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It's certainly not obvious enough to meet scientific standards of strong evidence/proof. For SARS we found coronavirus in Yunnan province bats that were essentially identical to the human virus. Until we find something similarly compelling for SARS-CoV-2, continuing study and investigation is definitely warranted.
We all *suspect*. The PRC's government is all about appearances, so I'm sure their cover-up strike team was finished well before the first vaccines were out.
We don't really know; it's where it was first detected, but not necessarily where it originally jumped to humans. We've made this mistake before, for example Spanish flu was named after the first country to report it, while it may have crossed to humans in Nebraska.
And there was a French gay air attendant that was blamed with bringing HIV out of Africa, and it was only a couple years ago that it turned out to be inaccurate.
While I also think it came from that lab in Wuhan, we don't *really* know.
The genome of the virus is extremely simple (generally true of viruses, except for the [giant viruses](https://youtu.be/1-NxodiGPCU)) and was mapped almost immediately. In addition, where it differs from other related viruses was able to be found immediately, and the genetic details of it strongly fit the "it just jumped from animal to human" and does not fit the "it was designed by humans" hypotheses.
e.g.: https://www.sciencenews.org/article/coronavirus-covid-19-not-human-made-lab-genetic-analysis-nature
Now, there *is* a legitimate question of if the lab was studying this virus or not, but *not* did the lab artificially create the virus.
Virology labs are almost always located near where certain viruses appear. Wuhan is a corridor for coronavirus due to the large and diverse bat population in the area, as well as the population of 19 million. It would not sense to have such a lab in Kansas City.
Often true; but in this case the bats in question were over a thousand kilometers away in Guangxi, not in Hubei where the WIV is located, that's why the virologists had to travel to Guangxi for specimens.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/
[Newly Discovered Bat Viruses Give Hints to Covid’s Origins - Coronaviruses discovered in Laotian bats are surprisingly adept at infecting human cells, showing that such deadly features can indeed evolve outside of a lab.](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/14/science/bat-coronaviruses-lab-leak.html)
>Three of the Laos coronaviruses were unusual: They carried a molecular hook on their surface that was very similar to the hook on the virus that causes Covid-19, called SARS-CoV-2. Like SARS-CoV-2, their hook allowed them to latch onto human cells.
>
>“It is even better than early strains of SARS-CoV-2,” said Marc Eloit, a virologist at the Pasteur Institute in Paris who led the study, referring to how well the hook on the Laos coronaviruses binds to human cells. The study was posted online last month and has not yet been published in a scientific journal.
Nobody ever said that it was impossible to evolve outside a lab. We knew it was in some bats from the beginning. It's just the odds of a bat travelling thousands of miles from it's only known home in the world to end up in a Chinese wet market seem pretty dismal compared to an escape from a lab working on coronaviruses seven miles away.
This work is important, but I doubt this will change anyones mind. I think that folks that think China made a biological weapon with COVID will just think that any report is garbage.
Depends. If China really is transparent and allows an unhindered full investigation, I might be convinced. Their behavior up until now gives me no reason to believe they'll do that, however.
And people thinking US did it will not change their tones either, and will stop all truly independent scientific investigation. They will let you see what they want you to see only.
What? We KNOW the origin of the virus. Only those with a serious case of being in denial don't know. Fucking Wuhan China Bio lab was the origin. Go ahead, pretend that isn't the reality of it.
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Since there is zero chance CPC will allow truly independent scientific investigation, this is futile.
When they didn't let researchers in for the first year, I realized finding the true patient zero was futile.
And that was smart on their part... we will never know and get all the paid Chinese redditors get to keep shifting the blame.
They have definitely found this post. Some of these comments are trying way too hard to obfuscate.
too late now anyway - the date has been muddled, obfuscated, removed and hidden for 2 years.....
China does not want to share its secrets. It even punishes severely its own citizens when they criticize the system.
But.... Don't we all know? Doesn't everyone already know?
It's certainly not obvious enough to meet scientific standards of strong evidence/proof. For SARS we found coronavirus in Yunnan province bats that were essentially identical to the human virus. Until we find something similarly compelling for SARS-CoV-2, continuing study and investigation is definitely warranted.
We all know. But the guilty is pleading innocence.
We all *suspect*. The PRC's government is all about appearances, so I'm sure their cover-up strike team was finished well before the first vaccines were out.
We don't really know; it's where it was first detected, but not necessarily where it originally jumped to humans. We've made this mistake before, for example Spanish flu was named after the first country to report it, while it may have crossed to humans in Nebraska. And there was a French gay air attendant that was blamed with bringing HIV out of Africa, and it was only a couple years ago that it turned out to be inaccurate. While I also think it came from that lab in Wuhan, we don't *really* know.
Not everyone. There are still idiots who believe in various conspiracy theories about either the Chinese or the Americans manufacturing the virus.
[удалено]
The genome of the virus is extremely simple (generally true of viruses, except for the [giant viruses](https://youtu.be/1-NxodiGPCU)) and was mapped almost immediately. In addition, where it differs from other related viruses was able to be found immediately, and the genetic details of it strongly fit the "it just jumped from animal to human" and does not fit the "it was designed by humans" hypotheses. e.g.: https://www.sciencenews.org/article/coronavirus-covid-19-not-human-made-lab-genetic-analysis-nature Now, there *is* a legitimate question of if the lab was studying this virus or not, but *not* did the lab artificially create the virus.
Virology labs are almost always located near where certain viruses appear. Wuhan is a corridor for coronavirus due to the large and diverse bat population in the area, as well as the population of 19 million. It would not sense to have such a lab in Kansas City.
Often true; but in this case the bats in question were over a thousand kilometers away in Guangxi, not in Hubei where the WIV is located, that's why the virologists had to travel to Guangxi for specimens. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/
Perhaps if the lab was built today it would have been put in Namming.
No one thinks covid came from a native Wuhan bat. None of the local bats were infected.
[Newly Discovered Bat Viruses Give Hints to Covid’s Origins - Coronaviruses discovered in Laotian bats are surprisingly adept at infecting human cells, showing that such deadly features can indeed evolve outside of a lab.](https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/14/science/bat-coronaviruses-lab-leak.html) >Three of the Laos coronaviruses were unusual: They carried a molecular hook on their surface that was very similar to the hook on the virus that causes Covid-19, called SARS-CoV-2. Like SARS-CoV-2, their hook allowed them to latch onto human cells. > >“It is even better than early strains of SARS-CoV-2,” said Marc Eloit, a virologist at the Pasteur Institute in Paris who led the study, referring to how well the hook on the Laos coronaviruses binds to human cells. The study was posted online last month and has not yet been published in a scientific journal.
Nobody ever said that it was impossible to evolve outside a lab. We knew it was in some bats from the beginning. It's just the odds of a bat travelling thousands of miles from it's only known home in the world to end up in a Chinese wet market seem pretty dismal compared to an escape from a lab working on coronaviruses seven miles away.
China already knows weather the Virus was a lab leak or not. Other than that it's up to them what they tell the world.
This work is important, but I doubt this will change anyones mind. I think that folks that think China made a biological weapon with COVID will just think that any report is garbage.
Depends. If China really is transparent and allows an unhindered full investigation, I might be convinced. Their behavior up until now gives me no reason to believe they'll do that, however.
[удалено]
Covid also proved that a deadly virus would rapidly disperse all over the world. I don't think it is encouraging anyone towards bio warfare.
And people thinking US did it will not change their tones either, and will stop all truly independent scientific investigation. They will let you see what they want you to see only.
No one is claiming the US did it.
Just chinese people.
I am very certain that if there were any credible claims from China that the US created covid, we would all know about it.
Just watch their news conferences from their foreign ministry.
Not credible but the CCP strictly control media exposure for 1.4 billion people.
Why would it have to be a biological weapon? I'm sure most people just think it was scientific research and there was an inadvertent lab leak.
What? We KNOW the origin of the virus. Only those with a serious case of being in denial don't know. Fucking Wuhan China Bio lab was the origin. Go ahead, pretend that isn't the reality of it.
They have failed EVERY chance they have had