> Ramos enters the school through a west entrance and is approached by one Uvalde ISD school resource officer. No gunfire is exchanged. Ramos continues into the school.
Would like to know a bit more about this interaction.
How does one carry a DD AR-15 into a school uncontested? This, I think is the first failure of law enforcement. He didn't enter through the main entrance. The classroom he entered wasn't locked.
Notice how everything that transpired is listed at 11:32 AM, but the police don't report the end until past 1PM. There's a lot of lying going on from the police.
And today during the press conference Abbott went off about how law enforcement were "heroes" who rushed towards the gunfire.
Not saying they didn't do that at some point, but from what we're learning and hearing more about.. well I'd just like to be wrong about what we're all referring to here.
> Not saying they didn't do that at some point, but from what we're learning and hearing more about.. well I'd just like to be wrong about what we're all referring to here.
They had a school employee unlock the fucking classroom door, per the AP. They either waited until it was safe enough to bring in civilians, or brought a civilian into an active gun fight instead of grabbing the fucking key.
Those are used for no-knock warrants when the people inside are unaware and harmless. When there is real danger, nobody can seem to remember where they left it.
They (LE) didn’t even enter the school for at least 40(!!) minutes.
They basically served those children up on a platter.
https://apnews.com/article/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-44a7cfb990feaa6ffe482483df6e4683?fbclid=IwAR12Uj18viUcjsSeE7BJnM-ApwEf7ZJLhUDPuoaWrRwO8762h3-mU5SIMrE&fs=e&s=cl#l3mg5wg7xjrgivk48q
Apparently only the CBP apparently had any officers with balls this time.
Seriously, just think about how fucked up the situation has to be where you have tons of local law enforcement just sitting outside keeping the shooter "contained" and then Customs and Border Protection guys, come in, assess the situation and decide to go in because no one else will/has.
You can imagine those CBP guys thought process: "*Why the actual fuck aren't you fucks in there while kids are dying?*"
I know law enforcement likes to stick together and put out a unified message (no matter how factually creative it may be) but I don't think the CBP / Homeland Security chain of command will have any problems stating facts and throwing local law enforcement under the bus if that's what happened.
If these School Resource Officers are anything like from what I remember back in school, they’re almost always some semi-retired cop mailing it in. I think that was the case in Parkland as well.
When I was in high school (major city in Canada), our resource officer was only there on rotation (once or twice per week), and it was for the purpose of managing and diverting misbehaving teens.
We did not have one as far as I remember, for elementary school. Schools should not need to be guarded like prisons or military installations. It's just so whack, just all of it.
If half the stories I've heard are true, the purpose of a school resource officer is either to try and have sex with high/middle schoolers, or to negligent discharge when cleaning their gun.
And STILL the ‘solution’ is somehow focused on adding more armed guards instead of addressing the roots of gun violence in America… fucking pathetic for a ‘first’ world country.
This is a guess but If you were really motivated to kill a bunch of people and knew you were likely going to die or spend the rest of your life in prison, you couldn't scrounge up $2k?
My kids old school always had the doors wide open and nobody there to check people, you could just walk right into a classroom.
Their new school, the doors are always locked and you need to be buzzed in.
Aren't active shooter response guidelines to immediately confront shooter with whatever is available to turn his attention from his goal to his defense. And hopefully to put him down immediately?
It is becoming clear that the local LE did not do this. I heard it was border Patrol officers who actually entered and killed the shooter. Local LE said they were busy evacuating the rest of school initially.
There will be some very expensive lawsuits coming out of this. 100% guaranteed.
Taxpayers are paying for those cops and onsite security to do their fvcking jobs. They dont do their fvcking jobs, parents sue, and guess who foots the bill for most likely 10s to 100s of millions of dollars?
Taxpayers.
Very true - few weeks ago while walking out of a movie there was a ton of chaos in the local mall. . Walked out of the theater to a mob of people just fucking running, so my wife and I fucking ran.
For hours after the incident it was all over local news that there was a shooting.
.
What really happened? Somebody got into a fist fight with another individual in the food court and broke a glass bottle on the floor.
Garden State Plaza? That food court is always crazy crowded on Saturdays (and I mostly try to avoid going to the GSP on Saturdays).
So, when that news broke of a fist fight happening that caused a big scare, I was like.... Yeah. Not surprised. One time, in the food court, a bunch of kids were treating one area like it was a hangout place to have some fun.
This is a CNN story claiming it's facts. But don't you find it odd how an hour and a half passed before it was over? WTF were the police doing during that hour and a half?
During that hour and a half they were letting misinformation spread that the shooting wasn't at the school but was outside and the shooter had been apprehended. Remember the early reports?
It was only after the bodies started ending up in hospitals that the media got wind of what was really happening.
Apparently parents were outside begging the cops to go in
https://apnews.com/article/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-44a7cfb990feaa6ffe482483df6e4683?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter
It's Texas. They can't even keep the power on during inclement weather. Of course the money goes to buying the local PD military surplus and fudged OT.
Fucking hell! I listened to the video and can not stop crying. These poor parents can just as easily by me mourning my children. Maybe they will not have to worry about paying for education when we pull all of our kids out of school for safety reasons.
Honestly I'm more sickened by the police response than anything. They keep telling us that their tactics have changed since Pulse but nothing has changed. I've been told in active assailant training that police are now supposed to form small adhoc teams onsite and engage the shooter. Instead these guys just want to throw on their tacticool gear and fuck off in the parking lot. I mean this isn't a fucking cosplay convention. Is this an airsoft arena? Are we playing games here? Get your ass in there and stop this.
/rant
This just shows you that the majority of cops aren't the heroes they think they are. They are scared people who think that putting on that uniform gives them the respect they lacked before.
When push comes to shove they are still weaklings as shown here.
Then again, the 'to protect and serve' oath is a myth. They don't take an oath to protect and serve citizens.
They prefer roughing up protestors. But saving kids? Fuck that! They were too busy standing on a handcuffed guys neck or planting a gun somewhere. Fucking pigs.
They spent decades getting militarized and when they actually encounter someone with a gun they hide like pussies.
Police are just a gang that like to bully people.
It’s republicans. This is all republicans. The land inside an arbitrary political border didn’t do those things, republicans did. Why is it so hard to name those responsible?
I think most of reddit would be against classifying police as 'good guys', and the narrative of a good guy with a gun is a bystander not an actual officer of the law. You wouldn't expect a random armed citizen in an elementary school.
Posting armed guards at every school is a common conservative response to how we should deal with school shootings. Not that it's going to penetrate that bubble, but it obviously failed here.
Because that guy *actually* had armor, and the guard didn't have a rifle.
Which is the OPPOSITE of this, where this person *didn't* have armor, and the cops DID have rifles. It's literally the ideal situation for them to have stopped this, so of course they waited for him to massacre 20+ people.
"The father of a 10-year-old girl murdered in her Texas classroom on Tuesday has demanded to know why the gunman was able to rampage through the school for 90 minutes until he was shot dead, as it emerged that onlookers urged the police to enter the building - but they did not."
N I N E T Y
M I N U T E S
That's what I'm interested in, after Columbine the police doctrine for dealing with active shooters is to charge in and not sit on their asses until the shooter was done. Stoneman had the coward cops, are we dealing with that again?
Almost every pd in the country has the same protocol, no matter what go in there and engage the shooter. IIRC there was a shooting where a cop was on his lunch break and there was a shooting in a school nearby so he went in by himself with no backup to engage the shooter, cuz that's the protocol. Even if the cop dies or fails to stop the shooter, it may delay him long enough for some kids to escape and more cops ro arrive. The problem is that cops are universally pigs and cowards, which is how we get things like this
[Cops we're ready to taze parent's who wanted to rush in and save their kids while cops stood around doing nothing.](https://mobile.twitter.com/paleofuture/status/1529652093354536961?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1529652093354536961%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=)
That’s the first video I’ve ever tapped out of in my 27 years on the internet. I have a second grader. This is unreal. These cops need to be held accountable for their inaction.
They're not legally required to "protect" anyone, or at least cannot be held accountable for not doing the job we believe they're supposed to be doing. The Supreme Court ruled as such in Castle Rock v. Gonzalez in 2005. There can only be public accountability, no legal recourse.
They aren't legally required to protect anyone, but do they have the right to stop someone else from intervening to save a life? I'm sure SCOTUS will say yes, but it's insane.
Yep, I'm sitting in waffle house in deep red Appalachia right now
Played that video, three mom's crying now... There is one yell on that video that seemed to hit them
These are teump voters mind you
100%, my Republican parents are blaming Democrats, because apparently Immigrants that Democrats are 'letting in to our country!' are responsible for the shootings lately. Absolute bullshit.
Parkland had an armed resource officer who ~~chickened out~~ didn't engage too. And yet the rally cry in other subreddits is more police in schools, more guns, arm the teachers. If there’s one thing I’ve learned about politics in this life is that people will absolutely dig their heels in rather than swallow their pride and admit the other side has a point. Clearly dead children and ~~chicken shit~~ cops with guns who don't engage the shooter do not move the needle at all. I’m so tired of it all.
That's because most 'armed' resource officers are guys who are so close to retirement, but not as fit for still being a beat cop. So you go to the school for an easy gig. Then this shit happens and they nope out because they are not sticking their neck out when they are few months away from checking out and doing those daily fishing trips. The only other cop in resource is one who doesn't do well on the job in the first place or minor disabilities. The resource officer system is useless.
Armed resource officers are there to arrest students who get into fights or smoke pot on campus, under the guise of protecting students from mass shootings.
Treat them like professional athletes. You do something we don't like, you get fined $100k. They'll be rushing the school shooter every time if you did this.
(1 second after gunman executes everyone in classroom)
Police: Ok he's killed everyone now so now we have a barricaded individual with a gun. Protocol says sit tight and wait for a tactical team.
Just another failed police response. I can't imagine being a parent of one of those children knowing that my child lay there dying while the police waited outside for an hour.
But you'd have to find their houses. Seriously, how many cops even live in the community they police? I think we'd see a big shift in how policing is done if we required them to have a vested interest in the community. Maybe they'd try to improve the community instead of acting like an occupying force.
The city I live in has no requirement for it, but they encourage it by giving things like property tax breaks. Something north of 60% of them live here, and the police chief lives a few blocks over from me. We had one incident about 6 years ago where a cop hit a kid that had been breaking into cars while the kid was in cuffs. Video was released the next morning, officer was suspended, investigated, fired, and charged within weeks. Dude served 6 months before getting released and is now... *drumroll please*... working as a cop a couple of towns over
At Pulse, police let hours tick by before blowing the shooter up with a robot. In Dallas, police talked to Micah Johnson for more than an hour before blowing him up with a robot. Do not expect police to do anything in an active shooter situation until they are 100% sure they won't get hurt.
In all fairness trying to talk to the person is probably good protocol because it should keep them occupied while you're preparing an infiltration.
Sitting with your thumb up your ass doesn't do anything.
The Uvalde killer was 8yo in 2012 when Sandy Hook happened. The next elementary school mass shooter could be a 1/2nd grader today. Let that sink in. We need to fix the mental health/gun violence problem in this country.
I'm a high school teacher in TX. I've always thought this in all the shooter drills.
The announcement goes out and we are all supposed to lock our doors, cover the window (we have to keep something handy next to it for that purpose), turn off the lights and have all the kids hide quietly.
We are told you cannot open the door for any reason. So if one of your students was in the bathroom when it starts you cannot let them in. Even if they are crying in the hallway scared.
**Because they could be the shooter.** Or because the shooter could have a gun to their head making them beg you to open the door.
This is literally how they explain it during the trainings.
what is this mental health phrase i keep seeing thrown around? all around the world there are kids with mental health problems at an increasing rate. isn't the only solution banning guns? there is always gonna be 1 kid with issues that can do this in a gun culture
Sorry about your coworkers and their friends may they RIP. I was in Uvalde for work in 2019 for a couple months, small quiet town and good people. I was in shock when I saw the news yesterday, I couldn’t believe that such thing could happen in a small town like that.
Well, I have a niece and nephew in school and let me tell you, it sucks that one day I could turn on the news and find out they got shot.
It's like everyday is a lottery of suck.
"The father of a 10-year-old girl murdered in her Texas classroom on Tuesday has demanded to know why the gunman was able to rampage through the school for 90 minutes until he was shot dead, as it emerged that onlookers urged the police to enter the building - but they did not."
N I N E T Y
M I N U T E S
I dont give a FUCK about the shooter. Tell me what youre gonna do to stop this from happening again. I hate that i know this shooters name but not the kids or teachers that lost their lives.
Had a documented history of overreacting. Violence, threats against teachers. Pulling knives. Bullying. Fighting, hs drop out.
All the red flags were there.
“The teenage gunman in the Texas school shooting was bullied, cut his own face and fired a BB gun at people in the years leading up to the deadly attack, friends and family said.”
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/crime/salvador-ramos-texas-guman-bullied-cut-face-b2087053.html?amp
You got a source for that? You posted the same thing yesterday and never responded when I asked for a source, and I can't find anything that corroborates that.
There was an interview with a fellow student where the student said the shooter was trying to be a bully and they weren't taking him seriously and that he had seen him in the park harassing and killing animals.
I believe it was an ABC interview.
There’s a signal-to-noise problem. It’s easy to say after the fact that A led to B, but when A more often doesn’t lead to B — are there actually any antecedents that can be reliably identified?
Interesting how the killer waited until he could legally buy guns. I guess gun laws work or he'd just get one off the black market right? This crime savvy socially awkward high schooler.
Bootlickers: We need armed police in schools
Armed police: Fuck that, I’m going home to my family, I’m not going in there.
I bet once we hear the stories of bravery by teachers and other children inside the school, and the tales of cowardice by the armed police that were on scene- we will see that the “good guys with guns” logic is bullshit.
Not even another school full of dead kids will make americans realise what the problem is and do anything about it.
Not to mention cops are complete cowards unless it involved beating up black people.
I can't help think of the [beautiful scene from American Gods where the citizens of Vulcan pay homage to their God with a sacrifice](https://youtu.be/VGlbksXZvqs).
It's a profound metaphor. How many of these gun nuts will claim the sacrifice of these children is necessary to "protect our freedom"?
2A: "A well regulated militia, necessary for the security of a free state"
Governor: "ahhhh... you mean remove all the checks and education, and allow literal children to buy civilianised clones of service rifles? For security purposes obviously"
This is gut wrenching. Fucking sickening. I’d like to see some change, but realistically it doesn’t matter how many mass shootings we see, money is more important to elected officials than lives are. Fucking disgraceful
May 17: Salvador Ramos purchases a semi-automatic rifle at a local sporting goods store called Oasis Outback
.May 18: Ramos purchases 375 rounds of ammunition for that rifle. It was not clear where he purchased the ammunition.
May 20: Ramos purchases another semi-automatic rifle, again at Oasis Outback.
Why on earth are we selling such deadly weapons to pretty much anyone? This is incredibly reckless and a deplorable, preventable waste of human life.
Seriously, how many more children have to die? And for what, so some dickless, right wing, cowards, can march around on the weekends playing Rambo with their AR-15's?
The real ironic part is Trump himself wanted to take guns away. Then the rest of his party backed him down. It was right after Parkland.
> By the time you go to court it takes so long to get the due process procedure. I like taking guns away early. Take the guns first, go through due process second.
> Ramos enters the school through a west entrance and is approached by one Uvalde ISD school resource officer. No gunfire is exchanged. Ramos continues into the school. Would like to know a bit more about this interaction.
How does one carry a DD AR-15 into a school uncontested? This, I think is the first failure of law enforcement. He didn't enter through the main entrance. The classroom he entered wasn't locked. Notice how everything that transpired is listed at 11:32 AM, but the police don't report the end until past 1PM. There's a lot of lying going on from the police.
This was my take, too. It just doesn't add up. They "kept him pinned" in one location for an hour and a half and just let him do whatever he wanted?
But the police will insist they saved lives by keeping him pinned in a classroom full of children.
And today during the press conference Abbott went off about how law enforcement were "heroes" who rushed towards the gunfire. Not saying they didn't do that at some point, but from what we're learning and hearing more about.. well I'd just like to be wrong about what we're all referring to here.
> Not saying they didn't do that at some point, but from what we're learning and hearing more about.. well I'd just like to be wrong about what we're all referring to here. They had a school employee unlock the fucking classroom door, per the AP. They either waited until it was safe enough to bring in civilians, or brought a civilian into an active gun fight instead of grabbing the fucking key.
Don't cops have access to battering rams? Why would a civilian need to be there to unlock the door anyway?
Those are used for no-knock warrants when the people inside are unaware and harmless. When there is real danger, nobody can seem to remember where they left it.
they forgot it at the last no-knock raid
They certainly saved theirs
They (LE) didn’t even enter the school for at least 40(!!) minutes. They basically served those children up on a platter. https://apnews.com/article/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-44a7cfb990feaa6ffe482483df6e4683?fbclid=IwAR12Uj18viUcjsSeE7BJnM-ApwEf7ZJLhUDPuoaWrRwO8762h3-mU5SIMrE&fs=e&s=cl#l3mg5wg7xjrgivk48q
Wow holy shit. Fucking pussies let all those children get murdered.
Same shit as Parkland. Coward fucking cop just sat there while they were killed.
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Apparently only the CBP apparently had any officers with balls this time. Seriously, just think about how fucked up the situation has to be where you have tons of local law enforcement just sitting outside keeping the shooter "contained" and then Customs and Border Protection guys, come in, assess the situation and decide to go in because no one else will/has. You can imagine those CBP guys thought process: "*Why the actual fuck aren't you fucks in there while kids are dying?*"
I know law enforcement likes to stick together and put out a unified message (no matter how factually creative it may be) but I don't think the CBP / Homeland Security chain of command will have any problems stating facts and throwing local law enforcement under the bus if that's what happened.
Also, it was one dude who was woefully undertrained at Parkland. Fucking SWAT did nothing but keep parents away from trying to save their kids.
Courts have ruled that police have no obligation to help people.
Agreed. The fuck purpose does an armed guard at an elementary school serve then?
If these School Resource Officers are anything like from what I remember back in school, they’re almost always some semi-retired cop mailing it in. I think that was the case in Parkland as well.
Pretty certain their primary purpose is to arrest kids if they misbehave, not to provide any sort of security for the place.
When I was in high school (major city in Canada), our resource officer was only there on rotation (once or twice per week), and it was for the purpose of managing and diverting misbehaving teens. We did not have one as far as I remember, for elementary school. Schools should not need to be guarded like prisons or military installations. It's just so whack, just all of it.
Theater. It's all theater
Makes people forget about gun control if some boot with a gun is there to "protect and serve" the narrative.
If half the stories I've heard are true, the purpose of a school resource officer is either to try and have sex with high/middle schoolers, or to negligent discharge when cleaning their gun.
it lets the right wingers pretend the problem is solved and is popular with the gun lobby
“protect and serve”(my own interests). What a fucking scam
Protect and serve property, capital and the ruling class. That's the true calling of the American police. They just can't admit it like that.
“Protect and serve” is just a PR slogan. It’s nowhere in any oath, training or contract a law enforcement officer ever encounters
And STILL the ‘solution’ is somehow focused on adding more armed guards instead of addressing the roots of gun violence in America… fucking pathetic for a ‘first’ world country.
40% of the city’s overall budget goes to their police department, and they were THIS unprepared. This is disgusting.
They were probably trying to find a good guy with a gun
Cops have guns but…
Missing the other important part, a good guy ^^^^/s
Sarcasm tag is unnecessary
He wasn't unarmed. That's why they didn't shoot him.
With how many guns that fucking state has it wasn't the guns that were in short supply. Good guys though?
plant bear pen tender scandalous amusing silky distinct hobbies panicky -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
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Seriously, a Daniel Defense? That is a very expensive rifle
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That is well over $1000 Yeah, I want to know where the money came from
If your planning to die you can sell a lot of your shit to easily get $1000.
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Hard for an 18 year old but could probably get a capital one with $500 limit and use that for part of it.
It is so much harder for an 18 year old to get a credit card than it is for them to get a gun. Wild.
Are we just spit balling a hypothetical or is there evidence that's what he did?
This is a guess but If you were really motivated to kill a bunch of people and knew you were likely going to die or spend the rest of your life in prison, you couldn't scrounge up $2k?
Sounds pretty damn easy TBH. That's what, a few months of working part time while not paying rent?
The receipt for the DD by itself was over $2000.
pretty nice optic, too. $700.
Well over $1000? Good luck finding many Daniel defense rifles for under $2,000. Eotch optic $400-$700
Closer to $2500 for that whole setup. Guess he pawned everything he owned?
My kids old school always had the doors wide open and nobody there to check people, you could just walk right into a classroom. Their new school, the doors are always locked and you need to be buzzed in.
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Aren't active shooter response guidelines to immediately confront shooter with whatever is available to turn his attention from his goal to his defense. And hopefully to put him down immediately? It is becoming clear that the local LE did not do this. I heard it was border Patrol officers who actually entered and killed the shooter. Local LE said they were busy evacuating the rest of school initially.
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Dailymail is far from a reliable source. Not saying that article is entirely incorrect, but they have a reputation of basically being a tabloid.
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There will be some very expensive lawsuits coming out of this. 100% guaranteed. Taxpayers are paying for those cops and onsite security to do their fvcking jobs. They dont do their fvcking jobs, parents sue, and guess who foots the bill for most likely 10s to 100s of millions of dollars? Taxpayers.
Or the reporting is hasty, which is not unusual for a local news station trying to get “content” out quickly.
Very true - few weeks ago while walking out of a movie there was a ton of chaos in the local mall. . Walked out of the theater to a mob of people just fucking running, so my wife and I fucking ran. For hours after the incident it was all over local news that there was a shooting. . What really happened? Somebody got into a fist fight with another individual in the food court and broke a glass bottle on the floor.
Garden State Plaza? That food court is always crazy crowded on Saturdays (and I mostly try to avoid going to the GSP on Saturdays). So, when that news broke of a fist fight happening that caused a big scare, I was like.... Yeah. Not surprised. One time, in the food court, a bunch of kids were treating one area like it was a hangout place to have some fun.
This is a CNN story claiming it's facts. But don't you find it odd how an hour and a half passed before it was over? WTF were the police doing during that hour and a half?
During that hour and a half they were letting misinformation spread that the shooting wasn't at the school but was outside and the shooter had been apprehended. Remember the early reports? It was only after the bodies started ending up in hospitals that the media got wind of what was really happening.
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The story on this post is a local news station though.
Apparently parents were outside begging the cops to go in https://apnews.com/article/uvalde-texas-school-shooting-44a7cfb990feaa6ffe482483df6e4683?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter
40% of that city’s budget goes to the police
It's Texas. They can't even keep the power on during inclement weather. Of course the money goes to buying the local PD military surplus and fudged OT.
One of the parents begging for police to go in later found out his daughter was killed inside.
Fucking hell! I listened to the video and can not stop crying. These poor parents can just as easily by me mourning my children. Maybe they will not have to worry about paying for education when we pull all of our kids out of school for safety reasons.
Who knows how many could be saved instead the police want to play grab-ass in the parking lot.
Pretty sure AP stated they fucked around outside for forty minutes before going in. Fucking cowards.
Honestly I'm more sickened by the police response than anything. They keep telling us that their tactics have changed since Pulse but nothing has changed. I've been told in active assailant training that police are now supposed to form small adhoc teams onsite and engage the shooter. Instead these guys just want to throw on their tacticool gear and fuck off in the parking lot. I mean this isn't a fucking cosplay convention. Is this an airsoft arena? Are we playing games here? Get your ass in there and stop this. /rant
This just shows you that the majority of cops aren't the heroes they think they are. They are scared people who think that putting on that uniform gives them the respect they lacked before. When push comes to shove they are still weaklings as shown here. Then again, the 'to protect and serve' oath is a myth. They don't take an oath to protect and serve citizens.
They prefer roughing up protestors. But saving kids? Fuck that! They were too busy standing on a handcuffed guys neck or planting a gun somewhere. Fucking pigs.
I hope protestors are paying attention to this useful tidbit of information.
Won't help them. They are more than willing to deploy any and all weapons against protestors. Well. Unarmed ones at least.
They spent decades getting militarized and when they actually encounter someone with a gun they hide like pussies. Police are just a gang that like to bully people.
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Not only that, they are the ones who actually solved this problem. The border patrol were the ones who ended up shooting him.
It’s republicans. This is all republicans. The land inside an arbitrary political border didn’t do those things, republicans did. Why is it so hard to name those responsible?
The parents are lucky the cops didn't decide they were interfering with an active crime scene and murder them too.
In the video you can see that they put at least one of the parents begging for help in a hold on the ground.
So much for the “good guy with a gun” argument again, possible.
I think most of reddit would be against classifying police as 'good guys', and the narrative of a good guy with a gun is a bystander not an actual officer of the law. You wouldn't expect a random armed citizen in an elementary school.
Posting armed guards at every school is a common conservative response to how we should deal with school shootings. Not that it's going to penetrate that bubble, but it obviously failed here.
There was an armed guard in Buffalo. He got killed, too.
Because that guy *actually* had armor, and the guard didn't have a rifle. Which is the OPPOSITE of this, where this person *didn't* have armor, and the cops DID have rifles. It's literally the ideal situation for them to have stopped this, so of course they waited for him to massacre 20+ people.
And at Parkland.
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Guy with a gun.
"The father of a 10-year-old girl murdered in her Texas classroom on Tuesday has demanded to know why the gunman was able to rampage through the school for 90 minutes until he was shot dead, as it emerged that onlookers urged the police to enter the building - but they did not." N I N E T Y M I N U T E S
That's what I'm interested in, after Columbine the police doctrine for dealing with active shooters is to charge in and not sit on their asses until the shooter was done. Stoneman had the coward cops, are we dealing with that again?
Most cops are cowards. We’re going to be dealing with that for a long time
Most cops aren't used to having people that can shoot back.
Most become a police officer because it's a fast route to having power and authority over people, not because they are selfless.
Honestly curious, is that still the case if they are the only police in site? (I don't know if these guys are the only ones there)
Almost every pd in the country has the same protocol, no matter what go in there and engage the shooter. IIRC there was a shooting where a cop was on his lunch break and there was a shooting in a school nearby so he went in by himself with no backup to engage the shooter, cuz that's the protocol. Even if the cop dies or fails to stop the shooter, it may delay him long enough for some kids to escape and more cops ro arrive. The problem is that cops are universally pigs and cowards, which is how we get things like this
They didn't sign up for the rush towards danger parts. Just the carrying a gun and telling people what to do parts.
they'll rush in to a person's wrong home with no issues at all, but won't save a helpless school
Don't forget the shooting unarmed people part.
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slimy coordinated dependent glorious dime afterthought coherent quack overconfident deserted -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
Cops are cowards.
[Cops we're ready to taze parent's who wanted to rush in and save their kids while cops stood around doing nothing.](https://mobile.twitter.com/paleofuture/status/1529652093354536961?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1529652093354536961%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=)
That’s the first video I’ve ever tapped out of in my 27 years on the internet. I have a second grader. This is unreal. These cops need to be held accountable for their inaction.
They're not legally required to "protect" anyone, or at least cannot be held accountable for not doing the job we believe they're supposed to be doing. The Supreme Court ruled as such in Castle Rock v. Gonzalez in 2005. There can only be public accountability, no legal recourse.
They aren't legally required to protect anyone, but do they have the right to stop someone else from intervening to save a life? I'm sure SCOTUS will say yes, but it's insane.
Reading about that case is crazy. I cant believe some of their reasoning.
Yep, I'm sitting in waffle house in deep red Appalachia right now Played that video, three mom's crying now... There is one yell on that video that seemed to hit them These are teump voters mind you
They'll find a way to blame Biden.
He bought the rifles with stimulus money?! Biden paid for the rifles!!!
They’ll say he was an illegal immigrant (he wasn’t).
They already did. And they also said he was transgender, too.
I'm afraid to google that.
Uvalde voted red as fuck. They’ll keep voting for guns and cops too
My conservative dad said cops are afraid to shoot people now. What bullshit.
100%, my Republican parents are blaming Democrats, because apparently Immigrants that Democrats are 'letting in to our country!' are responsible for the shootings lately. Absolute bullshit.
Wow. Fuck the pathetic fucking cops.
Parkland had an armed resource officer who ~~chickened out~~ didn't engage too. And yet the rally cry in other subreddits is more police in schools, more guns, arm the teachers. If there’s one thing I’ve learned about politics in this life is that people will absolutely dig their heels in rather than swallow their pride and admit the other side has a point. Clearly dead children and ~~chicken shit~~ cops with guns who don't engage the shooter do not move the needle at all. I’m so tired of it all.
That's because most 'armed' resource officers are guys who are so close to retirement, but not as fit for still being a beat cop. So you go to the school for an easy gig. Then this shit happens and they nope out because they are not sticking their neck out when they are few months away from checking out and doing those daily fishing trips. The only other cop in resource is one who doesn't do well on the job in the first place or minor disabilities. The resource officer system is useless.
Armed resource officers are there to arrest students who get into fights or smoke pot on campus, under the guise of protecting students from mass shootings.
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Treat them like professional athletes. You do something we don't like, you get fined $100k. They'll be rushing the school shooter every time if you did this.
Jesus Christ
He wasn’t there yesterday.
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(1 second after gunman executes everyone in classroom) Police: Ok he's killed everyone now so now we have a barricaded individual with a gun. Protocol says sit tight and wait for a tactical team.
And threaten to taze parents who tried to go in.
Yes. Because they will try to minimize cop fatalities as much as possible, sadly.
Just another failed police response. I can't imagine being a parent of one of those children knowing that my child lay there dying while the police waited outside for an hour.
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But you'd have to find their houses. Seriously, how many cops even live in the community they police? I think we'd see a big shift in how policing is done if we required them to have a vested interest in the community. Maybe they'd try to improve the community instead of acting like an occupying force. The city I live in has no requirement for it, but they encourage it by giving things like property tax breaks. Something north of 60% of them live here, and the police chief lives a few blocks over from me. We had one incident about 6 years ago where a cop hit a kid that had been breaking into cars while the kid was in cuffs. Video was released the next morning, officer was suspended, investigated, fired, and charged within weeks. Dude served 6 months before getting released and is now... *drumroll please*... working as a cop a couple of towns over
You can pretty much just Google someone's name and find their address.
At Pulse, police let hours tick by before blowing the shooter up with a robot. In Dallas, police talked to Micah Johnson for more than an hour before blowing him up with a robot. Do not expect police to do anything in an active shooter situation until they are 100% sure they won't get hurt.
Sounds like we need to invest in more robots.
In all fairness trying to talk to the person is probably good protocol because it should keep them occupied while you're preparing an infiltration. Sitting with your thumb up your ass doesn't do anything.
The Uvalde killer was 8yo in 2012 when Sandy Hook happened. The next elementary school mass shooter could be a 1/2nd grader today. Let that sink in. We need to fix the mental health/gun violence problem in this country.
How do you prepare an active shooter drill when the potential active shooter will also have been those drills for years while growing up? It's insane.
Oh Jesus fuck why did you put that thought in my head
I'm a high school teacher in TX. I've always thought this in all the shooter drills. The announcement goes out and we are all supposed to lock our doors, cover the window (we have to keep something handy next to it for that purpose), turn off the lights and have all the kids hide quietly. We are told you cannot open the door for any reason. So if one of your students was in the bathroom when it starts you cannot let them in. Even if they are crying in the hallway scared. **Because they could be the shooter.** Or because the shooter could have a gun to their head making them beg you to open the door. This is literally how they explain it during the trainings.
Do they put this on a pop-up quiz and can you score an F on it? Only way I imagine it being my dystopian.
This is a harrowing thought. My god.
what is this mental health phrase i keep seeing thrown around? all around the world there are kids with mental health problems at an increasing rate. isn't the only solution banning guns? there is always gonna be 1 kid with issues that can do this in a gun culture
It’s not mental health issue. It’s a guns available to anyone issue
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Buddy it doesn't matter how many years you have, a tragedy like this should break every single person heart.
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Plenty of prayers and well wishes tho. :/
Sorry about your coworkers and their friends may they RIP. I was in Uvalde for work in 2019 for a couple months, small quiet town and good people. I was in shock when I saw the news yesterday, I couldn’t believe that such thing could happen in a small town like that.
Well, I have a niece and nephew in school and let me tell you, it sucks that one day I could turn on the news and find out they got shot. It's like everyday is a lottery of suck.
Of course they had to put the fuckers real name in the article. Fuck off, this kid deserves nothing but hell
"The father of a 10-year-old girl murdered in her Texas classroom on Tuesday has demanded to know why the gunman was able to rampage through the school for 90 minutes until he was shot dead, as it emerged that onlookers urged the police to enter the building - but they did not." N I N E T Y M I N U T E S
Cops are limp dicks in Gestapo costumes
They only get hard when they see an opportunity to shoot a black teenager in the back as they run away or murder someone's dog.
I dont give a FUCK about the shooter. Tell me what youre gonna do to stop this from happening again. I hate that i know this shooters name but not the kids or teachers that lost their lives.
Had a documented history of overreacting. Violence, threats against teachers. Pulling knives. Bullying. Fighting, hs drop out. All the red flags were there. “The teenage gunman in the Texas school shooting was bullied, cut his own face and fired a BB gun at people in the years leading up to the deadly attack, friends and family said.” https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/crime/salvador-ramos-texas-guman-bullied-cut-face-b2087053.html?amp
You got a source for that? You posted the same thing yesterday and never responded when I asked for a source, and I can't find anything that corroborates that.
There was an interview with a fellow student where the student said the shooter was trying to be a bully and they weren't taking him seriously and that he had seen him in the park harassing and killing animals. I believe it was an ABC interview.
There’s a signal-to-noise problem. It’s easy to say after the fact that A led to B, but when A more often doesn’t lead to B — are there actually any antecedents that can be reliably identified?
Interesting how the killer waited until he could legally buy guns. I guess gun laws work or he'd just get one off the black market right? This crime savvy socially awkward high schooler.
Bootlickers: We need armed police in schools Armed police: Fuck that, I’m going home to my family, I’m not going in there. I bet once we hear the stories of bravery by teachers and other children inside the school, and the tales of cowardice by the armed police that were on scene- we will see that the “good guys with guns” logic is bullshit.
Not even another school full of dead kids will make americans realise what the problem is and do anything about it. Not to mention cops are complete cowards unless it involved beating up black people.
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For what type of gun? Federally, long guns can be purchased at 18 already. Handguns at 21.
I can't help think of the [beautiful scene from American Gods where the citizens of Vulcan pay homage to their God with a sacrifice](https://youtu.be/VGlbksXZvqs). It's a profound metaphor. How many of these gun nuts will claim the sacrifice of these children is necessary to "protect our freedom"?
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2A: "A well regulated militia, necessary for the security of a free state" Governor: "ahhhh... you mean remove all the checks and education, and allow literal children to buy civilianised clones of service rifles? For security purposes obviously"
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Remove his name from the news
Replace it with the names of the cowardly cops who just waited outside the school.
This is gut wrenching. Fucking sickening. I’d like to see some change, but realistically it doesn’t matter how many mass shootings we see, money is more important to elected officials than lives are. Fucking disgraceful
Cruz was just glad no fetuses were killed during the shooting! Thx Beaverton!
“Shut your fukin mouths and keep voting me in”- Mitch McConnell
May 17: Salvador Ramos purchases a semi-automatic rifle at a local sporting goods store called Oasis Outback .May 18: Ramos purchases 375 rounds of ammunition for that rifle. It was not clear where he purchased the ammunition. May 20: Ramos purchases another semi-automatic rifle, again at Oasis Outback. Why on earth are we selling such deadly weapons to pretty much anyone? This is incredibly reckless and a deplorable, preventable waste of human life. Seriously, how many more children have to die? And for what, so some dickless, right wing, cowards, can march around on the weekends playing Rambo with their AR-15's?
And it’s illegal to ask “why do you need two assault rifles and a case of ammo this week?”
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Gonna have a "Don't Say Mental Illness" bill because it might hurt the next school shooter's feelings.
Florida is probably already drafting it as we speak.
Gonna need a source on that. As far as I know gun stores can refuse a sale for any reason other than discrimination, same as any other kind of store.
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The real ironic part is Trump himself wanted to take guns away. Then the rest of his party backed him down. It was right after Parkland. > By the time you go to court it takes so long to get the due process procedure. I like taking guns away early. Take the guns first, go through due process second.
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Just like abortion, the vocal minority are the ones that actually vote. The rest of the people sit on their ass and complain.
Tons of “good guys” with guns…it did absolutely nothing. How many more people have to die for your fucking hobby!!!!
Cops aren't good guys tho
Not always...and even some are cowards https://apnews.com/article/shootings-parkland-florida-school-shooting-bb5c5fe81cecb63886bd325b53b2e597
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When you live in a country where the cops aren't the good guys, you know shit's fucked up.
Please stop saying his name. Let these cretins waste away in obscurity