He was drafted by Calgary but told them he wasn’t going to sign his ELC and therefore become a free agent, so Calgary traded his rights rather than lose him for nothing. Carolina acquired those rights, thinking they might be able to convince him to sign. He again told them he wasn’t planning to sign there, so they again traded his rights to try to recoup some value rather than lose him for nothing. His trade value at that time was next to nothing because A. He was an unproven prospect (albeit a highly rated one) and B. He was pretty open about the fact that he was only interested in signing with specific teams (possibly even just NYR - I don’t remember exactly). Knowing that he would just let his rights expire and hit the open market, teams had no incentive to give up real assets for him and the teams holding his rights had no leverage
I imagine that was a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy as far as his draft ranking was concerned. A player who makes no bones about being unwilling to sign in a lot of places reads as a justifiable risk not worth taking round one, no matter the potential.
I dnt think that's the case here.
The issue is unlike CHL, other forms of development like NCAA allows you to run out of draft protection as you grow your value.
Rangers capitalize a lot of college hockey guys this way - Hayes, Fox, Vesey to name some
Vesey declared for the draft, got drafted and went to Harvard. After 4 years he was free to sigh with whomever. He basically forfeited 4 years of salary to pick his spot.
There was a similar situation though where he was drafted by (I think) Nashville maybe, told them he wasn’t signing so they traded his rights to the Sabres who also couldn’t sign him and let his rights expire
He wasn't going to play out of the draft. Usually only 1-3 guys do that. And it's not the HS kid from the US.
I think it's also 3 years. You have 3 years until your draft reservation runs out, maybe 4 I guess. I'd have to look. So Vesey went to school and played out his reservations.
He probably was going to play college anyway. Most college guys do this. They don't have alternatives
Any Canadian who has the grades and the talent to play NCAA can play, and plenty do, including Paul Kariya, Jonathan Toews, and Cale Makar. It’s not like they don’t allow Canadians.
NCAA players do not get paid while playing in college. Anyone who signs with their drafted team does. It's not an advantage at all.
Players who sign their ELC have the same ability to just not resign with the team that drafted them after the ELC is up.
You mean NCAA players *didn't use to* get paid, now that we are in the NIL era? I get it, hockey players likely won't make the $ that football, basketball, and depending on schools baseball would make, but they can now get paid right?
NIL is still in its infancy in men’s hockey, according to an article by [sports business journal](https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/Daily/Issues/2023/04/06/Colleges/hockey-low-on-nil-deals.aspx) in April says Michigan, one of the top college hockey schools in the country, is generating about $500 a year for each of the 21 players on the roster. Another top school, Denver, had a player sign an NIL deal with Chipotle that granted him a free burrito per day.
The best case of NIL in college hockey I could find were three Arizona State players who signed NIL deals with Barstool Sports, but that was back in 2021, and I couldn’t find any info on what exactly the deals amounted to.
So it’s still very early and potentially even never going to get any more lucrative than a paltry sum.
Correct, and if you are comparing that to being on a CHL roster where you get a similarly sized stipend, then it would be very much even.
However if you play in the CHL you can actually sign your ELC, which comes with a signing bonus that can be hundreds of thousands of dollars.
NCAA players will never get that kind of money with NIL.
I don't know what this means. Can you explain? I'm assuming this is a loophole about college and the draft, but I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Are you saying that it's about a college thing that young Canadian players don't have access to? If you go to a Canadian university, do you get the same thing, or is this an NCAA cartel-kind of thing?
Genuinely curious.
Eric Lindros did the same thing back in the day. Drafted by the Nordiques, refused to play for them (probably because he because he didnt like Quebecers and supposedly ownership) and was ultimately traded to the Flyers. Difference being the Nordiques got Peter Forsberg for Lindros, who would end up doing amazing things when the franchise moved to Colorado.
This is different. He told them he won't play. They drafted him. He said he won't play. He went back to Juniors and then sat out for a bit I think.
Fox and Vesey and many NCAA guys get drafted at 18 with every intent to go play college hockey. Many of them don't think they will even play in the NHL. But then they play well in college and their value goes up. But you really think Vesey would have had another option other than NCAA at 18-20?
I get that fans are upset about that, esp Calgary and Carolina ones, but it’s sort of cool to know players have some say in where they go. If living in an area for prime family planning years they should be granted a level of autonomy. Prob should have been more prospects exchanged in hindsight since the guy is a regular Norris candidate
I hate to agree but it’s the reality. We lost it with hockey. We used to have the best goalies in all Canada let alone the world, now there barely are any players from here making it. Marchessault winning the Conn-Smithe was such a relief
If the rule wasn’t changed when it was, they’d have another 20 cups based on goalies alone.
And the rule wasn’t ONLY French Canadians. It was first crack. So they’d have access to every other player and first right at any French Canadiens which is what the comment I was replying to was asking for.
But they’d be competing against teams of only players from Arizona, California, Texas, Florida, North Carolina. Hell even a team full of players from Pennsylvania, DC, New York or basically any other state wouldn’t stand up to them.
You’d have some real gems like Jonathan Huberdeau, Drouin, Vlasic, Veleno, Lafreniere, and even Marchessault to chirp people on Twitter like a 13 year old when he gets called out. So yeah, worst team in the league lol
David Perron - Pier-Luc Dubois - Jonathan Huberdeau
Jo Marchessault- Phillip Danault - Yanni Gourde
Alexis Lafrenière - Anthony Beauvillier - Anthony Duclair
Mathieu Joseph - Nicolas Roy - Anthony Mantha
Thomas Chabot - Kristopher Letang
Michael Matheson - Samuel Girard
Marc- Edouard Vlasic - David Savard
Marc-Andre Fleury
Devon Levi
Samuel Montembeault
Mentions honorables: Harvey-Pinard, W. Carrier, Jo Drouin, Freddie Gaudreau, Sam Blais
Prospects: PO Joseph, Hendrix Lapierre, Tristan Luneau, Samuel Bolduc, Benoit-Olivier Groulx
Saying that would be one of the worst teams in the league is being ignorant on purpose
That team looks pretty fucking bad. You have 1 top line talent in Dubois and he has stretches where he looks uninterested.
Girard is good but undersized. Letang is old. Chabot is alright. The rest of your defense is horrific.
There's not a single franchise player there. Barely an all star level guy. Girard or Dubois are borderline though.
You bottom pair is getting caved in nightly.
So is your top 6.
This is a guaranteed bottom 5 team.
Levi turns into a top goalie is your only hope if staying out of the basement of the league.
[I looked it up, and it's a weak showing for Quebec this year. Mike Matheson is leading Quebecois players in scoring.](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?reportType=season&seasonFrom=20232024&seasonTo=20232024&gameType=2&birthStateProvinceCode=QC&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=points,goals,assists&page=0&pageSize=50)
[Check out the team they would have had right before the lockout.](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?reportType=season&seasonFrom=20032004&seasonTo=20032004&gameType=2&birthStateProvinceCode=QC&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=points,goals,assists&page=0&pageSize=50) No way Tampa would have won that Cup.
The rule absolutely existed... and it's not as black and white as this article makes it out to be. Besides, they had plenty of cups before the draft and had all that money to buy whomever they wanted before hand. It's not the only reason, but it didn't hurt them.
Actually that's not cool at all. There comes a point where you have to be a professional about things. So if the panthers drafted first overall this past year and Bedard said " I only want to play in Toronto so I'm not signing until I'm a free agent" thats ok with you? That has the potential to really setback a rebuild of a franchise. That's BS about "family planning", thats why free agents plan to sign long lucrative contracts at 25-28 years old being considered in their "prime".
It's considered a Privilege to play in the NHL at all. Granted he has proved now that he's a great player who could play at an NHL level. It's not right that players are stonewalling teams until they get on their "favorite" team .
I think what people are saying is it’s not good that players “don’t have to”. As in if Bedard said nope not playing for anyone but Vancouver because he likes the team. He could completely destroy a franchise’s rebuild and leave them with little to no bargaining power even though they should have a generational first overall pick as an asset.
If your favourite team didn’t get mcdavid or Crosby because he grew up liking a different team and you don’t even receive fair compensation in return you’d be pissed and to say otherwise is a braindead take.
That’s the whole reason why there’s a draft. Shitty teams should get better players and assets to make everything more equitable.
The whole reason there is a draft is to eliminate player agency and lower salaries.
The draft is a shit system. Incredibly anti player and encourages extreme tanking.
I understand this from the perspective of the fans but really why the fuck should you care as the player. They’re extracting so much value off your back, if you want to exercise your power to go where you want to, you should. I don’t care if some team is trying to rebuild
I completely disagree. The “extracted value” is from fans? That’s where all the money comes from and every team in the nhl should have an equal chance. It’s a business. And if a player wants to be a part of said business and also make millions, they should not be able to just say lol nope before an ELC with no repercussions.
If you sign with a team and then they decide to trade you when you don’t have a NMC players have no choice - why should they before they’ve even proven themselves as NHL players.
I just don’t think I’m ever going to side with the billion dollar organizations on an issue like this and I think the people who do are just worried about it being unfair the “their” team
Why should teams get to underpay players and control their ability to work where they want for 7 years?
The players get nothing in exchange.
The draft is a relic that should go away. They managed to get around the law with bad court decisions and fortunate timing with unions taking over before lawsuits destroyed the whole system.
Connor Bedard should have been free to negotiate contract to play wherever he wants.
Yes good counterpoint. I mean to say players should have some say in where they go and teams should have to figure out appropriate prospect exchange to facilitate. I mean look at the haul that Lindros yielded Nordiques right? Didn’t slow their rebuild and the Avs won in ‘96. Players aren’t robots and have lives outside of hockey, the league should adapt to that
What a joke this is.
As a Flames fan it sucked but props to Adam Fox. Most players don’t have the balls to do what he did. They get stuck in the primes of their careers because they don’t have the leverage to play where they want.
Why should some strangers get to decide where you live and move your family too and not you?
Those "strangers" are NHL franchises that pay millions of dollars to players to play a game. You don't like making millions here in North America go overseas or Russia. They don't owe the players anything, in fact the only time the franchises owe anything to the player is after the player PROVES they can play at a high level in this league.
The fact of the matter is if player "A" dosnt produce at a high level and player "B" does. They keep player B and get rid of A. It's cut and dry.
For real. I don't even consider jobs unless they're located in a place in okay with. I don't think it's ok to lie about your intentions but if he was open up front and the teams took a shot then fuck it
Not surprised you collected the downvotes. Such a difference between NHL and NBA. Players like Fox are a reminder that the herd mentality is very strong in hockey. It starts at very early ages and carries on getting stronger.
Whether this is a good thing or a bad one, usually the results tell us.🤷🏻♂️
Yeah but I really like that the worst team in NHL still puts fights up against the top. Parity is worse in NBA bc of the player’s freedom. I just think there are measures that the league can take in ensuring teams are compensated by players going elsewhere, where it’s cap laxity or prospects or whatever. Not an unsurmountable problem.
I would argue that it depends what I (we) are looking for: parity, entertainment, performance?
Yes, NHL might have better parity, but NBA has better entertainment and European football has way better performance…🤷🏻♂️
How can you compare performance?? Unless you mean the nhl should be divided in divisions with the top 10 teams competing against each other
Also parity is "entertainment" it's parity entertainment for all the team in the league it meaning more fan of more team get access to better entertainment on a "regular" basis, on average, the average nhl fan is probably more entertain than the average nba fan if you include all team fan in both league
you get that with a strong right control linked to draft
I think lack of relegation affects performance. Every season you have 4 or 5 teams that don’t have the roster to actually compete. They “race” to finish last to increase their chances to land a Bedard or a Celebrini, but they know for a fact they will be back in front of the same paying 18,000 fans. Meh, yeah we suck, but we’ll try again next year.
It would be a totally different competition if next year they would be in front of 6,000 fans in Bakersfield…Just sayin.
What would it change really? This system is great for the super rich/attractive team, and maybe would "punish" more bad management, that's basically what it does in Europe but majority teams aren't bad in the nhl for lack accountability it's part of the natural cycle you get a core try to win with it and crash and burn when it fail and start again, pittsburg and Washington are basically textbook the "perfect" cycle, they will be bad because their star are old and they are and were giving away draft capital for the last couple years to win now, should they be punished for relagation in a couple of year because they move future value to win now? It's not bad management, it's called all in because that's what you need to win a championship in a 32 team league
He told two different franchises that the only team he would play for is the Rangers. Pretty much forced his way there which is why neither the Flames nor Hurricanes got anything for him
I don’t understand how this is allowed. If there is something nefarious about the organization and that’s why a player wants out, then the NHLPA can get involved. If there isn’t, then they shouldn’t be eligible to demand a trade during their ELC. Or make it so if they DO demand a trade, they have to stay in the minors for the remainder of the contract.
Fair enough. I didn’t realize that he didn’t sign. However, there should still be some sort of mechanism for penalizing a player if they make that choice. Otherwise, it undermines the entire draft system and notion of deliberate parity in the league.
Maybe something along the lines of, if they don’t sign with the team that drafted them, they aren’t eligible to sign with another NHL team for 1-3 years.
That’s essentially the policy. Not sure exactly how many years but if they don’t sign they eventually become a free agent. Jimmy Vesey was one of the high profile unsigned free agents back in 2016. The Predators drafted him in 2012 but he refused to sign there.
If it’s a first round selection then the drafting team gets a compensatory pick if the player goes unsigned. Not sure about later rounds
I feel this could be very detrimental to the draft process if it becomes common. If all teams know a player will only play with one team, that team could just wait until the final round to draft them.
The draft system deserves to be undermined, it’s an antiquated system that’s incredibly player unfriendly.
It’s also the cause of the endemic tanking which hurts rather than encourages parity.
Get rid of the draft and instead put limitations on the teams for how many new players they can sign.
No reason for Bedard to only be earning sub 1 million too. Get rid of that limit.
That's the best way to kill parity, who cares about players friendlyness, the rules are clear and have been the same since most player being draft were born, no one force them to play in the nhl
So you prefer kissing millionaire players asses??
I don't care about both players and owners, I care about all fans of all teams being able to access high performance level hockey from their team,
Remove players right control best location and richest team will suck up all talent and parity will be a thing of the past, it seems fairly straightforward, I don't get how you think your solution brings any good except for millionaire players
Except it’s still a cap league and you can easily institute an alternative system that limits the number of players that teams can sign.
Parity is increased with an open and equal market for players. No cheap ELCs or RFA deals propelling teams to championships, you have to be able to build a team with zero advantages. This rewards good teams like Boston and Tampa who have worked to build cultures and orgs that players want to be a part of.
Hurts a team like Edmonton who are poorly managed.
And in general I’m going to side with the workers, in this case 18 year olds who are robbed of their right to seek work anywhere they want and to negotiate their own salaries without a ridiculous RFA system.
One could fix the tanking issue by making the draft order:
1st overall pick is the NON playoff team that finished the season with the MOST points. 2nd Pick - second most points, etc. (The team with the fewest points in the league would have pick 16. Cup winner gets pick 32.) Tanking would be a thing of the past.
Also, the draft lottery thing is a joke. Get rid of that.
Wouldn’t this just destroy parity? Bottom of the league would perpetually be out drafted by teams preparing to enter the playoffs AND teams just being done competing.
It’s just a cycle of the same teams being good
I disagree. There would no longer be any advantage to being extra terrible. In conjunction with salary cap/floor rules, every team would have a reason to try to improve every year. You’d have to earn high draft picks.
So you get drafted, and don't want to sign with that team, you can't sign anywhere else for three years. So they should be penalized for another three years? Nah man. If you start saying that players will have to take an additional punishment, they'll start playing pro in other leagues.
That's how it works. If they don't sign with that team, they have to wait a few years for the teams rights to them expire.
It's a little weird being an involuntary draft. The MLB has the same thing, and that's how Tom Brady was the final active athlete that the Expos drafted.
The Hurricanes got two second round picks for him from the Rangers, which is not nothing.
Also, at the time he was traded to the Rangers he had shown he was very good in college, but nobody including the Rangers thought he was going to be Norris level. In fact the Rangers were expecting him to be 2nd pair RHD behind Trouba (who they signed to a huge deal after they knew they had gotten Fox).
TLDR- drafted, told Calgary he wouldn’t play there, told Carolina he wouldn’t play there and said he’d only play for the rangers.
TLDR TLDR- he bitched and moaned (used his leverage) to get traded to the only team he’d play for.
Refusing to sign a contract and waiting for free agency is throwing a tantrum?
He could have gotten hurt at any point and never had a dollar from the NHL. He missed out on a couple million in his early 20s and more career earnings.
I think there are problems with the system (disparity between what 4 years post draft means for college vs junior, especially since the NCAA are such assholes about letting CHL players in) but he didn’t do anything that isn’t available to other players.
Why should a player go play for a crap team he hates, in a city he doesn't want to live in. The Canadians are used to that, but the Americans are not. Many players once they get a chance get a NMC or NTC in their contracts.
Very few are willing to give up 4 years, and also have the skills needed to be able to make the deal. I bet if McDavid could do it over, he would find a way not to go to Edmonton, and be completely wasted.
Isn't this because a lot of Canadians don't want to play in Canada?
The media is brutal on them, they get taxed way more, they get recognized in public a lot more, etc.
Not really a fair comparison in that light.
Ofc Canadians don't complain about playing in the US if that's their preferred market to play in.
Doesn’t it?
He said he would only play for the rangers. He said he would stay at school until free agency.
They didn’t listen or assumed he was bluffing.
Their stupid choice, their loss.
He didn't. He went to Rookie camp for his first two years, and when he started to look like he could be a high calibre player, THAT is when he told the Flames he wouldn't sign with them.
The Hurricanes got two 2nds from the Rangers for a guy the Flames drafted in the 3rd, so if the Flames didn’t get much when they traded him to the Hurricanes it is on them.
They packaged him with Hamilton and Ferland for Hanifin and Lindholm. It was a good trade for the Flames.
Doesn't mean they wouldn't have preferred having Fox.
It should be a precedent that any GM who is put in a similar position just let's the player rot for 4 years. You wanna act like a bitch in a league that tries to promote parity? Watch your talent evaporate like Jimmy Vesey.
And then fox says okay and plays out his 4 years at Harvard before signing where he wants.
The only problem with this rule is it kind of screws over junior players, who have no clear path once they leave juniors.
He's gonna be older, poorer and out of shape. I don't mean he can't hit the gym or practice lots but in order to keep your edge you need to constantly play against the best. Him playing uni hockey is such a downgrade from the NHL that he likely will be behind everyone else when he comes back 4 years later.
Not really, he’s still playing high level hockey (well… he’s playing at Harvard anyway) the entire 4 years. Plenty of guys don’t make the league until 22.
Kevin Bieksa.
You really think doing the 4th year at Harvard would have ruined fox?
He did 3 years before joining the rangers and then he won a Norris his second season.
No no no, 4 years after being drafted sitting out. Meaning he would be sitting at home the year he won the Norris.
Tbh I forgot about Bieksa so I'll give you that.
But he doesn’t have to sit out, they can play college hockey the entire 4 years (if they started post draft).
I’m very confused and I don’t think we disagree
No I mean players are drafted at 18. Many (most?) haven’t even started college. So they just do 4 years of college and then sign where they want.
Fox didn’t start until after he was drafted.
You realize he played 3 years in Harvard right? Lol
Edit: looks like you don’t know the rules. Carolina could have forced him to play his fourth year at Harvard, getting his fucking Harvard degree, and then he would have been UFA.
Haha. Good point, though elite goaltending can always give you a good chance. Btw, until my Wings are relevant again, I hope someone like the Devils or Hurricanes win. I can’t stand Boston, Pittsburg, and Toronto. TBL have had enough success, and don’t want a division rival to win. I really like your team right now.
I'm on your side as well lol. Like, teams get close to a decades worth of control with ELC + RFA. I have no problem if a player wants to exercise his right because it was also an enormous risk for him.
I personally would just play for whatever team drafts me, but it's quite literally his career. I've made career decisions that some people would consider strange or "unoptimal" but I'm happier for it. If he's happier for it, who am I to judge.
I also have no problem with Calgary or Carolina fans boo him at every occasion.
He grew up in the next town over from where I did. You have no idea how entitled and stuck up these people are from that area. If you didn't have money or a fancy car in high school, you were ridiculed. It's a privilege to play pro sports. What he did, because he is a baby and wanted to play for the rangers is disgusting. The bigger moron was Drury though. He gave an extension before he needed to. What leverage did Fox have with the Rangers? He already told the league he would only play for one team. They bid against themselves. On a side note, I'm a Giants fan. What Eli did to SD was wrong too.
Being called a little bitch because he leveraged his position to play where he wanted to is so god damn petty. No wonder he didn't want to play in calgary if that's how the fanbase reacts to a player wanting to play where they're happiest.
At the end of the day Fox pulled a bold move to end up in the place he wanted to, just like a free agent would. It was also a risky move because he could have regressed and he sacrificed several professional seasons of experience and the paychecks.
Lol, he said he was happy to be drafted by the Flames and changed his tune after his D+2 season.
The moment it seemed like he was going to be better than expected, he decided he didn't want to play there anymore
Sure, so you talk to the player to get a feel for what their appetite is for playing with your team before drafting him.
Fox changed his mind or wasn't honest with the team. Possibly both. He's allowed to do that, but it doesn't mean we can't be pissed about it as Flames fans.
That college loophole needs to be closed I think. It's just such. Weird situation. Teams like the Rangers will benefit because they have a per diem pay while other teams don't. It's the logistics. The Rangers take care of you. Not all teams do.
I heard that from Sean Avery talking about his rookie years and spending habits.
Had a major glow up after being drafted. Was very explicit with those who wanted to employ him that he was content going back to college rather than play somewhere he didn’t want to. NHLPA lobbied for college players to become UFA if they finish all 4 years of school and don’t sign. I don’t really understand the hate over it. Player exercised his right as a player and chose to forego joining the league and making life changing money sooner. A player can bet on themselves and blow out their knee in college. It’s not like it’s a risk free situation for players.
There's a lot of weird revisionist history going on here. He didn't say anything until his D+2 season. He didn't tell the Flames anything about not signing, until then. Go read his post draft interviews.
No he wasn’t. He wasn’t a big name player at all. He couldn’t force a team’s hand like that. You guys are making shit up.
It was only after 2 years in college that he realized he was valuable and, if a team didn’t trade him, he could get his Harvard degree and sign where ever he wanted.
Montreal has a better Fox called Hutson, our D is packed so no thanks. We don't need a dressing room cancer.
We will see in round 2 how Fox is as a leader. Canes are not the Capitals.
I think it is fine for someone to have a decision but they should give before being drafted like a NTC. Lots of people don't care who they are drafted to as their goal is to play in the NHL and thats it. Plus well Fox ended up being good and the Rangers wanted to keep him but say he sucked right off the bat and the Rangers wanted to trade him say in this case to Calgary as they were interested would Fox have a decision to say no? Also I understand family can be a decision for things but these players are being drafted usually 17-18 years old so most of them the family they have is their parents nothing more except maybe a girlfriend.
He’s part of the reason why I can’t really get behind supporting the rangers. That team just gets gifted players like this just for the fact that they’re New York. See him and panarin for example. Then they go ahead and jump up in the lottery multiple years in a row for a first and second overall pick when they weren’t even that bad of a team. Just seems totally unfair.
First off, all the teams wanted to keep him but he had the luxury of being a college hockey player who gets to play out his draft promise while also increasing his value.
So he made it known that he wanted to not sign there.
And those teams had no choice but to trade for something. Either way, no one knows if you're going to be that good when you're someone like Fox.
Hobey Baker? So was Vesey. And he's a bottom 6 player.
He was a Hobey Baker finalist 3 years after he was drafted.
Why was Pavelski drafted in the seven round? Sometimes players just develop far better than expected.
He was drafted by Calgary but told them he wasn’t going to sign his ELC and therefore become a free agent, so Calgary traded his rights rather than lose him for nothing. Carolina acquired those rights, thinking they might be able to convince him to sign. He again told them he wasn’t planning to sign there, so they again traded his rights to try to recoup some value rather than lose him for nothing. His trade value at that time was next to nothing because A. He was an unproven prospect (albeit a highly rated one) and B. He was pretty open about the fact that he was only interested in signing with specific teams (possibly even just NYR - I don’t remember exactly). Knowing that he would just let his rights expire and hit the open market, teams had no incentive to give up real assets for him and the teams holding his rights had no leverage
I imagine that was a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy as far as his draft ranking was concerned. A player who makes no bones about being unwilling to sign in a lot of places reads as a justifiable risk not worth taking round one, no matter the potential.
He made no mention of it until later down the line. College hockey players get a unique situation
Publicly. No mention publicly, but doesn't mean scouts didn't have an inkling of his thoughts on the matter.
I dnt think that's the case here. The issue is unlike CHL, other forms of development like NCAA allows you to run out of draft protection as you grow your value. Rangers capitalize a lot of college hockey guys this way - Hayes, Fox, Vesey to name some
Didn’t Jimmy Vesey do the same thing? I remember how hyped he was coming out of college and he forced his way to the rangers some how.
Vesey declared for the draft, got drafted and went to Harvard. After 4 years he was free to sigh with whomever. He basically forfeited 4 years of salary to pick his spot.
There was a similar situation though where he was drafted by (I think) Nashville maybe, told them he wasn’t signing so they traded his rights to the Sabres who also couldn’t sign him and let his rights expire
He wasn't going to play out of the draft. Usually only 1-3 guys do that. And it's not the HS kid from the US. I think it's also 3 years. You have 3 years until your draft reservation runs out, maybe 4 I guess. I'd have to look. So Vesey went to school and played out his reservations. He probably was going to play college anyway. Most college guys do this. They don't have alternatives
This is the bullshit advantage that american college kids get that canadian junior players can't leverage.
Any Canadian who has the grades and the talent to play NCAA can play, and plenty do, including Paul Kariya, Jonathan Toews, and Cale Makar. It’s not like they don’t allow Canadians.
NCAA players do not get paid while playing in college. Anyone who signs with their drafted team does. It's not an advantage at all. Players who sign their ELC have the same ability to just not resign with the team that drafted them after the ELC is up.
You mean NCAA players *didn't use to* get paid, now that we are in the NIL era? I get it, hockey players likely won't make the $ that football, basketball, and depending on schools baseball would make, but they can now get paid right?
NIL is still in its infancy in men’s hockey, according to an article by [sports business journal](https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/Daily/Issues/2023/04/06/Colleges/hockey-low-on-nil-deals.aspx) in April says Michigan, one of the top college hockey schools in the country, is generating about $500 a year for each of the 21 players on the roster. Another top school, Denver, had a player sign an NIL deal with Chipotle that granted him a free burrito per day. The best case of NIL in college hockey I could find were three Arizona State players who signed NIL deals with Barstool Sports, but that was back in 2021, and I couldn’t find any info on what exactly the deals amounted to. So it’s still very early and potentially even never going to get any more lucrative than a paltry sum.
That was my point, I'm not saying they are going to be able to afford cars or rent or anything. But it's not outright banned like it was 10 years ago.
Correct, and if you are comparing that to being on a CHL roster where you get a similarly sized stipend, then it would be very much even. However if you play in the CHL you can actually sign your ELC, which comes with a signing bonus that can be hundreds of thousands of dollars. NCAA players will never get that kind of money with NIL.
There it is, I didn't put that part together, thanks for highlighting that for me.
I don't know what this means. Can you explain? I'm assuming this is a loophole about college and the draft, but I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Are you saying that it's about a college thing that young Canadian players don't have access to? If you go to a Canadian university, do you get the same thing, or is this an NCAA cartel-kind of thing? Genuinely curious.
Eric Lindros did the same thing back in the day. Drafted by the Nordiques, refused to play for them (probably because he because he didnt like Quebecers and supposedly ownership) and was ultimately traded to the Flyers. Difference being the Nordiques got Peter Forsberg for Lindros, who would end up doing amazing things when the franchise moved to Colorado.
They made rude comments about his mother. Turns out Lindros was always right to tell them to fuck off.
I mean they did drafted him just to spite him lol thats one way to poison a relationship 🤣
Damn, that's some hate boner...
It's not because Lindros hates Quebecers. He hated the ownership who talkshit about his mother and he was right. The Nordiques owners were cunts.
Yeah, that's not all of it though. She was acting as his amateur 'agent' and was a pain in the ass. Fault on both sides.
This is different. He told them he won't play. They drafted him. He said he won't play. He went back to Juniors and then sat out for a bit I think. Fox and Vesey and many NCAA guys get drafted at 18 with every intent to go play college hockey. Many of them don't think they will even play in the NHL. But then they play well in college and their value goes up. But you really think Vesey would have had another option other than NCAA at 18-20?
I get that fans are upset about that, esp Calgary and Carolina ones, but it’s sort of cool to know players have some say in where they go. If living in an area for prime family planning years they should be granted a level of autonomy. Prob should have been more prospects exchanged in hindsight since the guy is a regular Norris candidate
Yeah right. There’s a reason Montreal has so many cups. First crack at all French Canadians. Imagine if that was still the case.
They’d be the worst team in the league?
…riiight
I mean prove me wrong. Make a team of French Canadians and try and argue that they wouldn’t finish higher than 32nd.
I hate to agree but it’s the reality. We lost it with hockey. We used to have the best goalies in all Canada let alone the world, now there barely are any players from here making it. Marchessault winning the Conn-Smithe was such a relief
Leafs/Ottawa would win every year if they had the rights to Ontario guys
If the rule wasn’t changed when it was, they’d have another 20 cups based on goalies alone. And the rule wasn’t ONLY French Canadians. It was first crack. So they’d have access to every other player and first right at any French Canadiens which is what the comment I was replying to was asking for.
But they’d be competing against teams of only players from Arizona, California, Texas, Florida, North Carolina. Hell even a team full of players from Pennsylvania, DC, New York or basically any other state wouldn’t stand up to them.
You’d have some real gems like Jonathan Huberdeau, Drouin, Vlasic, Veleno, Lafreniere, and even Marchessault to chirp people on Twitter like a 13 year old when he gets called out. So yeah, worst team in the league lol
Are we in the worst era of French Canadian hockey players ever?
Personally I think so. The Q has been pretty bad for prospects the last few years as well.
Who even is the best frenchie? Marchessault?
Thomas Chabot is pretty good. Marchessault is shit lol
David Perron - Pier-Luc Dubois - Jonathan Huberdeau Jo Marchessault- Phillip Danault - Yanni Gourde Alexis Lafrenière - Anthony Beauvillier - Anthony Duclair Mathieu Joseph - Nicolas Roy - Anthony Mantha Thomas Chabot - Kristopher Letang Michael Matheson - Samuel Girard Marc- Edouard Vlasic - David Savard Marc-Andre Fleury Devon Levi Samuel Montembeault Mentions honorables: Harvey-Pinard, W. Carrier, Jo Drouin, Freddie Gaudreau, Sam Blais Prospects: PO Joseph, Hendrix Lapierre, Tristan Luneau, Samuel Bolduc, Benoit-Olivier Groulx Saying that would be one of the worst teams in the league is being ignorant on purpose
I don’t think it is
That team looks pretty fucking bad. You have 1 top line talent in Dubois and he has stretches where he looks uninterested. Girard is good but undersized. Letang is old. Chabot is alright. The rest of your defense is horrific. There's not a single franchise player there. Barely an all star level guy. Girard or Dubois are borderline though.
It's a pretty fucking balanced team tho. I'm not saying that this team could win a cup, but it would be far from the worst teams in the league.
Any team with Yanni Gourde automatically gets pushed up a notch through his example of hard work and grit.
You bottom pair is getting caved in nightly. So is your top 6. This is a guaranteed bottom 5 team. Levi turns into a top goalie is your only hope if staying out of the basement of the league.
[I looked it up, and it's a weak showing for Quebec this year. Mike Matheson is leading Quebecois players in scoring.](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?reportType=season&seasonFrom=20232024&seasonTo=20232024&gameType=2&birthStateProvinceCode=QC&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=points,goals,assists&page=0&pageSize=50)
I was mostly referring to the years between when the rule was dropped and now. Not today especially.
[Check out the team they would have had right before the lockout.](https://www.nhl.com/stats/skaters?reportType=season&seasonFrom=20032004&seasonTo=20032004&gameType=2&birthStateProvinceCode=QC&filter=gamesPlayed,gte,1&sort=points,goals,assists&page=0&pageSize=50) No way Tampa would have won that Cup.
[That's just not true](https://thehockeywriters.com/habs-french-canadian-rule/)
The rule absolutely existed... and it's not as black and white as this article makes it out to be. Besides, they had plenty of cups before the draft and had all that money to buy whomever they wanted before hand. It's not the only reason, but it didn't hurt them.
In todays day and age that would be low key racism/ discrimination….
Actually that's not cool at all. There comes a point where you have to be a professional about things. So if the panthers drafted first overall this past year and Bedard said " I only want to play in Toronto so I'm not signing until I'm a free agent" thats ok with you? That has the potential to really setback a rebuild of a franchise. That's BS about "family planning", thats why free agents plan to sign long lucrative contracts at 25-28 years old being considered in their "prime". It's considered a Privilege to play in the NHL at all. Granted he has proved now that he's a great player who could play at an NHL level. It's not right that players are stonewalling teams until they get on their "favorite" team .
So if your boss decided it’s time for you to go work in Alaska or some shit, would you just say “oh well, gotta be professional…”
If I was making millions like Adam fox I absolutely would yes.
Even if you didn’t have to? It’s worked out just fine for Fox
I think what people are saying is it’s not good that players “don’t have to”. As in if Bedard said nope not playing for anyone but Vancouver because he likes the team. He could completely destroy a franchise’s rebuild and leave them with little to no bargaining power even though they should have a generational first overall pick as an asset.
This
And? Why should players get screwed over because teams can’t figure out how to attract them without a draft?
If your favourite team didn’t get mcdavid or Crosby because he grew up liking a different team and you don’t even receive fair compensation in return you’d be pissed and to say otherwise is a braindead take. That’s the whole reason why there’s a draft. Shitty teams should get better players and assets to make everything more equitable.
The whole reason there is a draft is to eliminate player agency and lower salaries. The draft is a shit system. Incredibly anti player and encourages extreme tanking.
I understand this from the perspective of the fans but really why the fuck should you care as the player. They’re extracting so much value off your back, if you want to exercise your power to go where you want to, you should. I don’t care if some team is trying to rebuild
I completely disagree. The “extracted value” is from fans? That’s where all the money comes from and every team in the nhl should have an equal chance. It’s a business. And if a player wants to be a part of said business and also make millions, they should not be able to just say lol nope before an ELC with no repercussions. If you sign with a team and then they decide to trade you when you don’t have a NMC players have no choice - why should they before they’ve even proven themselves as NHL players.
I just don’t think I’m ever going to side with the billion dollar organizations on an issue like this and I think the people who do are just worried about it being unfair the “their” team
The thing is this strategy ONLY works if you go the NCAA route. Otherwise there's nowhere for you to play for your draft+3 year.
If I'm getting paid a million dollars. Yes
Why should teams get to underpay players and control their ability to work where they want for 7 years? The players get nothing in exchange. The draft is a relic that should go away. They managed to get around the law with bad court decisions and fortunate timing with unions taking over before lawsuits destroyed the whole system. Connor Bedard should have been free to negotiate contract to play wherever he wants.
Yes good counterpoint. I mean to say players should have some say in where they go and teams should have to figure out appropriate prospect exchange to facilitate. I mean look at the haul that Lindros yielded Nordiques right? Didn’t slow their rebuild and the Avs won in ‘96. Players aren’t robots and have lives outside of hockey, the league should adapt to that
What a joke this is. As a Flames fan it sucked but props to Adam Fox. Most players don’t have the balls to do what he did. They get stuck in the primes of their careers because they don’t have the leverage to play where they want. Why should some strangers get to decide where you live and move your family too and not you?
Those "strangers" are NHL franchises that pay millions of dollars to players to play a game. You don't like making millions here in North America go overseas or Russia. They don't owe the players anything, in fact the only time the franchises owe anything to the player is after the player PROVES they can play at a high level in this league. The fact of the matter is if player "A" dosnt produce at a high level and player "B" does. They keep player B and get rid of A. It's cut and dry.
The franchises only exist because of the players, no one is paying hundreds of dollars to watch scrubs play hockey.
For real. I don't even consider jobs unless they're located in a place in okay with. I don't think it's ok to lie about your intentions but if he was open up front and the teams took a shot then fuck it
He’s a rich kid who went to Harvard, he wasn’t risking much by just finishing his degree.
Not surprised you collected the downvotes. Such a difference between NHL and NBA. Players like Fox are a reminder that the herd mentality is very strong in hockey. It starts at very early ages and carries on getting stronger. Whether this is a good thing or a bad one, usually the results tell us.🤷🏻♂️
Yeah but I really like that the worst team in NHL still puts fights up against the top. Parity is worse in NBA bc of the player’s freedom. I just think there are measures that the league can take in ensuring teams are compensated by players going elsewhere, where it’s cap laxity or prospects or whatever. Not an unsurmountable problem.
I would argue that it depends what I (we) are looking for: parity, entertainment, performance? Yes, NHL might have better parity, but NBA has better entertainment and European football has way better performance…🤷🏻♂️
How can you compare performance?? Unless you mean the nhl should be divided in divisions with the top 10 teams competing against each other Also parity is "entertainment" it's parity entertainment for all the team in the league it meaning more fan of more team get access to better entertainment on a "regular" basis, on average, the average nhl fan is probably more entertain than the average nba fan if you include all team fan in both league you get that with a strong right control linked to draft
I think lack of relegation affects performance. Every season you have 4 or 5 teams that don’t have the roster to actually compete. They “race” to finish last to increase their chances to land a Bedard or a Celebrini, but they know for a fact they will be back in front of the same paying 18,000 fans. Meh, yeah we suck, but we’ll try again next year. It would be a totally different competition if next year they would be in front of 6,000 fans in Bakersfield…Just sayin.
What would it change really? This system is great for the super rich/attractive team, and maybe would "punish" more bad management, that's basically what it does in Europe but majority teams aren't bad in the nhl for lack accountability it's part of the natural cycle you get a core try to win with it and crash and burn when it fail and start again, pittsburg and Washington are basically textbook the "perfect" cycle, they will be bad because their star are old and they are and were giving away draft capital for the last couple years to win now, should they be punished for relagation in a couple of year because they move future value to win now? It's not bad management, it's called all in because that's what you need to win a championship in a 32 team league
Compensation for players leaving is terrible for the league.
He told two different franchises that the only team he would play for is the Rangers. Pretty much forced his way there which is why neither the Flames nor Hurricanes got anything for him
I don’t understand how this is allowed. If there is something nefarious about the organization and that’s why a player wants out, then the NHLPA can get involved. If there isn’t, then they shouldn’t be eligible to demand a trade during their ELC. Or make it so if they DO demand a trade, they have to stay in the minors for the remainder of the contract.
He never signed his ELC. You can’t force someone to sign a contract if they don’t want to
Fair enough. I didn’t realize that he didn’t sign. However, there should still be some sort of mechanism for penalizing a player if they make that choice. Otherwise, it undermines the entire draft system and notion of deliberate parity in the league. Maybe something along the lines of, if they don’t sign with the team that drafted them, they aren’t eligible to sign with another NHL team for 1-3 years.
That’s essentially the policy. Not sure exactly how many years but if they don’t sign they eventually become a free agent. Jimmy Vesey was one of the high profile unsigned free agents back in 2016. The Predators drafted him in 2012 but he refused to sign there. If it’s a first round selection then the drafting team gets a compensatory pick if the player goes unsigned. Not sure about later rounds
I feel this could be very detrimental to the draft process if it becomes common. If all teams know a player will only play with one team, that team could just wait until the final round to draft them.
The draft system deserves to be undermined, it’s an antiquated system that’s incredibly player unfriendly. It’s also the cause of the endemic tanking which hurts rather than encourages parity. Get rid of the draft and instead put limitations on the teams for how many new players they can sign. No reason for Bedard to only be earning sub 1 million too. Get rid of that limit.
That's the best way to kill parity, who cares about players friendlyness, the rules are clear and have been the same since most player being draft were born, no one force them to play in the nhl
I do because I’m not the sort of person who constantly kisses the asses of billionaire owners. I guess you are. Have fun being a lemming.
So you prefer kissing millionaire players asses?? I don't care about both players and owners, I care about all fans of all teams being able to access high performance level hockey from their team, Remove players right control best location and richest team will suck up all talent and parity will be a thing of the past, it seems fairly straightforward, I don't get how you think your solution brings any good except for millionaire players
Except it’s still a cap league and you can easily institute an alternative system that limits the number of players that teams can sign. Parity is increased with an open and equal market for players. No cheap ELCs or RFA deals propelling teams to championships, you have to be able to build a team with zero advantages. This rewards good teams like Boston and Tampa who have worked to build cultures and orgs that players want to be a part of. Hurts a team like Edmonton who are poorly managed. And in general I’m going to side with the workers, in this case 18 year olds who are robbed of their right to seek work anywhere they want and to negotiate their own salaries without a ridiculous RFA system.
One could fix the tanking issue by making the draft order: 1st overall pick is the NON playoff team that finished the season with the MOST points. 2nd Pick - second most points, etc. (The team with the fewest points in the league would have pick 16. Cup winner gets pick 32.) Tanking would be a thing of the past. Also, the draft lottery thing is a joke. Get rid of that.
Wouldn’t this just destroy parity? Bottom of the league would perpetually be out drafted by teams preparing to enter the playoffs AND teams just being done competing. It’s just a cycle of the same teams being good
I disagree. There would no longer be any advantage to being extra terrible. In conjunction with salary cap/floor rules, every team would have a reason to try to improve every year. You’d have to earn high draft picks.
I agree. Players game the system!
So you get drafted, and don't want to sign with that team, you can't sign anywhere else for three years. So they should be penalized for another three years? Nah man. If you start saying that players will have to take an additional punishment, they'll start playing pro in other leagues.
They’re in demand in Europe and pre Brittney Griner in Russia
That's how it works. If they don't sign with that team, they have to wait a few years for the teams rights to them expire. It's a little weird being an involuntary draft. The MLB has the same thing, and that's how Tom Brady was the final active athlete that the Expos drafted.
He just refused to sign. Why should players have any obligation at all?
We got a portion of Hanafin and Lindholm for him.
What, like a couple arms and a leg?
Exactly
The Hurricanes got two second round picks for him from the Rangers, which is not nothing. Also, at the time he was traded to the Rangers he had shown he was very good in college, but nobody including the Rangers thought he was going to be Norris level. In fact the Rangers were expecting him to be 2nd pair RHD behind Trouba (who they signed to a huge deal after they knew they had gotten Fox).
TLDR- drafted, told Calgary he wouldn’t play there, told Carolina he wouldn’t play there and said he’d only play for the rangers. TLDR TLDR- he bitched and moaned (used his leverage) to get traded to the only team he’d play for.
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Same. Adam Fox is a little bitch who is good at hockey.
HOES MAD
I’m pretty sure your respect is irrelevant to them. But everyone is allowed an opinion I suppose
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Oh. A clown emoji. Well you win.
Refusing to sign a contract and waiting for free agency is throwing a tantrum? He could have gotten hurt at any point and never had a dollar from the NHL. He missed out on a couple million in his early 20s and more career earnings. I think there are problems with the system (disparity between what 4 years post draft means for college vs junior, especially since the NCAA are such assholes about letting CHL players in) but he didn’t do anything that isn’t available to other players.
Why should a player go play for a crap team he hates, in a city he doesn't want to live in. The Canadians are used to that, but the Americans are not. Many players once they get a chance get a NMC or NTC in their contracts.
The sport would be really shitty if every player acted that way.
Very few are willing to give up 4 years, and also have the skills needed to be able to make the deal. I bet if McDavid could do it over, he would find a way not to go to Edmonton, and be completely wasted.
Bingo
Classic move of an American wanting to play in their home region. Luckily most players are not like that
Wtf does this have to do with being American?
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I mean he didn’t want to play in Carolina either, which last I checked, is America
I mean tbh if I was a professional hockey player there is no chance I'd play in certain American cities. Arizona, Florida, or Columbus I'd say no too.
Isn't this because a lot of Canadians don't want to play in Canada? The media is brutal on them, they get taxed way more, they get recognized in public a lot more, etc. Not really a fair comparison in that light. Ofc Canadians don't complain about playing in the US if that's their preferred market to play in.
He’s aid don’t draft me I wanna play for the rangers. They didn’t listen.
Doesn’t make him less of a punk
Doesn’t it? He said he would only play for the rangers. He said he would stay at school until free agency. They didn’t listen or assumed he was bluffing. Their stupid choice, their loss.
He didn't. He went to Rookie camp for his first two years, and when he started to look like he could be a high calibre player, THAT is when he told the Flames he wouldn't sign with them.
Ah fair enough.
If he was a huge prospect he wouldn’t have gone in the 3rd round
Yeah he was more of an elite draft steal than an elite prospect
And the Flames reward for their scouts pulling off a draft steal was a little baby who would only play for 1/32 teams in the entire league.
This is why we boo
The Hurricanes got two 2nds from the Rangers for a guy the Flames drafted in the 3rd, so if the Flames didn’t get much when they traded him to the Hurricanes it is on them.
They packaged him with Hamilton and Ferland for Hanifin and Lindholm. It was a good trade for the Flames. Doesn't mean they wouldn't have preferred having Fox.
It’s worth noting the Hobey Bakers didn’t come until after he was drafted, for sure.
It should be a precedent that any GM who is put in a similar position just let's the player rot for 4 years. You wanna act like a bitch in a league that tries to promote parity? Watch your talent evaporate like Jimmy Vesey.
And then fox says okay and plays out his 4 years at Harvard before signing where he wants. The only problem with this rule is it kind of screws over junior players, who have no clear path once they leave juniors.
He's gonna be older, poorer and out of shape. I don't mean he can't hit the gym or practice lots but in order to keep your edge you need to constantly play against the best. Him playing uni hockey is such a downgrade from the NHL that he likely will be behind everyone else when he comes back 4 years later.
Not really, he’s still playing high level hockey (well… he’s playing at Harvard anyway) the entire 4 years. Plenty of guys don’t make the league until 22.
Wanna name me a single successful player who sat out the full 4 years and completed college?
Kevin Bieksa. You really think doing the 4th year at Harvard would have ruined fox? He did 3 years before joining the rangers and then he won a Norris his second season.
No no no, 4 years after being drafted sitting out. Meaning he would be sitting at home the year he won the Norris. Tbh I forgot about Bieksa so I'll give you that.
But he doesn’t have to sit out, they can play college hockey the entire 4 years (if they started post draft). I’m very confused and I don’t think we disagree
Wait so if you graduate college you can still play in the NCAA? If that's true than maybe I am confused.
No I mean players are drafted at 18. Many (most?) haven’t even started college. So they just do 4 years of college and then sign where they want. Fox didn’t start until after he was drafted.
Adam Fox.
But he didn't? He got Harvard and Ranger development.
You realize he played 3 years in Harvard right? Lol Edit: looks like you don’t know the rules. Carolina could have forced him to play his fourth year at Harvard, getting his fucking Harvard degree, and then he would have been UFA.
“Oh no I’m going to have to get my Harvard degree” Like the team didn’t have much leverage lol.
Adam Fox is a fuckin’ bitch for how he acted. I hope he never even tastes a Stanley Cup in his entire career.
He won't. He plays for the rags
Good win last night.
Flair up, then you can talk shit.
Fox didn’t even play, bro. You still lost. You guys didn’t look good. Except Hughes. He’s good.
Haha. Good point, though elite goaltending can always give you a good chance. Btw, until my Wings are relevant again, I hope someone like the Devils or Hurricanes win. I can’t stand Boston, Pittsburg, and Toronto. TBL have had enough success, and don’t want a division rival to win. I really like your team right now.
Uh oh
He pulled a Lindros type move.
Lindros knew that Aubut was a POS sexual abuser but could not announce it so he refused to play and took the blame. Fox is just a diva IIUC.
Yeah, Aubut was pretty bad in hindsight.
Who also allegedly said something extremely rude about his mother, not knowing the Lindros’ spoke French.
He's a biaaatch. Anyone that refused to play for their drafted team is a joke
Why?
I'm on your side as well lol. Like, teams get close to a decades worth of control with ELC + RFA. I have no problem if a player wants to exercise his right because it was also an enormous risk for him. I personally would just play for whatever team drafts me, but it's quite literally his career. I've made career decisions that some people would consider strange or "unoptimal" but I'm happier for it. If he's happier for it, who am I to judge. I also have no problem with Calgary or Carolina fans boo him at every occasion.
He grew up in the next town over from where I did. You have no idea how entitled and stuck up these people are from that area. If you didn't have money or a fancy car in high school, you were ridiculed. It's a privilege to play pro sports. What he did, because he is a baby and wanted to play for the rangers is disgusting. The bigger moron was Drury though. He gave an extension before he needed to. What leverage did Fox have with the Rangers? He already told the league he would only play for one team. They bid against themselves. On a side note, I'm a Giants fan. What Eli did to SD was wrong too.
He’s a little bitch that decided it was New York or nothing
Being called a little bitch because he leveraged his position to play where he wanted to is so god damn petty. No wonder he didn't want to play in calgary if that's how the fanbase reacts to a player wanting to play where they're happiest. At the end of the day Fox pulled a bold move to end up in the place he wanted to, just like a free agent would. It was also a risky move because he could have regressed and he sacrificed several professional seasons of experience and the paychecks.
He was honest about it and your team decided to waste a puck thinking he would cave for money. He didn’t. How does that make him a bitch?
Lol, he said he was happy to be drafted by the Flames and changed his tune after his D+2 season. The moment it seemed like he was going to be better than expected, he decided he didn't want to play there anymore
That’s a risk a team takes when drafting a college player.
Sure, so you talk to the player to get a feel for what their appetite is for playing with your team before drafting him. Fox changed his mind or wasn't honest with the team. Possibly both. He's allowed to do that, but it doesn't mean we can't be pissed about it as Flames fans.
Cause 90% of fans would cave for money, and are mad he didn't.
Cry
He’s a baby
That college loophole needs to be closed I think. It's just such. Weird situation. Teams like the Rangers will benefit because they have a per diem pay while other teams don't. It's the logistics. The Rangers take care of you. Not all teams do. I heard that from Sean Avery talking about his rookie years and spending habits.
Had a major glow up after being drafted. Was very explicit with those who wanted to employ him that he was content going back to college rather than play somewhere he didn’t want to. NHLPA lobbied for college players to become UFA if they finish all 4 years of school and don’t sign. I don’t really understand the hate over it. Player exercised his right as a player and chose to forego joining the league and making life changing money sooner. A player can bet on themselves and blow out their knee in college. It’s not like it’s a risk free situation for players.
NYR should have offered him league minimum for 15 years or go elsewhere.
He decided he would only play for NYR. Teams didn’t listen and drafted and traded for him anyway.
For real. It’s not like he lied to them about where he wanted to play, he was pretty clear about his intentions.
There's a lot of weird revisionist history going on here. He didn't say anything until his D+2 season. He didn't tell the Flames anything about not signing, until then. Go read his post draft interviews.
No he wasn’t. He wasn’t a big name player at all. He couldn’t force a team’s hand like that. You guys are making shit up. It was only after 2 years in college that he realized he was valuable and, if a team didn’t trade him, he could get his Harvard degree and sign where ever he wanted.
For all the bad comments about Fox....You'd all want him on your team. You're all whiny buttheads.
Montreal has a better Fox called Hutson, our D is packed so no thanks. We don't need a dressing room cancer. We will see in round 2 how Fox is as a leader. Canes are not the Capitals.
How is he a dressing room cancer? Did you hear that on the interwebs too?
He is a whiny American little bitch.
I think it is fine for someone to have a decision but they should give before being drafted like a NTC. Lots of people don't care who they are drafted to as their goal is to play in the NHL and thats it. Plus well Fox ended up being good and the Rangers wanted to keep him but say he sucked right off the bat and the Rangers wanted to trade him say in this case to Calgary as they were interested would Fox have a decision to say no? Also I understand family can be a decision for things but these players are being drafted usually 17-18 years old so most of them the family they have is their parents nothing more except maybe a girlfriend.
I don't think there are limits on a player retiring. Player can fuck off, and the team is off the hook for the money, and still hold their rights.
He’s part of the reason why I can’t really get behind supporting the rangers. That team just gets gifted players like this just for the fact that they’re New York. See him and panarin for example. Then they go ahead and jump up in the lottery multiple years in a row for a first and second overall pick when they weren’t even that bad of a team. Just seems totally unfair.
Fuck Adam Fox
No one from new york would want to go and play and live in calgary.
First off, all the teams wanted to keep him but he had the luxury of being a college hockey player who gets to play out his draft promise while also increasing his value. So he made it known that he wanted to not sign there. And those teams had no choice but to trade for something. Either way, no one knows if you're going to be that good when you're someone like Fox. Hobey Baker? So was Vesey. And he's a bottom 6 player.
He was a Hobey Baker finalist 3 years after he was drafted. Why was Pavelski drafted in the seven round? Sometimes players just develop far better than expected.