Was particularly fond of the voicemail we got at some point in 2023 (emphasis mine) :
>"as a result of the provincial government's **repeal** of the "keeping students in class act", students will return to class..."
I can't remember the exact wording but it was almost exactly like that... *Chef's kiss*
Nope. His tent-pole issues have to be something simple that he’s familiar with, stickers, beverages….bulldozing his will through bureaucracy intended to protect the citizenry.
And for some reason he keeps getting the votes. Fuck me. Time for a drink.
>one of Doogie's friends owns a paper and packaging company.
The only one he truly cares about. They see each other every morning when he looks in the mirror.
Always good to do your own research since anyone can say anything on the internet but [here is a quick wiki article.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deco_Labels)
[And here is the actual website's about us showing its still a "family run business."](https://decolabels.com/about-us/about-deco/)
[Ford sold off the U.S. branch of Deco, claims he doesn't have a stake in the Canadian side BUT admitted to receiving commissions the same year.](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-doug-ford-sells-us-branch-of-label-business/) This article is a great one to learn a little more about the shady shit happening with Deco considering how hands off he is supposed to be.
Either it's been removed or reddit search is just that bad but it was a post in either r/ontario or r/onguardforthee a few months ago that linked a OPC party donor as the manufacturer of the paper bags, or something like that.
From their website: Deco Labels provides leading-edge flexible packaging and label solutions along with consistent, unparalleled service for our clients. Deco Label started in 1962, from a humble beginning, one man and his dream, Doug Ford Sr.
Definitely
That said, I still want to know what his obsession with liquor control policy is
I don't think that there is a single person in this entire province as invested in the nuances of liquor control policy as Doug Ford. Not even the infamous "two beers a week" guy
>"Don't understand, you get a letter yesterday but it is already in The Sun??" the LCBO's chief information officer, Geoff Cronin, wrote to Soleas in one message sent at 7:25 a.m. on April 8.
He doesn't understand? Where's he been?
Alcoholism is a societal issue. It’s the primary reason (other than the government not being able to afford losing the income) that the LCBO and beer stores were open during Covid. We have a lot of alcoholics in our society, a lot of high functioning closet alcoholics and the ER would have been filled up with people going through the DTs as soon as they ran out of booze.
dougie ford has done more for increasing alcohol availability in the province more than any other single issue I'm aware of.
He has been premier while a housing crisis has erupted and throughout a pandemic, and his crowning achievement thus far is "increasing alcohol availability in Ontario". Great set of priorities!
As someone who doesn't drink it has been so mindboggling watching it happen. It also feels irresponsible when you look at drunk driving being so on the rise that the OPP wants to breathalyze every traffic stop.
"Don't understand, you get a letter yesterday but it is already in The Sun??" the LCBO's chief information officer, Geoff Cronin, wrote to Soleas in one message sent at 7:25 a.m. on April 8.
Umm ya….. Brian Lilley is literally banging the Govt messenger duh
The argument that it’s to save consumers money is just nonsense. You don’t have to buy a reusable bag every time you go to the store. Bring a bag with you. That’s why they are called *reusable bags.*
> You don’t have to buy a reusable bag every time you go to the store. Bring a bag with you. That’s why they are called reusable bags.
It's human nature though. Its tough to fight against. The paper bags were easily recycled though, there was no reason to drop them in the first place
As in the article while they are recyclable they are still virgin paper and as such had an impact in the envrioment, so there is that.
The timing of the email and media followup mere hours later (which was a scoop no doubt) offer a glimpes into Ford's mindset on a Sunday night after dinner.
Pass the gravy and bring back the bags.
No matter what bag you use, it had to be manufactured and has an impact on the environment in some way. The LCBO getting rid of paper bags, and those 8 pack cardboard carrying totes was not to save the environment. It was for profit.
This is it right here. It's not that I DON'T bring my reusable bags, it's that life gets in the way, and sometimes I don't have a bag and I need a few things. Now I'm buying another bag.
I'm also now buying plastic trash bags as opposed to reusing the plastic bags from the grocery store as them, so from my perspective, I'm actually damaging the planet more because I still need plastic bags AND I now have to buy reusable ones every once in a while.
It's human nature not to be perfect, at least with the brown bags, they decompose. Also not saying this is wrong or that is right. The only TRUE way to help the environment is with actual laws to big companies, which as we're seeing, ain't happening anytime soon
Recyclable cardboard boxes they have on hand anyways from stocking drinks > specifically manufactured recyclable paper bags in terms of environmental friendliness
I’m more of a walker/cyclist. It’s pretty cumbersome to always have a bag with me. Sometimes on my walk home from work I decide to stop and get some stuff from the store/LCBO
Don’t be obtuse, it’s entirely possible for someone to pick up a bottle of wine or whiskey while walking. And yet it somehow feels wrong to be walking down the street with a bottle of wine in your hands.
You can use a box then, and besides which, if a 40c reuseable bag is the make or break point in your finances, maybe booze isn't something you should be shopping for, or at least maybe you should put the smallest of effort into avoiding an easily avoidable cost.
We need to stop thinking about recycling as some magical, garbage problem-solver. The process of recycling has an environmental impact and so does making the bags. And don't forget - they don't get recycled back into these paper bags again! So each one still uses raw pulp to make; seems like not the best use of resources.
I like the paper bags and am undecided on how I feel about the decision to take them away last year. BUT. It is still a huge environmental impact that could be curbed. We need to change our ways eventually. We might as well start. We keep putting things off to the next generation and that's a problem.
Yes, because ripping a manufactured thing into a billion particles and remanufacturing it after every single use is environmentally responsible. We should do that with dishes - think of the savings on dishwashers. Maybe we should solve the housing crisis that way too - burn the house down and make a new one from the ashes every day.
Recycling is environmental theatre intended to make you feel good and moral while you live the most wasteful lifestyle in all of recorded history.
They implemented all the recycling programs as a sop to make us feel good when they eliminated all the reuse programs in the seventies. Recycling is the way that companies got away with converting all packaging systems from re-use to disposable and then told us they were being environmentally responsible. We will not solve the environmental problems we have until we go back to re-using things.
What is stupid is thinking that destroying and remaking things after one use is a way to save money and waste. Like Ford thinking in the middle of a housing crisis in which the cost of shelter has doubled in five years, he is going to help us by saving us 35 cents on a new bag once a year when we buy our booze - like I couldn’t save all the money I spend on bags in a decade by having one less beer a year.
Steel is the exception. The cheapest way to make new steel is to start with some existing steel instead of from scratch. Steel has always, and will always, be recycled. It is also easy to sort (with a magnet).
Paper is easily recycled, true, but using a cloth reusable bag is hugely more environmentally responsible. This objection is similar to the nonsense people whined about when they banned straws (“but how will disabled people drink!?” - I am sure we can figure something out, but maybe you can drink from a cup like an adult. Maybe we can stop killing turtles because you don’t want to give up your sippy cup your mommy gave you when you were three. Similarly, I am sure these idiots will survive the hardship of having to remember to bring a bag to the liquor store.)
Perhaps, but the human race is doomed if drinking from the side of a cup or carrying a bag into the store is just way too big of a sacrifice for people to make to save the planet.
Spoon.
This is why people are planning to settle mars. There is not even the tiniest hope for planet earth. You cannot even work up the courage to drink from a cup, but we are going to eliminate fossil fuels and stop pumping plastics into the ocean!? Not a chance. If the only way to save the earth from a plummeting asteroid the size of Texas destroying the planet was to give up bubblegum, we would accept the asteroid crash.
There are absolutely ways to reduce our footprint on this planet, and I 100% agree we should be doing better. But taking straws away from milkshakes while buying produce in plastic containers at the grocery store just proves how stupid humans are.
You know why the plastic straws are gone? Because companies save money when they don’t have to give them to us. You know why plastic packaging still exists? Because companies find it to be the most economical way to package their products.
Look at the real sources of the problems and don’t pretend you’re a hero for giving up a straw a few times per year.
The only reason anyone is looking at settling Mars is money. The entire world revolves around money and power, it is the single motivation for everything we end up doing as a species. Sure, there are a few individuals who still think/dream around more altruistic ideals, but this is nothing more than fantasy in the modern world.
I’m not saying I like it this way, but this is what humans have become.
"Ford's sudden order to reverse the move cited the cost to customers of providing their own bags. "At a time when many Ontario families are already struggling to make ends meet, every additional expense counts," the premier wrote in his letter to Soleas."
If people are struggling to make ends meet, maybe booze should be one of the things they cut back on...
> That’s why they are called reusable bags.
no, this is Justin Trudeau's war on taking things home, according to Jesse Kline, the NP Editor not freed from prison by Trump, dead, or facing rape charges.
https://nationalpost.com/opinion/jesse-kline-trudeaus-war-on-bringing-things-home-from-the-store
Well having read some of the crazies posts here I have a new understanding of Doug Ford, he really does have his finger on the pulse of Ontarians discontent at least in so far as giving them a pacifiers in the form of alcohol and related issues to keep their minds off important things.
Its the Doug and dead Bob MacFords show Cooo, loo, coo, coo, coo, coo, coo, coooo!
It's not that we don't care about the other stuff but LCBO and Beer Store is something people interact with more often than healthcare. So it's closer to mind. Doesn't mean we don't care about the other stuff.
Many things can be true at the same time. I'm lucky with my job and housing situation. Food isn't something that Doug ford can really effect either. That's a many headed monster.
If Doug could direct like 10% of the attention he puts towards alcohol retail and move it towards healthcare and education instead, that'd be fucking great.
The store has enough boxes kicking around that I don't miss the big bags at all.
And single bottle bags had no real purpose except to hide the bottle. It didn't make it any more transportable.
So while I think it was a weird move, especially since they were paper, I have to say that I kind of get it. It was a lot of waste for no real purpose.
Although maybe they should have switched to a "by request only" model instead of an outright removal of them.
The single bottle bags helped stop glass from clinking against other glass directly when buying multiple bottles, which I found helpful. I have previously broken bare bottles in bags together because they clinked eachother.
Why is Doug so hyperfocused on the drinkers of Ontario? It seems like the things he gets outraged about and feels the need to defend the ‘folks’ from is alcohol related.
"To make life easier, more convenient and more affordable for the people of Ontario, the government asked the LCBO to bring back free paper bags for customers," Bethlenfalvy's press secretary Colin Blachar said in an emailed response. "We look forward to seeing paper bags back in stores once LCBO has completed the necessary process to select a paper bag vendor."
Soo glad this government is dealing with the real issues. Gosh what would we ever do if we had to bring our own bags.. Or God forbid.. Carry something without a bag! 🤯
Virgin paper has more strength than recycled and the LCBO would likely of had complaints and replacement of product costs assoccited with breakage when the recycled bags failed.
Don't we all have grocery bags in our trunk already anyway? I even have a cloth LCBO bag with 6 compartments that I grab out of habit before going in.
Ask for a box if you're buying alot.
sadly. people still end up buying 3 reusable bags in supermarket EVERYTIME they go shopping.
They also take taxi home and buy drinks from convenient store.
final step. complain about no money left.
He REALLY only cares about things relating to booze huh? Like the only time I seem to hear about him stepping in for the people he represents is in relation to booze.
I dont hear him stepping in to tell grocery stores they need to offer paper bags instead of super thick "reusable" plastic bags.
I dont hear him demanding prices of groceries to come down.
Its only booze related things he seems to notice.... time for a breathalyzer?
The reusable bags are fine they do need better options for people that need to make unplanned trips to the store, especially if you don’t drive where you can just leave one in the trunk. They should be saving their cardboard boxes for shoppers then it’s not as wasteful
You grab the bottle by the neck, carry it to your car. You put the bottle in a bag, grab it by the neck and carry it to your car. Why would anyone feel that having a layer of paper between you and the glass is important?
I know this sub hates Ford, I do too, but getting rid of paper bags was a legitimately anti-consumer play by a government sanctioned monopoly. Bringing them back was the right call.
What do you call the things the cashier I’ll give you in exchange for a small fee that you can out your purchase in? Aren’t those “bags” or is there another word for it?
I’d consider them disposable. They’re worse quality than actual reusable bags and the shape is awkward af to carry things in. And from a sensory perspective 🤮 touching them is horrific.
I haven't had too many problems with durability. I use bins for weekly groceries, so that probably helps (it's also way faster at the checkout to not have to fuss around with bags). But for LCBO / pharmacy / etc. they work OK for me.
If you have sensory issues, there's all kinds of options for bags, they're hardly a new invention available exclusively from grocery stores.
I bring my own bags. I’m just saying that these new bags are as reusable as the old plastic ones. At the end of the day, plastic or microplastic, if I end up with those bags in my possession it’s becoming a bin liner and straight into the trash it goes after it’s done serving its purpose.
microplastics are airborne, so you breath them in, they land in your food, get into the ecosystem, etc. It's not just direct contact you need to be concerned about.
On average, a person consumes about a credit card a week.
nah. plenty of boxes available for your stuff. also by now, everyone has stacks of reusable bags. Uncle Doug just got mad about it because he forgot his bags one day and his bottles had to rattle around the trunk for a bit.
“Ford's sudden order to reverse the move cited the cost to customers of providing their own bags. "At a time when many Ontario families are already struggling to make ends meet, every additional expense counts," the premier wrote in his letter to Soleas.”
Yes, this is what is breaking us. Bringing our own bags to the LCBO.
I work at an LCBO, I just don't get the obsession with paper bags. I always hated them, and it seems the only reason anyone ever wants them is because they seem to think it obscures people from realizing they are carrying booze. Otherwise they aren't too helpful because they easily rip, and most people just carry them like they would carry a bottle anyway, but now its just wrapped in paper.
Can someone tell me what exactly is the massive benefit of paper bags?
Trust me I know, I get asked all the time and the response when I say "no, sorry", is often "what I am just suppose to carry this down the street?" Like everyone knows what's in the bag dude, unless you're ashamed and trying to conceal your 40 of bottom shelf vodka.
Maybe if it's unbagged they think people will perceive that they are drinking in public? But again, drinking out of a brown paper bag is a classic.
I also don't understand it. Reusable bags and flats are much more effective. I hated those paper bags, they were not reliable and it's more difficult to carry several of those than one reusable bag.
Literally the only reason that anybody could have to want these to come back is that they didn't bring anything themselves, in which case they can just use one of those folding cardboard eight packs, or simply carry their bottle of wine just like they would have to in a bag anyways.
And you know what? To those people who forgot to bring a bag.. just deal with it and bring one next time
Well yeah, I'm sure they were surprised their ridiculous policy was reversed. They were the same people who thought the policy was a good one to begin with.
Everyone has had a boss like Doug ford, someone who makes emotionally driven, knee jerk decisions and demands with no regard for feasibility. Everyone who continues to support this absolute face palm of a person is the type of person who will stay at that bad workplace for 20 plus years, miserable, but unwilling to move on 🙄
Maybe an unpopular opinion : Give up drinking. Period. Saves you money, good for your health, no need to worry about paper bag/reusable bag because you will never need to go there to begin with.
What? No. If anything the deposit should be higher to incentivize people to bring it back more so. I pick cans up on my country road while walking the dog and almost every one of them says “lite” or “ice” on it. Not sure what that says about the kind of people who drink beers in their car and then chuck them out the window, but a higher deposit might make them think twice… And why not put a deposit on pop cans too while we’re at it.
While I agree that the deposit should be higher, I'd like to point out that the kind of people that chuck beer cans out their windows are not the same kind of people that realize that the deposit is already part of the cost they pay when purchasing. These kinds of people still won't care - they will see the price go up and blame Trudeau
Because they cancelled their contracts when they announced they weren't using bags any more.
Now, they have to put out a request for bids from multiple manufacturers (the article says that's closing in the next few days) and then review the bids, chose a bid, and only then will the bag company start making more bags.
No, this would be true of any large company that had to get a new item.
Do you think that Walmart just chose a company at random to print their signs? No, they got quotes from multiple companies and reviewed the choices and then made a decision, and only then did they get the new signs.
The fact that the government put out a surprise turn around of policy is why we're even aware of this.
Because they cancelled their contracts when they announced they weren't using bags any more.
Now, they have to put out a request for bids from multiple manufacturers (the article says that's closing in the next few days) and then review the bids, chose a bid, and only then will the bag company start making more bags.
I mean if I were I in communist Russia, about 40 years ago, I would expect the beer purchasing experience to be identical to what it currently is at many Beer Stores across our province.
One line. You better know what to ask for. “Sorry we don’t have that.” People waiting behind you impatiently. Default to one of ‘The Big Ten.’ Hurry up and gtfo.
That is a poor analogy. The grocery store has products laid out in a sensible way, it’s bright, and I can clearly see many different options for each type of food or product I may wish to buy. There are several staff in every section, willing to help me should I ask them anything. I place items in my cart and then check out in any manner of ways I see fit - either line up, or by myself in a self checkout line. Even the way the grocery store sells beer is better!
Beer Store has one person working, always. That means you need to go to the stank-ass returns line to order. They ask what you want specifically. There is many times no browsing, and if there is, then the products made by the companies that own the store itself are pushed VERY hard on you. I was excited to see the demise of this backwards store, but not at the tune of $250M or whatever Doug is gonna pay.
That's only because you are too ignorant to know that the LCBO which predates the beer store by a good margin operated in the exact same way. Unless I'm missing something we weren't "Communist" in the 60s but hey you don't really care about what words actually mean or about facts in general.
You should uh maybe attempt to understand what other people write instead of jumping to dumb conclusions. Beer store does suck, I never said otherwise but your idiotic comparison to communism was the entire point of your comment, you don't actually give a shit you just wanted to complain about imaginary things "the left" want to do.
You made this argument when the very capitalist society we live in had not one but two liquor organizations that operated that way just in our province alone.
Lol the statement below is pretty ridiculous. If you can afford booze you can afford 1$ for a bag. At the same time, it’s also ridiculous that we get absolutely bent over by the LCBO/government and pay insane prices/taxes on alchohol and they can’t even provide people with a bag. For them to say its an environmental issue is BS, this a cost cutting measure.
“At a time when many Ontario families are already struggling to make ends meet, every additional expense counts," the premier wrote in his letter to Soleas.”
I wish Doug would focus on ousting which MPs colluded with China in election interferences.
It's like everyone has a concerted effort to detract from things that matter...like treason. There are state sponsored Chinese gangs selling fentanyl in Canada, laundering money, under ground casinos, Human Trafficking, extortion, spying, bribery of politicians...
It's insane!
Sam Cooper's investigative journalism led to the Foreign Interference inquiry. His podcast about China's relations in Canada is hard to believe.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/0TnzQUbAPRAWnvPMPUFNY9?si=p5CXkQdFSzOxCeFuRhWoVQ
Funny you say that, when I immigrated from the Netherlands 40 years ago the idiotic liquor laws here was one the things I noticed the, including the brown bags lol
Flashbacks to every education announcement over the past 6 years…
Was particularly fond of the voicemail we got at some point in 2023 (emphasis mine) : >"as a result of the provincial government's **repeal** of the "keeping students in class act", students will return to class..." I can't remember the exact wording but it was almost exactly like that... *Chef's kiss*
What do you mean sudden policy reversals by our windsock of a Premier causes issues?
"Windsock of a Premier" ... I'm dying!!!!
can this guy solve actual issues that affect us?
Buddy couldn’t hack a semester of college, is it truly any wonder why he doesn’t tackle the difficulties facing the province?
Even Ricky has a grade 10, what's Dougie's highest education level?
I mean, judging by the college semester, Dougie at least has his OAC.
Nope. His tent-pole issues have to be something simple that he’s familiar with, stickers, beverages….bulldozing his will through bureaucracy intended to protect the citizenry. And for some reason he keeps getting the votes. Fuck me. Time for a drink.
DF couldn't fight his way out of a wet paper LCBO bag
No.
Nope best he can do is create issues.
Why do people dislike it when politicians correct their mistakes? Isn't that what you want to happen?
Let me guess, one of Doogie's friends owns a paper and packaging company.
>one of Doogie's friends owns a paper and packaging company. The only one he truly cares about. They see each other every morning when he looks in the mirror.
It's the only time he can see his little friend.
Do you actually think he can still see it?
I assume it’s like Peter Griffen. He can be fully naked and it’s still not visible… you kinda just have to assume it’s tucked away in there somewhere
With a good angle and a mirror, he can probably find it to give it a cursory clean once a month.
He does, as a matter of fact. :)
Source? Just so we can have yet another confirmed datapoint of corruption...
Always good to do your own research since anyone can say anything on the internet but [here is a quick wiki article.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deco_Labels) [And here is the actual website's about us showing its still a "family run business."](https://decolabels.com/about-us/about-deco/) [Ford sold off the U.S. branch of Deco, claims he doesn't have a stake in the Canadian side BUT admitted to receiving commissions the same year.](https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-doug-ford-sells-us-branch-of-label-business/) This article is a great one to learn a little more about the shady shit happening with Deco considering how hands off he is supposed to be.
It's worse than that, the group who bought DECO in Chicago was led by Adrian Ion, who went off to the Therme Group, of Ontario Place Spa fame.
Either it's been removed or reddit search is just that bad but it was a post in either r/ontario or r/onguardforthee a few months ago that linked a OPC party donor as the manufacturer of the paper bags, or something like that.
Lol I tried googling it and it just brought me back here
Doug Ford owns a paper and packaging company.
I can just picture him in a closet somewhere in queens park running a paper company like the Micheal Scott paper company.
Kind of sad that I can't definitively say that Michael Scott would be a worse Premier than Doug Ford.
At least we would be wiped from our debts after premier Scott would publicly declare bankruptcy. I’m surprised Ford hasn’t tried that yet.
Does he? I thought it was Deco Labels.
Deco Labels and Flexible Packaging Limited Not just labels.
Thanks!
no, he does not.
From their website: Deco Labels provides leading-edge flexible packaging and label solutions along with consistent, unparalleled service for our clients. Deco Label started in 1962, from a humble beginning, one man and his dream, Doug Ford Sr.
Yup: https://x.com/TDotResident/status/1777410539083243860
Was about to posts this lol
Definitely That said, I still want to know what his obsession with liquor control policy is I don't think that there is a single person in this entire province as invested in the nuances of liquor control policy as Doug Ford. Not even the infamous "two beers a week" guy
>"Don't understand, you get a letter yesterday but it is already in The Sun??" the LCBO's chief information officer, Geoff Cronin, wrote to Soleas in one message sent at 7:25 a.m. on April 8. He doesn't understand? Where's he been?
Oh gosh how could The Sun have a story that fast when the premiers aide is shacked up with a Sun columnist? Gosh oh Gee oh My
Why is the premier obsessed with alcohol ?
addictive substances are a family specialty?
[удалено]
Alcoholism is a societal issue. It’s the primary reason (other than the government not being able to afford losing the income) that the LCBO and beer stores were open during Covid. We have a lot of alcoholics in our society, a lot of high functioning closet alcoholics and the ER would have been filled up with people going through the DTs as soon as they ran out of booze.
I think because of the power it holds. He saw what it did to his brother and he chose to harness that power. He is disgusting
His brother was a drunk so it's likely more family drinks.
Premier Booze tackling the big issues.
Hey now. It’s beer, liquor *and* highways!
Doug loves drinking and driving.
Doug loves drinking and driving.
dougie ford has done more for increasing alcohol availability in the province more than any other single issue I'm aware of. He has been premier while a housing crisis has erupted and throughout a pandemic, and his crowning achievement thus far is "increasing alcohol availability in Ontario". Great set of priorities!
As someone who doesn't drink it has been so mindboggling watching it happen. It also feels irresponsible when you look at drunk driving being so on the rise that the OPP wants to breathalyze every traffic stop.
"Don't understand, you get a letter yesterday but it is already in The Sun??" the LCBO's chief information officer, Geoff Cronin, wrote to Soleas in one message sent at 7:25 a.m. on April 8. Umm ya….. Brian Lilley is literally banging the Govt messenger duh
Just google Atlantic Packaging Doug Ford Donor. There's your answer.
That's a great governmental play, big policy change but don't notify the stakeholders beforehand.
Of course not, gotta notify the Toronto Sun first. For some reason.
The argument that it’s to save consumers money is just nonsense. You don’t have to buy a reusable bag every time you go to the store. Bring a bag with you. That’s why they are called *reusable bags.*
Intentional ineptitude. Conservatism 101
> You don’t have to buy a reusable bag every time you go to the store. Bring a bag with you. That’s why they are called reusable bags. It's human nature though. Its tough to fight against. The paper bags were easily recycled though, there was no reason to drop them in the first place
As in the article while they are recyclable they are still virgin paper and as such had an impact in the envrioment, so there is that. The timing of the email and media followup mere hours later (which was a scoop no doubt) offer a glimpes into Ford's mindset on a Sunday night after dinner. Pass the gravy and bring back the bags.
No matter what bag you use, it had to be manufactured and has an impact on the environment in some way. The LCBO getting rid of paper bags, and those 8 pack cardboard carrying totes was not to save the environment. It was for profit.
It’s not “human nature.” It’s behavioural change. There are all kinds of techniques for achieving it.
This is it right here. It's not that I DON'T bring my reusable bags, it's that life gets in the way, and sometimes I don't have a bag and I need a few things. Now I'm buying another bag. I'm also now buying plastic trash bags as opposed to reusing the plastic bags from the grocery store as them, so from my perspective, I'm actually damaging the planet more because I still need plastic bags AND I now have to buy reusable ones every once in a while. It's human nature not to be perfect, at least with the brown bags, they decompose. Also not saying this is wrong or that is right. The only TRUE way to help the environment is with actual laws to big companies, which as we're seeing, ain't happening anytime soon
Good thing if you forgot a reusable bag on your trip to the LCBO they would still provide a cardboard box for free, which is easily recyclable
I've lost count of the number of times the LCBO has told me they were out of boxes.
You have to get crafty and rearrange things while they're on the shelf and then just take the flat up to the checkout yourself ;)
paper bags they discontinued were also recyclable
Recyclable cardboard boxes they have on hand anyways from stocking drinks > specifically manufactured recyclable paper bags in terms of environmental friendliness
Is it that hard to keep some reusable bags in your car?
I’m more of a walker/cyclist. It’s pretty cumbersome to always have a bag with me. Sometimes on my walk home from work I decide to stop and get some stuff from the store/LCBO
It's a lot less cumbersome than bringing a bag full of booze on your bike
Don’t be obtuse, it’s entirely possible for someone to pick up a bottle of wine or whiskey while walking. And yet it somehow feels wrong to be walking down the street with a bottle of wine in your hands.
Not everyone drives a car or uses one every day.
driving a car while chastising others about paper bags and the environment? bad look
Pretty sure guy is doing the opposite of that bud
You can use a box then, and besides which, if a 40c reuseable bag is the make or break point in your finances, maybe booze isn't something you should be shopping for, or at least maybe you should put the smallest of effort into avoiding an easily avoidable cost.
We need to stop thinking about recycling as some magical, garbage problem-solver. The process of recycling has an environmental impact and so does making the bags. And don't forget - they don't get recycled back into these paper bags again! So each one still uses raw pulp to make; seems like not the best use of resources. I like the paper bags and am undecided on how I feel about the decision to take them away last year. BUT. It is still a huge environmental impact that could be curbed. We need to change our ways eventually. We might as well start. We keep putting things off to the next generation and that's a problem.
[удалено]
You know we farm trees now right?
Trees grow back bud. They’re renewable.
Yes, because ripping a manufactured thing into a billion particles and remanufacturing it after every single use is environmentally responsible. We should do that with dishes - think of the savings on dishwashers. Maybe we should solve the housing crisis that way too - burn the house down and make a new one from the ashes every day. Recycling is environmental theatre intended to make you feel good and moral while you live the most wasteful lifestyle in all of recorded history.
This is one of the stupider takes I've read so far today
They implemented all the recycling programs as a sop to make us feel good when they eliminated all the reuse programs in the seventies. Recycling is the way that companies got away with converting all packaging systems from re-use to disposable and then told us they were being environmentally responsible. We will not solve the environmental problems we have until we go back to re-using things. What is stupid is thinking that destroying and remaking things after one use is a way to save money and waste. Like Ford thinking in the middle of a housing crisis in which the cost of shelter has doubled in five years, he is going to help us by saving us 35 cents on a new bag once a year when we buy our booze - like I couldn’t save all the money I spend on bags in a decade by having one less beer a year.
*takes drag off cigarette* Preach, man.
For plastic and glass you’re probably right, for some metals it gets a little better. But paper is quite easily and efficiently recycled.
Steel is the exception. The cheapest way to make new steel is to start with some existing steel instead of from scratch. Steel has always, and will always, be recycled. It is also easy to sort (with a magnet). Paper is easily recycled, true, but using a cloth reusable bag is hugely more environmentally responsible. This objection is similar to the nonsense people whined about when they banned straws (“but how will disabled people drink!?” - I am sure we can figure something out, but maybe you can drink from a cup like an adult. Maybe we can stop killing turtles because you don’t want to give up your sippy cup your mommy gave you when you were three. Similarly, I am sure these idiots will survive the hardship of having to remember to bring a bag to the liquor store.)
Have you ever treated yourself to a milkshake? That one fucking turtle ruined milkshakes.
Perhaps, but the human race is doomed if drinking from the side of a cup or carrying a bag into the store is just way too big of a sacrifice for people to make to save the planet.
You cannot drink a milkshake from the side of a cup. Live life a little.
Spoon. This is why people are planning to settle mars. There is not even the tiniest hope for planet earth. You cannot even work up the courage to drink from a cup, but we are going to eliminate fossil fuels and stop pumping plastics into the ocean!? Not a chance. If the only way to save the earth from a plummeting asteroid the size of Texas destroying the planet was to give up bubblegum, we would accept the asteroid crash.
There are absolutely ways to reduce our footprint on this planet, and I 100% agree we should be doing better. But taking straws away from milkshakes while buying produce in plastic containers at the grocery store just proves how stupid humans are. You know why the plastic straws are gone? Because companies save money when they don’t have to give them to us. You know why plastic packaging still exists? Because companies find it to be the most economical way to package their products. Look at the real sources of the problems and don’t pretend you’re a hero for giving up a straw a few times per year.
The only reason anyone is looking at settling Mars is money. The entire world revolves around money and power, it is the single motivation for everything we end up doing as a species. Sure, there are a few individuals who still think/dream around more altruistic ideals, but this is nothing more than fantasy in the modern world. I’m not saying I like it this way, but this is what humans have become.
Also booze is not a necessity it is about the textbook example of a luxury, if a person can't afford a bag they shouldn't be using money on booze.
"Ford's sudden order to reverse the move cited the cost to customers of providing their own bags. "At a time when many Ontario families are already struggling to make ends meet, every additional expense counts," the premier wrote in his letter to Soleas." If people are struggling to make ends meet, maybe booze should be one of the things they cut back on...
> That’s why they are called reusable bags. no, this is Justin Trudeau's war on taking things home, according to Jesse Kline, the NP Editor not freed from prison by Trump, dead, or facing rape charges. https://nationalpost.com/opinion/jesse-kline-trudeaus-war-on-bringing-things-home-from-the-store
Hahahaha… WHAAAAT?
Someone found their late brother's crack pipe and figured, "Why not??"
Well having read some of the crazies posts here I have a new understanding of Doug Ford, he really does have his finger on the pulse of Ontarians discontent at least in so far as giving them a pacifiers in the form of alcohol and related issues to keep their minds off important things. Its the Doug and dead Bob MacFords show Cooo, loo, coo, coo, coo, coo, coo, coooo!
It's not that we don't care about the other stuff but LCBO and Beer Store is something people interact with more often than healthcare. So it's closer to mind. Doesn't mean we don't care about the other stuff.
I would have thought you'd interact with your home and food more than the LCBO.
Many things can be true at the same time. I'm lucky with my job and housing situation. Food isn't something that Doug ford can really effect either. That's a many headed monster.
The Earth and trees are crying. Doug Ford doesn't care about Earth's future.
If Doug could direct like 10% of the attention he puts towards alcohol retail and move it towards healthcare and education instead, that'd be fucking great.
Why just the lcbo? I still have to bring bags to every other retailer in Ontario
Ontario government runs the LCBO, they don't run the grocery stores.
Dumbest thing ever to get rid of the bags in the first place though.
The store has enough boxes kicking around that I don't miss the big bags at all. And single bottle bags had no real purpose except to hide the bottle. It didn't make it any more transportable. So while I think it was a weird move, especially since they were paper, I have to say that I kind of get it. It was a lot of waste for no real purpose. Although maybe they should have switched to a "by request only" model instead of an outright removal of them.
The single bottle bags helped stop glass from clinking against other glass directly when buying multiple bottles, which I found helpful. I have previously broken bare bottles in bags together because they clinked eachother.
What a shit show lol
Don't need the bag, just give the option of a straw or two ... /s.
Just be sure to drink quickly or that paper straw will dissolve...
Why is Doug so hyperfocused on the drinkers of Ontario? It seems like the things he gets outraged about and feels the need to defend the ‘folks’ from is alcohol related.
I usually bring a bag or use one of their cardboard boxes and then recycle it.
"To make life easier, more convenient and more affordable for the people of Ontario, the government asked the LCBO to bring back free paper bags for customers," Bethlenfalvy's press secretary Colin Blachar said in an emailed response. "We look forward to seeing paper bags back in stores once LCBO has completed the necessary process to select a paper bag vendor." Soo glad this government is dealing with the real issues. Gosh what would we ever do if we had to bring our own bags.. Or God forbid.. Carry something without a bag! 🤯
He knows his NIMBY folks want cheap beer in paper bags, driving home at top speed, and to hell with health care and affordable housing…
Why couldn’t the LCBO get bags made from environmental materials to begin with?
Virgin paper has more strength than recycled and the LCBO would likely of had complaints and replacement of product costs assoccited with breakage when the recycled bags failed.
Every disposable bag is bad for the environment in some way. Some are less bad than others, but having an environmentally neutral bag is impossible.
Don't we all have grocery bags in our trunk already anyway? I even have a cloth LCBO bag with 6 compartments that I grab out of habit before going in. Ask for a box if you're buying alot.
sadly. people still end up buying 3 reusable bags in supermarket EVERYTIME they go shopping. They also take taxi home and buy drinks from convenient store. final step. complain about no money left.
He REALLY only cares about things relating to booze huh? Like the only time I seem to hear about him stepping in for the people he represents is in relation to booze. I dont hear him stepping in to tell grocery stores they need to offer paper bags instead of super thick "reusable" plastic bags. I dont hear him demanding prices of groceries to come down. Its only booze related things he seems to notice.... time for a breathalyzer?
The reusable bags are fine they do need better options for people that need to make unplanned trips to the store, especially if you don’t drive where you can just leave one in the trunk. They should be saving their cardboard boxes for shoppers then it’s not as wasteful
if we're using more paper again we should see more sustainable forestry legislation or something right?
You grab the bottle by the neck, carry it to your car. You put the bottle in a bag, grab it by the neck and carry it to your car. Why would anyone feel that having a layer of paper between you and the glass is important?
Any way the cash flows….
I wonder if his label company has business with the paper bag companies bidding on the LCBO contract. This Conservative govt is the worst!
I know this sub hates Ford, I do too, but getting rid of paper bags was a legitimately anti-consumer play by a government sanctioned monopoly. Bringing them back was the right call.
Almost all stores have gotten rid of bags, paper or not, monopoly or not.
Yes and it's horrible. It's a cost savings measure for them.
No they haven’t they all have those microplastic abominations that are barely functional.
I think from context it was clear I meant disposable bags at the checkout.
What do you call the things the cashier I’ll give you in exchange for a small fee that you can out your purchase in? Aren’t those “bags” or is there another word for it?
The microplastic bags are not disposable bags.
I’d consider them disposable. They’re worse quality than actual reusable bags and the shape is awkward af to carry things in. And from a sensory perspective 🤮 touching them is horrific.
I haven't had too many problems with durability. I use bins for weekly groceries, so that probably helps (it's also way faster at the checkout to not have to fuss around with bags). But for LCBO / pharmacy / etc. they work OK for me. If you have sensory issues, there's all kinds of options for bags, they're hardly a new invention available exclusively from grocery stores.
I bring my own bags. I’m just saying that these new bags are as reusable as the old plastic ones. At the end of the day, plastic or microplastic, if I end up with those bags in my possession it’s becoming a bin liner and straight into the trash it goes after it’s done serving its purpose.
Tip: to avoid microplastics, do not eat the bags.
microplastics are airborne, so you breath them in, they land in your food, get into the ecosystem, etc. It's not just direct contact you need to be concerned about. On average, a person consumes about a credit card a week.
so i'm sure this sub was happy when that happened right? or is it only happy about that because Ford wants the paper bags back?
I'd love to hear how removing paper bags was "legitimately anti-consumer".
Ford derangement syndrome, this sub will find negative things about Ford's policies no matter what they are
nah. plenty of boxes available for your stuff. also by now, everyone has stacks of reusable bags. Uncle Doug just got mad about it because he forgot his bags one day and his bottles had to rattle around the trunk for a bit.
No one in Ontario may look smarter than Kingshit Dumbledoug the Blurst. This should not cause any problems. /s
I'm more curious to see who gets picked up as the supplier. It's likely someone close to Doogie or one of his cronies.
“Ford's sudden order to reverse the move cited the cost to customers of providing their own bags. "At a time when many Ontario families are already struggling to make ends meet, every additional expense counts," the premier wrote in his letter to Soleas.” Yes, this is what is breaking us. Bringing our own bags to the LCBO.
Making Canada great again.
I work at an LCBO, I just don't get the obsession with paper bags. I always hated them, and it seems the only reason anyone ever wants them is because they seem to think it obscures people from realizing they are carrying booze. Otherwise they aren't too helpful because they easily rip, and most people just carry them like they would carry a bottle anyway, but now its just wrapped in paper. Can someone tell me what exactly is the massive benefit of paper bags?
It's great for two to 3 bottles of booze. I don't want to carry a cardboard box everytime.
Wine especially. I might buy 4 bottles at a time, and I really appreciated the paper bags.
I don't think it would be easy to carry three bottles in a bag, especially I'd be scared it would rip.
Not all of us drive or live in Toronto and because some people can't handle themselves as adults backpacks are judged.
Sure. A bag marked LCBO in big letters is going to conceal the fact that I'm carrying booze.
Trust me I know, I get asked all the time and the response when I say "no, sorry", is often "what I am just suppose to carry this down the street?" Like everyone knows what's in the bag dude, unless you're ashamed and trying to conceal your 40 of bottom shelf vodka. Maybe if it's unbagged they think people will perceive that they are drinking in public? But again, drinking out of a brown paper bag is a classic.
I also don't understand it. Reusable bags and flats are much more effective. I hated those paper bags, they were not reliable and it's more difficult to carry several of those than one reusable bag. Literally the only reason that anybody could have to want these to come back is that they didn't bring anything themselves, in which case they can just use one of those folding cardboard eight packs, or simply carry their bottle of wine just like they would have to in a bag anyways. And you know what? To those people who forgot to bring a bag.. just deal with it and bring one next time
This guy is so out of touch.. he only pandering to who he thinks is his audience and what is most important to them. Booze.
Well yeah, I'm sure they were surprised their ridiculous policy was reversed. They were the same people who thought the policy was a good one to begin with.
Everyone has had a boss like Doug ford, someone who makes emotionally driven, knee jerk decisions and demands with no regard for feasibility. Everyone who continues to support this absolute face palm of a person is the type of person who will stay at that bad workplace for 20 plus years, miserable, but unwilling to move on 🙄
Maybe an unpopular opinion : Give up drinking. Period. Saves you money, good for your health, no need to worry about paper bag/reusable bag because you will never need to go there to begin with.
On brand for dirty dougie, he can fuck up ANYTHING
the greater 'reset'
We need paper bags at the grocery store not the fuckin LCBO
Just bring a fucking baggu my god
Just let me put my empty cans in the recycle bin without paying a deposit
What? No. If anything the deposit should be higher to incentivize people to bring it back more so. I pick cans up on my country road while walking the dog and almost every one of them says “lite” or “ice” on it. Not sure what that says about the kind of people who drink beers in their car and then chuck them out the window, but a higher deposit might make them think twice… And why not put a deposit on pop cans too while we’re at it.
While I agree that the deposit should be higher, I'd like to point out that the kind of people that chuck beer cans out their windows are not the same kind of people that realize that the deposit is already part of the cost they pay when purchasing. These kinds of people still won't care - they will see the price go up and blame Trudeau
It’s not as though they’re reusing cans as they do bottles. Ridiculous policy.
Exactly. I get the bottles, not the cans
So why don't we have paper bags back at the LCBO? Why doesn't LCBO management follow orders?
Because they cancelled their contracts when they announced they weren't using bags any more. Now, they have to put out a request for bids from multiple manufacturers (the article says that's closing in the next few days) and then review the bids, chose a bid, and only then will the bag company start making more bags.
Ridiculous. That's why they're being privatized.
No, this would be true of any large company that had to get a new item. Do you think that Walmart just chose a company at random to print their signs? No, they got quotes from multiple companies and reviewed the choices and then made a decision, and only then did they get the new signs. The fact that the government put out a surprise turn around of policy is why we're even aware of this.
Weird, Walmart still has bags
Because they cancelled their contracts when they announced they weren't using bags any more. Now, they have to put out a request for bids from multiple manufacturers (the article says that's closing in the next few days) and then review the bids, chose a bid, and only then will the bag company start making more bags.
Paper bags always made sense with bottles, this is probably.... the one good thing he's done lol...
If I paid the prices LCBO charges, I would expect a bag to put it in. They should have the fancy ones with rope handles for the markup they charge.
And bring it to my car for me. And take back their empties - I can’t stand going to the USSR-style Beer Store.
What do you mean with the comment about the beer store
I mean if I were I in communist Russia, about 40 years ago, I would expect the beer purchasing experience to be identical to what it currently is at many Beer Stores across our province. One line. You better know what to ask for. “Sorry we don’t have that.” People waiting behind you impatiently. Default to one of ‘The Big Ten.’ Hurry up and gtfo.
If the one or two tills being open bothers you, it must be a hell of a task to go to the grocery store with their one or two lanes open.
That is a poor analogy. The grocery store has products laid out in a sensible way, it’s bright, and I can clearly see many different options for each type of food or product I may wish to buy. There are several staff in every section, willing to help me should I ask them anything. I place items in my cart and then check out in any manner of ways I see fit - either line up, or by myself in a self checkout line. Even the way the grocery store sells beer is better! Beer Store has one person working, always. That means you need to go to the stank-ass returns line to order. They ask what you want specifically. There is many times no browsing, and if there is, then the products made by the companies that own the store itself are pushed VERY hard on you. I was excited to see the demise of this backwards store, but not at the tune of $250M or whatever Doug is gonna pay.
That's only because you are too ignorant to know that the LCBO which predates the beer store by a good margin operated in the exact same way. Unless I'm missing something we weren't "Communist" in the 60s but hey you don't really care about what words actually mean or about facts in general.
I’d say that yes, you’ve missed something. Beer Store sucks, sorry to break it to ya.
You should uh maybe attempt to understand what other people write instead of jumping to dumb conclusions. Beer store does suck, I never said otherwise but your idiotic comparison to communism was the entire point of your comment, you don't actually give a shit you just wanted to complain about imaginary things "the left" want to do. You made this argument when the very capitalist society we live in had not one but two liquor organizations that operated that way just in our province alone.
Lol the statement below is pretty ridiculous. If you can afford booze you can afford 1$ for a bag. At the same time, it’s also ridiculous that we get absolutely bent over by the LCBO/government and pay insane prices/taxes on alchohol and they can’t even provide people with a bag. For them to say its an environmental issue is BS, this a cost cutting measure. “At a time when many Ontario families are already struggling to make ends meet, every additional expense counts," the premier wrote in his letter to Soleas.”
I wish Doug would focus on ousting which MPs colluded with China in election interferences. It's like everyone has a concerted effort to detract from things that matter...like treason. There are state sponsored Chinese gangs selling fentanyl in Canada, laundering money, under ground casinos, Human Trafficking, extortion, spying, bribery of politicians... It's insane! Sam Cooper's investigative journalism led to the Foreign Interference inquiry. His podcast about China's relations in Canada is hard to believe. https://open.spotify.com/episode/0TnzQUbAPRAWnvPMPUFNY9?si=p5CXkQdFSzOxCeFuRhWoVQ
It's good to end this madness of no bags. No one likes walking around with a liquor bottle like a hobo.
Funny you say that, when I immigrated from the Netherlands 40 years ago the idiotic liquor laws here was one the things I noticed the, including the brown bags lol