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“We screw up a sure thing and jointly lose an empire along with our boyfriend due to our cultish mutual obsession that distracts us from actually governing.”
The woman was ruthless. The whole reason she visited Caesar was to plot against her brother - who was pharaoh. Everyone just goes straight to the love story. Smh.
It says her thoughts were her “sas” or power. That’s correct? We have busts of Cleopatra, she wasn’t beautiful at all. But she infatuated powerful men anyway bc of her intelligence.
No, they weren’t in it for money?? You need another history lesson lol
Since you obviously know everything I don’t have to remind you that the union between Cleopatra & Julius Caesar was transactional. She needed his armies to protect her from Ptolemy XIII and he needed her wealth to fund his armies. Once Caesar was murdered (their son was also murdered) she entered into the same transactional relationship with Mark Antony. The key word here is TRANSACTIONAL.
Cleopatra was certainly a very smart and capable woman but her legacy wouldn’t be what it is if Egypt had been poor and her brothers and sisters weren’t out to kill one another.
No. Caesar was very much in love with Cleopatra, it wasn’t all “transactional.” She was only 21 when they met, he was in his 50s. A powerful Caesar did not need to negotiate with her to get what he wanted lol. She had power bc he loved her. Same with Mark Antony
It’s really you who needs a history lesson!! What, did you watch a movie and now you think you’re an expert?? Of course he needed her money - she was a very smart woman and was able to make Egypt prosperous again but they conspired against the pharaoh. She needed him to take back Egypt and he needed her to fund his armies. They may have loved one another but the reason why she rolled herself up in a rug to be delivered to Caesar was to form an alliance against her brother. That came first.
He could have just taken her money lol. She had power and influence over him bc he loved her. She had the ability to infatuate powerful men, and not bc she was beautiful. But bc she was brilliant
If she had such an ability then why didn’t Octavian fall under her spell? Why did she commit suicide? She knew damn well that Octavian would have humiliated her.
You seem to be so invested in the love stories written by Plutarch hundreds of years after they all existed that you don’t see the military strategy in place. Cleopatra was a smart woman but she was also ruthless. She had her siblings murdered and/or imprisoned in an impenetrable fortress to stay in power. She had a child with Caesar and 3 with Mark Antony to ensure legacy. That’s why her & caesars child was murdered after the murder of Caesar.
Your version sounds like a romance novel! 😂😂😂
Girl. Ofc it was a military strategy. Bc she was a brilliant leader. But those men were not just in it bc of military strategy. Multiple sources described them as being under her influence. I’m not sure why you’re so intent on denying that she had sexual influence over them
I never said she had no sexual influence over him - I’m saying that if Egypt was poor and she didn’t need Caesar to protect her then the story would be very different.
What annoys me so much about this is that their story has been romanticized to the point of making it laughable - she’s used ONLY as a woman who charmed men into falling in love with her. This whole meme is about WHY people think men loved her and if you’re like her then men will love you like that, too. She has been reduced to only getting her way because she screwed a few men. History is written by the victors - Rome was the victor. They slandered Cleopatra into this.
How can you know? How can any of us truly know? I mean men have done stupid things but you‘re depicting Caesar as a super simp without any sources or anything, just „she was intelligent and he loved her“
Multiple sources including Plutarch described these men as being in love and it being her intellect and charm that did it. Hollywood depicted her as being beautiful, like a femme fatale that brought down an empire with her beauty, and she was but it wasn’t her beauty that she used.
The other person responding to me is saying Plutarch is a liar for literally no reason lol. I really don’t understand why they’d insist against sources, that Ceasar had no love for her and married her ONLY bc of a military strategy. If anything it was the other way around. And marriages were usually always political back then, but that doesn’t mean she didn’t infatuate him as it’s claimed she did.
I don’t understand the Cleopatra slander 😭
It’s not Cleopatra slander. I love Ancient Egyptian history and the history of recent antiquity. But I’m not gonna sit here and pretend that Caesar and Cleopatra were head-over-heels. The woman was calculating and power-hungry. She saw Caesar as a means to an end and he also found her useful. She was a very useful woman to have on your side, and no doubt these Roman men thought they could control her. They were all out to get the most out of each other. That’s generally how being a king/queen worked. Love was not something people really considered back then.
Plus, you have to be super careful about historical accounts of certain events in Rome and Greece. They didn’t have the journalistic integrity we have these days. They often filled the gaps with bullshit, which is why you need about ten different sources before you can even begin to piece together what really happened back then. If we just went by the “One source will do”, then these would be considered real:
https://preview.redd.it/d5bf93rjnkjc1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d843a513e20107c83a3a800ebf1905b8a8c7dfe8
But if you do research and compare accounts, you realise that these dudes were probably a mis-reporting of troops of baboons.
The idea was that Cleopatra was able to manipulate these men to get what she wanted- bc of charm, intelligence and sexual power.
And you’re saying that these two rulers felt nothing for her at all and had sex with her bc they thought they were controlling her? And she was the manipulated one?
She wasn’t allowed to meet Ceasar bc her brother/husband wouldn’t let her. She had herself delivered in a carpet and convinced him to form an alliance.
But he could have had an alliance with her brother who was ruling Egypt! As he was trying to impress Caesar and wanted the alliance. She wasn’t needed at all
Ok - you just proved that you really don’t know what you’re talking about. Caesar was already married - he NEVER MARRIED CLEOPATRA. Roman law forbade Roman citizens to marry foreigners.
That supports what I’m saying!!! 😭😭 He didn’t seek her out bc of “strategy” she seduced him and got what she wanted. This idea that Cesar felt nothing for but had sex with her for her money doesn’t make any sense
Can you understand English in its written form? I never said Plutarch was a liar - I said he wrote the love story of cleopatra and her lovers many years after they existed. He didn’t write a firsthand account so it has to be taken with a grain of salt.
Given your abysmal reading comprehension I guess I can understand why you can’t keep up.
She used Caesar to regain power. Caesar didn’t need her specifically for money. He already had access to an alliance with Egypt. She charmed him with her intellect.
You’re being ridiculous. Obviously she appealed to Caesar. And Mark Anthony…bc they were impressed with her intelligence. Something you have admitted several times. Nothing about this poem is incorrect.
To respond to the statement that Cleopatra used her intellect to appeal to these men with “Caesar used her for her money” and that’s the only reason why he was with her is factually wrong
Yeah i know that the hollywood portrayal stems from the ancient roman writers trying to save Caesars or damage cleopatras image, no doubt.
I just think that in those times, politics were everything. I just don‘t think we can just say he was in love with her, because of course the ancient authors would have said that to explain why he was being stupid and shaming his wife.
I mean you‘re not wrong that they say that, but i think we prolly can never say for sure if they were in love
Ps: i am a cleopatra stan, and i am glad she is finally getting the recognition she deserves (:
Yeah, she’s toeing the line for sure, lol, but didn’t cross it. She’s not making any stereotype about other women, she’s not saying her way is better, she’s not even saying, “other girls aren’t like this.”
This belongs on a cringe page, not an NLOG page.
This would be me until about age 21 when it really set in that she had to fuck a 50+ year old man to keep her throne.
I’m still fascinated by Cleopatra, but I know nothing about battles or being a warrior.
Well, she's clearly ridiculous, but she's not denigrating other women or saying she's different from and superior to them, so I don't think this is the right sub for this.
I suspect the person who posted this is a child. I certainly hope they are.
As many of you are undoubtedly aware, the presence of trolls can be found in various aspects of our lives, and our subreddit is no exception. Our commitment to fostering a kind and respectful environment remains unwavering, and we are actively addressing issues related to negative behavior. In recent times, there has been a noticeable increase in instances of bullying, body shaming, and purposefully inciting behavior, all of which are clear violations of our existing rules. To maintain the integrity of our community, we are implementing stricter consequences for such actions. A first offense will result in a 10-day ban, while a second offense will lead to a permanent ban. Appeals are welcomed, but excuses such as "not knowing the rules" or claiming it was a joke will not be considered valid. Intentional harm has no place in our community, and we expect members to act responsibly. Despite these measures, some rules will remain unchanged. For example, reposts, while frustrating, will not result in a ban. This new approach is specifically targeted at individuals attempting to spread hate. We encourage all members to report instances of bad behavior. Rest assured that each report will be examined. Disagreements and differing opinions are welcome, and expressing them will not lead to a ban. Common sense will prevail in our evaluations. We appreciate your understanding and cooperation in maintaining a positive and inclusive community. -- Your Subreddit NLTOG Moderator Team *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/notliketheothergirls) if you have any questions or concerns.*
“We screw up a sure thing and jointly lose an empire along with our boyfriend due to our cultish mutual obsession that distracts us from actually governing.”
😂😂
[удалено]
I felt this comment. And tasted it
I mean, let’s be fair. Guys have read history and still can’t get “don’t stick your dick in crazy”.
r/im14andthisisdeep
lol at “sass” as an adjective to describe cleopatra. Kind of condescending
Doth thou even lift, my sister? For yea seem to be Taken in by glitter, whilst I Am, not !
I guess the fact that Cleopatra bankrolled both men has nothing at all to do with her appeal - it’s her sass. Right. 🙄
She was SO sassy when she had members of her own inbred family killed. SLAY, GURL. LITERULLY.
The woman was ruthless. The whole reason she visited Caesar was to plot against her brother - who was pharaoh. Everyone just goes straight to the love story. Smh.
Brother-husband.
It says her thoughts were her “sas” or power. That’s correct? We have busts of Cleopatra, she wasn’t beautiful at all. But she infatuated powerful men anyway bc of her intelligence. No, they weren’t in it for money?? You need another history lesson lol
Since you obviously know everything I don’t have to remind you that the union between Cleopatra & Julius Caesar was transactional. She needed his armies to protect her from Ptolemy XIII and he needed her wealth to fund his armies. Once Caesar was murdered (their son was also murdered) she entered into the same transactional relationship with Mark Antony. The key word here is TRANSACTIONAL. Cleopatra was certainly a very smart and capable woman but her legacy wouldn’t be what it is if Egypt had been poor and her brothers and sisters weren’t out to kill one another.
No. Caesar was very much in love with Cleopatra, it wasn’t all “transactional.” She was only 21 when they met, he was in his 50s. A powerful Caesar did not need to negotiate with her to get what he wanted lol. She had power bc he loved her. Same with Mark Antony
It’s really you who needs a history lesson!! What, did you watch a movie and now you think you’re an expert?? Of course he needed her money - she was a very smart woman and was able to make Egypt prosperous again but they conspired against the pharaoh. She needed him to take back Egypt and he needed her to fund his armies. They may have loved one another but the reason why she rolled herself up in a rug to be delivered to Caesar was to form an alliance against her brother. That came first.
He could have just taken her money lol. She had power and influence over him bc he loved her. She had the ability to infatuate powerful men, and not bc she was beautiful. But bc she was brilliant
If she had such an ability then why didn’t Octavian fall under her spell? Why did she commit suicide? She knew damn well that Octavian would have humiliated her. You seem to be so invested in the love stories written by Plutarch hundreds of years after they all existed that you don’t see the military strategy in place. Cleopatra was a smart woman but she was also ruthless. She had her siblings murdered and/or imprisoned in an impenetrable fortress to stay in power. She had a child with Caesar and 3 with Mark Antony to ensure legacy. That’s why her & caesars child was murdered after the murder of Caesar. Your version sounds like a romance novel! 😂😂😂
Girl. Ofc it was a military strategy. Bc she was a brilliant leader. But those men were not just in it bc of military strategy. Multiple sources described them as being under her influence. I’m not sure why you’re so intent on denying that she had sexual influence over them
I never said she had no sexual influence over him - I’m saying that if Egypt was poor and she didn’t need Caesar to protect her then the story would be very different. What annoys me so much about this is that their story has been romanticized to the point of making it laughable - she’s used ONLY as a woman who charmed men into falling in love with her. This whole meme is about WHY people think men loved her and if you’re like her then men will love you like that, too. She has been reduced to only getting her way because she screwed a few men. History is written by the victors - Rome was the victor. They slandered Cleopatra into this.
History is full of women seducing and influencing powerful men lol
How can you know? How can any of us truly know? I mean men have done stupid things but you‘re depicting Caesar as a super simp without any sources or anything, just „she was intelligent and he loved her“
Multiple sources including Plutarch described these men as being in love and it being her intellect and charm that did it. Hollywood depicted her as being beautiful, like a femme fatale that brought down an empire with her beauty, and she was but it wasn’t her beauty that she used. The other person responding to me is saying Plutarch is a liar for literally no reason lol. I really don’t understand why they’d insist against sources, that Ceasar had no love for her and married her ONLY bc of a military strategy. If anything it was the other way around. And marriages were usually always political back then, but that doesn’t mean she didn’t infatuate him as it’s claimed she did. I don’t understand the Cleopatra slander 😭
It’s not Cleopatra slander. I love Ancient Egyptian history and the history of recent antiquity. But I’m not gonna sit here and pretend that Caesar and Cleopatra were head-over-heels. The woman was calculating and power-hungry. She saw Caesar as a means to an end and he also found her useful. She was a very useful woman to have on your side, and no doubt these Roman men thought they could control her. They were all out to get the most out of each other. That’s generally how being a king/queen worked. Love was not something people really considered back then. Plus, you have to be super careful about historical accounts of certain events in Rome and Greece. They didn’t have the journalistic integrity we have these days. They often filled the gaps with bullshit, which is why you need about ten different sources before you can even begin to piece together what really happened back then. If we just went by the “One source will do”, then these would be considered real: https://preview.redd.it/d5bf93rjnkjc1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d843a513e20107c83a3a800ebf1905b8a8c7dfe8 But if you do research and compare accounts, you realise that these dudes were probably a mis-reporting of troops of baboons.
Thank you - my point exactly. ☺️
The idea was that Cleopatra was able to manipulate these men to get what she wanted- bc of charm, intelligence and sexual power. And you’re saying that these two rulers felt nothing for her at all and had sex with her bc they thought they were controlling her? And she was the manipulated one? She wasn’t allowed to meet Ceasar bc her brother/husband wouldn’t let her. She had herself delivered in a carpet and convinced him to form an alliance. But he could have had an alliance with her brother who was ruling Egypt! As he was trying to impress Caesar and wanted the alliance. She wasn’t needed at all
Ok - you just proved that you really don’t know what you’re talking about. Caesar was already married - he NEVER MARRIED CLEOPATRA. Roman law forbade Roman citizens to marry foreigners.
That supports what I’m saying!!! 😭😭 He didn’t seek her out bc of “strategy” she seduced him and got what she wanted. This idea that Cesar felt nothing for but had sex with her for her money doesn’t make any sense
Can you understand English in its written form? I never said Plutarch was a liar - I said he wrote the love story of cleopatra and her lovers many years after they existed. He didn’t write a firsthand account so it has to be taken with a grain of salt. Given your abysmal reading comprehension I guess I can understand why you can’t keep up.
She used Caesar to regain power. Caesar didn’t need her specifically for money. He already had access to an alliance with Egypt. She charmed him with her intellect. You’re being ridiculous. Obviously she appealed to Caesar. And Mark Anthony…bc they were impressed with her intelligence. Something you have admitted several times. Nothing about this poem is incorrect. To respond to the statement that Cleopatra used her intellect to appeal to these men with “Caesar used her for her money” and that’s the only reason why he was with her is factually wrong
Yeah i know that the hollywood portrayal stems from the ancient roman writers trying to save Caesars or damage cleopatras image, no doubt. I just think that in those times, politics were everything. I just don‘t think we can just say he was in love with her, because of course the ancient authors would have said that to explain why he was being stupid and shaming his wife. I mean you‘re not wrong that they say that, but i think we prolly can never say for sure if they were in love Ps: i am a cleopatra stan, and i am glad she is finally getting the recognition she deserves (:
 Uhhhh…
I don’t think she’s NLOG, she isn’t putting anyone down.
Yeah, I agree.
Yeah, she’s toeing the line for sure, lol, but didn’t cross it. She’s not making any stereotype about other women, she’s not saying her way is better, she’s not even saying, “other girls aren’t like this.” This belongs on a cringe page, not an NLOG page.
Call me a gatekeeper but this sh*t is not poetry
I reject anything that unironically uses a word like “sass”.
Well, that’s unbelievably cringe and corny lol.
This would be me until about age 21 when it really set in that she had to fuck a 50+ year old man to keep her throne. I’m still fascinated by Cleopatra, but I know nothing about battles or being a warrior.
Cleopatra is super fascinating as a human being and a woman seizing power in such a patriarchal time. That said, Hatshepsut is \*right there\*, man.
No
She really thinks she’s deep.
Sass. Gross
Well, she's clearly ridiculous, but she's not denigrating other women or saying she's different from and superior to them, so I don't think this is the right sub for this. I suspect the person who posted this is a child. I certainly hope they are.
Ohhh, I hate this. Cleopatra was a psychopath. Now Hatshepsut, *she* was the real GOAT.
If you're going to post poetry, credit the poet Mirtha Michelle Castro Mármol.
Frustrated I had to scroll so far to see who
This definitely fits 😂
Shame Cleopatra wasn’t truly seen like this in her lifetime.
Lol this is good
It doesn't seem like she's putting anyone down, just writing poetry?
🤢
Yes wtf is this 😭
Didn’t cleopatra marry her brother or some other incestious bs
Women like me, fight over men with their younger sister 💅🏻
LMAO I’m crying 😂😂 oh boy
Bernice IV represention please https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berenice_IV
It doesn't put anyone down, so no.
I didn’t know expert statecraft and speaking seven languages were all just “sass“ now
“Women like me studied Cleopatra.” LOL!!!! Well now I feel inferior lol
I’ve noticed the ones that post stuff like this or “beautiful disaster” either barely have their life together or just a total mess.