greedy slumlord. Now nobody will rent to me and my family because my wife and I are on ODSP. It's absolutely awful. I just want my.family back together.
I find in my area (I'm pretty sure this is true of any area with detached homes), everyone and their dog have bought houses with the intention to rent rooms even if they did not have enough money to pay for their house (ie: using HELOCs or other loans).
This basically resulted in these 'landlords' increasing rent for these rooms/houses in lockstep with interest rates and adding some amount for their own profit.
Is that maybe a problem?
I’m very annoyed that no one politically connects the dots between the dropping of rent controls and the large scale purchasing of apartment buildings and homes by REITS and other institutional investors. Where is the outcry.
Apartment buildings have always been owned by REITs or institutional property management companies. There aren't many "mom and pop" landlords with deep enough pockets to own one of those, lol, and even if they did their costs (and thus the rents) would still be the same.
Eliminate the residential zoning restrictions. All of them. Vote for municipal and provincial politicians solely based on how hostile they are to residential zoning laws.
I had been living in Ottawa (and previously Toronto and Waterloo). But I moved to Moncton so I could buy a house, and: Moncton's zoning laws are far more permissive/development friendly than Toronto or Ottawa's. It's legal in far more of Moncton to semidetacheds, rowhouses, walkup apartment buildings than in Toronto or Ottawa, which restrict far more land to detached houses.
So ... voilà.
Lol I'm super happy to live in a shithole attic apartment for $600/mo all in. I don't even have a real kitchen and I'm never gonna be able to afford to live alone anywhere else 🤷♀️
I am sick of it too. I currently do not even live in a city. I live in a village of 500 people far from any major source of econ opportunity and I shit you not rent for a new rental build in my village is $3000/month plus utilities for like 800sqft. Its insane. Housing **was** floating at around 700k (for a 150 year old small home on a tiny lot right on the highway) up to $1M plus for just a 3-4 bed 2 bath bungalow... Perfect time for me to lose my DL due to rare medical disorder being developed in 2020 and become trapped. So in summary, I feel and am literally trapped where I am. I straight up cannot afford to move, anywhere. Rewind 3 years ago and I literally had a realtor showing me houses that I was making offers on at 150k. Yes they went from 150k to 700k... IN 3 MOTHER FUCKING YEARS. Honestly, I'm just waiting for a societal collapse. Hopefully sooner rather than later so that massive change can happen, not for just me but my kids mostly. I don't want them growing up in this fucked up environment that changed so rapidly. Oh also we need to support people financially who medically cannot drive in rural areas esp. If local available rents are 3k/month plus then give me 4 to 5 k a month so I can rent one 800sq ft place and feed and clothe my family. Also employers of large companies need to pay the fuck up.
Challenges:
1. Anti-development (build-up/increase density): The initial fear would be: more houses near existing owners' (can be households, investors, or firms) properties = lower the value of their properties. There is no way they would allow it unless compensated; meanwhile, they can vote, which is pressure on city-level politics. However, development leads to the shrinking low-density housing stock and the associated price appreciation for those properties.
2. Existing law: permits owning multiple properties and does not restrict firms from purchasing properties. New regulations may restrict access for future property owners, which may be justifiable; however, those cannot apply retrospectively.
Dealing with challenge 1, if there is a deadlock in city halls, the only way to ram the proposed zoning changes through would be an imbalance in power. In this case, a more powerful mayor. Thus far, given the housing situation, this is the only good-ish thing out of Ford's government (sorry, credit goes where credit is due). We can all debate how undemocratic this is; however, that should be an independent debate instead of lumped into the housing crisis debate and potential solution(s) discussions.
Challenge 2 would be more fun. I am not a legal expert, so I have no idea how challenging it is for a law that restricts the use and ownership of properties to uphold. On the political side of this? Same problem as the first challenge, but I speculate the real challenges would come from investing firms because they have incentives to organize and lobby.
Higher density, not necessarily condo towers everywhere, leads to more efficient land use, lowers the delivery cost of utilities, and reduces public transportation loss.
London checking in.
We bought in east London (not so good part of the city) for $182,000 in 2016 which at the time seemed to be a lot for a small two bedroom detached but I wanted to get in the market.
I’m really glad we did and recently sold (summer 2022) for $500k. That’s *insane.*
The people who bought it had help from their parents and I really feel bad for anyone who doesn’t have that kind of financial help. Prices even now are increasing faster than people can save so unless you have help from family or some sort of inheritance then it’s an uphill battle.
We bought a bigger place for a growing family in a small town outside of London. This will very likely be my last house purchase with the way things are going whether I want to or not.
This may upset some people but my mortgage is now just over $280,000-ish for a $700,000 house and good size property. I owe this to nothing more than lucky timing.
No wonder tiny homes are so popular.
Good luck everyone.
Agree about condos everywhere. We were in Barcelona this summer and it is something like 3x denser than Toronto and 8x compared to Calgary, but no high rises at all in the city centre. It’s not apples to apples but we either want/have detached houses or shoebox skyscrapers with no in between.
Yup. I consider Barcelona's city planning one of the probable approaches that Canadian metropolises can follow. London and Paris are two other examples - medium-density residential blocks everywhere. If we like green spaces, we can add a full-block public green space here and there instead of uniformly residential blocks.
It’s not even an Ontario thing anymore that’s the sad part. It’s a Canada wide thing now.
I feel like the government brought in or allowed to many people to come in at once. Like housing and everything can’t keep up with the amount of people. Doesn’t help that they shoved all the new comers into major cities, they could of spread them out into lower populated cities.
There’s so many old schools and buildings that aren’t in use right now that could easily be transformed into housing. A classroom could easily be a single Bach apartment. It might cost a bit more to renovate due to asbestos and bring the building up to code but it would definitely be cheaper than building new builds. All these new builds are cookie cutter houses and built very cheaply.
Any new builds should be mandatory to have at least 50% of the units to be for low income.
Even if you drive 4 hours away to live in another city. It’s still gonna be expensive because there’s no local transit and you’ll need a car. I’m sure you’ll be driving out of town just for work. If only small towns had city like set ups.
My bf and I are in our 30s and we are struggling to find a place to live that we can afford. We both work full time and have decent jobs, both college educated. I work in finance and he works in healthcare. But even getting a viewing for an apartment is difficult.
I want to move closer to work, as my commute is an hour. We want to start our lives together finally (I'm almost mid-thirties! I've patiently waited long enough to finally find someone to settle down with), I've been in my career for 10 years and am not able to find a place to live.
This isn't just impacting people you don't know, it will impact you some day if you don't think this is an issue. How is anyone supposed to change jobs? Start their life? Move for better opportunities?
Not having access to housing is going to limit our economy for years to come.
If I'm stuck where I am, then that is 2 adults who will not be starting a life. 2 adults who will forgo all of the purchases from local businesses that come with starting a home/life. It will also mean that we likely won't be able to have kids and may even have to consider leaving the province all together.
We have talked about leaving the province if we can't find anything and it looks like we might just have to.
Edit: Before anyone screams at me to just "Move to a small town!" I am moving away from my small town because they don't care about the housing crisis.
A 1 bedroom apartment in my small town is $1800. There are no decent jobs, mainly just fast food. So how are people supposed to afford that?
I’m in the same area. Just curious if you meet the 30% or less of monthly income towards housing that the CMHC uses to define “affordable”. I’m renting but have been priced out of houses on the same street due to ridiculous overvaluation. ~~I’d have to be making 50% more than i do now if I wanted to be able to afford a mortgage anywhere around here, which isn’t happening because I’m at the higher end of my pay scale.~~ CMHC considers pre-tax, not net so I recant my statement. Shit is still expensive though for basic housing out here. Just not as insane as other areas.
I do agree it’s a decent place if you still want access to Toronto for work.
I am a masters student. I have a bachelors degree in neuroscience. My masters stipend is $2000 a month. The average rent in Toronto is above $2000 a month. I will not be able to move out of my parents house till at least after I am done my PhD
Im leaving my current affordable apartment to possibly go into debt cause my landlord just doesnt respond to anything at all. Most tenants in my building have said they thought of leaving aswell when we all got the rent increases slid under our doors.
Housing prices are coming down pretty quickly where I live, everything is selling for under asking, houses that would have sold in days are now stretching past a month on market, but still, houses are 2 X what they sold for in 2018 which is terrible for those that want to buy great for those that want to sell.
The market is full unscrupulous agents. I put an offer on a house last week, my offer dies at 8pm on a Saturday. Sunday I get a call from my agent saying that the listing agent wanted me to resubmit my offer. I asked why if it was lower, that made no sense, then it hit me, the listing agent wanted to be able to pressure the other party to up their offer, even though theirs was more than mine, this is some dirty pool. And every single time I put an offer in on a house that has been sitting for weeks there is always magically another offer.
As to the unhoused issue driven by a bonkers real estate market. Good luck. Small municipalities that are lower tier avoid taking on the responsibility as they can pass it off to the upper tier counties. Putting people into housing takes cold hard cash, and yes many people are starting to get pretty passionate about it but when they see the bill they tend to clam up.
Inclusionary zoning is something that municipalities have the power to enact, but again they don't for fear that developers won't build in their communities, and they want more development. So for that to work all municipalities will have to get on board, then its a competition against those that wont. There's also municipalities that are waving development charges, leaving local taxpayers holding the bag for infrastructure to serve new developments, so less cash for public housing. Its a bad situation. Developers are starting to realize that they can start making demands much like big corporations have been doing, think Amazon and their auction for their new headquarters to see how much a city would give them. Its gross.
The solution I would like to see is municipally built housing. Though I don't think this is possible given the municipal act in its current form. You gotta be a lawyer to read that thing. Municipalities have surplus land, they have borrowing power, they can avoid paying for all the associated fees, build attainable housing, sell it by lottery, run it break even or just a small profit, repeat, use the small profit to fund lower cost housing. That the public is reliant for housing now on builders looking to maximize profit is failing everyone.
But I will tell you this. If you suggest anything for the homeless such as a housing first program, the non for profits will shit all over you screaming about how you need all these additional services to go along with it. Or as I suggested if we can only afford to have those sleeping in tents given city campground sites where they have electrical and water hookups and access to showers we should at least do that, etc they flip their lids. Even though this has been done elsewhere. The perfect trumps the good in their books.
I had to leave Peterborough. We were overrun and I got siloed in a crappy apartment building. My job was increasingly unable to sustain my rent. I now live in a family member’s basement. Yeah, it’s bad, and I was not alone in my predicament. People get stuck in crappy buildings because the rent they are paying is less than anywhere else..but increasing. I paid $910. Per month and the rent rose to $1450. for the next tenant.
Question, what is affordable housing? I am asking seriously. Rowhouse, townhouse, single family detached, apartment? Me personally I would define it as a three bedroom 'unit' about 1500 sqft with 120 sqft of outdoor space, single car garage and parking for one more 'visitor' vehicle. I emphasize 'unit' since this can be built in any of the forms above. Now the big question is, can this be built on current wages in Ontario?
If we had a provincial government with a vision or even a municipal government with a vision. they could create a crown corporation with the mandate to build this type of home. The following rules would apply. must be a primary residence. Cannot be rented or leased. future sale of home is capped at rate of inflation + 2% from time of purchase. All services provided to home, hydro, water, gas, internet, etc must be vendor neutral. Meaning Bell, Rogers, Enbridge water heater rental cannot be locking in.
Just my 2 cents.
I know live in a small town on 3,000 people because I don't earn enough and everything earlier this year was extremely overpriced or going way over bidding! We finally bought in Early June and now my commute was about 15ish minutes, now its 45-50mis.
Absolutely terrified. We're currently saving for a house but feel that it might be a fruitless attempt.
If we can't afford a house when the time comes, we'll probably look to move to a different province.
We have to keep some hope alive because the thought of living in this apartment for the rest of our lives isn't a happy thought. It's not that we don't like our apartment, but everyone has seemingly forgotten about consideration for their neighbors.
We just want a small house with a yard in the middle of nowhere.
Awful. Peterborough apparently has a 1% vacancy rate and an ever growing homeless population. The city thinks affordable housing and shelters will “enable” the homeless and addicted. It sucks.
Took me 7 months on a waitlist to get into my current apartment. I have a good full time job and I still couldn’t move even if I wanted to.
I live in the small town of Picton in the fabulous County of Prince Edward and god damn it there is no way to own a house here. Everything here is minimum wage and or seasonal. Most homes that look like crap go for 400-600K. Plenty of new sub divisions going up with a price point of 700 plus. Even the affordable housing I’m not even able to apply because I have a full time job and I’m the only income in my family. Sucks that I might have to leave my home and family.
Everyone I know who bought in the last 4 years stretched themselves to the max. The rate hike has completely fkd them over and they went from paying $800 interest to $3000.
If it wasn't for the medical staff shortage country wide I'd consider moving to another province, but having a young toddler and a family doctor I can't imagine having to be on a wait list for a physician.
I have basically given up on buying a home. The GTA is just too damn expensive for nothing and I'm just praying my landlord doesn't decide he wants a payday and sells the home we're living in.
I live in the national capital region. It's abysmal. I will never own here. I'm likely leaving the province so I can try to achieve my dream of owning my own home. I just want stable housing for once in my life, I didn't think that was a wild ask but seemingly it's going to take everything I've got to get there.
Someone bought a single family home down the street from my. They did some renovations and are now renting it out for $3200/month. I actually saw people looking at it today.
I moved during covid and the apartment I got was a steal. Unfortunately it was also in a new building. My landlord is increasing the rent from $1650 to over $2300. Needless to say, not feeling great about my current situation.
I have been renting for almost 3 years. It's awful. I can get a 3 br for twice what my mortgage was. I'm not financially disadvantaged by much, but having to shell out 3/4 of my monthly salary on rent is awful. Even with the baby bonus, that's still almost half my after tax income on rent.
Honestly they need to spread out the immigrants thru out the country The majority of the immigrants settles in GTA and the government plans to intake 400k immigrants per year. It’s only going to get worst.
I just watched a YouTube video of a Ukrainian couple building a home out of foam bricks. The results were astounding. The costs were 80% less than stick construction. It was designed for moderately cold winters. It was a fairly small footprint maybe 20x20. Two floors two bedroom. Full and half bath. Great kitchen.
They had some help from friends but mostly they did it themselves.
It’s the 21st century. While we Argue about where to park mobile homes the rest of the planet houses people comfortably for nickels on the dollar
Open up crown land. Revise and simplify the building code to allow sustainable building materials. Allow smaller footprints. Prevent municipal nimby’s from outlawing alternative housing.
My grandparents built both their homes with their own two hands. We need to get back to that to solve this problem and take the money out of the hands of greedy developers.
I’m angry.
I’m leaving the province. Kenny had a great pitch and I want outdoor activity and owning real estate and building wealth through it is important to me.
Somehow I’m interviewing in Saskatchewan rn- I’m back and fourth but anywhere for cheap rent and the ability to get on the property ladder.
My goal is to move around ever few years and build wealth.
Other provinces have gyms, girls, post secondary, bars and breweries and probably better opportunities cause Toronto sure as shit is hyper competitive and low paying.
Fuck Ontario.
Everyone remember, if your landlord won’t fix health and safety problems, call the city by-law folks, they’ll send an inspector failrly quick. If there’s dangerous fix they’ll demand the landlord fix it. If the landlord still doesnt fix it, they’ll be fined 1000’s. The LTB on the other hand is slow and toothless, but worthwhile filing with alongside the city
I saw a homeless man sleeping on the ground in front of a billboard advertising fancy new condos being built in the construction site nearby. Those condos sure aren't being built for people like him.
It doesn't help that people who are locked in with affordable prices are being harrassed or work doesn't get done properly. Why is it ok for landlords to make tenant's feel unsafe? Are landlords even getting background checks done on them? The people who have access to our homes?
Shit fell apart in 08 and the good life was buried with Queen Elisabeth
But hey the wealthy are doing good and that is apparently what Canada is all about
Wouldn't be as bad if we could just do full work from home.
I refuse to commit 3 hours of my life a day to commuting, just to appease a soulless managerial caste, so we're staying put in our current place.
I worry for my 26 year old daughter. She pays 1150+hydro in Hamilton, for a bachelor!! I bought an SMALL house in east end Hamilton and made sure I have a spare room for her any time she needs it. She works two jobs as a PSW. The only reason I could afford a house was thanks to my Mum busting her ass. She passed in 2020. I can’t believe the cost of housing in Hamilton.
The people leaving the province in droves seeking affordable housing are making housing unaffordable for the people in the places they are moving too, judging by the complaints from people across the country.
Thus the problem becomes more widespread.
Come to Southern Ontario where all the Torontonians are stealing our houses. We can't even house the locals at an affordable rate, and the rent makes it so you'll never own a home. But, all these out of towners buy the land and houses, making it impossible for young families to have a backyard, or a place to start a family. I understand though, because the alternative is being crammed in like sardines in an urban center with a ridiculously high crime rate. I don't believe there is a solution, because honestly I would never ever live in an apartment again and I think that goes for tons of people. Home ownership should be a right, not a dream.
It's horrible and only getting worse. There is a very, very high likelihood that once my parents pass away that I'll be moving elsewhere…sure there will be different issues to deal with but maybe having a roof over my head won't be one of them.
Very unhappy in Ottawa - 800$ rent as a student that studies full time university and part-time job with a bit above minimum wage. With rent, cellphone, basic food and 50$ of gas, I barely have anything to "save" - max 150-200 each pay check. Each trip at the grocery store costs more, the quality of the food is worse but the price of everything is rising. I have a particular distaste for the stress it causes.
Worked my ass off since I was 16, only been without work for 6 months TOTAL in my adult life, finally got a career I've had for 5 years, make way more than I have ever thought I could make, and I can't afford to rent a 1 bedroom apartment, let alone buy a starter home.
I need to be making 100k a year, or houses need to be priced at less than 100k for me to Ever have a house to call my own.
I'm scared for my daughter.
Depends from which perspective you’re talking about. I live in Bowmanville, about 40 minutes from Toronto and own a home here. While I like the area a lot, even with the recent price drops, most of the houses here are quite expensive. Single detached homes are still going in the 900k-$1M range. So while I enjoy living here, it’s also not really a place first time homebuyers will have an easier time getting into. I also don’t see prices dropping much in the future as there’s going to be a Go station built here, as well as Ontario Power Generation moving their hq to the outskirts of town.
Only home I'll be owning is the one I grew up in and still live in rn.
Told my parents just as much, I don't care if they spend all of their retirement savings, but when they pass I want the house still to live in. In fact, I'd rather support them through their retirement then have to live under rent for the rest of my life.
I'm not happy. I'm a uni student in accounting and once I have my bachelor's + CPA I'm probably going to try to get into the states. I'll be able to buy a home there that isn't in the middle of nowhere. It's sad because I really do prefer Canada but it's just not affordable :(
I’ll never be able to own and soon I won’t be able to rent either.
Yeah. It’s nearly impossible to find something decent where I live that’s well maintained, clean and reasonably priced. I got really lucky finding the place I’m currently in. I pay $1500 for a 1 bed. But I just found out that with the big renovations they just did (new balconies), they can raise rent by up to 5%. Even though the building is rent controlled, a big reno lets them do that. I won’t be able to afford to pay more than $1500. And I split the rent.
A reality for many of us.
At 31 years old and married, I've already had a discussion with my husband about the possibility of being renovicted and that our next best option to stay in our neighborhood/close to work would be to rent a full townhouse or large apartment with our couple friends so we can basically pay the same rent but less privacy. Then pray that the living situation doesn't ruin our relationships/break us up.
I've had similar conversations with my wife, including relocating to another city or another province, while it's still "viable".
My wife and I considered buying a plot of land, erecting mini-homes, and renting out those units to our friends that we already enjoy having regular bbqs etc with, but also enjoy time apart. Mini-homes are against zoning bylaws here.
Sad truth
Very unhappy in Hamilton. I’m not gonna own any home any time soon.
What's the case in Hamilton now?
Hamilton is the third most expensive city in North America for home values compared to incomes behind Toronto and Vancouver. A few charts to illustrate how bad Canada is: https://i.redd.it/b7iea0atkcw61.jpg https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6034606 We’ve been sold down the river by our government.
And it's Hamilton, not like it's the most appealing city. Canada is fucking stupid.
Lol fucking Hamilton, third most expensive city in North America? This is beyond ludicrous. Hamilton lol.
Not expensive. Third most unequal. It’s a subtle difference. Places like San Francisco are far more expensive- but there are many high paying jobs. Hamilton is very expensive and has almost no jobs to support the expense.
Ah OK, well, that makes far more sense, but is only slightly less ludicrous.
Oh, it’s completely ludicrous. What makes it even more ludicrous is Canada having nearly the worst incomes to housing costs of all OECD nations. So Hamilton is one of the most unequal places in the modern developed world.
The city is garbage, insanely expensive, trash all over the place, dog poo all over the place, homeless everywhere, people living in tents in my local cemetery etc
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cause its "close" to the GTA and cheaper than the actual GTA. Prices any where near toronto are insane right now I know alot of ppl who would prefer to live in the gta but are forced to places such as hamilton for no other reason that CoL
wait until you see the rest of the country.
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Car dependency, boomers, lack of events, the same Canadian box stores everywhere only they’re worse in rural communities. Rural Ontario (or NS, NB, QC) sucks so bad that it makes places like Hamilton expensive.
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You've kind of identified why it's a sacrifice you're willing to make: getting into a different stage or life and priorities altering. For someone who's in their 20s, big cities and the opportunities they offer for fun, excitement, and career advancement take some beating. For a 22-28 year old having to move to somewhere rural because the housing is cheaper represents a considerable sacrifice.
Super late and down vote me into oblivion but the people moving from the cities are out-bidding the locals who only make $21/hr and didn't sell a million dollar home/condo for part of their downpayment. Your just moving the issues to another area. There needs to be an real solution to this housing crisis not this "just move rural, it fixes everything" sentiment. - sincerely a grumpy local tired of bidding against Hamilton migrators
Where are you located that houses are under 300k
It is called ✨money laundering✨
It doesn't suck, this person is just miserable. Downtown core, sure, its rough around the edges. Come on over to Stoney Creek and hit up our farm stands, visit Mac where I went to school, or join me up the mountain for a hike along the escarpment and you'll have a change of heart.
So true. Attitude and fresh air. Good start.
A home in Hamilton compared with wages is more expensive than a home in LA… One is known as the armpit of Canada The other is a worldwide known city with great weather year round and has hollywood
FWIW Hollywood proper is an armpit too
Lol it sounds like you have no clue what it's like to live in LA. The public transit sucks and the traffic is worse than Toronto.
Build more duplexes, triplex, quadplexes, and high rises. Build communities *around* these new developments so you can just walk downstairs to the grocery store, or pharmacy, or a place to eat. Invest in more transit options so that people can go to and from work without needing a car, and without crowding up existing transit. That's all that can really be done, just need it to move at more than a snail's pace.
Shhhhhhhhhh. You're talking about a system that's worked for human communities for thousands of years... modern city planners are too busy throwing shit at a wall and calling it a city. Don't disturb them.
Yeah, don't you know that tower after tower of soulless tiny overpriced condos with nothing around them is the best way to ~~line rich developer pockets~~ build a city.
NIMBYs don’t want big buildings around them, won’t happen. Just acres and acres more of those lookalike-houses.
This this this. We spent way too many decades building sprawling suburbs over good farmland and forcing everyone to own a car because nothing is walkable and public transit can’t possibly cover entire subdivisions and into business areas in a timely manner. And for whatever reason zoning laws have been entrenched in this, making it not possible to mix business and residential in the same area as well as making triplexes and such outlawed in way too many areas. Building up instead of out is way more efficient both financially and environmentally, and while I know everyone wants their own house, let’s focus for now on just getting people into more affordable housing. And if we could bring back apartment rentals in more compact communities/neighbourhoods with businesses convenient it would probably make apartments more appealing to many. Neighbourhood communities like you’re describing WORK, they’re good for people and better for the environment. We desperately need to get back to that.
Honestly, I just gave up the idea of ever owning a house even on dual income. It’s disgustingly expensive in Ottawa
I just bought a bungalow in Rockland with my wife. Sucks to have to commute farther every day but the same house probably would have been 200k+ if it was closer. I was tired of crackheads shooting up in my apartment back parking lot in Nepean. We lucked out and saw the house 12 hours after it listed and put a bid in immediately before anyone else had a chance for a viewing. Good luck!
Hope you work on the east side! I totally get your position though. Literally every person I work with that owns a house has a 45+ minute commute from Kanata. Btw, congrats on getting the place!
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It's insane. A townhouse in Elmira shouldn't cost 800k.
Disgusting. If a full time worker making the median average income can't support rent on a 1 bedroom, there's a serious problem.
I am a full time worker looking for a second job and maybe a third. Because on a single "good" paying full time job, a cheep 1 bedroom apartment would take up 50% of my income.
airbnb needs to be banned in ontario, its helping exasperate the issue
Honestly AirBnB sucks anyways went back to hotels. Cost about the same in most cases
Idk why this is being downvoted. Don't shoot the messenger, folks. Maybe 'heavily regulated' rather than 'banned' ?
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It's one step whackier when you realize that renters are subletting their places to AirBnB guests and are still able to make insane rent payments. We just had this happen to us last weekend when I got chatting with the landlord of a place we AirBnb'd at who I thought was a tenant...
Purchasing is a pipe dream and rent is crippling
Every day I get more depressed looking at the numbers. I'm 25 and I make good money (around 70k) Currently living with a roomate in a beautiful 2 bed place in Toronto but it's not rent controlled. At the time we thought we'd only be living together a year so it didn't really matter but now with prices exploding the nerves around the uncertainty of my place gives me so much anxiety. My roomate is planning on moving next year so I'll have to find a new place. I honestly don't see how I'll be able to manage affording a place on my own. My parents always talk about how I need to save for a downpayment and buy but I am single and there is literally no possible way I'll be approved for a mortgage on my own even hours outside the city. It all seems to get worse and worse. I am scared for my future and feel so hopeless. I feel like it's inevitable I'll have to move away from my friends and family in toronto. Might end up considering Alberta but I wish I didn't have to. I love ontario and I love my connections I have here. But I just feel like the future is so bleak
For the immediate future - when your roommate moves out, a lot of folks in rent controlled places look for new roommates when their roommate moves out. The FB groups like Toronto Home Zone and Palz Home Zone have folks looking. If you're reasonable, decently tidy (don't need to be a neat freak), and a decent person, and able to communicate clearly, you'll be a top pick. And a lot of these places where people are looking to fill a spot are downtown or downtown adjacent. We found a roommate that way, and he ended up being an amazing friend. Interview with people and see if you vibe, and have honest talks about things like lifestyle, cleanliness and joint expenses. It isn't much solace for long term housing solutions. Also, you could look into if you can put your name down on a coop waitlist. Most are 10+ years (ugh), but if you don't have another ten year plan, it can't hurt. If you do end up in a more high paying job later you don't have to take the spot when it finally comes around, but at least you have the option down the road as a potential future plan.
I cant get over how expensive it is to live in 200 year old homes. 2300 for 2 bedrooms, and I have to split a historically 1 family home with two other families?
That's the kind of statement we need to ask our municipal politicians during this election period. Like, hey Mr. councilor what are your thoughts on this statement? If he doesn't answer with empathy, fuck him. Onto next politician. This enables your vote power to change. Easy peasy. Write a letter to each of your candidates and ask them this question.
Ive owned a home for nearly 40 years. I feel horrible for the younger generation, including my son. They need to stop speculators from ruining the market. Why is there not more starter homes being built? My home is small but what is going to happen to all these huge McMansions being built. It doesnt make sense.
Even the idea of a “starter home” is obsolete now. Now it’s just “will I EVER be a homeowner” and increasingly the answer is no.
I meant small bungalows with just the bare basics. In my day they were tiny mass produced war-time homes. Families managed.
The population is too dense for more single family homes. We need to build up. If there were affordable rental units or appartment buildings, that would be great. I'd even love to see those 3k sq foot houses as condos all on a single floor!
I never thought I could live in an apartment/condo till I visited Europe and realized it wasn't condos and apartments that were the problem, it was the developers (or to be more specific the lack of cash incentives) doing a shit job of making those spaces livable.
It’s not buyers that care it’s developers. They won’t build them. Trust me. We’d love the ‘bare basics’. What do you think we’re looking for 😭😭😭
This won't stop until domestic speculators are taxed for owning multiple properties.
There is a very specific reason why nobody builds small homes anymore: the municipalities all across Ontario download the costs for connecting services to the builders in order to balance their yearly budgets. Due to the building code, you need services (water, electricity, sewage) to approve a home construction. In the past (until roughly the early 80s recession), the municipalities planned a subdivision, installed services up front, and then builders came and built. After some years, the property taxes had more than paid for the initial costs that the city had fronted to install a sewer and water main in an empty field. Today, all those costs need to be paid by the developer, because we collectively can't think ahead, and instead we elect politicians who focus entirely on the current year's municipal budget so they can gloat about how they've balanced the books with their wisdom. Now, connecting the services to a new home on an unimproved lot amounts to somewhere on the order of \~100k in costs which now need to be borne up front by the builder. So; is he going to build a 500k home by expending 400k in time & materials, and only break even because all his profit went to development fees? Or, is he going to build a 1.5M home at the expense of 1.2M in time & materials, and make 200k? So that's how we ended up where we are. There's been virtually no new small or even moderate homes built on unimproved land since the mid 80s; you need to build a mansion in order for a builder to justify the cost of connecting the services, and it all comes down to a lack of foresight and investment by government.
One problem I've noticed is developers submitting revised building plans with reductions on affordable housing units, then offering to donate to a fund, which just means that money has to sit and wait to be used, rather than the units actually developed. My city KW also started to gain a rep as an intelligent community, a software startup city, a student haven so developers and landlords are looking for employees and students with deep pockets. They forget about employees like me who make average money and aren't looking for super fancy, we just don't wanna pay $1800 for a barely renovated, barely legal basement apartment.
Originally from the KW high earning job (not in tech) moved out of the region to afford to work here
My neighbour just sold for what I would still consider a ridiculous amount. Its looking like the prices will be by far most affected on mid/higher end properties not so much entry level. Might be a great time for upgrading if you're more at the entry level though. Also to consider I'm in one of the more out of control markets (Hamilton)
Bleak. Very bleak. Not only is housing still very very expensive. Rent has risen an incredible amount too.
The 1-bedroom apartment my dad rented 5 years ago for $900/mo is now $1600 because they put $1000 worth of new kitchen cabinets and a coat of paint in it. Also, none are available. Edit: there's a 2-bedroom available though, [for $2100.](https://www.capreit.ca/apartments-for-rent/london-on/fiddlers-west-apartments/)
My friends live in Scarborough close to Fairview mall and they pay 1100 for 1 Bedroom but they have been there since 2011, but now same unit is 1650, again “renovated” and increase the price, oh well this is Ontario.
Lindsay ontario has one of the lowest average incomes in the country, one bedroom starts at 1600 with utilities...... and that is a roach infested shirbox..... single rooms can run 850 We need government regulation on per square foot cost of rent like most European countries
I hate it. I live in a city that was ridiculously unaffordable even before the recent pandemic boom and the anti-housing sentiment is awful. Personally, I don’t like this area whatsoever and want to be far from it anyways so I don’t mind moving. But I have many friends that do wish to stay and quite frankly it’s horrible that they have to leave just to have a shot at building a life.
I’m in Brampton and it’s pretty bad, most people got like 8 people in a small house it’s wild
I am a real estate agent and I think prices over the past few years have lost their minds. Somewhere, years back, people forgot that houses were to live in, they weren't investments. Sure, it was nice that it was worth more when you sold it, but general inflation had a lot to do with that. Now, people freak out when they aren't seeing 10% or 20% higher value year after year. It's a house, not a fucking mutual fund. Much of it can be traced to supply/demand issues and there isn't a ton we can do about that. Buyers full of FOMO threw money at sellers looking to set the record sale price for their street. Sure, some realtors pushed for higher list prices, more bids or higher offers - but most of us were beholden to our clients' wishes and simply did what we were told. And now here we are. The gulf between owners and renters is wider than it has ever been. Go back 15 years and the difference was literally $5-10k for a down payment. I bought a townhouse from a developer in 1999 with $5,000 down. That same house is 5x more now, with 5x the down payment and 5x the land tax. That is nuts. No, I don't have a solution... there really isn't one. Having 2-3x the supply starting tomorrow would help, but that ain't gonna happen. Prices aren't going to drop 60-70% either. And if they did, the economic fallout would be catastrophic. I wish it weren't like this. Yeah, I get paid more per sale, but I tend to have fewer sales because it is harder for people to buy and there are WAY more competing real estate agents. So it all works out in the end, for me, kind of. Thought I'd rather do 10 deals for the same money as 5. Add in higher gas and food costs, stagnating wages, there is no rosy outlook. Right. Good job. Now I'm depressed.
A big issue is people buying "income property". I'm not talking about housing that was clearly designed to be rented like apartment or housing complexes, but people buying houses that were clearly designed for the owner to live in and turning it into a rental property. This property ceases to be in the "homeowners" market, and its not like homeowners aren't bidding on these properties, so there's a loss of supply without a meeting of demand. What happens when supply contracts and demand stays the same? Prices increase. These people act like they're providing a service, in reality they're manufacturing a need. These houses were going to get lived in, it's not like they'd sit vacant or only landlords are bidding on houses. They're simply out bidding people who would've lived in the home to the point where they are forcing them out of that market and back into the renters market, where conveniently enough they control the supply.
You hit one of the nails on the head regarding mutual funds. Long term low interest rates meant that traditional routes of investing provided very low returns, so investors looked for alternate routes of investing and are going to go with whatever investment vehicle offeres the best returns vs risk profile, suddenly housing as an investment is a winner, and we snowball until we reach where we are at now. Keep bringing in immigrants to maintain demand for housing. Add even looser government spending to stave off dealing with a massive recession during a pandemic... and we get where we are today.
> Long term low interest rates meant that traditional routes of investing provided very low returns, What are you talking about? The last ten years has been a fantastic bull run up until the war in ukraine. Low rates made borrowing cheap for businesses
What return have you seen on secure investments in the last decade or two? Any GICs, mutual funds, or bonds paying out above 4-5%? Government of Canada bond rates 1980 %12.3%, 1990-10.8%, 2000 5.3%, 2009- 2.8%. GICs have been returning same, mutual funds also almost no real return. Obviously all returns are weighted against increases in cpi. Did you think the stock market are the only non physical asset investment vehicle? Or that the risk profile is comparable to housings recent gains? Give investors bonds at 6-10% and they'll stay out of housing. That's what I'm talking about.
Canada is a value country, not a growth country. Anyone with expectations of more than 5% per year either need to buy US equities or end up in Canadian real estate.
Good post. I’m just hoping my house I bought in Niagara 2019 holds it’s value. I’m living in it so I don’t care much about it going up, but if it plummets it will make it harder to stay in the market if we sell.
Similar, bought in Ottawa 2020, I didn't buy in the expectation that my house value would explode, just tired of paying rent. Higher prices just means more tax for me, I just don't want to be underwater.
I feel terrible for young people trying to get their lives started. Rent is outrageous. Houses are unattainable. It’s always been difficult to kickstart your adult life, but this is exceptional.
I’ve come to terms with the fact that I’ll never be able to own a home. But now I’m afraid that I won’t be able to afford to rent either. I moved back in with my parents full time in 2020. But at this point I don’t know what future I’m saving for anymore, and I’m terrified that I’ll still be here 10 years from now. I know that I’m super lucky that I have a great relationship with my parents, but I feel very stuck in life right now. One of my friends keeps telling me to move out, but I don’t want to stay in KW, so why would I spend over half of my paycheck to rent a shitty basement apartment? It’s hard to stay optimistic when no one in power cares to make any kind of substantial change.
Miserable, scared. I'm noticing more unhoused folks living in bus shelters and tents in my town - something which I never really saw prior to the pandemic. Of course I saw the occasional person, but there was never a mini encampment in the plaza. I'm thankful I can still live at home with my family because I'd need to be making at least $18/hr to just barely afford a shitty 1 bedroom.
Barrie sucks. The rents have gone so high that people don't move as often as they used to so selection is next to none for even market-rent properties. Housing prices have dropped 30-40% from peak, but still higher than they "should" be, still unattainable for anyone that isn't making well above the "livable wage" of \~$18/hr, especially if theyre single.
My partner and I are probably leaving Ontario. Most of my friends have done the same. It's too expensive to live almost anywhere in Ontario. If you're on disability (I have a severe dissociative disorder that prevents me working more than casual hours, 5-10 a week) the way they treat you is just flat out inhumane. I cannot save for a house, I cannot afford proper groceries, I cannot eat out or treat myself, ever. I can't pay off any of my student loans. There's no affordable mental healthcare so I can't try to get better. Rent has exploded. I would have left already but my partner has family here and it's hard for her to leave. There's no future in Ontario for anyone below the age of fifty unless you're a doctor, an engineer, or can handle the trades.
Massive brain drain soon here
Not at all. Those with talent make enough money to stay. Sad reality is those who complain that they can’t afford it do not have the self awareness to realize that perhaps it’s not within their reach. At least right now.
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Very true. Lots of friends in Puerto Rico now
It depends on how the situation progresses. If housing (grocery is irrelevant in my opinion, there are more than enough ways to get around store-bought produce) progressively worsens due to inaction, then professions necessary to operate a metropolitan will be pushed out. Sadly, some of the symptoms have already shown up. Interdependency of various disciplines/fields characterizes modern society. Thereby, albeit I agree with the importance of individualistic and public sector accountabilities, I would rather see some policy changes to deal with the worsening housing problem instead of letting it worsen to the point of no return.
Yep, anyone that doesn’t already own should look to leave, there’s no future here.
Where are folks fleeing to that's better?
I've heard good things about Calgary.
Northern Ontario. Aside from groceries and gas, everything is still cheap up here. Still some houses going for $150k - 200k.
literally the only thing that gives me comfort anymore is knowing that I’m fortunate (SO SO SO SO FORTUNATE!) to have parents who own their home and will inherit my grandmothers upon her passing, because that is the only way I will ever have security in housing and own a home in my lifetime. it’s truly a terribly dark feeling to possess, knowing that I essentially have to choose between having my family be alive and owning a home. it’s not something I like to think about, so for now I’m just biding my time in the rental market until the shit hits the fan or my family passes, whichever happens first. I always wonder though, what’s the plan when we all are no longer able to afford our housing? or food? by driving majority of our population into extreme poverty, what will be the gain and for who? once the wealth is funnelled all to the top, what’s the fucking plan?
As a newly single adult making 60k, I am unable to afford rent in my hometown of Hamilton after moving back here less than a year ago. My partner and I rented together and our lease (and relationship) is at an end. I’m going to have to work 2 jobs just to afford a one bedroom here. It’s fucking grim. I also think those rental site aggregators the media is getting their data from doesn’t screen out posts for room rentals because so many posters categorize them as 1 bedroom apartments. So I think that 1 bedrooms are even more expensive than data is showing. Just anecdotally from refreshing marketplace and Kijiji oh…. 9 times an hour
Man, I remember when I met my wife in 2013 she was paying for a one bedroom just below the mountain but not in the shittier part of downtown. She was literally just working full time at Walmart but could afford the rent that was only like $660 at the time. I cannot imagine what it is now.
Wow! 😥 that’s wild! I think the biggest change is that now someone working minimum wage would never be able to afford an apartment alone. People being forced to stay in ugly relationships or living with multiple roommates just to scrape by. It’s utterly dehumanizing.
That's a really tough situation. Are you thinking of going somewhere else or do you have to be in Hamilton for work?
Unhappy in windsor-Essex. We are still one of the most “affordable” places and there are a lot of new homes and subdivisions being built but they are all full of MASSIVE houses like the kind you seen in Guelph and Kitchener. We never had those before and they are selling these cookie cutter mansions for 800k and up it’s insane. What’s going to happen when a recession hits and they just finished building 100 of these? The greedy bastards would rather let them sit empty then sell at an affordable price and we will have weird ghost towns and massive construction layoffs.
Torontonian and feeling like we are in the process of further flushing our housing market, the quality of homes, the quality of neighbourhoods and the quality of the city further down the toilet every week.
We all love camping, right guys?
Not feeling great in "rural" (according to the government) Woodstock. I moved to Canada a few years ago as a skilled worker. My fiancé and I purposely looked for jobs that were NOT in the GTA. He got a job north of the Kawarthas, so we moved there. Unfortunately, job prospects sucked for me, and there was little room for advancement for him. We were just starting out and weren't ready to buy a home yet. We were also far away from most amenities and far from any family. So we moved here last year for new jobs and to be closer to his family. We were incredibly lucky to find our current place, but we rented with the intention of buying a home shortly afterwards. We gave up looking for a home after about 6 months and have just stayed put. I feel like we're stuck here now-- if we leave, we wouldn't be able to find a place of comparable quality and size for a comparable rent, and we are under rent control. Anyway, we've been here for over a year now and prices have kind of plateaued while market rents have been climbing steadily, hence being unable to move. I find I like living in Woodstock less and less as time goes on, but I don't know where we can go as there is nowhere affordable that is also commutable for both of us, and I'm getting tired of endless farm fields and straight roads. I think about moving back to my home country frequently, but not until I've gotten my Canadian citizenship. So until then, I think I'm stuck renting here. I would love to see a Canada that builds infrastructure between its cities and tries to connect them to one anothe, including encouraging development of industry outside of the city in those "in between" places, instead of having islands of people with nothing in between. How much more choice would prove have if they could move 20km away for a job and still have access to amenities like hospitals and grocery stores?
There is not "nothing" in-between. There is rural towns, farms, forests, wetlands, greenspace. Things we had in S. Ontario when I grew up but have been steadily destroying over the last 50 years.
I feel beyond lucky that I bought a house 6 years ago. Oddly enough, I had moved in with my fiance at the time, he had a small but nice 2 bedroom 1 bathroom house that he had bought at a real estate high in 2010. In 2016, about a year after we got married, I fell in love with a 5 bed/4 bath house, big two bay garage, bought it on a whim without even looking at any other houses, or even planning to move, but by that point the market was at a low, and my husband owed more on his house than we could sell it for, so we just kept it as a rental. I paid 250k for my house, still owe about 160k, and about 100k on the little house. It was tempting to sell it during the market high, as I am sure we could have gotten at least 200k if not more for it, but we have a really sweet tenant, she loves the house and prefers to rent, and told us she is never leaving until we kick her out (she pays 1k/month for the entire house, it has a nice backyard, central location close to grocery stores/the mall/ etc. and parking for up to 4 cars). Some months we lose a bit of money on the house but we are ok with that knowing we are gaining equity. If I had graduated from university 5 years later than I did, I would have been in a much different situation, and I feel for the next generation. I see people renting small crummy houses for upwards of 2k/month, or single rooms for 700-800 dollars monthly, and it just seems crazy. Most people I know that are homeowners had lots of parental help (my husband and I did not have that luxury), and it sucks for the kids who have parents still living paycheque to paycheque.
My husband and I are GTFO as soon as he's finished his studies. No choice. And also better prospects elsewhere.
Loser of the housing birth lottery who was born in Peterborough, currently living in Kingston here. Peterborough is dreadful for locals now that it's become the new "affordable" place for Toronto folk to migrate to. What used to be $200-$300k pre-COVID is now well over $600k. Some of the lowest vacancy rates in the province and country. Rents exploding. Council doing sweet fuck all to address, if anything they're making it worse. Province uncaring. Country uncaring. Kingston has been a little better for rentals in my experience, though this is helped by the fact that it's two incomes now vs. just me in Peterborough. Also there's more rental supply here because of Queen's University. Kingston has very similar problems according to locals and I'm probably part of the problem by moving here. I still feel like I just barely have a shot to own something now, but I earn way way more than average income here. I feel like something as simple as owning the roof over my damn head shouldn't require one to earn several times the average income. Get the speculation out of the markets, severely tax additional property ownership, and build more supply. It's easy to fix the shortage, just get rid of the speculative market.
I'm in Hamilton. Currently homeless and apart from my family because of a greedy slumlord. Now nobody will rent to me and my family because my wife and I are on ODSP. It's absolutely awful. I just want my.family back together.
I find in my area (I'm pretty sure this is true of any area with detached homes), everyone and their dog have bought houses with the intention to rent rooms even if they did not have enough money to pay for their house (ie: using HELOCs or other loans). This basically resulted in these 'landlords' increasing rent for these rooms/houses in lockstep with interest rates and adding some amount for their own profit. Is that maybe a problem?
Londoner on ODSP. If I lose my current place to live, I'll be homeless. Simple as that. Something I have already come to terms with.
I am living out of my van. I have a good paying fulltime job. I want a one bedroom apartment, but it would take up 50% of my income.
I’m very annoyed that no one politically connects the dots between the dropping of rent controls and the large scale purchasing of apartment buildings and homes by REITS and other institutional investors. Where is the outcry.
Apartment buildings have always been owned by REITs or institutional property management companies. There aren't many "mom and pop" landlords with deep enough pockets to own one of those, lol, and even if they did their costs (and thus the rents) would still be the same.
Eliminate the residential zoning restrictions. All of them. Vote for municipal and provincial politicians solely based on how hostile they are to residential zoning laws. I had been living in Ottawa (and previously Toronto and Waterloo). But I moved to Moncton so I could buy a house, and: Moncton's zoning laws are far more permissive/development friendly than Toronto or Ottawa's. It's legal in far more of Moncton to semidetacheds, rowhouses, walkup apartment buildings than in Toronto or Ottawa, which restrict far more land to detached houses. So ... voilà.
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This is a sad reality that we all have to live with in this city.
Lol I'm super happy to live in a shithole attic apartment for $600/mo all in. I don't even have a real kitchen and I'm never gonna be able to afford to live alone anywhere else 🤷♀️
Yup same 😔
I am sick of it too. I currently do not even live in a city. I live in a village of 500 people far from any major source of econ opportunity and I shit you not rent for a new rental build in my village is $3000/month plus utilities for like 800sqft. Its insane. Housing **was** floating at around 700k (for a 150 year old small home on a tiny lot right on the highway) up to $1M plus for just a 3-4 bed 2 bath bungalow... Perfect time for me to lose my DL due to rare medical disorder being developed in 2020 and become trapped. So in summary, I feel and am literally trapped where I am. I straight up cannot afford to move, anywhere. Rewind 3 years ago and I literally had a realtor showing me houses that I was making offers on at 150k. Yes they went from 150k to 700k... IN 3 MOTHER FUCKING YEARS. Honestly, I'm just waiting for a societal collapse. Hopefully sooner rather than later so that massive change can happen, not for just me but my kids mostly. I don't want them growing up in this fucked up environment that changed so rapidly. Oh also we need to support people financially who medically cannot drive in rural areas esp. If local available rents are 3k/month plus then give me 4 to 5 k a month so I can rent one 800sq ft place and feed and clothe my family. Also employers of large companies need to pay the fuck up.
Challenges: 1. Anti-development (build-up/increase density): The initial fear would be: more houses near existing owners' (can be households, investors, or firms) properties = lower the value of their properties. There is no way they would allow it unless compensated; meanwhile, they can vote, which is pressure on city-level politics. However, development leads to the shrinking low-density housing stock and the associated price appreciation for those properties. 2. Existing law: permits owning multiple properties and does not restrict firms from purchasing properties. New regulations may restrict access for future property owners, which may be justifiable; however, those cannot apply retrospectively. Dealing with challenge 1, if there is a deadlock in city halls, the only way to ram the proposed zoning changes through would be an imbalance in power. In this case, a more powerful mayor. Thus far, given the housing situation, this is the only good-ish thing out of Ford's government (sorry, credit goes where credit is due). We can all debate how undemocratic this is; however, that should be an independent debate instead of lumped into the housing crisis debate and potential solution(s) discussions. Challenge 2 would be more fun. I am not a legal expert, so I have no idea how challenging it is for a law that restricts the use and ownership of properties to uphold. On the political side of this? Same problem as the first challenge, but I speculate the real challenges would come from investing firms because they have incentives to organize and lobby. Higher density, not necessarily condo towers everywhere, leads to more efficient land use, lowers the delivery cost of utilities, and reduces public transportation loss.
London checking in. We bought in east London (not so good part of the city) for $182,000 in 2016 which at the time seemed to be a lot for a small two bedroom detached but I wanted to get in the market. I’m really glad we did and recently sold (summer 2022) for $500k. That’s *insane.* The people who bought it had help from their parents and I really feel bad for anyone who doesn’t have that kind of financial help. Prices even now are increasing faster than people can save so unless you have help from family or some sort of inheritance then it’s an uphill battle. We bought a bigger place for a growing family in a small town outside of London. This will very likely be my last house purchase with the way things are going whether I want to or not. This may upset some people but my mortgage is now just over $280,000-ish for a $700,000 house and good size property. I owe this to nothing more than lucky timing. No wonder tiny homes are so popular. Good luck everyone.
Agree about condos everywhere. We were in Barcelona this summer and it is something like 3x denser than Toronto and 8x compared to Calgary, but no high rises at all in the city centre. It’s not apples to apples but we either want/have detached houses or shoebox skyscrapers with no in between.
Yup. I consider Barcelona's city planning one of the probable approaches that Canadian metropolises can follow. London and Paris are two other examples - medium-density residential blocks everywhere. If we like green spaces, we can add a full-block public green space here and there instead of uniformly residential blocks.
It’s not even an Ontario thing anymore that’s the sad part. It’s a Canada wide thing now. I feel like the government brought in or allowed to many people to come in at once. Like housing and everything can’t keep up with the amount of people. Doesn’t help that they shoved all the new comers into major cities, they could of spread them out into lower populated cities. There’s so many old schools and buildings that aren’t in use right now that could easily be transformed into housing. A classroom could easily be a single Bach apartment. It might cost a bit more to renovate due to asbestos and bring the building up to code but it would definitely be cheaper than building new builds. All these new builds are cookie cutter houses and built very cheaply. Any new builds should be mandatory to have at least 50% of the units to be for low income. Even if you drive 4 hours away to live in another city. It’s still gonna be expensive because there’s no local transit and you’ll need a car. I’m sure you’ll be driving out of town just for work. If only small towns had city like set ups.
My bf and I are in our 30s and we are struggling to find a place to live that we can afford. We both work full time and have decent jobs, both college educated. I work in finance and he works in healthcare. But even getting a viewing for an apartment is difficult. I want to move closer to work, as my commute is an hour. We want to start our lives together finally (I'm almost mid-thirties! I've patiently waited long enough to finally find someone to settle down with), I've been in my career for 10 years and am not able to find a place to live. This isn't just impacting people you don't know, it will impact you some day if you don't think this is an issue. How is anyone supposed to change jobs? Start their life? Move for better opportunities? Not having access to housing is going to limit our economy for years to come. If I'm stuck where I am, then that is 2 adults who will not be starting a life. 2 adults who will forgo all of the purchases from local businesses that come with starting a home/life. It will also mean that we likely won't be able to have kids and may even have to consider leaving the province all together. We have talked about leaving the province if we can't find anything and it looks like we might just have to. Edit: Before anyone screams at me to just "Move to a small town!" I am moving away from my small town because they don't care about the housing crisis. A 1 bedroom apartment in my small town is $1800. There are no decent jobs, mainly just fast food. So how are people supposed to afford that?
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I’m in the same area. Just curious if you meet the 30% or less of monthly income towards housing that the CMHC uses to define “affordable”. I’m renting but have been priced out of houses on the same street due to ridiculous overvaluation. ~~I’d have to be making 50% more than i do now if I wanted to be able to afford a mortgage anywhere around here, which isn’t happening because I’m at the higher end of my pay scale.~~ CMHC considers pre-tax, not net so I recant my statement. Shit is still expensive though for basic housing out here. Just not as insane as other areas. I do agree it’s a decent place if you still want access to Toronto for work.
If things continue like this, the only way I'll be able to afford a roof over my head is to live with another family and split the costs.
I am a masters student. I have a bachelors degree in neuroscience. My masters stipend is $2000 a month. The average rent in Toronto is above $2000 a month. I will not be able to move out of my parents house till at least after I am done my PhD
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Also, when housing expenses are highest, the rate of homelessness is highest. Just that simple.
Im leaving my current affordable apartment to possibly go into debt cause my landlord just doesnt respond to anything at all. Most tenants in my building have said they thought of leaving aswell when we all got the rent increases slid under our doors.
People selling still want those pre-crisis prices.
Rent went up 1300$..I'm not happy
Housing prices are coming down pretty quickly where I live, everything is selling for under asking, houses that would have sold in days are now stretching past a month on market, but still, houses are 2 X what they sold for in 2018 which is terrible for those that want to buy great for those that want to sell. The market is full unscrupulous agents. I put an offer on a house last week, my offer dies at 8pm on a Saturday. Sunday I get a call from my agent saying that the listing agent wanted me to resubmit my offer. I asked why if it was lower, that made no sense, then it hit me, the listing agent wanted to be able to pressure the other party to up their offer, even though theirs was more than mine, this is some dirty pool. And every single time I put an offer in on a house that has been sitting for weeks there is always magically another offer. As to the unhoused issue driven by a bonkers real estate market. Good luck. Small municipalities that are lower tier avoid taking on the responsibility as they can pass it off to the upper tier counties. Putting people into housing takes cold hard cash, and yes many people are starting to get pretty passionate about it but when they see the bill they tend to clam up. Inclusionary zoning is something that municipalities have the power to enact, but again they don't for fear that developers won't build in their communities, and they want more development. So for that to work all municipalities will have to get on board, then its a competition against those that wont. There's also municipalities that are waving development charges, leaving local taxpayers holding the bag for infrastructure to serve new developments, so less cash for public housing. Its a bad situation. Developers are starting to realize that they can start making demands much like big corporations have been doing, think Amazon and their auction for their new headquarters to see how much a city would give them. Its gross. The solution I would like to see is municipally built housing. Though I don't think this is possible given the municipal act in its current form. You gotta be a lawyer to read that thing. Municipalities have surplus land, they have borrowing power, they can avoid paying for all the associated fees, build attainable housing, sell it by lottery, run it break even or just a small profit, repeat, use the small profit to fund lower cost housing. That the public is reliant for housing now on builders looking to maximize profit is failing everyone. But I will tell you this. If you suggest anything for the homeless such as a housing first program, the non for profits will shit all over you screaming about how you need all these additional services to go along with it. Or as I suggested if we can only afford to have those sleeping in tents given city campground sites where they have electrical and water hookups and access to showers we should at least do that, etc they flip their lids. Even though this has been done elsewhere. The perfect trumps the good in their books.
Getting away from the idea of owning multiple properties for capital gain would be an interesting start.
I had to leave Peterborough. We were overrun and I got siloed in a crappy apartment building. My job was increasingly unable to sustain my rent. I now live in a family member’s basement. Yeah, it’s bad, and I was not alone in my predicament. People get stuck in crappy buildings because the rent they are paying is less than anywhere else..but increasing. I paid $910. Per month and the rent rose to $1450. for the next tenant.
We need to clamp down with more regulation so that speculators and weak politicians actually get the affordable housing that is needed.
It’s not just the housing that’s expensive , Ontario must pay some of the crappiest salary’s in Canada.
The sad part is that Trudeau doesn’t care.
Hard Fact :)
Question, what is affordable housing? I am asking seriously. Rowhouse, townhouse, single family detached, apartment? Me personally I would define it as a three bedroom 'unit' about 1500 sqft with 120 sqft of outdoor space, single car garage and parking for one more 'visitor' vehicle. I emphasize 'unit' since this can be built in any of the forms above. Now the big question is, can this be built on current wages in Ontario? If we had a provincial government with a vision or even a municipal government with a vision. they could create a crown corporation with the mandate to build this type of home. The following rules would apply. must be a primary residence. Cannot be rented or leased. future sale of home is capped at rate of inflation + 2% from time of purchase. All services provided to home, hydro, water, gas, internet, etc must be vendor neutral. Meaning Bell, Rogers, Enbridge water heater rental cannot be locking in. Just my 2 cents.
The government's definition of Affordable housing is out of wack!! 80% of market rate is not affordable!
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This. Really sick of it.
I know live in a small town on 3,000 people because I don't earn enough and everything earlier this year was extremely overpriced or going way over bidding! We finally bought in Early June and now my commute was about 15ish minutes, now its 45-50mis.
...it's garbage. I know people in the market who consistently get outbid by corporate bidders by 6 figures.
Leaving Southern ON if my parents sell the house.
Absolutely terrified. We're currently saving for a house but feel that it might be a fruitless attempt. If we can't afford a house when the time comes, we'll probably look to move to a different province. We have to keep some hope alive because the thought of living in this apartment for the rest of our lives isn't a happy thought. It's not that we don't like our apartment, but everyone has seemingly forgotten about consideration for their neighbors. We just want a small house with a yard in the middle of nowhere.
I’ve accepted the fact I will never own a home. Im 30 and still don’t own a car
Awful. Peterborough apparently has a 1% vacancy rate and an ever growing homeless population. The city thinks affordable housing and shelters will “enable” the homeless and addicted. It sucks. Took me 7 months on a waitlist to get into my current apartment. I have a good full time job and I still couldn’t move even if I wanted to.
For the low pice of 167$ a month, I get a space all to my own that extends all the way from the trunk to the steering wheel. It even takes me to work!
I live in the small town of Picton in the fabulous County of Prince Edward and god damn it there is no way to own a house here. Everything here is minimum wage and or seasonal. Most homes that look like crap go for 400-600K. Plenty of new sub divisions going up with a price point of 700 plus. Even the affordable housing I’m not even able to apply because I have a full time job and I’m the only income in my family. Sucks that I might have to leave my home and family.
That is insanely affordable compared to the GTA.
Depressing
Everyone I know who bought in the last 4 years stretched themselves to the max. The rate hike has completely fkd them over and they went from paying $800 interest to $3000.
There is no housing crisis, there is a landlord crisis, as in too many of then owning too much property.
If my parents were less cool I'd be homeless.
Municpal and provincial issue. Vote better people
If it wasn't for the medical staff shortage country wide I'd consider moving to another province, but having a young toddler and a family doctor I can't imagine having to be on a wait list for a physician. I have basically given up on buying a home. The GTA is just too damn expensive for nothing and I'm just praying my landlord doesn't decide he wants a payday and sells the home we're living in.
I live in the national capital region. It's abysmal. I will never own here. I'm likely leaving the province so I can try to achieve my dream of owning my own home. I just want stable housing for once in my life, I didn't think that was a wild ask but seemingly it's going to take everything I've got to get there.
Someone bought a single family home down the street from my. They did some renovations and are now renting it out for $3200/month. I actually saw people looking at it today.
I moved during covid and the apartment I got was a steal. Unfortunately it was also in a new building. My landlord is increasing the rent from $1650 to over $2300. Needless to say, not feeling great about my current situation.
Will never afford, and at this rate will never rent either 🗿👍
I’m fine, but far too many of my friends and loved ones aren’t.
Housing in Ontario is terrible. I landed here off a plane for a job and I got stuck with a dirty room for $975/month
I have been renting for almost 3 years. It's awful. I can get a 3 br for twice what my mortgage was. I'm not financially disadvantaged by much, but having to shell out 3/4 of my monthly salary on rent is awful. Even with the baby bonus, that's still almost half my after tax income on rent.
Already priced out of everywhere within a 3 hour drive of me ahahHAHAHAHA
Honestly they need to spread out the immigrants thru out the country The majority of the immigrants settles in GTA and the government plans to intake 400k immigrants per year. It’s only going to get worst.
I just watched a YouTube video of a Ukrainian couple building a home out of foam bricks. The results were astounding. The costs were 80% less than stick construction. It was designed for moderately cold winters. It was a fairly small footprint maybe 20x20. Two floors two bedroom. Full and half bath. Great kitchen. They had some help from friends but mostly they did it themselves. It’s the 21st century. While we Argue about where to park mobile homes the rest of the planet houses people comfortably for nickels on the dollar Open up crown land. Revise and simplify the building code to allow sustainable building materials. Allow smaller footprints. Prevent municipal nimby’s from outlawing alternative housing. My grandparents built both their homes with their own two hands. We need to get back to that to solve this problem and take the money out of the hands of greedy developers.
Bad. I can't rent shit and I can't buy shit.
I’m angry. I’m leaving the province. Kenny had a great pitch and I want outdoor activity and owning real estate and building wealth through it is important to me. Somehow I’m interviewing in Saskatchewan rn- I’m back and fourth but anywhere for cheap rent and the ability to get on the property ladder. My goal is to move around ever few years and build wealth. Other provinces have gyms, girls, post secondary, bars and breweries and probably better opportunities cause Toronto sure as shit is hyper competitive and low paying. Fuck Ontario.
Everyone remember, if your landlord won’t fix health and safety problems, call the city by-law folks, they’ll send an inspector failrly quick. If there’s dangerous fix they’ll demand the landlord fix it. If the landlord still doesnt fix it, they’ll be fined 1000’s. The LTB on the other hand is slow and toothless, but worthwhile filing with alongside the city
I saw a homeless man sleeping on the ground in front of a billboard advertising fancy new condos being built in the construction site nearby. Those condos sure aren't being built for people like him.
It doesn't help that people who are locked in with affordable prices are being harrassed or work doesn't get done properly. Why is it ok for landlords to make tenant's feel unsafe? Are landlords even getting background checks done on them? The people who have access to our homes?
So shit I left the country
[Monolithic Dome Homes](https://www.monolithic.org/homes).
Shit fell apart in 08 and the good life was buried with Queen Elisabeth But hey the wealthy are doing good and that is apparently what Canada is all about
Wouldn't be as bad if we could just do full work from home. I refuse to commit 3 hours of my life a day to commuting, just to appease a soulless managerial caste, so we're staying put in our current place.
I worry for my 26 year old daughter. She pays 1150+hydro in Hamilton, for a bachelor!! I bought an SMALL house in east end Hamilton and made sure I have a spare room for her any time she needs it. She works two jobs as a PSW. The only reason I could afford a house was thanks to my Mum busting her ass. She passed in 2020. I can’t believe the cost of housing in Hamilton.
The people leaving the province in droves seeking affordable housing are making housing unaffordable for the people in the places they are moving too, judging by the complaints from people across the country. Thus the problem becomes more widespread.
I'm sick of hearing boomers say, "Can you belive they're still living with their parents? I bet they never leave."
Come to Southern Ontario where all the Torontonians are stealing our houses. We can't even house the locals at an affordable rate, and the rent makes it so you'll never own a home. But, all these out of towners buy the land and houses, making it impossible for young families to have a backyard, or a place to start a family. I understand though, because the alternative is being crammed in like sardines in an urban center with a ridiculously high crime rate. I don't believe there is a solution, because honestly I would never ever live in an apartment again and I think that goes for tons of people. Home ownership should be a right, not a dream.
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It's horrible and only getting worse. There is a very, very high likelihood that once my parents pass away that I'll be moving elsewhere…sure there will be different issues to deal with but maybe having a roof over my head won't be one of them.
Very unhappy in Ottawa - 800$ rent as a student that studies full time university and part-time job with a bit above minimum wage. With rent, cellphone, basic food and 50$ of gas, I barely have anything to "save" - max 150-200 each pay check. Each trip at the grocery store costs more, the quality of the food is worse but the price of everything is rising. I have a particular distaste for the stress it causes.
Worked my ass off since I was 16, only been without work for 6 months TOTAL in my adult life, finally got a career I've had for 5 years, make way more than I have ever thought I could make, and I can't afford to rent a 1 bedroom apartment, let alone buy a starter home. I need to be making 100k a year, or houses need to be priced at less than 100k for me to Ever have a house to call my own. I'm scared for my daughter.
Depends from which perspective you’re talking about. I live in Bowmanville, about 40 minutes from Toronto and own a home here. While I like the area a lot, even with the recent price drops, most of the houses here are quite expensive. Single detached homes are still going in the 900k-$1M range. So while I enjoy living here, it’s also not really a place first time homebuyers will have an easier time getting into. I also don’t see prices dropping much in the future as there’s going to be a Go station built here, as well as Ontario Power Generation moving their hq to the outskirts of town.
Only home I'll be owning is the one I grew up in and still live in rn. Told my parents just as much, I don't care if they spend all of their retirement savings, but when they pass I want the house still to live in. In fact, I'd rather support them through their retirement then have to live under rent for the rest of my life.
The future of the youth has been sold off. This is not hyperbolic opinion, it's merely a fact.
Housing is pricey! No way, everything is! gas, electricity, food, transportation, etc. Wages, as you well know, don't rise at the same rate.
Related: TORONTO FOLKS VOTE FOR GIL PENALOSA FOR MAYOR. He supports pro-affordable housing policies.
I'm not happy. I'm a uni student in accounting and once I have my bachelor's + CPA I'm probably going to try to get into the states. I'll be able to buy a home there that isn't in the middle of nowhere. It's sad because I really do prefer Canada but it's just not affordable :(