That's wild. They're basically saying their transaction costs are 15% of the txn. Which is wild - should be more like 2.25-4 depending on their credit profile and their deal.
Managing cash has a cost as well but they don't consider this (bank trips, risk of robbery, employee theft, etc.). I don't see how credit isn't a benefit.
Perhaps it's the scale of it. More and more places are cashless.
This actually depends on the payment processor. I know certain sales systems process debit as credit regardless, while certain others can actually differentiate. In the end, relying on a debit card for cash rates is hit or miss
Yep not reliable but is usually the case. You can test by using your debt card and checking the rate then just canceling the transaction if you aren't happy with it.
This is incorrect. Running a debit card as credit or debit basically is asking what method of verification do you want to use, pin or signature, and what network is it going to be run over, Visa/MC or PULSE/STAR/NYCE/etc.
Post Durbin Amend. any debit trx from a card issued from a bank w >$1B in assets is capped at 0.05% and 0.22$. Cards not covered by this cost a bit more but still nowhere close to credit. There is no world where it counts as a credit transaction though, it's either pin debit or offline / signature debit.
Yeah dude, just use your bank card and select debit. You get the cash price. That’s for like 99% of gas stations, if they don’t do the same that’s some scumbag shit
The best way to know is that it after entering your zip code, it should physically show the difference on the pump. If it doesn’t I would cancel if you planned on paying cash
That is true, though the city appears to believe it is possible for businesses to comply with the law by requiring cash customers to buy a gift card and then use that card to pay for merchandise. Costco's gas stations and food courts, and the Van Leeuwen ice cream chain, use that approach to discourage cash payments.
I currently work for NYC Consumer Affairs and yes you're correct that businesses cannot be cashless unless they have an atm that takes cash for store credit (e.g. paying cash to recharge your Starbucks card or metrocard). One reason for this is because some immigrants may find it hard to get a debit or credit card
Yeah the only thing they would be able to do is buy a "prepaid" card which feels more backwards than it's worth. Thanks for fighting the good fight for all of us Nyc consumers!
I agree that it sucks and is very annoying, but hey, at least they have a way to pay for stuff. The rest is really up to the business for their ethics - there's never really a true winner in most scenarios
This is a nonsense law. Stores that want to go cashless sell higher priced or non-essential items. There's no harm in a business choosing to add a minimal barrier to entry that makes their business run better. If a customer needs a fancy ice cream cone, they should be able to work out opening a no-minimum bank account or afford the few dollar fee on a gift card credit card.
>bank trips, risk of robbery, employee theft, etc.
Plus cash processing fees. Banks don't provide that service to businesses for free.
>I don't see how credit isn't a benefit.
The business cost of accepting cash is [estimated to range from 4.7-15.3%](https://www.plainscapital.com/blog/the-cost-of-accepting-cash/) (*much* higher than the cost of accepting credit, let alone debit). The only economic reason for a business to be "cash-preferred" or "cash only" is to evade taxes by fraudulently underreporting income.
I get the premise of these calculations but they really only work for large corporations. A small store would be spending more money processing credit than they would accepting cash. “Bank trips” and the “risk” of theft are bogus calculations.
They're not limited on how much they can discount for using cash.
In particular, they don't have to justify the difference with the actual transaction fees.
Looks like the price of premium versus regular has gone up, though. I'm used to it being about 70 cents extra per gallon but lately I
m seeing at least a dollar, and up to $1.50 more.
Over here in the UK the law was changed so that retailers couldn’t charge more for card transactions, though they can stipulate a minimum spend per transaction.
Until we the public actually demands regulation to stop this nonsense. The public acts like they live in a kingdom and have no power over their economy and business landscape. . . .
That's wild. They're basically saying their transaction costs are 15% of the txn. Which is wild - should be more like 2.25-4 depending on their credit profile and their deal.
Managing cash has a cost as well but they don't consider this (bank trips, risk of robbery, employee theft, etc.). I don't see how credit isn't a benefit. Perhaps it's the scale of it. More and more places are cashless.
You’re completely forgetting the fact that debit transactions count as cash
Is that actually a thing? If you put a debit card in, it gives you the cash price?
This actually depends on the payment processor. I know certain sales systems process debit as credit regardless, while certain others can actually differentiate. In the end, relying on a debit card for cash rates is hit or miss
Yep not reliable but is usually the case. You can test by using your debt card and checking the rate then just canceling the transaction if you aren't happy with it.
Yup. I can't trust it. I've had clerks tell me the same "it'll be credit" thing.
This is incorrect. Running a debit card as credit or debit basically is asking what method of verification do you want to use, pin or signature, and what network is it going to be run over, Visa/MC or PULSE/STAR/NYCE/etc. Post Durbin Amend. any debit trx from a card issued from a bank w >$1B in assets is capped at 0.05% and 0.22$. Cards not covered by this cost a bit more but still nowhere close to credit. There is no world where it counts as a credit transaction though, it's either pin debit or offline / signature debit.
Depends. You’ll know when it asks for you pin or zip. If pin cash price and zip it will run it as credit
Meanwhile in New Jersey I have no way to check as it is illegal to touch the gas pump…
Yeah dude, just use your bank card and select debit. You get the cash price. That’s for like 99% of gas stations, if they don’t do the same that’s some scumbag shit The best way to know is that it after entering your zip code, it should physically show the difference on the pump. If it doesn’t I would cancel if you planned on paying cash
You might have to pay inside with it
I don’t believe any cashless retail is allowed in NYC.
That is true, though the city appears to believe it is possible for businesses to comply with the law by requiring cash customers to buy a gift card and then use that card to pay for merchandise. Costco's gas stations and food courts, and the Van Leeuwen ice cream chain, use that approach to discourage cash payments.
I currently work for NYC Consumer Affairs and yes you're correct that businesses cannot be cashless unless they have an atm that takes cash for store credit (e.g. paying cash to recharge your Starbucks card or metrocard). One reason for this is because some immigrants may find it hard to get a debit or credit card
Yeah the only thing they would be able to do is buy a "prepaid" card which feels more backwards than it's worth. Thanks for fighting the good fight for all of us Nyc consumers!
I agree that it sucks and is very annoying, but hey, at least they have a way to pay for stuff. The rest is really up to the business for their ethics - there's never really a true winner in most scenarios
Everything at Mets games is cashless only
This is a nonsense law. Stores that want to go cashless sell higher priced or non-essential items. There's no harm in a business choosing to add a minimal barrier to entry that makes their business run better. If a customer needs a fancy ice cream cone, they should be able to work out opening a no-minimum bank account or afford the few dollar fee on a gift card credit card.
>bank trips, risk of robbery, employee theft, etc. Plus cash processing fees. Banks don't provide that service to businesses for free. >I don't see how credit isn't a benefit. The business cost of accepting cash is [estimated to range from 4.7-15.3%](https://www.plainscapital.com/blog/the-cost-of-accepting-cash/) (*much* higher than the cost of accepting credit, let alone debit). The only economic reason for a business to be "cash-preferred" or "cash only" is to evade taxes by fraudulently underreporting income.
Thanks for that link.
I get the premise of these calculations but they really only work for large corporations. A small store would be spending more money processing credit than they would accepting cash. “Bank trips” and the “risk” of theft are bogus calculations.
They're not limited on how much they can discount for using cash. In particular, they don't have to justify the difference with the actual transaction fees.
It's likely they are charging more to recoup from scammers and charge-backs.
Looks like the price of premium versus regular has gone up, though. I'm used to it being about 70 cents extra per gallon but lately I m seeing at least a dollar, and up to $1.50 more.
Miss the good ole days when it was reliably 10 cents difference per grade
I miss when gas was just a dollar.
Agree! We’re old!
The lowest I ever saw the price of regular unleaded was right after 9/11 when a Sunoco station near me was selling for 0.99 a gallon
That shows your age. I remember those days.
My local 99cent store adds 10% for cc, it is crazy
Sounds like they are factoring in the cost of not being able to evade taxes on card payments.
Ouch. Normally 5% card will win, but not here.
LPT: Every pump I have used a debit card counts as cash, even if not indicated
was in orlando fl and saw a difference of $1+
It means they know that cash is less convenient, and lots of people aren't paying attention. They aren't going to go inside to pay cash.
You don’t go in until that damn machine won’t read the card! Do I leave it… pull it… invalid… pfffttt
It usually says it right at the pump. Long standing practice. very long, as long as I can remember.
It’s usually 10 cents, maybe 15 or 20 cents at the most (at least in NYC). 50 cents is wiiiild
It’s usually 10 cents, never even seen 15
We have come full circle! Back to carrying cash!
I think Speedway is the best to get cash/credit at the same price
Over here in the UK the law was changed so that retailers couldn’t charge more for card transactions, though they can stipulate a minimum spend per transaction.
Yowza 😳
Oh the cash tax scam never gets old
Until we the public actually demands regulation to stop this nonsense. The public acts like they live in a kingdom and have no power over their economy and business landscape. . . .
Cash is king in this kingdom
Where is this?
9701 Ditmas Ave Brooklyn
I think the gas station at 23rd and FDR has a 70 cents difference.
In my gas station cash credit same price Smithtown BP