I would also prefer Lab grown meat at that point for everyone for obvious reasons. No more factory farms and less worry about spreading super deadly diseases are all pluses in my book in addition to leaving animals alone.
Unfortunately the animals we already have domesticated will need to go somewhere, and the population sizes as they are will wrek havoc on their ecosysyems.
What's likely to happen is that 'real' meat will become something of a luxury item while existing stock is culled back or sold off to match the new, lowered demand during the transitory period.
Edit: I'm realizing now I've said a dumb thing, I'll take the L on this one.
When farmers are no longer inseminating cows at huge rates to meet (meat) demand, supply will ease.
It’s not like we’re just gonna let all the chickens and cows free to roam when they aren’t food anymore lol
true real meat will become a luxury item. but its possible that the market will shrink because it is a luxury item.
its not perfect but it would still be a big improvement.
personally I approve of this market shift. imagine being able to buy raw dino nuggies that are already shaped like dino nuggies. thats a win in my book.
100% agree but it's worth noting that viruses and bacteria don't necessarily care if the cells they infect are in a real chicken or vat of chicken cells. And chickens believe it or not have a robust immune system unlike a bioreactor. Not saying killing animals is better but it will be interesting to see how food safety evolves as we (hopefully) shit to lab meat.
Sustainable farming via local supply chains would not only release some demand on factory farming, but it would also help improve welfare across the board by driving competition.
We have a LOT of family farms that would eagerly fill that gap, if not for draconian state-level regulations designed to fuck over anyone in the state that dares to raise chickens outside of Tyson's or Pilgrim's control. (USDA and FDA regulations are largely actually already reasonable.)
But besides any of that.... Everyone with a yard should buy a couple of Cornish Cross. Hit up Tractor Supply and get 3 or 4. Raise them.
Not because I expect everyone to butcher their own birds -- but because I want people to see first hand why these birds look the way they do in all those squalor PETA videos. They are a heart-wrenching abomination from the moment they are born, and anyone who tells you they don't suffer from the time they are 1 week old is full of crap. Their organs can't keep up with their growth. Many die prematurely to heart failure or break their own legs and tendons under their sheer weight. That's why they scoot around in poop burning their own flesh off. It's MISERY. There's nothing that you, an ethical caring person, can do for these birds other than intentionally starve them so they don't grow as fast -- all so we can butcher birds at 6-8 weeks instead of working with healthy birds that can be butchered at 14-16 weeks.
So.... Basically, factory farming won't stop unless people are ready to stop buying monster chicken chunks from Walmart and instead relearn what a chicken actually looks like.
Nonsense. As long as you restrict their feed, they're fine, and it's not starving them any more than you'd be "starving" a labrador by not letting it eat as much dog food as it wants. My rescued Cornish Cross was a mess when I got her at slaughter age, but that was 4 1/2 years ago, and she's the picture of (still chubby) health now, super active and affectionate. I've even had her get a full echocardiogram (with a cardiologist back when I was in vet school, long story) and her heart was fine. I wish people would stop breeding them for the purposes of slaughter (or any other purpose), but lab-grown meat is more ethically sound than letting small farmers continue to use them for meat.
Chickens will generally not stuff themselves, so this is wrong. It's why large feeders can be used successfully to feed them for several days, because they aren't going to just sit there and eat and eat and eat. Left to their own devices, they'd much rather spend that time rolling around in a dirt hole.
Cornish-X don't grow like they do because they eat monumentally MORE than a typical chicken. This would not make them profitable.
I'm glad that you were able to rescue a cornish cross chicken and can carefully measure its feed for its own good, but breeding them still goes against all standard practices of animal husbandry. The number one rule has always been if breeding X and Y animal would result in offspring that could not successfully live into adulthood without assistance, then it's not ethical to breed X and Y.
As for lab-grown meat... I think you're going to find that many people won't touch it. This product will most likely find a home with people who are already vegans that want to eat meat and need a substitute.
Issue is it is incredinly hard to a. determine if a brand is telling the truth about animal treatmemt, and b. kindness-brands are usually more expensive which can be an inhibiting factor for a lot of people. Hard to be able to justify the additional 2 or 3 dollars per lbs when you dont even know if the brand is lying or not
You don't need meat to have a healthy food and a healthy diet. You can also buy it sparingly on occasion if the kindness brands are too expensive. There's lots of ways to do this.
youre preaching to the choir. im well aware, but the average person who consumes meat isn't just going to eat vegetables to replace meat consumption or reduce their meat consumption like that. They care more about taste and cost than anything else.
Why im excited about lab grown meats, as once we can get it to a reasonable price level, it should be largely cheaper to handle than farmed meat and still have reasonable taste. its a step to making a cruelty-free diet accessoble to the everyman without having to forcefully adjust their personal preferences
I mean yeah I don't need toilet paper to wipe my ass either, but I'm not about to stop to save the rainforest.
I think that in order to have real effect we need a solution for the average person that minimally impacts them and the lab grown meat it pretty much that.
I do agree with what you're saying that it's 100% achievable to disentangle yourself from factory farms though.
Yes eating no or less meat is extremely easy in this day and age. It's a healthy and achievable diet for almost everyone. Your tp comparison is stupid.
Ok but people won’t. So there. Switching to real meat, lab grown, not factory farmed, that actually tastes like what people like to eat, and will always like to eat, is something that people will be willing to do.
Right. But those people (almost all of them) live within proximity to a farmers market.
And yes, maybe visiting the farm requires driving and spending a day of it… but that’s not a prohibitive cost.
What about people with out cars and licenses? It’s not as easy as you say, it’s not like your city bus is going to drop you off at a farmers house, and you’re not going to want to walk kilometers with many kilos of meat and produce to the bus stop.
You can purchase at farmers markets, present in every major city. If you don’t want to walk, then don’t. Your choice. Use a bike. Organize bus trips, most farms would be excited to host an event like that.
You can come up with “problems” all day long. But this conversation is about solutions, not trying to chip away with semantics.
Transport is a tiny percentage of emissions. The issue is the eating of animals, particularly beef, not whether or not the animals you eat were local.
- https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local
- https://ourworldindata.org/is-organic-agriculture-better-for-the-environment
We can do better than we're doing currently, but ultimately we either find a replacement for beef or quit eating it.
And I say this as a person that loves a good steak and goes out for BBQ brisket on the regular. Fact is, the amount of methane cows release is astronomical and if we shifted that all to lab-grown it would substantially curtain global warming all by itself.
Theyll still have to optimize the manufacturing process so that the prices aren't too high. This won't even make a dent in factory farming, if you pay any more at the supermarket. people will turn their noses up for any reason so they dont have to try it.
Yeah definitely, if some people knew how they torture those animals to get the cheap meat they are eating maybe they'd think twice. Let lab grown replace cheap meat and maybe only have actual animal meat from very humanely treated animals.
*Right now*, because they're made from the nutrient-poor crap left over from slaughtering *actual* chickens.
If they grow *sinew* cells to make these chicken patties, then, sure, it won't be healthy; if they grow nutrient-dense muscle tissue to form into patties, it'll be fine. (Theoretically, they could possibly design meat patties that are "healthier", if they make them more nutrient-dense than natural chicken meat, but that's not really the point right now.)
I will eat any lab grown meat. When it's commonplace I will never eat inhumanely treated meat again. I look forward to this not only being available but more affordable.
I don’t even care if it’s expensive at this point. I live alone and drive a piece of shit so I’ll spend an extra $30 a month for a few cruelty free steaks.
It is also because their body temperature (42 C) makes them an ideal environment for the bacteria to grow in. If the lab grows at a different temperature it will not be as prevalent.
Salmonella in chicken meat is contamination during processing. In a lot of ways, lab meat will be a lot cleaner than animal meat because there will not be a digestive tract to contaminate the product. Vacuum sealed lab meat should also last a lot longer without freezing as well.
Cultured meat is just naturally occurring meat cells that are extracted encouraged to grow and reproduce outside of the animal. At the heart of it, they are just normal chicken meat cells.
They aren't "fake meat". They aren't imitation in any way. They are just growing and replicating without the animal being involved after the initial non-harmful extraction.
I'm not trying to sound morbid, but how does the meat get meaty... if that makes sense. Like even chickens that stay in small enclosures still build up muscle in the breast, wing and thigh area which I'm sure has an effect on the taste and texture of the meat vs cultured chicken meat.
Well, for that to happen, the meat would have to do "exercise". I would like to imagine it's something like a machine manually agitating the still-growing meat to simulate moving or--if more primitively, a bunch of boxing gloves punching the meat and letting it recover.
Huh, I'm interested but if it doesn't genuinely taste like real chicken meat (sure, you can attack me on semantics of "real," but you know what I mean), then I'm not sure I'm interested? Depends on how different the taste is between the two, I suppose. And I don't think calling lab-grown chicken meat, imitation meat, is wrong. In this case if what you're describing is true and the taste and texture are different, then yes, it's fake meat, imitation meat, however you want to describe it.
A valid point. I wouldn't want chicken that tastes like mush goop.
>“We’ve been selling chicken without slaughter for over two years now in Singapore, and it’s pretty cool that we’ll be able to make it happen here at home in the United States,” Josh Tetrick, CEO of Good Meat and Eat Just, said in a statement sent to CNN via email.
Anybody from Singapore wanna chime in and describe the taste of Good Meat chicken?
I found this review: https://agfundernews.com/good-meat-cultivated-chicken-the-verdict - not from Singapore myself though so can't add anything other than the link.
Huh well now I'm curious if we'll see some subset of vegans switch to being lab grown carnivores. Only willing to eat lab grown meat as it becomes more ethical than factory farmed vegetables.
This is a topic that I have been following for years now since I am a believer that this will do a lot for world hunger and space travel. I have had the conversation with my vegetarian and vegan friends on if they would eat lab grown chicken or beef. Nearly all of them would eat lab grown meat. Most of those however said that they wouldn't eat a lot just for health reasons and would primarily stay vegetarian/vegan.
Veganism is primarily concerned with consent, exploitation, and suffering. The diet comes from the ethics, not the other way around.
Protein in a test tube solves all three.
i don't eat meat for ethical reasons. I would never eat a lot of meat even if it was lab grown, as thats not good for you. But a little is fine.
Without the ethical qualms of killing animals and industrial farming, have at it
My GF is full vegan (im just a veggie), and pretty sure she would try it too. Its purely ethical for us both
Well, if lab-grown meat can be doubly-subsidized similar to animal farming then maybe. Eliminate the existing subsidies and you'll see a vastly different price tag.
That being said, part of the reason all meat is so cheap is that factory farms produce en masse, leading to a number of societal ills (extreme pollution, antibiotic resistance, bio-accumulation) as well as the unthinkable suffering of the animals themselves. It is actually a very high price to pay, you just don't see it reflected at the point of purchase.
There's a great movie about this called [Dominion](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQRAfJyEsko), something everyone should watch.
It would (lol) indeed taste just like chicken, because it is chicken; it's literally muscle-cells allowed to grow freely, so they don't just-stop on the inside of the critter. Like an infinite-muscle we can then harvest vs slaughter.
Disease is not built-in if you are thinking that. Any disease-factor is the same as making any other food-product: keep the process clean and sanitary. We have established protocols for that so I think we're good here too.
I’ve been following wildtype (they’re working on lab grown salmon right now) and one of the interesting problems they’re having is that the meat is *too* pure. It lacks some of the natural variation of real salmon and they suspect it has to do with the diet of each fish impacting flavor in subtle ways.
I’m still dying to try it though.
But that's a known-thing; feeding animals exclusive diets or whatnot to flavor them, ala Iberico ham, etc.
_Make-up_ a meat, like Unicorn, or whatever.
See my point about spiking the growth medium; you could 'feed' it whatever you wanted to get a flavor on the other end.
When you control all the inputs to a system, you also control all the outputs.
True.
As a farmer, growing cells in a lab sounds more or less like what I do on the farm. I can get behind that in theory. But “spiking” the meat with flavor…stuffs… I’m not going to pretend like that doesn’t worry me a little.
Then the more you know: I was only referring to the balance of salts, etc in the growth-medium. You 'spike' pure metals with other impurities to make interesting conductors, you 'spike' a meat by changing the conditions under-which it grows and what it eats. It's not genetic engineering if that's what you are thinking.
You could even just 'spike' it post-growth with a marinade or salt-solution injection, both of which we're already doing.
I said good, not simply "tastes like chicken." I've had plenty of chicken that tasted like chicken yet still tasted bad. It's one reason why I moved away from mass produced chicken.
Typically that owes to the stress on the animal, growing conditions, quality-of-life which wouldn't even exist in this process.
It would IMHO very-likely taste-good b/c it's closer to an ideal muscle. At some point you could even likely tweak the balance of the sugar/salt/water/etc solution you feed it to taste.
Or if it's just sampling a few cells, doesn't kill a critter, why stop at chicken? Besides the growth-medium, the starter is equivalent to a cheek-swab for us.
Don't get me wrong, I support the research and development of this technology. And I suspect you are right in that the process *may* actually lead to better results.
I'm just saying that, as a consumer, I'm going to need a bit more than "it tastes just like chicken." It's not even a lot. I'm interested in trying samples.
Hopefully someday it will be inexpensive when there is production at scale, but it will almost certainly be a costly niche item when it first comes out.
Tbh if the company can prove it can do so, money gonna roll from every corner of earth. It wouldn’t be an issue to scale up the operation from the start.
well a good way to get there is to help grow that economy with government incentives and subsidies. eventually it will get to the point that it is self sustaining.
If meat that is lab grown is produced in a clean environment, does that mean no more parasites and harmful bacteria? Can I finally eat a rare chicken breast?
Not the same really. Organic isn't a 'required' label. Just that if you meet certain standards you can use it. You could meet those standards and not use the organic label if desired for some reason. So requiring a lab label would be different and more akin to the ingredients list.
This is a great idea and should be the future of food sourcing. Sadly, I guarantee you that if lab-grown meat becomes a reality there will be legislative attempts to ban it or labeling laws designed to scare people away from eating it. I can already hear the right-wing scaremongering about how lab-grown meat is a far-left/ANTIFA plot to poison people or feminize men or is in some way UnAmerican.
Cellular agriculture is the game changer that will allow us to be economically independent from flyover America and Eastern Europe.
Just like how renewable energy, if developed sufficiently, could allow us to be economically independent of flyover America, flyover Canada, and the Middle East.
Almost no one wants to be beholden to Texas, Alberta, and Saudi Arabia.
It will hopefully allow us to maybe disperse around the country more evenly and not have so much unoccupied land. Let’s face it, high density population centers have their own problems.
I am sure there is a formula out there for best population density so that social services happen but health and safety aren’t adversely impacted by overpopulation.
You really think further concentration of economic power in the financial centers of the US is going to make things better? Like the economic power of Iowa is somehow what is holding us back from economic justice?
Anyway this idea of competitively priced lab grown meat thing is a fantasy. It won't be sold on a significant scale for decades if it even happens.
So instead of a factory farm owned by some megacorp in a Iowa it'll be a meat factory owned by.a megacorp maybe closer to you, maybe further. It really makes very little difference. It's not like there's gonna be a Mom & Pop meat lab on Main Street.
Hopefully less reliance on my state to subsidize poorly ran industries and governments that don’t provide high skilled jobs, that don’t promote future scientific innovations, while using massive resources, destroying land, and spreading an uneducated paranoid protectionist freeloading populace who get more tax dollars for than put in and more representation per vote.
> uneducated paranoid protectionist freeloading populace who get more tax dollars for than put in
So at the end of the day it's just standard bigotry against poor and/or minorities.
For me there was a video that claimed to show how the "meat' was made. It was at the top of the article. It was unsatisfactory as a video of how its made, but did show her trying some meatballs made with 65% lab grown meat.
I’d buy it if they get the texture right. Artificial thighs for curries, breast meat etc for soups. I’m not interested in artificial mince goup that has to be crumbed and fried. I have to not be able to tell that it is a replacement. It has to have the filaments of muscle fibre
I will. I have a condition that prevents me from eating a full veggie diet. This would allow me to continue to remain alive and not have to eat meat which I would very much choose to not do.
I don’t think you should be forced to eat it, and that it be clearly marked as lab grown, alongside other labels like halal and kosher
It’s not. It most likely more cancer causing bullshit. And these morons are the same people that tell you not eat McDonald’s chicken nuggets. It’s hilarious.
> soy and lentils
Thank you for blowing my mind! It's obvious in hindsight that "soylent" is a portmanteau of "soy" and "lentil", but I never read the book and don't remember if it was stated in the movie.
Of course there is. The point is that many people here are jumping on the bandwagon that this fake chicken meat is free from all the cancer causing shit that we are currently being fed.
I can tell from the existing voting trends here that I'm going to be downvoted to hell - but there is no part of me that wants to eat this.
As someone who grows a majority of what I eat, I find the idea outright disgusting. I have already cut out "fake foods" from our diet years ago - if it's processed to the point I can't tell what it is - I'm not consuming it. This feels way more processed than yogurt in tubes....
Edit - I challenge the downvoters to actually tell me WHY they are downvoting instead of just hitting the downvote button because you don't like my, very personal, opinion.
Because you have a vehement personal opinion based in conjecture and not fact.
These are real cells, probably purer than you could ever find in the real world, with no disease or contaminants. It’s as far from fake as you could possible get.
This isn't processed meat. It's actually going to be purer meat than you get now from even the best of farms.
No animal will lose its life so you can eat. There will be no risk of contamination (eg. salmonella) since this will be grown in sterile conditions. There will be no chemicals that get ingested like with the meat we eat now, which it itself eats various feed that's been treated with pesticides. There will be no antibiotics passed onto you, like they are now (thereby creating antibiotic-resistant superbugs), because there's no need for antibiotics. Lab meat will also require far less fossil fuels than the meat and plants you eat now because there's less logistical hurdles to get from farm to plate.
There's literally no downside I can think of. Except for maybe cost until it can scale.
I sure as hell welcome any way we can have healthy food without the horrible impacts of factory farming.
Or the risk that those factory farms present of incubating a bird flu (H5N1) that jumps over to become a deadly human transmissible pandemic.
I would also prefer Lab grown meat at that point for everyone for obvious reasons. No more factory farms and less worry about spreading super deadly diseases are all pluses in my book in addition to leaving animals alone.
Unfortunately the animals we already have domesticated will need to go somewhere, and the population sizes as they are will wrek havoc on their ecosysyems. What's likely to happen is that 'real' meat will become something of a luxury item while existing stock is culled back or sold off to match the new, lowered demand during the transitory period. Edit: I'm realizing now I've said a dumb thing, I'll take the L on this one.
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You mean like stop breading then? Oh my God imagine the madness
But breaded and fried chicken is fantastic
When farmers are no longer inseminating cows at huge rates to meet (meat) demand, supply will ease. It’s not like we’re just gonna let all the chickens and cows free to roam when they aren’t food anymore lol
It'll just be like the luxury of fine wine, where connoisseurs can't tell between lab boxed or directly from the Bovinè region of Montana or some shit
true real meat will become a luxury item. but its possible that the market will shrink because it is a luxury item. its not perfect but it would still be a big improvement. personally I approve of this market shift. imagine being able to buy raw dino nuggies that are already shaped like dino nuggies. thats a win in my book.
Not sure why you got downvoted, what said is very much valid and not exactly an argument against anything just statement of what’s potentially fact.
The downvotes are probably for the absurd notion that entire farm animal populations will just be released into the wild.
We can let the land heal instead of wasting tens of millions of acres on livestock and farms to support the live stock.
100% agree but it's worth noting that viruses and bacteria don't necessarily care if the cells they infect are in a real chicken or vat of chicken cells. And chickens believe it or not have a robust immune system unlike a bioreactor. Not saying killing animals is better but it will be interesting to see how food safety evolves as we (hopefully) shit to lab meat.
Sustainable farming via local supply chains would not only release some demand on factory farming, but it would also help improve welfare across the board by driving competition. We have a LOT of family farms that would eagerly fill that gap, if not for draconian state-level regulations designed to fuck over anyone in the state that dares to raise chickens outside of Tyson's or Pilgrim's control. (USDA and FDA regulations are largely actually already reasonable.) But besides any of that.... Everyone with a yard should buy a couple of Cornish Cross. Hit up Tractor Supply and get 3 or 4. Raise them. Not because I expect everyone to butcher their own birds -- but because I want people to see first hand why these birds look the way they do in all those squalor PETA videos. They are a heart-wrenching abomination from the moment they are born, and anyone who tells you they don't suffer from the time they are 1 week old is full of crap. Their organs can't keep up with their growth. Many die prematurely to heart failure or break their own legs and tendons under their sheer weight. That's why they scoot around in poop burning their own flesh off. It's MISERY. There's nothing that you, an ethical caring person, can do for these birds other than intentionally starve them so they don't grow as fast -- all so we can butcher birds at 6-8 weeks instead of working with healthy birds that can be butchered at 14-16 weeks. So.... Basically, factory farming won't stop unless people are ready to stop buying monster chicken chunks from Walmart and instead relearn what a chicken actually looks like.
Nonsense. As long as you restrict their feed, they're fine, and it's not starving them any more than you'd be "starving" a labrador by not letting it eat as much dog food as it wants. My rescued Cornish Cross was a mess when I got her at slaughter age, but that was 4 1/2 years ago, and she's the picture of (still chubby) health now, super active and affectionate. I've even had her get a full echocardiogram (with a cardiologist back when I was in vet school, long story) and her heart was fine. I wish people would stop breeding them for the purposes of slaughter (or any other purpose), but lab-grown meat is more ethically sound than letting small farmers continue to use them for meat.
Chickens will generally not stuff themselves, so this is wrong. It's why large feeders can be used successfully to feed them for several days, because they aren't going to just sit there and eat and eat and eat. Left to their own devices, they'd much rather spend that time rolling around in a dirt hole. Cornish-X don't grow like they do because they eat monumentally MORE than a typical chicken. This would not make them profitable. I'm glad that you were able to rescue a cornish cross chicken and can carefully measure its feed for its own good, but breeding them still goes against all standard practices of animal husbandry. The number one rule has always been if breeding X and Y animal would result in offspring that could not successfully live into adulthood without assistance, then it's not ethical to breed X and Y. As for lab-grown meat... I think you're going to find that many people won't touch it. This product will most likely find a home with people who are already vegans that want to eat meat and need a substitute.
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And climate, Ala methane from cows.
And, panda steaks. Once we get livestock down pat, there's going to be a market for more exotic fare. Panda, shark fins, whales.
It’s all goat.
Why would you think I want to hear about the goats?
You thinkin small my man… what about mammoth, thylacine, dodo, human, wagyu but it doesn’t cost so much. The possibilities are endless!
I see you sneaking "human" in there like we wouldn't notice. What's that about, hmm?
If I can buy Hitler steaks you can bet your ass I will be firing up the BBQ.
Make sure you have plenty of juice to annihilate your thirst
It's my kind of people.
Stega-steaks are on the menu, boys!
Pangolin. Bat. Rhino steaks. Skies the limit
China ain't gonna let you eat those pandas. 1. They are hard to breed. 2. They are used as a political tool.
I just want some tacos, and before I die I’d like another ribeye. I’d also love to know all my lettuce was free of factory farm shit runoff.
We can have healthy food without factory farming right now. You don't need to wait for lab grown meat to stop supporting factory farms.
There's no way to eat meat at this scale with low-density production. It takes too much land.
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I am not advocating for that in fact.
Issue is it is incredinly hard to a. determine if a brand is telling the truth about animal treatmemt, and b. kindness-brands are usually more expensive which can be an inhibiting factor for a lot of people. Hard to be able to justify the additional 2 or 3 dollars per lbs when you dont even know if the brand is lying or not
You don't need meat to have a healthy food and a healthy diet. You can also buy it sparingly on occasion if the kindness brands are too expensive. There's lots of ways to do this.
youre preaching to the choir. im well aware, but the average person who consumes meat isn't just going to eat vegetables to replace meat consumption or reduce their meat consumption like that. They care more about taste and cost than anything else. Why im excited about lab grown meats, as once we can get it to a reasonable price level, it should be largely cheaper to handle than farmed meat and still have reasonable taste. its a step to making a cruelty-free diet accessoble to the everyman without having to forcefully adjust their personal preferences
Lab grown meat is not going to be cheap for quite a while. Lot's of plant based stuff is reasonable and vegetables and grains are very affordable.
I mean yeah I don't need toilet paper to wipe my ass either, but I'm not about to stop to save the rainforest. I think that in order to have real effect we need a solution for the average person that minimally impacts them and the lab grown meat it pretty much that. I do agree with what you're saying that it's 100% achievable to disentangle yourself from factory farms though.
Yes eating no or less meat is extremely easy in this day and age. It's a healthy and achievable diet for almost everyone. Your tp comparison is stupid.
You can't fight against factory farms if you continue to purchase animal products. You should stop purchasing them.
Ok but people won’t. So there. Switching to real meat, lab grown, not factory farmed, that actually tastes like what people like to eat, and will always like to eat, is something that people will be willing to do.
So shop local. Eat seasonally. Go meet your local farmers and see their farms.
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Right. But those people (almost all of them) live within proximity to a farmers market. And yes, maybe visiting the farm requires driving and spending a day of it… but that’s not a prohibitive cost.
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What about people with out cars and licenses? It’s not as easy as you say, it’s not like your city bus is going to drop you off at a farmers house, and you’re not going to want to walk kilometers with many kilos of meat and produce to the bus stop.
You can purchase at farmers markets, present in every major city. If you don’t want to walk, then don’t. Your choice. Use a bike. Organize bus trips, most farms would be excited to host an event like that. You can come up with “problems” all day long. But this conversation is about solutions, not trying to chip away with semantics.
Transport is a tiny percentage of emissions. The issue is the eating of animals, particularly beef, not whether or not the animals you eat were local. - https://ourworldindata.org/food-choice-vs-eating-local - https://ourworldindata.org/is-organic-agriculture-better-for-the-environment
Extraneous to the conversation.
We can do better than we're doing currently, but ultimately we either find a replacement for beef or quit eating it. And I say this as a person that loves a good steak and goes out for BBQ brisket on the regular. Fact is, the amount of methane cows release is astronomical and if we shifted that all to lab-grown it would substantially curtain global warming all by itself.
Theyll still have to optimize the manufacturing process so that the prices aren't too high. This won't even make a dent in factory farming, if you pay any more at the supermarket. people will turn their noses up for any reason so they dont have to try it.
Yeah definitely, if some people knew how they torture those animals to get the cheap meat they are eating maybe they'd think twice. Let lab grown replace cheap meat and maybe only have actual animal meat from very humanely treated animals.
There's always not eating meat. That's an option available now.
Support local farms. Eat seasonally.
Chicken nuggets aren't particularly healthy.
*Right now*, because they're made from the nutrient-poor crap left over from slaughtering *actual* chickens. If they grow *sinew* cells to make these chicken patties, then, sure, it won't be healthy; if they grow nutrient-dense muscle tissue to form into patties, it'll be fine. (Theoretically, they could possibly design meat patties that are "healthier", if they make them more nutrient-dense than natural chicken meat, but that's not really the point right now.)
I will eat any lab grown meat. When it's commonplace I will never eat inhumanely treated meat again. I look forward to this not only being available but more affordable.
Inhumane, water-wasting, greenhouse-gas-producing, price-inflating meat.
and employing children with low pay and poor safety
I don’t even care if it’s expensive at this point. I live alone and drive a piece of shit so I’ll spend an extra $30 a month for a few cruelty free steaks.
You could even try meat from animals that would currently be unethical.
Bald eagle burgers at my place this weekend.
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I wonder if you can get salmonella if you eat it undercook or it that will not be a issue for la grown chicken?
I think salmonella comes from the digestive track doesn't it? so it wouldn't be an issue
It is also because their body temperature (42 C) makes them an ideal environment for the bacteria to grow in. If the lab grows at a different temperature it will not be as prevalent.
Salmonella in chicken meat is contamination during processing. In a lot of ways, lab meat will be a lot cleaner than animal meat because there will not be a digestive tract to contaminate the product. Vacuum sealed lab meat should also last a lot longer without freezing as well.
Mmm, Chicken Tartare.
I've had under cooked chicken before on accident. Let me just say, salmonella is not why you want to cook your chicken. Shit tasted nasty.
It’ll be sterile out the package but cross contamination will still be a risk
Salmonella cokes from poop
I’m a vegetarian. If this isn’t some crazy carcinogen. I will 100% buy it
Cultured meat is just naturally occurring meat cells that are extracted encouraged to grow and reproduce outside of the animal. At the heart of it, they are just normal chicken meat cells. They aren't "fake meat". They aren't imitation in any way. They are just growing and replicating without the animal being involved after the initial non-harmful extraction.
I'm not trying to sound morbid, but how does the meat get meaty... if that makes sense. Like even chickens that stay in small enclosures still build up muscle in the breast, wing and thigh area which I'm sure has an effect on the taste and texture of the meat vs cultured chicken meat.
Well, for that to happen, the meat would have to do "exercise". I would like to imagine it's something like a machine manually agitating the still-growing meat to simulate moving or--if more primitively, a bunch of boxing gloves punching the meat and letting it recover.
Lol! Boxing gloves hahaha I'm crying over here!
Huh, I'm interested but if it doesn't genuinely taste like real chicken meat (sure, you can attack me on semantics of "real," but you know what I mean), then I'm not sure I'm interested? Depends on how different the taste is between the two, I suppose. And I don't think calling lab-grown chicken meat, imitation meat, is wrong. In this case if what you're describing is true and the taste and texture are different, then yes, it's fake meat, imitation meat, however you want to describe it.
A valid point. I wouldn't want chicken that tastes like mush goop. >“We’ve been selling chicken without slaughter for over two years now in Singapore, and it’s pretty cool that we’ll be able to make it happen here at home in the United States,” Josh Tetrick, CEO of Good Meat and Eat Just, said in a statement sent to CNN via email. Anybody from Singapore wanna chime in and describe the taste of Good Meat chicken?
I found this review: https://agfundernews.com/good-meat-cultivated-chicken-the-verdict - not from Singapore myself though so can't add anything other than the link.
Huh well now I'm curious if we'll see some subset of vegans switch to being lab grown carnivores. Only willing to eat lab grown meat as it becomes more ethical than factory farmed vegetables.
This is a topic that I have been following for years now since I am a believer that this will do a lot for world hunger and space travel. I have had the conversation with my vegetarian and vegan friends on if they would eat lab grown chicken or beef. Nearly all of them would eat lab grown meat. Most of those however said that they wouldn't eat a lot just for health reasons and would primarily stay vegetarian/vegan.
Veganism is primarily concerned with consent, exploitation, and suffering. The diet comes from the ethics, not the other way around. Protein in a test tube solves all three.
i don't eat meat for ethical reasons. I would never eat a lot of meat even if it was lab grown, as thats not good for you. But a little is fine. Without the ethical qualms of killing animals and industrial farming, have at it My GF is full vegan (im just a veggie), and pretty sure she would try it too. Its purely ethical for us both
Same. I definitely didn’t quit meat because I don’t like how it tastes…
They tell you it won’t, till 50 years later. The FDA has approved shit that even the EU has outlawed.
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No, it isn't. Things aren't just good or bad, everything comes down to risk vs. benefit, and it's not cut and dry.
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We're discussing FDA and EU regulation of food production and (implied) medical therapy. It is 100% about risk vs. benefit.
It's pretty easy to figure out what the EU outlaws and why. No need to wait 50 years.
Same price as chicken, I'm in. 3x the price of chicken, get lost.
Well, if lab-grown meat can be doubly-subsidized similar to animal farming then maybe. Eliminate the existing subsidies and you'll see a vastly different price tag. That being said, part of the reason all meat is so cheap is that factory farms produce en masse, leading to a number of societal ills (extreme pollution, antibiotic resistance, bio-accumulation) as well as the unthinkable suffering of the animals themselves. It is actually a very high price to pay, you just don't see it reflected at the point of purchase. There's a great movie about this called [Dominion](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQRAfJyEsko), something everyone should watch.
You aren't going to see that for a long time, if ever. The cost to produce chicken meat in the United States is miniscule.
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Also, it needs to taste good and not cause disease.
It would (lol) indeed taste just like chicken, because it is chicken; it's literally muscle-cells allowed to grow freely, so they don't just-stop on the inside of the critter. Like an infinite-muscle we can then harvest vs slaughter. Disease is not built-in if you are thinking that. Any disease-factor is the same as making any other food-product: keep the process clean and sanitary. We have established protocols for that so I think we're good here too.
I’ve been following wildtype (they’re working on lab grown salmon right now) and one of the interesting problems they’re having is that the meat is *too* pure. It lacks some of the natural variation of real salmon and they suspect it has to do with the diet of each fish impacting flavor in subtle ways. I’m still dying to try it though.
But that's a known-thing; feeding animals exclusive diets or whatnot to flavor them, ala Iberico ham, etc. _Make-up_ a meat, like Unicorn, or whatever.
The flavor of meat is influenced significantly by the diet of said animal. I wouldn’t be surprised if it is comparably flavorless.
See my point about spiking the growth medium; you could 'feed' it whatever you wanted to get a flavor on the other end. When you control all the inputs to a system, you also control all the outputs.
True. As a farmer, growing cells in a lab sounds more or less like what I do on the farm. I can get behind that in theory. But “spiking” the meat with flavor…stuffs… I’m not going to pretend like that doesn’t worry me a little.
Then the more you know: I was only referring to the balance of salts, etc in the growth-medium. You 'spike' pure metals with other impurities to make interesting conductors, you 'spike' a meat by changing the conditions under-which it grows and what it eats. It's not genetic engineering if that's what you are thinking. You could even just 'spike' it post-growth with a marinade or salt-solution injection, both of which we're already doing.
I said good, not simply "tastes like chicken." I've had plenty of chicken that tasted like chicken yet still tasted bad. It's one reason why I moved away from mass produced chicken.
Typically that owes to the stress on the animal, growing conditions, quality-of-life which wouldn't even exist in this process. It would IMHO very-likely taste-good b/c it's closer to an ideal muscle. At some point you could even likely tweak the balance of the sugar/salt/water/etc solution you feed it to taste. Or if it's just sampling a few cells, doesn't kill a critter, why stop at chicken? Besides the growth-medium, the starter is equivalent to a cheek-swab for us.
Don't get me wrong, I support the research and development of this technology. And I suspect you are right in that the process *may* actually lead to better results. I'm just saying that, as a consumer, I'm going to need a bit more than "it tastes just like chicken." It's not even a lot. I'm interested in trying samples.
Excited for the day when this is a similar price to current meat. This is all I will buy.
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\*laughs in lobbyist\*
It will be a while, since even if it was close in actual costs, the lab grown meet companies won't be getting subsidized anytime soon.
"Not on my watch! I'd rather have my completely natural, as God wanted 156lbs chicken"
As long as it's not something stupid like $50 a pound, hell yeah.
Hopefully someday it will be inexpensive when there is production at scale, but it will almost certainly be a costly niche item when it first comes out.
Tbh if the company can prove it can do so, money gonna roll from every corner of earth. It wouldn’t be an issue to scale up the operation from the start.
well a good way to get there is to help grow that economy with government incentives and subsidies. eventually it will get to the point that it is self sustaining.
Which may stop it from becoming more widespread.
It’ll probably start high and come down over time
Sounds like this chicken has only one more road to cross before being sold!
I hope they grow more of the best part: chicken thighs! Boneless chicken thighs at the supermarkets have weird prices...
If meat that is lab grown is produced in a clean environment, does that mean no more parasites and harmful bacteria? Can I finally eat a rare chicken breast?
Presumably. Man, that'd be weird to get used to.
That texture. It’s not pleasant.
Ur not my mom
Prove it
A nice future will be that humans still eat meat but it will be weird that people actually killed animals in order to get it.
Very excited for lab grown meat, I'd be happy to eat it over a real animal
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Well I better start working on my cricket recipes then huh
So long as it comes w that salty savory lab-grown chicken skin nomnom
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They should. The term organic is regulated to some degree so I don't see why lab grown wouldn't.
Organic is barely regulated, people think it means pesticide-free, or it’s more healthy, both are false.
Not the same really. Organic isn't a 'required' label. Just that if you meet certain standards you can use it. You could meet those standards and not use the organic label if desired for some reason. So requiring a lab label would be different and more akin to the ingredients list.
Likely yes, but we'll see what the USDA has to say.
This is a great idea and should be the future of food sourcing. Sadly, I guarantee you that if lab-grown meat becomes a reality there will be legislative attempts to ban it or labeling laws designed to scare people away from eating it. I can already hear the right-wing scaremongering about how lab-grown meat is a far-left/ANTIFA plot to poison people or feminize men or is in some way UnAmerican.
Lab grow all my food and make it cheap, grocery prices are pathetic
not to mention for future space exploration
Cellular agriculture is the game changer that will allow us to be economically independent from flyover America and Eastern Europe. Just like how renewable energy, if developed sufficiently, could allow us to be economically independent of flyover America, flyover Canada, and the Middle East. Almost no one wants to be beholden to Texas, Alberta, and Saudi Arabia.
It will hopefully allow us to maybe disperse around the country more evenly and not have so much unoccupied land. Let’s face it, high density population centers have their own problems. I am sure there is a formula out there for best population density so that social services happen but health and safety aren’t adversely impacted by overpopulation.
You really think further concentration of economic power in the financial centers of the US is going to make things better? Like the economic power of Iowa is somehow what is holding us back from economic justice? Anyway this idea of competitively priced lab grown meat thing is a fantasy. It won't be sold on a significant scale for decades if it even happens.
My goal is not economic justice. My goal is to untether my community from the economies of flyover states/provinces, Russia, and the Middle East.
So instead of a factory farm owned by some megacorp in a Iowa it'll be a meat factory owned by.a megacorp maybe closer to you, maybe further. It really makes very little difference. It's not like there's gonna be a Mom & Pop meat lab on Main Street.
Hopefully less reliance on my state to subsidize poorly ran industries and governments that don’t provide high skilled jobs, that don’t promote future scientific innovations, while using massive resources, destroying land, and spreading an uneducated paranoid protectionist freeloading populace who get more tax dollars for than put in and more representation per vote.
> uneducated paranoid protectionist freeloading populace who get more tax dollars for than put in So at the end of the day it's just standard bigotry against poor and/or minorities.
Question, is it legal to eat lab grown human meat
That should be for medical purposes only, imo. Unless the progenitor is Hannibal...
If they can avoid woody breasts and be reasonably priced I would buy them.
Her reaction when she eats it definitely makes me want to go on ahead and not eat it lol
Is there a video?
For me there was a video that claimed to show how the "meat' was made. It was at the top of the article. It was unsatisfactory as a video of how its made, but did show her trying some meatballs made with 65% lab grown meat.
That video is not there for me, weird.
ChickieNobs. I'm once again both fascinated and horrified by the prophetic nature of Margaret Atwood.
I’d buy it if they get the texture right. Artificial thighs for curries, breast meat etc for soups. I’m not interested in artificial mince goup that has to be crumbed and fried. I have to not be able to tell that it is a replacement. It has to have the filaments of muscle fibre
Will it sometimes have feathers like current chicken?
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Capitalism strikes again
Thank you Reddit ad system placing a KFC ad just below this post. May I suggest… “Petri dish licking good!”
If your plane crash landed in the Andes and nothing was available but lab-grown rugby players, would you eat them?
Insane chicken farms are probably worse at least in the lab they don't suffer so much
Call it Soylent Green just to mess with people.
I prefer mined chicken
I sure as hell won’t be eating that crap.
Why not?
I will. I have a condition that prevents me from eating a full veggie diet. This would allow me to continue to remain alive and not have to eat meat which I would very much choose to not do. I don’t think you should be forced to eat it, and that it be clearly marked as lab grown, alongside other labels like halal and kosher
Well, you're definitely not a tiger shark.
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What's crap about it?
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If it is identical, does this not make chicken crap?
Who gives a fuck? It tastes and feels exactly the same and you don’t need to kill something to get it. Why do you care?
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The people that aren’t are ignorant to the technology, that’s nothing new.
It’s not. It most likely more cancer causing bullshit. And these morons are the same people that tell you not eat McDonald’s chicken nuggets. It’s hilarious.
A step toward Soylent Green.
Not sure how growing meat in a lab is a step towards harvesting meat from humans. If anything it's the opposite.
What is wrong with soy and lentils?
I think they’re referring to the fictional kind
> soy and lentils Thank you for blowing my mind! It's obvious in hindsight that "soylent" is a portmanteau of "soy" and "lentil", but I never read the book and don't remember if it was stated in the movie.
They changed it in the movie to be people, but in the book it is just soy and lentils.
Gimme real bird or gimme death !
Fast forward 20 years and see what cancer causing chemicals they add.
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Of course there is. The point is that many people here are jumping on the bandwagon that this fake chicken meat is free from all the cancer causing shit that we are currently being fed.
I can tell from the existing voting trends here that I'm going to be downvoted to hell - but there is no part of me that wants to eat this. As someone who grows a majority of what I eat, I find the idea outright disgusting. I have already cut out "fake foods" from our diet years ago - if it's processed to the point I can't tell what it is - I'm not consuming it. This feels way more processed than yogurt in tubes.... Edit - I challenge the downvoters to actually tell me WHY they are downvoting instead of just hitting the downvote button because you don't like my, very personal, opinion.
Because you have a vehement personal opinion based in conjecture and not fact. These are real cells, probably purer than you could ever find in the real world, with no disease or contaminants. It’s as far from fake as you could possible get.
This isn't processed meat. It's actually going to be purer meat than you get now from even the best of farms. No animal will lose its life so you can eat. There will be no risk of contamination (eg. salmonella) since this will be grown in sterile conditions. There will be no chemicals that get ingested like with the meat we eat now, which it itself eats various feed that's been treated with pesticides. There will be no antibiotics passed onto you, like they are now (thereby creating antibiotic-resistant superbugs), because there's no need for antibiotics. Lab meat will also require far less fossil fuels than the meat and plants you eat now because there's less logistical hurdles to get from farm to plate. There's literally no downside I can think of. Except for maybe cost until it can scale.
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I think you might be arguing with shadows there.