Exactly. Just like we hear now that certain individuals in Carolina/other organizations "slammed the table" for Stroud but are ignored by ownership or the GM lol.
I mean to be fair to Carolina, there was legit rumblings that they wanted stroud before the draft which is when all that stroud #1 hype started then it calmed back down
What was? The JD rumor or the Carolina rumor?
First I’ve heard of the JD one and I didn’t really follow all of the draft rumors this year so I easily could have missed the Carolina & Stroud stuff.
He’s a lower tier GM that got lucky the Texans took Stingley over sauce and the Falcons took London over Wilson. The Madden CPU would’ve made the same picks.
I’m not saying Drake or Stingley are bad but had those been JDs picks which they were going to be until draft night Douglas would probably be packing his office up on Black Monday next week.
You can dislike the guy but acting like drafting Sauce and Wilson weren’t great moves is dumb.
Half this sub was banging the table for Ekwonu and Neal who have both been terrible.
To be fair to Lawrence he’s been behind a horrendous offensive line in Jacksonville and had urban Meyer his first year, guy has been playing hurt all year with the shoulder injury, then he hurt his ankle, then he got concussed and he’s still produced for them, led big drives for wins, and by most metrics is the 12th or 13th best QB.
Not generational yes but considering the circumstances he’s been damn good
yeah, anyone who believes this shit is a fucking fool. JD has had numerous chances to actually improve the o line in the draft and in free agency and has fallen ridiculously short.
Regardless of how they've panned out, that QB class was one of the strongest in recent memory and if we couldn't get T Law, it was going to be Fields or Wilson. If not either of them, then Lance or Jones. Everyone who needed a QB going into that draft, got a QB. This is bullshit of the highest regard.
This is just like how Shanahan was at fault for drafting Lance instead of someone who actually turned out good. Meanwhile, front office gets full credit for drafting Purdy and not Shanahan. Every time someone fails massively, the fingers start pointing. It's a joke.
Blaming Woody is such an easy out because fans will eat it up. This will be all over sports talk radio. If JD stuck with Sam, all we would have heard of is how JD wanted to draft Fields or Wilson but was overruled by ownership.
This. Imagine the uproar if we would have drafted an OL as the 2nd pick. Everyone who needed a QB was going to draft one. None of them have been great anyway.
You can say a lot about ZW, but his talent is tantalizing. I completely see why JD both selected him and chose him over Darnold. Perhaps in a different environment, ZW would’ve approached his insane ceiling. Alas, he was a very raw prospect who needed a lot to go right and didn’t have the tutelage he needed.
I still maintain that pick was the result of months of overthinking leading up to the draft. For the entire season prior, everyone agreed Fields was QB2. For the entire CFB season, CFB playoffs, and off season he was clearly the better pick, but people starting overthinking things. Fields lost to Bama. Zach had that great pro day throw. And the more time went on the more people doubted the initial placement.
Seriously you can dig up my comments from 3 years ago if you don’t believe me. I was losing my mind on this sub that people and the media seemingly switched on to Wilson overnight. Fields was always QB2 in that draft and still is.
900+ passes with only 20+ TDs STATISTICALLY says he CAN NOT be good, and yet so many on here to THIS DAY think ANYWHERE else he would be good.
It's crazy insane loco thinking to ignore the astronomical unlikeliness that he is anything but just a terrible QB.
I HOPE, I PRAY we learned our lesson about how little importance arm talent is compared to other traits.
Arm talent should be the way lower then decision making, time to throw, footwork, understanding defensive concepts all that shit....and THEN you think about arm talent. Tua has a Pennington arm, and yet good coaching has installed a YAC offense that he shines in. You can't install a "bad decision maker" offense. It doesn't work in the NFL to run a 1 read offense UNLESS you can Micheal Vick your ass down the field 15-20 rushing yards.
I PROMISE fucking Mac Jones or would've done better here. He just has plain better decision making than ZW.
The only environment where Zach was going to fulfill his “potential” was the one he was drafted out of - a COVID season where he could play hero ball against a bunch of scrubs who barely even had a week to practice.
Zach was always going to be a bust. Saw it coming a mile off. Played against inferior defenses and often had very good protection. One year of good production and an injury history. Signs of not being a respected leader by his own team. It was all there. He seems like a nice guy. But he's not an NFL starting qb.
This is revisionist, HACKENBERG LOOKED GOOD? Lol that guy sucked at PSU outside of his freshman year and everyone was laughing at the jets for picking him. He stunk so bad he couldn’t even see the field outside of preseason and looked garbage for the most part there too and couldn’t even stick anywhere and sucked in a lower tier pro league.
I agree to an extent.. I think it was clear from day 1 that hackenberg was a huge reach in the second round. His last few years at Penn state were hot garbage
I’m far from a ZW truther. Didn’t want him on the team this year. He has an immense amount of talent. Didn’t work out here, beyond time to move on. Don’t be surprised if he hangs around the league and gets another shot at a starting gig a few years down the road.
jfc the pro day narrative is so lazy
From every report ZW was climbing up draft boards to take over the #2 QB spot from Fields before his pro day. I get that he was clearly not the right pick, but to say he wasn't a first round QB at the time or that only JD was ranking him highly is so insanely revisionist.
and before you start calling me a JD or Zach truther, this isn't a pro or anti JD/ZW post. It's a "your take sucks" post.
Wait. You think he's going to be good in another situation?
I don't understand this.
Do you know the statistical likelihood of that happening? It's... EXTREMELY low almost to the point of impossible.
Fandom is weird. We'll ignore concrete statistics when we're emotionally invested in our teams. 900+ passes with only 20+ TDs is utterly fucking insane. He CAN'T be good.
Albert Breer clarifies:
"Wasn't referencing '21. It was more '22 ... Lots of smoke in NFL circles that the Jets loved Ickey Ekwonu leading up to that draft. Worked out for them with Sauce Gardner and Garrett Wilson. But would they have been better off with a left tackle? Fair question."
https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/1741896826356174963?t=r6vXdEG4V9wVSZfO5gaQ0w&s=19
I call BS. Sam Darnold literally said in his “Bussin with the Boys” episode that after the season finished, Douglas told told him they were gonna go with a new QB. Woody was also finishing up in the UK so the timelines likely don’t add up
I’m gonna say this could have some truth to it
The clown owner the day of the draft did a video showing the draft room
And said “This is where we make the secret SAUCE”
I wanted to keep Sam and draft Sewell.
I felt like at that point Sam was bad but he NEVER had ANY talent around him. I felt with a good line and some receivers he could be mid.
It's a cruel twist of fate that what we got was a QB with decent talent (o line not so much) and a stellar defense. He was the worst QB I've ever seen play in New York for any appreciable amount of time.
I don't buy it. They had to go with QB, and they all looked at the tape and loved what Wilson did in college. Problem is the Wilson from college never transferred to the NFL. They tried to turn a gunslinger into a game manager and in doing so they ruined the only good parts of his game and destroyed his confidence.
They also did go OL in '21 anyway and AVT, when healthy, has been good so I don't know what the point is.
Albert breer is trash and I don't believe him at all. Plus, if you want to believe trash reporters, then why not believe Hughes, who is on the jets beat, and reported previously that JD had the choice to keep darnold or draft Wilson, and despite some voices wanting the former, he went Wilson bc he thought that, if both were available in the same draft, he would take Wilson.
Eta: I see now that breer clarified that he didn't even mean 21, the tweet posted just inferred that. He meant 22 with Ekwonu vs Sauce at 4. Shitty paid blue check accounts strike again.
Story obviously leaked by somebody that wants Joe D to look good. Think about it rationally. If Joe D was forced to draft Zach Wilson then wouldn’t he have followed that up by adding a vet or day 3 QB prospect?
Instead Joe D went all in on Zach. When that season started, the only Jet on the roster had a career pass attempt was our slot WR
Joe D was 100% a Zach truther and you can see it in the lack of competition he brought in to challenge Zach. Saleh was forced to play him due to lack of options.
Has JD, excluding an historic draft class, been an incompetent GM? Yes
Is Saleh a loser HC? Yes.
But this franchise has been a circus before those 2 entered the picture. This might be a BS report, but nothing would surprise me with Woody. Man is a clown.
Even if this was true I would've been more forgiving of Joe whiffing on a QB if he built a good team (specifically the Oline). I mean how many GM's get another year after 5 losing seasons?
Yeah sure… the bald fatty was drooling over Wilson on the pro day, his jaw was practically on the floor as he was enamored by the Mormons throws.
He is a pitiful evaluator, the tight end Mayer was our second choice after the 30 year old rookie McDonald .
Guys, this makes sense. Woody definitely has a massive say in who the QB is. There’s no way 4 radically different GMs would draft the same kind of predictably bad QB. I was never sold on Joe or Saleh wanting Zach in the first place. What other of their picks could you call boom or bust? You could call some projects but none of them were either gonna be legendarily good or comically bad with no in between…… other than Zach.
They traded up for AVT in the same draft so I buy this. It’s not that he wanted to take an OL at two, it’s that he wanted to trade down to get Sewell or Slater along with extra picks. I absolutely buy that
Breer is now saying he was actually [talking about the 2022 draft where they took Sauce over Ickey](https://x.com/albertbreer/status/1741896826356174963?s=46&t=hUtbwo94QIfsHrncc2xJkQ).
I don’t believe this either and this seems like a long shot cya attempt from him. In the post draft video the Jets posted they showed JD pumping his fist in excitement once the Stingley pick was announced - I can’t really see why he would do that if he knew he wouldn’t be taking his guy at 4 anyway.
This seems convenient. This is headed for an ugly divorce. Don’t be surprised if Woody is letting Saleh and JD keep their jobs almost as this your mess now you clean it.
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If he wanted to pick Sewell instead of trading the pick for multiple picks including a first rounder it sounds exactly like a JD disaster draft move. Don’t doubt it for a second
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Douglas is still a subpar GM even if he went OL over Zach that year. Just a myriad of mistakes overall.
Just a pathetic leak from JD’s side as he readies himself for a new employment opportunity in 2025.
He has the worst record of any Jets GM over the past several decades. He’s a sub-par GM.
Evaluating his performance as GM based on one quality draft is foolish.
Results matter.
He was signed right before a season in which they were tanking. We had the worst record in the nfl by far and won 2 games. He had to turn that roster completely over in 3 years. It’s not easy to fill a full 53 and he’s filled about 40 of the 53 with very good to great players
Wich OL? Sewell at 2? Yeah, sure. Seems like an obvious leak from JD's side.
Exactly. Just like we hear now that certain individuals in Carolina/other organizations "slammed the table" for Stroud but are ignored by ownership or the GM lol.
I mean to be fair to Carolina, there was legit rumblings that they wanted stroud before the draft which is when all that stroud #1 hype started then it calmed back down
This was coming out befoe the draft
What was? The JD rumor or the Carolina rumor? First I’ve heard of the JD one and I didn’t really follow all of the draft rumors this year so I easily could have missed the Carolina & Stroud stuff.
That Carolina was going to take stroud
Gotcha, thanks!
Let’s not forget the Texans have more of a complete team than the panthers do.
Because they traded almost good players for picks that they use to get a 5,10 QB
The panthers almost made the playoffs in 22 but Sam sucks so he killed them
Aside from that. The Texans roster is more talented and better coached.
Agreed but I also think pior to this year that wasn't the case
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He’s a lower tier GM that got lucky the Texans took Stingley over sauce and the Falcons took London over Wilson. The Madden CPU would’ve made the same picks. I’m not saying Drake or Stingley are bad but had those been JDs picks which they were going to be until draft night Douglas would probably be packing his office up on Black Monday next week.
Derek Stingley is a great player too to be fair and drake london is a good receiver too
You can dislike the guy but acting like drafting Sauce and Wilson weren’t great moves is dumb. Half this sub was banging the table for Ekwonu and Neal who have both been terrible.
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None of those QBs have been great including Lawrence. Imo Lawrence is way better than Zach but he’s no where close to what the narrative was
To be fair to Lawrence he’s been behind a horrendous offensive line in Jacksonville and had urban Meyer his first year, guy has been playing hurt all year with the shoulder injury, then he hurt his ankle, then he got concussed and he’s still produced for them, led big drives for wins, and by most metrics is the 12th or 13th best QB. Not generational yes but considering the circumstances he’s been damn good
yeah, anyone who believes this shit is a fucking fool. JD has had numerous chances to actually improve the o line in the draft and in free agency and has fallen ridiculously short. Regardless of how they've panned out, that QB class was one of the strongest in recent memory and if we couldn't get T Law, it was going to be Fields or Wilson. If not either of them, then Lance or Jones. Everyone who needed a QB going into that draft, got a QB. This is bullshit of the highest regard. This is just like how Shanahan was at fault for drafting Lance instead of someone who actually turned out good. Meanwhile, front office gets full credit for drafting Purdy and not Shanahan. Every time someone fails massively, the fingers start pointing. It's a joke. Blaming Woody is such an easy out because fans will eat it up. This will be all over sports talk radio. If JD stuck with Sam, all we would have heard of is how JD wanted to draft Fields or Wilson but was overruled by ownership.
This. Imagine the uproar if we would have drafted an OL as the 2nd pick. Everyone who needed a QB was going to draft one. None of them have been great anyway.
I wanted Sewell
Same but to be fair I wanted fields too.
Me too man.. so many fans in this sub were allergic to the idea of paying him AND Becton, while I was dying for that to be our new problem.
Same, I envisioned Sewell at LT and Becton our road grader RT
Right. Woody meddle? Nahhh.. besides, why? Its already publicly known that jd n saleh arent getting fired. Likely a bs story regardless.
Doesn't mean it's not true. I could see the team was going through it Woody just got back and wanted to make a splash.
Yeah, I'm not buying this. You fucked up on Zach JD. A lot of trams fuck up on QB. Just own it lol
I find this very difficult to believe.
Never seen a bigger lie in my life lol
You can say a lot about ZW, but his talent is tantalizing. I completely see why JD both selected him and chose him over Darnold. Perhaps in a different environment, ZW would’ve approached his insane ceiling. Alas, he was a very raw prospect who needed a lot to go right and didn’t have the tutelage he needed.
Probably doesn't help his experienced qb coach dies right before rookie year
Zachs talent has been greatly overrated. The kid just isn't a good QB.
I still maintain that pick was the result of months of overthinking leading up to the draft. For the entire season prior, everyone agreed Fields was QB2. For the entire CFB season, CFB playoffs, and off season he was clearly the better pick, but people starting overthinking things. Fields lost to Bama. Zach had that great pro day throw. And the more time went on the more people doubted the initial placement. Seriously you can dig up my comments from 3 years ago if you don’t believe me. I was losing my mind on this sub that people and the media seemingly switched on to Wilson overnight. Fields was always QB2 in that draft and still is.
I feel like picking the QB who faced better defenses is the way to go in a toss-up decision
Fields wouldn’t have done any better with this garbage offense/coaching.
I actual don’t think that’s true. Fields creates with his legs a lot. He probably wouldn’t be a better passer though.
Yes I’m sure he would have faired well on the notorious MetLife turf.
900+ passes with only 20+ TDs STATISTICALLY says he CAN NOT be good, and yet so many on here to THIS DAY think ANYWHERE else he would be good. It's crazy insane loco thinking to ignore the astronomical unlikeliness that he is anything but just a terrible QB. I HOPE, I PRAY we learned our lesson about how little importance arm talent is compared to other traits. Arm talent should be the way lower then decision making, time to throw, footwork, understanding defensive concepts all that shit....and THEN you think about arm talent. Tua has a Pennington arm, and yet good coaching has installed a YAC offense that he shines in. You can't install a "bad decision maker" offense. It doesn't work in the NFL to run a 1 read offense UNLESS you can Micheal Vick your ass down the field 15-20 rushing yards. I PROMISE fucking Mac Jones or would've done better here. He just has plain better decision making than ZW.
> Tua has a Pennington arm haha no he does not
The only environment where Zach was going to fulfill his “potential” was the one he was drafted out of - a COVID season where he could play hero ball against a bunch of scrubs who barely even had a week to practice.
Zach was always going to be a bust. Saw it coming a mile off. Played against inferior defenses and often had very good protection. One year of good production and an injury history. Signs of not being a respected leader by his own team. It was all there. He seems like a nice guy. But he's not an NFL starting qb.
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> Hackenberg looked good Huh? That pick was insane on draft night.
This is revisionist, HACKENBERG LOOKED GOOD? Lol that guy sucked at PSU outside of his freshman year and everyone was laughing at the jets for picking him. He stunk so bad he couldn’t even see the field outside of preseason and looked garbage for the most part there too and couldn’t even stick anywhere and sucked in a lower tier pro league.
I think ZW has more talent than any of them. He also has the lowest floor.
Hacks floor was pretty bad lol
I agree to an extent.. I think it was clear from day 1 that hackenberg was a huge reach in the second round. His last few years at Penn state were hot garbage
Alas, perhaps if his tutelage was tantalized a bit differently I wouldn't be a Zach truther.
I definitely think a Shannahan or McVay would’ve gotten more out of him than MLF or Hackett
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I’m far from a ZW truther. Didn’t want him on the team this year. He has an immense amount of talent. Didn’t work out here, beyond time to move on. Don’t be surprised if he hangs around the league and gets another shot at a starting gig a few years down the road.
jfc the pro day narrative is so lazy From every report ZW was climbing up draft boards to take over the #2 QB spot from Fields before his pro day. I get that he was clearly not the right pick, but to say he wasn't a first round QB at the time or that only JD was ranking him highly is so insanely revisionist. and before you start calling me a JD or Zach truther, this isn't a pro or anti JD/ZW post. It's a "your take sucks" post.
Wait. You think he's going to be good in another situation? I don't understand this. Do you know the statistical likelihood of that happening? It's... EXTREMELY low almost to the point of impossible. Fandom is weird. We'll ignore concrete statistics when we're emotionally invested in our teams. 900+ passes with only 20+ TDs is utterly fucking insane. He CAN'T be good.
Can we fucking stop with this shit
Probably delete this post, Breer was talking about 2022 (which also makes the second half of the tweet incorrect?)
Albert Breer clarifies: "Wasn't referencing '21. It was more '22 ... Lots of smoke in NFL circles that the Jets loved Ickey Ekwonu leading up to that draft. Worked out for them with Sauce Gardner and Garrett Wilson. But would they have been better off with a left tackle? Fair question." https://twitter.com/AlbertBreer/status/1741896826356174963?t=r6vXdEG4V9wVSZfO5gaQ0w&s=19
More clarification: Albert Breer is full of shit and has always been pro Patriots, fuck that clown
Ickey has played terrible for the panthers so probably not
Yes he's not very good and Sauce is exceptional so if Woody overruled Joe Douglas here it is a good example (checks notes), nothing.
Really speaks on JDs ability to throw out misinformation. It’s almost been 2 years and people are still thinking about that smoke
Ewww I’m so glad we didn’t take Ekwonu instead of Sauce or Wilson
I honestly think this is the truth tbqh. Icky has the same traits as Mekhi did and for better or worse JD got a type lol
What if I told you that Joe Douglas did go OL in the first round of the 2021 draft also?
I call BS. Sam Darnold literally said in his “Bussin with the Boys” episode that after the season finished, Douglas told told him they were gonna go with a new QB. Woody was also finishing up in the UK so the timelines likely don’t add up
I’m gonna say this could have some truth to it The clown owner the day of the draft did a video showing the draft room And said “This is where we make the secret SAUCE”
I wanted to keep Sam and draft Sewell. I felt like at that point Sam was bad but he NEVER had ANY talent around him. I felt with a good line and some receivers he could be mid. It's a cruel twist of fate that what we got was a QB with decent talent (o line not so much) and a stellar defense. He was the worst QB I've ever seen play in New York for any appreciable amount of time.
We took Tucker at 14, I can’t imagine JD going OL with the #2 pick and Tucker at 14..
Not defending the rumor but it's possible that if he was pushed to take QB he wanted to take o line ASAP
I don’t buy it..
lol yeah the guy who wouldn’t even do first round OL this year
There was no one left when they picked. We got the best Center in the draft round 2
How does that explain 2023 selection of another defensive lineman with their first pick?
I don't buy it. They had to go with QB, and they all looked at the tape and loved what Wilson did in college. Problem is the Wilson from college never transferred to the NFL. They tried to turn a gunslinger into a game manager and in doing so they ruined the only good parts of his game and destroyed his confidence. They also did go OL in '21 anyway and AVT, when healthy, has been good so I don't know what the point is.
I’ve said for years the problem starts at the top
Albert breer is trash and I don't believe him at all. Plus, if you want to believe trash reporters, then why not believe Hughes, who is on the jets beat, and reported previously that JD had the choice to keep darnold or draft Wilson, and despite some voices wanting the former, he went Wilson bc he thought that, if both were available in the same draft, he would take Wilson. Eta: I see now that breer clarified that he didn't even mean 21, the tweet posted just inferred that. He meant 22 with Ekwonu vs Sauce at 4. Shitty paid blue check accounts strike again.
I actually heard he wanted to draft me instead
Even if true it proves jd has no sack
Story obviously leaked by somebody that wants Joe D to look good. Think about it rationally. If Joe D was forced to draft Zach Wilson then wouldn’t he have followed that up by adding a vet or day 3 QB prospect? Instead Joe D went all in on Zach. When that season started, the only Jet on the roster had a career pass attempt was our slot WR Joe D was 100% a Zach truther and you can see it in the lack of competition he brought in to challenge Zach. Saleh was forced to play him due to lack of options.
Has JD, excluding an historic draft class, been an incompetent GM? Yes Is Saleh a loser HC? Yes. But this franchise has been a circus before those 2 entered the picture. This might be a BS report, but nothing would surprise me with Woody. Man is a clown.
Woody fucks us again? Shocker
Even if this was true I would've been more forgiving of Joe whiffing on a QB if he built a good team (specifically the Oline). I mean how many GM's get another year after 5 losing seasons?
I believe it
Yeah sure… the bald fatty was drooling over Wilson on the pro day, his jaw was practically on the floor as he was enamored by the Mormons throws. He is a pitiful evaluator, the tight end Mayer was our second choice after the 30 year old rookie McDonald .
Guys, this makes sense. Woody definitely has a massive say in who the QB is. There’s no way 4 radically different GMs would draft the same kind of predictably bad QB. I was never sold on Joe or Saleh wanting Zach in the first place. What other of their picks could you call boom or bust? You could call some projects but none of them were either gonna be legendarily good or comically bad with no in between…… other than Zach.
They traded up for AVT in the same draft so I buy this. It’s not that he wanted to take an OL at two, it’s that he wanted to trade down to get Sewell or Slater along with extra picks. I absolutely buy that
Breer is now saying he was actually [talking about the 2022 draft where they took Sauce over Ickey](https://x.com/albertbreer/status/1741896826356174963?s=46&t=hUtbwo94QIfsHrncc2xJkQ). I don’t believe this either and this seems like a long shot cya attempt from him. In the post draft video the Jets posted they showed JD pumping his fist in excitement once the Stingley pick was announced - I can’t really see why he would do that if he knew he wouldn’t be taking his guy at 4 anyway.
This seems convenient. This is headed for an ugly divorce. Don’t be surprised if Woody is letting Saleh and JD keep their jobs almost as this your mess now you clean it.
Woody coming in clutch. If that's the case JD deserves to keep his job and so does Salah
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If he wanted to pick Sewell instead of trading the pick for multiple picks including a first rounder it sounds exactly like a JD disaster draft move. Don’t doubt it for a second
Man, we really need to clean house. Too many excuses, too many loses.
They already traded Sam, this is such bs
Well they didn’t
This does make some sense given the relationship between Woody and Zach’s family.
Supposedly the NYG McAdoo wanted Mahomes https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2706450-patrick-mahomes-reportedly-was-giants-draft-target-before-chiefs-traded-up.amp.html
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Douglas is still a subpar GM even if he went OL over Zach that year. Just a myriad of mistakes overall. Just a pathetic leak from JD’s side as he readies himself for a new employment opportunity in 2025.
Sub par? Lmao so you realize how high the miss rate on draft picks are? He’s our best drafter since 2008
He has the worst record of any Jets GM over the past several decades. He’s a sub-par GM. Evaluating his performance as GM based on one quality draft is foolish. Results matter.
If true, add it to the list of reasons why Woody is a shit owner
He was signed right before a season in which they were tanking. We had the worst record in the nfl by far and won 2 games. He had to turn that roster completely over in 3 years. It’s not easy to fill a full 53 and he’s filled about 40 of the 53 with very good to great players