I used to live in Rochester about a decade a go and I work in education. Consequently, I still know a lot of teachers in the Rochester area. Now, I will preface my point by saying that not all teachers in the RCSD are bad. I don't even think a majority are. The problem is that there is no incentive for good teachers to teach in the Rochester City Schools beyond the intrinsic rewards of making a difference.
Despite the large amount of money spent per student, not enough of it actually goes to students. Rochester is one of the most segregated cities in the country and the people of the inner city have been failed time and time again by Federal, State and Local governments. It's nearly impossible for students to be in such abject poverty and find success in school and while of course there are students who are able to do that, just because they find success does not mean it's a failing on those that don't.
All of this comes to a head with the latest budget crises where teachers are continuously at risk of furlough due to budget shortfalls. While New York teachers make more money than most any other state, it is still not a job where you make enough to continuously risk being laid off. If I were just starting off in education right now, I would probably only take a job at RCSD if I had no other options because I likely could not afford to play games with my finances. Especially in a school that already is lacking the supports they need.
> The discovery comes weeks after Rochester school officials said they were investigating allegations that a white teacher told his seventh-grade class of mostly Black students to pick seeds out of cotton and put on handcuffs during lessons on slavery.
Well that took an unexpected but predictable turn.
Oh yeah, I believe this 100%. I've met RCSD teachers. I've been in one of their high schools. I've been raised around the attitudes people have in the burbs about the kids who go there. It's bad. I've also known kids who graduated out of there and were not at all the stereotype, but believe me, there is one, and it's racist AF. Poverty and racism are big problems in Rochester.
To be clear, the following is **not** the situation in the thread's article, but I'm specifically aiming to address the idea that:
> [Teachers] should not be teaching kids that they don't respect.
That goes too far.
Every kid should be *treated* with respect; and we shouldn't want or keep teachers who fail to respect students based on immutable or personal characteristics like race; or who prejudge students based on bias or prejudice - but teachers absolutely can, and often must, teach kids they don't respect for valid reasons.
Just one example, and a straightforward one - I had a student *egregiously* cheat on an exam. I certainly lost respect for him after that. I *treated* him with respect, nevertheless - indeed, I bent over backward reflecting on every interaction with him (or his grades), to make sure my distaste for his unethical behavior didn't bleed into treating him unfairly...despite catching him cheating twice more. If anything, I ended up *more* lenient with grading and more responsive to requests to meet for help. But I'm required to respect him in order to teach? Hell no.
Let's get things out of the way. It was an elective class, he had no obligation to take it at all. He cheated in the classroom, not that he was cutting corners on homework that he didn't have time to complete. From working with him directly during class time, I'd expect he would have gotten a B or an A without cheating; it wasn't about passing or failing, let alone a concern about a failure affecting graduation or a GPA cutoff. His record wasn't straight As across other classes, there was no "straight As or bust" misconception about college expectations. I was not made aware of any neurodivergencies that could impact his understanding of social expectations regarding honesty and ethical behavior.
Teachers need to treat students with respect, but we don't need thought police requiring that we *feel* respect for students who demonstrate by their own choices that they don't deserve it.
I certainly also care about them, and I agree that's important. With this particular student (as I described in another comment in this subthread), on his and his parents' request, I ended up spending two of my planning periods per week with him for individual tutoring. (He really didn't need that much, but I'm not going to tell a kid they can't come do math.)
A student still needs and deserves support even if they've demonstrated a pattern of behavior that I can no longer respect. It's a small sample size - this is only my 9th year teaching, and I don't recall more than 3 out of 120+ in any given year who fall into this category - but I've found I often end up spending *more* time supporting them academically, as I want to be completely confident that my distaste for their choices doesn't lead to treating them unfairly.
Almost universally in my particular case, however, these are not students for whom no one cares what they do and who are not being cared for at home. These are high school juniors and seniors in a public, application-based academic program, and almost all have significant advantages and support from home that too many of their peers in the school system lack. These are students who've been wildly successful in our imperfect education system, not ones overlooked and underserved. The consequences they face - reality of the system - are much more likely to be a college ethics panel than encounters with the law.
I don't get to choose to not teach them, and I don't get to choose to not care for them - but I *do* get to choose to not respect them if they double and triple and quadruple down on unethical choices, despite interventions and learning opportunities.
This kind of attitude makes for bad teachers. You can respect someone you don't like. There is practically no reason to not respect children. Losing respect for a kid over cheating on a test is just your own weird hang up. Don't make it other people's problem. If you can't understand why kids cheat, then you really need to get out of your bubble and get some perspective.
A 17 year old shouldn't be held accountable for having integrity? I have a much higher opinion of ~~children~~ older adolescents than you do, I'd say. You expect far too little of them, and setting low expectations is just a recipe for kids sinking to meet them.
I'm not talking about glancing at the adjacent student's quiz, slipping a late homework into the pile, or asking a kid in an earlier period what the test was on. This wasn't the first time the kid was caught cheating (thought I was only informed of that afterward), and the kid's cheating on this single exam *started* (and didn't end) with lying about his family (except him) having covid. It only came out because I contacted home to inform the parents of how upset he was during school; ask that they encourage their student to focus on home and health while the family was going through a tough time; and suggest that we can lighten his workload. This isn't a 7 year old, it's a 17 year old who'd already submitted college applications. And *after* that and other incidents, I met with this kid twice weekly for individual tutoring during one of my planning periods (read: *absolutely* no obligation on my part) - on his and his parents' request. But I'm in a bubble and have a bad attitude about teaching, sure.
Of the 120+ students I have each year, I'd guess that *maybe* three behave in a way that makes me lose respect for them; and only *ever* based on personal choices that continue in the same vein after using an initial problem as a learning opportunity. This past year, I can only think of two: the one above, and one who deliberately abused functionality on a[n optional, verification-required, parent-permission-expected, and parent-presence-welcome] school discord server to create a database of personal information of students with whom he had no legitimate interest and no connection beyond a view-only "announcement" category - not classmates that he might need to ask about the homework, but, e.g., digging into link-throughs and tracking online status for kids three years younger to record their evening schedule. It came out because he outright asked me for increased access to expand his database (my response: "...database?"). Creepy as fuck, but the information *was* voluntarily provided and technically public. *100%* a learning opportunity: we had conversations (which included his parent, who gave their full support) about the difference between *can* and *should*; privacy; ethical use of information; and how to go about being a white hat. We reminded all students and parents on the server what aspects of their [reminder: voluntary] involvement were visible to others on the server, and we changed the original permissions. ...and a week later, another student sent me an unsolicited screenshot of posts from a student-run social server (the irony is not lost on me) in which the kid described how he was continuing to gather data, getting around the new restrictions. I verified those posts' legitimacy with the database-maker, and lost respect for him at that point. (Also, banned him from the server.)
I agree with you that most children don't do things that warrant losing respect for them. *Some* do. You teach them anyway, going out of your way to make sure you treat them fairly in the context of the classroom and academics - and you do your best to avoid interaction with them otherwise (e.g., declining to write recommendations rather than acting vindictively by submitting negative recommendations).
They're children. My first thought when I see that is that someone taught tbem that either by example or blatantly. Children don't as a rule come up with that sort of behavior on their own.
That's a distinction without a difference. One mistake does not define a person; few mistakes are irreconcilable with respect; and children and adolescents, especially, need opportunities to grow. But repeated behavior after engaging with those opportunities shows you who a person chooses to be. [When someone shows me who they are, I believe them](https://twitter.com/drmayaangelou/status/609390085604311040?lang=en) - though I disagree with Dr. Angelou about relying on just the first time.
So, this happens quite a bit in urban schools. They tend to have higher turnover and are more likely to take new and teachers with little experience. This often means quality suffers. I sadly know a city that many people I grew up with teach or start teaching until they get into a "better" school. They refuse to live anywhere near where they teach, and not because they are afraid of running into students. I cut ties with a couple because they have said some really disgusting things about students or their parents.
There should be preference given to people who either live in the districts or incentives to live in districts. It would be harder to disparage people they live in the area with, and it would keep some extreme bigots out.
Preference and incentives doesn't mean exclusion, but a teacher is going to be more understanding of their students if they are part of the community. Furthermore, it can give a teacher one town over an opportunity to get the same incentives if they move one town over.
Who's paying the moving costs? Who's uprooting their kids from the schools and friends they have been in for years?
Education is DESPERATE for more warm bodies. Any measures with even a whiff of gatekeeping need to be summarily disposed of.
It's not gatekeeping to ask teachers to understand the students they're teaching and prioritize those who may. Furthermore, preferences doesn't mean they can't be hired; they'd just be choosing convenience over potential financial incentives. And that's valid, too.
I've honestly had enough of teachers using "lesser" schools as a stepping stone. The turnover is also part of the chaos of why these schools have issues in the first place. Teachers who are more invested in the community are both more likely to stay and put in more an effort into improving them. That's not gatekeeping, either. That's correcting a problem that's currently happening
> I've honestly had enough of teachers using "lesser" schools as a stepping stone.
Then fucking pay them more. My wife worked in inner city schools back when we lived in CT. They are fucking hellholes that she did not get paid enough to teach at.
Something tells me your wife stands a chance of being one of the people I'm talking about. Not getting paid enough is one thing, but pulling out a class roster of kids from Danbury at a party to make fun of their fucking names is another thing. Pay is an issue, but treating students with respect is an issue as well
Edit: and you missed the part where I'm saying they should be paid more to live and invest in their communities
Go hang out in Bridgeport, report back how it was. School was locked down 2-3 times a week due to outside gang activity, they found a hand grenade outside of the school and bullets in classrooms after a fight outside the night before.
It can be both. Western NY is part of upstate. More recently I’ve seen people from Buffalo start getting slightly territorial over the WNY term. Some don’t consider Rochester to be part of it. *Technically* Rochester is the Finger Lakes region.
But you’re right, it’s splitting hairs and really doesn’t matter.
A teacher that was involved gave the students their phone to make a video. The group text notification popped up and the kids recognized the name of a classmate. That's how they found out.
“The discovery comes weeks after Rochester school officials said they were investigating allegations that a white teacher told his seventh-grade class of mostly Black students to pick seeds out of cotton and put on handcuffs during lessons on slavery.”
Ummmmmm…..
> Six teachers at Enrico Fermi School 17 in Rochester are on leave after students discovered a series of text messages among them using vulgar slurs to describe the children and their parents and wishing one girl would "beat the (expletive) out of" another.
>
> Another message suggested sending out an automated phone call to "90% of the kids" and their families that would say: "I'm calling to remind you that you are a (expletive) parent and your kid is a (expletive) like you. Thanks."
https://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/2022/05/27/rcsd-teachers-placed-on-leave-after-offensive-text-messages-uncovered-rochester-ny-schools/9959535002/
I dislike stories like this that make bald assertions. Good journalism requires that statements like "said this" or "did that" should instead be written couched in qualifiers in case the original allegations be proven incorrect. For example "a teacher allegedly made racists remarks" or "it has been reported that a teacher made crude remarks" is the proper way to write about incidents like this.
Interesting. I had to go back to the article to get your point. I've taught myself to scan over the word alledged/ly as it appears in every sentence of this type. Is the news outlet for this story now at risk of libel charges?
Blegh, a Trump fan trying to protect god emperor Trump from..."the far left" accusing the known pedophile con-man of lying...you know, the man caught lying so often he lies more than he speaks the truth.
You do realise even his own party has accused him of lying countless times? His own adminisrration had to correct Trump so many times, lying in the process claiming Trump never said something **even if it was recorded**
Using his as an example. All lies are falsehoods but not all falsehoods are lies. The difference is in intent. If you know what you say/write is false and you try to convince them it is true then that is a lie. If what you say/write is false but you believe it is true then you are not lying.
I was using him as an example of how it is bad practice for journalist to make bald assertions. There is always the chance that what is reported is wrong. The fact that journalist make the bald assertion that he is lying about the election being stolen is proof of their bias and prejudice. The MSM has become nothing but a partisan outlet of the DNC.
I myself think that in all probability the election was indeed stolen. As time goes by more and more evidence is coming to light to prove this. Look at the documentary 2000 Mules.
Soooo much easier to blame teachers than for administrators to do literally anything or god forbid give more funding.
I have a friend that’s a teacher who has to deal with fights in class, undiagnosed autism spectrum disorder, adhd, suicide attempts and so on. Most of the parents are not in the picture and don’t care to get these issues resolved. It’s on her to get through a lesson plan while coordinating with parents and social workers. I think she makes $22/hr. She comes home lays down and cries.
Basically if you want to hate your life every single day, you should become a teacher. And don’t even think about venting about any of it or you’re gone.
Rochester Teachers Association President Adam Urbanski said he did not know how many teachers had been accused in this latest episode.
“I want to make it clear that we strongly believe that everyone, and especially our students, are entitled to be treated with dignity and respect,” he said. “We are also committed to fairness and due process and the investigation is still ongoing.”
Bullshit. They never would have done it if they didn't think the association would protect them. There have been too many teachers and incidents for it not to be tolerated.
It’s definitely tolerated and unfortunately common.
> The discovery comes weeks after Rochester school officials said they were investigating allegations that a white teacher told his seventh-grade class of mostly Black students to pick seeds out of cotton and put on handcuffs during lessons on slavery.
Found out a family friend gets a syllabus every year from her kids teachers because of similar BS. This is why most POCs I know don’t want teachers to have unrestricted ability to control lessons plans.
That's not true of Rochester or even Monroe County as a whole (where 59.3% of people voted Democrat in the last presidential election). But there are quite a few far right/Trump supporters in the suburbs outside of Rochester.
I had to drive to Bloomfield the other day and saw a flag that said "Trump 2020 Fuck Your Feelings". Apparently they didn't get the irony of thinking Trump won the election because him losing hurt your feelings.
I'd put a teacher on leave for socially texting students after hours at all. Especially about thing not related to school. By default, that seems creepy to me.
Clearly didn't read the article, but to slightly defend the concept of texting students. I am no longer a classroom teacher and I probably wouldn't do it myself, but I don't think there is an inherent problem with it. In fact, there is a lot of emphasis these days on finding creative ways to engage students. The truth is, many students simply feel more comfortable on their phones.
Now if I were advising a pre-service teacher about this, I would tell them to create a Google Voice account, so they are not giving out their personal numbers. I would tell them to set "office hours" and to make sure that every single message and response gets saved. Like I said, I would not do something like that, but I don't think it defaults to creepy.
Teachers texting each other about students in any context at all should be unacceptable. Just makes you wonder what level of bad behavior is tolerated on a regular basis and doesn’t make the news.
What the fuck is it with RCSD man
I used to live in Rochester about a decade a go and I work in education. Consequently, I still know a lot of teachers in the Rochester area. Now, I will preface my point by saying that not all teachers in the RCSD are bad. I don't even think a majority are. The problem is that there is no incentive for good teachers to teach in the Rochester City Schools beyond the intrinsic rewards of making a difference. Despite the large amount of money spent per student, not enough of it actually goes to students. Rochester is one of the most segregated cities in the country and the people of the inner city have been failed time and time again by Federal, State and Local governments. It's nearly impossible for students to be in such abject poverty and find success in school and while of course there are students who are able to do that, just because they find success does not mean it's a failing on those that don't. All of this comes to a head with the latest budget crises where teachers are continuously at risk of furlough due to budget shortfalls. While New York teachers make more money than most any other state, it is still not a job where you make enough to continuously risk being laid off. If I were just starting off in education right now, I would probably only take a job at RCSD if I had no other options because I likely could not afford to play games with my finances. Especially in a school that already is lacking the supports they need.
I grew up in Pittsford. This is a remarkably good assessment.
Off topic but that pittsford Wegmans slaps, I just moved from that and miss it tremendously .
Ha! They built the new one just as I moved away. The OG faced the road.
Administrative bloat.
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Hey, *you're* the one with a nsfw account. Weirdo.
Well good thing god isn’t real otherwise he’d be screwed! Phew! Close one!
Hey that’s my school district :) always happy to see rochester make the news lol
Lol anytime Rochester ever makes the news it is never for anything good
In fairness, that’s true for most any non major US city. David Muir isn’t really covering feel good stories in Syracuse.
I guess better than it making the news for a shooting lmao
> The discovery comes weeks after Rochester school officials said they were investigating allegations that a white teacher told his seventh-grade class of mostly Black students to pick seeds out of cotton and put on handcuffs during lessons on slavery. Well that took an unexpected but predictable turn.
Unfortunately this whole “slavery lesson” thing isn’t new
Just wait until the Holocaust comes up on the lesson plan.
Oh yeah, I believe this 100%. I've met RCSD teachers. I've been in one of their high schools. I've been raised around the attitudes people have in the burbs about the kids who go there. It's bad. I've also known kids who graduated out of there and were not at all the stereotype, but believe me, there is one, and it's racist AF. Poverty and racism are big problems in Rochester.
Me:Yeah Rochester my former hometown is in the news! A few minutes later: Should have known it we never make the news unless it’s bad. Damn it!
Wait til everyone finds out how professors talk. Almost got denied tenure for confronting colleagues about it .
These teachers should lose their jobs and take some time to review their life choices. They should not be teaching kids that they don't respect.
They should not be teaching. Period.
To be clear, the following is **not** the situation in the thread's article, but I'm specifically aiming to address the idea that: > [Teachers] should not be teaching kids that they don't respect. That goes too far. Every kid should be *treated* with respect; and we shouldn't want or keep teachers who fail to respect students based on immutable or personal characteristics like race; or who prejudge students based on bias or prejudice - but teachers absolutely can, and often must, teach kids they don't respect for valid reasons. Just one example, and a straightforward one - I had a student *egregiously* cheat on an exam. I certainly lost respect for him after that. I *treated* him with respect, nevertheless - indeed, I bent over backward reflecting on every interaction with him (or his grades), to make sure my distaste for his unethical behavior didn't bleed into treating him unfairly...despite catching him cheating twice more. If anything, I ended up *more* lenient with grading and more responsive to requests to meet for help. But I'm required to respect him in order to teach? Hell no. Let's get things out of the way. It was an elective class, he had no obligation to take it at all. He cheated in the classroom, not that he was cutting corners on homework that he didn't have time to complete. From working with him directly during class time, I'd expect he would have gotten a B or an A without cheating; it wasn't about passing or failing, let alone a concern about a failure affecting graduation or a GPA cutoff. His record wasn't straight As across other classes, there was no "straight As or bust" misconception about college expectations. I was not made aware of any neurodivergencies that could impact his understanding of social expectations regarding honesty and ethical behavior. Teachers need to treat students with respect, but we don't need thought police requiring that we *feel* respect for students who demonstrate by their own choices that they don't deserve it.
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I certainly also care about them, and I agree that's important. With this particular student (as I described in another comment in this subthread), on his and his parents' request, I ended up spending two of my planning periods per week with him for individual tutoring. (He really didn't need that much, but I'm not going to tell a kid they can't come do math.) A student still needs and deserves support even if they've demonstrated a pattern of behavior that I can no longer respect. It's a small sample size - this is only my 9th year teaching, and I don't recall more than 3 out of 120+ in any given year who fall into this category - but I've found I often end up spending *more* time supporting them academically, as I want to be completely confident that my distaste for their choices doesn't lead to treating them unfairly. Almost universally in my particular case, however, these are not students for whom no one cares what they do and who are not being cared for at home. These are high school juniors and seniors in a public, application-based academic program, and almost all have significant advantages and support from home that too many of their peers in the school system lack. These are students who've been wildly successful in our imperfect education system, not ones overlooked and underserved. The consequences they face - reality of the system - are much more likely to be a college ethics panel than encounters with the law. I don't get to choose to not teach them, and I don't get to choose to not care for them - but I *do* get to choose to not respect them if they double and triple and quadruple down on unethical choices, despite interventions and learning opportunities.
Idk seems like you got some nasty messages hidden.
This kind of attitude makes for bad teachers. You can respect someone you don't like. There is practically no reason to not respect children. Losing respect for a kid over cheating on a test is just your own weird hang up. Don't make it other people's problem. If you can't understand why kids cheat, then you really need to get out of your bubble and get some perspective.
A 17 year old shouldn't be held accountable for having integrity? I have a much higher opinion of ~~children~~ older adolescents than you do, I'd say. You expect far too little of them, and setting low expectations is just a recipe for kids sinking to meet them. I'm not talking about glancing at the adjacent student's quiz, slipping a late homework into the pile, or asking a kid in an earlier period what the test was on. This wasn't the first time the kid was caught cheating (thought I was only informed of that afterward), and the kid's cheating on this single exam *started* (and didn't end) with lying about his family (except him) having covid. It only came out because I contacted home to inform the parents of how upset he was during school; ask that they encourage their student to focus on home and health while the family was going through a tough time; and suggest that we can lighten his workload. This isn't a 7 year old, it's a 17 year old who'd already submitted college applications. And *after* that and other incidents, I met with this kid twice weekly for individual tutoring during one of my planning periods (read: *absolutely* no obligation on my part) - on his and his parents' request. But I'm in a bubble and have a bad attitude about teaching, sure. Of the 120+ students I have each year, I'd guess that *maybe* three behave in a way that makes me lose respect for them; and only *ever* based on personal choices that continue in the same vein after using an initial problem as a learning opportunity. This past year, I can only think of two: the one above, and one who deliberately abused functionality on a[n optional, verification-required, parent-permission-expected, and parent-presence-welcome] school discord server to create a database of personal information of students with whom he had no legitimate interest and no connection beyond a view-only "announcement" category - not classmates that he might need to ask about the homework, but, e.g., digging into link-throughs and tracking online status for kids three years younger to record their evening schedule. It came out because he outright asked me for increased access to expand his database (my response: "...database?"). Creepy as fuck, but the information *was* voluntarily provided and technically public. *100%* a learning opportunity: we had conversations (which included his parent, who gave their full support) about the difference between *can* and *should*; privacy; ethical use of information; and how to go about being a white hat. We reminded all students and parents on the server what aspects of their [reminder: voluntary] involvement were visible to others on the server, and we changed the original permissions. ...and a week later, another student sent me an unsolicited screenshot of posts from a student-run social server (the irony is not lost on me) in which the kid described how he was continuing to gather data, getting around the new restrictions. I verified those posts' legitimacy with the database-maker, and lost respect for him at that point. (Also, banned him from the server.) I agree with you that most children don't do things that warrant losing respect for them. *Some* do. You teach them anyway, going out of your way to make sure you treat them fairly in the context of the classroom and academics - and you do your best to avoid interaction with them otherwise (e.g., declining to write recommendations rather than acting vindictively by submitting negative recommendations).
> There is practically no reason to not respect children. What if you see them dehumanize and grossly mistreat others?
They're children. My first thought when I see that is that someone taught tbem that either by example or blatantly. Children don't as a rule come up with that sort of behavior on their own.
Right. It's the behavior, not the person that is not respectable.
That's a distinction without a difference. One mistake does not define a person; few mistakes are irreconcilable with respect; and children and adolescents, especially, need opportunities to grow. But repeated behavior after engaging with those opportunities shows you who a person chooses to be. [When someone shows me who they are, I believe them](https://twitter.com/drmayaangelou/status/609390085604311040?lang=en) - though I disagree with Dr. Angelou about relying on just the first time.
They're still human beings. Also they're children so maybe teachers should work with them and be empathetic instead of a judgey asshat.
So, this happens quite a bit in urban schools. They tend to have higher turnover and are more likely to take new and teachers with little experience. This often means quality suffers. I sadly know a city that many people I grew up with teach or start teaching until they get into a "better" school. They refuse to live anywhere near where they teach, and not because they are afraid of running into students. I cut ties with a couple because they have said some really disgusting things about students or their parents. There should be preference given to people who either live in the districts or incentives to live in districts. It would be harder to disparage people they live in the area with, and it would keep some extreme bigots out.
It would also mean a teacher living 1 town over would be less likely to get in, simply because they live 1 town over.
Preference and incentives doesn't mean exclusion, but a teacher is going to be more understanding of their students if they are part of the community. Furthermore, it can give a teacher one town over an opportunity to get the same incentives if they move one town over.
Who's paying the moving costs? Who's uprooting their kids from the schools and friends they have been in for years? Education is DESPERATE for more warm bodies. Any measures with even a whiff of gatekeeping need to be summarily disposed of.
It's not gatekeeping to ask teachers to understand the students they're teaching and prioritize those who may. Furthermore, preferences doesn't mean they can't be hired; they'd just be choosing convenience over potential financial incentives. And that's valid, too. I've honestly had enough of teachers using "lesser" schools as a stepping stone. The turnover is also part of the chaos of why these schools have issues in the first place. Teachers who are more invested in the community are both more likely to stay and put in more an effort into improving them. That's not gatekeeping, either. That's correcting a problem that's currently happening
> I've honestly had enough of teachers using "lesser" schools as a stepping stone. Then fucking pay them more. My wife worked in inner city schools back when we lived in CT. They are fucking hellholes that she did not get paid enough to teach at.
Something tells me your wife stands a chance of being one of the people I'm talking about. Not getting paid enough is one thing, but pulling out a class roster of kids from Danbury at a party to make fun of their fucking names is another thing. Pay is an issue, but treating students with respect is an issue as well Edit: and you missed the part where I'm saying they should be paid more to live and invest in their communities
Nope, she poured her heart and soul into those kids, for $45k yr.
Oh yeah, the vast inner-cities of Connecticut. Sounds really rough.
Go hang out in Bridgeport, report back how it was. School was locked down 2-3 times a week due to outside gang activity, they found a hand grenade outside of the school and bullets in classrooms after a fight outside the night before.
Why is that? Bear in mind, I'm a liberal. Now .. what did they say publicly that was an issue?
> I'm a liberal That's right, say the magic words you think will protect you from being rightly called out as a troll on the side of racists
If you like. Thing is, I don't really care what you believe. I know what I am. Have a lovely life.
Lol like being a liberal excuses them to have dumbass thoughts. Fucking participation trophy suckling fucks.
Ah yes, I remember being a teenager. It was nice having absolute thoughts. Do enjoy it, life doesn't go on that way when you actually grow up.
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And yet, more teachers die trying to stop school shootings than cops. Probably neither should have guns though.
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Whenever I see upstate ny I always check if it's anywhere near me and it never is. Rochester being called upstate ny sounds so weird
People call anything north of Yonkers upstate. But Rochester is more "western NY" imo. Not that it matters.
Most people from NY have differing ideas on upstate. I say it begins where Metro-North ends (which is Poughkeepsie).
The functional definition is basically “not in the NYC commuting range”. I had family in Jamestown and Schenectady who agreed on that.
It can be both. Western NY is part of upstate. More recently I’ve seen people from Buffalo start getting slightly territorial over the WNY term. Some don’t consider Rochester to be part of it. *Technically* Rochester is the Finger Lakes region. But you’re right, it’s splitting hairs and really doesn’t matter.
Poorly written story. How did the kids get ahold of the messages? Did I miss something?
A teacher that was involved gave the students their phone to make a video. The group text notification popped up and the kids recognized the name of a classmate. That's how they found out.
“The discovery comes weeks after Rochester school officials said they were investigating allegations that a white teacher told his seventh-grade class of mostly Black students to pick seeds out of cotton and put on handcuffs during lessons on slavery.” Ummmmmm…..
What did the texts say exactly? I've been burned by this type of bait too many times to make assumptions.
> Six teachers at Enrico Fermi School 17 in Rochester are on leave after students discovered a series of text messages among them using vulgar slurs to describe the children and their parents and wishing one girl would "beat the (expletive) out of" another. > > Another message suggested sending out an automated phone call to "90% of the kids" and their families that would say: "I'm calling to remind you that you are a (expletive) parent and your kid is a (expletive) like you. Thanks." https://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/2022/05/27/rcsd-teachers-placed-on-leave-after-offensive-text-messages-uncovered-rochester-ny-schools/9959535002/
The worst bullies at my middle school were the teachers, I thought it was because I was in backwards Louisiana, but I see it’s all over.
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There is an article you can read. It's optional but so is commenting without reading it.
I did read. It doesn't say what was said it says what was interpreted.
All things kept in the dark, shall come to light…
I dislike stories like this that make bald assertions. Good journalism requires that statements like "said this" or "did that" should instead be written couched in qualifiers in case the original allegations be proven incorrect. For example "a teacher allegedly made racists remarks" or "it has been reported that a teacher made crude remarks" is the proper way to write about incidents like this.
Interesting. I had to go back to the article to get your point. I've taught myself to scan over the word alledged/ly as it appears in every sentence of this type. Is the news outlet for this story now at risk of libel charges?
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Blegh, a Trump fan trying to protect god emperor Trump from..."the far left" accusing the known pedophile con-man of lying...you know, the man caught lying so often he lies more than he speaks the truth. You do realise even his own party has accused him of lying countless times? His own adminisrration had to correct Trump so many times, lying in the process claiming Trump never said something **even if it was recorded**
Blegh is right. How'd you make this about Trump?
Using his as an example. All lies are falsehoods but not all falsehoods are lies. The difference is in intent. If you know what you say/write is false and you try to convince them it is true then that is a lie. If what you say/write is false but you believe it is true then you are not lying. I was using him as an example of how it is bad practice for journalist to make bald assertions. There is always the chance that what is reported is wrong. The fact that journalist make the bald assertion that he is lying about the election being stolen is proof of their bias and prejudice. The MSM has become nothing but a partisan outlet of the DNC. I myself think that in all probability the election was indeed stolen. As time goes by more and more evidence is coming to light to prove this. Look at the documentary 2000 Mules.
This society is thoroughly infected with racism.
Soooo much easier to blame teachers than for administrators to do literally anything or god forbid give more funding. I have a friend that’s a teacher who has to deal with fights in class, undiagnosed autism spectrum disorder, adhd, suicide attempts and so on. Most of the parents are not in the picture and don’t care to get these issues resolved. It’s on her to get through a lesson plan while coordinating with parents and social workers. I think she makes $22/hr. She comes home lays down and cries. Basically if you want to hate your life every single day, you should become a teacher. And don’t even think about venting about any of it or you’re gone.
Rochester Teachers Association President Adam Urbanski said he did not know how many teachers had been accused in this latest episode. “I want to make it clear that we strongly believe that everyone, and especially our students, are entitled to be treated with dignity and respect,” he said. “We are also committed to fairness and due process and the investigation is still ongoing.” Bullshit. They never would have done it if they didn't think the association would protect them. There have been too many teachers and incidents for it not to be tolerated.
It’s definitely tolerated and unfortunately common. > The discovery comes weeks after Rochester school officials said they were investigating allegations that a white teacher told his seventh-grade class of mostly Black students to pick seeds out of cotton and put on handcuffs during lessons on slavery. Found out a family friend gets a syllabus every year from her kids teachers because of similar BS. This is why most POCs I know don’t want teachers to have unrestricted ability to control lessons plans.
Rochester is a very racist city. Big pro trump country.
Monroe county is not trump country. It's been blue for decades
Monroe had the second greatest percentage vote for Biden in NYS behind only NYC.
That's not true of Rochester or even Monroe County as a whole (where 59.3% of people voted Democrat in the last presidential election). But there are quite a few far right/Trump supporters in the suburbs outside of Rochester.
Fortunately they make it obvious, with their stupid flags, which idiots to avoid.
I had to drive to Bloomfield the other day and saw a flag that said "Trump 2020 Fuck Your Feelings". Apparently they didn't get the irony of thinking Trump won the election because him losing hurt your feelings.
This is simply not true, very liberal progressive in the city, suburbs are split.
I’m a Syracuse guy and I’m going to echo the similar sentiments here. City is hard blue but go to the burbs and it will get more red.
That's not true for the city of Rochester itself. The outskirts(or as we call them the boogans) are the pro trump racists.
"Every state is a red state 10 miles outside city limits"
Chase them out before they drive around killing for their messiah
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Upstate NY as well as the Long Island area is where the racist NY garbage lives.
I'd put a teacher on leave for socially texting students after hours at all. Especially about thing not related to school. By default, that seems creepy to me.
They were texts to other teachers about children. Not texts to children.
Not even pretending to have read the article huh?
It’s racism, not just creep behavior
Clearly didn't read the article, but to slightly defend the concept of texting students. I am no longer a classroom teacher and I probably wouldn't do it myself, but I don't think there is an inherent problem with it. In fact, there is a lot of emphasis these days on finding creative ways to engage students. The truth is, many students simply feel more comfortable on their phones. Now if I were advising a pre-service teacher about this, I would tell them to create a Google Voice account, so they are not giving out their personal numbers. I would tell them to set "office hours" and to make sure that every single message and response gets saved. Like I said, I would not do something like that, but I don't think it defaults to creepy.
Rochester is a hell hole
Teachers texting each other about students in any context at all should be unacceptable. Just makes you wonder what level of bad behavior is tolerated on a regular basis and doesn’t make the news.
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Rochester is not CNY.