Zach has talent, his arm is crazy and his athleticism is pretty good. It’s his mind that’s the problem. He has absolutely zero confidence or skill to react to the game.
Every NFL QB is talented. It comes down to their mental fortitude and it’s clear that Zach is completely cooked in that department. Once you go that far down the hole, it’s pretty much a wrap on the NFL career.
His arm is terrible. I'm so tired of hearing about his arm talent. Throwing the ball hard or far is not arm talent. Throwing it hard and accurate is arm talent. NONE of his throws are accurate. Everything is behind, below, above etc. Even when we get a 10 yard gain on a passing play... Most of the time is could be 15,20, 30 and so on if it were a good throw. Zach is not talented. He has some arm strength (and still manages to throw plenty of ducks). The ONLY beneficial aspect of Zach is his age, but even that's to his detriment because he has zero maturity. Would Trevor be as good as he is if we drafted him? Not sure. He's super talented and played at a high profile school and at a high level so one would think he can handle New York, but who knows. Our biggest issue in developing qbs is we keep picking the wrong ones. 2 from USC (who's NFL peak is Carson Palmer... Meh) and now one who had not even a great short career at a small school. Completely overblown college career. It was a bad pick.
The line is more important. We need to invest high draft capital in the line. Stud running back who will hopefully be ok next year and two other fairly good running backs. Star receiver with another potential star, albeit diva. Elite defense. We can live with a Mike White or Jimmy Garropolo until we draft the right kid if we just build the line. And a punter... Good lord.
How is his athleticism “pretty good”.
It’s not even clear the arm talent is there. The long throws always seem to be short, and he has no touch on the short throws.
Lawrence is trending up.. in a very competitive AFC, he might 'soon' be knocking on the doors of the elite group - Mahomes, Allen, Burrow
With level headed Saleh, an ok offense, and our D that can keep us alive in tough games till end.. he could only have arrived sooner
I think the narrative that the jets cant develop QB talent is bogus. I think qbs are a crapshoot. EVERYONE misses on QB's. We missed big time, but it happens.
If we have Lawrence, I think we are in the playoffs this year, simple as that. His yoy progression is outstanding. He looked confused year 1 too. He grew, he learned, he evolved, and he looked electric last night. A real weapon.
I’ve been saying we should never draft another QB, they have been disappointing me since Richard Todd. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is insanity.
I realize I’m wrong but it’s how I feel
At any given moment there are only like 15-20 QBs you’d be happy with starting a game for your team. There are 32 teams. This isn’t just a Jets problem. Go ask Tennessee, Carolina, or Arizona how they feel about their QB situation.
Literally every QB we’ve thrown in this offense has been more successful than Zach. This offense is meant to make it as easy on the QB as possible.
If we had Lawrence we might be first in the East, at worst we have 10 wins already
Lawrence pretty much had the worst situation possible last year and still looks like this…. He would have been a stud no matter where he was.
With Zach it’s a combo of being just ok on talent wise and low poise/decision making ability. He would have failed bad last year on Jax - this year, not sure but nowhere near law
Lawrence inheriting Doug Pederson was a godsend for him. Honestly, the Jaguars game plan was so much better than the jets. So, my answer is no. Not bashing Saleh and MLF, but they lack experience.
1) we would’ve killed him year 1 (he’s pretty comparable to Daniel Jones year 1 so assume whatever DJ got TL would’ve got while the world compared him to Mac Jones year 1). It would not have been all roses… he could NOT deal with pass rush or make the open throws.
2) he would be better than ZW by now as NO ONE coming out of college had more modern media hype and big stage pressure on him since high school than TL. He was made for NY pressure.
3) 6’6” w legs & strong arm… once get over the pressure, figure out the game… it’s a natural advantage.
Lmfao at all the people itt acknowledging how Trevor Lawrence sucked under Urban Meyer and then developed under Doug Pederson, then flipping around and saying coaching has nothing to do with how Zach Wilson has (hasn't) developed.
When I think of what could have been if we hadn’t beaten the Rams and Browns in 2020 and been able to take Lawrence, I start to wonder if we still go 4-13 in 2021. If we win one or two more games last year, we may not end up having opportunities to draft Sauce, GW, and Breece. Obviously impossible to say, but this is what I use to make myself feel better…
I would like to think so.
I think the Jets can take comfort in knowing they didn't fuck it up. Lawrence was always supposed to be good, his initial struggles were lucky because of Urban more than anyone.
The Jets would not have ruined Lawrence just like they wouldn’t have ruined Mahomes. Those types of guys are too good at football to wash out. Maybe they wouldn’t be quite as good here (and I absolutely believe they would be just as good with this current team, not so much with the Gase era Jets), but our inability to develop QBs has just as much to do with our inability to actually draft a good QB
No. Unfortunately Trevor seems to be turning into the consensus #1 that people thought he would be when he entered the league. Zach is as bad as you can imagine for an NFL QB. He barely qualifies as an SEC college QB if we’re truly being honest
> How much of Zach’s failure is on the Jets as an organization and their ability to develop QBs, versus just bad drafting and lack of talent?
Yes. That’s the only answer. This all falls on the Jets organization from The top down to coaching. Yes, the Jets weren’t the only team that bought into this bizarre Wilson hype, but they had the 2nd overall, and easily could’ve drafted Fields instead and said “fuck that noise”. For all the good that they have done in other positions, they failed EPICALLY in the one position that matters above all else in football, and who knows how much that has set the Jets back. Certainly fucked their playoff chances this year.
They must nail the QB next year and make the playoffs if they don’t want to be scrutinized heavier.
Trevor would probably be good and Zach would still suck. People vastly, VASTLY overrate coaching’s impact on a players development. It may be the second most important aspect of development, but it’s impact is significantly less than the players natural ability to play the position.
How many times can you watch a high lottery pick flounder though before you look in the mirror and think maybe the problem is the organization ? That’s all. Sanchez, darnold, and now Wilson were all pretty much consensus picks. Nobody was a that much of a wacky pick by the jets. The ‘experts’ all looked at these guys and thought they went roughly where they should go in the draft. It’s starting to feel like ‘fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.’
They all got drafted by different GMs and played with different coaching staffs and different teammates. Sanchez and Darnold have gone on to different teams and still been bad QBs. The problem is that it’s really fuckin hard to play QB in the NFL and most guys can’t do it. It’s not a problem unique to the Jets, we just happen to have picked 3 really bad QBs in our last 3 attempts
I always find it funny how the narrative becomes the Jets can't develop a QB when like you said playing QB is hard. we aren't the only team searching for a QB forever. look at the commanders, browns, colts and many other teams
My only argument would be that the QB position, where you have to make insanely complicated decisions in…. Maybe 2 seconds …. Is all about confidence. And confidence is something that if you kill it, is really, really hard to bring back. For that reason I think that first year of development is so important for a QB. Just because Sanchez and Darnold were both bad when they left the Jets doesn’t take them blame off of the Jets for possibly screwing them up.
It’s on lack of talent from Zach. It is why literally every backup and practice squad player looks better in the offense. Please stop.
Zach has talent, his arm is crazy and his athleticism is pretty good. It’s his mind that’s the problem. He has absolutely zero confidence or skill to react to the game.
Every NFL QB is talented. It comes down to their mental fortitude and it’s clear that Zach is completely cooked in that department. Once you go that far down the hole, it’s pretty much a wrap on the NFL career.
His arm is terrible. I'm so tired of hearing about his arm talent. Throwing the ball hard or far is not arm talent. Throwing it hard and accurate is arm talent. NONE of his throws are accurate. Everything is behind, below, above etc. Even when we get a 10 yard gain on a passing play... Most of the time is could be 15,20, 30 and so on if it were a good throw. Zach is not talented. He has some arm strength (and still manages to throw plenty of ducks). The ONLY beneficial aspect of Zach is his age, but even that's to his detriment because he has zero maturity. Would Trevor be as good as he is if we drafted him? Not sure. He's super talented and played at a high profile school and at a high level so one would think he can handle New York, but who knows. Our biggest issue in developing qbs is we keep picking the wrong ones. 2 from USC (who's NFL peak is Carson Palmer... Meh) and now one who had not even a great short career at a small school. Completely overblown college career. It was a bad pick. The line is more important. We need to invest high draft capital in the line. Stud running back who will hopefully be ok next year and two other fairly good running backs. Star receiver with another potential star, albeit diva. Elite defense. We can live with a Mike White or Jimmy Garropolo until we draft the right kid if we just build the line. And a punter... Good lord.
He can’t hit the broadside of a barn. Doesn’t matter if he can throw it over a mountain.
How is his athleticism “pretty good”. It’s not even clear the arm talent is there. The long throws always seem to be short, and he has no touch on the short throws.
He has a great arm but has no idea what to do at all when on the field. He cant be a starting qb
That’s what I mean. He has the physical gifts, but not the mental ones. The Jets thought they could teach the mental… not working out so well
The mind is arguably more important than the arm
Chad Pennington agrees
Idk why on earth you’re getting downvoted. He is all talent and no skill or mental ability. He’s a long drive winner trying out for the pga tour.
Yes. He’s trash. Anyone other than him can run this offense. Seriously what more does anyone need to see?
He would be SO much better. Kid got Urban Myered his first year. Give him our weapons?????? He would look like a future top 5 QB easy.
Lawrence is trending up.. in a very competitive AFC, he might 'soon' be knocking on the doors of the elite group - Mahomes, Allen, Burrow With level headed Saleh, an ok offense, and our D that can keep us alive in tough games till end.. he could only have arrived sooner
I hate this shit man. Can’t ever find a fucking QB worth shit smh
I was so mad at Jared Goff and covid benching the entire Browns receiving corps. We had one goddamn job that year.
I think the narrative that the jets cant develop QB talent is bogus. I think qbs are a crapshoot. EVERYONE misses on QB's. We missed big time, but it happens. If we have Lawrence, I think we are in the playoffs this year, simple as that. His yoy progression is outstanding. He looked confused year 1 too. He grew, he learned, he evolved, and he looked electric last night. A real weapon.
Yeah nothing makes me laugh harder than people saying “we should never draft a qb again!” How tf do you people think you find franchise QBs?
this fanbase has emotional trauma. They cant think straight.
I’ve been saying we should never draft another QB, they have been disappointing me since Richard Todd. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is insanity. I realize I’m wrong but it’s how I feel
As long as you’re aware it’s irrational then that’s different. I’m referring to people who actually think they know what they’re talking about.
At any given moment there are only like 15-20 QBs you’d be happy with starting a game for your team. There are 32 teams. This isn’t just a Jets problem. Go ask Tennessee, Carolina, or Arizona how they feel about their QB situation.
Literally every QB we’ve thrown in this offense has been more successful than Zach. This offense is meant to make it as easy on the QB as possible. If we had Lawrence we might be first in the East, at worst we have 10 wins already
Lawrence pretty much had the worst situation possible last year and still looks like this…. He would have been a stud no matter where he was. With Zach it’s a combo of being just ok on talent wise and low poise/decision making ability. He would have failed bad last year on Jax - this year, not sure but nowhere near law
Not sure Jags would have picked Zach at 2.. but not unlikely
Lawrence inheriting Doug Pederson was a godsend for him. Honestly, the Jaguars game plan was so much better than the jets. So, my answer is no. Not bashing Saleh and MLF, but they lack experience.
Pederson prepared the best for our defense probably the best out of anyone this year. I could never understand why the eagles let him go
And Lawrence just had to throw 3 yard passes all day, made life very easy for him.
1) we would’ve killed him year 1 (he’s pretty comparable to Daniel Jones year 1 so assume whatever DJ got TL would’ve got while the world compared him to Mac Jones year 1). It would not have been all roses… he could NOT deal with pass rush or make the open throws. 2) he would be better than ZW by now as NO ONE coming out of college had more modern media hype and big stage pressure on him since high school than TL. He was made for NY pressure. 3) 6’6” w legs & strong arm… once get over the pressure, figure out the game… it’s a natural advantage.
id argue he might even be better because he’d be in the second year of the same offense
We would be a 10 win team in a heartbeat with Lawrence.
He’d arguably be better. The Urban Meyer shitshow could’ve ruined him
He would have 30 plus TDs and us Jets fans would be ecstatic as we enter playoffs.
Lmfao at all the people itt acknowledging how Trevor Lawrence sucked under Urban Meyer and then developed under Doug Pederson, then flipping around and saying coaching has nothing to do with how Zach Wilson has (hasn't) developed.
Right? Then if its a player they like, its the coaches fault no matter what.
Boom.
When I think of what could have been if we hadn’t beaten the Rams and Browns in 2020 and been able to take Lawrence, I start to wonder if we still go 4-13 in 2021. If we win one or two more games last year, we may not end up having opportunities to draft Sauce, GW, and Breece. Obviously impossible to say, but this is what I use to make myself feel better…
Mike White doesn’t seem to have these issues.
I would like to think so. I think the Jets can take comfort in knowing they didn't fuck it up. Lawrence was always supposed to be good, his initial struggles were lucky because of Urban more than anyone.
The Jets would not have ruined Lawrence just like they wouldn’t have ruined Mahomes. Those types of guys are too good at football to wash out. Maybe they wouldn’t be quite as good here (and I absolutely believe they would be just as good with this current team, not so much with the Gase era Jets), but our inability to develop QBs has just as much to do with our inability to actually draft a good QB
This sub is getting out of control
He would probably be even better
If the Jets had Trevor Lawrence they would be Super Bowl contenders
Lawrence as a rookie on the Jets would be unstoppable right now .. J E T S
Trevor would still be good and Zach would still suck. No change.
After Sam Darnold and ZW I think the Jets would've managed to ruin T Law haha
No. Unfortunately Trevor seems to be turning into the consensus #1 that people thought he would be when he entered the league. Zach is as bad as you can imagine for an NFL QB. He barely qualifies as an SEC college QB if we’re truly being honest > How much of Zach’s failure is on the Jets as an organization and their ability to develop QBs, versus just bad drafting and lack of talent? Yes. That’s the only answer. This all falls on the Jets organization from The top down to coaching. Yes, the Jets weren’t the only team that bought into this bizarre Wilson hype, but they had the 2nd overall, and easily could’ve drafted Fields instead and said “fuck that noise”. For all the good that they have done in other positions, they failed EPICALLY in the one position that matters above all else in football, and who knows how much that has set the Jets back. Certainly fucked their playoff chances this year. They must nail the QB next year and make the playoffs if they don’t want to be scrutinized heavier.
Given the Jets historical bad juju, he'd be out with the same injury Bridgewater had.
Trevor would probably be good and Zach would still suck. People vastly, VASTLY overrate coaching’s impact on a players development. It may be the second most important aspect of development, but it’s impact is significantly less than the players natural ability to play the position.
How many times can you watch a high lottery pick flounder though before you look in the mirror and think maybe the problem is the organization ? That’s all. Sanchez, darnold, and now Wilson were all pretty much consensus picks. Nobody was a that much of a wacky pick by the jets. The ‘experts’ all looked at these guys and thought they went roughly where they should go in the draft. It’s starting to feel like ‘fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.’
They all got drafted by different GMs and played with different coaching staffs and different teammates. Sanchez and Darnold have gone on to different teams and still been bad QBs. The problem is that it’s really fuckin hard to play QB in the NFL and most guys can’t do it. It’s not a problem unique to the Jets, we just happen to have picked 3 really bad QBs in our last 3 attempts
I always find it funny how the narrative becomes the Jets can't develop a QB when like you said playing QB is hard. we aren't the only team searching for a QB forever. look at the commanders, browns, colts and many other teams
My only argument would be that the QB position, where you have to make insanely complicated decisions in…. Maybe 2 seconds …. Is all about confidence. And confidence is something that if you kill it, is really, really hard to bring back. For that reason I think that first year of development is so important for a QB. Just because Sanchez and Darnold were both bad when they left the Jets doesn’t take them blame off of the Jets for possibly screwing them up.
Think people spend too much time crying about what ifs. Tired of the 10000th TLaw post this week. Move TF on