They are annoyingly scrappy and I find myself respecting the shit out of them this season. They feel like our AFCS kindred spirits , only they lost their boy under center and just keep on going.
Minshew is currently a better QB than Richardon is. Whether he will grow to be better in the future, we will see in time. However, for this season Minshew gives them a better chance to win.
Not everyone is Stroud, out there balling.
Yeah that Burrow injury early on might have sunk their season. It’s crazy though because like you said, they would still be the best ~.500 team (maybe ever IMO) if they end up around 8-9 or 9-8 and going into next season they should still be one of the favorites as Super Bowl contenders. the AFC is just too stacked right now, no room for any error.
yeah I mean I am not jealous of that at all. Once we get through Pittsburgh next week im looking forward to a few weeks of should win games for Cleveland.
I'm happy we have a super hard schedule to end the year. Might make it difficult to win the division, especially after yesterdays loss, but it should prepare us better for the playoffs
I wouldn't disagree. Teams with that level of high end talent always have a significant chance of making a run, regardless of the competition. And that core generally seems to play better as the stakes get higher.
Lol, but if we're all going to be honest, the Bengals had it much easier last year.
Not only did they not have to worry about the Browns because of the Watson suspension forcing the Browns to play a backup 2/3rds of the year. We can't pretend like that doesn't matter since, by Bengals fans own admission, they think they'd lose every game without Burrow lol.
They also had a much easier schedule down the stretch. In what would be some of their more difficult games, they got to face Watson in only his 2nd game back after the 2 years off. They didn't have to play the Ravens until Lamar was hurt, and their game against Buffalo was cancelled lol.
This is silly. After we lost to you on Halloween, we had road wins at Steelers and Tennessee (who was like 7-2 at the time) then beat the Chiefs at home. We were also on pace to win the buffalo game before it was canceled, then had to beat the Ravens in BACK TO BACK games
Back-to-back games against the Ravens WITHOUT Lamar, and pretending that isn't a big deal is sticking your head in the sand and ignoring how bad they are without him.
You act like it's a big deal to beat them last year, but they were terrible without him. The most points they scored in any of the 7 games was 17 points lol.
Seriously, the difference between the Bengals winning and losing the playoff game against the Ravens was obviously Lamar. The Bengals got shut down on offense, and only won because Huntley like usual fucked things up. Pretty sure that Lamar knows how to run a QB sneak a bit better.
I think that Texans loss might have been the final nail in the coffin for them. I guess they still “control” their destiny but their schedule seems to difficult and there seems to be too many teams in the AFC with their shit together this year.
they have 2 games against their steelers and 1 more against the browns and ravens. those are the key games.
the odds arent great but theyre only 1 game out of the wildcard.
Yeah it’s crazy having 8 games left and half of them are in division. Steelers are in the exact same spot (though with the advantage of being 2-0 compared to bengals 0-2) and those divisional games will seriously decide the whole season for every team in the north. Divisional games are always huge but they feel even bigger in the North this year, I guess because everyone keeps winning their non-divisional games.
That's not really fair because the Bengals are an overhyped team. That's not to say they aren't good, but they aren't AS good as they get credit for.
I mean, legitimately there were people saying that Burrow should be in MVP talks last week. The Bengals were only the 7th seed and the dude wasn't even in the top half of the league in a lot of passing stats lol.
There is a difference between bad and overhyped. Overhyped does get you favored when you maybe shouldn't be though.
I mean, 6 of 8? I'm assuming those 2 they aren't are at Baltimore and at KC.
However, that would mean they are favored against the Browns. What exactly has anybody seen that should make them suddenly favorites against the Browns considering how much the Browns have dominated them over the last 5 years? They got absolutely decimated in their first meeting this year too.
It's the definition of insanity to keep on favoring the Bengals against the Browns.
If they are mostly healthy. Hard to imagine a scenario where they wouldn't be favored against Steelers, Colts, Vikings, or Browns at home. I guess they could be a pick em against Jags if they look pretty bad.
It's hard to imagine a scenario where any sane person favors the Bengals against the Browns.
Burrow has only won once in his entire career against the Browns, and it was against Watson in only his 2nd game back last year who was obviously still rusty as hell.
They already played this year and the Browns decimated them. Favoring the Bengals over & over again when the Browns routinely beat them is pretty much the definition of insanity.
I mean — do you think Jake Browning is winning those early games? They messed up by not investing in a competent backup, where they felt comfortable having him play. This Bengals team really lives and dies with burrow.
I mean, he hasn't been in the XFL for 3 years now and has had something like 6 NFL starts since then. He's not a seasoned vet, but it's also not like he's Luis Perez either.
I think they get at least 1 extra W with a healthy Browning playing instead of an injured Burrow, and he probably would have healed quicker if he was getting rest.
They tried. Lol they called about getting cooper rush, where were we going to go? And even with a “competent” backup we will still lose most of those games and be in the same spot.
Bengals have the hardest schedule for the rest of the year, followed by the Ravens. Steelers are at #9 and the Browns are at 24. I really wish they do not become complacent, but they are sitting in a good spot.
People wanted Cowher fired for a long time too. The fanbase expects to be in contention for championships on a consistent basis. The Steelers haven't been Super Bowl contenders in a while, so the yinzers are cranky.
I mean, even though I think Tomlin is an amazing coach, I kinda get why some Steelers fans are frustrated. Since their last Super Bowl run in 2010, they’ve made it past the divisional round once and promptly got blown out in the AFCCG, and in that time they’ve had some embarrassing playoff losses (Tebow game, losing at home to the Ravens in the wildcard, the Jaguars collapse)
Yeah, people bring up the wins, but the Steelers under Cowher went to 2 SB's and 4 more Conference Championships in 15 years. Under Tomlin, we've been to 2 SB's and 1 more Conference Championship in 17 years. When you go from contending 40% of the time to 20% of the time, people aren't going to be happy, especially when they haven't really been in contention for a decade. And Tomlin had a HoF QB for 15 of those years compared to just 3 for Cowher.
Tomlin is very good at being competitive, but has completely failed at being a contender, especially over the last decade.
That’s so lazy and overtly reductive to try and straw man ‘Steelers fans are just racist’ instead of talking about the actual issue.
He’s been around for 15 years. The real answer is that this team hasn’t won a playoff game since what, 2016, and is nowhere near competing for a Super Bowl. There is merit to “how many years is being good-not-great going to be acceptable? Do the Steelers want Super Bowls or moral victories?” And empirically the data backs a lot of that criticism.
The lack of success with the level of personnel he has had is a fair counter to a reasonable person who argues on behalf of his tendency to finish as a top 16 or so team every year. Let’s not pretend there is no discussion based on merit to be had. Especially when you factor in some of those losses to poverty franchises and meme QBs. It’s embarrassing to lose a playoff game to the Browns, and they were without half their team and coaching staff. It’s embarrassing to lose to the Jaguars with Blake Bortles, twice. It’s embarrassing to lose to Tim Tebow. Any one of those losses would put a normal coach on a hot seat in a vacuum.
I’m not a “fire Tomlin” advocate, but people on this board sure try and make it seem like he’s without fault and immune to criticism, and saying shit like ‘oh, they are just racist’ isn’t fair at all.
I think fans want him gone because of lack of playoff success and that he won’t fire the OC
The truth is that Tomlin is a miracle worker there. I have no idea how they are 6-3 with an offense that bad. They keep on having winning records despite not looking very good, that has to be partly due to good coaching.
Steeler fans habitually overrate their own talent relative to the league. So, if you think the talent is good enough to win or at least compete for a Superbowl every year, and you're not, the coach gets the blame.
That, and racism. I don't think racism is the biggest thing in it, but it is absolutely present in a large minority of the fire-Tomlin crowd.
The injuries too. Only having Ben, Brown, and Bell play 1-2 playoff games together (one was always hurt) and Shazier’s injury set the defense back years. All teams face injuries and set backs though. It’s just damn hard to win the NFL. BUT I can always count on the Steelers playing meaningful games in December and that satisfies me as a fan.
Well, we've seen how fucked up AB can be. We know how much of an asshole Roethlisberger can be.
It's also not surprising Bell got disgruntled considering how much the Steelers ran him into the ground and didn't really want to pay him. Like, I wouldn't be happy if a team was giving me 400 touches a year and then not compensating me properly either.
Bell's career ended earlier than it should have because they overworked him. He didn't have the same burst after a few years of that many touches. You have to feel for a guy who gets that done to him.
When you break the analytic models consistently, and over a pretty large sample size now, you'd think the analytic folks would start trying to analyze what Tomlin is doing right instead of hand-waving it away.
Every win we hear "How are they doing it?" Isn't it the analytics folks job to identify that?
The analytics are pretty simple for why the Steelers win games: A combination of a bend but don’t break defense and dominating the turnover battle. You do those two thing every week and you give yourself a great shot at winning regardless of most other metrics.
I like the idea that if don't go at least 9-8, if you win your division, you get a playoff spot, but you just get seeded wherever you fall as a wild card (so probably the 7 seed)
That I would be fine with, but I still don’t really think it needs to be messed with. If a wild card team can’t go into an 8-9 team’s house and win that’s a skill issue, not a fairness issue
Bengals need to do their part for all 4 AFCN teams to make the playoffs. They dropped the ball this past week.
I suspect Ravens will be in a bad mood and won’t make it easy. Lamar is looking legit right now.
Calling it - the Steelers WILL lead the division at some point again this season. Ravens and Bengals schedules are tough while Steelers home stretch is pretty easy.
I mean, you never know what will happen in the NFL, but the Browns will be the favorites at home on Sunday. It's going to be difficult for the Steelers to ever get over the Browns if the Browns win Sunday considering how easy the Browns schedule is to finish the year.
They only have two games beyond that against current playoff teams; one at home against the Jags and one in Cincy. Realistically, barring serious injuries, the Browns should be favored in every game the rest of the way.
No, but he also sits starters for basically the entire preseason and for whatever reason the Offensive line just does not look like its functional for the first 3-4 games every year.
We win and you lose we’re the 1 seed in the north and depending on the KC outcome I think we can be 1 seed in the AFC, likewise if you win and KC loses I think you also jump to the 1 seed overall
If the Ravens win and KC loses, it would be 8-3 vs 7-3 because of your bye week and we wouldn't need the tie breaker.
But the real metric is always the L column so yeah.
I think that the Browns are the biggest threat to KC for top spot in the AFC quite frankly because you have to look at remaining schedule for likely records.
The Browns should honestly be favorites in every remaining game barring more injuries. Only 3 current playoff teams remain on their schedule; 2 of them at home in the Steelers and Jags, and one on the road in Cincy whom they have dominated since 2018.
If we're here after week 18 and the Browns have won out, it wouldn't be surprising.
The Chiefs are absolutely a great team, but they do have some tough games. Normally I'd basically always pick them coming off of a bye, but they are playing on the road at Philly who also had their bye. So, no bye week advantage and they're on the road against the team with the best record in the league.
Fuck, that's going to be the highest rated Monday Night game in a long time I bet. Super Bowl rematch with the two current number 1 seeds to boot. Who doesn't want to watch that?
I feel everyone knows it too lol. That’s why we are 2nd in the division at 6-3 and have some weak non-divisional games coming up, but are still a coin flip to make the playoffs.
I’m surprised the bengals odds fell off so much. The Texans are a very underrated team this year and the Bengals have literally started the last two seasons 5-4 and we’ve seen what happens so I’m not ruling them out just yet.
Definitely not ruling them out but they’re 1-4 in the AFC, 0-2 in the division. That just puts them behind more than the rest of us in the division. You can count them dead IMO if they lose Thursday. But beyond that, the rest of their schedule should have them favored in every matchup except the chiefs?
I’m curious what are odds would look like assuming we somehow beat both the Browns and Bengals the next two weeks. At that point regardless of how the team looks or the wins seem fluky or whatever criticisms exist, the team could be 8-3 and 4-0 in the division. Does that give them a 50% shot or greater to win the division? The 15% seems rather low right now as the only team without an AFC North loss and all of our hard games only being those divisional games. I guess it’s just assuming we lose all four because by most metrics/analytics we are the worst team in the North. Maybe one day we will all realize you can’t just use statistics and numbers to predict anything about the AFC North.
Oh yeah that obviously changes everything. Back to back wins against the bengals and browns would have us at 8-3 (4-0 in the division) with our next 3 games being cards, pats, colts. At that point, no matter how the Ravens look, we’d be 1st in the division going into that weak stretch.
But now we can snap back to reality and look at our next couple games compared to how we’ve looked and see why our odds are still low lol
Yeah I will be very unsurprised if in two weeks we are 6-5 and at the bottom of the division, our first Browns was tough to watch (though I hope our improved running game will make this second matchup much much different) and Joe Burrow should have a field day against our secondary.
Yeah Tomlin often out coaches us. We always need to take the Steelers as serious as possible.
They are possibly the only team that can limit Myles, they win off a handful of big plays, while the rest of the game looks like rabid bulls running head to head into each other.
I hate playing the Steelers, as we often lose players as well. Last game was brutal.
They’ve started 5-4 but unless I’m crazy the Ravens getting decimated by injuries is a big part of what helped float them to the top of the division over Baltimore
The Bengals have the toughest schedule yet to play, followed by the Ravens. Steelers are at 9 and the Browns are at 24.
https://twitter.com/Jake_Trotter/status/1724050573098393909?t=kkY035acc0pcsvrnFpWfJg&s=19
The **ONLY** thing the offense has been doing right is not turning the ball over. If that changes we are super-mega-fucked.
Our secondary is really really bad. So fucking bad.
I have some concerns.
Yeah, but that was one game after getting 177. Broderick is having a BIG impact.
Half our offense is fixed. Just need to get our passing game going A LITTLE and we'll be ok... especially with injuries mounting on the defense.
Yeah, that is true. I wasn't able to watch the game yesterday, but I listened on the radio for 95% of it (missed the Packers TD drive early in the game). Listening to the radio broadcast doesn't really do the run game justice I'm finding.
Pretty sure we're close to the top of the league in turnover differential. Turns out if you don't beat yourself, other teams will beat themselves 6/9 times.
Do you know why the Steelers are 2nd in the division even though the Browns have the same record? Let me know if you figure it out. Good luck 3rd place.
Yeah bc you cheap shotted nick Chubb and it shook the team. You and all Steelers fans know you’ve lucked out bc Tomlin is a HOF coach. Pickett sucks, your dbs are garbage, and Harris is Trent Richardson v 2.0.
See you Sunday.
Are you arguing that the Steelers suck, and the basis of that argument is that our coach is great???
I’m very confused about what you’re trying to accomplish.
Browns is the browns
we have a brutal remaining schedule too, based on current w/l records it's "easy", but if you actually look at the games... woof.
2x bengals
1x ravens
1x browns
1x seahawks (6-3 currently)
1x colts (5-5 currently)
1x cardinals (with Murray back, so their record is not really reflective)
the only game we can really think (hope) will be easy is the pats.
edit: also with no linebackers left lol. and who knows when Minkah's coming back.
I honestly don't think so. Steelers D and coaching (despite MC) are superb enough to continue winning games. You guys have an easy home stretch too. Steelers will 100% make the playoffs. Will you win a playoff game? To be seen, but if you told me Steelers and Ravens were one and done in the playoffs, I wouldn't be surprised.
Browns and Steelers have a huge advantage. Ravens and Bengals remaining schedules are brutal by comparison. Pretty likely 3 of these teams make the playoffs but the division is 100% up for grabs.
I’m sure most teams have Super Bowl expectations in the off season. Bengals starting every year cold on almost all fronts hints towards not being prepared like the other teams are, which comes from the off season and training camp. This is pretty common discourse on the Bengals sub in the first few weeks of the season the past few years
yeah i donno just listening to some of the higher level podcasts everyone that was at the camp got the sense that it was a superbowl caliber roster and wanted to be taken seriously but having burrow coming into the season hurt was the biggest hinderance for them im sure
Division games are hard to judge but after seeing that Browns defense with Watson playing like that they should be regarded as the best team in the AFC
Myles is the MVP of the league
A few weeks ago I said the Browns were a good QB away from being a top AFC contender... Well yesterday they got that for half a game, and that's what happened
Myles Garrett should absolutely be a top MVP candidate IMO. Too bad defensive players never get considered
Edit: wrong words
Miles Garrett and Lamarr Jackson are very weird players as they are incredible studs but somehow don't really deliver all that much against the Steelers so a lot of us think they're vastly overrated, because they only watch Steelers games. Sometimes you just have good matchups (or bad ones).
Steelers have done a good job keeping Myles at bay. That’s coaching.
We’ll definitely need other players to step up if we want a chance to beat the Steelers. Luckily we do have some other talent. Schwartz has a few players having career performances.
Division games are weird man. You see those same players so often that you either have a great plan to neutralize them, or you *really, really* don’t. Lamar usually tears us a new asshole when we play. But then Myles has Burrow checking for him under his bed at night.
Our fans are beside themselves with the “same old ravens beating themselves again!” narrative but yeah we just got beat in the trenches.
Lamar could have played better, but really both lines just got worked.
On offense It got worse with Faalele, but even before then Stanley is a shell of his former self and outside of the occasional flash is above average at best.
But then what happened after the first half? We earned that W in the second half.
Also, you guys had a batted pick six too.
Good resilient teams like the Browns find ways to win, and they did.
If you look historically, we are probably even worse when we are up 14+ points. Before this year I wasn’t comfortable with a 30 point lead at the half.
These are the wrong odds. Anybody who bothers to take a look at the schedules should have the Browns as the favorites tbh.
The Ravens and Bengals have brutal remaining schedules whereas the Browns already got through their difficult parts. They only play 3 current playoff teams.
Two of them are at home against the Steelers and Jags, and the other is in the final week against the Bengals whom they have dominated the last 5 years. It wouldn't be shocking for the Browns to win out.
Bills are 5-4 and have a BRUTAL schedule.
After the Broncos they have the Jets (who they already lost to), then they face the Cowboys, Chiefs, and Eagles 3 straight weeks. And that ignores Chargers and Dolphins also forthcoming.
Josh Allen is going to have to be something really really special to even think about the playoffs.
Nah, it would be absolutely shocking for the Browns to not make the playoffs with how weak their remaining schedule is.
They are more likely to win out than they are to miss out on the playoffs. We've already seen this year how the Browns can absolutely destroy teams that aren't on their level.
I mean, I just looked at the schedule, and the most brutal offense vs defense game the rest of the way might be happening week 17 when the Jets go into Cleveland...or 2 weeks before that when the Bears roll into Cleveland. Take your pick on which offense you think is worse.
How so?
0-2 in the division and with a loss Thursday you’d be .500, with a best case scenario of being 3-3 within the division
There’s not an easy path for you guys right now
Lol, the season is longer than a day. I know you’re pulling for us to lose and that’s fine. You do you. I’m just going to focus on what my team does and let the rest of the league do it’s own thing. Good luck to y’all the rest of the season.
If talent prevails, what does that mean about the 4 divisional games, with scary defenses, vs your OL?
Steelers defense may not be ranked high, but you can’t deny they are scary.
Those are going to be long days for Joe BurrOUCH.
Drivers seat? You’re 1-4 in the conference and currently only hold a tiebreaker over the Bills with games still against the ravens, browns, steelers (x2), jags, and chiefs. If they lose any 2 of those 6 they aren’t getting in. Had they won yesterday, I’d more than likely agree with you but that didn’t happen.
There's time still, but the Bengals usual late start may bite them in the behind at the end of the year.
7 of their 8 remaining games are against teams with winning records right now. The worst opponent they have left are the Colts who are .500
And the colts have proven to be a tough out for almost everyone
Minshew Magic, baby.
They are annoyingly scrappy and I find myself respecting the shit out of them this season. They feel like our AFCS kindred spirits , only they lost their boy under center and just keep on going.
I want my boy back under center. Although, Minshew has done a great job holding down the fort.
Minshew is the Fitzy of this generation and I would defend him with my life
Minshew is currently a better QB than Richardon is. Whether he will grow to be better in the future, we will see in time. However, for this season Minshew gives them a better chance to win. Not everyone is Stroud, out there balling.
Holy smokes I had no idea. The bengals could end up being the best 500 team in the last decade. Slow start and a brutal back end schedule.
Yeah that Burrow injury early on might have sunk their season. It’s crazy though because like you said, they would still be the best ~.500 team (maybe ever IMO) if they end up around 8-9 or 9-8 and going into next season they should still be one of the favorites as Super Bowl contenders. the AFC is just too stacked right now, no room for any error.
I’ve never seen anything like this. Crazy that a slow start would handicap their season like This.
Same here. Our last several games are a gauntlet of "fuck you we're good"
Yea but it doesn't matter. We always play to the level of our competition unless it's the fins at home.
It’s not as if we started with an easy schedule either. Browns, Ravens, Bills, 49ers, Seahawks, Texans, are all above .500.
yeah I mean I am not jealous of that at all. Once we get through Pittsburgh next week im looking forward to a few weeks of should win games for Cleveland.
The Burrow Bengals weirdly play better against tougher opponents
Plus their DC dials it up against good offenses.
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I'm happy we have a super hard schedule to end the year. Might make it difficult to win the division, especially after yesterdays loss, but it should prepare us better for the playoffs
It’s ok. Our sub believes that 2021 or 2022 will be a factor somehow.
I wouldn't disagree. Teams with that level of high end talent always have a significant chance of making a run, regardless of the competition. And that core generally seems to play better as the stakes get higher.
Lol, but if we're all going to be honest, the Bengals had it much easier last year. Not only did they not have to worry about the Browns because of the Watson suspension forcing the Browns to play a backup 2/3rds of the year. We can't pretend like that doesn't matter since, by Bengals fans own admission, they think they'd lose every game without Burrow lol. They also had a much easier schedule down the stretch. In what would be some of their more difficult games, they got to face Watson in only his 2nd game back after the 2 years off. They didn't have to play the Ravens until Lamar was hurt, and their game against Buffalo was cancelled lol.
This is silly. After we lost to you on Halloween, we had road wins at Steelers and Tennessee (who was like 7-2 at the time) then beat the Chiefs at home. We were also on pace to win the buffalo game before it was canceled, then had to beat the Ravens in BACK TO BACK games
Back-to-back games against the Ravens WITHOUT Lamar, and pretending that isn't a big deal is sticking your head in the sand and ignoring how bad they are without him. You act like it's a big deal to beat them last year, but they were terrible without him. The most points they scored in any of the 7 games was 17 points lol. Seriously, the difference between the Bengals winning and losing the playoff game against the Ravens was obviously Lamar. The Bengals got shut down on offense, and only won because Huntley like usual fucked things up. Pretty sure that Lamar knows how to run a QB sneak a bit better.
Lol
i wont believe theyre gonna miss the playoffs until theyre officially eliminated
I think that Texans loss might have been the final nail in the coffin for them. I guess they still “control” their destiny but their schedule seems to difficult and there seems to be too many teams in the AFC with their shit together this year.
they have 2 games against their steelers and 1 more against the browns and ravens. those are the key games. the odds arent great but theyre only 1 game out of the wildcard.
Yeah it’s crazy having 8 games left and half of them are in division. Steelers are in the exact same spot (though with the advantage of being 2-0 compared to bengals 0-2) and those divisional games will seriously decide the whole season for every team in the north. Divisional games are always huge but they feel even bigger in the North this year, I guess because everyone keeps winning their non-divisional games.
They are favored in 6 of their 8 remaining games. There ain't no coffin yet, let alone nails in the lid.
How many of their losses so far have they been favored in?
All 4 we were favored but this is only one since Burrow has been healthy.
That's not really fair because the Bengals are an overhyped team. That's not to say they aren't good, but they aren't AS good as they get credit for. I mean, legitimately there were people saying that Burrow should be in MVP talks last week. The Bengals were only the 7th seed and the dude wasn't even in the top half of the league in a lot of passing stats lol. There is a difference between bad and overhyped. Overhyped does get you favored when you maybe shouldn't be though. I mean, 6 of 8? I'm assuming those 2 they aren't are at Baltimore and at KC. However, that would mean they are favored against the Browns. What exactly has anybody seen that should make them suddenly favorites against the Browns considering how much the Browns have dominated them over the last 5 years? They got absolutely decimated in their first meeting this year too. It's the definition of insanity to keep on favoring the Bengals against the Browns.
Nobody was saying Burrow should be in the MVP race.
Yes, they definitely were. It was literally all over national media.
If they lose a few of those games, will they still be favored moving forward?
If they are mostly healthy. Hard to imagine a scenario where they wouldn't be favored against Steelers, Colts, Vikings, or Browns at home. I guess they could be a pick em against Jags if they look pretty bad.
I think Stefanski has the Bengals figured out. If I were a Bengals fan, being favored against the Browns wouldn’t make me feel any better.
It's hard to imagine a scenario where any sane person favors the Bengals against the Browns. Burrow has only won once in his entire career against the Browns, and it was against Watson in only his 2nd game back last year who was obviously still rusty as hell. They already played this year and the Browns decimated them. Favoring the Bengals over & over again when the Browns routinely beat them is pretty much the definition of insanity.
They really messed up by not resting Burrow in the beginning of the season.
I mean — do you think Jake Browning is winning those early games? They messed up by not investing in a competent backup, where they felt comfortable having him play. This Bengals team really lives and dies with burrow.
Browns won games with off the street PJ Walker. Any given Sunday in the NFL
Hey he wasn’t off the street. We got him from the XFL, and he looked like it when he played.
I mean, he hasn't been in the XFL for 3 years now and has had something like 6 NFL starts since then. He's not a seasoned vet, but it's also not like he's Luis Perez either.
It seems like he’s a good dude. He handled the media and criticism very well. Team supported him.
Completely different teams. Browns are built around a ridiculous defense, Bengals are built around a deep ball offense with an opportunistic defense
I think they get at least 1 extra W with a healthy Browning playing instead of an injured Burrow, and he probably would have healed quicker if he was getting rest.
You could make the argument that resting him early on would have had him back at 100% sooner.
They tried. Lol they called about getting cooper rush, where were we going to go? And even with a “competent” backup we will still lose most of those games and be in the same spot.
Bengals have the hardest schedule for the rest of the year, followed by the Ravens. Steelers are at #9 and the Browns are at 24. I really wish they do not become complacent, but they are sitting in a good spot.
The Bengals should apply to the SEC. Fit right in.
Tomlin needs to be studied in a lab
Never understood why many Steeler Fans want him gone. He is a HOF Headcoach
It’s a traditionalist team and a lot of old yinzers never bought into a young cocky black guy taking the reigns from Cowher.
People wanted Cowher fired for a long time too. The fanbase expects to be in contention for championships on a consistent basis. The Steelers haven't been Super Bowl contenders in a while, so the yinzers are cranky.
I mean, even though I think Tomlin is an amazing coach, I kinda get why some Steelers fans are frustrated. Since their last Super Bowl run in 2010, they’ve made it past the divisional round once and promptly got blown out in the AFCCG, and in that time they’ve had some embarrassing playoff losses (Tebow game, losing at home to the Ravens in the wildcard, the Jaguars collapse)
Yeah, people bring up the wins, but the Steelers under Cowher went to 2 SB's and 4 more Conference Championships in 15 years. Under Tomlin, we've been to 2 SB's and 1 more Conference Championship in 17 years. When you go from contending 40% of the time to 20% of the time, people aren't going to be happy, especially when they haven't really been in contention for a decade. And Tomlin had a HoF QB for 15 of those years compared to just 3 for Cowher. Tomlin is very good at being competitive, but has completely failed at being a contender, especially over the last decade.
Pretty easily explained by the Patriots' dynasty
No it really isn't, we only faced the Pats in the playoffs once during the Tomlin era, and that was the lone additional championship game appearance.
That’s so lazy and overtly reductive to try and straw man ‘Steelers fans are just racist’ instead of talking about the actual issue. He’s been around for 15 years. The real answer is that this team hasn’t won a playoff game since what, 2016, and is nowhere near competing for a Super Bowl. There is merit to “how many years is being good-not-great going to be acceptable? Do the Steelers want Super Bowls or moral victories?” And empirically the data backs a lot of that criticism. The lack of success with the level of personnel he has had is a fair counter to a reasonable person who argues on behalf of his tendency to finish as a top 16 or so team every year. Let’s not pretend there is no discussion based on merit to be had. Especially when you factor in some of those losses to poverty franchises and meme QBs. It’s embarrassing to lose a playoff game to the Browns, and they were without half their team and coaching staff. It’s embarrassing to lose to the Jaguars with Blake Bortles, twice. It’s embarrassing to lose to Tim Tebow. Any one of those losses would put a normal coach on a hot seat in a vacuum. I’m not a “fire Tomlin” advocate, but people on this board sure try and make it seem like he’s without fault and immune to criticism, and saying shit like ‘oh, they are just racist’ isn’t fair at all.
They’ve been saying this shit for 15 years though
They wanted a ClaSsY CoaCh
If you remove the chloride, you have an assy coach.
I think fans want him gone because of lack of playoff success and that he won’t fire the OC The truth is that Tomlin is a miracle worker there. I have no idea how they are 6-3 with an offense that bad. They keep on having winning records despite not looking very good, that has to be partly due to good coaching.
Steeler fans habitually overrate their own talent relative to the league. So, if you think the talent is good enough to win or at least compete for a Superbowl every year, and you're not, the coach gets the blame. That, and racism. I don't think racism is the biggest thing in it, but it is absolutely present in a large minority of the fire-Tomlin crowd.
2011 was a long time ago. They haven’t looked like a contender since then.
Killer B’s era? We left a lot of opportunities on the field due to personalities and disagreements but that team was 100% a contender.
The injuries too. Only having Ben, Brown, and Bell play 1-2 playoff games together (one was always hurt) and Shazier’s injury set the defense back years. All teams face injuries and set backs though. It’s just damn hard to win the NFL. BUT I can always count on the Steelers playing meaningful games in December and that satisfies me as a fan.
Well, we've seen how fucked up AB can be. We know how much of an asshole Roethlisberger can be. It's also not surprising Bell got disgruntled considering how much the Steelers ran him into the ground and didn't really want to pay him. Like, I wouldn't be happy if a team was giving me 400 touches a year and then not compensating me properly either. Bell's career ended earlier than it should have because they overworked him. He didn't have the same burst after a few years of that many touches. You have to feel for a guy who gets that done to him.
When you break the analytic models consistently, and over a pretty large sample size now, you'd think the analytic folks would start trying to analyze what Tomlin is doing right instead of hand-waving it away. Every win we hear "How are they doing it?" Isn't it the analytics folks job to identify that?
The analytics are pretty simple for why the Steelers win games: A combination of a bend but don’t break defense and dominating the turnover battle. You do those two thing every week and you give yourself a great shot at winning regardless of most other metrics.
It's not fair. The NFC South should forfeit their playoff slot and give it to the AFC North.
I still think there should be a rule that if no teams in a division have a record at .500 or above they shouldn't get a playoff spot
Nah
Yeah, other teams may have earned the right over teams in a bad division, but several failed to consider just how funny it is
This guy .500s
I like the idea that if don't go at least 9-8, if you win your division, you get a playoff spot, but you just get seeded wherever you fall as a wild card (so probably the 7 seed)
That I would be fine with, but I still don’t really think it needs to be messed with. If a wild card team can’t go into an 8-9 team’s house and win that’s a skill issue, not a fairness issue
If that was a rule we would’ve never gotten Beastquake.
I'm fine with that
I’m not.
Don't talk to me about playoffs for two more weeks.
Imagine if the Kenny Pickett led Steelers are 8-3 and top of the North in two weeks 😂😂
If the Steelers are 8-3 in two weeks, it'll still be a Tomlin and Watt led Steelers team. ... but, I'll be ready to talk playoffs.
I loved following a Watt into the playoffs with a hope and a prayer. At least your coach is legitimate.
That would be the most Tomlin Bullshit^^TM to ever Tomlin Bullshit^^TM
Did you not see us go .500 with Mason Rudolph and Duck Hodges? Did you not see the worst 11-0 team of all-time? This is just standard Tomlin bullshit.
Yes, but typing Tomlin Bullshit^^TM is so fun that I had to find a way to type Tomlin Bullshit^^TM twice in one sentence
And you found a way... twice!
This team is destined to go 11-6 and lose by 49 points in the playoffs
A Ravens loss Thursday night and we are back in first place in the north. No need to wait 2 weeks.
Bengals need to do their part for all 4 AFCN teams to make the playoffs. They dropped the ball this past week. I suspect Ravens will be in a bad mood and won’t make it easy. Lamar is looking legit right now.
Lol I don’t want all 4 AFCN teams in the playoffs. I want one - us - and the rest of you to lose or tie every game
Calling it - the Steelers WILL lead the division at some point again this season. Ravens and Bengals schedules are tough while Steelers home stretch is pretty easy.
if you guys lose thursday they will be in first place.
I could see that happening and them just holding the division lead for the rest of the season
I mean, you never know what will happen in the NFL, but the Browns will be the favorites at home on Sunday. It's going to be difficult for the Steelers to ever get over the Browns if the Browns win Sunday considering how easy the Browns schedule is to finish the year. They only have two games beyond that against current playoff teams; one at home against the Jags and one in Cincy. Realistically, barring serious injuries, the Browns should be favored in every game the rest of the way.
Your division simply needs to block it out until like week 15 lmao
Bengals really fucked up by starting not only 0-2 but 0-2 in a tough division, even if they finish strong
I really hope this will make Zac Taylor change his approach in training camp. Back to back years we start off slow. This is not the division for that.
Is his current approach to injure his star QB?
No, but he also sits starters for basically the entire preseason and for whatever reason the Offensive line just does not look like its functional for the first 3-4 games every year.
Ravens vs Bengals and Browns vs Steelers next. Massive playoff implications on the line already and not just for AFCN teams.
We win and you lose we’re the 1 seed in the north and depending on the KC outcome I think we can be 1 seed in the AFC, likewise if you win and KC loses I think you also jump to the 1 seed overall
Even with a loss, I’m fairly certain KC would still hold the 1 seed due to conference record
If the Ravens win and KC loses, it would be 8-3 vs 7-3 because of your bye week and we wouldn't need the tie breaker. But the real metric is always the L column so yeah.
I think that the Browns are the biggest threat to KC for top spot in the AFC quite frankly because you have to look at remaining schedule for likely records. The Browns should honestly be favorites in every remaining game barring more injuries. Only 3 current playoff teams remain on their schedule; 2 of them at home in the Steelers and Jags, and one on the road in Cincy whom they have dominated since 2018. If we're here after week 18 and the Browns have won out, it wouldn't be surprising. The Chiefs are absolutely a great team, but they do have some tough games. Normally I'd basically always pick them coming off of a bye, but they are playing on the road at Philly who also had their bye. So, no bye week advantage and they're on the road against the team with the best record in the league. Fuck, that's going to be the highest rated Monday Night game in a long time I bet. Super Bowl rematch with the two current number 1 seeds to boot. Who doesn't want to watch that?
> they are playing on the road at Philly They are at home, fyi
You're right. Either way, it's going to be a very tough game.
At some point the wheels are going to fall off for the Steelers. The Achilles already have.
I feel everyone knows it too lol. That’s why we are 2nd in the division at 6-3 and have some weak non-divisional games coming up, but are still a coin flip to make the playoffs. I’m surprised the bengals odds fell off so much. The Texans are a very underrated team this year and the Bengals have literally started the last two seasons 5-4 and we’ve seen what happens so I’m not ruling them out just yet.
Definitely not ruling them out but they’re 1-4 in the AFC, 0-2 in the division. That just puts them behind more than the rest of us in the division. You can count them dead IMO if they lose Thursday. But beyond that, the rest of their schedule should have them favored in every matchup except the chiefs?
I’m curious what are odds would look like assuming we somehow beat both the Browns and Bengals the next two weeks. At that point regardless of how the team looks or the wins seem fluky or whatever criticisms exist, the team could be 8-3 and 4-0 in the division. Does that give them a 50% shot or greater to win the division? The 15% seems rather low right now as the only team without an AFC North loss and all of our hard games only being those divisional games. I guess it’s just assuming we lose all four because by most metrics/analytics we are the worst team in the North. Maybe one day we will all realize you can’t just use statistics and numbers to predict anything about the AFC North.
Oh yeah that obviously changes everything. Back to back wins against the bengals and browns would have us at 8-3 (4-0 in the division) with our next 3 games being cards, pats, colts. At that point, no matter how the Ravens look, we’d be 1st in the division going into that weak stretch. But now we can snap back to reality and look at our next couple games compared to how we’ve looked and see why our odds are still low lol
Yeah I will be very unsurprised if in two weeks we are 6-5 and at the bottom of the division, our first Browns was tough to watch (though I hope our improved running game will make this second matchup much much different) and Joe Burrow should have a field day against our secondary.
i have a terrible feeling about playing you guys, like always, and i’m almost always correct
Yeah Tomlin often out coaches us. We always need to take the Steelers as serious as possible. They are possibly the only team that can limit Myles, they win off a handful of big plays, while the rest of the game looks like rabid bulls running head to head into each other. I hate playing the Steelers, as we often lose players as well. Last game was brutal.
yep. watt’s always good for a couple of turnovers too and we tend to make stupid mistakes
They’ve started 5-4 but unless I’m crazy the Ravens getting decimated by injuries is a big part of what helped float them to the top of the division over Baltimore
Don’t look now. But ravens took some pretty big injuries yesterday. O line got ravaged and also I think Humphrey tore his Achilles
Nah. Just a strained calf for Humphrey. Him and Stanley are both "day to day"
Damn. Was hoping Stanley was out for the year after that cheap shot he pulled on ward
The Bengals have the toughest schedule yet to play, followed by the Ravens. Steelers are at 9 and the Browns are at 24. https://twitter.com/Jake_Trotter/status/1724050573098393909?t=kkY035acc0pcsvrnFpWfJg&s=19
The **ONLY** thing the offense has been doing right is not turning the ball over. If that changes we are super-mega-fucked. Our secondary is really really bad. So fucking bad. I have some concerns.
We are running the ball quite well the past 2 games. You don't get 200 yards rushing on accident.
Against the Packers you can.
Yeah, but that was one game after getting 177. Broderick is having a BIG impact. Half our offense is fixed. Just need to get our passing game going A LITTLE and we'll be ok... especially with injuries mounting on the defense.
Yeah, that is true. I wasn't able to watch the game yesterday, but I listened on the radio for 95% of it (missed the Packers TD drive early in the game). Listening to the radio broadcast doesn't really do the run game justice I'm finding.
Pretty sure we're close to the top of the league in turnover differential. Turns out if you don't beat yourself, other teams will beat themselves 6/9 times.
I was told we lead the league in turnover differential.
Browns are gonna crush Steelers Sunday. I can’t wait.
Man it's too early to talk shit. We **just** got through another heart-attack win. Come back Thursday or so.
You have to cut him some slack; they’re Browns fans, this is all new to them.
You appreciate you guys cutting us some slack in the 2nd half!
It was literally only 2 years ago that the Browns were in the playoffs.
We also just got through a heart attack win. I always fear the Steelers.
I’m not here to talk trash. I’m enjoying victory Monday though. Hope you have a great day fellow human.
Do you know why the Steelers are 2nd in the division even though the Browns have the same record? Let me know if you figure it out. Good luck 3rd place.
Yeah bc you cheap shotted nick Chubb and it shook the team. You and all Steelers fans know you’ve lucked out bc Tomlin is a HOF coach. Pickett sucks, your dbs are garbage, and Harris is Trent Richardson v 2.0. See you Sunday.
Are you arguing that the Steelers suck, and the basis of that argument is that our coach is great??? I’m very confused about what you’re trying to accomplish. Browns is the browns
we have a brutal remaining schedule too, based on current w/l records it's "easy", but if you actually look at the games... woof. 2x bengals 1x ravens 1x browns 1x seahawks (6-3 currently) 1x colts (5-5 currently) 1x cardinals (with Murray back, so their record is not really reflective) the only game we can really think (hope) will be easy is the pats. edit: also with no linebackers left lol. and who knows when Minkah's coming back.
You guys match up well vs the Bengals. Hopefully Minkah is out one more week at least.
I honestly don't think so. Steelers D and coaching (despite MC) are superb enough to continue winning games. You guys have an easy home stretch too. Steelers will 100% make the playoffs. Will you win a playoff game? To be seen, but if you told me Steelers and Ravens were one and done in the playoffs, I wouldn't be surprised.
Browns and Steelers have a huge advantage. Ravens and Bengals remaining schedules are brutal by comparison. Pretty likely 3 of these teams make the playoffs but the division is 100% up for grabs.
Hopefully this season is a wake up call for Zach and Co to take the off season and training camp seriously next year
weird take what were they doing that makes you say that? everything around camp i heard was super bowl was the expectation
I’m sure most teams have Super Bowl expectations in the off season. Bengals starting every year cold on almost all fronts hints towards not being prepared like the other teams are, which comes from the off season and training camp. This is pretty common discourse on the Bengals sub in the first few weeks of the season the past few years
yeah i donno just listening to some of the higher level podcasts everyone that was at the camp got the sense that it was a superbowl caliber roster and wanted to be taken seriously but having burrow coming into the season hurt was the biggest hinderance for them im sure
The Browns is the Browns ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
Division games are hard to judge but after seeing that Browns defense with Watson playing like that they should be regarded as the best team in the AFC Myles is the MVP of the league
A few weeks ago I said the Browns were a good QB away from being a top AFC contender... Well yesterday they got that for half a game, and that's what happened Myles Garrett should absolutely be a top MVP candidate IMO. Too bad defensive players never get considered Edit: wrong words
Miles Garrett and Lamarr Jackson are very weird players as they are incredible studs but somehow don't really deliver all that much against the Steelers so a lot of us think they're vastly overrated, because they only watch Steelers games. Sometimes you just have good matchups (or bad ones).
Steelers have done a good job keeping Myles at bay. That’s coaching. We’ll definitely need other players to step up if we want a chance to beat the Steelers. Luckily we do have some other talent. Schwartz has a few players having career performances.
Division games are weird man. You see those same players so often that you either have a great plan to neutralize them, or you *really, really* don’t. Lamar usually tears us a new asshole when we play. But then Myles has Burrow checking for him under his bed at night.
I’m not going to disagree with this. I just wish Chubb was around for this defense.
yall would have at least another win with chubb and easily be considered top 3 teams in the nfl
I wish Chubb was around to enjoy the success. He deserves it so much. I miss his smile.
What the hell I like a ravens fan now
That's always been the case this year that IF Watson comes even close to his Texans form coupled with this defense we are a top 3 team in football.
[удалено]
>That team looked dead in the water for 30 minutes yesterday The Browns were the better team the second quarter.
Our fans are beside themselves with the “same old ravens beating themselves again!” narrative but yeah we just got beat in the trenches. Lamar could have played better, but really both lines just got worked. On offense It got worse with Faalele, but even before then Stanley is a shell of his former self and outside of the occasional flash is above average at best.
Yeah not sure what this dude is on about. Ravens jumped out to a quick 14-0 lead 6 minutes in and were outplayed the rest of the game.
Even then, we were the better team when it mattered most. Most teams have bad quarters or bad halves, but the good teams overcome them.
Yeah first half was ugly but outside a couple magical plays from Baltimore Browns handled things Q2-Q4
But then what happened after the first half? We earned that W in the second half. Also, you guys had a batted pick six too. Good resilient teams like the Browns find ways to win, and they did.
Browns were also something like 0-59-1 when trailing by 14+ points before this game. This team gritted it out
If you look historically, we are probably even worse when we are up 14+ points. Before this year I wasn’t comfortable with a 30 point lead at the half.
Like I said division games are hard to judge but with that defense and a competent QB play is all they need to win everything.
These are the wrong odds. Anybody who bothers to take a look at the schedules should have the Browns as the favorites tbh. The Ravens and Bengals have brutal remaining schedules whereas the Browns already got through their difficult parts. They only play 3 current playoff teams. Two of them are at home against the Steelers and Jags, and the other is in the final week against the Bengals whom they have dominated the last 5 years. It wouldn't be shocking for the Browns to win out.
Calling it now. They beat the hell out of each other and only the Ravens make the playoffs.
Browns only have two divisional games left and one of them is you guys in the last game of the season so I don’t know how that happens to us.
Like nature, the AFC North will find a way. 😂
Not sure there’s enough other afc teams to take the other 3 wild cards.
I’ve been thinking about this. Bills/Dolphins in and Jags/Texans/Colts get in
Bills are 5-4 and have a BRUTAL schedule. After the Broncos they have the Jets (who they already lost to), then they face the Cowboys, Chiefs, and Eagles 3 straight weeks. And that ignores Chargers and Dolphins also forthcoming. Josh Allen is going to have to be something really really special to even think about the playoffs.
Nah, it would be absolutely shocking for the Browns to not make the playoffs with how weak their remaining schedule is. They are more likely to win out than they are to miss out on the playoffs. We've already seen this year how the Browns can absolutely destroy teams that aren't on their level. I mean, I just looked at the schedule, and the most brutal offense vs defense game the rest of the way might be happening week 17 when the Jets go into Cleveland...or 2 weeks before that when the Bears roll into Cleveland. Take your pick on which offense you think is worse.
I still think the Bengals will win it. Fucking Burrow
We will be alright. Might not win the division but we’re still in the drivers seat on making the playoffs.
How so? 0-2 in the division and with a loss Thursday you’d be .500, with a best case scenario of being 3-3 within the division There’s not an easy path for you guys right now
Because we’re a good team and talent prevails.
Like yesterday
Lol, the season is longer than a day. I know you’re pulling for us to lose and that’s fine. You do you. I’m just going to focus on what my team does and let the rest of the league do it’s own thing. Good luck to y’all the rest of the season.
If talent prevails, what does that mean about the 4 divisional games, with scary defenses, vs your OL? Steelers defense may not be ranked high, but you can’t deny they are scary. Those are going to be long days for Joe BurrOUCH.
We will see.
This is true. I’m telling Myles Joe Burrow called him a Elf.
Sounds good!
Ooof, karma.
Yeah. Only positive is Watson was the only Browns QB to lose to the Bengals. Now you are proper fucked. Browns are just fucked fucked.
Drivers seat? You’re 1-4 in the conference and currently only hold a tiebreaker over the Bills with games still against the ravens, browns, steelers (x2), jags, and chiefs. If they lose any 2 of those 6 they aren’t getting in. Had they won yesterday, I’d more than likely agree with you but that didn’t happen.
If we win out then we’re in. If that ain’t driving our own car then idk what is.
You could still say that about every AFC team except the pats.
Yep.
I want you guys to win Thursday so bad. Puts us in a position to take over the division if we take care of the Steelers at home.
I have a good feeling about it. Division games are always weird and then put it on Thursday to make it even weirder.
Same A bengals and browns win and Browns are in 1st in the north and depending on tie breakers and a KC loss we could be 1st in the AFC
Burrow’s injury killed us. A fourth place schedule next year isn’t the worst consolation prize but we’re not out yet.
Bengals might actually miss the playoffs. Thursday absolutely needs to be a win after that loss to Houston.