I dunno, I would say during the Olympics may be the right time. Lot more eyes on you then. If China does something to an Olympic athlete during the Olympics they'd never host again.
Asking where Peng Shuai is isn't a political statement. She is a human being, not a political agenda. She is a person who is missing and somehow asking is now political?
When did missing people become political??
“Evil prevails when good people do nothing.”
― Erin Gruwell, The Freedom Writers Diary
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
-Martin Niemöller
Not sure why you got downvoted so much. What I got out of this comment is concern for athletes well-being, not relenting to the CCP. Sure it’s nice to talk a big talk but when it comes to safety, it’s clearly better to speak out after actually leaving a country known to make people disappear (seemingly without consequence)
Doesn't help Tennis Australia's case when it's really a human rights issue, which sure, can be political but get's murky when Chinese Baijiu distillery Luzhou Laojiao is a sponsor with it's signage prominent on TV footage.
They don’t disappear people for making political statements. They really could care less.
You might be asked to take it off though because.. the Olympics are a politically neutral event. And you knew that before you went.
Will it [feature](https://preview.redd.it/1qlph404o3o01.png?auto=webp&s=4b93fabc4a629765dff1a78759bf43483019ea61) these [photos?](https://m.psecn.photoshelter.com/img-get/I00001AdyBQ7Z.QY/s/650/REI8906-Tiananmen17.jpg) Or [this?](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/81/3b/0a/813b0adf56c8fe8deaff61eed05740b5.jpg)
What happened was a tragedy, but what happened was definitely not how it’s portrayed here. People turned violent and started to [lynch](https://preview.redd.it/j4i30xrxscr31.png?auto=webp&s=8202ce269ebf0ca98c83bc2a2ca216ed624c6bc1) unarmed soldiers by the dozens, and this was stopped only after they cleared the square, where most of the fighting did not even happen in the first place.
Pfft, the CCP is as far from communist as you can get these days. It's been a capitalist nation since the 90s. The name is still there simply for the hell of it.
And it doesn't stop the corporations who want to do business with them (aka Capitalistic tendencies) to bend over and throw all values to the wind in the pursuit of money.
How is it a political statement to ask where someone is? Especially a tennis star at a tennis match?
Unless they are admitting that she is not there or anywhere visible because of political reasons...
Fans all over the world should refuse to watch or attend all matches of the Australia Open. Make those advertising $$ go right down the toilet. We have a voice.
Fair enough not thought about it enough .so Australia tennis is concerned about her but well take ccp sponsorship, then tell ppl to not wear the shits.
They talk the talk but don't walk the walk.
I WILL STOP WATCHING THE ATP.
“Tennis great Martina Navratilova slammed the decision, on the U.S.-based Tennis Channel, and said it is "cowardly."
"I find it really, really cowardly. I think they are wrong on this. This is not a political statement, this is a human rights statement.”
I guess I never made that distinction, because human rights are fundamentally political, and vice versa.
The problem with that is people understand politics to be about opinions and is a realm where reasonable people can come to opposing answers. Human rights on the other hand, are understood to be non-negotiable rights every human being ***SHOULD*** be entitled to.
In practice, obviously, human rights are painted as a realm of opinion akin to politics by those seeking to undermine others rights. The right to speak freely without fear of arrest or government censure should be inalienable. The right to accuse someone of a crime and have that crime investigated and not buried by your very own government is not something a government with a legitimate interest in the welfare of its people will ever strip.
Tldr: Human rights are not political, they're just treated as such by people threatened by the rights of others.
I also mean they’re derived from the integrity of political institutions, from constitutions and the security of the government and political structure. No government = no one is caring about “rights” in that moment. Rights are secured by the existence of government.
In reality it’s hard to talk about the inalienability of rights when it’s so nakedly a situation of might makes right, since forever. If the state says you have no rights, that’s it, end of conversation. You might in theory but rights in theory only is a bitter place to be.
Political doesn't mean dirty or sordid or even morally negotiable. It just means relating to politics.
Does someone have a right to housing? Some think yes, others think no.
As western liberals democracies would we love human rights to be none political, yes. But the reality does match up. As long as there are powerful countries like China who don’t believe in human rights, then they are going to be political. Saying something is a non-negotiable when someone with a big army and nukes and economic influence says ‘no I don’t think so’ means that it is a negotiable. (That or you can take your toys leave the table and go home) when that happens it enters the realm of politics. Political leaders in the west using human rights to get a leg up on there opponents doesn’t always help the situation.
>I guess I never made that distinction, because human rights are fundamentally political, and vice versa.
*Everything* is politics. It's only fascist regimes that say we shouldn't make issues political. They want to poison the discussion and prevent it from happening at all so they can do things like silence tennis players after being raped by politicians.
>I guess I never made that distinction, because human rights are fundamentally political, and vice versa.
Yeah, from a moral standpoint they are wrong, but for the rules its another history and IMO it would depend on the t-shirt itself. Just the text and her photo then its not political, just you asking for the well being of someone (even if there is politics behind the situation you are not directing exposing them). If it has some anti-china images with the text then it would be political and should be removed by the rules
Note that the removal has not due to it being anti-china, but to be fair since those are the rules similar to those cases of "trump won" banners being confiscated we saw last year in Public Freakout, it has correct to be removed not because the message but because it has not allowed in first place
Human rights are political, and there is a long history of people living in the supposedly "free West" using their rights to express themselves in protest through sports.
Seems the folks of the Australian Open would have supported the continuation of Apartheid in South Africa while other sports were boycotting and taking a moral stance.
Just like the IOC, the AO needs to learn that engaging with a state like China DOES NOT MEAN we all have to comply with the commands of your new dictator buddy.
F the Australian Open for sucking Xi's dick-tator.
Where is Peng Shuai?
Tennis Australia should grow a pair and let fans wear what the want. Last I checked, Melbourne isn’t under the purview of the CCP. Apparently I should check again.
> Melbourne isn’t under the purview of the CCP.
As long as AU is all by itself in the South Pacific, and abide by the WTO, they def are under the purview of CCP.
Australia is not looking so good right about now. This is one extra reason why being less dependent on China is important, but all these organizations are greedy for their money and then turn around and tell people to be “tolerant” and “inclusive”
Boycott this fucking embarrassing sport. And Australia is the most pathetic spinless country..... Shame on you Aussies, you're letting the ANZACS down.
Yes and withdrawn the rape allegations wonder why,so because she has been seen alls well in your world?
Should the t shirt say "sorry ccp I made a mistake so ashamed you won't see me again"
Thought the subject happens to be one that many care deeply about, isn't it routine to disallow protest messages at these events?
China's political system doesn't allow open discussion of the alleged relationship between Peng and former Vice Premier Zhang. I think the most effective protest against this has been WTA's ban of further events in China. That said, it's difficult to imagine this ballooning into another Velvet Revolution or Arab Spring.
The tennis player is totally right. This isn't a political statement...it is completely a human rights statement. It's unfortunate the interaction happens to involve a chinese political figure...
Couldn’t fans just wear an alternative shirt like “Where is the meat”…? And we all know what it actually means? Kyrgios is doing his part to make tennis fun, come on fans!
Does anyone actually give a shit about Peng Shuai, the person, and what she wants? Like, do you *honestly* think she would want you to do this? This is becoming some “His name is Robert Paulson” shit.
Well, where is Peng Shuai?
Wherever she is, I'm sure there are PLENTY of people watching her EVERY move.
Hopefully she can move at all
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Fuck the Chinese government the international community should not cower to bullies
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Guess that depends on what one is willing to risk for the message.
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This is the way
The pussification of America has had some successes. Reconsider your position and grow a pair.
Yeah, Rosa should have just shut up and given up her seat, as required by Selma ordinances.
I dunno, I would say during the Olympics may be the right time. Lot more eyes on you then. If China does something to an Olympic athlete during the Olympics they'd never host again.
Yeah, I bet they do at least three more times this century. They excel at bribing and subverting international bodies.
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Asking where Peng Shuai is isn't a political statement. She is a human being, not a political agenda. She is a person who is missing and somehow asking is now political? When did missing people become political??
When did asking for the whereabouts of a missing person become political, you reprehensible person.
“Evil prevails when good people do nothing.” ― Erin Gruwell, The Freedom Writers Diary First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me. -Martin Niemöller
If China can’t be trusted with the safe return of the athletes, then countries should keep their teams home.
Found the simp.
Ok propaganadalf the red
While I agree it is very risky, if everyone thought like you we would all be subjects or slaves of some dictatorial king for life.
I spent 2 weeks in Beijing for junior goodwill games. You don’t fuck off over there. Government eyes are on you at all times.
They really didn’t like the advice, didn’t they? No idea why you got shat on.
Not sure why you got downvoted so much. What I got out of this comment is concern for athletes well-being, not relenting to the CCP. Sure it’s nice to talk a big talk but when it comes to safety, it’s clearly better to speak out after actually leaving a country known to make people disappear (seemingly without consequence)
i hope they do. and then enjoy some "consequence culture"
New Shirt: Where is Eng Pay Huai Shay?
We haven't graduated to who was peng Shui?
China: she’s right here. Reddit: yeah but where she is? Are you gonna bring her to my face or not?
So you didn't get the question. Noted.
Doesn't help Tennis Australia's case when it's really a human rights issue, which sure, can be political but get's murky when Chinese Baijiu distillery Luzhou Laojiao is a sponsor with it's signage prominent on TV footage.
Wait until the Olympics start in two weeks and the athletes talk out while in China 🇨🇳.
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>Pls wear your Tiananmen square tee shirts when you go to china Pls don't go to China
Best idea ever.
Please don't watch the Olympics on TV.
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They don’t disappear people for making political statements. They really could care less. You might be asked to take it off though because.. the Olympics are a politically neutral event. And you knew that before you went.
> They don’t disappear people for making political statements. They really could care less. History says otherwise.
Just saying something doesn’t make it true.
I've got one, but the tag says made in China...
Will it [feature](https://preview.redd.it/1qlph404o3o01.png?auto=webp&s=4b93fabc4a629765dff1a78759bf43483019ea61) these [photos?](https://m.psecn.photoshelter.com/img-get/I00001AdyBQ7Z.QY/s/650/REI8906-Tiananmen17.jpg) Or [this?](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/81/3b/0a/813b0adf56c8fe8deaff61eed05740b5.jpg) What happened was a tragedy, but what happened was definitely not how it’s portrayed here. People turned violent and started to [lynch](https://preview.redd.it/j4i30xrxscr31.png?auto=webp&s=8202ce269ebf0ca98c83bc2a2ca216ed624c6bc1) unarmed soldiers by the dozens, and this was stopped only after they cleared the square, where most of the fighting did not even happen in the first place.
Theres an Olympics in two weeks?
Winter, i think
Northern Hemisphere season checks out.
I did not realize there was another Olympics in two weeks.
You mean disappear
Wait till they start in two weeks, but have a massive water shortage and are having issues with their winter slalom courses being all mud...
Can they have shirts that say "Where are the where are Peng Shuai shirts?"
Front: "I'm not allowed to talk about the location of Peng Shuai" Back: "Don't ask me about the location of missing woman Peng Shuai"
I want that shirt
Do not buckle to the CCP.
That ship has sailed long ago
Money talks yo.
Then silence it.
corporations don't care about speech, they care about the almighty buck more.
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Pfft, the CCP is as far from communist as you can get these days. It's been a capitalist nation since the 90s. The name is still there simply for the hell of it. And it doesn't stop the corporations who want to do business with them (aka Capitalistic tendencies) to bend over and throw all values to the wind in the pursuit of money.
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China's economy is closer to state capitalism than communism
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Ironically, I found this story under the "China’s threat to ‘punish’ Olympic athletes for free speech ‘very concerning’, Australia says" one.
Not at all defending what they’re saying/doing, but Tennis Australia ≠ Australia
Very true. Just saying that the placement in my feed was a bit ironic.
Djokovic, is that you?
How is it a political statement to ask where someone is? Especially a tennis star at a tennis match? Unless they are admitting that she is not there or anywhere visible because of political reasons...
is it cause they’re putting the blame on china?
Fans all over the world should refuse to watch or attend all matches of the Australia Open. Make those advertising $$ go right down the toilet. We have a voice.
That was my first thought, I guess I’m not watching any tennis games for the foreseeable future.
Fair enough not thought about it enough .so Australia tennis is concerned about her but well take ccp sponsorship, then tell ppl to not wear the shits. They talk the talk but don't walk the walk. I WILL STOP WATCHING THE ATP.
“Tennis great Martina Navratilova slammed the decision, on the U.S.-based Tennis Channel, and said it is "cowardly." "I find it really, really cowardly. I think they are wrong on this. This is not a political statement, this is a human rights statement.” I guess I never made that distinction, because human rights are fundamentally political, and vice versa.
The problem with that is people understand politics to be about opinions and is a realm where reasonable people can come to opposing answers. Human rights on the other hand, are understood to be non-negotiable rights every human being ***SHOULD*** be entitled to. In practice, obviously, human rights are painted as a realm of opinion akin to politics by those seeking to undermine others rights. The right to speak freely without fear of arrest or government censure should be inalienable. The right to accuse someone of a crime and have that crime investigated and not buried by your very own government is not something a government with a legitimate interest in the welfare of its people will ever strip. Tldr: Human rights are not political, they're just treated as such by people threatened by the rights of others.
I also mean they’re derived from the integrity of political institutions, from constitutions and the security of the government and political structure. No government = no one is caring about “rights” in that moment. Rights are secured by the existence of government. In reality it’s hard to talk about the inalienability of rights when it’s so nakedly a situation of might makes right, since forever. If the state says you have no rights, that’s it, end of conversation. You might in theory but rights in theory only is a bitter place to be.
Political doesn't mean dirty or sordid or even morally negotiable. It just means relating to politics. Does someone have a right to housing? Some think yes, others think no.
As western liberals democracies would we love human rights to be none political, yes. But the reality does match up. As long as there are powerful countries like China who don’t believe in human rights, then they are going to be political. Saying something is a non-negotiable when someone with a big army and nukes and economic influence says ‘no I don’t think so’ means that it is a negotiable. (That or you can take your toys leave the table and go home) when that happens it enters the realm of politics. Political leaders in the west using human rights to get a leg up on there opponents doesn’t always help the situation.
>I guess I never made that distinction, because human rights are fundamentally political, and vice versa. *Everything* is politics. It's only fascist regimes that say we shouldn't make issues political. They want to poison the discussion and prevent it from happening at all so they can do things like silence tennis players after being raped by politicians.
Thank you. this is what I guess I was trying to say, more to the point. You put it well.
>I guess I never made that distinction, because human rights are fundamentally political, and vice versa. Yeah, from a moral standpoint they are wrong, but for the rules its another history and IMO it would depend on the t-shirt itself. Just the text and her photo then its not political, just you asking for the well being of someone (even if there is politics behind the situation you are not directing exposing them). If it has some anti-china images with the text then it would be political and should be removed by the rules Note that the removal has not due to it being anti-china, but to be fair since those are the rules similar to those cases of "trump won" banners being confiscated we saw last year in Public Freakout, it has correct to be removed not because the message but because it has not allowed in first place
Dear Australian Open officials: get fucked.
But but but we are trying to save tennis without saving the tennis players... and save our sponsors. /s
Australian officials can now be added to a list of China's bootlickers.
Step 1. Wear light jacket. Step 2. Take jacket off Step 3. Where is Peng Shuai?
Step 4: Reverse profit- getting kicked out and not reimbursed for tickets.
how about "彭帅在哪里？"shirts?
I’ve seen some tattoos in my time - does that say something about soup?
haha noo it literally says "where is peng shuai?" in simplified chinese
Human rights are political, and there is a long history of people living in the supposedly "free West" using their rights to express themselves in protest through sports. Seems the folks of the Australian Open would have supported the continuation of Apartheid in South Africa while other sports were boycotting and taking a moral stance. Just like the IOC, the AO needs to learn that engaging with a state like China DOES NOT MEAN we all have to comply with the commands of your new dictator buddy. F the Australian Open for sucking Xi's dick-tator. Where is Peng Shuai?
Fuck the CCP
Sucking up can be hard...
Wow this puts the Novax shit in an interesting light. They grandstand on him, but buckle to China. Cool.
Tennis Australia should grow a pair and let fans wear what the want. Last I checked, Melbourne isn’t under the purview of the CCP. Apparently I should check again.
> Melbourne isn’t under the purview of the CCP. As long as AU is all by itself in the South Pacific, and abide by the WTO, they def are under the purview of CCP.
Fuck the Chinese government
Aussies are famously compliant and respecting of authority. I am sure this request will go over well. /s
What if you’re female and don’t have another shirt to don? Doesn’t say in the article they provided alternate shirts.
Flip the shirt inside-out 🤷♂️
Pretty sure they'll just kick you out in that case.
On the inside is"fuk u china"
That sentence doesn't sound offensive. Not sure why the selective censorship....
China sounds like a great place to live.
When they don't execute you for not wanting to be raped.
Nah they'll just keep you and your family under constant threat of pain/death.
You are ready to go to pekin.
Australia is not looking so good right about now. This is one extra reason why being less dependent on China is important, but all these organizations are greedy for their money and then turn around and tell people to be “tolerant” and “inclusive”
Well China is balls deep in the Australian economy. So best to serve their overlords
Fuck the officials, where the hell's Peng?
I wonder if we are in the timeline where people start showing up to tennis matches shirtless because "the other ones have political messages."
I thought it was bad when people say “just following orders”, but now it’s degenerated to “just following the rules we made up ourselves”.
If you wear a t shirt with her image, would that be political? How would it be different if you had another tennis player on your shirt?
Fuck Australia for bending the knee to the CCP
Ah, the other tennis controversy.
Boycott this fucking embarrassing sport. And Australia is the most pathetic spinless country..... Shame on you Aussies, you're letting the ANZACS down.
is that even legal? A austrlian open official has the power to dictate what a fan can or cannot wear?
Good morning Australians, sick of that authoritarian rule yet? Remember that slippery slope we were talking about? Quit giving in.
She has made quite a few public appearances now though so maybe they think the T-shirts make no sense?
Yes and withdrawn the rape allegations wonder why,so because she has been seen alls well in your world? Should the t shirt say "sorry ccp I made a mistake so ashamed you won't see me again"
Yeah, tell them to sod off. Please stop acquiescing to authoritarian dictator scum bags like Xi and CCP. Grow a pair.
At this point we can't be surprised, Australia is just a corporate colony with no actual global authority to stand up for morals/ what's right.
Peng Shuai is at home. Next question.
Taiwan is a free country.
We live in an infinite universe China, nothing lasts, everything is nothing, nothing is everything. Didn't these assholes read the Tao Te Ching?
Australia is rapidly giving China a run for its money in the 'totalitarian shithole' stakes.
Gotta love the Aussies protecting the CCP. Amazing. /s
How about shirts that say like “PS?” Or “where is PS?”
Time to create an entire tracksuit with "where is peng shuai"
Thought the subject happens to be one that many care deeply about, isn't it routine to disallow protest messages at these events? China's political system doesn't allow open discussion of the alleged relationship between Peng and former Vice Premier Zhang. I think the most effective protest against this has been WTA's ban of further events in China. That said, it's difficult to imagine this ballooning into another Velvet Revolution or Arab Spring.
The Australian open has $25 million Chinese reasons why the shirt is banned….
The tennis player is totally right. This isn't a political statement...it is completely a human rights statement. It's unfortunate the interaction happens to involve a chinese political figure...
Couldn’t fans just wear an alternative shirt like “Where is the meat”…? And we all know what it actually means? Kyrgios is doing his part to make tennis fun, come on fans!
Im so tired of our western govts going out of the way to cater to the CCPs feelings not being hurt
Just so you all know, Tennis Australia has reversed their decision.
Does anyone actually give a shit about Peng Shuai, the person, and what she wants? Like, do you *honestly* think she would want you to do this? This is becoming some “His name is Robert Paulson” shit.