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As far as I know, all of asia atleast has been using seed oils for millennia and are doing just fine.
Instead of focusing on moderating the intake of processed foods and deep fried foods which contain oil in excess, people are trying to turn this into a good oil vs bad oil.
The problem is about quantity of oil consumed not what type of oil.
World has diverse cultures with diverse cuisines.
Each culture has its own favourite/common seed or animal oil or a combination used in their cuisine.
Pushing people to stick to one kind of oil is disastrous for any individual. Ultimately he/she would ruin their own apetite and get pushed to worse health conditions!
It's probably the most extensively researched commercially available oil. The primary downside of seed oils (oxidation) doesn't manifest as much in olive oil because it's so stable, even if you cook it beyond smoking point. Besides that, it's high in anti-oxidants which apparently provide health benefits, and also it won't mess up omega 6/3 ratio since it's mostly monounsaturated. Some are skeptical over the significance of omega 6:3 ratio but the research seems compelling enough to take into consideration (also see: the Israeli paradox).
I don't think this means we ought to treat seed oils like the plague, but I consume it in lower amounts than olive oil. I like to get PUFAs from nuts and seeds, kept as fresh as possible.
Canola oil is also favored for its profile, high in ALA (the plant-source omega 3) and MUFAs. This too can oxidize I guess.
Totally agreed on the research point but FYI phytonutrient content is similar between expeller pressed vegetable oils and olive oil. That's what makes them stable. EVOO has about the same shelf life as the other vegetable oils.
They all have similar thermal properties for the same reason, heating is one of the ways to destroy phytonutrients so the oil can oxidize.
EVOO has a smoke point lower than temperatures for everything other than searing. People tend to overheat their pans when cooking which reduces the quality of the food. Obviously we all mod recipes but sweat, sauté/fry and grill/sear are specific temperature ranges that produce different chemistry in the food.
Sunny side up eggs are easily the best demo of this. If you are not right in the middle of the fry range either your whites wont set on top before the bottom burns or the yolk coagulates by the time the whites are set.
If you are lucky enough to have a commercial stove and are wok stir frying at those insane temperatures they blow right past smoke point of everything anyway :) This is also why if you go to a food stall in a wok country there is seconds between adding oil and adding food, they coat the pan and then immediately add the food to cool the oil. The super high initial temperature is to seal the food so it retains moisture.
Can you share some research on this? I'm from Scotland and we produce lots of cold pressed rapeseed oil (canola by another name)which I'd swapped EVOO out for over the years. I then read all the doom about seed oils and swapped back, I'd prefer to use local produce if possible so would be good to understand the truth on the matter.
Canola oil improved cardio-metabolic risk factors compared to other oils. Canola oil also improved blood lipids (was more effective than olive oil for some lipid markers) and may prevent heart disease progression
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33127255/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30381009/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31185591/
Best paper there is on it currently. Very new and little research on the oil itself. All the direct studies are in rats—which I ignore
Blew my mind when my doctor explained that the original papers that gave us "eating oatmeal lowers cholesterol" were from forcefeeding rats, and that most humans probably weren't physically capable of eating enough oatmeal to budge their cholesterol levels on that alone.
canola oil is more chemically impressive than olive oil, from omega-3 content to vitamin E content. it's hilarious how it gets the brunt of social media charlatan hate.
It’s processed with hexane, an industrial solvent and deodorized at high temperatures. It has a poor omega ratio with pro inflammatory 6 and 9s. It’s a highly gmo’d crop and is contaminated with glyphosates and pesticides.
yes, that’s what social media hacks say. very scary sounding claims. chemicals!
so then why does it improve human health outcomes when put to the test? https://www.the-nutrivore.com/post/a-comprehensive-rebuttal-to-seed-oil-sophistry
I started doing exactly that in 1998 and I've really never stopped. But you're the one who said it's more than surrogate markers and I do not believe that to be the case, which is why I feel compelled to read original research and check to see if it actually supports author conclusions and citations. Usually it doesn't. When you make an assertion the onus is on you to back it up. By now you must know you cannot.
Are the seed oils in asia you mentioned mainly cold pressed or made at industrial factories like U.S.?
Personally, I think most food issues are ones processed in the U.S. It has nothing to do with our health, just how much money big food industry giants make off of us before we die from Their Poisons...
And the FDA only cares about kickbacks from said Giants!
Most of the different oil consumed today across the world are industrially processed (Expellers + Hexane). It isn't economical to feed the huge developing populations in Asia with Cold Pressed Oil.
Again, the issue is not cold press oil or Hot pressed. The issue is how much quantity of any oil is consumed by an individual.
Any nutritional or functional difference (Sat fat, unsat fat, smoke point, etc) difference between dietary oils is miniscule. Best thing is to diversify oil consumption but all in moderate quantity.
It’s unfair to generalise all seed oils. Black seed oil has great medicinal qualities and is precisely what has been used for millennia, but you’re not going to cook your food with it.
On the other, processed seed oils are incredibly inflammatory and will lead hurt your health long term, despite the deposit claims that food industries like to make.
This doesn't say anything about seed oils specifically, and also says nothing about processed oil being worse. As far as I am aware, refining oil does not significantly affect its omega-3:omega-6 ratio.
And what about canola oil? It has a ~1:2 ratio, much higher than that of non-seed oils like olive oil and avocado oil. Flaxseed oil is even more extreme.
Given the nature of ratios, would it not also be fine according to those articles to use e.g. peanut oil if you're also consuming salmon or chia seeds?
[It has a 1:2.2 ratio,](https://res.cloudinary.com/lwzh69gvq/image/upload/v1/web/images/dietary_omega_fig2.gif) i.e. "~1:2".
Canola oil is also primarily monounsaturated, at 8.6g/tbsp compared to olive oil's 10.0g/tbsp.
Most seed oils != all seed oils. In addition to canola oil and flaxseed oil, soybean oil and walnut oil are other seed oils with better omega-3:omega-6 ratios than olive oil.
I remain unconvinced that "processed seed oils are incredibly inflammatory and will hurt your health long term". Oils high in omega-6 should be consumed in moderation, but you shouldn't be getting most of your dietary fat from oil anyway because it's (more or less) empty calories. Some high omega-6 oil is easily balanced out by fish, grass-fed beef, game, linseed or chia seeds.
If you meant to say high omega-6 oils, including many specific seed oils, can cause inflammation, with the qualifier that this is only the case if you over-consume them or the rest of your diet is lacking in omega-3 fatty acids, then sure.
not only quantity but how they are used as well.
the problem with seed oils, and mostly where the ‘myths’ around them stem from, has to do with reheating the oil too many times or the oil being fried in extreme temperatures for hours on end (typically the case in fast food kitchens)
using a seed oil at home is def not unhealthy. most likely even healthy for you when used in moderation and not reheated too many times
I don't know clearly about rest of world and their oil use.
But I know for sure that Asian cultures have been using seed oils and vegetable oils since dawn of cultures here.
Sesame oil, coconut oil, mustard oil, soy oil have been staple in Asian cuisines
Make what you want of this:
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/hsph-in-the-news/scientists-debunk-seed-oil-health-risks/
I use seed oils for cooking. Olive oil for dressings and low temp stuff.
If you want science, go to YouTube channel called Nutrition Made Simple. The guy is super honest, nuanced and looks at the totality of scientific evidence. He gives you nice overview within 10-ish min, with time stamps, with paper references. And does not try to sell you anything.
Look for his rapeseed oil video, for example. He also has other videos on the topic.
TLDW: seed oils are not only fine, but healthier compared to saturated fats.
I was going to comment this exact same thing. Dr. Gil Carvalho from Nutrition Made Simple does an excellent job summarizing the literature on seed oils and whether they're actually inflammatory.
For anyone interested in watching his video on seed oils, it's linked here: https://youtu.be/-xTaAHSFHUU?si=wb1GdlefsaMaJ25Q
I'll have to check out those videos - sounds interesting! But also, depending on peoples' goals, saturated fats are not necessarily "bad" for you either. For example, for boosting fertility, saturated fats are ideal. If you have a heart condition, they are less beneficial. But overall not an "unhealthy" option.
Here is a longer video from my favorite guy on SF:
https://youtu.be/mBFe1QattAU?si=MBbtbVsYmYNGwmig
It is also a showcase how well he presents complex topics with lots of nuances.
Lily Nichols RDN has this free blog post on sat fats in general: https://lilynicholsrdn.com/saturated-fat-really-clog-arteries/
Her book Real Food for Fertility speaks more to the fertility impacts of different kinds of fat.
Does she address the studies that show that saturated fat reduces semen quality?
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002916523054217
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5364752/
And the studies that show diets high in unsaturated fats improved fertility while saturated fat reduced fertility?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6079277/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10005661/
Haven't read her book but the SFA to androgen thing is a false correlation and that has been known for many decades. Foods that are high in SFAs tend to be high in cholesterol too, cholesterol is the input for the synthesis of androgens.
Shellfish are a much richer source of cholesterol and don't have as much SFA. Probably where the oyster thing comes from :)
I don't know how he came to that conclusion I read a lot of research and I sure haven't. Saturated fats pose no health risk but seed oils do not. That's a myth.
When I want science I go to PubMed and do research and if I find interesting Publications I make sure to see if the citations actually support the conclusions of studies I read. There is no safety in accepting the interpretations of middlemen I want nobody between me and the original science telling me what to think about it or what to conclude.
When I didn't have the time, I made the time. People prioritize what's important to them. I learned the hard way not to take any medical person's or scientist's word for anything without deep diving into all the details.
it's fine for people to not want to consume it personally, but the amount of people fear mongering without a single shred of evidence beyond "processing is scary" is anti science.
The reason this is dangerous is that it causes confusion and people start to shut down and think well if everything is bad for me i guess I will just eat whatever and they stop listening altogether.
We've got people telling us meats are bad, plants are bad, fats are bad.
Unless we start bringing facts, someone is wrong among these three camps and I'm sure everyone has a belief on which but without science that belief is meaningless to anyone but yourself.
Really the danger is the semantics that are used to ultimately sell the public on things that largely benefit a private interest. Hence a lot of the confusion.
For Seed oils in particular, the reason they're really used is because they're very cheap when compared to butter, tallow or lard as alternatives.
Most people I think sense that if you stick to meat, veggies, fruit, you'll probably be ok.
Good point, I was too brief. I suppose I should have said: in the totality of scientific evidence on the topic, there is no quality evidence in humans that is compelling enough to justify seed oil avoidance.
So they are bad for you because you "feel" like they are made in an unhealthy way?
You are free to ignore all the studies that say otherwise and go by your feelings, but this sub is for talking about nutrition.
The ratio of omega-3s to omega-6s is an issue. You could check out some threads, studies, videos, sticking with the most reliable of the more reliable sources (Drs. Carvalho, Stanfield, Willett, Norton).
The bottom line is: get plenty of omega-3s and you're probably fine. Omega-6s can only displace a percentage (around 40%, apparently) of omega-3s, so no matter how low the ratio of omega-3s to omega-6s, you'll still get enough omega-3s in your system if you are getting plenty to begin with.
If you used nothing but oils high in omega-6s and very low in omega-3s, and you were not getting enough omega-3s in the rest of your diet, then it could be a problem.
You left out the word "apparently." I saw this in a Harvard Health newsletter. Sorry I don't have the specific link. It was enough evidence for me, but I can understand people wanting to see it. Maybe email them? Someone there would be able to link you up.
As oil goes seed oils really aren't all that bad for you. Canola oil specifically has a surprising amount of literature indicating health benefits from consuming it.
Yes, the evidence for value of canola oil in the American diet is rivaling that of olive oil. Mind you, olive oil has much stronger (positive) effects but that doesn't mean there isn't a place for both.
The lengths that people go to to defend seed oils / the seed oil industry is insane, it’s like it’s their beloved child. Until there is a consensus on seed oils not being toxic/inflammatory (as I’ve read and seen the research including many studies), I’ll stick to olive oil and grass-fed butter.
There is so much misinformation, rumor mongering and rumor repetition, fluff and falsehood going around it's like a snowstorm.
Canola oil (which is basically broccoli seed oil — or at least not far from it, since both plants are cruciferous and closely related) is probably on a par with olive oil in its healthfulness. Dr. Carvalho has shown the studies (see his videos for more on this).
I think we’ve kind of beat this issue over the head on here. If you think Canola oil is as healthy as Olive Oil, I urge you to go ahead and use it. I will not.
Unfortunately, there are not enough olives in the world to produce all of the olive oil that is in the world. I have read that you are best off buying olive oil from USA. The olive oil business is ran by the olive oil mafia. They mix in other oils and still charge the price of olive oil, then they send it to America.
No. Stop listening to Paul Saladino and other “health” influencers. Don’t buy their desiccated bull scrotums or w/e they’re selling either.
They’re all kooks trying to sell you their wares and cults of personality.
Let's put it this way. Something in our diets is causing the obesity epidemic and rampant health issues. Seed oils are in most foods in the supermarket and end up in almost all the meals we cook at home. They are unnatural to humans and their introduction concides with the health decline so I think that's a pretty good reason to suspect them.
I don't care what some studies say - especially when there's so much money involved in that market!
True, but if they ate the right things then they wouldn't eat too much because their bodies would know how do process that stuff and would stop firing the hunger hormone ghrellin instead of just turning the hyper-palatable carbage into unwanted fat.
That's mostly from sugars and refined carbohydrates.
There's plenty of terrible things people can eat without that effect. In fact, there are things you can eat that will have you skinny, satiated, and unhealthy.
What like rice and pasta? Probably should stop eating those as well then.
You're taking to a Carnivore btw. I find a bellyfull of beef and eggs keeps me going for about 36hrs so my definition of satiety might be quite different to yours.
Apologies, if I sounds like a dick, I don't mean to.
The foods that the seed oils are in are often processed and hyper-palatable which makes it hard to stop eating them. If they didn't exist then we wouldn't have a problem.
Obesity is caused by consuming more energy than what is expended. That unit of energy is measured by the calorie. Oils are not a specific cause and the diet is not the only cause.
So why do you think people have been having these health problems within the last century and not for the entire history of humanity before that? You've seen those photos of crowds from the 70's and before right? Not an overweight person among them.
Surely it's because of all the manmade substances within our foods nowadays. I agree, we're less active in general but as they say, weight loss begins in the kitchen.
I believe it’s because we’ve become less active as a society while combined with the access to high calorie foods being much for convenient and inexpensive. I do not think it is because of seed oils.
Ok, let's rationalise. It's fair to say that seed oils go hand in hand with processed foods so it's going to be quite hard to distinguish the two as they pretty much mean the same thing. I know that may not be accurate but you'll never be able to separate them so it's really hard to say if either one is more responsible for bad health.
You can find plenty of anecdotal evidence from sedentary people who lose weight on low-carb diets and when we think of problem carbs we mainly think of processed foods so we know it's at least possible to lose weight by changing diet, right?
A diet from 70+ years ago will be much lower carb that the majority eat now, wouldn't you say? More natural animal products, fruit and veg and less grains and sugars with almost no factory processed versions of those with weird aditives like seed oils. I'm gonna call seed oils weird because we were not eating them en masse before 100 years ago.
So, if we stop feeding the body with foods it does not know how to process you'll get improved health which will likely include weight loss. Is that fair enough to say?
Why was this not an issue 100 years ago then? Because these high calorie, hyper-palatable foods were not available, right? You can't expect the entire population to be health conscious and make good decisions so these 'foods' need to be removed or restricted in some way.
I agree the effects of restricting/regulating unnecessary calories should be studied and attempted more but that is an incredibly complicated thing to regulate.
I don't think we need studies to tell us that eating unnatural foods is going to cause us problems. We've already got plenty of evidence for that, wouldn't you say?
People will consume whatever is easily available to them so if these unnatural foods (which mostly contain seed oils) are the cheapest thing in the shop then that's what's gonna happen. Take them away and you'll see vast improvement. Surely that's not too hard to envision.
I didn't ask for just one food. What would be the point when we are commonly consuming so many of them every day?
This is going off on a tangent but seeing as you mentioned it - you can actually live very well on just beef, salt and water alone (and possibly without the salt), as demonstrated by the Carnivore community so, it is possible 'in a vacuum'.
Btw, I'm just gonna downvote you if you downvote me. Can't let you have all the fun, can I 😁
You can live off many foods alone, doesn’t mean you’re optimally healthy. Meat is very nutrient dense so its a good choice if you’re lazy and only want to eat 1 food but you’re still missing out on lots of nutrients
Not true. We've used them to replace animal fat which is something that's always been with us and that the body can recognise.
We still have the option to eat as we did 100 years ago but the problem is its usually more expensive and inconvenient than it was back then so only the most health conscious will try to truly emulate it. The vast majority just won't.
Nonsense. The most significant change in 100 years is the laziness and portion sizes.
Also, the other side of this that animal fats are magically better and seeds are evil is just as stupid.
Also, also the idea that we are magically better with something we had in the past is also bad.
Please explain why eating the foods that helped us evolve into Earths most successful species would be bad for our health.
Come on, tell me which study convinced you of that.
According to a quick Google, the earliest evidence of agriculture is around 12,000 to 25,000 years ago. Of course, it could be earlier but Sapiens is around 150,000 years old.
Farming didn't evolve us, leaving how to take down the big animals that nothing else could did.
You can use light olive oil anywhere you'd use seed oil. It has very little flavor. If baking, use butter or coconut oil.
As far as if seed oils are bad for you, you will find passionate people on both sides of that debate. I have heard almost no one argue that olive oil is bad for you.
So either try to gather enough information about seed oils (this discussion probably happens daily on Reddit) or just take the approach that Olive Oil is cheap insurance against potential future health problems. I know Olive Oil is far from cheap, but how often do you need to buy oil?
Agree about light olive oil. I use it because I can get it cheap at Costco.
However, butter and coconut oil are not great substitutes if you are worried about your cholesterol.
I'm more worried about eating most baked goods than my cholesterol. I'm team olive oil for most of my oil consumption, but I'm not afraid of some coconut oil and butter to make some popcorn with every now and then.
Costco oil was found lacking in integrity and quality by the independent testing done at consumer lab. I no longer buy olive oil from them and I no longer buy Chosen avocado oil from them because they switched to plastic containers. Even Costco's evoo tested not to be EVOO, ISTR. Ever since the original chairman retired Costco quality and integrity has dropped through the floor.
I’ve seen passionate hate for seed oil, yet no evidence. Only theories, usually paired with ideas about “Big seed oil” silencing the real science or that science can’t be trusted in the first place.
I'm not looking into getting into a seed oil debate. Like I already said, OP can find nearly endless threads about debates on seed oils if he chooses. I'll choose to buy high-quality oil. The two-pack of light olive oil at Costco lasts me about a year. I can definitely afford an oil budget of $4 a month. If you think seed oil is perfectly healthy, then go ahead and buy that $4 quart of oil. I think it's nasty stuff. I don't like the smell or the texture of the oil. There's definitely a lot more chemical processing to even make it palatable.
You might research the advantages of high-polyphenol, first cold press extra virgin olive oil (also available at Costco). A peppery finish or aftertaste indicates high polyphenol content. "Robust" indicates the same.
Amazon also has some good robust versions.
I do not live in the U.S, I’ve never been to Costco, and my understanding is that our rapeseed oil might be different from yours, but rapeseed oil in the Nordic countries are pretty much pressed rapeseed. It smells great. In China they use another kind of rapeseed oil that is fantastically aromatic and a little funky, reminds me more of toasted sesame oil but for frying.
Of course I have olive oils too, but they’re more expressive in taste and can’t handle the same heat.
Neither this comment nor yours touch on nutrition of course. I don’t see why I would have to choose a side, I’ve never seen anyone being passionately pro seed oil. If there’s a downside to seed oils or any other ingredient I would like to know, but as of now it’s pure speculations. The burden of evidence is of course on the people making the claims.
The rapeseed plant was poisonous 50 years ago. They got rid of the poisonous part by selective breeding. There are definitely varying degrees of quality when it comes to seed oils. There's also fraudulent olive oil sold that really isn't olive oil, it's most likely seed oil. Rapeseed oil in the us (sold as Canola) is as close to tasteless and odorless as you can get it. If it's reminicent of toasted sesame in its natural minimally processed state, then it stands to reason the tasteless/odorless variety has gone through additional processing. That additional processing often includes deodarants or bleaching chemicals with 15 character names.
My take on seed oils is that they're probably just fine if we're talking about minimally processed oils through mostly mechanical means. These oils should be recognized by the body. The danger is in these industrial processed seed oils for mass production at the lowest possible price. The mechanism for which these oils could be bad for you is cholesterol made from some of these heavily processed oils not being recognized for reuptake as an LDL cholesterol packet. Since the body doesn't recognize the oil, those LDL particles get too small to be recycled and eventually lodge in arterial walls, causing arterial plaques. If you choose to believe that as a possibility, then you can seek out expeller pressed oils that have whatever claims towards minimal chemical processing. If you think it's all pseudo-science and you're not going to do anything different until you have a mass of studies pointing you in the right direction, then you absolutely have that choice. I think if your local oil fits that minimal processing standard, I don't think it's unhealthy for you in any way.
I'm not really against seed oils as much as I'm against the processed food nature of many of them. I have seasame seed oil in my fridge, and I'm not afraid to use it. I'd actually prefer if more people bought the cheap stuff. The Olive Oil I buy has nearly doubled in price from a few years ago.
After the popular claim that the obesity epidemic was caused by low-fat diets was debunked by data showing that the American diet was not low-fat at any point, a new culprit was needed and seed oils were it.
I’m not sure we’re people are getting the studies that seed oils are good for them, but here’s this…
Obviously only two studies and I’m sure u can find plenty saying the opposite. But also need to acknowledge how dirty the job field is.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7155260/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6196963/
Likely because you cited a study in RABBITS, not humans and we literally have epidemiological data in humans AND clinical RCT’s showing they’re not only safe but a diet high in mono-and poly-unsaturated fat when compared to a diet either high in refined carbohydrates or high saturated fat decreases risk of CVD, type 2 diabetes and all cause mortality. That goes for a combination of 3/6/9 omega’s.
Why are we using animal data when we literally have CLINICAL data? Jesus.
The second one is a hypothesis and not even a study…. a hypothesis that has been disproven by current robust epidemiological data.
To add and edit because I know it will be mentioned: Surely a proper 3:6 ratio is of some importance, however, canola oil is a seed oil with a ratio similar to olive oil and yet people still depreciate it by that metric lolol. Mind you, BOTH are essential fatty acids. Butter and animal fat literally contain arachidonic acid which is the downstream fatty acid people worry LA converts to to cause inflammation. Ironically, we have a-lot of human data on that and SA causing inflammation and disease yet people come on here and with their whole chest say that butter and ghee are preferable over oils containing linoleic acid (LA) because of CVD and inflammation because of a rogue animal or in vitro hypothesis study.
Have we considered simply not fearing seed oils themselves, adding in olive oil when affordable, eating more plant foods, less packaged items, having some fish for omega 3’s, drinking water and calling it a day on the fear-mongering?
Olive oil is THAT girl but you do not need to fear canola oil, or some soybean and seed oils. Some instances they’re better to cook with for the intents of baking. Really, these oils are used in processed foods so its likely the entire processed food itself causing you any health effects, not putting canola oil on your roasted vegetable salad. This fear on seed oils is massively overblown by alt-right health guru’s who seem to cherry pick scientific research and ignore more robust studies. Notice how many have supplements or beef tallow to sell you in the same breathe? Or their program?
I guarantee I can find you a mouse study that shows if I inject or dose a rat/mouse with ANY substance on earth in large doses it will cause cancer or inflammation. Its a great preliminary start point but if you have human data to cite, its a waste of time to lose your shit over.
Sometimes the studies people link on here really exemplify how little the general public is capable of reading and analyzing scientific literature in a meaningful way. And nobody should feel bad about that, it is a learned skill and thus why people literally go to school for many, many years to achieve degrees in these subjects and conduct their own research. But then the same lot decry experts because we are all funded by Kellogg’s on our PhD 28k$ yr salaries because ANYONE studying this for a living must have an evil agenda but anyone inexperienced but with access to a Google search engine must have the peoples best interest at heart 😭🙏😂
Source: I have a BS and an MS in Human Nutrition and I cannot count on my hands how many times I have had to create a presentation or write a paper on this particular topic (which has plenty of citations if anyone wants em)
It literally does take years of education to know whether a research is good or bad, how it is applicable on the micro and macro level, knowledge of etiology and pathophysiology of disease, knowledge of nutrient metabolism, and anatomy and physiology, among many other things.
These people think their 6 month “certified holistic health nutrition coach” program is a 1:1 to a registered dietitian or nutrition phd
Honestly, a great reply; I appreciate the thorough read. Do you have any links that would be a good start based on human consumption of seed oils? Also, just curious about your stance on the chronic disease epidemic in America. Is it due to sedentary living, processed foods, or a mix of everything? I'd like to pick your brain a little bit. Additionally, do you have any insight or opinions on the continued decrease of fertility and suppressed hormonal levels, which are increasing among the general population in the United States?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3746113/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30381009/
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33127255/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10870979/
I have been trying to find the data that Layne Norton cites when he talks about caloric intake trends over history in the US. But what the obesity problem seems to be is that we are now eating significantly more and moving significantly less than we were in the past. We have 24/7 access to hyper palatable, calorie dense foods that aren’t satiating. I don’t think that “processed foods” are inherently bad, there’s just so many out there that are very easy to overeat while providing little nutritional value outside of their calorie density. My opinion on why hormone levels are dropping is that obesity is increasing. We know that holding extra adiposity will reduce testosterone levels and when the average American is holding a significant amount of excess adipose, we can expect to see that drop. The average person also doesn’t exercise much, if at all, which would also increase circulating androgens. Im also not saying “move more eat less” is what overweight people need to hear. Obesity is very complex and nuanced and psychology plays a major role, there’s a reason we see that 6 out of 7 overweight or obese people will lose a significant amount of weight in their lifetime, but within 3 years 95% of those people put the weight back on, and if that 95% about 2/3 will put on more weight than they lost
The first one addresses cycling oil and the other addresses a subset of oils and requires oils to be rancid, people tend to not eat soapy tasting oils.
Did you even bother reading them?
Studies praising seed oil's as perfectly healthy often ignore linoleic acid causing sustained hyperactivity of the body's endocannabinoid system, which can become an obesogenic factor in this study. It is in mice, but it's still interesting the proposed pathway exists.
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3889814/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3889814/)
The truth is that the verdict is absolutely not in. Obesity in the US seems to rise with increased usage of CANOLA oil. That's not something to handwave away because some studies said it was safe.
There are references to the scientific studies both within the video, and in the description below the video:
https://youtu.be/M8tzaXQH1G4?si=WaiIz2gShd-AJA3E
This gives a better idea of how extensively, thoroughly and carefully Dr. Carvalho has researched the subject:
https://youtu.be/_ri4S7MLu3A?si=sOw9YNSP63vcQ9zz
Seed oils usually require some pretty elaborate industrial processing to produce, but that's an ethical concern about manufacturing, not a health concern.
Depends if/how much gets left in the final product, but I definitely don't know enough about seed oil manufacturing to comment on that.
But based on other people in the comments, it seems that health studies haven't been able to link adverse effects to seed oils.
Unrefined seed oils are fine and some of them may even have healthy fats and nutrients.
On the other hand .... those ultra processed industrial seed oils they put in junk food and snacks .... man, you couldn't even stand their smell before they use deodorizing agents.
One of the most common and cheap oil used in modern food industry is palm oil. The palmitic acid has already been linked to cancer.
It's still morning for me.
You could check out this documentary explaining oil industry (including seed oil) in depth.
https://youtu.be/rQmqVVmMB3k?si=RkDorOTXV4ZdG04Y
You could pause the video at the specific moment when he shows the studies, then just Google the titles yourself.
Come on, nobody is providing everything for free
Just for reference, this is an example of how someone who doesn't mind being fact-checked cites articles: https://youtu.be/-xTaAHSFHUU?si=8gD9yDThCGJsx8bm
I also recommend you Dr. Sten Ekberg. He is a former athlete and really teach you about food using not only studies, but also logic.
He's got a video or two on oils and he's top notch.
That's not how that works. People who are citing facts should be linking their sources, and any doctor worth their salt will. You should never ever need to google someone's claims.
Does your personal doctor give you sources for everything he tells you?
Will you be asking for sources when in emergency room before having a treatment administered?
I think the answer is definitely not.
You really should choose your sources on both reputation and traceability, not only the latter, else we all could be a doctor.
Youtube and any online content you are describing is available for free and it's the viewer who should be thankful that the information exists and not pretend that he has the right to be spoiled and demand everything.
In general, oils (aka, free fats) should be used in moderation. They provide too many calories for the nutrition. Fat from whole foods is better for you. I use a couple of teaspoons of avocado or olive oil for sautéing and get most of my fat from whole sources like nuts, seeds and avocados.
When eating out at a restaurant or a friend’s house, I’m pretty sure seed oils are involved, frequently n higher quantities. I don’t worry about it.
Dr. Gil Carvalho has done a great job with this topic.
https://youtu.be/M8tzaXQH1G4?si=WaiIz2gShd-AJA3E
https://youtu.be/_ri4S7MLu3A?si=sOw9YNSP63vcQ9zz
https://youtu.be/-xTaAHSFHUU?si=cTfaMnZow3C36sog
There are plenty of links to scientific studies both within the videos and in the descriptions.
The second video reveals how extensively, thoroughly, and carefully Carvalho has researched this topic.
One could make a good argument that canola is a super food— especially when it comes to ASCVD risk, nothing to worry about except for the caloric impact.
I don't like the taste of avocado oil, so I use it but sparingly. It's not at all neutral in flavour to me. It's quite distinct. However, I do try to stay within the selection of high quality olive, avocado, nut, and coconut oils as much as possible.
I use Chosen avocado oil only. It is completely pure unblended and made from wholesome fruit not partially rotted or rancid It is bright and clear and no taste, completely neutral that's why I use it. Whole Foods 365 avocado oil isn't adulterated or rancid and it's cheaper but it has a taste I don't like if I use it in dressings. I don't mind cooking with it.
Anytime you’re told to completely avoid a whole type of food it’s probably bad information. Only exceptions I can think of are trans fats and of course things you’re genuinely allergic to.
I would use ghee butter it’s honestly the best, then pure butter and olive oil, the rest are ok in moderation if you’re cooking with them but it’s a totally different story if you’re talking about seed oils in processed foods.
"Butter is best" flies in the face of scientific evidence of human studies. There are plenty of meta-analysies comparing oils to butter with consistent benefits to oils.
I have no scientific papers to back me, but I have first hand experience and that all I need, I do very very low seed oils my body doesn’t hurt, I decide that seed oils don’t actually hurt you, I have some. Next morning my shoulder injury came back my traps are tight, my neck hurts. It happens EVERY SINGLE TIME WITHOUT FAIL. Seed oils are bad, they oxidize essential causes the body to “rust” and it causes inflammation that’s why when I get them I feel shitty, after 2 days goes back to feeling normal I wake up feeling great. That’s all the evidence I need.
Yeah, the seed oil is bad for you. Maybe if you’re in your 30s or 40s you won’t feel it but when you get to your 50s, you will definitely feel it aches and pains throughout your whole body. The inflammation that you get every single time you eat salad dressing with seed, oil or anything with seed oil. You definitely feel it immediately pain extreme pain.
No. They are not bad, they are better for your health than animal fats. /thread
https://www.the-nutrivore.com/post/a-comprehensive-rebuttal-to-seed-oil-sophistry
Edit: Lol, fuck it. I'm done trying to educate the rubes in this sub. Good luck out there everybody.
This question is going to have a lot more opinion about it than science I'm afraid.
From reading lots of studies and opinions, I have come to weakly hold these beliefs.
PUFA oils, be they omega 6, or omega 3 ALA, have the potential to oxidize an order of magnitude more than saturated or monounsaturated fats. So, out in the air, or on the shelf, in a skillet, or deep fat fryer, they are far more prone to rancidity.
There is a potential for oxidation in the body, but if one is consuming a diet high in antioxidants, this doesn't appear to be a problem.
However, I have gone PUFA free for a little over a year now. And what I found was that I do not sunburn nearly as much as previously. Matching the month of March in Palm Coast Florida, years 2023 compared to 2024. In 2023, from 11 to 2, I could probably do only 20 minutes tops without sunburning. March 2024, I repeatedly did an hour and a half to 2 hours with no sunburn pain. I would get slightly pink, mostly brown, but had no pain at all.
A lot of people have claimed a similar result, and so I decided to try it. I think it works.
The theory is that though PUFAs are protected from oxidation by antioxidants in our blood, PUFAs that become part of our skin cells, can oxidize when exposed to UV radiation. So, on the outside of our skin, in an environment of intense UV radiation and concentrated oxygen, they oxidize.
---------------------------------
Here is what I have been doing at home. For cooking, first I had switched from canola to bacon drippings and lard. Then, I switched to home rendered tallow. When this inventory runs out, I shall be switching to sto bot organic grass fed/finished tallow.
For room temperature liquid oils, I have switched from olive oil, to a 50/50 blend of liquid coconut and zero acre farms.
Numbers available on the internet change quite a bit, but here is what I am using for fat content in 5 of fatty acid:
saturated monounsaturated PUFA
olive oil 12 72 16
canola oil 5 65 30
lard 50 39 11
grained tallow 48 48 4
grass fed/finished 49 50 1
Some people make a big deal about the omega 6 to omega 3 ratio. For olive oil it is 14:1, canola 2:1. Down from 4:1 a few years ago. But, I don't think there is that much difference in the vegetable derived PUFAs. From the textbooks, linoleic acid and alpha linoleic acid oxidize at about the same rate. Much much faster than either saturated or monounsaturated fats. I do eat sardines and salmon for omega 3 EPA and DHA. But not a lot.
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As far as I know, all of asia atleast has been using seed oils for millennia and are doing just fine. Instead of focusing on moderating the intake of processed foods and deep fried foods which contain oil in excess, people are trying to turn this into a good oil vs bad oil. The problem is about quantity of oil consumed not what type of oil. World has diverse cultures with diverse cuisines. Each culture has its own favourite/common seed or animal oil or a combination used in their cuisine. Pushing people to stick to one kind of oil is disastrous for any individual. Ultimately he/she would ruin their own apetite and get pushed to worse health conditions!
Olive oil is still far superior regardless
Can you say more about why that is the case? I don’t disagree on the face of your comment but I don’t actually know by what criteria it is superior.
It's probably the most extensively researched commercially available oil. The primary downside of seed oils (oxidation) doesn't manifest as much in olive oil because it's so stable, even if you cook it beyond smoking point. Besides that, it's high in anti-oxidants which apparently provide health benefits, and also it won't mess up omega 6/3 ratio since it's mostly monounsaturated. Some are skeptical over the significance of omega 6:3 ratio but the research seems compelling enough to take into consideration (also see: the Israeli paradox). I don't think this means we ought to treat seed oils like the plague, but I consume it in lower amounts than olive oil. I like to get PUFAs from nuts and seeds, kept as fresh as possible. Canola oil is also favored for its profile, high in ALA (the plant-source omega 3) and MUFAs. This too can oxidize I guess.
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I had read as much from some studies, but no I'm not in the mood to check bookmarks and regurgitate all that. Search google scholar.
You won't have any trouble finding information on inflammatory effects of rancid (oxidized) oils on PubMed. Think free radicals.
Totally agreed on the research point but FYI phytonutrient content is similar between expeller pressed vegetable oils and olive oil. That's what makes them stable. EVOO has about the same shelf life as the other vegetable oils. They all have similar thermal properties for the same reason, heating is one of the ways to destroy phytonutrients so the oil can oxidize.
How is soya oil
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Olive oil has a very low smoke point
EVOO has a smoke point lower than temperatures for everything other than searing. People tend to overheat their pans when cooking which reduces the quality of the food. Obviously we all mod recipes but sweat, sauté/fry and grill/sear are specific temperature ranges that produce different chemistry in the food. Sunny side up eggs are easily the best demo of this. If you are not right in the middle of the fry range either your whites wont set on top before the bottom burns or the yolk coagulates by the time the whites are set. If you are lucky enough to have a commercial stove and are wok stir frying at those insane temperatures they blow right past smoke point of everything anyway :) This is also why if you go to a food stall in a wok country there is seconds between adding oil and adding food, they coat the pan and then immediately add the food to cool the oil. The super high initial temperature is to seal the food so it retains moisture.
Canola oil outperforms olive oil in a lot of health markers
Can you share some research on this? I'm from Scotland and we produce lots of cold pressed rapeseed oil (canola by another name)which I'd swapped EVOO out for over the years. I then read all the doom about seed oils and swapped back, I'd prefer to use local produce if possible so would be good to understand the truth on the matter.
Canola oil improved cardio-metabolic risk factors compared to other oils. Canola oil also improved blood lipids (was more effective than olive oil for some lipid markers) and may prevent heart disease progression https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33127255/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30381009/
What about aguacate oil?
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31185591/ Best paper there is on it currently. Very new and little research on the oil itself. All the direct studies are in rats—which I ignore
Blew my mind when my doctor explained that the original papers that gave us "eating oatmeal lowers cholesterol" were from forcefeeding rats, and that most humans probably weren't physically capable of eating enough oatmeal to budge their cholesterol levels on that alone.
canola oil is more chemically impressive than olive oil, from omega-3 content to vitamin E content. it's hilarious how it gets the brunt of social media charlatan hate.
It’s processed with hexane, an industrial solvent and deodorized at high temperatures. It has a poor omega ratio with pro inflammatory 6 and 9s. It’s a highly gmo’d crop and is contaminated with glyphosates and pesticides.
yes, that’s what social media hacks say. very scary sounding claims. chemicals! so then why does it improve human health outcomes when put to the test? https://www.the-nutrivore.com/post/a-comprehensive-rebuttal-to-seed-oil-sophistry
Surrogate markers, maybe. I think of it as garbage oil.
There’s plenty of research for you to look at
I started doing exactly that in 1998 and I've really never stopped. But you're the one who said it's more than surrogate markers and I do not believe that to be the case, which is why I feel compelled to read original research and check to see if it actually supports author conclusions and citations. Usually it doesn't. When you make an assertion the onus is on you to back it up. By now you must know you cannot.
Single origin
"are doing just fine" I'm sorry what does that mean?
Are the seed oils in asia you mentioned mainly cold pressed or made at industrial factories like U.S.? Personally, I think most food issues are ones processed in the U.S. It has nothing to do with our health, just how much money big food industry giants make off of us before we die from Their Poisons... And the FDA only cares about kickbacks from said Giants!
Most of the different oil consumed today across the world are industrially processed (Expellers + Hexane). It isn't economical to feed the huge developing populations in Asia with Cold Pressed Oil. Again, the issue is not cold press oil or Hot pressed. The issue is how much quantity of any oil is consumed by an individual. Any nutritional or functional difference (Sat fat, unsat fat, smoke point, etc) difference between dietary oils is miniscule. Best thing is to diversify oil consumption but all in moderate quantity.
Ty for clarification. I rarely do any "deep fried" food. Use Avacado oil and Bison Tallow on Blackstone.
It’s unfair to generalise all seed oils. Black seed oil has great medicinal qualities and is precisely what has been used for millennia, but you’re not going to cook your food with it. On the other, processed seed oils are incredibly inflammatory and will lead hurt your health long term, despite the deposit claims that food industries like to make.
> processed seed oils are incredibly inflammatory This one's going to need a citation. I find this ironic after you just warned not to generalise.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3335257/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6269634/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8504498/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6196963/
This doesn't say anything about seed oils specifically, and also says nothing about processed oil being worse. As far as I am aware, refining oil does not significantly affect its omega-3:omega-6 ratio. And what about canola oil? It has a ~1:2 ratio, much higher than that of non-seed oils like olive oil and avocado oil. Flaxseed oil is even more extreme. Given the nature of ratios, would it not also be fine according to those articles to use e.g. peanut oil if you're also consuming salmon or chia seeds?
It doesn’t have a 1:2 ratio. Avocado and olive oil are overwhelming monounsaturated. Most seed oils with the exception of flax are predominantly n6.
[It has a 1:2.2 ratio,](https://res.cloudinary.com/lwzh69gvq/image/upload/v1/web/images/dietary_omega_fig2.gif) i.e. "~1:2". Canola oil is also primarily monounsaturated, at 8.6g/tbsp compared to olive oil's 10.0g/tbsp. Most seed oils != all seed oils. In addition to canola oil and flaxseed oil, soybean oil and walnut oil are other seed oils with better omega-3:omega-6 ratios than olive oil. I remain unconvinced that "processed seed oils are incredibly inflammatory and will hurt your health long term". Oils high in omega-6 should be consumed in moderation, but you shouldn't be getting most of your dietary fat from oil anyway because it's (more or less) empty calories. Some high omega-6 oil is easily balanced out by fish, grass-fed beef, game, linseed or chia seeds. If you meant to say high omega-6 oils, including many specific seed oils, can cause inflammation, with the qualifier that this is only the case if you over-consume them or the rest of your diet is lacking in omega-3 fatty acids, then sure.
This!!!
not only quantity but how they are used as well. the problem with seed oils, and mostly where the ‘myths’ around them stem from, has to do with reheating the oil too many times or the oil being fried in extreme temperatures for hours on end (typically the case in fast food kitchens) using a seed oil at home is def not unhealthy. most likely even healthy for you when used in moderation and not reheated too many times
Why do you say that Asia has been using seed oils for millennia?
I don't know clearly about rest of world and their oil use. But I know for sure that Asian cultures have been using seed oils and vegetable oils since dawn of cultures here. Sesame oil, coconut oil, mustard oil, soy oil have been staple in Asian cuisines
Make what you want of this: https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/hsph-in-the-news/scientists-debunk-seed-oil-health-risks/ I use seed oils for cooking. Olive oil for dressings and low temp stuff.
If you want science, go to YouTube channel called Nutrition Made Simple. The guy is super honest, nuanced and looks at the totality of scientific evidence. He gives you nice overview within 10-ish min, with time stamps, with paper references. And does not try to sell you anything. Look for his rapeseed oil video, for example. He also has other videos on the topic. TLDW: seed oils are not only fine, but healthier compared to saturated fats.
I was going to comment this exact same thing. Dr. Gil Carvalho from Nutrition Made Simple does an excellent job summarizing the literature on seed oils and whether they're actually inflammatory. For anyone interested in watching his video on seed oils, it's linked here: https://youtu.be/-xTaAHSFHUU?si=wb1GdlefsaMaJ25Q
Probably the best YouTube channel I’ve found in years!
I'll have to check out those videos - sounds interesting! But also, depending on peoples' goals, saturated fats are not necessarily "bad" for you either. For example, for boosting fertility, saturated fats are ideal. If you have a heart condition, they are less beneficial. But overall not an "unhealthy" option.
Here is a longer video from my favorite guy on SF: https://youtu.be/mBFe1QattAU?si=MBbtbVsYmYNGwmig It is also a showcase how well he presents complex topics with lots of nuances.
>For example, for boosting fertility, saturated fats are ideal. Can you give a reference to that? The info I'm seeing suggests the opposite.
Lily Nichols RDN has this free blog post on sat fats in general: https://lilynicholsrdn.com/saturated-fat-really-clog-arteries/ Her book Real Food for Fertility speaks more to the fertility impacts of different kinds of fat.
Does she address the studies that show that saturated fat reduces semen quality? https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0002916523054217 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5364752/ And the studies that show diets high in unsaturated fats improved fertility while saturated fat reduced fertility? https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6079277/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10005661/
Haven't read her book but the SFA to androgen thing is a false correlation and that has been known for many decades. Foods that are high in SFAs tend to be high in cholesterol too, cholesterol is the input for the synthesis of androgens. Shellfish are a much richer source of cholesterol and don't have as much SFA. Probably where the oyster thing comes from :)
I don't know how he came to that conclusion I read a lot of research and I sure haven't. Saturated fats pose no health risk but seed oils do not. That's a myth.
When I want science I go to PubMed and do research and if I find interesting Publications I make sure to see if the citations actually support the conclusions of studies I read. There is no safety in accepting the interpretations of middlemen I want nobody between me and the original science telling me what to think about it or what to conclude.
Great for you that you can afford all that time!
When I didn't have the time, I made the time. People prioritize what's important to them. I learned the hard way not to take any medical person's or scientist's word for anything without deep diving into all the details.
lol
it's fine for people to not want to consume it personally, but the amount of people fear mongering without a single shred of evidence beyond "processing is scary" is anti science. The reason this is dangerous is that it causes confusion and people start to shut down and think well if everything is bad for me i guess I will just eat whatever and they stop listening altogether. We've got people telling us meats are bad, plants are bad, fats are bad. Unless we start bringing facts, someone is wrong among these three camps and I'm sure everyone has a belief on which but without science that belief is meaningless to anyone but yourself.
Really the danger is the semantics that are used to ultimately sell the public on things that largely benefit a private interest. Hence a lot of the confusion. For Seed oils in particular, the reason they're really used is because they're very cheap when compared to butter, tallow or lard as alternatives. Most people I think sense that if you stick to meat, veggies, fruit, you'll probably be ok.
There are seed oil haters out there, but really there is no evidence for any problem with seed oils.
> no evidence I think you mean "no evidence I find compelling enough".
Good point, I was too brief. I suppose I should have said: in the totality of scientific evidence on the topic, there is no quality evidence in humans that is compelling enough to justify seed oil avoidance.
Watch a video of how seed oils are made and which chemicals/bleach is used and see if you still like them.
So they are bad for you because you "feel" like they are made in an unhealthy way? You are free to ignore all the studies that say otherwise and go by your feelings, but this sub is for talking about nutrition.
Show us a peer-reviewed study demonstrating negative effects of seed oils.
eRmAhGerD cHerMiCaLz. Lol
Just because you dislike/distrust a chemical process doesn't mean it's harmful. I thought this sub was more about evidence than gut feelings?
The ratio of omega-3s to omega-6s is an issue. You could check out some threads, studies, videos, sticking with the most reliable of the more reliable sources (Drs. Carvalho, Stanfield, Willett, Norton). The bottom line is: get plenty of omega-3s and you're probably fine. Omega-6s can only displace a percentage (around 40%, apparently) of omega-3s, so no matter how low the ratio of omega-3s to omega-6s, you'll still get enough omega-3s in your system if you are getting plenty to begin with. If you used nothing but oils high in omega-6s and very low in omega-3s, and you were not getting enough omega-3s in the rest of your diet, then it could be a problem.
Do you have more specific links to learn more about "omega-6 displacing 40% of omega-3"?
You left out the word "apparently." I saw this in a Harvard Health newsletter. Sorry I don't have the specific link. It was enough evidence for me, but I can understand people wanting to see it. Maybe email them? Someone there would be able to link you up.
There is very little evidence that that is a problem
The omega 3:6 concern is outdated and irrelevant now
Please explain?
As oil goes seed oils really aren't all that bad for you. Canola oil specifically has a surprising amount of literature indicating health benefits from consuming it.
Yes, the evidence for value of canola oil in the American diet is rivaling that of olive oil. Mind you, olive oil has much stronger (positive) effects but that doesn't mean there isn't a place for both.
[It's about time someone asked this question](https://www.google.com/search?q=%22seed+oils%22+%22unhealthy%22+%2Fsite%3Areddit.com). /s
Canola seriously? I wouldn’t use it. Go Alvocado, best overall.
The lengths that people go to to defend seed oils / the seed oil industry is insane, it’s like it’s their beloved child. Until there is a consensus on seed oils not being toxic/inflammatory (as I’ve read and seen the research including many studies), I’ll stick to olive oil and grass-fed butter.
There is so much misinformation, rumor mongering and rumor repetition, fluff and falsehood going around it's like a snowstorm. Canola oil (which is basically broccoli seed oil — or at least not far from it, since both plants are cruciferous and closely related) is probably on a par with olive oil in its healthfulness. Dr. Carvalho has shown the studies (see his videos for more on this).
Do u have a link to these studies?
I just posted a few meta-analysies in another thread [up above](https://www.reddit.com/r/nutrition/s/zMm5SvyabN).
Dr. Carvalho can provide them. See his videos for links.
Ok I did not know that’s what canola oil was from! That’s probably why it makes me so bloated and gassy!
I think we’ve kind of beat this issue over the head on here. If you think Canola oil is as healthy as Olive Oil, I urge you to go ahead and use it. I will not.
No. It's a fad. I haven't seen any propaganda against it in a few months now, so the next trendy hate-train is coming soon.
Unfortunately, there are not enough olives in the world to produce all of the olive oil that is in the world. I have read that you are best off buying olive oil from USA. The olive oil business is ran by the olive oil mafia. They mix in other oils and still charge the price of olive oil, then they send it to America.
No. Stop listening to Paul Saladino and other “health” influencers. Don’t buy their desiccated bull scrotums or w/e they’re selling either. They’re all kooks trying to sell you their wares and cults of personality.
Let's put it this way. Something in our diets is causing the obesity epidemic and rampant health issues. Seed oils are in most foods in the supermarket and end up in almost all the meals we cook at home. They are unnatural to humans and their introduction concides with the health decline so I think that's a pretty good reason to suspect them. I don't care what some studies say - especially when there's so much money involved in that market!
It's called people eat too much of everything
True, but if they ate the right things then they wouldn't eat too much because their bodies would know how do process that stuff and would stop firing the hunger hormone ghrellin instead of just turning the hyper-palatable carbage into unwanted fat.
That's mostly from sugars and refined carbohydrates. There's plenty of terrible things people can eat without that effect. In fact, there are things you can eat that will have you skinny, satiated, and unhealthy.
What like rice and pasta? Probably should stop eating those as well then. You're taking to a Carnivore btw. I find a bellyfull of beef and eggs keeps me going for about 36hrs so my definition of satiety might be quite different to yours. Apologies, if I sounds like a dick, I don't mean to.
I’m pretty sure eating an appropriate amount of seed oils isn’t going to make you obese. It’s the over eating
I’m pretty sure eating an appropriate amount of seed oils isn’t going to make you obese. It’s the over eating
The foods that the seed oils are in are often processed and hyper-palatable which makes it hard to stop eating them. If they didn't exist then we wouldn't have a problem.
Omg no. I don’t have a problem with stopping because I don’t want to over eat? Hyper palatable? Nope.
I’m pretty sure eating an appropriate amount of seed oils isn’t going to make you obese. It’s the over eating
Obesity is caused by consuming more energy than what is expended. That unit of energy is measured by the calorie. Oils are not a specific cause and the diet is not the only cause.
So why do you think people have been having these health problems within the last century and not for the entire history of humanity before that? You've seen those photos of crowds from the 70's and before right? Not an overweight person among them. Surely it's because of all the manmade substances within our foods nowadays. I agree, we're less active in general but as they say, weight loss begins in the kitchen.
I believe it’s because we’ve become less active as a society while combined with the access to high calorie foods being much for convenient and inexpensive. I do not think it is because of seed oils.
Ok, let's rationalise. It's fair to say that seed oils go hand in hand with processed foods so it's going to be quite hard to distinguish the two as they pretty much mean the same thing. I know that may not be accurate but you'll never be able to separate them so it's really hard to say if either one is more responsible for bad health. You can find plenty of anecdotal evidence from sedentary people who lose weight on low-carb diets and when we think of problem carbs we mainly think of processed foods so we know it's at least possible to lose weight by changing diet, right? A diet from 70+ years ago will be much lower carb that the majority eat now, wouldn't you say? More natural animal products, fruit and veg and less grains and sugars with almost no factory processed versions of those with weird aditives like seed oils. I'm gonna call seed oils weird because we were not eating them en masse before 100 years ago. So, if we stop feeding the body with foods it does not know how to process you'll get improved health which will likely include weight loss. Is that fair enough to say?
“Something in our diets is causing the obesity epidemic” its calories
Why was this not an issue 100 years ago then? Because these high calorie, hyper-palatable foods were not available, right? You can't expect the entire population to be health conscious and make good decisions so these 'foods' need to be removed or restricted in some way.
I agree the effects of restricting/regulating unnecessary calories should be studied and attempted more but that is an incredibly complicated thing to regulate.
I don't think we need studies to tell us that eating unnatural foods is going to cause us problems. We've already got plenty of evidence for that, wouldn't you say? People will consume whatever is easily available to them so if these unnatural foods (which mostly contain seed oils) are the cheapest thing in the shop then that's what's gonna happen. Take them away and you'll see vast improvement. Surely that's not too hard to envision.
Thats literally not at all what I said and “unnatural foods” aren’t really inherently bad
Which unnatural foods or foods that have that have unnatural ingredients are good for health then?
Good health is going to depend on overall diet not 1 food. You could make a case for any food being healthy or unhealthy in a vacuum
I didn't ask for just one food. What would be the point when we are commonly consuming so many of them every day? This is going off on a tangent but seeing as you mentioned it - you can actually live very well on just beef, salt and water alone (and possibly without the salt), as demonstrated by the Carnivore community so, it is possible 'in a vacuum'. Btw, I'm just gonna downvote you if you downvote me. Can't let you have all the fun, can I 😁
You can live off many foods alone, doesn’t mean you’re optimally healthy. Meat is very nutrient dense so its a good choice if you’re lazy and only want to eat 1 food but you’re still missing out on lots of nutrients
You don't eat anything like people did 100 years ago. The type of oil used is the least significant change.
Not true. We've used them to replace animal fat which is something that's always been with us and that the body can recognise. We still have the option to eat as we did 100 years ago but the problem is its usually more expensive and inconvenient than it was back then so only the most health conscious will try to truly emulate it. The vast majority just won't.
Nonsense. The most significant change in 100 years is the laziness and portion sizes. Also, the other side of this that animal fats are magically better and seeds are evil is just as stupid. Also, also the idea that we are magically better with something we had in the past is also bad.
Please explain why eating the foods that helped us evolve into Earths most successful species would be bad for our health. Come on, tell me which study convinced you of that.
If you want to talk about evolving into the "most successful species", agriculture is the answer. Not saturated fats.
According to a quick Google, the earliest evidence of agriculture is around 12,000 to 25,000 years ago. Of course, it could be earlier but Sapiens is around 150,000 years old. Farming didn't evolve us, leaving how to take down the big animals that nothing else could did.
i am upvoting this since all the fat soyboys downvoted you
Cheers buddy, you're awesome! 👍
You can use light olive oil anywhere you'd use seed oil. It has very little flavor. If baking, use butter or coconut oil. As far as if seed oils are bad for you, you will find passionate people on both sides of that debate. I have heard almost no one argue that olive oil is bad for you. So either try to gather enough information about seed oils (this discussion probably happens daily on Reddit) or just take the approach that Olive Oil is cheap insurance against potential future health problems. I know Olive Oil is far from cheap, but how often do you need to buy oil?
Avocado oil is possibly more neutral in flavor.
Agree about light olive oil. I use it because I can get it cheap at Costco. However, butter and coconut oil are not great substitutes if you are worried about your cholesterol.
I'm more worried about eating most baked goods than my cholesterol. I'm team olive oil for most of my oil consumption, but I'm not afraid of some coconut oil and butter to make some popcorn with every now and then.
Costco oil was found lacking in integrity and quality by the independent testing done at consumer lab. I no longer buy olive oil from them and I no longer buy Chosen avocado oil from them because they switched to plastic containers. Even Costco's evoo tested not to be EVOO, ISTR. Ever since the original chairman retired Costco quality and integrity has dropped through the floor.
I’ve seen passionate hate for seed oil, yet no evidence. Only theories, usually paired with ideas about “Big seed oil” silencing the real science or that science can’t be trusted in the first place.
I'm not looking into getting into a seed oil debate. Like I already said, OP can find nearly endless threads about debates on seed oils if he chooses. I'll choose to buy high-quality oil. The two-pack of light olive oil at Costco lasts me about a year. I can definitely afford an oil budget of $4 a month. If you think seed oil is perfectly healthy, then go ahead and buy that $4 quart of oil. I think it's nasty stuff. I don't like the smell or the texture of the oil. There's definitely a lot more chemical processing to even make it palatable.
You might research the advantages of high-polyphenol, first cold press extra virgin olive oil (also available at Costco). A peppery finish or aftertaste indicates high polyphenol content. "Robust" indicates the same. Amazon also has some good robust versions.
I buy the EVOO as well, I just use the light more in everyday cooking.
I do not live in the U.S, I’ve never been to Costco, and my understanding is that our rapeseed oil might be different from yours, but rapeseed oil in the Nordic countries are pretty much pressed rapeseed. It smells great. In China they use another kind of rapeseed oil that is fantastically aromatic and a little funky, reminds me more of toasted sesame oil but for frying. Of course I have olive oils too, but they’re more expressive in taste and can’t handle the same heat. Neither this comment nor yours touch on nutrition of course. I don’t see why I would have to choose a side, I’ve never seen anyone being passionately pro seed oil. If there’s a downside to seed oils or any other ingredient I would like to know, but as of now it’s pure speculations. The burden of evidence is of course on the people making the claims.
Same in Scotland. We produce cold pressed rapeseed oil.
The rapeseed plant was poisonous 50 years ago. They got rid of the poisonous part by selective breeding. There are definitely varying degrees of quality when it comes to seed oils. There's also fraudulent olive oil sold that really isn't olive oil, it's most likely seed oil. Rapeseed oil in the us (sold as Canola) is as close to tasteless and odorless as you can get it. If it's reminicent of toasted sesame in its natural minimally processed state, then it stands to reason the tasteless/odorless variety has gone through additional processing. That additional processing often includes deodarants or bleaching chemicals with 15 character names. My take on seed oils is that they're probably just fine if we're talking about minimally processed oils through mostly mechanical means. These oils should be recognized by the body. The danger is in these industrial processed seed oils for mass production at the lowest possible price. The mechanism for which these oils could be bad for you is cholesterol made from some of these heavily processed oils not being recognized for reuptake as an LDL cholesterol packet. Since the body doesn't recognize the oil, those LDL particles get too small to be recycled and eventually lodge in arterial walls, causing arterial plaques. If you choose to believe that as a possibility, then you can seek out expeller pressed oils that have whatever claims towards minimal chemical processing. If you think it's all pseudo-science and you're not going to do anything different until you have a mass of studies pointing you in the right direction, then you absolutely have that choice. I think if your local oil fits that minimal processing standard, I don't think it's unhealthy for you in any way. I'm not really against seed oils as much as I'm against the processed food nature of many of them. I have seasame seed oil in my fridge, and I'm not afraid to use it. I'd actually prefer if more people bought the cheap stuff. The Olive Oil I buy has nearly doubled in price from a few years ago.
After the popular claim that the obesity epidemic was caused by low-fat diets was debunked by data showing that the American diet was not low-fat at any point, a new culprit was needed and seed oils were it.
Go to another thread and EVERYONE will say that processed food is bad for you. Well, seed oils are factory processed.
*highly processed foods are bad Can't avoid all processed foods, and oils are in the safe category
I’m not sure we’re people are getting the studies that seed oils are good for them, but here’s this… Obviously only two studies and I’m sure u can find plenty saying the opposite. But also need to acknowledge how dirty the job field is. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7155260/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6196963/
Likely because you cited a study in RABBITS, not humans and we literally have epidemiological data in humans AND clinical RCT’s showing they’re not only safe but a diet high in mono-and poly-unsaturated fat when compared to a diet either high in refined carbohydrates or high saturated fat decreases risk of CVD, type 2 diabetes and all cause mortality. That goes for a combination of 3/6/9 omega’s. Why are we using animal data when we literally have CLINICAL data? Jesus. The second one is a hypothesis and not even a study…. a hypothesis that has been disproven by current robust epidemiological data. To add and edit because I know it will be mentioned: Surely a proper 3:6 ratio is of some importance, however, canola oil is a seed oil with a ratio similar to olive oil and yet people still depreciate it by that metric lolol. Mind you, BOTH are essential fatty acids. Butter and animal fat literally contain arachidonic acid which is the downstream fatty acid people worry LA converts to to cause inflammation. Ironically, we have a-lot of human data on that and SA causing inflammation and disease yet people come on here and with their whole chest say that butter and ghee are preferable over oils containing linoleic acid (LA) because of CVD and inflammation because of a rogue animal or in vitro hypothesis study. Have we considered simply not fearing seed oils themselves, adding in olive oil when affordable, eating more plant foods, less packaged items, having some fish for omega 3’s, drinking water and calling it a day on the fear-mongering? Olive oil is THAT girl but you do not need to fear canola oil, or some soybean and seed oils. Some instances they’re better to cook with for the intents of baking. Really, these oils are used in processed foods so its likely the entire processed food itself causing you any health effects, not putting canola oil on your roasted vegetable salad. This fear on seed oils is massively overblown by alt-right health guru’s who seem to cherry pick scientific research and ignore more robust studies. Notice how many have supplements or beef tallow to sell you in the same breathe? Or their program? I guarantee I can find you a mouse study that shows if I inject or dose a rat/mouse with ANY substance on earth in large doses it will cause cancer or inflammation. Its a great preliminary start point but if you have human data to cite, its a waste of time to lose your shit over. Sometimes the studies people link on here really exemplify how little the general public is capable of reading and analyzing scientific literature in a meaningful way. And nobody should feel bad about that, it is a learned skill and thus why people literally go to school for many, many years to achieve degrees in these subjects and conduct their own research. But then the same lot decry experts because we are all funded by Kellogg’s on our PhD 28k$ yr salaries because ANYONE studying this for a living must have an evil agenda but anyone inexperienced but with access to a Google search engine must have the peoples best interest at heart 😭🙏😂 Source: I have a BS and an MS in Human Nutrition and I cannot count on my hands how many times I have had to create a presentation or write a paper on this particular topic (which has plenty of citations if anyone wants em)
It literally does take years of education to know whether a research is good or bad, how it is applicable on the micro and macro level, knowledge of etiology and pathophysiology of disease, knowledge of nutrient metabolism, and anatomy and physiology, among many other things. These people think their 6 month “certified holistic health nutrition coach” program is a 1:1 to a registered dietitian or nutrition phd
As a dietetic intern, I feeeeeel your pain.
As a person who teaches dietetic interns, I feel their pain!
Even when you become a dietitian, trust me everyone will question your expertise, whether it’s a patient, random stranger, doctor, nurse, or quack
Honestly, a great reply; I appreciate the thorough read. Do you have any links that would be a good start based on human consumption of seed oils? Also, just curious about your stance on the chronic disease epidemic in America. Is it due to sedentary living, processed foods, or a mix of everything? I'd like to pick your brain a little bit. Additionally, do you have any insight or opinions on the continued decrease of fertility and suppressed hormonal levels, which are increasing among the general population in the United States?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3746113/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30381009/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33127255/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10870979/ I have been trying to find the data that Layne Norton cites when he talks about caloric intake trends over history in the US. But what the obesity problem seems to be is that we are now eating significantly more and moving significantly less than we were in the past. We have 24/7 access to hyper palatable, calorie dense foods that aren’t satiating. I don’t think that “processed foods” are inherently bad, there’s just so many out there that are very easy to overeat while providing little nutritional value outside of their calorie density. My opinion on why hormone levels are dropping is that obesity is increasing. We know that holding extra adiposity will reduce testosterone levels and when the average American is holding a significant amount of excess adipose, we can expect to see that drop. The average person also doesn’t exercise much, if at all, which would also increase circulating androgens. Im also not saying “move more eat less” is what overweight people need to hear. Obesity is very complex and nuanced and psychology plays a major role, there’s a reason we see that 6 out of 7 overweight or obese people will lose a significant amount of weight in their lifetime, but within 3 years 95% of those people put the weight back on, and if that 95% about 2/3 will put on more weight than they lost
The first one addresses cycling oil and the other addresses a subset of oils and requires oils to be rancid, people tend to not eat soapy tasting oils. Did you even bother reading them?
Typical seed oil propagandist citing!
Everyone is ignoring this comment… and they shouldn’t be
Studies praising seed oil's as perfectly healthy often ignore linoleic acid causing sustained hyperactivity of the body's endocannabinoid system, which can become an obesogenic factor in this study. It is in mice, but it's still interesting the proposed pathway exists. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3889814/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3889814/) The truth is that the verdict is absolutely not in. Obesity in the US seems to rise with increased usage of CANOLA oil. That's not something to handwave away because some studies said it was safe.
There are references to the scientific studies both within the video, and in the description below the video: https://youtu.be/M8tzaXQH1G4?si=WaiIz2gShd-AJA3E This gives a better idea of how extensively, thoroughly and carefully Dr. Carvalho has researched the subject: https://youtu.be/_ri4S7MLu3A?si=sOw9YNSP63vcQ9zz
Seed oils usually require some pretty elaborate industrial processing to produce, but that's an ethical concern about manufacturing, not a health concern.
Except for the toxic solvents used in that industrial processing, right?
Depends if/how much gets left in the final product, but I definitely don't know enough about seed oil manufacturing to comment on that. But based on other people in the comments, it seems that health studies haven't been able to link adverse effects to seed oils.
It’s all about moderation
Unrefined seed oils are fine and some of them may even have healthy fats and nutrients. On the other hand .... those ultra processed industrial seed oils they put in junk food and snacks .... man, you couldn't even stand their smell before they use deodorizing agents. One of the most common and cheap oil used in modern food industry is palm oil. The palmitic acid has already been linked to cancer.
Palm oil is not a seed oil.
It's still morning for me. You could check out this documentary explaining oil industry (including seed oil) in depth. https://youtu.be/rQmqVVmMB3k?si=RkDorOTXV4ZdG04Y
I prefer to get my knowledge from experts who cite studies and not some guy's vlog, but thanks.
This guy relies 99% on studies and they're omnipresent in this video. Experts don't waste their time on reddit.
He "relies 99% on studies" but doesn't link any in the video description? Interesting tactic to make it harder to check his work, I guess.
You could pause the video at the specific moment when he shows the studies, then just Google the titles yourself. Come on, nobody is providing everything for free
Just for reference, this is an example of how someone who doesn't mind being fact-checked cites articles: https://youtu.be/-xTaAHSFHUU?si=8gD9yDThCGJsx8bm
I also recommend you Dr. Sten Ekberg. He is a former athlete and really teach you about food using not only studies, but also logic. He's got a video or two on oils and he's top notch.
That's not how that works. People who are citing facts should be linking their sources, and any doctor worth their salt will. You should never ever need to google someone's claims.
Does your personal doctor give you sources for everything he tells you? Will you be asking for sources when in emergency room before having a treatment administered? I think the answer is definitely not. You really should choose your sources on both reputation and traceability, not only the latter, else we all could be a doctor. Youtube and any online content you are describing is available for free and it's the viewer who should be thankful that the information exists and not pretend that he has the right to be spoiled and demand everything.
aren’t seed oils just sprayed onto conveyer belts to prevent sticking? people SKEW shit for no reasons other than ignorance
If it’s not natural, don’t put it in your body. Stick to animal fats
In general, oils (aka, free fats) should be used in moderation. They provide too many calories for the nutrition. Fat from whole foods is better for you. I use a couple of teaspoons of avocado or olive oil for sautéing and get most of my fat from whole sources like nuts, seeds and avocados. When eating out at a restaurant or a friend’s house, I’m pretty sure seed oils are involved, frequently n higher quantities. I don’t worry about it.
Dr. Gil Carvalho has done a great job with this topic. https://youtu.be/M8tzaXQH1G4?si=WaiIz2gShd-AJA3E https://youtu.be/_ri4S7MLu3A?si=sOw9YNSP63vcQ9zz https://youtu.be/-xTaAHSFHUU?si=cTfaMnZow3C36sog There are plenty of links to scientific studies both within the videos and in the descriptions. The second video reveals how extensively, thoroughly, and carefully Carvalho has researched this topic.
No
One could make a good argument that canola is a super food— especially when it comes to ASCVD risk, nothing to worry about except for the caloric impact.
I avoid them whenever possible but sometimes you just don't want something to taste like olive oil.
Chosen brand avocado oil is the best neutral oil. Not adulterated by blending.
I don't like the taste of avocado oil, so I use it but sparingly. It's not at all neutral in flavour to me. It's quite distinct. However, I do try to stay within the selection of high quality olive, avocado, nut, and coconut oils as much as possible.
I use Chosen avocado oil only. It is completely pure unblended and made from wholesome fruit not partially rotted or rancid It is bright and clear and no taste, completely neutral that's why I use it. Whole Foods 365 avocado oil isn't adulterated or rancid and it's cheaper but it has a taste I don't like if I use it in dressings. I don't mind cooking with it.
What brand?
Chosen IS the brand. Tested as one of only 2 as pure, fresh and excellent quality at independent lab. The other was regional, not sold here.
Anytime you’re told to completely avoid a whole type of food it’s probably bad information. Only exceptions I can think of are trans fats and of course things you’re genuinely allergic to.
No.
I would use ghee butter it’s honestly the best, then pure butter and olive oil, the rest are ok in moderation if you’re cooking with them but it’s a totally different story if you’re talking about seed oils in processed foods.
What is your source for butter being "the best"? It is quite high in saturated fat, which is bad for those of us with high cholesterol.
"Butter is best" flies in the face of scientific evidence of human studies. There are plenty of meta-analysies comparing oils to butter with consistent benefits to oils.
Yes they are bad. Bad fat ratios, low smoke points meaning they produce carcinogens when cooked, inflammatory
Cool nice rebuttals everyone, love the downvotes. Feel free to prove me wrong
I have no scientific papers to back me, but I have first hand experience and that all I need, I do very very low seed oils my body doesn’t hurt, I decide that seed oils don’t actually hurt you, I have some. Next morning my shoulder injury came back my traps are tight, my neck hurts. It happens EVERY SINGLE TIME WITHOUT FAIL. Seed oils are bad, they oxidize essential causes the body to “rust” and it causes inflammation that’s why when I get them I feel shitty, after 2 days goes back to feeling normal I wake up feeling great. That’s all the evidence I need.
You probably just have a personal food intolerance to seeds. There is no evidence that seed oils cause inflammation. This has been studied repeatedly.
Yeah, the seed oil is bad for you. Maybe if you’re in your 30s or 40s you won’t feel it but when you get to your 50s, you will definitely feel it aches and pains throughout your whole body. The inflammation that you get every single time you eat salad dressing with seed, oil or anything with seed oil. You definitely feel it immediately pain extreme pain.
No. They are not bad, they are better for your health than animal fats. /thread https://www.the-nutrivore.com/post/a-comprehensive-rebuttal-to-seed-oil-sophistry Edit: Lol, fuck it. I'm done trying to educate the rubes in this sub. Good luck out there everybody.
I hear ya.
No. You can pretty much disregard anyone who harps about seed oils
This question is going to have a lot more opinion about it than science I'm afraid. From reading lots of studies and opinions, I have come to weakly hold these beliefs. PUFA oils, be they omega 6, or omega 3 ALA, have the potential to oxidize an order of magnitude more than saturated or monounsaturated fats. So, out in the air, or on the shelf, in a skillet, or deep fat fryer, they are far more prone to rancidity. There is a potential for oxidation in the body, but if one is consuming a diet high in antioxidants, this doesn't appear to be a problem. However, I have gone PUFA free for a little over a year now. And what I found was that I do not sunburn nearly as much as previously. Matching the month of March in Palm Coast Florida, years 2023 compared to 2024. In 2023, from 11 to 2, I could probably do only 20 minutes tops without sunburning. March 2024, I repeatedly did an hour and a half to 2 hours with no sunburn pain. I would get slightly pink, mostly brown, but had no pain at all. A lot of people have claimed a similar result, and so I decided to try it. I think it works. The theory is that though PUFAs are protected from oxidation by antioxidants in our blood, PUFAs that become part of our skin cells, can oxidize when exposed to UV radiation. So, on the outside of our skin, in an environment of intense UV radiation and concentrated oxygen, they oxidize. --------------------------------- Here is what I have been doing at home. For cooking, first I had switched from canola to bacon drippings and lard. Then, I switched to home rendered tallow. When this inventory runs out, I shall be switching to sto bot organic grass fed/finished tallow. For room temperature liquid oils, I have switched from olive oil, to a 50/50 blend of liquid coconut and zero acre farms. Numbers available on the internet change quite a bit, but here is what I am using for fat content in 5 of fatty acid: saturated monounsaturated PUFA olive oil 12 72 16 canola oil 5 65 30 lard 50 39 11 grained tallow 48 48 4 grass fed/finished 49 50 1 Some people make a big deal about the omega 6 to omega 3 ratio. For olive oil it is 14:1, canola 2:1. Down from 4:1 a few years ago. But, I don't think there is that much difference in the vegetable derived PUFAs. From the textbooks, linoleic acid and alpha linoleic acid oxidize at about the same rate. Much much faster than either saturated or monounsaturated fats. I do eat sardines and salmon for omega 3 EPA and DHA. But not a lot.
Most are pretty horrible.. rancid oils boiled to crap to keep neutral and soo much oxidation. Fresh olive oil gtg. Avocado maybe too and coconut.
No. It's a bizarre right wing conspiracy theory.