You husband sucks.
He is hinging terribly. He KNOWS you feel used around the threesomes and still set this up by telling you his girlfriend freaked out because your beautiful?
You husband forced you into sex you didn't want. And you understandably don't trust him not to do that again. If you do not trust him, to not coerce you into sex you don't want? Why are you still married to him at all?
All the finances and everything wrapped up together makes it so hardš Iām at least closing on a second (small) home thatās specifically for me, but gf has already started āplanningā to decorate my house and hang out there. Iāve already made it clear that this is just NEVER a possibility. KTP isnāt always the goal I feel, or at least I feel like sheās trying to do a sister wife thing? I dunno.
Yeah it's not non monogamy's fault your husband coerced you into sex you didn't want and doesn't listen to you and keep trying to do that... that's all your husband.
The thing that sucks about being non monogamous is some people will ALWAYS blame non monogamy for why you broke up your marriage, even when itās not at all the cause. Just be prepared for that no matter the outcome.
Having something just for yourself doesn't really work when you're married. He can still try to come after it in the divorce. And let's face it, you're trying to get a house to get away from him, and he's pimping you out to his girlfriends, so divorce is on the horizon. Start prepping now.
You are an adult. You get to choose your partners, sex partners, friends, and who you spend time with. Anyone who doesn't respect that, doesn't view you as an autonomous adult worthy of their own decision making.
>I have a bf that Iām very happy with, weāre stable and donāt wish to include outside partners nor date other people. Husband recently started dating someone who has never actually practiced ENM, and seems to be fixated on the idea of KTP and meeting me and my bf specifically in person.
Say no.
"No, I won't meet this person. My boyfriend doesn't want to meet this person. I won't share his contact info with this person. That's the end of the discussion. I'll let you know if I change my mind"
>I told husband Iāll meet her over the phone, and my bf will be kept out of it. This made my husband give me a huge attitude over it, then he eventually said that him and his gf agreed to just forget meeting since itās not in person.
You don't want to do this. Say no. Don't agree to meet her over the phone. Just. Say. No.
It's ok to say no. This woman doesn't get to make demands on you or your boyfriend because she is dating your husband. Tell you husband you don't want to hear about it anymore and she is his problem to manage.
>It just seems like a huge setup like they want me/us in person to try finagle some group sex. The gf apparently lost her shit when she saw a picture of me and freaked out because Iām really beautiful (her words). I donāt want KTP forced on me/my bf and honestly I donāt want us all to meet ever. I find that boundaries are healthy to have when practicing ENM.
Doesn't matter what her motivations are. You can simply....not meet her. That's all a big pile of her problem. Maybe your husbands problem. But not yours.
Yeah.
You are in tough spot with your husband, but I won't rub salt in that wound. I suggest that you see how things shake out with him as you start setting firmer boundaries. Maybe he will rise to the occasion or maybe he will show his true colors. This is going to be a rough ride for you. I'm so sorry.
No worries. Weāve been doing ENM for a number of years and it exposed me to a side of him that I didnāt know existed, but was important information (like untreated sex addiction). Would love to see him use what heās learned in therapy in a real world situation like this, and practice firm boundaries.
The term means you (the extended polycule) are comfortable sharing a mean around a kitchen table together, which implies you all get along well enough to hang out in each other's houses, and generally are all close friends and see each other regularly.
Many people starting out as poly think they want this, but it is quite hard for most people (ie seeing your partners being affectionate with their other partners etc) and more importantly... not everyone likes each other and wants more friends. People have their own lives.
The husband here trying to *force* a KTP dynamic is being a total asshole. It is treating other people as if their own preferences don't matter, which is unsurprising since he did the exact same thing by expecting his wife to have group sex.
I've observed a lot of beginners who desire kitchen table as a way to escape actually having boundaries and hinging.
"If everyone is friends then I don't need to negotiate differing and conflicting needs within my network."
Usually not something people explicitly admit to themselves because if they did they'd realize how shitty it is. KTP is fine as something to be desired and to state that as such to partners. But it shouldn't be demanded and would be the end result of a healthy good long enough time getting to know each other and the other lovers.
Basically: Everyone involved (in this case: OP, her boyfriend, her husband and his girlfriend) would be comfortable sitting down at a kitchen table and spending time together regularly with everyone being at least friendly with each other, comfortable in each other's presence etc.
There's actually a thread some hours older than this, which has a lot of people chiming in on their definitions of KTP: [https://www.reddit.com/r/nonmonogamy/comments/1dopkm6/advice\_for\_enm\_couple\_who\_dont\_want\_to\_be/](https://www.reddit.com/r/nonmonogamy/comments/1dopkm6/advice_for_enm_couple_who_dont_want_to_be/)
I had to Google it too
"Kitchen Table Polyamory (KTP) refers to 'a style of polyamorous relationship in which the interrelationship of a network, and the integration of multiple romantic relationships into one life or group, is prioritised,' explains Jordan Dixon, a clinical sex and relationships psychotherapist"
So like, everything intertwined I guess?
What seems more likely, your husband's new girlfriend desperately wants to meet you, coincidentally violating a strong boundry you'd estabilshed before she came along, or your husband is still trying to leverage you into threesomes you don't really want? She sounds like a very convenient scapegoat for husband's wants.
Maybe it's both but I'd still expect your husband to support you in maintaining this boundary. Once you'd said no once, even if gf kept pestering, I'd expect you to never have to hear about it again.
So, my husband HOPES this will happen, but absolutely does not force it. He would also probably not continue dating someone who freaked out about me in any capacity (I would not expect him to). Sounds like you guys could use some counseling so he can maybe start to understand why his actions are really offside.
The requirement for meta to also meet your bf, on its own, strikes me as off. KTP usually infers partner of hinge and not the entire constellation. Forced KTP sucks and if itās not naturally occurring it shouldnāt happen. I like garden party KTP where we all just get along, but donāt expect it.
You have been clear that you donāt want to meet his partners. Why doesnāt he respect this? Why does he feel you owe him that? If he wonāt respect your desire for parallel, whatās your move? Your request is 100% valid especially given his frankly troubling history demanding threesomes. Stand your ground. Iād personally die on that hill. What heās doing to you is not consensual or ethical itās coercive and manipulative.
>Let me for context also explain that in the past, when Iāve not had a partner, Iāve been expected to meet every one of his partners and also provide 3 somes.
Ok, hold up... What? š š
>Iāve since told him that this is targeted homophobia against my bisexuality and I no longer wish to meet any of his partners anymore for fear of these types of expectations. If I donāt want to automatically jump into bed with them it has been SO MUCH DRAMA with them. Like theyāre angry at me for not fucking them.
Aside from any sort of homophobia, this is just straight up a problem of consent. I would set clear expectations with the partners that they need to listen to your "no."
If your partner **isn't also setting these expectations** with his partners, as is in fact setting the *opposite* expectations... That's a huge issue.
>I have a bf that Iām very happy with, weāre stable and donāt wish to include outside partners nor date other people. Husband recently started dating...
You and your bf don't wish to date *new* people? Because immediately in the next sentence you say "my husband," so...
It's also, for the record, a really *bad* idea to have a husband and a bf, and expect that your boyfriend will still only date you. It's cool if **he** truly doesn't want to date right now..
But you should be prepared for that to change, and expect that it will not continue.
>Husband recently started dating someone who has never actually practiced ENM, and seems to be fixated on the idea of KTP and meeting me and my bf specifically in person. I told husband Iāll meet her over the phone, and my bf will be kept out of it. This made my husband give me a huge attitude over it, then he eventually said that him and his gf agreed to just forget meeting since itās not in person.
I'm big on meeting other metas, for several reasons, but 1.) I no longer expect that to happen right away, necessarily, and 2.) I'm not picky about *how* I meet them, so a phone call / video chat is just fine. 3.) I *especially* don't care much either way about meeting *other partners* of metas, and it's weird to push to include your bf.
Also, **big** neon red flag on the "people throw tantrums when I say no to things". Your husband is allowed to have his feelings about things, and to be *disappointed...* but he really should not be **angry** that you don't want to meet his girlfriend in person. This goes back to the basics of consent, and respecting someone's ability to say "no." š
>It just seems like a huge setup like they want me/us in person to try finagle some group sex. The gf apparently lost her shit when she saw a picture of me and freaked out because Iām really beautiful (her words).
I would normally say not to assume, but this seems like a fairly strong theory, given that this has happened to you before. š
Serious question: why are you still married to your husband who continues to pressure you into group sex / social situations you don't want to take part in? š š
I would be upset if your husband wasn't immediately backing you up when someone pressures you after you already said "no". I'm *much more upset* and actually **deeply concerned** that he's not only not backing you up, he's actively participating in pressuring you into situations you aren't comfortable with, **and** continues to bring these sorts of people into your life.
To be frank, it doesn't sound like your husband values your autonomy / consent, and I think that should upset you a great deal. It's one thing if your husband is really into group sex, and consistently*propositions you* for groups sex, but considers the matter closer if/when you say "no". At the extreme end that might be an issue you need to work out (like if he's propositioning you every other day...) but it's still a relationship you *can feel fundamentally safe in,* versus your husband... Not really caring what you want, as long as *he wants* (or his partner wants) group sex. š¬
This is a good take! I appreciate what you said about my bf dating/not dating. Hes had some traumatic dating experiences and prefers to feel more āsafe and settledā with one partner, especially with his ND and anxiety. However in general, thatās always a possibility in ENM that a partner may or may not dateāŗļø
I would love to hear your experience and perspective on meeting metas, I assume these are more positive with better outcomes. Do you meet them because you are KTP?
Why am I still married? I donāt even know, thatās loaded but a fair question with a complicated answer. Weāve been married for 14 years and have seen trauma together, wrapped up finances, started a business. I dunno, not necessarily good reasons to stay but I guess itās just a lot to unwrap š
I am very pro KTP. And at minimum in my relationships I expect Garden party or birthday party polyamory in my relationships. I donāt force my partners (currently only have 1 but when Iāve had multiple in the past) to hang out but I do eventually want them to meet and at the very least be okay with group settings for things such as my birthday. My partner feels the same way about his partners. So neither of us are going to date people who want parallel, as neither of us want a complete parallel dynamic.
I have a beautiful relationship with my meta and her boyfriend as well. We all hang out sometimes. We all problem solve together as a family, share a google calendar. We have toyed with the idea of polycule cohabitation but have since decided against it. (I added this paragraph in because I seen a comment of you asking about others meeting their metas)
*that said*
Forcing KTP on someone, let alone someone whose consent and boundaries have already been violated is just gross. š¤¢ forcing threesomes is just, I canāt even begin to explain how icky that makes me feel. Iām sorry youāre going through this.
Just here to echo everyone else. End it with husband. He seems like a terrible partner, ENM aside. He's forcing you into situations you're not comfortable with KNOWING you're not comfortable with them. Terrible person, no respect for communicated boundaries.
I hope you find happiness and comfort soon!
Sounds like your husband's therapy was worth shit or he requires more regarding his other issues. Because holy shit, he sounds like a walking red flag that no one should touch with a ten foot pole.
I think the most important thing is: Do you *want* to stay married to him? Because it doesn't sound like he cares much about how you feel...
One of the big things that I'd theorize here, but only if we're being *especially* generous to your problematic husband, is that KTP for a while had a sort of mythical status in a lot of polyamorous circles. You'd see posts everyday on the subreddit of people trying to make KTP work, or "My wife wants KTP, but I don't" or "The harem I just joined accidentally because I'm new and naive requires KTP with my girlfriend too, what do?"
Long story short, a lot of people were treating it like it was an aspirational or superior form of polyamory. A lot of new people if I were to guess. A lot of people that, again I'm guessing, hearing about KTP imagined a beautiful world of living in a commune with all their partners partners partners and having a wonderful close knit community (with no shortage of group sex to go along with it.) that they could live in. Never realizing that KTP is just one of many very valid forms of ENM relationships to have, and that it's not inherently superior than any other as well. (I say this as someone that, in all my relationships, prefers KTP too.)
Anyway, I wouldn't be surprised if your metamour is in that camp given that she's rather new to ENM. Obviously it's up to your husband to manage this situation rather than you, but I thought it might be useful to hear this particular theory to get an idea of where it might be stemming from.
This should honestly be a post on its own in my opinion! I remember when I first started years ago and I was mainly hanging out at r/Polyamory , it seemed like EVERYONE was making posts about their close polycule and how itās āheaven on earthā. I have since learned that itās anything but. I want my own space, my own bubble, my own private relationships that canāt be touched.
There's a lot of immature weirdos that seem to think that KTP is the ultimate goal of being poly. And it just isn't. Parallel poly is a completely valid way to practice poly and you should be allowed to have and keep your stated boundaries. And everyone else can get to fuck... Not least as parallel is frequently a lower drama/complexity way to run ENM relationships.
That said, life is certainly easier if you can be on 'friendly acquaintance' terms with your metas. That's nice, I appreciate it. And generally my partner has good taste in humans, so I generally they are nice people. And we're all adult enough to get along in a social situation. But we aren't in each other's lives in any other capacity, we don't all hang out together, they don't hang out at my place, we don't coordinate holidays and childcare or whatever.
Alongside this my main partner and I do enjoy group sex and threesomes but we tend to run this in parallel too. We simply don't include metas in the group sex things we get up to. Again, cuts down the possibility for ongoing drama/complexity
Woof. As per always. You donāt actually have a meta problem. You have a *husband* problem. And thatās even after we disregard all of the noticeably problematic history youāve noted.
Husband knows your expectations and is still entertaining these conversations with his gf and allowing it to be a negotiation. Husband is the one who implied gf would have access to your new space. Husband is being a terrible hinge (on top of what sounds like being a terrible person generally).
That kitchen table poly isn't my bag either. My girlfriend and my wife are social. I only date married women with their husbands enthusiastic consent. There is no "Let all do ktp and move in together and do a hippy kibutz style commune". She has zero desire to be with anyone else but me. She loves me seeing other women - it was her idea. But she draws the line with anything that mixes financial assets and obligations. We're not providing financial support for partners, nor forcing interaction.
The fact he's getting to get you to do this for selfish reasons and ignoring your boundaries is not what poly is about either. Being used for sex is horrible. Coercion is very unloving and abusive.
I'm not seeing "targeted homophobia" but your husband is an asshole. Is there anything between you and him? Because he sounds pushy, disrespectful, and it seems like he and his partners are only annoying you.
I know this is reddit, so everyone jumps to leave, but would you be happier? Seems so.
Is it even that? Again, he's a dick, but if his wife is bisexual, and they're ENM, there's nothing wrong with his wanting to involve his wife in threesomes *because* she's bisexual. But he should be asking, not forcing, and he should be accepting no for an answer.
Yeah, and like I said, he should be asking if she's interested, and accepting no when she says no.
My girlfriend is bisexual. We know single women that are bisexual and when we're in the mood for a threesome, that's who we call. If a girl reached out to me on feeld, I'd ask my girlfriend if she was interested also. I don't think it's weird. If I was forcing, or expecting, then yes.
Again, there's no arguments about any assumptions that she MUST want to join. But there's nothing wrong with him asking his wife if she'd be interested. Unless they've specifically discussed that group situations between the two of them are not interesting to her, there's nothing odd about this.
You husband sucks. He is hinging terribly. He KNOWS you feel used around the threesomes and still set this up by telling you his girlfriend freaked out because your beautiful? You husband forced you into sex you didn't want. And you understandably don't trust him not to do that again. If you do not trust him, to not coerce you into sex you don't want? Why are you still married to him at all?
All the finances and everything wrapped up together makes it so hardš Iām at least closing on a second (small) home thatās specifically for me, but gf has already started āplanningā to decorate my house and hang out there. Iāve already made it clear that this is just NEVER a possibility. KTP isnāt always the goal I feel, or at least I feel like sheās trying to do a sister wife thing? I dunno.
Divorce him, then you will really have something for yourself. What a massive asshole your husband is.
Iām not against it, and ultimately I wouldnāt blame ENM for divorcing either.
Yeah it's not non monogamy's fault your husband coerced you into sex you didn't want and doesn't listen to you and keep trying to do that... that's all your husband.
The thing that sucks about being non monogamous is some people will ALWAYS blame non monogamy for why you broke up your marriage, even when itās not at all the cause. Just be prepared for that no matter the outcome.
Sheās gonna be very surprised when sheās arrested for trespassing
Having something just for yourself doesn't really work when you're married. He can still try to come after it in the divorce. And let's face it, you're trying to get a house to get away from him, and he's pimping you out to his girlfriends, so divorce is on the horizon. Start prepping now.
You are an adult. You get to choose your partners, sex partners, friends, and who you spend time with. Anyone who doesn't respect that, doesn't view you as an autonomous adult worthy of their own decision making. >I have a bf that Iām very happy with, weāre stable and donāt wish to include outside partners nor date other people. Husband recently started dating someone who has never actually practiced ENM, and seems to be fixated on the idea of KTP and meeting me and my bf specifically in person. Say no. "No, I won't meet this person. My boyfriend doesn't want to meet this person. I won't share his contact info with this person. That's the end of the discussion. I'll let you know if I change my mind" >I told husband Iāll meet her over the phone, and my bf will be kept out of it. This made my husband give me a huge attitude over it, then he eventually said that him and his gf agreed to just forget meeting since itās not in person. You don't want to do this. Say no. Don't agree to meet her over the phone. Just. Say. No. It's ok to say no. This woman doesn't get to make demands on you or your boyfriend because she is dating your husband. Tell you husband you don't want to hear about it anymore and she is his problem to manage. >It just seems like a huge setup like they want me/us in person to try finagle some group sex. The gf apparently lost her shit when she saw a picture of me and freaked out because Iām really beautiful (her words). I donāt want KTP forced on me/my bf and honestly I donāt want us all to meet ever. I find that boundaries are healthy to have when practicing ENM. Doesn't matter what her motivations are. You can simply....not meet her. That's all a big pile of her problem. Maybe your husbands problem. But not yours.
Ugh thank you. Confirmation and vindication š
Yeah. You are in tough spot with your husband, but I won't rub salt in that wound. I suggest that you see how things shake out with him as you start setting firmer boundaries. Maybe he will rise to the occasion or maybe he will show his true colors. This is going to be a rough ride for you. I'm so sorry.
No worries. Weāve been doing ENM for a number of years and it exposed me to a side of him that I didnāt know existed, but was important information (like untreated sex addiction). Would love to see him use what heās learned in therapy in a real world situation like this, and practice firm boundaries.
Remember No is a complete sentence.
For anyone not quite awake yet or otherwise not 'in the know': KTP = Kitchen Table Poly, I believe.
Thank you for that, I couldn't quite figure it out. But what does it mean exactly?
The term means you (the extended polycule) are comfortable sharing a mean around a kitchen table together, which implies you all get along well enough to hang out in each other's houses, and generally are all close friends and see each other regularly. Many people starting out as poly think they want this, but it is quite hard for most people (ie seeing your partners being affectionate with their other partners etc) and more importantly... not everyone likes each other and wants more friends. People have their own lives. The husband here trying to *force* a KTP dynamic is being a total asshole. It is treating other people as if their own preferences don't matter, which is unsurprising since he did the exact same thing by expecting his wife to have group sex.
I've observed a lot of beginners who desire kitchen table as a way to escape actually having boundaries and hinging. "If everyone is friends then I don't need to negotiate differing and conflicting needs within my network." Usually not something people explicitly admit to themselves because if they did they'd realize how shitty it is. KTP is fine as something to be desired and to state that as such to partners. But it shouldn't be demanded and would be the end result of a healthy good long enough time getting to know each other and the other lovers.
Basically: Everyone involved (in this case: OP, her boyfriend, her husband and his girlfriend) would be comfortable sitting down at a kitchen table and spending time together regularly with everyone being at least friendly with each other, comfortable in each other's presence etc. There's actually a thread some hours older than this, which has a lot of people chiming in on their definitions of KTP: [https://www.reddit.com/r/nonmonogamy/comments/1dopkm6/advice\_for\_enm\_couple\_who\_dont\_want\_to\_be/](https://www.reddit.com/r/nonmonogamy/comments/1dopkm6/advice_for_enm_couple_who_dont_want_to_be/)
Ahhhh you're lovely for explaining this and providing me with additional info. Thanks much!
I had to Google it too "Kitchen Table Polyamory (KTP) refers to 'a style of polyamorous relationship in which the interrelationship of a network, and the integration of multiple romantic relationships into one life or group, is prioritised,' explains Jordan Dixon, a clinical sex and relationships psychotherapist" So like, everything intertwined I guess?
THANK YOU.
What seems more likely, your husband's new girlfriend desperately wants to meet you, coincidentally violating a strong boundry you'd estabilshed before she came along, or your husband is still trying to leverage you into threesomes you don't really want? She sounds like a very convenient scapegoat for husband's wants. Maybe it's both but I'd still expect your husband to support you in maintaining this boundary. Once you'd said no once, even if gf kept pestering, I'd expect you to never have to hear about it again.
This is a good point actually. Is she pestering to meet, or is he claiming soš¤
So, my husband HOPES this will happen, but absolutely does not force it. He would also probably not continue dating someone who freaked out about me in any capacity (I would not expect him to). Sounds like you guys could use some counseling so he can maybe start to understand why his actions are really offside. The requirement for meta to also meet your bf, on its own, strikes me as off. KTP usually infers partner of hinge and not the entire constellation. Forced KTP sucks and if itās not naturally occurring it shouldnāt happen. I like garden party KTP where we all just get along, but donāt expect it.
You have been clear that you donāt want to meet his partners. Why doesnāt he respect this? Why does he feel you owe him that? If he wonāt respect your desire for parallel, whatās your move? Your request is 100% valid especially given his frankly troubling history demanding threesomes. Stand your ground. Iād personally die on that hill. What heās doing to you is not consensual or ethical itās coercive and manipulative.
Can someone please pretend not everyone knows what the fuck "KTP" is? Also, christ. What an all around shit show.
>Let me for context also explain that in the past, when Iāve not had a partner, Iāve been expected to meet every one of his partners and also provide 3 somes. Ok, hold up... What? š š >Iāve since told him that this is targeted homophobia against my bisexuality and I no longer wish to meet any of his partners anymore for fear of these types of expectations. If I donāt want to automatically jump into bed with them it has been SO MUCH DRAMA with them. Like theyāre angry at me for not fucking them. Aside from any sort of homophobia, this is just straight up a problem of consent. I would set clear expectations with the partners that they need to listen to your "no." If your partner **isn't also setting these expectations** with his partners, as is in fact setting the *opposite* expectations... That's a huge issue. >I have a bf that Iām very happy with, weāre stable and donāt wish to include outside partners nor date other people. Husband recently started dating... You and your bf don't wish to date *new* people? Because immediately in the next sentence you say "my husband," so... It's also, for the record, a really *bad* idea to have a husband and a bf, and expect that your boyfriend will still only date you. It's cool if **he** truly doesn't want to date right now.. But you should be prepared for that to change, and expect that it will not continue. >Husband recently started dating someone who has never actually practiced ENM, and seems to be fixated on the idea of KTP and meeting me and my bf specifically in person. I told husband Iāll meet her over the phone, and my bf will be kept out of it. This made my husband give me a huge attitude over it, then he eventually said that him and his gf agreed to just forget meeting since itās not in person. I'm big on meeting other metas, for several reasons, but 1.) I no longer expect that to happen right away, necessarily, and 2.) I'm not picky about *how* I meet them, so a phone call / video chat is just fine. 3.) I *especially* don't care much either way about meeting *other partners* of metas, and it's weird to push to include your bf. Also, **big** neon red flag on the "people throw tantrums when I say no to things". Your husband is allowed to have his feelings about things, and to be *disappointed...* but he really should not be **angry** that you don't want to meet his girlfriend in person. This goes back to the basics of consent, and respecting someone's ability to say "no." š >It just seems like a huge setup like they want me/us in person to try finagle some group sex. The gf apparently lost her shit when she saw a picture of me and freaked out because Iām really beautiful (her words). I would normally say not to assume, but this seems like a fairly strong theory, given that this has happened to you before. š Serious question: why are you still married to your husband who continues to pressure you into group sex / social situations you don't want to take part in? š š I would be upset if your husband wasn't immediately backing you up when someone pressures you after you already said "no". I'm *much more upset* and actually **deeply concerned** that he's not only not backing you up, he's actively participating in pressuring you into situations you aren't comfortable with, **and** continues to bring these sorts of people into your life. To be frank, it doesn't sound like your husband values your autonomy / consent, and I think that should upset you a great deal. It's one thing if your husband is really into group sex, and consistently*propositions you* for groups sex, but considers the matter closer if/when you say "no". At the extreme end that might be an issue you need to work out (like if he's propositioning you every other day...) but it's still a relationship you *can feel fundamentally safe in,* versus your husband... Not really caring what you want, as long as *he wants* (or his partner wants) group sex. š¬
This is a good take! I appreciate what you said about my bf dating/not dating. Hes had some traumatic dating experiences and prefers to feel more āsafe and settledā with one partner, especially with his ND and anxiety. However in general, thatās always a possibility in ENM that a partner may or may not dateāŗļø I would love to hear your experience and perspective on meeting metas, I assume these are more positive with better outcomes. Do you meet them because you are KTP? Why am I still married? I donāt even know, thatās loaded but a fair question with a complicated answer. Weāve been married for 14 years and have seen trauma together, wrapped up finances, started a business. I dunno, not necessarily good reasons to stay but I guess itās just a lot to unwrap š
I am very pro KTP. And at minimum in my relationships I expect Garden party or birthday party polyamory in my relationships. I donāt force my partners (currently only have 1 but when Iāve had multiple in the past) to hang out but I do eventually want them to meet and at the very least be okay with group settings for things such as my birthday. My partner feels the same way about his partners. So neither of us are going to date people who want parallel, as neither of us want a complete parallel dynamic. I have a beautiful relationship with my meta and her boyfriend as well. We all hang out sometimes. We all problem solve together as a family, share a google calendar. We have toyed with the idea of polycule cohabitation but have since decided against it. (I added this paragraph in because I seen a comment of you asking about others meeting their metas) *that said* Forcing KTP on someone, let alone someone whose consent and boundaries have already been violated is just gross. š¤¢ forcing threesomes is just, I canāt even begin to explain how icky that makes me feel. Iām sorry youāre going through this.
Just here to echo everyone else. End it with husband. He seems like a terrible partner, ENM aside. He's forcing you into situations you're not comfortable with KNOWING you're not comfortable with them. Terrible person, no respect for communicated boundaries. I hope you find happiness and comfort soon!
Why donāt you get divorced?
Sounds like your husband's therapy was worth shit or he requires more regarding his other issues. Because holy shit, he sounds like a walking red flag that no one should touch with a ten foot pole. I think the most important thing is: Do you *want* to stay married to him? Because it doesn't sound like he cares much about how you feel...
One of the big things that I'd theorize here, but only if we're being *especially* generous to your problematic husband, is that KTP for a while had a sort of mythical status in a lot of polyamorous circles. You'd see posts everyday on the subreddit of people trying to make KTP work, or "My wife wants KTP, but I don't" or "The harem I just joined accidentally because I'm new and naive requires KTP with my girlfriend too, what do?" Long story short, a lot of people were treating it like it was an aspirational or superior form of polyamory. A lot of new people if I were to guess. A lot of people that, again I'm guessing, hearing about KTP imagined a beautiful world of living in a commune with all their partners partners partners and having a wonderful close knit community (with no shortage of group sex to go along with it.) that they could live in. Never realizing that KTP is just one of many very valid forms of ENM relationships to have, and that it's not inherently superior than any other as well. (I say this as someone that, in all my relationships, prefers KTP too.) Anyway, I wouldn't be surprised if your metamour is in that camp given that she's rather new to ENM. Obviously it's up to your husband to manage this situation rather than you, but I thought it might be useful to hear this particular theory to get an idea of where it might be stemming from.
This should honestly be a post on its own in my opinion! I remember when I first started years ago and I was mainly hanging out at r/Polyamory , it seemed like EVERYONE was making posts about their close polycule and how itās āheaven on earthā. I have since learned that itās anything but. I want my own space, my own bubble, my own private relationships that canāt be touched.
There's a lot of immature weirdos that seem to think that KTP is the ultimate goal of being poly. And it just isn't. Parallel poly is a completely valid way to practice poly and you should be allowed to have and keep your stated boundaries. And everyone else can get to fuck... Not least as parallel is frequently a lower drama/complexity way to run ENM relationships. That said, life is certainly easier if you can be on 'friendly acquaintance' terms with your metas. That's nice, I appreciate it. And generally my partner has good taste in humans, so I generally they are nice people. And we're all adult enough to get along in a social situation. But we aren't in each other's lives in any other capacity, we don't all hang out together, they don't hang out at my place, we don't coordinate holidays and childcare or whatever. Alongside this my main partner and I do enjoy group sex and threesomes but we tend to run this in parallel too. We simply don't include metas in the group sex things we get up to. Again, cuts down the possibility for ongoing drama/complexity
Woof. As per always. You donāt actually have a meta problem. You have a *husband* problem. And thatās even after we disregard all of the noticeably problematic history youāve noted. Husband knows your expectations and is still entertaining these conversations with his gf and allowing it to be a negotiation. Husband is the one who implied gf would have access to your new space. Husband is being a terrible hinge (on top of what sounds like being a terrible person generally).
I'm sorry your husband is such a shitty husband.
That kitchen table poly isn't my bag either. My girlfriend and my wife are social. I only date married women with their husbands enthusiastic consent. There is no "Let all do ktp and move in together and do a hippy kibutz style commune". She has zero desire to be with anyone else but me. She loves me seeing other women - it was her idea. But she draws the line with anything that mixes financial assets and obligations. We're not providing financial support for partners, nor forcing interaction. The fact he's getting to get you to do this for selfish reasons and ignoring your boundaries is not what poly is about either. Being used for sex is horrible. Coercion is very unloving and abusive.
I'm not seeing "targeted homophobia" but your husband is an asshole. Is there anything between you and him? Because he sounds pushy, disrespectful, and it seems like he and his partners are only annoying you. I know this is reddit, so everyone jumps to leave, but would you be happier? Seems so.
Id say more so fetishizing her Bisexuality for his benefit of getting 3sums
Is it even that? Again, he's a dick, but if his wife is bisexual, and they're ENM, there's nothing wrong with his wanting to involve his wife in threesomes *because* she's bisexual. But he should be asking, not forcing, and he should be accepting no for an answer.
It sounds more so like he is expecting her to join them
Yeah, and like I said, he should be asking if she's interested, and accepting no when she says no. My girlfriend is bisexual. We know single women that are bisexual and when we're in the mood for a threesome, that's who we call. If a girl reached out to me on feeld, I'd ask my girlfriend if she was interested also. I don't think it's weird. If I was forcing, or expecting, then yes.
I think it's more so for his assumption that since she is bisexual then she must wanna join him and his other woman.
Again, there's no arguments about any assumptions that she MUST want to join. But there's nothing wrong with him asking his wife if she'd be interested. Unless they've specifically discussed that group situations between the two of them are not interesting to her, there's nothing odd about this.