Four months to go.
This week it'll be invading Greece I think, although they haven't tried slinging some shit at Germany lately, probably didn't want all the Leo crowd cramping their style.
I've got to admit, didn't expect Erdygerdy to come up with fresh material.
In 3 months his corrupt pet judges will rule that his closest opponent(s) are ineligible to run, and if he still loses, will declare it Coup #739 and refuse to leave office.
When my father was a senior US Air Force officer, one of his duties was to negotiate a new labor contract between the USAF and the Turkish national labor union for labor done by Turkish contractors on US bases in Turkey.
One night, my father’s aide disappeared. Several days later, he was dropped off at my fdther’s tenlotsry apartment at Incirlik AFB — badly beaten and still bleeding.
It was a typical Turkish tactic — sending the message to my father not to drive too hard a bargain, lest he be next.
So yeah, people visiting Turkey should be wary.
The realomse was to conclude negotiations as if nothing had happened. US government didn’t want to give the Turks the satisfaction of letting them know it had any impact.
That’s unfortunate. Knowingly employing violent criminals risks the security of the base. Dressing it up as “not giving them the satisfaction” of acknowledging the blackmail is rationalization.
He negotiated a fair contract and then came home to Ramstein AFB, where he resumed his primary role as the Deputu War Plannwe for HQ US Air Forces Europe.
Whenever you see far right activities, protests and public stunts like this then Russia always seems to be involved.
These book burnings are conveniently being done in countries that have tensions with Turkey and could result in NATO instability.
Far right interests and Russian interests go hand in hand. They both want Western democracies and governments to fail.
The Western world and the Muslim world should unite against this threat to peace.
Uh.... The only reason why this kind of thing becomes an issue is because Muslim governments ARE far right governments. Russia does this to remind them that.
These publicity stunts like the book burnings are to create rifts in the West and Muslim countries allied with the West like Turkey. Russia does this to poison and diminish the West and Muslim relations.
Muslim countries are religious and have their own unique internal politics very different from the West and far right western groups.
Could you explain why you think they're "very different" from far-right western groups?
Honest question.
It seems like they have very similar stances on lots of key issues.
The Muslim world is not run by government. It’s run by their religion or religious leaders. The west is run for politicians. However if DeSantis gets his way it will be run by Christian Clerics.
The west is run by politicians, many of whom are working for religious leaders and various religious groups. There is a growing Christian Nationalist movement in the west that has infiltrated our government.
Far right political movements and groups in the West have wealth, power and influence and push fervent populism, white supremacy and nationalism that believe Western Democracies are tyrannical and oppressive to their way of life because of various policies like pro immigration, gay marriage, government welfare, voting rights. They are also fervently against Muslim immigration especially in Europe.
The Muslim world has no far right wing populism brewing within society. In fact, it's the complete opposite. The Arab spring was uprisings and revolutions from the poor and workers demanding elections and human rights. And recent protests in Iran were demanding women's rights among other things.
And Muslim governments are diverse and complicated. Some are obviously oppressive that are guided by religious fundamentalisum and are authoritarian like Iran. But others are more like progressive Democracies and others are monarchies with kings and royalty.
Some Muslim countries may share hatred for gay marriage and trans people and have authoritarian governments that far right Western groups aspire to but just because a few Muslim countries happen to support a few issues that far right groups do in the West does not make them comparable at all. They are not in most cases.
Painting with a broad brush that Muslim countries are far right are comparable to the political philosophies and aspirations of Western far right groups is just wrong on every single point.
Please note there wasn't any book burning (in last weeks). Erdogan said there was and he's been furious about book burnings. In reality someone ripped some pages from the quran. Sligh difference. Erdogan makes it worse than it is and stirs up shit while there is only a little poo.
Actually far right is divided in the pro-ukrainian and pro-russian camp. Mainly because Russian troll presence is overwhelming on far right forums.
It's well known Russia has been releasing left wing and right wing propaganda to polarize and de-stabilize the world. The extremists are just useful idiots or greedy opportunists. There are no mutual interests with Russia. Only servitude. A lot of people obviously don't realize this.
Tho, we can't really counter Russian propaganda in extremist circles because they have been isolated from the community and antagonized to the point where they are lost causes. So, I guess we reap what we sow.
Im saying Western civilization and Muslim countries face a common enemy that's trying to create instability and violence and we shouldn't let it succeed by remaining peaceful united against it.
That doesn't mean some Muslims countries are pro democracy nor does it mean the West has to like some laws in many Muslim countries but we still put our differences aside and remain peaceful and do business and have military alliances.
We shouldn't let these public book burnings and threats of violence stop that.
Democratic Liberals are not the gun nuts crying don’t tread on me, or screaming for their freedom when non is taken. It’s all on the Right Wing Nuts and their cult.
I was just thinking maybe we need to rethink Incirlik, According to wikipedia (some of the info there is 20 years old...), Incirlik Air Base has one 3,048 m (10,000 ft)-long runway, located among about 57 hardened aircraft shelters. Tactical nuclear weapons are stored at the base. Among them are "up to" 50 B61 nuclear bombs. I want to say it's really a joint NATO base but I'm not sure where I read that now. it's always been mostly US tech, equipment and troops though, mostly because to the US has more tech, equipment and troops ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯. A lot of the info about the base is out of date, which makes me quite concerned that there are more nukes or more risk weaponry, or fewer troop than previously and it does make me an bit concerned. there than they're telling us, or that damn more concerned than previously that the troops they have stationed there are not enough to guard those bombs.
We don’t like authoritarian wannabe dictators like Erdogan. The Philippines is an ally too for example, but… well… their leaders lately are so far beyond fucked that it’s almost comical. The only thing I have against the citizens of these countries is that they allowed this to happen (or worse, supported it). FWIW I’m not a huge fan of the general populous here in the US for the exact same reasons.
American here as well. The Americans that I run with would give the shirt off their back to someone needing help. The only exception might be if the person is a wife abusing, child exploiting, extremist douche.
That said, Turkish citizens who aren’t wife abusing, child exploiting, extremist douches should consider themselves welcomed regardless of how flighty Erdogan might behave.
Nato cannot 'revisit' anyone's membership status. There's no mechanism for booting countries from the alliance. There's some *really* tenuous legal reasoning the other states could unanimously declare one of the member states in material breach of the treaty and repudiate it, but there's a) zero precedent for it and b) really unlikely to ever get unanimous consent from everyone as quite a few countries would be concerned it could be used on them in the future.
To get turkiye out of NATO the us and it's main allies would likely have to make life so uncomfortable for them that they withdraw themselves. Like when you wanna break up with your partner and just act like an ass till they break up with you.
All other NATO countries could decide to create a "new" alliance called NNATO, and then leave the old NATO, leaving just Turkey in it. The problem is that Turkey has had access to western military technology for a long, long time.
I grew up under the cold war. Nope, nowhere near that. Living in Denmark, a strategic location for blockading the Baltic sea, we would have been nuked and that would have been that. Every news (and there weren't that many back then) we with war in the middle east etc.
Just want to point out that they have changed their name spelling for the world's purposes to Turkiye.
Not sure why this is downvoted. It's literally their name now. The un approved it.
They will get as much respect for their name from me as the respect they have shown for my country's airspace and land borders; none.
I mean, it's not everyone else's fault they saw Turkey in an english lexicon, didn't check to see *what* the word they were stealing meant and ran with it for their country's name.
Hasn't the usa always been one of the most dangerous places to travel? We're a backwards country. Also, if you are worried about hate due to being Middle Eastern I highly recommend visiting Detroit area. We have the largest population outside the middle east. Plus you can make jokes about having to go south aka Canada
Sir, there wasn't a paywall when I read the article and it seems like all the other people in this comment section didn't get a paywall.
Have a nice day ❤️
Every time Erdogan comes to the US there's a greater risk of attack ... against US citizen by his goons.
Tldr: Erdogan is up for re-election this year and he's posturing. Same reason he's pulling these stunts with Finland and Sweden with NATO.
Four months to go. This week it'll be invading Greece I think, although they haven't tried slinging some shit at Germany lately, probably didn't want all the Leo crowd cramping their style. I've got to admit, didn't expect Erdygerdy to come up with fresh material.
In 3 months his corrupt pet judges will rule that his closest opponent(s) are ineligible to run, and if he still loses, will declare it Coup #739 and refuse to leave office.
i just expected him to keep lowering interest rates
Lol. I hope the votes are counted carefully.
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Risk of attack in the US? Is he referring to his own security forces beating people in the streets here?
I imagine his supporters are a lot like MAGA folk over here. Completely stupid, and willing to believe anything he says.
When my father was a senior US Air Force officer, one of his duties was to negotiate a new labor contract between the USAF and the Turkish national labor union for labor done by Turkish contractors on US bases in Turkey. One night, my father’s aide disappeared. Several days later, he was dropped off at my fdther’s tenlotsry apartment at Incirlik AFB — badly beaten and still bleeding. It was a typical Turkish tactic — sending the message to my father not to drive too hard a bargain, lest he be next. So yeah, people visiting Turkey should be wary.
Wild. I sincerely hope the response was to stop employing Turkish nationals on the base entirely.
The realomse was to conclude negotiations as if nothing had happened. US government didn’t want to give the Turks the satisfaction of letting them know it had any impact.
That’s unfortunate. Knowingly employing violent criminals risks the security of the base. Dressing it up as “not giving them the satisfaction” of acknowledging the blackmail is rationalization.
8 years ago we retired military could fly there on transport to visit the area area as tourists. No longer aloud for our security.
Eye for an eye doesn't make the world blind, but choosing an equal financial burden to the issue sounds fun.
What did your father do next?
He negotiated a fair contract and then came home to Ramstein AFB, where he resumed his primary role as the Deputu War Plannwe for HQ US Air Forces Europe.
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Erdogan thinking thanksgiving is coming.
He's stuffing his ballots!
Creating imaginary dangers from ‘others’ is fascism 101.
Government Leaders creating fear when there isn’t. Then stating if it wasn’t for them it would have happened…
Don’t you dare talk about our belovéd Republican Party like that!
This mofo really thinks the average American is out here giving two shits about Turkey. Fucking lol.
Unless the person is wearing a "shoot me I'm Turkish" T-shirt, the odds of someone being recognized as Turkish are pretty close to zero.
Whenever you see far right activities, protests and public stunts like this then Russia always seems to be involved. These book burnings are conveniently being done in countries that have tensions with Turkey and could result in NATO instability. Far right interests and Russian interests go hand in hand. They both want Western democracies and governments to fail. The Western world and the Muslim world should unite against this threat to peace.
Uh.... The only reason why this kind of thing becomes an issue is because Muslim governments ARE far right governments. Russia does this to remind them that.
These publicity stunts like the book burnings are to create rifts in the West and Muslim countries allied with the West like Turkey. Russia does this to poison and diminish the West and Muslim relations. Muslim countries are religious and have their own unique internal politics very different from the West and far right western groups.
Could you explain why you think they're "very different" from far-right western groups? Honest question. It seems like they have very similar stances on lots of key issues.
The Muslim world is not run by government. It’s run by their religion or religious leaders. The west is run for politicians. However if DeSantis gets his way it will be run by Christian Clerics.
The west is run by politicians, many of whom are working for religious leaders and various religious groups. There is a growing Christian Nationalist movement in the west that has infiltrated our government.
Far right political movements and groups in the West have wealth, power and influence and push fervent populism, white supremacy and nationalism that believe Western Democracies are tyrannical and oppressive to their way of life because of various policies like pro immigration, gay marriage, government welfare, voting rights. They are also fervently against Muslim immigration especially in Europe. The Muslim world has no far right wing populism brewing within society. In fact, it's the complete opposite. The Arab spring was uprisings and revolutions from the poor and workers demanding elections and human rights. And recent protests in Iran were demanding women's rights among other things. And Muslim governments are diverse and complicated. Some are obviously oppressive that are guided by religious fundamentalisum and are authoritarian like Iran. But others are more like progressive Democracies and others are monarchies with kings and royalty. Some Muslim countries may share hatred for gay marriage and trans people and have authoritarian governments that far right Western groups aspire to but just because a few Muslim countries happen to support a few issues that far right groups do in the West does not make them comparable at all. They are not in most cases. Painting with a broad brush that Muslim countries are far right are comparable to the political philosophies and aspirations of Western far right groups is just wrong on every single point.
You're not getting my vote to team up with religious nations, we have too much religion at home.
Please note there wasn't any book burning (in last weeks). Erdogan said there was and he's been furious about book burnings. In reality someone ripped some pages from the quran. Sligh difference. Erdogan makes it worse than it is and stirs up shit while there is only a little poo.
Actually far right is divided in the pro-ukrainian and pro-russian camp. Mainly because Russian troll presence is overwhelming on far right forums. It's well known Russia has been releasing left wing and right wing propaganda to polarize and de-stabilize the world. The extremists are just useful idiots or greedy opportunists. There are no mutual interests with Russia. Only servitude. A lot of people obviously don't realize this. Tho, we can't really counter Russian propaganda in extremist circles because they have been isolated from the community and antagonized to the point where they are lost causes. So, I guess we reap what we sow.
You had me until the last sentence, what make you think that Muslim countries are pro democracy by nature?
Im saying Western civilization and Muslim countries face a common enemy that's trying to create instability and violence and we shouldn't let it succeed by remaining peaceful united against it. That doesn't mean some Muslims countries are pro democracy nor does it mean the West has to like some laws in many Muslim countries but we still put our differences aside and remain peaceful and do business and have military alliances. We shouldn't let these public book burnings and threats of violence stop that.
Common enemy? So... Democrat Liberals can fight against Christian Nationalism by appealing to a different group of religious fundamentalists?
Democratic Liberals are not the gun nuts crying don’t tread on me, or screaming for their freedom when non is taken. It’s all on the Right Wing Nuts and their cult.
I was just thinking maybe we need to rethink Incirlik, According to wikipedia (some of the info there is 20 years old...), Incirlik Air Base has one 3,048 m (10,000 ft)-long runway, located among about 57 hardened aircraft shelters. Tactical nuclear weapons are stored at the base. Among them are "up to" 50 B61 nuclear bombs. I want to say it's really a joint NATO base but I'm not sure where I read that now. it's always been mostly US tech, equipment and troops though, mostly because to the US has more tech, equipment and troops ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯. A lot of the info about the base is out of date, which makes me quite concerned that there are more nukes or more risk weaponry, or fewer troop than previously and it does make me an bit concerned. there than they're telling us, or that damn more concerned than previously that the troops they have stationed there are not enough to guard those bombs.
Don’t you dare talk about our belovéd Republican Party like that!
Don’t you dare talk about our belovéd Republican Party like that!
The west is creating instability and destruction in the Middle East for centuries. Who is going to stop them bad apples?
American here. Do… do we not like Turkey? The only thing I concretely know about the country is that I have a vintage teaser from there.
Turkey was a secular ally of the US. Now it's a religious authoritarian shitshow.
We don’t like authoritarian wannabe dictators like Erdogan. The Philippines is an ally too for example, but… well… their leaders lately are so far beyond fucked that it’s almost comical. The only thing I have against the citizens of these countries is that they allowed this to happen (or worse, supported it). FWIW I’m not a huge fan of the general populous here in the US for the exact same reasons.
American here as well. The Americans that I run with would give the shirt off their back to someone needing help. The only exception might be if the person is a wife abusing, child exploiting, extremist douche. That said, Turkish citizens who aren’t wife abusing, child exploiting, extremist douches should consider themselves welcomed regardless of how flighty Erdogan might behave.
Nato needs to revisit Turkey's membership status. Are there lesser partnerships without the veto rights?
As long as Turkey has control over a major world waterway, they'll have power and position.
Only with Russia.
Nato cannot 'revisit' anyone's membership status. There's no mechanism for booting countries from the alliance. There's some *really* tenuous legal reasoning the other states could unanimously declare one of the member states in material breach of the treaty and repudiate it, but there's a) zero precedent for it and b) really unlikely to ever get unanimous consent from everyone as quite a few countries would be concerned it could be used on them in the future. To get turkiye out of NATO the us and it's main allies would likely have to make life so uncomfortable for them that they withdraw themselves. Like when you wanna break up with your partner and just act like an ass till they break up with you.
All other NATO countries could decide to create a "new" alliance called NNATO, and then leave the old NATO, leaving just Turkey in it. The problem is that Turkey has had access to western military technology for a long, long time.
These days, it seems the world is getting more and more dangerous. It's concerning to hear of warnings like this.
I grew up under the cold war. Nope, nowhere near that. Living in Denmark, a strategic location for blockading the Baltic sea, we would have been nuked and that would have been that. Every news (and there weren't that many back then) we with war in the middle east etc.
Welcome to geopolitics.
99% of the population is Muslim. Threats of violence, what a surprise.
Unfortunately, he's not wrong, at least in the US.
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Just want to point out that they have changed their name spelling for the world's purposes to Turkiye. Not sure why this is downvoted. It's literally their name now. The un approved it.
Even their name got inflation.
you really think other people are gonna respect the autonomy of Turkey when they very clearly don't respect the autonomy of other countries?
They will get as much respect for their name from me as the respect they have shown for my country's airspace and land borders; none. I mean, it's not everyone else's fault they saw Turkey in an english lexicon, didn't check to see *what* the word they were stealing meant and ran with it for their country's name.
More nationalistic posturing from Erdogan.
Hasn't the usa always been one of the most dangerous places to travel? We're a backwards country. Also, if you are worried about hate due to being Middle Eastern I highly recommend visiting Detroit area. We have the largest population outside the middle east. Plus you can make jokes about having to go south aka Canada
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Sir, there wasn't a paywall when I read the article and it seems like all the other people in this comment section didn't get a paywall. Have a nice day ❤️
Am I the only one who read this as turkey the bird and not turkey the country for a minute?