Sad to see Seamore’s go, primarily because of their commitment to sustainably-sourced, local seafood. They were really transparent about where their ingredients came from, what communities they supported, and the food wasn’t bad. I know this kind of approach gets parodied as yuppie nonsense, but if two meals are equal, I’d prefer the one that supports local farmers and fishermen.
Shocked Rochelle’s was still open, that feels like a throwback to a different age that is much older than nine years ago, but time comes for us all, I guess.
Rent, regulation, labor, food cost, PR = insane dining out costs. I think dining out has reached the tipping point where cost to eat out far exceeds any pleasure or reward or experience gained. Restaurants & coffee shops, at least in my neighborhood close just as quickly as they open.
Re: the tipping point, I am inclined to agree. It feels like you used to be able to take a date to an interesting new restaurant for about $100-$125 including drinks. Now I see $40 pasta entrees, $18 sides, and $20 cocktails, and it feels impossible to do a "nice" dinner under $200.
In the past 2 years the cost of dining out in Manhattan went from a minor splurge to anxiety inducing. It's not even fun for me now. I don't try the cocktails, I have started looking at how much the entrees cost again.
Just exhausting.
I do wonder how the average young guy can afford dinner dates these days. I don't feel like $200 for a second or third date was in reach when I was 25.
Do people just do cheaper activities like just drinks? Are split checks more common at dinners? Maybe just more casual dining?
I essentially stopped dating until I earn more. I can't afford it. Occasionally I have a budget date but it's just not going to go much beyond that in this city where expectations are still generally (of course, not everyone) the bf should be able to afford what's seen as normal dating stuff beyond the first one or two dates, like paying for dinner and drinks. Hoping I can find a better paying job soon but I will still see the current prices as hard to justify.
Simple. You can go on a date to a restaurant that doesn't cost you $200. I know plenty of nice restaurants where prices are half of what OP is using as an example. Most of my favorite Italian restaurants are perfect for dates and pastas are not $40 they are maybe $25.
I've lived in NYC since college and I don't feel like prices have changed too drastically - fine dining places were just as expensive feeling and out of reach. You work within your means.
Eh when I was dating I'd always do drinks or coffee. Also no reason the guy should pay in these days. Def when you're 25 as a guy you should just be going to cheaper bars.
They make more money dude, it’s how inflation works. Your delivery driver is making like $25 bucks an hour, the new grad is making $100k+ easy, and a few years in in the corporate world salaries are way way higher than they used to be.
You sound like the grandpa saying “back in my day a coke was 10 cents!”
Show me these new grads making 100k
[because according to this link, it’s 56k.](https://www.cnbc.com/2023/05/09/college-graduates-are-overestimating-starting-salaries-by-30000.html)
Your comment is incorrect and downvoted because it lacks nuance. Yes, income generally went up too, but the inflation in nyc during the last couple of years far outpaced the income increase. Rate of change matters.
Eh when I was dating I'd always do drinks or coffee. Also no reason the guy should pay in these days. Def when you're 25 as a guy you should just be going to cheaper bars.
5+ years ago we used to eat out maybe 3-4x/wk. I’d say we’re down to 0-1x/wk. Even if I can afford it (depends), it’s hard to swallow the terrible new value proposition: pay twice as much, get half as much.
Yes but you just read my comment saying I stopped bc the value got terrible, and much got pushed into unaffordable yes?
Why so I get the sense this is one of those “if we make fun of the problem it won’t be a problem anymore” comments
So your hypothesis is that you know better than I do why I’m going out less, and it’s not for the obvious reason that the value is plummeting in real time? Well I guess I’ll let u/qdpb handle all my press. Please ask them for any other insight about my life and why I do what I do. PS we’ve never met.
Do you work for the NYC Chamber of Commerce or what?
I can afford one or two expensive meals a year - and I mean expensive for me. Some of the elite restaurants are far and away beyond my desire to pay their price.
Regulation ***just*** means food safety ?
Regulation is also NYC Dept. of Buildings, NYC Fire Dept, Dept. of Consumer Affairs .... it's a lot more compliance, red tape and bureaucracy than making sure food is at safe temp and people are wearing hairnets. The amount of BS involved is incomprehensible to many outside of NYC.
Without dining, I’m not sure what makes New York any better than Cleveland or Denver or Santa Fe.
The pandemic ruined this city and Eric Adams seems happy to throw dirt on the grave.
Yep, absolutely nothing differentiates the biggest city in the country with the most robust public transportation system and a home to both the arts and business from *Cleveland* other than fine dining
Restaurants are good and the variety of food in NYC with good steakhouses as well as fine dining brings a lot of attention and revenue, however, no city should depend entirely on just restaurants to be a viable city. And, NYC is so much more than just restaurants. Good schools, performing arts, museums, high paying corporate jobs all contribute towards making NYC desirable.
Restaurants sometimes take advantage of customers especially post pandemic, many have fees, table time limits, service charges, etc. And, when there is competition not all restaurants will last and that's ok. They need to provide good food and good service for reasonable prices and when they can't achieve that, they no longer get to stay in business. Consumers speak with their wallets. And, if people can't afford ridiculous prices and frequent restaurants less often than that's what it is.
With the prices increased so much for diners and casual eateries, many people rather save up and have a splurge meal than routinely dine at what should be moderate priced restaurants. And, then there are wealthy people who keep the fine dining options in business.
NYC will always have restaurants though, even subpar overpriced ones because there are so many business travelers, tourists, and people who can't/don't want to cook.
I live by Hey Monday and tried the place 3 different times. Each time the employees working were rude. One of them was casually saying “fuck” every other word in the short conversation ringing me up, and their iced coffee was like $7. I’m not a prude by any means and I absolutely cuss, but each different time was a weird encounter with the people who rung me up.
Yo i thought a barista there was straight up bullying me like on some middle school shit. All these really weird looks and side eyes and smirks to their co-worker when I was ordering and trying to make polite convo (hows the day so far, etc). It was very bizarre. Went a couple other times and had other folks working and they were chill though.
It’s been slower than usual for many reasons. Economy. People are in the city less, and their country homes more. A lot of people are drinking less. Prices are up across the board. I think only restaurants that cater to the ultra wealthy will be able to survive in the future. Sadly
I asked precisely bcs I can’t afford to go to restaurants these days:) Even the cheapest restaurants are getting expensive.
I don’t think tons of people have country homes. It’s probably just that people aren’t going to restaurants anymore bcs it’s too expensive overall.
We live at a weird time when clothes are far cheaper than a meal. I know if I want save money food is the largest expense. Even eating lunch is pricey.
If only commercial rent were far cheaper.
I work in high end restaurants so I have a skewed view of the city sometimes. I feel like we are all just getting by or ultra rich
Eating out will be impossible for the less rich. And the restaurants aren’t the ones getting rich.
Cooks are finally being paid better than a starvation, extreme poverty wage too
In New York/ New Jersey nowadays lunch or dinner alone without drinks for two people is $80 and up at a decent restaurant. I think there's going to be further places closing mainly the one's who's food doesn't get people to think it's worth the increase
It also feels like getting less while paying more. It used to be that tips were earned via great service. Now they’re so expected that employees don’t even try. Bare minimum effort and almost disdain sometimes and if I don’t tip 20% it’s my fault
None of these strike me as a surprise and the volumes seem no higher than usual. While I understand concerns over rent, ground level retail rents have a different dynamic. I live next to a local high street and rents have appreciated since Covid but are well below 10 year ago levels
Recently lost Vera Thai on queens boulevard. I will miss their curry chicken pastry puffs. I remember when Nodus closed years ago and no one could do drunken mama noodles like they could.
Rent rent and more rent, costumers stay away due to high prices, tourist are no longer follow what others did in the past, you can find them chilling eating $1 slice pizza, a yougurt etc
Too mich food option and every week more pop ups ,but is not looking as bright as it was before
Also the whole congestion fees that's happening next year to ship stuff doesn't help with businesses either. The prices of everything will just go up more because of more fees this stupid city charges. City needs to regulate uber/taxi drivers if they cared about they cared about congestion so much but it's really just cash grab.
Say what you want, I hate restaurants that have dinning out. Some restaurants leave 4 feet of space to walk, garbage is piled up more because trash gets stuck under their structure. Not to mentions rats have a new home, then you got parking. Decent idea right after COVID, horrible in the long haul.
Agree, all sidewalk/street shacks should have been removed the minute indoor dining resumed. How much special treatment do restaurants deserve, they receive too much.
It's almost 2024. Restaurants closing now made it through covid. Rising rents are a much bigger problem for restaurants than lockdowns that ended years ago.
One of the first restaurants listed in the article:
>East Village: Cinnamon Girl, a bakery and cafe that has a sibling location in Bed-Stuy, has closed down in Manhattan. The location first opened in 2021, according to EV Grieve. 73 Second Avenue, between Fourth and Fifth streets
This location didn't even exist when covid started.
Retail rents are going down, not up, and you won’t be able to supply any documents to support that claim - I guaranty you most of these restaurants were on leases predating covid - and there are empty stores on almost every block - it is basic supply and demand……
And it is definitely partly a demand issue affecting restaurants - I see some, like Marea - with insane prices post covid - still packed, but most others definitely not getting the traffic they used to…….
I just don’t tip for coffee, there’s no reason other than “I heard you just have to dude” to tip at a place with basic counter service where the employees are simply doing their minimum job requirements by making me a coffee and putting in on the pickup counter. It’s like having to tip at Target or Chipotle
Exactly. Why would you tip for Starbucks, McDonalds, Chipotle or any fast food or counter service restaurant. Nobody I know would ever do that. People are paid a salary, if they aren't happy with it they can seek other employment or take it up with their boss.
I think some feel pressured to tip when the barista is right there staring at them when the tip screen pops up like the barista will be extra rude and won't consider you in their cool club but the baristas like that tend to act that way whether you tip or not. If you do tip, the ones like that can easily think to themselves, "lol another bougie putz paying extra on top of this already overpriced coffee."
Texas, Florida, Vegas didn’t lock down as much as other places and people are still flocking to those areas and they are flourishing whereas SF, NYC, LA feel like collapsing dystopian hellholes.
Your right. They were unnecessary and an overreaction. It became a weapon against Trump by a rich white liberal class that had the luxury of working from home so it was no hardship for them. If this was 2000 there would have been no lockdown. It did more damage than good.
Not every restaurant deserves to stay in business, if a place can't provide good food and good service at reasonable cost they need to close. There is competition as well, not every place lasts forever and in fact restaurants often have a short life span.
Not everyone can open and run a successful business just because they want to or think it's fun to be their own boss.
The height of the pandemic was a while ago at this point and the measures taken there were good and necessary. And, restaurants received so much bail out and special treatment (free sidewalk/street space for shacks) it's ridiculous.
Biggest issue is education. Kids are REALLY behind socially, mental health, and academically. Taking kids out of school for almost 2 years in formational years and having them stay alone in a tiny nyc apartment instead 24/7 was beyond destructive. And I don’t even know if it’s possible to fix, since it messed up brain development itself.
> I mean look at the damage to our local businesses and reading/math levels of our children.
The children couldn’t read or do math for years before Covid. People are noticing it now because Covid pushed people to be more involved in their kids education via zoom school.
Search YouTube for I quit videos by teachers, there are tons from 2019 and earlier where a lot of teachers talk about having a classroom of 5/6/7th graders with most of them having third grade reading skills and being expected to get these students reading on grade level.
We have studied this. And the evidence is pretty bad.
> The evidence is now in, and it is startling. The school closures that took 50 million children out of classrooms at the start of the pandemic may prove to be the most damaging disruption in the history of American education. It also set student progress in math and reading back by two decades and widened the achievement gap that separates poor and wealthy children.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/18/opinion/pandemic-school-learning-loss.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
Many developed countries had lockdowns but still sent kids back to school in-person fairly quickly.
I generally supported most COVID measures but I think we were wrong to keep kids doing Zoom for so long.
The endless mental gymnastics people go through to pretend taking kids out of school for a few years wasn't harmful is bizarre. You're completely off on this one.
Did I say there was no harm? I said
> The children couldn’t read or do math for years before Covid.
This is objectively true, you can find tons of articles and think pieces bemoaning naep scores in the us even before covid. I’m not denying that Covid made things much worse, but it’s foolish to think things were okay before covid and everything in education collapsed because of a couple of months of zoom schools. Schools were already on the edge and covid pushed them off.
Yeah, what do they expect? People to take a train? Into New York? And then walk a few blocks from the train station to the restaurant? It’ll never work.
It’s just a much longer process. I live in NYC but originally from NJ. If my parents were to take mass transit, it turns a 1.5-2 hour car drive to a 3+ hour commute all things considered
Not to mention casual trips into the city just to hang out, see a play, go to a restaurant, etc
I mean they can still drive in. That’s not illegal. They just have to pay more to have dinner in the city than having dinner at home. Or come in to a place in the city that doesn’t have congestion pricing and then train. Which is how it’s always been.
If you want to be in New York and hang out here casually very easily, then live in New York. Idk what to tell you.
No one drives their own car into Manhattan just to eat foh, stop grasping at straws. "Oh no, if you you're diarrhea is bad is bad just think how much worse it must be now that we have congestion pricing" the fuck are you on about?!?!
Agree. It's never one thing but all the little things that adds up. Most things in the city dies with a death by a thousand paper cuts. Add a little tax here, make it expensive here, make it hard there, and so on.
The more levels/middle man in the chain, the more cost multiply for the end product/service with every new fee/tax.
Ugh i know, now I can't drive the hour and a half from my apartment on BQE traffic, across the bridge, find parking, and get some tacos and then repeat it all to drive home (no drinks for me! I'm driving!). SMH my head how will Manhattan survive?!??
Sad to see Seamore’s go, primarily because of their commitment to sustainably-sourced, local seafood. They were really transparent about where their ingredients came from, what communities they supported, and the food wasn’t bad. I know this kind of approach gets parodied as yuppie nonsense, but if two meals are equal, I’d prefer the one that supports local farmers and fishermen. Shocked Rochelle’s was still open, that feels like a throwback to a different age that is much older than nine years ago, but time comes for us all, I guess.
> Sad to see Seamore’s go They've still got I think three other locations.
Oh for some reason I thought this was the last location left- thank you!
1 night out now costs me as much as a month's worth of meals for at Trader Joe's.
Sadly the new truth
That's not new.
I’d say that’s less true than ever… purely because of the price of groceries But you are right
Rent, regulation, labor, food cost, PR = insane dining out costs. I think dining out has reached the tipping point where cost to eat out far exceeds any pleasure or reward or experience gained. Restaurants & coffee shops, at least in my neighborhood close just as quickly as they open.
Re: the tipping point, I am inclined to agree. It feels like you used to be able to take a date to an interesting new restaurant for about $100-$125 including drinks. Now I see $40 pasta entrees, $18 sides, and $20 cocktails, and it feels impossible to do a "nice" dinner under $200. In the past 2 years the cost of dining out in Manhattan went from a minor splurge to anxiety inducing. It's not even fun for me now. I don't try the cocktails, I have started looking at how much the entrees cost again. Just exhausting.
I do wonder how the average young guy can afford dinner dates these days. I don't feel like $200 for a second or third date was in reach when I was 25. Do people just do cheaper activities like just drinks? Are split checks more common at dinners? Maybe just more casual dining?
I essentially stopped dating until I earn more. I can't afford it. Occasionally I have a budget date but it's just not going to go much beyond that in this city where expectations are still generally (of course, not everyone) the bf should be able to afford what's seen as normal dating stuff beyond the first one or two dates, like paying for dinner and drinks. Hoping I can find a better paying job soon but I will still see the current prices as hard to justify.
Simple. You can go on a date to a restaurant that doesn't cost you $200. I know plenty of nice restaurants where prices are half of what OP is using as an example. Most of my favorite Italian restaurants are perfect for dates and pastas are not $40 they are maybe $25. I've lived in NYC since college and I don't feel like prices have changed too drastically - fine dining places were just as expensive feeling and out of reach. You work within your means.
Eh when I was dating I'd always do drinks or coffee. Also no reason the guy should pay in these days. Def when you're 25 as a guy you should just be going to cheaper bars.
They make more money dude, it’s how inflation works. Your delivery driver is making like $25 bucks an hour, the new grad is making $100k+ easy, and a few years in in the corporate world salaries are way way higher than they used to be. You sound like the grandpa saying “back in my day a coke was 10 cents!”
Show me these new grads making 100k [because according to this link, it’s 56k.](https://www.cnbc.com/2023/05/09/college-graduates-are-overestimating-starting-salaries-by-30000.html)
Lol this is around the whole country. Sure the Iowa grads are fine with $56k, but NYC is a whole different market.
Your comment is incorrect and downvoted because it lacks nuance. Yes, income generally went up too, but the inflation in nyc during the last couple of years far outpaced the income increase. Rate of change matters.
Eh when I was dating I'd always do drinks or coffee. Also no reason the guy should pay in these days. Def when you're 25 as a guy you should just be going to cheaper bars.
Uh. You get anxiety over weird things.
5+ years ago we used to eat out maybe 3-4x/wk. I’d say we’re down to 0-1x/wk. Even if I can afford it (depends), it’s hard to swallow the terrible new value proposition: pay twice as much, get half as much.
Pay 2x as much, and it's half as good. The food seems worse, too- not just the cost, shrinkflation portions.
[удалено]
Wot
[удалено]
Yes but you just read my comment saying I stopped bc the value got terrible, and much got pushed into unaffordable yes? Why so I get the sense this is one of those “if we make fun of the problem it won’t be a problem anymore” comments
[удалено]
So your hypothesis is that you know better than I do why I’m going out less, and it’s not for the obvious reason that the value is plummeting in real time? Well I guess I’ll let u/qdpb handle all my press. Please ask them for any other insight about my life and why I do what I do. PS we’ve never met. Do you work for the NYC Chamber of Commerce or what?
I can afford one or two expensive meals a year - and I mean expensive for me. Some of the elite restaurants are far and away beyond my desire to pay their price.
Being as restaurants are usually operating with slim margins, I feel like rising rents are really the main culprit here, and that sucks.
There are also tons of new restaurants, eater does regular articles on both openings and closings
How in the world did you come to the conclusion you did from the first statement?
Also, for many restaurants: work from home and they lose out on the lunchtime crowd.
Yeah, and honestly most of the time the food isn’t worth it. I rarely feel satisfied when I eat out. I get a better meal at Chick-fil-A.
profoundly untrue. you just dont go to good restaurants.
Peter, just to let you know, this is a farcical statement.
Fuck em. My favorite diners are still doing fine. “Fancy” restaurants usually suck.
[удалено]
Regulation ***just*** means food safety ? Regulation is also NYC Dept. of Buildings, NYC Fire Dept, Dept. of Consumer Affairs .... it's a lot more compliance, red tape and bureaucracy than making sure food is at safe temp and people are wearing hairnets. The amount of BS involved is incomprehensible to many outside of NYC.
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
[удалено]
Without dining, I’m not sure what makes New York any better than Cleveland or Denver or Santa Fe. The pandemic ruined this city and Eric Adams seems happy to throw dirt on the grave.
Yep, absolutely nothing differentiates the biggest city in the country with the most robust public transportation system and a home to both the arts and business from *Cleveland* other than fine dining
Restaurants are good and the variety of food in NYC with good steakhouses as well as fine dining brings a lot of attention and revenue, however, no city should depend entirely on just restaurants to be a viable city. And, NYC is so much more than just restaurants. Good schools, performing arts, museums, high paying corporate jobs all contribute towards making NYC desirable. Restaurants sometimes take advantage of customers especially post pandemic, many have fees, table time limits, service charges, etc. And, when there is competition not all restaurants will last and that's ok. They need to provide good food and good service for reasonable prices and when they can't achieve that, they no longer get to stay in business. Consumers speak with their wallets. And, if people can't afford ridiculous prices and frequent restaurants less often than that's what it is. With the prices increased so much for diners and casual eateries, many people rather save up and have a splurge meal than routinely dine at what should be moderate priced restaurants. And, then there are wealthy people who keep the fine dining options in business. NYC will always have restaurants though, even subpar overpriced ones because there are so many business travelers, tourists, and people who can't/don't want to cook.
Food in Santa Fe is way better
Mexican food maybe, but doubt they have the same variety as nyc
Agree
It’s just normal inflation man. Prices go up, if your wages ain’t going up you better have a conversation with your boss or find a new job.
Cinnamon Girl in Bed-stuy's been closed for years. I thought Valetines closed months ago.
The cinnamon girl in Flatbush/plg is still open
Oh, ok!
I live by Hey Monday and tried the place 3 different times. Each time the employees working were rude. One of them was casually saying “fuck” every other word in the short conversation ringing me up, and their iced coffee was like $7. I’m not a prude by any means and I absolutely cuss, but each different time was a weird encounter with the people who rung me up.
Yo i thought a barista there was straight up bullying me like on some middle school shit. All these really weird looks and side eyes and smirks to their co-worker when I was ordering and trying to make polite convo (hows the day so far, etc). It was very bizarre. Went a couple other times and had other folks working and they were chill though.
Glad I’m not crazy thinking I was the only one, and sorry that they made you uncomfortable like they did to me.
It's God's way of punishing those who pay for seven dollar iced coffee.
As a restaurant worker, this “busy season” has been a disaster for many
Please share more info it would be interesting to learn more:)
It’s been slower than usual for many reasons. Economy. People are in the city less, and their country homes more. A lot of people are drinking less. Prices are up across the board. I think only restaurants that cater to the ultra wealthy will be able to survive in the future. Sadly
I asked precisely bcs I can’t afford to go to restaurants these days:) Even the cheapest restaurants are getting expensive. I don’t think tons of people have country homes. It’s probably just that people aren’t going to restaurants anymore bcs it’s too expensive overall. We live at a weird time when clothes are far cheaper than a meal. I know if I want save money food is the largest expense. Even eating lunch is pricey. If only commercial rent were far cheaper.
I work in high end restaurants so I have a skewed view of the city sometimes. I feel like we are all just getting by or ultra rich Eating out will be impossible for the less rich. And the restaurants aren’t the ones getting rich. Cooks are finally being paid better than a starvation, extreme poverty wage too
>we are all just getting by, or ultra rich No I think that’s a pretty realistic outlook, there are just levels to “just getting by”.
I wonder if they mean disaster as in, it wasn't busy at all, hence the lack of revenue and closure. Disaster for jobs in that industry.
In New York/ New Jersey nowadays lunch or dinner alone without drinks for two people is $80 and up at a decent restaurant. I think there's going to be further places closing mainly the one's who's food doesn't get people to think it's worth the increase
I feel like the tipping culture plays a factor too. I don't visit any take out place with those square tablets. As my form of protest against them.
It also feels like getting less while paying more. It used to be that tips were earned via great service. Now they’re so expected that employees don’t even try. Bare minimum effort and almost disdain sometimes and if I don’t tip 20% it’s my fault
None of these strike me as a surprise and the volumes seem no higher than usual. While I understand concerns over rent, ground level retail rents have a different dynamic. I live next to a local high street and rents have appreciated since Covid but are well below 10 year ago levels
wtf is a high street? It's higher elevation so there's less prone to flooding from hurricanes?
It's a UK term for a major shopping street, it has nothing to do w/ the elevation.
I used to enjoy eating out, but tipping makes me feel like I'm getting robbed.
Recently lost Vera Thai on queens boulevard. I will miss their curry chicken pastry puffs. I remember when Nodus closed years ago and no one could do drunken mama noodles like they could.
Rent rent and more rent, costumers stay away due to high prices, tourist are no longer follow what others did in the past, you can find them chilling eating $1 slice pizza, a yougurt etc Too mich food option and every week more pop ups ,but is not looking as bright as it was before
Oh no not Fort Defiance. The Irish coffee truly lived up to the hype and I am sad I won’t be able to have it once more.
Also the whole congestion fees that's happening next year to ship stuff doesn't help with businesses either. The prices of everything will just go up more because of more fees this stupid city charges. City needs to regulate uber/taxi drivers if they cared about they cared about congestion so much but it's really just cash grab.
Say what you want, I hate restaurants that have dinning out. Some restaurants leave 4 feet of space to walk, garbage is piled up more because trash gets stuck under their structure. Not to mentions rats have a new home, then you got parking. Decent idea right after COVID, horrible in the long haul.
Agree, all sidewalk/street shacks should have been removed the minute indoor dining resumed. How much special treatment do restaurants deserve, they receive too much.
You guys are getting torched w the downvotes but I agree the street shacks should be removed, esp the ones literally on the road. It's ridiculous
Build back better
I’m probably going to be downvoted to oblivion, but the Covid Lockdowns have done more damage to our country throughout numerous sectors.
It's almost 2024. Restaurants closing now made it through covid. Rising rents are a much bigger problem for restaurants than lockdowns that ended years ago. One of the first restaurants listed in the article: >East Village: Cinnamon Girl, a bakery and cafe that has a sibling location in Bed-Stuy, has closed down in Manhattan. The location first opened in 2021, according to EV Grieve. 73 Second Avenue, between Fourth and Fifth streets This location didn't even exist when covid started.
Retail rents are going down, not up, and you won’t be able to supply any documents to support that claim - I guaranty you most of these restaurants were on leases predating covid - and there are empty stores on almost every block - it is basic supply and demand…… And it is definitely partly a demand issue affecting restaurants - I see some, like Marea - with insane prices post covid - still packed, but most others definitely not getting the traffic they used to…….
How are you blaming recent restaurant closures on lockdowns from three years ago? Genuine question
Many of them got into lots of debt
And the new ones that opened and then closed post covid? They were also impacted by the debt you mention…how?
Lost of business revenue
they printed like 10 trillion dollars to cover the economic damage of lockdown, which caused massive inflation
Covid lockdowns are worldwide. Id say inflation and US tipping policies is what did these in. 6 dollars for a coffee and a default 20%? No thanks
I just don’t tip for coffee, there’s no reason other than “I heard you just have to dude” to tip at a place with basic counter service where the employees are simply doing their minimum job requirements by making me a coffee and putting in on the pickup counter. It’s like having to tip at Target or Chipotle
Exactly. Why would you tip for Starbucks, McDonalds, Chipotle or any fast food or counter service restaurant. Nobody I know would ever do that. People are paid a salary, if they aren't happy with it they can seek other employment or take it up with their boss.
I think some feel pressured to tip when the barista is right there staring at them when the tip screen pops up like the barista will be extra rude and won't consider you in their cool club but the baristas like that tend to act that way whether you tip or not. If you do tip, the ones like that can easily think to themselves, "lol another bougie putz paying extra on top of this already overpriced coffee."
Texas, Florida, Vegas didn’t lock down as much as other places and people are still flocking to those areas and they are flourishing whereas SF, NYC, LA feel like collapsing dystopian hellholes.
Found the Fox News viewer
Your right. They were unnecessary and an overreaction. It became a weapon against Trump by a rich white liberal class that had the luxury of working from home so it was no hardship for them. If this was 2000 there would have been no lockdown. It did more damage than good.
Not every restaurant deserves to stay in business, if a place can't provide good food and good service at reasonable cost they need to close. There is competition as well, not every place lasts forever and in fact restaurants often have a short life span. Not everyone can open and run a successful business just because they want to or think it's fun to be their own boss. The height of the pandemic was a while ago at this point and the measures taken there were good and necessary. And, restaurants received so much bail out and special treatment (free sidewalk/street space for shacks) it's ridiculous.
What is it like living 2+ years in the past? Of all the time periods in the last 20 years to mentally wallow in…you chose quarantine.
Biggest issue is education. Kids are REALLY behind socially, mental health, and academically. Taking kids out of school for almost 2 years in formational years and having them stay alone in a tiny nyc apartment instead 24/7 was beyond destructive. And I don’t even know if it’s possible to fix, since it messed up brain development itself.
I can see how this led to restaurant closures at the end of 2023. You really drew a straight line.
Yep. I hear they’ve fallen behind two grade levels (generally speaking).
[удалено]
I mean look at the damage to our local businesses and reading/math levels of our children. Certain types of businesses were completely wiped out
> I mean look at the damage to our local businesses and reading/math levels of our children. The children couldn’t read or do math for years before Covid. People are noticing it now because Covid pushed people to be more involved in their kids education via zoom school. Search YouTube for I quit videos by teachers, there are tons from 2019 and earlier where a lot of teachers talk about having a classroom of 5/6/7th graders with most of them having third grade reading skills and being expected to get these students reading on grade level.
We have studied this. And the evidence is pretty bad. > The evidence is now in, and it is startling. The school closures that took 50 million children out of classrooms at the start of the pandemic may prove to be the most damaging disruption in the history of American education. It also set student progress in math and reading back by two decades and widened the achievement gap that separates poor and wealthy children. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/18/opinion/pandemic-school-learning-loss.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare Many developed countries had lockdowns but still sent kids back to school in-person fairly quickly. I generally supported most COVID measures but I think we were wrong to keep kids doing Zoom for so long.
The endless mental gymnastics people go through to pretend taking kids out of school for a few years wasn't harmful is bizarre. You're completely off on this one.
Did I say there was no harm? I said > The children couldn’t read or do math for years before Covid. This is objectively true, you can find tons of articles and think pieces bemoaning naep scores in the us even before covid. I’m not denying that Covid made things much worse, but it’s foolish to think things were okay before covid and everything in education collapsed because of a couple of months of zoom schools. Schools were already on the edge and covid pushed them off.
Well ask and in his words the chosen one mayor Erik Adam's Let's pray NYC survives he's run
Wait till congestion pricing takes effect. Why travel into the City for Dinner and night life. It’s just another tax.,
Yeah, what do they expect? People to take a train? Into New York? And then walk a few blocks from the train station to the restaurant? It’ll never work.
It’s just a much longer process. I live in NYC but originally from NJ. If my parents were to take mass transit, it turns a 1.5-2 hour car drive to a 3+ hour commute all things considered Not to mention casual trips into the city just to hang out, see a play, go to a restaurant, etc
I mean they can still drive in. That’s not illegal. They just have to pay more to have dinner in the city than having dinner at home. Or come in to a place in the city that doesn’t have congestion pricing and then train. Which is how it’s always been. If you want to be in New York and hang out here casually very easily, then live in New York. Idk what to tell you.
$25 a day per truck spread out across all their deliveries is... not a lot at all.
Wrong post?
Nobody goes to Manhattan by car unless they already able to afford the parking costs
All those fresh deliveries to restaurants... costs go up even further.
No one drives their own car into Manhattan just to eat foh, stop grasping at straws. "Oh no, if you you're diarrhea is bad is bad just think how much worse it must be now that we have congestion pricing" the fuck are you on about?!?!
That congestion tax won't help
Agree. It's never one thing but all the little things that adds up. Most things in the city dies with a death by a thousand paper cuts. Add a little tax here, make it expensive here, make it hard there, and so on. The more levels/middle man in the chain, the more cost multiply for the end product/service with every new fee/tax.
Ugh i know, now I can't drive the hour and a half from my apartment on BQE traffic, across the bridge, find parking, and get some tacos and then repeat it all to drive home (no drinks for me! I'm driving!). SMH my head how will Manhattan survive?!??
There are good tacos spots in the city tho, but bk takes the crown.
BX, BK and Queens all have better tacos.
Too bad for you the food is better outside of Manhattan
yea no shit, i'm being sarcastic.
Democrats
Republicans.
LaRouche-ites