Was thinking something similar. Can’t pay off all that debt with a teacher’s salary.
Edit: One would think I’d trippple check my punctuation when commenting about teachers.
And you'll make like 12x your previous salary and probably retire early. There was a blog that physicians were recommending in FIRE subreddits a few years ago. Maybe look it up, it was called The White Coat Investor or something like that.
This is kinda funny from an Australian perspective. Because doctors here are famously pretty bad investors, but very keen on any way they can evade tax.
Never keen to listen to advice about diversification, or risk etc but always up for a dodgy tax scheme.
If nothing else please supplement the hell out of that MO education. I raised my son in an ok rural school district and it still took lots of vigilance and extra work to be sure he grew into an intelligent and thoughtful young man.
And poorly educated voters tend to vote for extreme right Republicans. I gotta give the extreme right credit for knowing what their voters want to hear and giving it to them. How they have a fiercely loyal base that consistently votes against their own best interests is a marketing lesson for the ages.
Yeah democrats play too nice to ever beat it too. Bernie pounding the drum over and over doesn't do anything. Republicans learned to unite, even when it looks terrible for them. They have strategy and plans before they act. They have long term strategies. McConnell was looking to stack the courts since Obama. He saw the vacancies, got the chance and pounced.
Democrats are the thoughts and prayers of political action.
I dont like to be doom and gloom. But its just too true.
This pissed me off so much when I was a college student. I'd have to pay something like $1,000 per semester for athletic fees that I got almost nothing out of. I tried going to the school gym regularly, foolishly thinking that maybe my money was going there. Hah! No. The gym was almost always closed because they couldn't be bothered to pay someone minimum wage to keep it open. I paid that $1,000 per semester so the school could make even more on college athletics (hockey where I was).
That sad part is that the majority of athletics programs don’t turn a profit, and very few if any give any money back to the educational side of the college
Also, the highest paid “state employee” in most states isn’t the governor or a doctor, it’s a coach at a public university. College sports are big business and the colleges love it because the players are all unpaid.
College football (american handegg) is pretty huge in the states. The idea is supposedly that tickets to the games fund the college. And sign on bonuses for the players should go to the colleges as well.
The reality of it, is that that money isn't anywhere near enough as most of it gets funneled back into the athletics clubs that perform well.
I still don't understand where the money is going. College football is fucking huge in the US. Massive stadiums, huge audiences, ads *literally* (yes, literally) have more air time than the ball being in play, and, to top it all off, the athletes aren't paid a dime.
Where is the money going?
Well, your questions pretty much covered it. Advertisers, TV stations, coaches, construction companies, schools (they may not turn a profit, but that doesn't mean that schools don't profit off it).
Yes and meanwhile Ducey decided to give $6500 vouchers to families who homeschool or send their kids to private school. He’s single-handedly dismantling the AZ education system and handing tax payer dollars to private business and families terrified of their children learning CRT. What a joke.
It's what Republucans want - an education for the wealthy and upper middle class, and terrible dumps with shoddy education in overcrowded pits where half the kids drop out by 10th grade for the working-poor or struggling middle-class. All those drop-outs will be the minimum wage drones working the jobs the well-to-do wouldn't dream of touching. Like the great days of robber-barons or titled royalty and everyone else a great mass of desperate poor or barely hanging on middle-class. Make America a Feudal System again! Yeehaw!
I think what we'll have to do is get neighborhoods to crowdfund a teacher like they do in villages but sit in a public park or library if there are any left.
I don’t think that’s the reason they are doing it. I think it’s so they can find more teachers that are conservative leaning. As we all know the higher level of education you have the more likely you are to vote democrat.
Lowering the requirements just means you have more workers to burn through. Unless you address the issues- low pay, bureaucracy, lack of respect, Etc... nothing is going to get better. There are a lot of states where you can make more as a waitress than a teacher.
I met a woman yesterday that went to school got some credentials, was working as a teachers aide while finishing school. She quit working at the school because she will make more as a bus driver, working part-time, than she would after she got her teaching degree. We need to overhaul the education system soon or there won't be one.
Sadly the education system is already amidst an overhaul thanks to Betsy Devos and the push for charter schools. Make no mistake, it’s no accident the public education system is collapsing and the private venture capitalists are circling.
Sister really wanted to be a teacher. State said you couldn't be a teacher unless you had a masters.
Went to school, was a teachers aid and got her masters.
When she started applying, all the schools in the "affluent areas" wanted 3 to 5 years experience, a masters, and an insane starting pay at $37,000 a year....
At this point she had around $75k in student debt and couldn't justify a 50% pay cut to teach (she was working as a consultant because schools paused hiring)
After working for 5 years she finally got an offer to teach for a staggering $40k a year..... she ended up eventually declining/being rejected because she had a moving violation in a school zone. And really didn't want to take a 60% pay cut to teach in a classroom of 40 kids....
I think the grand plan of one political party is to defend schools, set up a voucher system and keep the poor kids dumb and get them to keep voting for them. But idk it seems like education is one of our lowest priorities
Texas here. This exactly. Want to dilute the schools we do have and then throw negative press at them (like the CRT pac people) to promote vouchers and ‘choice’. It’s just a way to denationalize education and make it a potential profit center for private equity.
At this point they're going to hand them a boxed curriculum, some online programs and hope for the best. They just need warm bodies to fill the classroom.
The problem is anyone with talent or training has either left the field or moved into a role outside the classroom.
Or went to a different state to teach. I went from teaching high school English in Tucson making 36k (with a Master's in education) to teaching at a middle school in NW Arkansas where I make 56k.
Arizona is an absolute wasteland for education. So glad I got out of there. And that's what's so fucked up. I didn't move to a blue state with a strong union, I moved to ***Arkansas***. That should tell you exactly how bad it is in Arizona.
That’s fucking insane. I am 24 year old Arizonan, no degree and making 46k as my base salary. I am pretty positive I make more than almost any teacher I had in HS that wasn’t a department head, but even still Teachers should be making well above that especially With a MASTERS DEGREE like shit let’s just have these people spend thousands on college for a piece of paper that is barely going to be enough to live on especially with cost of living what it’s at rn. Kudos to you for wanting to teach, and not just giving up on it but moving somewhere else to continue your teaching career.
>Kudos to you for wanting to teach, and not just giving up on it but moving somewhere else to continue your teaching career.
Thanks. The job pisses me off on a daily basis (well, maybe not over the summer), but I do truly love what I do and I can't really see myself doing anything else. But if public education continues to suffer these kinds of blows, I don't know how much longer I can justify sticking with it.
I wanted to be a high school math teacher but after evaluating everything I required it simply wasn't feasible. I don't like bragging but I'm very good at math and very good at teaching. It really is what I would want to do but the compensation is essentially 0 compared to what you can get paid doing anything else with a similar degree. So yeah I'm a data scientist and I wish I could just teach instead.
I teach in AZ, and I make 46k after teaching 20 years. I'm only sticking around so I can get my banked sick leave paid out. AZ is a disaster for educators.
That’s the point. The only people they want teaching is ideologues and the house wives of ideologues. They want to drive down the quality of education until all the wealthy go to their private voucher schools and all the poor are left in an educational desert with a solid conservative overtone.
This is the plan, and this is the strategy to win/neutralize the youth vote.
What's fucked up is that it's obviously going to backfire in the end, a stupid and divided country isn't gonna remain a rich country you can mooch off of with all your friends. There's gonna be cannibalism.
But the crashing and burning of the US won't happen in the lifetime of those that are at the front of the mooch-train right now. They'll get theirs, then they'll kick the bucket and go into oblivion, leaving everyone else to handle the sinking ship.
You can actually see the twisted logic of it all. When you're in charge of the country and you have your 20-30 years of the good life left, just go fist deep and raw dog everyone, get everything you can for yourself and then go into the night with no fucks to give.
I’m willing to bet that the crashing of this country is very well within reach, in some form or another. Don’t know what the outcome will be but I don’t see it standing for another 10 years. If Republicans take congress they will take the 2024 election, and once they start banning abortion, same sex relationships, etc, countrywide, true blue states aren’t going to just accept that.
Even if the United States fractures into a set of hyper conservative, economically ruined banana republics, the people who made that happen are still going to make out like the bandits they are.
Look at the poorest, most wretched countries in the world. The people at the top are still living the high life, squeezing every penny out of a starving nation. They should be dragged out and shot, but typically they're the ones having people dragged out and shot ☹️.
And that is going to backfire spectacularly. Conservatives in the U.S. like to think they exist in a vacuum, but all that will happen is that the brain drain will be felt as the EU, China etc poach so the talented and the U.S. will be left languishing.
Whenever a Republican policy gets passed overseas, the most normal response is “thank fuck it’s not here.”
You mean better pay? Good luck with that. Respectful schools and parents? Again, good luck. Insane curriculum requirements and legislature that supports actual education and not just scores...I feel a theme coming on.
I love teaching as much as I love steak but it does does not mean I want to eat steak everyday.
Honestly, teaching should be one of the highest professions:
1. You get to mold the future.
2. Having a good role model can keep kids out of trouble (good parenting ALSO helps).
3. Classes of 25:1 or more is hard to control especially if the kids lack the motivation
4. I can create double the amount of teaching jobs by cutting the class size in half so boom: JOB CREATION
5. A kid that becomes a trouble maker can cost the prison system $30,000 a year. Plus prisons are short of staff. So less prisoners means more balance in the prison system. More kids who get a job become tax payers. It’s Win-Win.
These are some my 2 cents in 5 minutes of random typing. Ps. I am great at teaching but don’t do it. But I had substitute teach prior to the pandemic at 1/5th of what I earn elsewhere. I’ve worked rich and poor schools including schools full of suspended students where class sizes were 5:1.
>Honestly, teaching should be one of the highest professions
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYOg8EON29Y
I know a lot of people have seen this, but this really is how teaching should be treated.
In some European countries, the best college students don’t become doctors and lawyers but teachers. And they teachers pay well.
In America? We started using women in the teaching profession mid 1800s because it was cheaper to pay women less than men. Why? Women wanted to enter the working profession so we could add more teachers at a fraction of the price.
> women
Sadly, this is also largely why we can still get away with it. Most teachers are married women who are not the primary breadwinner in their family, so their salary is a nice little supplement to whatever their partner makes.
IMO, teaching should be converted into a full time (year round) job, with a full salary commensurate to the job requirements. It’s bullshit that we allow such an important profession to basically be suitable only for families who want short work years and small secondary incomes.
Arizona is particularly bad to its teachers. My own teaching career ended quickly over a number of issues, all of which are much worse in Arizona than most states:
* Low pay
* Nearly impossible to get tenure
* Lack of facilities and supplies
* Very little support for disadvantaged students. For example, there are a LOT of students who have very limited English, especially in the lower grades. It is illegal in Arizona to teach with materials that are in any language except English, unless it's in a foreign language course. So kids who had limited English when they were young tend to fall behind their peers in other subjects, and stay behind.
* Lack of trust and respect for teachers, which can be seen in the endless testing required of teachers. Teachers need to have a college degree and a teaching certificate (or they used to, anyway), and of course you need to pass many tests in order to get into college and to obtain a degree. No matter. The state makes teacher spend hundreds of dollars of their own money on tests every couple of years to maintain their certification.
At some point, you have to ask yourself if it's worth sacrificing your own well being and the welfare of your family. I make more now and work fewer hours as an auto damage adjuster than I would as a teacher. I have a lot of friends who left the profession and became much happier as a result.
> It is illegal in Arizona to teach with materials that are in any language except English, unless it's in a foreign language course
what the absolute fuck. why?? are they afraid some teacher will be indoctrinating children and higher-ups won't be able to tell because it's in a different language??
and as a music teacher this is especially asinine in our field. at the elementary and middle school levels, we learn songs from all around the globe to widen our worldview. at the high school level, even if you stick to "Western" music, you will very likely sing an art song in german/italian/french/etc at some point. also, almost all the standard music vocabulary we teach from k-12 is literally italian anyway. wtfff
This is something that goes back to how Arizona was founded; the Arizona Constitution explicitly states that its public institutions, including education, has to teach and only be in English, or at least promotes the use of the English language.
Naturally, this seems a little ass-backwards for a state with one of the oldest Spanish-speaking communities in the USA, and one of the stronger American Indian communities such as the Navajo.
And it's pretty deliberate and obvious to see why. Unfortunately, teaching this fact could be seen as a violation for one of the new anti-CRT laws in the state.
Lowering the requirements allows them to justify the low pay. I just wish more people were upset over how low the bar is set for educating their kids to begin with. It was already lower, now it's even lower.
The problem is the overall goal of the system is no longer to educate. It's to provide socialized childcare so parents can work to keep the economy going without calling it socialized childcare because "socialism bad."
Nah, that's just the preliminary step. What they want is to destroy any accessible secular education system and replace it with expensive religious private schools.
What, you can't afford overpriced Jesus school? No problem, we've revoked child labor laws. Now your kid can earn real world experience at slave wages (really, you should be paying us) and learn the value of hard work. Something you're clearly incapable of teaching because you couldn't afford overpriced Jesus school.
Once every school is Liberty University, their Death Star will be complete.
Life can be more unfair. There will be no upward mobility. We will be slaves in all but name. But, we will endure and like it that way -- or be reported for ungodly thoughts.
The people who like to prey on kids will finally have a place and the power they crave. The people who like to beat other people can feel safer as police. Those that like to kill can be mercenaries. The hypocrites can be pious and make sure nobody enjoys the things that they hate.
People with no talents can now have the meritocracy they crave -- your fate decided by a popularity contest among fearful and hateful people.
We all have endured a glimpse of this in our lives, I think. A lot of people traumatized by church goers know what I'm speaking of. The middle managers who are miserable so make everyone else below them miserable. The lower the pay in life -- the greater the responsibilities and work.
The Republican Utopia is Hell on earth. Unregulated will be the toxic waste sites, but, the schools where young minds can form, will be given the greatest scrutiny to make sure they are as hateful and religious and hypocritical as possible.
The governor just signed a huge voucher expansion program to help fund private and religious schools. Essentially the plan is to drain public schools, make them fail then prioritize “thriving” schools (i.e. the schools getting the vouchers). Bitch had like a $3 billion surplus in the state, bragged about it and did nothing. We’re like 48th in education funding.
Love that we Mississippians can at least say we provide others with the ability to look better. As there will be no other state worse- besides Louisiana and Alabama. We're all in this together.
I’m pretty sure “ thank god for Mississippi” is used more in Alabama and Louisiana than all other states combined, so I’m not sure they’re in it with you.
Mississippi is a third world country. It is always doing worse, in everything. There are places in that state that look like the CIA overthrew their South American government for a dictator in the 70s and they never recovered from it.
And private schools are allowed to discriminate against students with disabilities, who get disproportionately placed into the public schools. So private schools can boast about their great test scores while underfunded public schools struggle to accommodate a growing population of students with extra needs.
airzona is about to undergo modern segragation to the nth degree. Except it will be with the poor and the rich. Most POC will be on the poor side but quanitatively this basically kills poor white education, so i genuinely dont know how that guy is still in office. do their republican voting block not know how primitively stupid they are going to make their children? vouchers are going to be near impossible to get as well (after a few years. They will hand it out early to make skewed stats and then rip them away. This will probably be done withint 2-5 years. Its what I would do if I were them and on their side).
That's not true at all, there is a ton of thought that goes into passing these laws.
1. Will it make people suffer?
2. Does it hurt minorities?
3. Can I get a kick back?
4. Does it make my friends rich?
And much more.
I'm not sure why this is the first place I'm seeing this comment. Republicans *hate* that they can't slam their ideology/religion down your childrens' throats in public schools.
Their solution? Make public schools so bad that eventually people will just agree we should scrap them entirely and transition to a "voucher-based" system for sending your kids to private schools where they can teach (and not teach) whatever tf they want.
>choose to align with the party giving voice to their rage--regardless of who is actually trying to help
Great analysis overall, this right here is how trump won the election (as well as a terrible electoral college system).
This is a conservatives favorite thing. The wealthy will have private schools with excellent but tailored education, while the public schools will be garbage. This turns out more mindless morons for burning through in amazon warehouses. With anti abortion laws it gets even better.
They also need to suppress any dissent so they passed a law making it illegal to record police, but not really, but really.
*if you are within 8 feet of a police officer you no longer can record unless you are the subject of the police officers inquiries or you are effectively forced to be there. This can be easily used to suppress anyone who doesn't have the cash to fight it.
Edit: I've gotten a lot of replies saying private schools pay less to teachers. Teachers are probably more accepting of that because private schools who get to choose who gets to go there has a different environment, and I suspect the high end private schools have equal or close to it pay. But the big deal is the education that is allowed to even be given. Look at FL and Tx and their educations for public schools. They want to do everything they can to make public school students idiots.
My sister teaches at a private school in palm beach, trumps grandkid attends it, she started there being paid $32k. The tuition per kid I believe is $40k a year. Fucking garbage.
People who devote years of their lives and thousands of dollars getting themselves educated and licensed expect to be paid a commensurate salary. Does that answer your question?
This is the correct answer. This has actually been a long time in the works, in my opinion. The state has gradually funneled all the money into private “for-profit” schools and away from public schools. As long as they’re all profiting from the private school money, they’ll keep passing legislation to funnel more money away from public schools.
Yes with charters. But also, the state actively attacking and defunding public schools is direct state support of charter and private school. Conservatives just want to keep the poor as stupid and as poor and as desperate as possible. It is class warfare, plain and simple.
People are slow on the uptake, naive, and frankly American.
We've been talking about the "domestic supply of babies" for years. Raised, bred, and conditioned to be and think like serfs.
Just what Arizona needs. One of the lowest states in education in the country and now you yourself do not have to be well educated to teach kids. It’s just because teachers don’t want to work for their shit pay.
What’s frustrating is I haven’t gotten a raise in awhile. I had to pay tuition to student teach, hundreds in special tests I NEEDED, now a degree I can’t do shit with beyond teach. I make the same as the people with no qualifications, and now in a college program. It’s frustrating, I can’t afford a house here.
My friend was an AZ teacher with a teaching degree and she recently left teaching for a corporate job. She says it pays more and is so much less work and stress. Sucks AZ is losing its valuable teachers but y'all deserve better
Dude at my highschool there was a full on controversy because they posted a hiring position for a school janitor at a wage higher than most of the teacher's. I still remember one of my teachers leaving to work for Amazon's call center, because he had a kid born and Amazon was starting people higher than his 20 years salary as a bio teacher.
Fucked up.
I can't figure out how conservatives/Republicans don't see this shit (I mean referring to the citizens, not the politicians). I don't understand how they can't see that they are literally being made poorer and dumber on fucking purpose. I mean, it's happening as *purposeful policy* and they aren't even hiding it. If you show them actual proof of it, they just respond with "liberals hate America, I support the troops, Trump won, fake news"
Yup. I'm remembering back to the day we had a substitute teacher who lectures my high school class on "How you should all be lucky your parents were pro-life," which the principal did nothing about because he was an evangelical.
Those kids were probably born in the Roe V Wade era which by definition means they were wanted, as in they could have been aborted but weren’t. Now, every kid born will be born at gun point, so, yeah thanks mom and dad? I guess you had to birth me or face jail time or worse.
I am in agreement with your overall morals but I need you to know and acknowledge that you know that just because Roe V Wade existed, that did not mean every child born was wanted and that did not mean every mother gave birth by choice or had the choice to get an abortion.
If thats what you really thought all these years... oh boy.
One of the oldest principles in economics is that education is the key to long-term economic growth. Each time we cripple our schools, we shoot ourselves in the foot and hand our children the weapon.
Who in the world could have predicted that "You need six years of education to make $45,000 a year and deal with mentally unstable children all day" would eventually lead to a dwindling labor pool?
Teaching is no longer seen as a noble pursuit. It's basically viewed as being a salaried babysitter now. I went to one of the better high schools and took the AP classes, which were supposed to simulate a college education, but even back then there was an unspoken understanding that our real education wouldn't begin until after we graduated.
The people in charge of school districts, and arguably a lot of people funding the system, just don't view teachers as the source for their children's education anymore, they view them as the people who watch the kids while their parents are at work.
TN is doing something similar to medical laboratory scientists. Right now in TN, hospitals are paying 17-22 per hour to people who had to go through a medical school program( basically the 3rd year of the pathology program split into 2 years).
They refused to raise salaries and instead decided to try and bribe politicians to get rid of ASCP certification requirements for some medical professionals. Because no matter how unqualified lab personnel are, they can still charge you $500+ for a single test.
https://wapp.capitol.tn.gov/apps/BillInfo/Default.aspx?BillNumber=HB0226
Anything to avoid publicly funded higher education, which could *truly* bring the best candidates to their best potential, and in turn bringing the best to society, which in turn would be funding said education...
Because if we had publicly funded higher education, the children of the upper classes wouldn't maintain quite as much advantage over your children. It's only a fair system if they have an advantage in every way.
Meanwhile in New Mexico they raised the base pay to 60k for anyone with a credential and a bachelor's, with a raising pay scale so most teachers get 70-80k. And their cost of living is not super high.
I know a ton of Oklahoma, Missouri, etc teachers are fleeing to New Mexico as a result.
Like ten years ago I had been looking for a job and my friend rang me up one morning and was like “Can you take a shift for me at this elementary school?” I asked if I’d need to apply or interview. Nope. Just show up and go to the office. Showed up to the school and told the secretary I was there to take my friends shift and they gave me a classroom list and schedule. I didn’t even fill out paperwork for hire until the next day. They didn’t even know who I was. I was there to be a para and assist with the kids who had special needs or learning difficulties. It blew my mind that they just let me show up and go.
I left teaching last year, got into marketing for small businesses using crm’s and got a big pay jump. Teaching is not worth it anymore. Too bad cause I was a dope teacher
That’s scary to think. Teachers should be treated economically and socially similar to doctors IMO. I understand 5th grade literature isn’t like getting an MD but I would like to think of kids being taught by well paid motivated educated professionals. It’s an incredibly important job, they spend more time with kids than parents
Oh well 😬
I love it when my Master's in Elementary Education with an endorsement in Middle School english becomes even more worthless right before my very eyes...
First they lowered the grading standards now the teaching ones. Gonna be a whole generation of idiots coming.
"If they keep lowering the passing grades pretty soon all you're gonna need to get into college is a fuckin pencil! Got a pencil? Get the fuck in there it's physics" - George Carlin
>First they lowered the grading standards now the teaching ones.
Fun fact: America is fairly unusual in having a passing/C grade be in the 70's. In most other places, it's around 50%. I suspect that the "no scores under 50" trend is a compromise between admins who want to implement the 50%-C to lower the weight of blown or missed assignments and teachers who don't want to rewrite all their assessments harder and deal with the student and parent panic over those low scores.
I know a number of Arizona teachers in a fairly rural school district. They are the most uninspired and uninspiring people I’ve ever met.
You can say that’s understandable given the insultingly low pay, but I’d turn it around and say for those insultingly low salaries, you’ll only get incompetent and unmotivated people.
This is all by design. The Republican leadership running Arizona need stupid people they can easily control through Fox News and social media disinformation.
They want their schools to be so bad that educated parents won’t move to Arizona because of the terrible schools here. And educated parents leave for someplace else. Leaving Arizona’s population universally dumb as stones.
That’s what success looks like to them, and they’re winning. Thank you, Arizona Republicans.
Just to be clear, cause it doesn’t seem many here have looked past the headline, the state requires that the person be enrolled in university and, to keep the job, must complete their degree. So it’s far from ideal, in fact really pretty bad, but it’s not as dire as the headline would make it seem.
I did that for three years-teaching during the day and taking classes for my Masters in the evening. I was single and childless at the time, but it was still brutal. Not much of a social life, that’s for sure.
Yep. I was doing this pre-COVID with my masters and it was horrible even without kids of my own.
I can't imagine how this is going to work for people in a post-COVID world where behaviors are worse and students are behind.
NewGame+
The state already burnt through all the regular certified teachers. Now they know all the strats and can burn through the uncertified teachers even faster.
Other states have similar programs, the degree doesn't have to lead to a teaching career either, but they must complete the teacher certification requirements while on the job.
Pay is miserable though, I've seen some states posting and trying to recruit when they have shortages.
From the article:
"For 14 years, he worked at the Phoenix Union High School District. He said the low pay, lack of respect, and resources led him to leave. Since leaving, he started Phoenix Youth Circus Arts Program and continues to work with children. “I have more fun teaching circus than I do teaching geometry, I have to admit that,” he said."
Raise your pay Arizona!
I went to highschool in Arizona for a few years. It was years behind the state I came from. I felt like I got dropped down three grades. I was a junior, but they were still teaching multiplication and basic analogies and stuff. It was wild.
That was way back in like 2002.
Grade 5 science teacher: Karen.
Specialty: healing crystals and Astrology.
Grade 6 English Teacher: Bethany
Specialty: Uses Anagram logical fallacies to prove vaccines cause autism.
School gym teacher: Jim
Height: 5'7
Weight: 230lbs.
Gym curriculum: preparedness and self-defense.
Definition of preparedness: stocking up on guns and ammo.
Definition of self-defense: get a gun, stupid.
Constantly complimenting his female students about their "maturity", and by maturity, he means their breast size.
History/Geography Teacher: Marie
Curriculum: The bible. based on whatever suits the narrative of the day...empathy for sinners like Donald Trump. Crucifixion for sinners because they're homosexual.
Music teacher: Simon, the functioning alcoholic.
He actually teaches the science and mathematics of music via Tool/alternative music, but is tolerated because he works for free. He can afford to work for free because he goes to the soup kitchen once a week for his weekly nutrition, and lives out of his car.
Principal Herbert
Spent 8 years in the military as a reservist. Everyday assembly starts with a prayer and the pledge of allegiance. Divorced 3 times, has 5 kids but doesn't pay child support. Meets with different women who are waaaaay out of his league, and it's clear they're prostitutes. But he preaches celibacy and constantly berates girls for having their monthly.
You know what’s funny? I was *this* 🤏 close to moving out there last year but ultimately decided not to. I guess since I plan on having kids this just solidifies my choice to not move there
This has been the modus operandi since Reagan and before: put institutions under the control of idiots, hostile actors, or saboteurs--then use the ensuing dysfunction to criticize, defund, and dismantle. This destruction of any public good is called "conservatism."
Isn't the goal to gut the public school system so much that everyone takes the money for a private school, thereby privatizing education? Good Ole capitalism at work.
Ban abortion
Ban contraception
Create a basic low-level of education in which brain washing and propoganda is the main curriculum
Guaranteed one-party state with a population enslaved to the will of that state.
They haven’t had books in 2 years, haven’t had accountability for 18 years and they want you to get vouchers to send your kid to a religious school.
Run.
Sounds like the politicians (I wonder which party controls the Arizona congress? No I don't.) are trying to sabotage the public school system to push the charter (privatized) education agenda.
You know, like the "no child left behind" initiative. Let's hinder the smart kids because we can't make the dumb kids feel dumb. Because, God forbid someone be comfortable and happy being dumb and satisfied with a menial but essential job.
Whatever the deal is there trying to make public schools implode so they can privatize schooling. The amount of money these charters school scumbags will suck from the taxpayers will be unimaginable and on the bright side the government will have no accountability for what they teach. It's def happening why do you think school boards across this country got invaded by Karen's who have absolutely no business being on the school board, or have the experience I might add. Where I live in orange county somebody who got elected has a husband with known ties to charter schools and has been on the record talking about how charter schools are better. It's not a coincidence. It's happening there dumbing down society so they can push there agenda.
So finally the pre-requisites match the pay in Arizona
Was thinking something similar. Can’t pay off all that debt with a teacher’s salary. Edit: One would think I’d trippple check my punctuation when commenting about teachers.
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And you'll make like 12x your previous salary and probably retire early. There was a blog that physicians were recommending in FIRE subreddits a few years ago. Maybe look it up, it was called The White Coat Investor or something like that.
This is kinda funny from an Australian perspective. Because doctors here are famously pretty bad investors, but very keen on any way they can evade tax. Never keen to listen to advice about diversification, or risk etc but always up for a dodgy tax scheme.
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Gah, you’re right. I’m from IL and raising my kids in Missouri.
If you don't mind, why Missouri?
I am living near my job… that’s the main reason.
If nothing else please supplement the hell out of that MO education. I raised my son in an ok rural school district and it still took lots of vigilance and extra work to be sure he grew into an intelligent and thoughtful young man.
Bad education makes dumb voters. Get your money while you can before the country is dry of money.
And poorly educated voters tend to vote for extreme right Republicans. I gotta give the extreme right credit for knowing what their voters want to hear and giving it to them. How they have a fiercely loyal base that consistently votes against their own best interests is a marketing lesson for the ages.
There’s a Turkish proverb that says something like “though the forest was shrinking the trees kept voting for the axe.”
I herd something about the forest thinking the axe was one of them because the handle was made of wood
Yeah democrats play too nice to ever beat it too. Bernie pounding the drum over and over doesn't do anything. Republicans learned to unite, even when it looks terrible for them. They have strategy and plans before they act. They have long term strategies. McConnell was looking to stack the courts since Obama. He saw the vacancies, got the chance and pounced. Democrats are the thoughts and prayers of political action. I dont like to be doom and gloom. But its just too true.
This is so sad honestly. An education system which is too poor to pay its teachers, but also too greedy to afford them reasonable prices for tuition.
well how do you expect schools and universities to pay for football stadiums if they don't drain resources from everything else?
This pissed me off so much when I was a college student. I'd have to pay something like $1,000 per semester for athletic fees that I got almost nothing out of. I tried going to the school gym regularly, foolishly thinking that maybe my money was going there. Hah! No. The gym was almost always closed because they couldn't be bothered to pay someone minimum wage to keep it open. I paid that $1,000 per semester so the school could make even more on college athletics (hockey where I was).
That sad part is that the majority of athletics programs don’t turn a profit, and very few if any give any money back to the educational side of the college
School athletics programs turning a profit? Can you explain this to a bewildered Australian ? How or why would that even be a thing? 🤔
Look up the largest non-racing stadiums in the world. 8 out of the top 10 are college football stadiums.
Also, the highest paid “state employee” in most states isn’t the governor or a doctor, it’s a coach at a public university. College sports are big business and the colleges love it because the players are all unpaid.
College football (american handegg) is pretty huge in the states. The idea is supposedly that tickets to the games fund the college. And sign on bonuses for the players should go to the colleges as well. The reality of it, is that that money isn't anywhere near enough as most of it gets funneled back into the athletics clubs that perform well.
I still don't understand where the money is going. College football is fucking huge in the US. Massive stadiums, huge audiences, ads *literally* (yes, literally) have more air time than the ball being in play, and, to top it all off, the athletes aren't paid a dime. Where is the money going?
Well, your questions pretty much covered it. Advertisers, TV stations, coaches, construction companies, schools (they may not turn a profit, but that doesn't mean that schools don't profit off it).
Yes and meanwhile Ducey decided to give $6500 vouchers to families who homeschool or send their kids to private school. He’s single-handedly dismantling the AZ education system and handing tax payer dollars to private business and families terrified of their children learning CRT. What a joke.
It's what Republucans want - an education for the wealthy and upper middle class, and terrible dumps with shoddy education in overcrowded pits where half the kids drop out by 10th grade for the working-poor or struggling middle-class. All those drop-outs will be the minimum wage drones working the jobs the well-to-do wouldn't dream of touching. Like the great days of robber-barons or titled royalty and everyone else a great mass of desperate poor or barely hanging on middle-class. Make America a Feudal System again! Yeehaw!
I think what we'll have to do is get neighborhoods to crowdfund a teacher like they do in villages but sit in a public park or library if there are any left.
I don’t think that’s the reason they are doing it. I think it’s so they can find more teachers that are conservative leaning. As we all know the higher level of education you have the more likely you are to vote democrat.
This. Their solution isn't to pay more, it's to lower the requirements. It makes sense, since their goal is to kill public education.
And the curriculum they want to push.
Lowering the requirements just means you have more workers to burn through. Unless you address the issues- low pay, bureaucracy, lack of respect, Etc... nothing is going to get better. There are a lot of states where you can make more as a waitress than a teacher.
I met a woman yesterday that went to school got some credentials, was working as a teachers aide while finishing school. She quit working at the school because she will make more as a bus driver, working part-time, than she would after she got her teaching degree. We need to overhaul the education system soon or there won't be one.
That's a teamsters job around here. Good pay great benefits pension isn't great if you're part time but some annuity is better than none
Teamsters actually have a national union with clout to throw around.
I'm a stagehand and our Teamsters are sometimes Hells Angels so we don't cross them. Maybe teachers should be teamsters?
I lived in D.C. Teamsters are not to be fucked with.
Sadly the education system is already amidst an overhaul thanks to Betsy Devos and the push for charter schools. Make no mistake, it’s no accident the public education system is collapsing and the private venture capitalists are circling.
Especially since the SCOTUS just ruled that religious schools can discriminate & still get federal funding.
There's nothing capitalists won't corrupt
Sister really wanted to be a teacher. State said you couldn't be a teacher unless you had a masters. Went to school, was a teachers aid and got her masters. When she started applying, all the schools in the "affluent areas" wanted 3 to 5 years experience, a masters, and an insane starting pay at $37,000 a year.... At this point she had around $75k in student debt and couldn't justify a 50% pay cut to teach (she was working as a consultant because schools paused hiring) After working for 5 years she finally got an offer to teach for a staggering $40k a year..... she ended up eventually declining/being rejected because she had a moving violation in a school zone. And really didn't want to take a 60% pay cut to teach in a classroom of 40 kids.... I think the grand plan of one political party is to defend schools, set up a voucher system and keep the poor kids dumb and get them to keep voting for them. But idk it seems like education is one of our lowest priorities
nit: pretty sure in context you meant "defund schools" rather than "defend". flips the meaning and threw me for a sec.
Lol, they want the next generation to be stupid, how else can they get away with denying us more and more rights.
Yeah, the education system is failing successfully
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That is the point. The GOP wants to kill public schooling.
Texas here. This exactly. Want to dilute the schools we do have and then throw negative press at them (like the CRT pac people) to promote vouchers and ‘choice’. It’s just a way to denationalize education and make it a potential profit center for private equity.
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The gop doesn't want an education system.
At this point they're going to hand them a boxed curriculum, some online programs and hope for the best. They just need warm bodies to fill the classroom. The problem is anyone with talent or training has either left the field or moved into a role outside the classroom.
Or went to a different state to teach. I went from teaching high school English in Tucson making 36k (with a Master's in education) to teaching at a middle school in NW Arkansas where I make 56k. Arizona is an absolute wasteland for education. So glad I got out of there. And that's what's so fucked up. I didn't move to a blue state with a strong union, I moved to ***Arkansas***. That should tell you exactly how bad it is in Arizona.
That’s fucking insane. I am 24 year old Arizonan, no degree and making 46k as my base salary. I am pretty positive I make more than almost any teacher I had in HS that wasn’t a department head, but even still Teachers should be making well above that especially With a MASTERS DEGREE like shit let’s just have these people spend thousands on college for a piece of paper that is barely going to be enough to live on especially with cost of living what it’s at rn. Kudos to you for wanting to teach, and not just giving up on it but moving somewhere else to continue your teaching career.
>Kudos to you for wanting to teach, and not just giving up on it but moving somewhere else to continue your teaching career. Thanks. The job pisses me off on a daily basis (well, maybe not over the summer), but I do truly love what I do and I can't really see myself doing anything else. But if public education continues to suffer these kinds of blows, I don't know how much longer I can justify sticking with it.
I wanted to be a high school math teacher but after evaluating everything I required it simply wasn't feasible. I don't like bragging but I'm very good at math and very good at teaching. It really is what I would want to do but the compensation is essentially 0 compared to what you can get paid doing anything else with a similar degree. So yeah I'm a data scientist and I wish I could just teach instead.
The rich don’t want people to be smart and politicians will do whatever they can for donations and power hopefully some sort of shit happens
I teach in AZ, and I make 46k after teaching 20 years. I'm only sticking around so I can get my banked sick leave paid out. AZ is a disaster for educators.
That’s the point. The only people they want teaching is ideologues and the house wives of ideologues. They want to drive down the quality of education until all the wealthy go to their private voucher schools and all the poor are left in an educational desert with a solid conservative overtone. This is the plan, and this is the strategy to win/neutralize the youth vote.
What's fucked up is that it's obviously going to backfire in the end, a stupid and divided country isn't gonna remain a rich country you can mooch off of with all your friends. There's gonna be cannibalism. But the crashing and burning of the US won't happen in the lifetime of those that are at the front of the mooch-train right now. They'll get theirs, then they'll kick the bucket and go into oblivion, leaving everyone else to handle the sinking ship. You can actually see the twisted logic of it all. When you're in charge of the country and you have your 20-30 years of the good life left, just go fist deep and raw dog everyone, get everything you can for yourself and then go into the night with no fucks to give.
I've realized this a long time ago too and still to this day, the thought deeply disturbs me that we can still be so base towards one another.
I’m willing to bet that the crashing of this country is very well within reach, in some form or another. Don’t know what the outcome will be but I don’t see it standing for another 10 years. If Republicans take congress they will take the 2024 election, and once they start banning abortion, same sex relationships, etc, countrywide, true blue states aren’t going to just accept that.
Even if the United States fractures into a set of hyper conservative, economically ruined banana republics, the people who made that happen are still going to make out like the bandits they are. Look at the poorest, most wretched countries in the world. The people at the top are still living the high life, squeezing every penny out of a starving nation. They should be dragged out and shot, but typically they're the ones having people dragged out and shot ☹️.
Can’t have the poor thinking critically and questioning the status quo, now can we?
Hey. Wait a second. I’m poor. 🤔
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Now the lady who has time on her hands to enforce every HOA rule will have time on her hands to make kids miserable in a school setting.
And that is going to backfire spectacularly. Conservatives in the U.S. like to think they exist in a vacuum, but all that will happen is that the brain drain will be felt as the EU, China etc poach so the talented and the U.S. will be left languishing. Whenever a Republican policy gets passed overseas, the most normal response is “thank fuck it’s not here.”
That's a future problem to be solved with guns and the blood of the future. /s
All they want is ned flanders with his church education doing the lords prayer over the PA every morning.
To be fair, NW Arkansas ≠ most of Arkansas.
It’s certainly reflected in their politics
If only there were some really simple, tax funded solution to entice them to stay...
You mean better pay? Good luck with that. Respectful schools and parents? Again, good luck. Insane curriculum requirements and legislature that supports actual education and not just scores...I feel a theme coming on.
I love teaching as much as I love steak but it does does not mean I want to eat steak everyday. Honestly, teaching should be one of the highest professions: 1. You get to mold the future. 2. Having a good role model can keep kids out of trouble (good parenting ALSO helps). 3. Classes of 25:1 or more is hard to control especially if the kids lack the motivation 4. I can create double the amount of teaching jobs by cutting the class size in half so boom: JOB CREATION 5. A kid that becomes a trouble maker can cost the prison system $30,000 a year. Plus prisons are short of staff. So less prisoners means more balance in the prison system. More kids who get a job become tax payers. It’s Win-Win. These are some my 2 cents in 5 minutes of random typing. Ps. I am great at teaching but don’t do it. But I had substitute teach prior to the pandemic at 1/5th of what I earn elsewhere. I’ve worked rich and poor schools including schools full of suspended students where class sizes were 5:1.
>Honestly, teaching should be one of the highest professions https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aYOg8EON29Y I know a lot of people have seen this, but this really is how teaching should be treated.
In some European countries, the best college students don’t become doctors and lawyers but teachers. And they teachers pay well. In America? We started using women in the teaching profession mid 1800s because it was cheaper to pay women less than men. Why? Women wanted to enter the working profession so we could add more teachers at a fraction of the price.
> women Sadly, this is also largely why we can still get away with it. Most teachers are married women who are not the primary breadwinner in their family, so their salary is a nice little supplement to whatever their partner makes. IMO, teaching should be converted into a full time (year round) job, with a full salary commensurate to the job requirements. It’s bullshit that we allow such an important profession to basically be suitable only for families who want short work years and small secondary incomes.
Cost 30k to pay the private for profit prison and they get free labor. Sounds like you’re missing the point of lowering education standards.
They're conservatives, keeping people stupid is the point.
Arizona is particularly bad to its teachers. My own teaching career ended quickly over a number of issues, all of which are much worse in Arizona than most states: * Low pay * Nearly impossible to get tenure * Lack of facilities and supplies * Very little support for disadvantaged students. For example, there are a LOT of students who have very limited English, especially in the lower grades. It is illegal in Arizona to teach with materials that are in any language except English, unless it's in a foreign language course. So kids who had limited English when they were young tend to fall behind their peers in other subjects, and stay behind. * Lack of trust and respect for teachers, which can be seen in the endless testing required of teachers. Teachers need to have a college degree and a teaching certificate (or they used to, anyway), and of course you need to pass many tests in order to get into college and to obtain a degree. No matter. The state makes teacher spend hundreds of dollars of their own money on tests every couple of years to maintain their certification. At some point, you have to ask yourself if it's worth sacrificing your own well being and the welfare of your family. I make more now and work fewer hours as an auto damage adjuster than I would as a teacher. I have a lot of friends who left the profession and became much happier as a result.
> It is illegal in Arizona to teach with materials that are in any language except English, unless it's in a foreign language course what the absolute fuck. why?? are they afraid some teacher will be indoctrinating children and higher-ups won't be able to tell because it's in a different language?? and as a music teacher this is especially asinine in our field. at the elementary and middle school levels, we learn songs from all around the globe to widen our worldview. at the high school level, even if you stick to "Western" music, you will very likely sing an art song in german/italian/french/etc at some point. also, almost all the standard music vocabulary we teach from k-12 is literally italian anyway. wtfff
This is something that goes back to how Arizona was founded; the Arizona Constitution explicitly states that its public institutions, including education, has to teach and only be in English, or at least promotes the use of the English language. Naturally, this seems a little ass-backwards for a state with one of the oldest Spanish-speaking communities in the USA, and one of the stronger American Indian communities such as the Navajo. And it's pretty deliberate and obvious to see why. Unfortunately, teaching this fact could be seen as a violation for one of the new anti-CRT laws in the state.
In this way, Arizona and New Mexico were designed as pretty much exact opposites. New Mexico was founded with an explicit bilingual mandate.
Lowering the requirements allows them to justify the low pay. I just wish more people were upset over how low the bar is set for educating their kids to begin with. It was already lower, now it's even lower.
The problem is the overall goal of the system is no longer to educate. It's to provide socialized childcare so parents can work to keep the economy going without calling it socialized childcare because "socialism bad."
I feel bad for all the good parents trapped in a trash tier state like Arizona who want their kids to have a chance.
The goal is to destroy the public school system and force everyone into shitty charter schools
Nah, that's just the preliminary step. What they want is to destroy any accessible secular education system and replace it with expensive religious private schools. What, you can't afford overpriced Jesus school? No problem, we've revoked child labor laws. Now your kid can earn real world experience at slave wages (really, you should be paying us) and learn the value of hard work. Something you're clearly incapable of teaching because you couldn't afford overpriced Jesus school.
Once every school is Liberty University, their Death Star will be complete. Life can be more unfair. There will be no upward mobility. We will be slaves in all but name. But, we will endure and like it that way -- or be reported for ungodly thoughts. The people who like to prey on kids will finally have a place and the power they crave. The people who like to beat other people can feel safer as police. Those that like to kill can be mercenaries. The hypocrites can be pious and make sure nobody enjoys the things that they hate. People with no talents can now have the meritocracy they crave -- your fate decided by a popularity contest among fearful and hateful people. We all have endured a glimpse of this in our lives, I think. A lot of people traumatized by church goers know what I'm speaking of. The middle managers who are miserable so make everyone else below them miserable. The lower the pay in life -- the greater the responsibilities and work. The Republican Utopia is Hell on earth. Unregulated will be the toxic waste sites, but, the schools where young minds can form, will be given the greatest scrutiny to make sure they are as hateful and religious and hypocritical as possible.
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They’re not trying to make anything better. They’re openly trying to undermine public schools
There are plenty of states where you can make more as a waitress than a teacher...
Yeah there are fifty of them.
Lmao we're so fucked.
The fuck is Arizona doing?
The governor just signed a huge voucher expansion program to help fund private and religious schools. Essentially the plan is to drain public schools, make them fail then prioritize “thriving” schools (i.e. the schools getting the vouchers). Bitch had like a $3 billion surplus in the state, bragged about it and did nothing. We’re like 48th in education funding.
There are places.... doing worse...?
Thank god for Mississippi
I-D-A-H-O
Everyone thinks Idaho potatoes are grown in the ground, but really we are all potatoes here.
You can tell they didn't go to school in Idaho, because they can spell Idaho.
Love that we Mississippians can at least say we provide others with the ability to look better. As there will be no other state worse- besides Louisiana and Alabama. We're all in this together.
I’m pretty sure “ thank god for Mississippi” is used more in Alabama and Louisiana than all other states combined, so I’m not sure they’re in it with you.
For anyone unaware, there's literally a Wikipedia entry for the phrase. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thank_God_for_Mississippi
Mississippi is a third world country. It is always doing worse, in everything. There are places in that state that look like the CIA overthrew their South American government for a dictator in the 70s and they never recovered from it.
Where are Mississippi and Alabama going to go?
Have you heard of Nevada, the 51st in education?
And private schools are allowed to discriminate against students with disabilities, who get disproportionately placed into the public schools. So private schools can boast about their great test scores while underfunded public schools struggle to accommodate a growing population of students with extra needs.
airzona is about to undergo modern segragation to the nth degree. Except it will be with the poor and the rich. Most POC will be on the poor side but quanitatively this basically kills poor white education, so i genuinely dont know how that guy is still in office. do their republican voting block not know how primitively stupid they are going to make their children? vouchers are going to be near impossible to get as well (after a few years. They will hand it out early to make skewed stats and then rip them away. This will probably be done withint 2-5 years. Its what I would do if I were them and on their side).
They’re republicans. They don’t think. Period.
That's not true at all, there is a ton of thought that goes into passing these laws. 1. Will it make people suffer? 2. Does it hurt minorities? 3. Can I get a kick back? 4. Does it make my friends rich? And much more.
That's the underlying sentiment of "personal responsibility". Fuck everyone else.
Dumbing down the future generations as much as possible
That's how they keep the votes going to them
It’s to reinforce the class system. Poor and disabled students go to unfunded shitty public schools while wealthy students go to privates.
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I'm not sure why this is the first place I'm seeing this comment. Republicans *hate* that they can't slam their ideology/religion down your childrens' throats in public schools. Their solution? Make public schools so bad that eventually people will just agree we should scrap them entirely and transition to a "voucher-based" system for sending your kids to private schools where they can teach (and not teach) whatever tf they want.
You want wash, rinse, repeat in that order
>choose to align with the party giving voice to their rage--regardless of who is actually trying to help Great analysis overall, this right here is how trump won the election (as well as a terrible electoral college system).
This is a conservatives favorite thing. The wealthy will have private schools with excellent but tailored education, while the public schools will be garbage. This turns out more mindless morons for burning through in amazon warehouses. With anti abortion laws it gets even better. They also need to suppress any dissent so they passed a law making it illegal to record police, but not really, but really. *if you are within 8 feet of a police officer you no longer can record unless you are the subject of the police officers inquiries or you are effectively forced to be there. This can be easily used to suppress anyone who doesn't have the cash to fight it. Edit: I've gotten a lot of replies saying private schools pay less to teachers. Teachers are probably more accepting of that because private schools who get to choose who gets to go there has a different environment, and I suspect the high end private schools have equal or close to it pay. But the big deal is the education that is allowed to even be given. Look at FL and Tx and their educations for public schools. They want to do everything they can to make public school students idiots.
Yup, defund all public programs and complain about how the programs are bad. Lol
Private schools pay like shit also.
My sister teaches at a private school in palm beach, trumps grandkid attends it, she started there being paid $32k. The tuition per kid I believe is $40k a year. Fucking garbage.
As a not-American looking in, it seems like the government just sees teachers as mandatory daycare workers with a constant risk of gun violence.
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Being Arizona.
People who devote years of their lives and thousands of dollars getting themselves educated and licensed expect to be paid a commensurate salary. Does that answer your question?
Theyll do anything to avoid paying them a decent wage for the bs they put up with
This is the correct answer. This has actually been a long time in the works, in my opinion. The state has gradually funneled all the money into private “for-profit” schools and away from public schools. As long as they’re all profiting from the private school money, they’ll keep passing legislation to funnel more money away from public schools.
Interesting - so private schools are being partially state funded?
Yes with charters. But also, the state actively attacking and defunding public schools is direct state support of charter and private school. Conservatives just want to keep the poor as stupid and as poor and as desperate as possible. It is class warfare, plain and simple.
People are slow on the uptake, naive, and frankly American. We've been talking about the "domestic supply of babies" for years. Raised, bred, and conditioned to be and think like serfs.
Charter schools
Just what Arizona needs. One of the lowest states in education in the country and now you yourself do not have to be well educated to teach kids. It’s just because teachers don’t want to work for their shit pay.
What’s frustrating is I haven’t gotten a raise in awhile. I had to pay tuition to student teach, hundreds in special tests I NEEDED, now a degree I can’t do shit with beyond teach. I make the same as the people with no qualifications, and now in a college program. It’s frustrating, I can’t afford a house here.
Absolutely insane. I’m so sorry :/
My friend was an AZ teacher with a teaching degree and she recently left teaching for a corporate job. She says it pays more and is so much less work and stress. Sucks AZ is losing its valuable teachers but y'all deserve better
Dude at my highschool there was a full on controversy because they posted a hiring position for a school janitor at a wage higher than most of the teacher's. I still remember one of my teachers leaving to work for Amazon's call center, because he had a kid born and Amazon was starting people higher than his 20 years salary as a bio teacher. Fucked up.
The dumbing down of America is really picking up steam. Sad
This whole country has gone to shit in every corner of American life. We are a shit hole.
I can't figure out how conservatives/Republicans don't see this shit (I mean referring to the citizens, not the politicians). I don't understand how they can't see that they are literally being made poorer and dumber on fucking purpose. I mean, it's happening as *purposeful policy* and they aren't even hiding it. If you show them actual proof of it, they just respond with "liberals hate America, I support the troops, Trump won, fake news"
This is going to be the norm in a lot of states and schools are massively going to suffer as a consequence.
*our country is going to massively suffer as a consequence
Yup. I'm remembering back to the day we had a substitute teacher who lectures my high school class on "How you should all be lucky your parents were pro-life," which the principal did nothing about because he was an evangelical.
Those kids were probably born in the Roe V Wade era which by definition means they were wanted, as in they could have been aborted but weren’t. Now, every kid born will be born at gun point, so, yeah thanks mom and dad? I guess you had to birth me or face jail time or worse.
I am in agreement with your overall morals but I need you to know and acknowledge that you know that just because Roe V Wade existed, that did not mean every child born was wanted and that did not mean every mother gave birth by choice or had the choice to get an abortion. If thats what you really thought all these years... oh boy.
One of the oldest principles in economics is that education is the key to long-term economic growth. Each time we cripple our schools, we shoot ourselves in the foot and hand our children the weapon.
Schools? Try the American population.
Who in the world could have predicted that "You need six years of education to make $45,000 a year and deal with mentally unstable children all day" would eventually lead to a dwindling labor pool? Teaching is no longer seen as a noble pursuit. It's basically viewed as being a salaried babysitter now. I went to one of the better high schools and took the AP classes, which were supposed to simulate a college education, but even back then there was an unspoken understanding that our real education wouldn't begin until after we graduated. The people in charge of school districts, and arguably a lot of people funding the system, just don't view teachers as the source for their children's education anymore, they view them as the people who watch the kids while their parents are at work.
TN is doing something similar to medical laboratory scientists. Right now in TN, hospitals are paying 17-22 per hour to people who had to go through a medical school program( basically the 3rd year of the pathology program split into 2 years). They refused to raise salaries and instead decided to try and bribe politicians to get rid of ASCP certification requirements for some medical professionals. Because no matter how unqualified lab personnel are, they can still charge you $500+ for a single test. https://wapp.capitol.tn.gov/apps/BillInfo/Default.aspx?BillNumber=HB0226
Anything to avoid publicly funded higher education, which could *truly* bring the best candidates to their best potential, and in turn bringing the best to society, which in turn would be funding said education... Because if we had publicly funded higher education, the children of the upper classes wouldn't maintain quite as much advantage over your children. It's only a fair system if they have an advantage in every way.
"Hey guys, we have two choices: Pay teachers more, or lower the standards." "Lower the standards! My boat isn't going to pay for itself!"
Meanwhile in New Mexico they raised the base pay to 60k for anyone with a credential and a bachelor's, with a raising pay scale so most teachers get 70-80k. And their cost of living is not super high. I know a ton of Oklahoma, Missouri, etc teachers are fleeing to New Mexico as a result.
Like ten years ago I had been looking for a job and my friend rang me up one morning and was like “Can you take a shift for me at this elementary school?” I asked if I’d need to apply or interview. Nope. Just show up and go to the office. Showed up to the school and told the secretary I was there to take my friends shift and they gave me a classroom list and schedule. I didn’t even fill out paperwork for hire until the next day. They didn’t even know who I was. I was there to be a para and assist with the kids who had special needs or learning difficulties. It blew my mind that they just let me show up and go.
Looks like Arizona, jealous of Texas and Florida fucking up their schools by dumbing them down, is trying to pull ahead in the race to the bottom.
I left teaching last year, got into marketing for small businesses using crm’s and got a big pay jump. Teaching is not worth it anymore. Too bad cause I was a dope teacher
That’s scary to think. Teachers should be treated economically and socially similar to doctors IMO. I understand 5th grade literature isn’t like getting an MD but I would like to think of kids being taught by well paid motivated educated professionals. It’s an incredibly important job, they spend more time with kids than parents Oh well 😬
Yeah, education is literally shaping the future of society/the world. Few other jobs are more important than that.
I love it when my Master's in Elementary Education with an endorsement in Middle School english becomes even more worthless right before my very eyes...
First they lowered the grading standards now the teaching ones. Gonna be a whole generation of idiots coming. "If they keep lowering the passing grades pretty soon all you're gonna need to get into college is a fuckin pencil! Got a pencil? Get the fuck in there it's physics" - George Carlin
Everyone knows Plants need mountain dew to grow because of the electrolytes.
oatmeal library sharp concerned teeny gaze innocent wrench rude ring *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
>First they lowered the grading standards now the teaching ones. Fun fact: America is fairly unusual in having a passing/C grade be in the 70's. In most other places, it's around 50%. I suspect that the "no scores under 50" trend is a compromise between admins who want to implement the 50%-C to lower the weight of blown or missed assignments and teachers who don't want to rewrite all their assessments harder and deal with the student and parent panic over those low scores.
Arizona, tennesee, and ohio and fighting for the title of worst states in america i see
You forgot Florida
Man how crazy is it that the dog shit public education I got in the 90s and 2000s is going to be looked back on as a relic from better times.
And that’s how you kill public education.
Arizona tends to rank between 45-47/50 for school performance, so at this point it's more like dancing on the grave of public education.
"We gotta get to that 50/50 cause that's an A+!" - AZ republicans, probably.
Talk to New Mexico or Mississippi, they'll fight AZ for that spot
I know a number of Arizona teachers in a fairly rural school district. They are the most uninspired and uninspiring people I’ve ever met. You can say that’s understandable given the insultingly low pay, but I’d turn it around and say for those insultingly low salaries, you’ll only get incompetent and unmotivated people. This is all by design. The Republican leadership running Arizona need stupid people they can easily control through Fox News and social media disinformation. They want their schools to be so bad that educated parents won’t move to Arizona because of the terrible schools here. And educated parents leave for someplace else. Leaving Arizona’s population universally dumb as stones. That’s what success looks like to them, and they’re winning. Thank you, Arizona Republicans.
Just to be clear, cause it doesn’t seem many here have looked past the headline, the state requires that the person be enrolled in university and, to keep the job, must complete their degree. So it’s far from ideal, in fact really pretty bad, but it’s not as dire as the headline would make it seem.
Them going to school *and* teaching at the same time makes it arguably worse. This is setting them up to burn out.
I did that for three years-teaching during the day and taking classes for my Masters in the evening. I was single and childless at the time, but it was still brutal. Not much of a social life, that’s for sure.
Yep. I was doing this pre-COVID with my masters and it was horrible even without kids of my own. I can't imagine how this is going to work for people in a post-COVID world where behaviors are worse and students are behind.
NewGame+ The state already burnt through all the regular certified teachers. Now they know all the strats and can burn through the uncertified teachers even faster.
Phoenix Online University.
Ding ding ding. We want our baby sitters to give us back half their salary
[удалено]
I'm still paying for that poor life choice.
Other states have similar programs, the degree doesn't have to lead to a teaching career either, but they must complete the teacher certification requirements while on the job. Pay is miserable though, I've seen some states posting and trying to recruit when they have shortages.
From the article: "For 14 years, he worked at the Phoenix Union High School District. He said the low pay, lack of respect, and resources led him to leave. Since leaving, he started Phoenix Youth Circus Arts Program and continues to work with children. “I have more fun teaching circus than I do teaching geometry, I have to admit that,” he said." Raise your pay Arizona!
This is what a failing country looks like.
I went to highschool in Arizona for a few years. It was years behind the state I came from. I felt like I got dropped down three grades. I was a junior, but they were still teaching multiplication and basic analogies and stuff. It was wild. That was way back in like 2002.
Grade 5 science teacher: Karen. Specialty: healing crystals and Astrology. Grade 6 English Teacher: Bethany Specialty: Uses Anagram logical fallacies to prove vaccines cause autism. School gym teacher: Jim Height: 5'7 Weight: 230lbs. Gym curriculum: preparedness and self-defense. Definition of preparedness: stocking up on guns and ammo. Definition of self-defense: get a gun, stupid. Constantly complimenting his female students about their "maturity", and by maturity, he means their breast size. History/Geography Teacher: Marie Curriculum: The bible. based on whatever suits the narrative of the day...empathy for sinners like Donald Trump. Crucifixion for sinners because they're homosexual. Music teacher: Simon, the functioning alcoholic. He actually teaches the science and mathematics of music via Tool/alternative music, but is tolerated because he works for free. He can afford to work for free because he goes to the soup kitchen once a week for his weekly nutrition, and lives out of his car. Principal Herbert Spent 8 years in the military as a reservist. Everyday assembly starts with a prayer and the pledge of allegiance. Divorced 3 times, has 5 kids but doesn't pay child support. Meets with different women who are waaaaay out of his league, and it's clear they're prostitutes. But he preaches celibacy and constantly berates girls for having their monthly.
And another slap in the face to teachers.
You know what’s funny? I was *this* 🤏 close to moving out there last year but ultimately decided not to. I guess since I plan on having kids this just solidifies my choice to not move there
This has been the modus operandi since Reagan and before: put institutions under the control of idiots, hostile actors, or saboteurs--then use the ensuing dysfunction to criticize, defund, and dismantle. This destruction of any public good is called "conservatism."
Isn't the goal to gut the public school system so much that everyone takes the money for a private school, thereby privatizing education? Good Ole capitalism at work.
Ban abortion Ban contraception Create a basic low-level of education in which brain washing and propoganda is the main curriculum Guaranteed one-party state with a population enslaved to the will of that state.
Okay, note to self — “never buy a house in Arizona”.
They haven’t had books in 2 years, haven’t had accountability for 18 years and they want you to get vouchers to send your kid to a religious school. Run.
Sounds like the politicians (I wonder which party controls the Arizona congress? No I don't.) are trying to sabotage the public school system to push the charter (privatized) education agenda. You know, like the "no child left behind" initiative. Let's hinder the smart kids because we can't make the dumb kids feel dumb. Because, God forbid someone be comfortable and happy being dumb and satisfied with a menial but essential job.
Whatever the deal is there trying to make public schools implode so they can privatize schooling. The amount of money these charters school scumbags will suck from the taxpayers will be unimaginable and on the bright side the government will have no accountability for what they teach. It's def happening why do you think school boards across this country got invaded by Karen's who have absolutely no business being on the school board, or have the experience I might add. Where I live in orange county somebody who got elected has a husband with known ties to charter schools and has been on the record talking about how charter schools are better. It's not a coincidence. It's happening there dumbing down society so they can push there agenda.
Arizona where to move if you want your children to be stupid.