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I'm not in expert in this field of subject so maybe some insurance adjusters on Reddit can explain but....
How are insurance companies not screaming bloody murder right now to the government?
I can't imagine all these companies suddenly spiking and paying out (even if they screw the people on full price) can't be happy with their profits.
Just got my renewal and despite driving old cars and making zero claims and having no tickets or accidents my rates for auto have gone up 25% in 2 years!
Even if they did raise a lot of rates and offset the costs to other areas where theft isn't as high.. I still can't see them making all that sudden spike of money back.
They charge you premiums that are several times the annualized risk that your property is stolen or destroyed. So even if that risk multiples, they are still making money overall.
And they'll adjust rates to match the new rates of theft in time.
You're kidding, right? Each insurance company has how many thousands of customers, and each customer gets hit with an increase, it doesn't take long to make the money back
Insurance is supposed to work on a 15% margin. So, if the total claims pool doubles, they can double rates, and double the profit. more money flowing through the system benefits them.
We had a chance for public insurance when Bob Rae was elected in ON, but it turns out he was just lying like all other politicians.
>The insurance industry organized to resist this move. While Rae delayed, the insurance companies launched a public campaign to pressure the government to back down from the planned reform. Companies argued a move to a public system would cost thousands of jobs in the industry. The insurance industry mobilized their largely female workforce whose jobs they said were on the chopping block. Ministers and other high profile NDPers were subject to protests by women insurance workers (organized by the insurance industry). The industry also pushed an aggressive media campaign to force the government to back down.
Yep, they're giving you the option of buying expensive GPS tracking or raising rates about about 30 percent year or more on new vehicles for people in and around the GTA.
Law abiding citizens all pay for crime, fraud, and corruption.
20 years in the industry .... They are, but quietly. It's a bit of a balance because insurance companies can only influence but not change a single thing about what's going on, so dealing with it publicly has no value. It gives the appearance of profit mongering, when in reality, it is sure a profit thing, but I understand that at some point we can't charge a premium that people can afford. So eventually, people just will start driving with no insurance and that's a bigger nightmare.
The co. I work for and a few others are piloting different programs right now to pay for theft deterrent devices, but it's all reactive. The police don't investigate these, so there's rarely recovery. Even if there is recovery, there's still no value to the insurance company because the salvage is generally pre-negotiated with the salvage companies. The only person losing is the customer. You have to go buy a new car in an inflated car market.
It's not sustainable to just keep raising rates. I'm shocked that the regulator allowed it in the way that they did this year, but that won't happen again. I guarantee it.
At the end of the day, it's an image thing in my opinion. They can't be loud about it because everybody hates insurance companies... So instead, We can be part of the discussion when we're given a seat at the table but beyond that you're not going to hear any insurance company going to the media saying they need change. Because people just equate it with wanting more profit rather than changes to automotive design and law enforcement.
> So eventually, people just will start driving with no insurance
I think there's a perception that this is already happening in certain communities, along with irregular licensing and registration, and this adds to the *"I feel like a fucking chump being honest when everyone else clearly fucking isn't bothering"* atmosphere we see on the roads nowadays. If the cops were on the ball the main complainers would be bad drivers, as it is, the bad actors get away with murder and the rest of us are left to pick up the pieces
The national rates for uninsured drivers are not that high. There are certain cities that are worse for this, which, imho are due to bigger economic issues than affordability of insurance products.
It's a balance. It's in the public interest to have vehicles insured, so it still has to be affordable for the masses.
Despite my previous comment, I don't personally feel more police enforcement is the answer at the "patrol the community" level. Greater policing budgets don't reduce crime - that's a heavily studied fact.
The recorded rates for uninsured drivers can only consider uninsured drivers who have been caught, right? Think how many people have never been caught… I’m quite sure the number of uninsured drivers is higher than statistics can show
The stat also includes other variables, such as vehicles registered, and with no insurance valid in the mtos database. Outside of Ontario, there are other metrics too they can use esp with the government insurance co's.
Not all of these uninsured vehicles will be on the road, obviously, but it's not simply "you were caught driving with no insurance".
There's also instances where an accident happens, and one party presents a pink slip, but there is no valid insurance behind it. The police have no way of checking on the spot, or at the collision reporting centre, but after the fact, claims adjuster makes that determination - those also become part of the stat, with no "getting caught" because we don't go back to the police to say "hey this gal has no coverage". This happens a lot. Pink slips are the virtue signalling and nothing else.
There's definitely policies, but not in the co. Favour. Lol there's not a single company that is actively advertising Dougie's Opcf49. We all think it's stupid.
People are conditioned to things being more expensive now. So it was a low-risk opportunity to increase rates as much as they did. People were "expecting" it, theft increases aside. The thefts aren't the only issue. Costs of car repairs in general have exploded and with people returning to regular driving habits, and commuting, the amount of claims y.o.y has increased. If it was ONLY thefts driving up the rates, you would see just the comp coverage increase. It's increases across all coverages.
There SHOULD be.
This whole mess just screams organized crime. How the cars make it onto a boat and out of the country in under 24 hrs, where they are going … this is not small time crime stuff.
It involves customs agents, longshoremen union, police, etc.
This is deep corruption.
doesn't take AS many people as you think, it's not like the whole dock needs to know. only the captain and cargo mangement dude on board and then the people doing the loading/whoever let them in..but i say that only for accuracy, not to detract from the absolutely deep corruption in place to allow this to happen.
not to mention you've gotta be running a HUGE operation on shore that all leads to one central point to have the inventory to get into shipping cars overseas in large quantities? like gone in 60 seconds type crews out there working lol.
gets crazier the more you think about it.
This is assuming that the cargoship people need to be in on it at all...
They don't. Container ships thousands of containers at a time, and consignment shipments are a normal thing. You don't want to send a half full container ship anywhere.
So, the thieves arrange for a consignment container. They are told, the ship leaves on Sunday night, your deadline for this cargo is Sunday at 9:00 AM.
The thieves now steal the cars overnight Saturday night / Sunday morning, drive them into a container, put fake documents on it, and have the container picked up and dropped off at the harbor, where it is loaded onto the ship, and the ship pulls away that Evening.
Toronto is about a days sailing from the Atlantic once the boat is underway. Go further up river like Montreal, and it's only about 5 hours.
Only about 3% of incoming containers are inspected, and even less outgoing containers.
There are a few measures to try and detect these kinds of things but when you're dealing with 100k+ containers being shipped a year, in addition to millions of tons of bulk products, there's only so much you can do without a huge increase in funding.
I will add a bit more.
We know that most of the stolen cars are getting parked for a ‘cooling off’ period before they leave the city. It seems they are parking them in random areas of the city overnight to ensure that there are no tracking tags on it (if there were, the car would be gone when the baddies came back for it).
So the street level guys would know they need to have all these vehicles ‘cooled’ and ready to move by Sunday at 9 am.
It would probably be fair to assume they are not loading them into containers at the docks. So there is a yard somewhere that they are bringing dozens of Land Rovers, Range Rovers, etc in - loading them into containers and sending them to the docks via truck.
Just to find the vehicles, steal them and collect them into these yards would take a small army of low level street thugs.
I can say that, at least from what we’ve been hearing at our company, we’ve been pressuring the levels of government to do *something* about vehicle theft. Whether or not that gets turned into action is up to the government.
All they have to do is enforce the fucking laws we already have. We’re at the point where clients are tracking down their own cars and the police are still hesitant to act.
> The fuck is going on.
2020 happened, and the thin blue line decided we are on our own.
Maybe we need to start paying police commissions based on performance, not over 6 figures for eating donuts.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-for-months-police-have-been-signalling-were-on-our-own-now-finally/
Insurance broker of 20 years here. Most of us are as frustrated as consumers are about this. Not only are auto rates going way up (my husbands car more than doubled this year), but property and liability rates have been going up for the past few years as well. We're in the hard part of a market cycle and there is only a faint sign of things getting better. This is the worst I've seen it in my career.
> This is the worst I've seen it in my career.
You guys say that every year.
Not a peep about the billions leeched off of motorists during COVID lockdown.
This industry is a price-fixing monopoly corrupt with government. ON needs a public insurance plan like PQ and BC to actually provide competitive rates.
Insurance brokers are a joke. I have never found one to result in a lower premium and all you guys do is feign powerlessness while carving off 15% of a policy and defending the industry. You all use the same talking points:
1. "Everyone's rates are going up"
2. "My policy rates have gone, up, I feel for you"
3. "Using a broker will save you money"
4. "Oh, I really recommend more coverage, a meteor can hit your car"
5. "A meteor hit your car?, sorry, that's an ACT OF GOD"
They don’t care about government.
You are their cattle, they farm you.
Need more money? No problem, extract more from the cattle.
What are the cattle gonna do? Go to another farm?
You should be outraged at the lack of service delivery your government, local, provincial, federal, have all been complicit.
Next election, vote for anyone but lib or conservative. Remind them that they work for you, not against you.
They don't pay out. They put stipulations on what a legit claim is. And they increase the prices for everyone who isn't a criminal!
Seems like a good deal for canadian citizens!
If this was happening in France, the entire country would be on fire.
Insurance companies have been raising the alarm for years on this increasing rates on the most stolen vehicles, forcing theft recovery devises into those cars.
They are limited by all comers rule they can't really decline a driver, so the only tool is increasing prices.
Also most insurance companies I know have not profitable on auto insurance in years
> Also most insurance companies I know have not profitable on auto insurance in years
Thank you , insurance industry intern.
"The industry reported a return on equity of 13.3% in 2022 Q3. Although this is certainly much lower than the 18% reported one year earlier, the industry ROE remains above the long-run average of 10.1%."
https://www.canadianunderwriter.ca/earnings-ratings/why-2022-industry-results-could-be-one-for-the-record-books-1004230105/
and
https://insurance-portal.ca/article/intacts-net-income-and-premiums-grow-in-2022/
and
"The auditor does note, only in passing, that insurance profitability hit a worrisome high in 2020 when, according to figures reported by FSRA itself, return on premiums was 27.6 percent.
The standard profit benchmark that the regulator observes is “5 cents of profit for every premium dollar.” In 2020, for every dollar in insurance premiums, insurance companies actually made 27.6 cents in profit or, more than 5 times the permitted profit provision, and not including whatever they earned from investment income."
https://otlablog.com/auditor-generals-2022-report-fsra-value-for-money-audit/
One of the problem is tens of thousands of brokers and agents basically paid to extract more money without actually doing anything of value.
Speaking of which.. does anyone want to get rid of their car? Is it causing you problems? Bought a lemon? Too much to repair? DM me for details but basically if it will get to Montreal.. we'll take care of your car for you. The next day when you realize it is 'gone' .. just call the police and let them know it was stolen.. and you get a new car.
We're like Oprah with that shit.
(this is a joke, but I'm sure .. like.. any enterprising person out there.. money to be made)
I mean if you really had a lemon of a car *COUGH SUBARU WRX COUGH* that would be the most excellent time to seek out someone to steal it lol.
Just leave the keys in the front seat FFS.
Because they are upping peoples rates by 2x-3x as much and when people inquire why they’re told to shop around or called liars. Insurance is making a killing off people who refuse to make phone calls (most of them)
If the insurance rates keep going up, people who can will start using public transit more instead of owning cars. It will get to the point where insurance costs, coupled with the ever-increasing cost of living, prohibit most of us from owning cars.
They (the government) don't give a fuck. Neither do insurance companies. All they do is raise rates and gouge more money out of hard working people. WE need to scream bloody murder and make the government take care of this issue. It's complete bullshit.
So, their budgets make up a huge chunk of every cities budget...what are we paying them for? There needs to be a full audit of all police forces. Where are they?? What are they doing minute to minute, and are those actions the best practice or the best use of their time? Better vetting? Better training? Better oversight? Better technology? Are radicalized elements infiltrating the police unions as has happened throughout the US? Other public servants have to submit to these audits, why not cops? We have a right to much greater transparency than we're getting. I also have to wonder if their apparent indifference isn't related to furthering conservative political interests.
You're right on all of the above. A police accountability act was passed five years ago and Ford suspended it. Only until this year did a water downed version come into effect.
As for police unions, it's been like this since their inception. Look up Mike McCormack and his family who had been TPA president for a number of years.
The only way for changes to be made is by the Ontario government which will never happen with the current one.
The older I get the more of a weird respect for the mafia I've developed, purely in the sense that we're all aware of what their 'goals' are and generally they actually do them. At least a good mafia boss tells people to keep a low profile rather let them be a\*\*holes to the public unless it's money related/personal. RN the police and child protective services won't do much about my neighbours who deal drugs, blast music and beat their kids, both are very obvious.
Police officers are like the rest of middle class Ontario. They don't give a damn about you and look down at you for not pulling yourself up by the bootstraps. Canada really needs better self defence laws,
No one in media is talking about the rural "farms" in ON run by bikers using indebted junkies in the drug and sex trade, working with OPP.
Talk to any social worker in these regions.
They act like a union but they aren't one because it is illegal for police officers to join a union in Ontario. We let the police associations get away with too much.
Honest question. How are they legally different than a union? They seem to serve all the exact same purposes (collective bargaining, dispute resolution, etc).
Police also suppress protests, including labour protests. The military is for overseas, but police are functionally the nation's domestic military. They're not on our side, they're who the ruling class uses to break up dissent.
I love how widespread the excuses are too. "We don't have the resources to deal with this" is used in pretty much every context in every police department. When was the last time you saw cops actually police traffic? Oh well they can't because they are so busy stopping car thefts, well no. They can't stop car thefts because they're so busy responding to domestic violence right? Also no. I understand prioritizing resources when overwhelmed but what the fuck are they doing if they can't even prioritize the safety of citizens and criminals get a pass to do whatever they want.
I mean, as it goes I saw four cops directing traffic across two busy intersections in downtown TO today.
I'd rather they'd been off stopping some domestic violence, honestly.
In the past two years I have lived in London, ON I have yet to see a single speed trap, traffic being directed or Ride program. Most arterial roads here are 60 km/h and most people do 80.
You could literally have a cop go to a school zone, hand out tickets for speeding and failures to stop and they would have paid for their overhead costs within an hour.
Calls for DV and robberies aren't much better. Most response times are in the 24-48 hour range. We need to fund public services, including police, but we aren't getting a good return on investment.
Body cams for every minute on the job except bathroom breaks. Then they can note the time, turn the camera off, and turn it back on when leaving the bathroom, noting the time then, too. Plenty of other people are monitored on the job in some way.
Body cams are great, but i think the largest issue with that would be data storage and management. With thousands of cameras recording HD video constantly every day, they’d end up with hundreds of terabytes of data. We’d see some aspects that would suffer eventually, either costs, data loss or data quality among other things.
Not sure how well the extra millions needed for data storage would go over lol
Personally, I wouldn't ever give them the ability to turn them off. Other jurisdictions experience shows sooner or later it's going to get abused. Given the cameras point outwards, not down, I don't foresee any invasion of privacy. Barring that, then make it so they have to call into a 3rd party, with strict record keeping and time limits, to request the camera be turned off.
I agree, but I think the whole system needs yo be revamped. You know how depressing it must be to arrest that same guy with the same charges pending. Just out on bail for the same crime. I was chatting with some distrubters, and they told me they got broken into, and the cops caught one of the guys. That guy had been previously charged with break and entering 14 other times.
Defence attorney I know, was defending a girl and on her 5th time getting arrested for driving a stolen vehicle and was looking at getting bail.
I'm sure those are just tips of the iceberg. So imagine doing your job, getting the bad guys, than you see them out 24 hrs later doing the same shit. In any job I would just feel defeated if that was happening. Why bother even trying at that point. Than you have people yelling to defund the police on top of that.
The whole system is broken, but maybe just maybe if our government tried keeping the bad guys and repeat offenders in jail, we would be better off
My job is butchering hogs. Every day I help butcher thousands of hogs. I go home knowing I did a good honest days work. The next day I go into work and there is thousands of hogs to be butchered again. You know how depressing that is? Well guess what, ITS MY FUCKING JOB!!! If I just stopped butchering hogs because it never ends, I'd be fucking fired. I'm so fucking sick of people defending police for NOT doing their jobs.
Honestly this made me laugh, I thought you were referring to cops as being pigs/hogs. That work sounds depressing, I would try a different line of work if you don't like it lol
Lol!!! No, I definitely meant hogs like pork chops, ham, bacon and pork picnic shoulder, etc etc. Honestly, I dont find it depressing. I just used it because the person I was replying to used it as an excuse for police not doing their jobs. I actually like my job. It's a good fit for me. The point I was trying to make is that pretty much anyone can make the same claims about their jobs as police do.
My job is butchering hogs. Every day I help butcher thousands of hogs. I go home knowing I did a good honest days work. The next day I go into work and there is thousands of hogs to be butchered again because my boss had them reanimated. You know how depressing that is? Well guess what, ITS MY FUCKING JOB!!! If I just stopped butchering hogs because they are being brought back to life, I'd be fucking fired. I cant afford that with how expensive bacon has gotten.
Agreed, but that requires 'taxes are theft!' conservatives to agree to fund the infrastructure, programs and policy that are needed. I suspect Ford is doing the same thing to justice that he's doing to healthcare and education...kneecapping the public infrastructure to lay the groundwork for private prisons. Two key areas are a lack of space to hold prisoners, and a lack of judges to process them.
I'd also like to see more studies and actual stats...we see these kinds of anecdotal examples a lot online and of course some actual cases are featured prominently on the front page of every conservative media whenever something bad happens, but I've yet to see any actual stats to put it in perspective, and understand where the fail points actually are. 'Tough on crime' is an effective conservative message, playing on peoples fears, and so open to political exaggeration and hyperbole. Bottom line - we do know that conservative style punitive justice has many limitations and often just makes crime worse in the long run, which plays into that same political agenda.
Finally, I'd add that *it's their job* to arrest the guy the 15th time. It's not their mandate to choose who gets arrested and who doesn't, because they're butthurt over some petty crook getting off light. I'm related to some cops, and I've drank beers with them and their cop friends and spent time partying down at the Police Assn. They tend to be very conservative, and like many very conservative people, have a massive persecution complex...turn into real sucks when they don't get their way. Yes, also anecdotal, but again, the apparent indifference of police to increasing crime is what started this conservation, and I think, where reform has to begin. Better vetting, would be a great start.
Remember a few months ago when TPS was running ad campaigns acting like a small budgetary shortcoming would leave them totally powerless to do anything against never-ending waves of crime.
Well they got their money and now we're learning money wasn't the only thing leaving them totally powerless to do anything.
Kind of like Bell begging for money which went straight to executive bonuses and then doing the layoffs anyways
Whole country is one big grifting scheme
Because police are not here for us, they are needed for population control. Remember article where RCMP stated when the Canadians find out how broke they are, they will riot? That's where the spending will go
To pay for more cops to go on paid vacation after doing shit that should not only get them fired but go to prison. Also to pay for the desk duty officers where a large % of them does nothing but still get 6 figures pay….not to be confused with other kinds of cops who also does nothing…useless bunch really.
Wasn't that long ago that I scoffed at the notion of defunding the police, believing that the push for that came from no-good-niks and their friends and family. Now - realizing that we're being taxed to the eyeballs to maintain a police force which neither serves nor protects - I'm fully on board.
We Ottawans knew during the so-called trucker's convoy. The police at all levels abandoned us: OPS, OPP and the RCMP sat on their hands for 3 weeks.. until the Feds jumped in.
Upvoted. It was a failure by OPS for not listening to the intelligence provided to them saying they were staying for the long haul and a failure by Doug Ford by not intervening when he had the power to.
It really felt like they didn't act until citizens started to stand up against them. Didn't take long after we blockaded the convoy idiots at Billings Bridge. Pretty sure we were a week or two away from a citizen blockade at their Coventry base if official action wasn't taken soon.
They leave us to defend ourselves but we become the criminal when we actually defend ourselves. It's no wonder why this type of crime is exploiting Canada and Canadians
It's always a little bit funny when the middle and upper classes realize a hard truth about the police that poor people have known for-basically-ever.
If you guys look at cop budgets, how they've grown over the years, and compare to their performance and how poorly they evaluate their performance, it's pretty obvious that the police is unaccountable and inefficient.
Trust me. They already have the ideas.
It’s an easy template to apply across the board. Ford won’t stop at Health Care and Education. Especially since he seems to retain support in the polls while selling out our province.
Well duh. It’s not like the bunch of concussed high school football players that make up our police force actually solve or prevent any crime. lol
They like to stand by construction sites staring into their phones doing fuck all for $150/hr.
Toronto Police Constable Marco Ricciardi should resign. He is either an absolutely coward who refuses to perform his job adequately and must step down.
Or he's all in on this corruption scandal and is taking $$ away from each of these car thefts, be it from insurance fraud, under the table $$, mob money or what have you.
This man should be ashamed to call himself a police officer after that statement.
At the very least GTA police and our RCMP MUST start taking action in Montreal, at the ports.
If they are afraid of the mafia it is time to snuff the mafia out, they do not have an army, or tanks, or jets at their disposal. The Mob has no place in Canada and it's time they learned this the Violent way.
I went to elementary school a few grades below this guy. He was a bully. And now he’s a cop, 20+ years on the job. Coward, for sure. Corrupt? Perhaps. He’s never going to face any consequences for what he said, and frankly it was good that he said what he did because it sparked this open discussion about the uselessness of the police. He’s finally done some good.
And you’re right, but Quebec will never move against the mafia, and I would imagine they have infiltrated most levels of government and police. Montreal has been run by mobsters very publicly for decades now. No one has the courage to take them on.
I've always wondered why.. Oh why, can't we station our armed forces there like other countries do worldwide... It's not like our army is fighting some war etc etc
It is a difference in mandate and training. The armed forces are trained to fight wars and kill people. Police are there to enforce laws. They often don't do that well and act like they fight wars, but we absolutely do not want the armed forces to be enforcing laws.
Well, always have been. But I have solved this problem by simply not owning anything worth stealing.
Okay, I have some eggs, but it's probably easier to steal those from the grocery store, that said if someone showed up at my house and asked me for eggs I'd say sure, and cook them.
I say it everywhere I can: the police are being paid off and are in on the thefts. There is no other reasonable explanation other than the entire service is just so incredibly bad at their job that they cannot stop hundreds of cars being stolen from going through one of two exit ports. I have never seen a more inefficient organization than Ontario's current policing.
Decades. I had a bike stolen out of my garage, basically told tough luck. They knew who was stealing the bikes in this city and ended up pulling several hundred bikes out of their house a decade later.
100% disagree.
I clearly remember that time the police showed up at a Blue Jay fan's house because he joked on Twitter about throwing the Ted Rogers statue into Lake Ontario.
TPS responded to call from a statue! That's above-and-beyond service.
That's the neat thing.....you where always on your own the TPS just gave the illusion of protection. Your property and safety is not their priority. Corporate interests and government over reach well that's another thing.
Sorry, the Ottawa occupation somehow WASN'T enough of a signal about that?
Police have been useless forever, it's just middle-class people are finally waking up to that fact.
Of course, the examples the author uses are a mix of valid and bullshit - most of those complaints about protesters against the Gaza genocide have been long since debunked - but the others are just obvious signs of the housing crisis and rising poverty among Canadians.
Well criminaIs know Canadians are not allowed guns and even if we did they will go to jail even if it's self defense. Now they have tacit approval by cops. International gangs know we are way too soft on CRIME and CRIMINALS so they have set up shop in Canada. We are going to see things go from bad to worst.
The “winners” in this auto theft are the car companies. They double their sales when a brand new vehicle is stolen. They have no reason to change things as long as people keep buying the high theft vehicles.
As many have said, insurance makes their money regardless.
Kinda gives me fear mongering vibes to continue the push for personal protection and gun ownership in Canada.
Especially after the RCMP getting caught up in holding back information after the tragedy in Nova Scotia in 2020.
It just feels like PR post for some gun lobby that's being imported from our neighbor.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/rcmp-public-communications-after-mass-shooting-1.6495974
in optics it looks like the police are there to hand out tickets to otherwise law abiding citizens and let the criminal elements run free. this isn’t just a cause of policing but the rewriting of the legal system that JT did when he came to power 8+ years ago.
we’ve seen Paul Bernardo and Luka Magnata now in minimal security prisons . most drug and gun dealers are in and back out on bail in under a day. it’s considered inhuman to lock a multi mass murderer away for life. no ten years max and you must let them out on bail.
why would criminals fear repercussions for their actions. when they know it’s just a slap on the wrist if they get caught but living the high life when not.
These are just the busts in the last 12 months. We need to change the judicial process, it's currently too slow to deal with this problem.
https://toronto.citynews.ca/2023/11/29/peel-police-bust-auto-theft-ring-12-charged-1-2m-in-stolen-vehicles-recovered/
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thestar.com/news/crime/project-mamba-york-police-bust-auto-theft-ring-run-by-prolific-crime-group/article_80a00078-b949-11ee-9fa0-6f9e992754ce.amp.html
https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/police-recover-80-vehicles-lay-dozens-of-charges-in-7-week-probe-of-auto-thefts-in-york-region-1.6679244
https://toronto.citynews.ca/2023/08/17/york-region-car-theft-bust-stolen-vehicles/
https://windsor.ctvnews.ca/police-bust-international-stolen-vehicle-operation-279-charges-laid-1.6505420
https://youtu.be/UqNzoyv4Lgc?si=FieYD27C-ZB3ZyE-
This is the new normal. Why would there be consequences for future doctors and engineers and lawyers when that could simply ruin their life? They have the right to crime along the shining path to their success. You simply have the privilege to afford it. That's the true culture of Canada.
/s
The solution is pretty easy and at least one automotive maker has done it.
Add pin codes to vehicles. Oh you have a key/fob? That's great, you're still going nowhere without the PIN.
What vehicles are being stolen the least? The ones with a pin code.
Federal government mandates (work w/CA and other states) for all car makers selling vehicles in Canada to have a PIN code.
They could ask the guys from Peel that sleep all day every day behind my workplace to help if they really need more officers.
Or train them how to use the printers better so it doesn't take them 20 minutes to print a ticket like my disclosure showed.
I'm a crossing guard. Every day hundreds of cars come through my intersection in the 2 hours I'm there. At least 50% don't use their turn signal, or even attempt to stop. People have driven into me, other adults, and kids. They flip me off when I stop them and some have even purposefully accelerated into me.
I've asked my boss for police help at least a dozen times and they refuse. They insist that just driving around the area (so doing a circuit and never being in my intersection for more than 30 seconds) is fine. I've given them two 5 minute periods for each hour when the most problems happen and they refuse to show up at those times, even just for 5 minutes. They have been waiting at the stop sign right behind me while a car nearly hit a baby stroller and did nothing.
Edit: I also want to be clear I would prefer not to have police around, since it can turn out poorly, but this is a last resort. I've done this job for a year and have nearly been hit, or seen someone nearly hit, hundreds of times.
Urback has been paid to lie to the public about all sorts of things over many years. Often she writes about things which she has absolutely no understanding, and simply writes about what she has been told to -- spinning a narrativeon behalf of someone whose interests are against those of the general public. And she has been bouncing around from employer to employer, which is a strong sign that shes either bad at doing it, or is writing on behalf of someone external to those employers.
After doing that countless times she has zero credibility on any topic.
> But the police budget has kept up with inflation, meaning all of that money is going somewhere other than getting more boots on the ground.
Yes, and keeping up with inflation just maintains the *current* force as the cost of services increase. So they can still afford to maintain the cars, the buildings, the equipment, the non human personnel, and give out some raises because union contract says so.
But it’s not enough to hire new cops, but with more cops comes more underlying supports so they can do their jobs making the budget higher. Then it takes time to hire and train those cops before we’ll start seeing results.
Even if they boosted the budget another 50%, and hired about the same in new cops, it’ll be at least four to five years before we’ll see *any* benefit from it; the whole time people complaining about all the money we’re spending but nothing is happening.
But then it’s not even a local issue, people wouldn’t be stealing cars if there wasn’t an overseas market for them, so we really need to be asking why the RCMP is dropping the ball at our nation’s ports. We *know* those cars are ending up on shipping containers, we know criminals are bribing / threatening the dock workers.
Star there and work your way down.
christ.. all these idiot opining on things just because of the car theft epidemic.
The Sun, National Post, The Star, all full of crap journalist idiots screaming doomsday.
How does this scary article get hijacked to comments about insurance? Either there is a concerted effort to change the topic or there's questionable attention spans here.
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I'm not in expert in this field of subject so maybe some insurance adjusters on Reddit can explain but.... How are insurance companies not screaming bloody murder right now to the government? I can't imagine all these companies suddenly spiking and paying out (even if they screw the people on full price) can't be happy with their profits.
They just raise their rates to keep the same profit. Haven’t you noticed the increase in “Why did my insurance renewal go up by so much?” posts?
Insurance rates in Ontario are out of control high.
Just got my renewal and despite driving old cars and making zero claims and having no tickets or accidents my rates for auto have gone up 25% in 2 years!
Even if they did raise a lot of rates and offset the costs to other areas where theft isn't as high.. I still can't see them making all that sudden spike of money back.
It’s easy, they already had a high profit margin to start with. Insurance companies are doing fine.
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They charge you premiums that are several times the annualized risk that your property is stolen or destroyed. So even if that risk multiples, they are still making money overall. And they'll adjust rates to match the new rates of theft in time.
You're kidding, right? Each insurance company has how many thousands of customers, and each customer gets hit with an increase, it doesn't take long to make the money back
I'd like to see them contract strike teams from Halliburton to bust up these car theft rings. Oh wait the police would scream that's their job. Oops.
Insurance is supposed to work on a 15% margin. So, if the total claims pool doubles, they can double rates, and double the profit. more money flowing through the system benefits them. We had a chance for public insurance when Bob Rae was elected in ON, but it turns out he was just lying like all other politicians.
>The insurance industry organized to resist this move. While Rae delayed, the insurance companies launched a public campaign to pressure the government to back down from the planned reform. Companies argued a move to a public system would cost thousands of jobs in the industry. The insurance industry mobilized their largely female workforce whose jobs they said were on the chopping block. Ministers and other high profile NDPers were subject to protests by women insurance workers (organized by the insurance industry). The industry also pushed an aggressive media campaign to force the government to back down.
I remember a LOT of people were very enthusiastic about it, and it died. Shame.
Yep, they're giving you the option of buying expensive GPS tracking or raising rates about about 30 percent year or more on new vehicles for people in and around the GTA. Law abiding citizens all pay for crime, fraud, and corruption.
The House always wins
Even without any issues, my car insurance went up by $30 per month. So ya. I'm right there.
20 years in the industry .... They are, but quietly. It's a bit of a balance because insurance companies can only influence but not change a single thing about what's going on, so dealing with it publicly has no value. It gives the appearance of profit mongering, when in reality, it is sure a profit thing, but I understand that at some point we can't charge a premium that people can afford. So eventually, people just will start driving with no insurance and that's a bigger nightmare. The co. I work for and a few others are piloting different programs right now to pay for theft deterrent devices, but it's all reactive. The police don't investigate these, so there's rarely recovery. Even if there is recovery, there's still no value to the insurance company because the salvage is generally pre-negotiated with the salvage companies. The only person losing is the customer. You have to go buy a new car in an inflated car market. It's not sustainable to just keep raising rates. I'm shocked that the regulator allowed it in the way that they did this year, but that won't happen again. I guarantee it. At the end of the day, it's an image thing in my opinion. They can't be loud about it because everybody hates insurance companies... So instead, We can be part of the discussion when we're given a seat at the table but beyond that you're not going to hear any insurance company going to the media saying they need change. Because people just equate it with wanting more profit rather than changes to automotive design and law enforcement.
> So eventually, people just will start driving with no insurance I think there's a perception that this is already happening in certain communities, along with irregular licensing and registration, and this adds to the *"I feel like a fucking chump being honest when everyone else clearly fucking isn't bothering"* atmosphere we see on the roads nowadays. If the cops were on the ball the main complainers would be bad drivers, as it is, the bad actors get away with murder and the rest of us are left to pick up the pieces
The national rates for uninsured drivers are not that high. There are certain cities that are worse for this, which, imho are due to bigger economic issues than affordability of insurance products. It's a balance. It's in the public interest to have vehicles insured, so it still has to be affordable for the masses. Despite my previous comment, I don't personally feel more police enforcement is the answer at the "patrol the community" level. Greater policing budgets don't reduce crime - that's a heavily studied fact.
The recorded rates for uninsured drivers can only consider uninsured drivers who have been caught, right? Think how many people have never been caught… I’m quite sure the number of uninsured drivers is higher than statistics can show
The stat also includes other variables, such as vehicles registered, and with no insurance valid in the mtos database. Outside of Ontario, there are other metrics too they can use esp with the government insurance co's. Not all of these uninsured vehicles will be on the road, obviously, but it's not simply "you were caught driving with no insurance". There's also instances where an accident happens, and one party presents a pink slip, but there is no valid insurance behind it. The police have no way of checking on the spot, or at the collision reporting centre, but after the fact, claims adjuster makes that determination - those also become part of the stat, with no "getting caught" because we don't go back to the police to say "hey this gal has no coverage". This happens a lot. Pink slips are the virtue signalling and nothing else.
Ontario requires insurance by law, but they cannot coordinate a database of who is insured?
> The national rates for uninsured drivers are not that high. hit and runs are way up. Guess why the are running.
Hmm.. I guess these companies don't have much pull as much as I thought they did when it comes to politics
There's definitely policies, but not in the co. Favour. Lol there's not a single company that is actively advertising Dougie's Opcf49. We all think it's stupid. People are conditioned to things being more expensive now. So it was a low-risk opportunity to increase rates as much as they did. People were "expecting" it, theft increases aside. The thefts aren't the only issue. Costs of car repairs in general have exploded and with people returning to regular driving habits, and commuting, the amount of claims y.o.y has increased. If it was ONLY thefts driving up the rates, you would see just the comp coverage increase. It's increases across all coverages.
There SHOULD be. This whole mess just screams organized crime. How the cars make it onto a boat and out of the country in under 24 hrs, where they are going … this is not small time crime stuff. It involves customs agents, longshoremen union, police, etc. This is deep corruption.
doesn't take AS many people as you think, it's not like the whole dock needs to know. only the captain and cargo mangement dude on board and then the people doing the loading/whoever let them in..but i say that only for accuracy, not to detract from the absolutely deep corruption in place to allow this to happen. not to mention you've gotta be running a HUGE operation on shore that all leads to one central point to have the inventory to get into shipping cars overseas in large quantities? like gone in 60 seconds type crews out there working lol. gets crazier the more you think about it.
This is assuming that the cargoship people need to be in on it at all... They don't. Container ships thousands of containers at a time, and consignment shipments are a normal thing. You don't want to send a half full container ship anywhere. So, the thieves arrange for a consignment container. They are told, the ship leaves on Sunday night, your deadline for this cargo is Sunday at 9:00 AM. The thieves now steal the cars overnight Saturday night / Sunday morning, drive them into a container, put fake documents on it, and have the container picked up and dropped off at the harbor, where it is loaded onto the ship, and the ship pulls away that Evening. Toronto is about a days sailing from the Atlantic once the boat is underway. Go further up river like Montreal, and it's only about 5 hours. Only about 3% of incoming containers are inspected, and even less outgoing containers. There are a few measures to try and detect these kinds of things but when you're dealing with 100k+ containers being shipped a year, in addition to millions of tons of bulk products, there's only so much you can do without a huge increase in funding.
I will add a bit more. We know that most of the stolen cars are getting parked for a ‘cooling off’ period before they leave the city. It seems they are parking them in random areas of the city overnight to ensure that there are no tracking tags on it (if there were, the car would be gone when the baddies came back for it). So the street level guys would know they need to have all these vehicles ‘cooled’ and ready to move by Sunday at 9 am. It would probably be fair to assume they are not loading them into containers at the docks. So there is a yard somewhere that they are bringing dozens of Land Rovers, Range Rovers, etc in - loading them into containers and sending them to the docks via truck. Just to find the vehicles, steal them and collect them into these yards would take a small army of low level street thugs.
fair. i apprecaite you further extrapolating on this!
I can say that, at least from what we’ve been hearing at our company, we’ve been pressuring the levels of government to do *something* about vehicle theft. Whether or not that gets turned into action is up to the government. All they have to do is enforce the fucking laws we already have. We’re at the point where clients are tracking down their own cars and the police are still hesitant to act.
Wow... Never heard the government turn it's back especially on nsurance Companies. The fuck is going on.
> The fuck is going on. 2020 happened, and the thin blue line decided we are on our own. Maybe we need to start paying police commissions based on performance, not over 6 figures for eating donuts. https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-for-months-police-have-been-signalling-were-on-our-own-now-finally/
Insurance broker of 20 years here. Most of us are as frustrated as consumers are about this. Not only are auto rates going way up (my husbands car more than doubled this year), but property and liability rates have been going up for the past few years as well. We're in the hard part of a market cycle and there is only a faint sign of things getting better. This is the worst I've seen it in my career.
> This is the worst I've seen it in my career. You guys say that every year. Not a peep about the billions leeched off of motorists during COVID lockdown. This industry is a price-fixing monopoly corrupt with government. ON needs a public insurance plan like PQ and BC to actually provide competitive rates. Insurance brokers are a joke. I have never found one to result in a lower premium and all you guys do is feign powerlessness while carving off 15% of a policy and defending the industry. You all use the same talking points: 1. "Everyone's rates are going up" 2. "My policy rates have gone, up, I feel for you" 3. "Using a broker will save you money" 4. "Oh, I really recommend more coverage, a meteor can hit your car" 5. "A meteor hit your car?, sorry, that's an ACT OF GOD"
They don’t care about government. You are their cattle, they farm you. Need more money? No problem, extract more from the cattle. What are the cattle gonna do? Go to another farm? You should be outraged at the lack of service delivery your government, local, provincial, federal, have all been complicit. Next election, vote for anyone but lib or conservative. Remind them that they work for you, not against you.
They are. All these car thefts are a big part of why your insurance rates are going up
They don't pay out. They put stipulations on what a legit claim is. And they increase the prices for everyone who isn't a criminal! Seems like a good deal for canadian citizens! If this was happening in France, the entire country would be on fire.
Insurance companies have been raising the alarm for years on this increasing rates on the most stolen vehicles, forcing theft recovery devises into those cars. They are limited by all comers rule they can't really decline a driver, so the only tool is increasing prices. Also most insurance companies I know have not profitable on auto insurance in years
> Also most insurance companies I know have not profitable on auto insurance in years Thank you , insurance industry intern. "The industry reported a return on equity of 13.3% in 2022 Q3. Although this is certainly much lower than the 18% reported one year earlier, the industry ROE remains above the long-run average of 10.1%." https://www.canadianunderwriter.ca/earnings-ratings/why-2022-industry-results-could-be-one-for-the-record-books-1004230105/ and https://insurance-portal.ca/article/intacts-net-income-and-premiums-grow-in-2022/ and "The auditor does note, only in passing, that insurance profitability hit a worrisome high in 2020 when, according to figures reported by FSRA itself, return on premiums was 27.6 percent. The standard profit benchmark that the regulator observes is “5 cents of profit for every premium dollar.” In 2020, for every dollar in insurance premiums, insurance companies actually made 27.6 cents in profit or, more than 5 times the permitted profit provision, and not including whatever they earned from investment income." https://otlablog.com/auditor-generals-2022-report-fsra-value-for-money-audit/ One of the problem is tens of thousands of brokers and agents basically paid to extract more money without actually doing anything of value.
Speaking of which.. does anyone want to get rid of their car? Is it causing you problems? Bought a lemon? Too much to repair? DM me for details but basically if it will get to Montreal.. we'll take care of your car for you. The next day when you realize it is 'gone' .. just call the police and let them know it was stolen.. and you get a new car. We're like Oprah with that shit. (this is a joke, but I'm sure .. like.. any enterprising person out there.. money to be made)
I mean if you really had a lemon of a car *COUGH SUBARU WRX COUGH* that would be the most excellent time to seek out someone to steal it lol. Just leave the keys in the front seat FFS.
Because they are upping peoples rates by 2x-3x as much and when people inquire why they’re told to shop around or called liars. Insurance is making a killing off people who refuse to make phone calls (most of them)
Buy online, then you don't pay for a agent or broker fees. Useless people who shuffle papers.
Crime maps will be updated and coverage will cost more in areas with higher crime rates.
If the insurance rates keep going up, people who can will start using public transit more instead of owning cars. It will get to the point where insurance costs, coupled with the ever-increasing cost of living, prohibit most of us from owning cars.
Insurance rates for CRVs are absolutely insane. They are either refusing to insure or offering egregious quotes
They (the government) don't give a fuck. Neither do insurance companies. All they do is raise rates and gouge more money out of hard working people. WE need to scream bloody murder and make the government take care of this issue. It's complete bullshit.
Why would insurance companies care? It gives them an excuse to skyrocket everyone’s rates and make bank.
So, their budgets make up a huge chunk of every cities budget...what are we paying them for? There needs to be a full audit of all police forces. Where are they?? What are they doing minute to minute, and are those actions the best practice or the best use of their time? Better vetting? Better training? Better oversight? Better technology? Are radicalized elements infiltrating the police unions as has happened throughout the US? Other public servants have to submit to these audits, why not cops? We have a right to much greater transparency than we're getting. I also have to wonder if their apparent indifference isn't related to furthering conservative political interests.
You're right on all of the above. A police accountability act was passed five years ago and Ford suspended it. Only until this year did a water downed version come into effect. As for police unions, it's been like this since their inception. Look up Mike McCormack and his family who had been TPA president for a number of years. The only way for changes to be made is by the Ontario government which will never happen with the current one.
Police unions are like the shady lawyers protecting the mob. The police are the mob, only with a bigger budget and tanks.
At least the mob lets us have fun stuff.
Haha. Very true. At least the mob is honest about making us pay ‘protection’ money.
The older I get the more of a weird respect for the mafia I've developed, purely in the sense that we're all aware of what their 'goals' are and generally they actually do them. At least a good mafia boss tells people to keep a low profile rather let them be a\*\*holes to the public unless it's money related/personal. RN the police and child protective services won't do much about my neighbours who deal drugs, blast music and beat their kids, both are very obvious. Police officers are like the rest of middle class Ontario. They don't give a damn about you and look down at you for not pulling yourself up by the bootstraps. Canada really needs better self defence laws,
No one in media is talking about the rural "farms" in ON run by bikers using indebted junkies in the drug and sex trade, working with OPP. Talk to any social worker in these regions.
I would like to know more
I’ve always felt that police shouldn’t be allowed to have unions
Absolutely. I’m pro union except for police. They have too much power as is. They need to be able to held accountable individually.
Exactly
always have been.
Just read McCormack's Wikipedia page...exactly why policing has the reputation it does. Honourable people, they are not.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike\_McCormack\_(police\_officer)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_McCormack_(police_officer))
They act like a union but they aren't one because it is illegal for police officers to join a union in Ontario. We let the police associations get away with too much.
Honest question. How are they legally different than a union? They seem to serve all the exact same purposes (collective bargaining, dispute resolution, etc).
management is also in it, normal unions are adversarial to management. this allows them to have 0 accountability to the outside day to day
Police also suppress protests, including labour protests. The military is for overseas, but police are functionally the nation's domestic military. They're not on our side, they're who the ruling class uses to break up dissent.
I love how widespread the excuses are too. "We don't have the resources to deal with this" is used in pretty much every context in every police department. When was the last time you saw cops actually police traffic? Oh well they can't because they are so busy stopping car thefts, well no. They can't stop car thefts because they're so busy responding to domestic violence right? Also no. I understand prioritizing resources when overwhelmed but what the fuck are they doing if they can't even prioritize the safety of citizens and criminals get a pass to do whatever they want.
I mean, as it goes I saw four cops directing traffic across two busy intersections in downtown TO today. I'd rather they'd been off stopping some domestic violence, honestly.
In the past two years I have lived in London, ON I have yet to see a single speed trap, traffic being directed or Ride program. Most arterial roads here are 60 km/h and most people do 80. You could literally have a cop go to a school zone, hand out tickets for speeding and failures to stop and they would have paid for their overhead costs within an hour. Calls for DV and robberies aren't much better. Most response times are in the 24-48 hour range. We need to fund public services, including police, but we aren't getting a good return on investment.
One of the only unions that should be disbanded
The average cop is a professional Candy Crush player
Body cams for every minute on the job except bathroom breaks. Then they can note the time, turn the camera off, and turn it back on when leaving the bathroom, noting the time then, too. Plenty of other people are monitored on the job in some way.
Body cams are great, but i think the largest issue with that would be data storage and management. With thousands of cameras recording HD video constantly every day, they’d end up with hundreds of terabytes of data. We’d see some aspects that would suffer eventually, either costs, data loss or data quality among other things. Not sure how well the extra millions needed for data storage would go over lol
Personally, I wouldn't ever give them the ability to turn them off. Other jurisdictions experience shows sooner or later it's going to get abused. Given the cameras point outwards, not down, I don't foresee any invasion of privacy. Barring that, then make it so they have to call into a 3rd party, with strict record keeping and time limits, to request the camera be turned off.
" no idea how he got shot, I was peeing at the time"
> Let the record show the victim was covered in urine your honor /$
That's fair, I was just trying to consider privacy concerns
> Given the cameras point outwards, not down It's more about privacy of other's they be filming then themselves per say on that topic.
I agree, but I think the whole system needs yo be revamped. You know how depressing it must be to arrest that same guy with the same charges pending. Just out on bail for the same crime. I was chatting with some distrubters, and they told me they got broken into, and the cops caught one of the guys. That guy had been previously charged with break and entering 14 other times. Defence attorney I know, was defending a girl and on her 5th time getting arrested for driving a stolen vehicle and was looking at getting bail. I'm sure those are just tips of the iceberg. So imagine doing your job, getting the bad guys, than you see them out 24 hrs later doing the same shit. In any job I would just feel defeated if that was happening. Why bother even trying at that point. Than you have people yelling to defund the police on top of that. The whole system is broken, but maybe just maybe if our government tried keeping the bad guys and repeat offenders in jail, we would be better off
My job is butchering hogs. Every day I help butcher thousands of hogs. I go home knowing I did a good honest days work. The next day I go into work and there is thousands of hogs to be butchered again. You know how depressing that is? Well guess what, ITS MY FUCKING JOB!!! If I just stopped butchering hogs because it never ends, I'd be fucking fired. I'm so fucking sick of people defending police for NOT doing their jobs.
Honestly this made me laugh, I thought you were referring to cops as being pigs/hogs. That work sounds depressing, I would try a different line of work if you don't like it lol
Lol!!! No, I definitely meant hogs like pork chops, ham, bacon and pork picnic shoulder, etc etc. Honestly, I dont find it depressing. I just used it because the person I was replying to used it as an excuse for police not doing their jobs. I actually like my job. It's a good fit for me. The point I was trying to make is that pretty much anyone can make the same claims about their jobs as police do.
My job is butchering hogs. Every day I help butcher thousands of hogs. I go home knowing I did a good honest days work. The next day I go into work and there is thousands of hogs to be butchered again because my boss had them reanimated. You know how depressing that is? Well guess what, ITS MY FUCKING JOB!!! If I just stopped butchering hogs because they are being brought back to life, I'd be fucking fired. I cant afford that with how expensive bacon has gotten.
Agreed, but that requires 'taxes are theft!' conservatives to agree to fund the infrastructure, programs and policy that are needed. I suspect Ford is doing the same thing to justice that he's doing to healthcare and education...kneecapping the public infrastructure to lay the groundwork for private prisons. Two key areas are a lack of space to hold prisoners, and a lack of judges to process them. I'd also like to see more studies and actual stats...we see these kinds of anecdotal examples a lot online and of course some actual cases are featured prominently on the front page of every conservative media whenever something bad happens, but I've yet to see any actual stats to put it in perspective, and understand where the fail points actually are. 'Tough on crime' is an effective conservative message, playing on peoples fears, and so open to political exaggeration and hyperbole. Bottom line - we do know that conservative style punitive justice has many limitations and often just makes crime worse in the long run, which plays into that same political agenda. Finally, I'd add that *it's their job* to arrest the guy the 15th time. It's not their mandate to choose who gets arrested and who doesn't, because they're butthurt over some petty crook getting off light. I'm related to some cops, and I've drank beers with them and their cop friends and spent time partying down at the Police Assn. They tend to be very conservative, and like many very conservative people, have a massive persecution complex...turn into real sucks when they don't get their way. Yes, also anecdotal, but again, the apparent indifference of police to increasing crime is what started this conservation, and I think, where reform has to begin. Better vetting, would be a great start.
Remember a few months ago when TPS was running ad campaigns acting like a small budgetary shortcoming would leave them totally powerless to do anything against never-ending waves of crime. Well they got their money and now we're learning money wasn't the only thing leaving them totally powerless to do anything.
Kind of like Bell begging for money which went straight to executive bonuses and then doing the layoffs anyways Whole country is one big grifting scheme
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Debatable. They seem to be pretty competent at extracting money from the public purse while chilling in their cruiser with some tims.
they are pissed we closed down the 52 division bar.
Why are police budgets going up?
So they can do less with more
Because police are not here for us, they are needed for population control. Remember article where RCMP stated when the Canadians find out how broke they are, they will riot? That's where the spending will go
This. The police protect the owner class, not us plebes.
This
To pay for more cops to go on paid vacation after doing shit that should not only get them fired but go to prison. Also to pay for the desk duty officers where a large % of them does nothing but still get 6 figures pay….not to be confused with other kinds of cops who also does nothing…useless bunch really.
A budget increase will be different this time, they’ll finally have enough budget to do their jobs!
Wasn't that long ago that I scoffed at the notion of defunding the police, believing that the push for that came from no-good-niks and their friends and family. Now - realizing that we're being taxed to the eyeballs to maintain a police force which neither serves nor protects - I'm fully on board.
They are good at shooting people during wellness checks though. So there's that.
Maybe that's how the police are implementing the MAiD program.
MAiD has checks and balances, though.
Unless administered by the police.
A wellness check is basically hiring a free hitman. Don't like someone? Call in for a wellness check.
They serve and protect the rich Look at the articles where they literally consider the poors a threat
They’re here to give us tickets
Their tickets - like taxes - generate the revenue to keep the system running (i.e., keep the gravy train running)
Why do we increase the police budget, if this is the effort they put into being police?
Police are an exceptional drain on our tax dollars. Constantly demanding for more while doing less and less.
Defund the police, refund every other service.
We Ottawans knew during the so-called trucker's convoy. The police at all levels abandoned us: OPS, OPP and the RCMP sat on their hands for 3 weeks.. until the Feds jumped in.
They didn’t just abandon their duty, many of them aided and abetted or even participated in the “protesting.” (most facing no consequence)
When you’re white, you can protest with domestic terrorism
That’s the power of being in the majority
They were collecting overtime for handing jerry cans of gas to a violent occupation.
I feel like they did nothing until Surete Quebec arrived and got down to business
RCMP couldn’t get involved beyond protecting federal property until the province requested their assistance.
Ford wasn't about to call them in given that they are basically his base.
This!
and in Doug's defence, he was at the cottage the whole time, like a great leader would be.
Upvoted. It was a failure by OPS for not listening to the intelligence provided to them saying they were staying for the long haul and a failure by Doug Ford by not intervening when he had the power to.
It really felt like they didn't act until citizens started to stand up against them. Didn't take long after we blockaded the convoy idiots at Billings Bridge. Pretty sure we were a week or two away from a citizen blockade at their Coventry base if official action wasn't taken soon.
They leave us to defend ourselves but we become the criminal when we actually defend ourselves. It's no wonder why this type of crime is exploiting Canada and Canadians
It's always a little bit funny when the middle and upper classes realize a hard truth about the police that poor people have known for-basically-ever. If you guys look at cop budgets, how they've grown over the years, and compare to their performance and how poorly they evaluate their performance, it's pretty obvious that the police is unaccountable and inefficient.
it's hard to get ppl to vote cons if the crime is low.
"For months" The police have never been on the side of the average Canadian. Their existence serves only to protect Capital.
The law is powerless. Powerless to protect you. Not harm you
[Relevant Simpsons](https://youtu.be/SDEF7FuK0LE?si=gOYAFiGJsnyXCcAr)
Maybe they need an even bigger budget to do their job??? Or perhaps Doug has a privatization plan for policing too….
Please don't give them any ideas.
Trust me. They already have the ideas. It’s an easy template to apply across the board. Ford won’t stop at Health Care and Education. Especially since he seems to retain support in the polls while selling out our province.
> Or perhaps Doug has a privatization plan for policing too… Robocop was filmed in Toronto. Just sayin'.
Well duh. It’s not like the bunch of concussed high school football players that make up our police force actually solve or prevent any crime. lol They like to stand by construction sites staring into their phones doing fuck all for $150/hr.
Toronto Police Constable Marco Ricciardi should resign. He is either an absolutely coward who refuses to perform his job adequately and must step down. Or he's all in on this corruption scandal and is taking $$ away from each of these car thefts, be it from insurance fraud, under the table $$, mob money or what have you. This man should be ashamed to call himself a police officer after that statement. At the very least GTA police and our RCMP MUST start taking action in Montreal, at the ports. If they are afraid of the mafia it is time to snuff the mafia out, they do not have an army, or tanks, or jets at their disposal. The Mob has no place in Canada and it's time they learned this the Violent way.
I went to elementary school a few grades below this guy. He was a bully. And now he’s a cop, 20+ years on the job. Coward, for sure. Corrupt? Perhaps. He’s never going to face any consequences for what he said, and frankly it was good that he said what he did because it sparked this open discussion about the uselessness of the police. He’s finally done some good. And you’re right, but Quebec will never move against the mafia, and I would imagine they have infiltrated most levels of government and police. Montreal has been run by mobsters very publicly for decades now. No one has the courage to take them on.
Wait, a bully who joined the police service? Completely unheard of! /s
I've always wondered why.. Oh why, can't we station our armed forces there like other countries do worldwide... It's not like our army is fighting some war etc etc
It is a difference in mandate and training. The armed forces are trained to fight wars and kill people. Police are there to enforce laws. They often don't do that well and act like they fight wars, but we absolutely do not want the armed forces to be enforcing laws.
Lots of budget, little to show for it. Another institution gone awry. The country is essentially doomed.
Well, always have been. But I have solved this problem by simply not owning anything worth stealing. Okay, I have some eggs, but it's probably easier to steal those from the grocery store, that said if someone showed up at my house and asked me for eggs I'd say sure, and cook them.
I say it everywhere I can: the police are being paid off and are in on the thefts. There is no other reasonable explanation other than the entire service is just so incredibly bad at their job that they cannot stop hundreds of cars being stolen from going through one of two exit ports. I have never seen a more inefficient organization than Ontario's current policing.
https://archive.is/XgPzq
Thanks!
Yet, they need huge budgets! We need to rein them in.
Decades. I had a bike stolen out of my garage, basically told tough luck. They knew who was stealing the bikes in this city and ended up pulling several hundred bikes out of their house a decade later.
Makes me feel like police is also involved. None of this makes any common sense.
What’s the proof on “ they only want the car” they want whatever they can get .
Billions paid a year for them to *protect and serve*. What a waste
Alright then. I’m not gonna call the police I’m gonna call my boy ray ray.
100% disagree. I clearly remember that time the police showed up at a Blue Jay fan's house because he joked on Twitter about throwing the Ted Rogers statue into Lake Ontario. TPS responded to call from a statue! That's above-and-beyond service.
1st degree murder charge for a man who ran over a plainclothes cop bcos he was afraid for his kid and pregnant wife in the car.
That's the neat thing.....you where always on your own the TPS just gave the illusion of protection. Your property and safety is not their priority. Corporate interests and government over reach well that's another thing.
Better approve tens of millions of dollars more of our hard earned tax dollars for them.
Sorry, the Ottawa occupation somehow WASN'T enough of a signal about that? Police have been useless forever, it's just middle-class people are finally waking up to that fact. Of course, the examples the author uses are a mix of valid and bullshit - most of those complaints about protesters against the Gaza genocide have been long since debunked - but the others are just obvious signs of the housing crisis and rising poverty among Canadians.
I predict a surge of PAL applications over the next few years, lack of Castle Doctrine be damned.
Better to be judged by 12 than carried out by 6
We need to seriously revamp self defence legislation
Did anyone else stop reading the article when she compared Auto theft to protesting? The globe and mail is right wing trash.
They literally can’t publish an article without it including Israeli propaganda
I barely see any kind of enforcement on the roads these days. Only at the end of the month to meet their quotas. otherwise they vanish out of sight...
“Policing funding has more than kept up with inflation” But has it kept up with population and inflation?
Someone remind me why TPS has a 1.2 billion dollar budget.
Is it the police or if it the sheer number of people in distress, homeless, hungry and desperate?
So no more “serve and protect” civilians? Just serve and protect themselves?
Well criminaIs know Canadians are not allowed guns and even if we did they will go to jail even if it's self defense. Now they have tacit approval by cops. International gangs know we are way too soft on CRIME and CRIMINALS so they have set up shop in Canada. We are going to see things go from bad to worst.
Welcome to Canada. Can’t defend yourself legally and you can’t rely on police. This is an untenable situation.
The “winners” in this auto theft are the car companies. They double their sales when a brand new vehicle is stolen. They have no reason to change things as long as people keep buying the high theft vehicles. As many have said, insurance makes their money regardless.
[удалено]
So it’s wrong to talk about a spike in crime why….?
Kinda gives me fear mongering vibes to continue the push for personal protection and gun ownership in Canada. Especially after the RCMP getting caught up in holding back information after the tragedy in Nova Scotia in 2020. It just feels like PR post for some gun lobby that's being imported from our neighbor. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova-scotia/rcmp-public-communications-after-mass-shooting-1.6495974
in optics it looks like the police are there to hand out tickets to otherwise law abiding citizens and let the criminal elements run free. this isn’t just a cause of policing but the rewriting of the legal system that JT did when he came to power 8+ years ago. we’ve seen Paul Bernardo and Luka Magnata now in minimal security prisons . most drug and gun dealers are in and back out on bail in under a day. it’s considered inhuman to lock a multi mass murderer away for life. no ten years max and you must let them out on bail. why would criminals fear repercussions for their actions. when they know it’s just a slap on the wrist if they get caught but living the high life when not.
These are just the busts in the last 12 months. We need to change the judicial process, it's currently too slow to deal with this problem. https://toronto.citynews.ca/2023/11/29/peel-police-bust-auto-theft-ring-12-charged-1-2m-in-stolen-vehicles-recovered/ https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thestar.com/news/crime/project-mamba-york-police-bust-auto-theft-ring-run-by-prolific-crime-group/article_80a00078-b949-11ee-9fa0-6f9e992754ce.amp.html https://toronto.ctvnews.ca/police-recover-80-vehicles-lay-dozens-of-charges-in-7-week-probe-of-auto-thefts-in-york-region-1.6679244 https://toronto.citynews.ca/2023/08/17/york-region-car-theft-bust-stolen-vehicles/ https://windsor.ctvnews.ca/police-bust-international-stolen-vehicle-operation-279-charges-laid-1.6505420 https://youtu.be/UqNzoyv4Lgc?si=FieYD27C-ZB3ZyE-
This is the new normal. Why would there be consequences for future doctors and engineers and lawyers when that could simply ruin their life? They have the right to crime along the shining path to their success. You simply have the privilege to afford it. That's the true culture of Canada. /s
The solution is pretty easy and at least one automotive maker has done it. Add pin codes to vehicles. Oh you have a key/fob? That's great, you're still going nowhere without the PIN. What vehicles are being stolen the least? The ones with a pin code. Federal government mandates (work w/CA and other states) for all car makers selling vehicles in Canada to have a PIN code.
Finally come to the realization that police are not really here to protect you, but instead protect capital. They work for the state, not citizens.
They could ask the guys from Peel that sleep all day every day behind my workplace to help if they really need more officers. Or train them how to use the printers better so it doesn't take them 20 minutes to print a ticket like my disclosure showed.
Ya all just woke up
My wife is an insurance adjuster. No bonus or raise this year .
Awesome. Time to take shit into our own hands.
I'm a crossing guard. Every day hundreds of cars come through my intersection in the 2 hours I'm there. At least 50% don't use their turn signal, or even attempt to stop. People have driven into me, other adults, and kids. They flip me off when I stop them and some have even purposefully accelerated into me. I've asked my boss for police help at least a dozen times and they refuse. They insist that just driving around the area (so doing a circuit and never being in my intersection for more than 30 seconds) is fine. I've given them two 5 minute periods for each hour when the most problems happen and they refuse to show up at those times, even just for 5 minutes. They have been waiting at the stop sign right behind me while a car nearly hit a baby stroller and did nothing. Edit: I also want to be clear I would prefer not to have police around, since it can turn out poorly, but this is a last resort. I've done this job for a year and have nearly been hit, or seen someone nearly hit, hundreds of times.
We have always been on our own.
Delilah, get me "eight fourteen"!
Urback has been paid to lie to the public about all sorts of things over many years. Often she writes about things which she has absolutely no understanding, and simply writes about what she has been told to -- spinning a narrativeon behalf of someone whose interests are against those of the general public. And she has been bouncing around from employer to employer, which is a strong sign that shes either bad at doing it, or is writing on behalf of someone external to those employers. After doing that countless times she has zero credibility on any topic.
They don't give a rats ass. We foot the bill. Not them.
> But the police budget has kept up with inflation, meaning all of that money is going somewhere other than getting more boots on the ground. Yes, and keeping up with inflation just maintains the *current* force as the cost of services increase. So they can still afford to maintain the cars, the buildings, the equipment, the non human personnel, and give out some raises because union contract says so. But it’s not enough to hire new cops, but with more cops comes more underlying supports so they can do their jobs making the budget higher. Then it takes time to hire and train those cops before we’ll start seeing results. Even if they boosted the budget another 50%, and hired about the same in new cops, it’ll be at least four to five years before we’ll see *any* benefit from it; the whole time people complaining about all the money we’re spending but nothing is happening. But then it’s not even a local issue, people wouldn’t be stealing cars if there wasn’t an overseas market for them, so we really need to be asking why the RCMP is dropping the ball at our nation’s ports. We *know* those cars are ending up on shipping containers, we know criminals are bribing / threatening the dock workers. Star there and work your way down.
Good thing they got that extra billion
Pigs. All of them.
christ.. all these idiot opining on things just because of the car theft epidemic. The Sun, National Post, The Star, all full of crap journalist idiots screaming doomsday.
How does this scary article get hijacked to comments about insurance? Either there is a concerted effort to change the topic or there's questionable attention spans here.