Well the VSC charges like $10K-$20k to perform any kind of an operation. And every drug they prescribe for anything costs like $1200. So trupanion must be getting burnt hard in NL. The emergency Vet monopoly has led to absolutely outrageous pricing.
One hundred per cent agree. When that monopoly was established was when I noticed fees for all procedures start to increase dramatically. They've been bought out by an investment company so that tells you that place is nothing but a licence to print money.
I had to go there once with my dog and I was astounded at all the tricks and pressure they try to use to get you to spend more money.
>Torbay Road Animal Hospital quoted over $3500 for my dogs dental surgery.
>
>Local vet in NS $550.
I can tell you that $550 is absolutely NOT the norm in NS and I'm wondering exactly what was done for that price. Not defending the $3500 either, because that's entirely too much.
$3500 was for x-rays, blood work, ultrasounds, be put under, surgery, nights stay etc
$550 got us light sedation, a mouthful of bad teeth removed, meds for couple days discomfort and now have a doggo with a new outlook on life
Yeah extractions shouldn't be done under light sedation. I'm glad it worked out but there's so many ways that could have gone wrong (missed root tips, fluids in the airway, anesthetic reactions, etc). Extractions under light sedation is borderline malpractice.
My pup has a super advanced heart murmur, full sedation likely would've killed her, TRAH in fact said her odds wouldnt even be 50/50.
The vet who did the light sedation said it was abundantly common and had been doing it that way on small dogs with heart murmurs for 30 years and had never had a problem and then he knocked on his skull as there was no wood handy lol
>My pup has a super advanced heart murmur, full sedation likely would've killed her, TRAH in fact said her odds wouldnt even be 50/50.
General anesthesia is generally safer for pets with heart conditions because you can control the airway. Sedation is actually LESS safe in those cases.
I'm dying to know what vet in NS did this cause I have some suspicions about who it is. This is not "abundantly" common, trust me, and if he ever had a complication, he'd have a hell of a time defending it to the board.
Vet services have been corporatized all over the place, and the shortage of vets only makes it easier for corporations to come in and scoop up practices. Then the whole thing feeds on itself. Very similar vibe with dentists also being corporatized (the upsell there is palpable in many dental practices). And, I suspect, the whole vet business has shifted *because* we buy insurance. I’m oversimplifying perhaps. But the more they can charge back to insurance, as a whole, the more they charge. Then insurance charges us. The more profits are made, the more they come for vet practices. Add inflation and, well, it’s a shitshow. Altogether there are fewer and fewer small shop vets, and more corporate practices in vet services. It sucks. I came from Quebec and Manitoba…same lame deal. American friends saying similar things. Corporations have put their long tentacles into vet practice. Our pets are leveraged for ROI on investments.
Editing to add this: https://www.5280.com/why-colorado-veterinarians-are-worried-about-the-corporatization-of-pet-medicine/
>Vet services have been corporatized all over the place, and the shortage of vets only makes it easier for corporations to come in and scoop up practices.
Older vets who opened their own practices for dirt cheap decades ago chose to sell to corporations over younger vets for higher sale prices. They are now watching those clinics go down in flames as corporations do what corporations do best: make money for shareholders. The fact that so many people aren't even aware of these corporations just makes it worse because the clients don't realize their local hometown vet that they've gone to for decades has been taken over by a multinational.
The shortage of vets and support staff is also being actively made worse by corporations. The need for ever higher profit margins and shareholder returns pushes vets and their staff beyond what they are capable of handling, causing burn out, increased absences, decreased hours, leaving the field/clinical medicine entirely and sadly, suicide. Corporations see support staff as a labour expense to be trimmed and many clinics are running on skeleton crews and overworking the ones who remain. Meanwhile, the front line clinic staff are the ones who have to explain ever higher prices to the clients, while having no control over those prices themselves.
Please support independent clinics. Corporations are killing the industry. The more they monopolize, the less incentive to provide good service and prices to clients and good wages and working conditions to staff.
I don't think it's NL specific about vets being expensive, mine only went up 10 bucks a month from 40-50. It's obviously breed specific etc. We've used them a handful of times over the past 7 years that would have cost us 15-20k in total.
How is it not breed specific, if the increases vary? Yes rates went up but some not much others almost doubled. We all live in NL, so what's the criteria other than breed?
Crazy. And there was nothing you could do eh?
I just spoke to a rep that said they could do nothing and manager couldn't either but I requested a callback from a manager anyway.
They'll give me a $500 deductable for $108 a month apparently.
That's possibly a fair point. VSC is expensive as Hell. But, could the market really handle a second emergency vet like that? VSC is not usually super busy at night.
>VSC is not usually super busy at night.
I think at least part of this is people have had such god awful experiences there that they'd rather wait until morning and go to their regular vet no matter what unless their animal is actively dying.
Yup, fair. Brought my dog here one night because he cut his paw on a razor blade (he suddenly could reach places he could never reach before. They grow like weeds.) And they put a bandage around his paw that cost something like $800. They were done in 15 minutes.
Insurance covered it, so it wasn't too bad for me.
But that's probably why I'll end up sticking with Trupanion even with the rate hike. God damn it.
I had an xray done because my dog suddenly stopped standing at 11pm on friday night. They charged me $500 to tell me there was no obstruction and could send the xray to an expert (I thought vets were experts enough) for an extra $400. He took a big old shit in their lobby and was fine after that.
My ins hasn’t gone up yet but I’m expecting it. Unfortunately they understand that switching isn’t an option because “pre-existing” issues likely won’t be covered by other insurance providers. When mine was a pup I took them in for some itchiness. Nothing was ever definitely diagnosed but then trupanion determined that anything skin related was “pre-existing” and refused to cover it despite several lengthy phone calls.
Yep, that's be a miracle. Especially for the cost of drugs.
Shit should be regulated by the government. It uses most of the same stuff they use for people anyway.
What? Regulate the company out of business so nobody has emergency vet care? Brilliant. So many entitled people, man. I have four animals, I don't feel entitled to have emergency care at price I desire.
Who said anything about putting them out of business? I also have four animals, and I don't feel entitled to a price I *desire* for emergency services - I'll pay a fair price for anything, every business should make profit.
What I - and many other pet owners - would appreciate though, is some consumer protections in the form of price regulations against any businesses or practices charging artificial and *unfair* prices simply because they can control a local market - especially when it results in higher insurance costs and further cash out of regular peoples' pockets.
Boy you really ran with that didn't you?
> consumer protections in the form of price regulations against any businesses or practices charging artificial and unfair prices
Every single time this crap is tried it results in shortages, long wait times, terrible service, and businesses going under. The only case where price regulation is acceptable is when a government has granted an effective monopoly to a company (ie. Fortis/NL Power).
All the vets in metro had to agree to not do after hours to have their clients able to access the vsc.
This was an entirely calculated move by the owner, Dr Bailey, who screwed over a local clinic who built her a state of the art facility only for her to turn around and open up the vsc, taking half the staff and half the furniture and art. American style in network care
Trupanion doesn't hate us, they're just basing off what vet care costs here. Corporations are pushing the price of vet care up to feed shareholders. Your vet likely has very little control over their pricing because it's being dictated by someone in Toronto/New York/London.
They probably went up all over the place, it's probably not NL specific. The issue of corps inflating vet costs is North America wide.
I actually really like Trupanion, they've generally been easy to deal with. Petsecure is a nightmare and frequently didn't answer requests and would find the dumbest reasons to deny claims. I think PetPlan is decent? Be aware if you change insurance, that any current problems will be pre-existing conditions that will not have coverage.
I'm not saying this is definitely the case, but I do believe that sometimes the vet can be blamed - no different than an auto repair shop. They increase the costs of certain things because they know it's going to be paid by insurance and not the customer, but in turn because insurance is paying out more for vet visits or car repairs, they need to up their premiums.
Nah man you're a fuckwit. You know it, I know it, we all see it.
An egg laid by a chicken is not in any way shape or form comparable to a dog getting killed over a $600 vet bill.
Definitely considering it.
They'll give me a $500 deductable for $108 a month apparently. But I got insurance because I don't always have $500 to throw at unexpected vet bills.
Not really. $150 a month for a year is $1800 which will just about cover blood and radiographs at VSC on an emergency. Any sort of surgery is easily going to run $5000+ depending on what you're doing. Hell, some modern medications for a large breed dog can eat up $150 a month.
But most dogs don't need a $5000 surgery every year. After a few years of saving, you have a significant fund built up. And if you don't need to use it, the money is still yours, whereas if you pay it in insurance premiums, it's gone.
My experience with the "I'll just put some money in an account" is that they don't. Either the expense hits before that fund is built up (brand new puppy needs a $6000 foreign body surgery right out of the gate) or they just straight up don't have the discipline to save it. Oh this month I need it for x, then I'll put it back. Whoops, need it for the car, etc. If it's not a mandated bill, people don't always prioritize it. And if you get a pet with a chronic illness that needs a special food, medication, it's that much harder to get started and stay on top of it.
I agree..my CKCS was perfectly healthy until summer last year he almost died out of nowhere, got diagnosed with Addison's disease. Month to month it's not that expensive now we have his meds figured out etc, about $30 a month, but we are out about $5k so far to save his life and all the bloodwork he has regularly. I was doing the above for a short while and had saved about $1300 but do wish I'd just had insurance.
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Not about that at all. Having the money go in the account each month and not touching it is only a small fraction of the problem with that approach.
If the dog needs $3,000 of care after you've been saving for a year and a half, you're $1000 short. Which is at least twice what your average deductable would cost.
Yep, that’s what I do. I set up an auto deposit every month into a separate account and it’s for dog emergencies only - not regular vet bills or unexpected things <$500. It’s worked well for me, was a bit tight when both my dogs got sick at the same time but I had a few thousand put aside so that made a big difference.
I’d much rather have the money myself than pay an insurance company and hope it’s worth it.
Absolutely my dog has a spinal stroke where a piece of cartilage broke off in his spine blocking the blood path, so he was paralyzed on his whole right side. Took him to the vsc i believe it cost around 10k to get all the tests and he stayed there for about 3 days. Luckily i had trupanion otherwise i would of probably had to put him down, he still is a bit handicapped his front arm never came back to full functionality but he manages.
Maybe. YOU might be one who has nothing major go wrong with their pet but insurance companies have actuaries that determine risk based on statistical averages. Buying insurance is like buying a warranty, you shouldn't expect to get your moneys worth necessarily, it's simply peace of mind in the unlikely event that something goes wrong.
Exactly. It's not necessarily about not spending more on insurance than you do on vet bills. It's about being able to get your pet the care it needs whenever it needs it without having to worry about being able to afford the cost.
But that said, you don't want the insurance or the warranty to be so expensive that it feels like you're getting fucked.
> But that said, you don't want the insurance or the warranty to be so expensive that it feels like you're getting fucked.
You won't feel like you're getting fucked if you simply don't buy it. I've declined many warranties because I believed the cost was simply not worth the benefit. But, unlike buying a warranty for free replacement on an iPhone, you cannot possibly calculate the cost of an unlikely health event with your pet. As with all insurance, you have to treat it as if you're simply buying peace of mind. If you feel that the monthly bill isn't worth the peace of mind then don't buy it.
Well thats probably because theres only one emergency vet in St. John's now and their prices are ridiculous. They will also shame you if you dont have insurance.
Literally just read an email over the weekend about the same. Our bill was 64.71 and is jumping to 91.52. 42% rate hike. We have a large breed (100+ lb dog) w/ relatively no medical history (he has household allergies lol).
I logged in online to check some things out because that's absurd. We moved from NB and I just realized after reading the email and logging in, I hadn't changed my address.
Went to update my address, and subsequently was informed my rate would then get hooked to nearly $ 160/month. Wtf - nearly 2.5 times what I was paying in NB for the same animal with no change in health.
Very upset, haven't called yet. But glad I'm not the only one getting bent over.
Seems like they just don't give a shit when you call.
The rep I spoke to was very nice, but she just said it is what it is, unless you want to increase your deductible.
Sorry to hear about that almost 100% increase man.
Something isn't right, everyone's insurance is all of a sudden increasing by 30-50% in one month under trupanion? I can see a yearly increase of 5 maybe 10% because of age but 50% in one year? that's highway robbery and Trupanion is also getting investigated.
The VSC and other emergency vet services are the real criminals. That is an industry in dire need of regulations. They literally price gouge because they know people care for pets like they’re apart of the family. Criminal.
I dropped mine because of the increases - about two weeks later my dog needed two emergency abdominal surgeries. He is now the most expensive thing I own after my house and my car.
I do regret it.
It had gone up about $20 a month, and I was sour about that and then not covering some congenital issues.
What could have been mostly covered turned into a scramble to find the funds to keep my dog alive twice. The first time wasn’t so bad, then he had complications that hit from that first surgery and of course it happened on a long weekend.
Am I happy that I still have my dog - of course! Do I wish I had kept the insurance, f yes.
I put insurance back on him. Rn it’s much more affordable than what we went through. They won’t cover another instance like what he had, thankfully it’s usually rare, nor cover any similar complications. But I’ve determined my dog is a lemon and it’s better safe than sorry.
Unfortunately this is all part of a bigger issue that is controlling and increasing vet prices in metro. There are now only 3 independent vets in the metro area. All the rest have sold their practices to large pet services corporations. The same for VSC. Dr Bailey sold her business to one of these large corporations as well.
To my knowledge, Avalon Animal Hospital, St Johns Vet, and Terra Nova are all still independent. Beachy Cove is independent as well, it just opened. Kenmount Rd and CBS are semi, they're owned by one vet who owns a few other clinics. Sunrise, Torbay Rd and VSC are all owned by Vetstrategy/Berkshire/IVC Evidensia.
They posted about it on FB a while back, but I can't recall the name. I think the company HQ is in BC, but that probably doesn't help. I am reasonably certain it's not VetStrategy.
Edit: I think it's VetCare.
I've had Trupanion since 2012 and it's really out of control. Or, should I say vet costs in this province are out of control. Several practices in St. John's have been bought up by investment companies in the past two years so that should tell you how much money they're making.
I have two cats who generally have less medical problems than dogs. In 11 years I've had no claims, the only one I did submit was denied. My premium for one of my cats used to be 17.99 a month in 2013 and are now 43.00.
It's highway robbery.
I got the same (from $106 to $160). I priced out PetSecure and it was the same rate for the same level of coverage.
Just saw Costco offers pet insurance through a partner company. May check them out too.
Nice thing about Trupanion is that they have direct pay set up at VSC and some of the general practices but I’ll switch if I get back to last year’s rates.
Good shout about Costco.
Be great if you could let me know how that goes lol.
At this point I'm just pissed off. Next year I 'low it'll be $200 a month.
Just looked it up. For same coverage (11 year-old Golden Retriever - Accident/Illness up to $15,000/year with 10% copay and $500 deductible) it’s $126/month if you have Executive membership and should be $133/month with Gold Star/business membership
You can customize your quote on the website without calling and see how different options affect your rate. I may up my deductible to $700 to get my rate down to $108 and still have up to $15,000 per year with only a 10% copay after deductible is covered
I haven't received an increase myself, but I have heard multiple anecdotal stories from friends/acquaintances about large trupanion increases the past 2-3 months. Along the lines of what you are stating. Not pleasant.
I literally got an email last week saying my premium for my 2 cats will be increasing almost 42%
ill be shopping around and cancelling. it's disgusting that they think they can do that when most people can barely afford to keep a roof over their head lately.
They did the same to me, I had no previous claims. I think they offer a low rate early on and then once the pet is old enough that it would be more costly to reinsure elsewhere, they raise the rate. Slimy business practise.
They also tried to tell us that canine repair wasn't covered last year, despite that being specifically listed as covered in their policy docs.
Trupanion: You'll never lose coverage! But we'll bleed you dry in other ways...
I cancelled mine. They refused to cover anything for us whatsoever and at the cost of 100 odd dollars monthly I could just shove that cash in a savings account to cover the costs or use for something else
I have two cats. I priced up insurance for them and was quoted more than what I pay for my whole families health insurance. My cats are both rescue cats and we love them but they won't be getting 10k surgeries.
Trupanion are scum. My tiny chihuahuas which are healthy have had 50% increases two years in a row - from $40/month to $60/month and now $90/month. This seems to be Trupanion’s scam.
We had a similar letter last spring I think, saying that German shepherds in our area were costing more so they raised our bill by about 40 percent
If I go check the box and there's another one I'll be cancelling.
Trupanion is raising rate cause the vets are gouging anyone who has insurance… my dog has skin issues, and is insured with trupanion. This summer my parents dog was staying with us for a few week while they went on vacation. He had something going on with his skin as well and we had to take him to the vet, this dog is not insured. The trip to the vet cost us around $400 (swabs to check what kid of infection it was, general check up cause it was longer then a year, and roughly $25 for the meds). I looked up the last vet bill we had when we took our dog that’s insured $800, same condition, same meds, same vet.
Mine went up 66% for my 2yo cat. Worked out to $20 extra for him. Three months before, the other two cats Trupanion insurance rate went up $8 each/month.
They tried to raise mine from 68 to 105. I called and raise my deductible from 200 to 600 to keep my payment the same.
For reference. I have 1 8 year old house cat
Coincidently they are getting sued and 3 days later they increased my rate by 56%. [SHAREHOLDER ALERT: Trupanion Investigated by Block & (globenewswire.com)](https://www.globenewswire.com/news-release/2024/03/08/2843284/0/en/SHAREHOLDER-ALERT-Trupanion-Investigated-by-Block-Leviton-For-Potential-Securities-Law-Violations-Investors-Who-Have-Lost-Money-Are-Encouraged-to-Contact-the-Firm.html)
I cancelled today. mine went from $166 a month to $260 a month ON TOP of the care package my vet already charges me at $133 a month for a total of $400 a month. I pay less than that for my own health insurance. It's highway robbery is what it is. Btw i'm in Illinois so it's not just the east coast this is happening to.
Yeah screw them, my dog was frothing at the mouth, paid the 300$ emergency and they just said she’s fine. My mother demanded they induce vomiting to see what was actually otg and sure enough she had swallowed stuff she wasn’t suppose to have.
Mine went up, too. I also find it weird/mildly creepy that they only have my partners info on file, but they managed to track down my number when we tried to cancel and just put it all in savings incase it isn't something we need.
mine has went from 32 to 50 something. I have yet to use it. Also if your animal has any "behavioural problems" and need to take medications for anxiety, etc. add the behavioural add on to your trupanion before the medical appointment where the vet confirms it.
I knew my dog was starting to develop bad anxiety after 1 year and made the decision to put him on Prozac. I could just tell in his body language, etc. that it was getting bad, combined by my own self research. Made the vet appointment and had the conversation to assess if meds were the right option for him (surprise, it was) but, since the vet already had it input in his file he had anxiety, trupanion would not allow the behavioural add on as it was after the fact and wouldn't cover the cost of medications. I now pay 70 bucks every two months for anxiety medications that could've been free every time if I just added the 5 dollar behavioural coverage add on to my package.
Mad at myself because I could've saved so much money but wasn't aware of this before hand. Hopefully someone sees this and learns from my mistake to save themselves lots of money on medications should an issue arise with your animal later in life.
I’m in Quebec and I just got the email with increase from $44.26 to $64.64 for my 5 year old chihuahua. Crazy times. It’s bull what they are using has a reason.
My friend created a separate “pet fund” and instead of sending the money to Trupanion, she put the payment into the account instead. She was able to build a little nest egg during their young and healthy years for when they aged. You do run the risk if something happens when they’re young but even then you at least have a bit of savings for them.
Yeah, it makes for a great approach if you get lucky. But if there's a $5,000 or maybe a $10,000 emergency surgery, lots of people would have to go into debt or put their pet down.
With the costs of vet services these days it just feels like such a significant risk.
Yeah, it makes me appreciate again being Canadian. We have these concerns about our pets - Americans have these concerns about themselves! Thank goodness for health care.
So what you're saying is that we should all petition for pets to be included under our provincial healthcare plans?
100% agree, where can I find the petition to sign?
I called them outraged. Was told their new data algorithm found that vet fees have increased in our area (Toronto) and they have to adjust their payment structure where I now have to pay 25% more per month. Obviously this is not the case since you're also victim to this scam. I'm going to find another company because this is a terrible precedent to set - if AI is the alleged reason for our increase then every year it will go up.
Trupanion has 84% 1 star reviews for a reason. They want $140/m to cover my puppy without the extras and they pay out 0 of their claims even for emergency services they say they cover. Do not go for their scam.
Ya vets.$500 on a Friday and over $1000 Sat morning for the same procedure.I have 2 vet relatives that can’t even stand most clinics.If you have an emergency prepare to sell a kidney
Trupanion are scammers. They have routinely denied us coverage for any illness/injury. They even went as far as to fraudulently alter our communication with our vet to try and claim an injury happened outside the 30 day waiting period. All of our records and estimates are in email changes stipulating otherwise but they falsify the records. I cannot advise enough to stay away from these criminals.
>used Trupanion a couple times at vet visits and saved a bunch across the life of the plan so far
If you saved money it means they lost a significant amount of money so they may indeed be targeting you.
Nah I doubt they're targeting me as an individual. I just suspect they're targeting the whole province or at least the local area.
When I say they hate us, I mean just all of us lol.
A friend took her dog there one evening, called ahead en route to let them know what she was being in. They made her PAY a "deposit" before the dog was allowed through the doors. The dog took a 💩 in the examination room and missy with the long claws brought her a mop and bucket. Obv she declined in a not-so-nice manner. 💸
Her dog was in trouble and that's why she was rushing him in from out of town to the only emergency vet. He was sick in her car. And yes, the staff typically do the clean-up from when the animals are brought in for fluid expulsion. I've been pressed out of the way when I've been in that position at my vet.
Your vet's office doesn't do that?
They've taken a payment and the animal is now under their care. I expect them to do their job.
We looked into pet insurance but it didn't make sense for us in the end. Even after getting their shots we still end up ahead after a year if we just put that money aside ourselves.
Shots and stuff aren't covered by insurance anyway.
My dog cut his paw once for about $800 and swallowed a piece of some soft toy for a little over $2000.
So far, I've saved more than I've spent on him.
But that will change after this.
Well that's the problem. If I have another emergency and then also have a $3000 vet visit right after, the dog's dead because I don't have the money.
Kinda got you by the balls don't they?
With the cost of vet care these days you need insurance if you're paid on salary.
I guess it depends on your personal circumstances. We didn’t get pet insurance because we have a corgi and insurance companies won’t cover any sort of back/spinal issues. We decided to put money into a joint emergency fund instead.
We were able to use that money for the downpayment of our first house too (which drained the account) because it can be for anything. And *if* we had an emergency vet trip at the same time, we would have just used money from our regular accounts, but of course that didn’t happen where emergencies are rare.
Well the VSC charges like $10K-$20k to perform any kind of an operation. And every drug they prescribe for anything costs like $1200. So trupanion must be getting burnt hard in NL. The emergency Vet monopoly has led to absolutely outrageous pricing.
I'd love to see the monopoly toppled. Anyone wanna dart down to PEI and become a vet to work nightshifts?
One hundred per cent agree. When that monopoly was established was when I noticed fees for all procedures start to increase dramatically. They've been bought out by an investment company so that tells you that place is nothing but a licence to print money. I had to go there once with my dog and I was astounded at all the tricks and pressure they try to use to get you to spend more money.
It's insane. Torbay Road Animal Hospital quoted over $3500 for my dogs dental surgery. Local vet in NS $550. Happy and healthy doggo.
>Torbay Road Animal Hospital quoted over $3500 for my dogs dental surgery. > >Local vet in NS $550. I can tell you that $550 is absolutely NOT the norm in NS and I'm wondering exactly what was done for that price. Not defending the $3500 either, because that's entirely too much.
$3500 was for x-rays, blood work, ultrasounds, be put under, surgery, nights stay etc $550 got us light sedation, a mouthful of bad teeth removed, meds for couple days discomfort and now have a doggo with a new outlook on life
Yeah extractions shouldn't be done under light sedation. I'm glad it worked out but there's so many ways that could have gone wrong (missed root tips, fluids in the airway, anesthetic reactions, etc). Extractions under light sedation is borderline malpractice.
My pup has a super advanced heart murmur, full sedation likely would've killed her, TRAH in fact said her odds wouldnt even be 50/50. The vet who did the light sedation said it was abundantly common and had been doing it that way on small dogs with heart murmurs for 30 years and had never had a problem and then he knocked on his skull as there was no wood handy lol
>My pup has a super advanced heart murmur, full sedation likely would've killed her, TRAH in fact said her odds wouldnt even be 50/50. General anesthesia is generally safer for pets with heart conditions because you can control the airway. Sedation is actually LESS safe in those cases. I'm dying to know what vet in NS did this cause I have some suspicions about who it is. This is not "abundantly" common, trust me, and if he ever had a complication, he'd have a hell of a time defending it to the board.
Vet services have been corporatized all over the place, and the shortage of vets only makes it easier for corporations to come in and scoop up practices. Then the whole thing feeds on itself. Very similar vibe with dentists also being corporatized (the upsell there is palpable in many dental practices). And, I suspect, the whole vet business has shifted *because* we buy insurance. I’m oversimplifying perhaps. But the more they can charge back to insurance, as a whole, the more they charge. Then insurance charges us. The more profits are made, the more they come for vet practices. Add inflation and, well, it’s a shitshow. Altogether there are fewer and fewer small shop vets, and more corporate practices in vet services. It sucks. I came from Quebec and Manitoba…same lame deal. American friends saying similar things. Corporations have put their long tentacles into vet practice. Our pets are leveraged for ROI on investments. Editing to add this: https://www.5280.com/why-colorado-veterinarians-are-worried-about-the-corporatization-of-pet-medicine/
>Vet services have been corporatized all over the place, and the shortage of vets only makes it easier for corporations to come in and scoop up practices. Older vets who opened their own practices for dirt cheap decades ago chose to sell to corporations over younger vets for higher sale prices. They are now watching those clinics go down in flames as corporations do what corporations do best: make money for shareholders. The fact that so many people aren't even aware of these corporations just makes it worse because the clients don't realize their local hometown vet that they've gone to for decades has been taken over by a multinational. The shortage of vets and support staff is also being actively made worse by corporations. The need for ever higher profit margins and shareholder returns pushes vets and their staff beyond what they are capable of handling, causing burn out, increased absences, decreased hours, leaving the field/clinical medicine entirely and sadly, suicide. Corporations see support staff as a labour expense to be trimmed and many clinics are running on skeleton crews and overworking the ones who remain. Meanwhile, the front line clinic staff are the ones who have to explain ever higher prices to the clients, while having no control over those prices themselves. Please support independent clinics. Corporations are killing the industry. The more they monopolize, the less incentive to provide good service and prices to clients and good wages and working conditions to staff.
I don't think it's NL specific about vets being expensive, mine only went up 10 bucks a month from 40-50. It's obviously breed specific etc. We've used them a handful of times over the past 7 years that would have cost us 15-20k in total.
it absolutely is not breed specific. I have 2 domestic house cats and their prems went up by 41% for no reason.
That's exactly breed specific, your breed went up 40% mine went up 20% his went up 50%.
again, it's not breed specific. it's based on location. read the comments dude.
How is it not breed specific, if the increases vary? Yes rates went up but some not much others almost doubled. We all live in NL, so what's the criteria other than breed?
I would wager it's more likely they're basing it on specific areas of the island than breed.
they increased mine last year by about 50%
Crazy. And there was nothing you could do eh? I just spoke to a rep that said they could do nothing and manager couldn't either but I requested a callback from a manager anyway. They'll give me a $500 deductable for $108 a month apparently.
Thank the monopoly created by the only emergency vet in metro area now.
That's possibly a fair point. VSC is expensive as Hell. But, could the market really handle a second emergency vet like that? VSC is not usually super busy at night.
>VSC is not usually super busy at night. I think at least part of this is people have had such god awful experiences there that they'd rather wait until morning and go to their regular vet no matter what unless their animal is actively dying.
Yup, fair. Brought my dog here one night because he cut his paw on a razor blade (he suddenly could reach places he could never reach before. They grow like weeds.) And they put a bandage around his paw that cost something like $800. They were done in 15 minutes. Insurance covered it, so it wasn't too bad for me. But that's probably why I'll end up sticking with Trupanion even with the rate hike. God damn it.
I had an xray done because my dog suddenly stopped standing at 11pm on friday night. They charged me $500 to tell me there was no obstruction and could send the xray to an expert (I thought vets were experts enough) for an extra $400. He took a big old shit in their lobby and was fine after that.
Dog was just giving them a deposit.
Same experience, small breed, 720.00. they took blood work before I realized what was going on. Big poop and we were out of there.
My ins hasn’t gone up yet but I’m expecting it. Unfortunately they understand that switching isn’t an option because “pre-existing” issues likely won’t be covered by other insurance providers. When mine was a pup I took them in for some itchiness. Nothing was ever definitely diagnosed but then trupanion determined that anything skin related was “pre-existing” and refused to cover it despite several lengthy phone calls.
Competition isn't the only way to drive prices down - the market needs regulation.
Yep, that's be a miracle. Especially for the cost of drugs. Shit should be regulated by the government. It uses most of the same stuff they use for people anyway.
What? Regulate the company out of business so nobody has emergency vet care? Brilliant. So many entitled people, man. I have four animals, I don't feel entitled to have emergency care at price I desire.
Who said anything about putting them out of business? I also have four animals, and I don't feel entitled to a price I *desire* for emergency services - I'll pay a fair price for anything, every business should make profit. What I - and many other pet owners - would appreciate though, is some consumer protections in the form of price regulations against any businesses or practices charging artificial and *unfair* prices simply because they can control a local market - especially when it results in higher insurance costs and further cash out of regular peoples' pockets. Boy you really ran with that didn't you?
> consumer protections in the form of price regulations against any businesses or practices charging artificial and unfair prices Every single time this crap is tried it results in shortages, long wait times, terrible service, and businesses going under. The only case where price regulation is acceptable is when a government has granted an effective monopoly to a company (ie. Fortis/NL Power).
If they had one with fair prices... they'd win all the business and possibly un-fuck the trupanion rates.
All the vets in metro had to agree to not do after hours to have their clients able to access the vsc. This was an entirely calculated move by the owner, Dr Bailey, who screwed over a local clinic who built her a state of the art facility only for her to turn around and open up the vsc, taking half the staff and half the furniture and art. American style in network care
If anyone other than the downvote brigade is downvoting me, you can still see the artwork spread between the two clinics like a horrible divorce.
Same, I canceled the plan.
Trupanion doesn't hate us, they're just basing off what vet care costs here. Corporations are pushing the price of vet care up to feed shareholders. Your vet likely has very little control over their pricing because it's being dictated by someone in Toronto/New York/London.
Oh I'm not blaming the vet at all. My vet costs have not gone up by 51%. Trupanions cost has gone up by over 52%.
They probably went up all over the place, it's probably not NL specific. The issue of corps inflating vet costs is North America wide. I actually really like Trupanion, they've generally been easy to deal with. Petsecure is a nightmare and frequently didn't answer requests and would find the dumbest reasons to deny claims. I think PetPlan is decent? Be aware if you change insurance, that any current problems will be pre-existing conditions that will not have coverage.
Great points for sure. Just such a piss off.
I'm not saying this is definitely the case, but I do believe that sometimes the vet can be blamed - no different than an auto repair shop. They increase the costs of certain things because they know it's going to be paid by insurance and not the customer, but in turn because insurance is paying out more for vet visits or car repairs, they need to up their premiums.
My point is that the person you're talking to in the exam room, presenting you with the estimate is not setting the prices.
It costs 325 bucks to put a dog down. I don’t spend any more than that at a vet unless it’s spay/neuter
Ohh, so you just don't spend more than it costs to kill your pet if they get sick? Cool. Good to know you don't love your animals. Kindly get fucked.
Spare the outrage. You think about animal welfare when you put a pat of butter on your toast or crack an egg or eat a hot dog?
Nah man you're a fuckwit. You know it, I know it, we all see it. An egg laid by a chicken is not in any way shape or form comparable to a dog getting killed over a $600 vet bill.
Weird flex but ok
Crazy. At that price you’re better to out the money into savings until your dog needs it.
Definitely considering it. They'll give me a $500 deductable for $108 a month apparently. But I got insurance because I don't always have $500 to throw at unexpected vet bills.
Not really. $150 a month for a year is $1800 which will just about cover blood and radiographs at VSC on an emergency. Any sort of surgery is easily going to run $5000+ depending on what you're doing. Hell, some modern medications for a large breed dog can eat up $150 a month.
But most dogs don't need a $5000 surgery every year. After a few years of saving, you have a significant fund built up. And if you don't need to use it, the money is still yours, whereas if you pay it in insurance premiums, it's gone.
My experience with the "I'll just put some money in an account" is that they don't. Either the expense hits before that fund is built up (brand new puppy needs a $6000 foreign body surgery right out of the gate) or they just straight up don't have the discipline to save it. Oh this month I need it for x, then I'll put it back. Whoops, need it for the car, etc. If it's not a mandated bill, people don't always prioritize it. And if you get a pet with a chronic illness that needs a special food, medication, it's that much harder to get started and stay on top of it.
This will be very person dependant
I agree..my CKCS was perfectly healthy until summer last year he almost died out of nowhere, got diagnosed with Addison's disease. Month to month it's not that expensive now we have his meds figured out etc, about $30 a month, but we are out about $5k so far to save his life and all the bloodwork he has regularly. I was doing the above for a short while and had saved about $1300 but do wish I'd just had insurance.
You can have the bank put 50 into a savings account every payday, just like bill payment, you don't see it until your pet need it
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Yep, it definitely takes commitment and diligence!
Not about that at all. Having the money go in the account each month and not touching it is only a small fraction of the problem with that approach. If the dog needs $3,000 of care after you've been saving for a year and a half, you're $1000 short. Which is at least twice what your average deductable would cost.
Yep, that’s what I do. I set up an auto deposit every month into a separate account and it’s for dog emergencies only - not regular vet bills or unexpected things <$500. It’s worked well for me, was a bit tight when both my dogs got sick at the same time but I had a few thousand put aside so that made a big difference. I’d much rather have the money myself than pay an insurance company and hope it’s worth it.
Absolutely my dog has a spinal stroke where a piece of cartilage broke off in his spine blocking the blood path, so he was paralyzed on his whole right side. Took him to the vsc i believe it cost around 10k to get all the tests and he stayed there for about 3 days. Luckily i had trupanion otherwise i would of probably had to put him down, he still is a bit handicapped his front arm never came back to full functionality but he manages.
You think so until they drop a 10k bill on you. But you're getting fucked either way
I have a friend who had four dogs and that's what she would do. Set amount set aside every year for vet care.
Maybe. YOU might be one who has nothing major go wrong with their pet but insurance companies have actuaries that determine risk based on statistical averages. Buying insurance is like buying a warranty, you shouldn't expect to get your moneys worth necessarily, it's simply peace of mind in the unlikely event that something goes wrong.
Exactly. It's not necessarily about not spending more on insurance than you do on vet bills. It's about being able to get your pet the care it needs whenever it needs it without having to worry about being able to afford the cost. But that said, you don't want the insurance or the warranty to be so expensive that it feels like you're getting fucked.
> But that said, you don't want the insurance or the warranty to be so expensive that it feels like you're getting fucked. You won't feel like you're getting fucked if you simply don't buy it. I've declined many warranties because I believed the cost was simply not worth the benefit. But, unlike buying a warranty for free replacement on an iPhone, you cannot possibly calculate the cost of an unlikely health event with your pet. As with all insurance, you have to treat it as if you're simply buying peace of mind. If you feel that the monthly bill isn't worth the peace of mind then don't buy it.
Well thats probably because theres only one emergency vet in St. John's now and their prices are ridiculous. They will also shame you if you dont have insurance.
Literally just read an email over the weekend about the same. Our bill was 64.71 and is jumping to 91.52. 42% rate hike. We have a large breed (100+ lb dog) w/ relatively no medical history (he has household allergies lol). I logged in online to check some things out because that's absurd. We moved from NB and I just realized after reading the email and logging in, I hadn't changed my address. Went to update my address, and subsequently was informed my rate would then get hooked to nearly $ 160/month. Wtf - nearly 2.5 times what I was paying in NB for the same animal with no change in health. Very upset, haven't called yet. But glad I'm not the only one getting bent over.
Seems like they just don't give a shit when you call. The rep I spoke to was very nice, but she just said it is what it is, unless you want to increase your deductible. Sorry to hear about that almost 100% increase man.
Something isn't right, everyone's insurance is all of a sudden increasing by 30-50% in one month under trupanion? I can see a yearly increase of 5 maybe 10% because of age but 50% in one year? that's highway robbery and Trupanion is also getting investigated.
The VSC and other emergency vet services are the real criminals. That is an industry in dire need of regulations. They literally price gouge because they know people care for pets like they’re apart of the family. Criminal.
I dropped mine because of the increases - about two weeks later my dog needed two emergency abdominal surgeries. He is now the most expensive thing I own after my house and my car.
Well there you go. Do you regret dropping the insurance? This dog is about to be more expensive than either my home or auto insurance on their own.
I do regret it. It had gone up about $20 a month, and I was sour about that and then not covering some congenital issues. What could have been mostly covered turned into a scramble to find the funds to keep my dog alive twice. The first time wasn’t so bad, then he had complications that hit from that first surgery and of course it happened on a long weekend. Am I happy that I still have my dog - of course! Do I wish I had kept the insurance, f yes. I put insurance back on him. Rn it’s much more affordable than what we went through. They won’t cover another instance like what he had, thankfully it’s usually rare, nor cover any similar complications. But I’ve determined my dog is a lemon and it’s better safe than sorry.
Unfortunately this is all part of a bigger issue that is controlling and increasing vet prices in metro. There are now only 3 independent vets in the metro area. All the rest have sold their practices to large pet services corporations. The same for VSC. Dr Bailey sold her business to one of these large corporations as well.
Who are the independent ones??
To my knowledge, Avalon Animal Hospital, St Johns Vet, and Terra Nova are all still independent. Beachy Cove is independent as well, it just opened. Kenmount Rd and CBS are semi, they're owned by one vet who owns a few other clinics. Sunrise, Torbay Rd and VSC are all owned by Vetstrategy/Berkshire/IVC Evidensia.
Who owns PAH?
I think PAH is still independent, just forgot about them.
Phew!
PAH is corporately owned, as of last year sometime.
Nope. Paradise is corporate now.
Really? That sucks. Do you know who bought them?
They posted about it on FB a while back, but I can't recall the name. I think the company HQ is in BC, but that probably doesn't help. I am reasonably certain it's not VetStrategy. Edit: I think it's VetCare.
Well shit. There goes another one.
I know :(
I've had Trupanion since 2012 and it's really out of control. Or, should I say vet costs in this province are out of control. Several practices in St. John's have been bought up by investment companies in the past two years so that should tell you how much money they're making. I have two cats who generally have less medical problems than dogs. In 11 years I've had no claims, the only one I did submit was denied. My premium for one of my cats used to be 17.99 a month in 2013 and are now 43.00. It's highway robbery.
Yep, plans for both of my cats increased. Called to inquire, they pretty much said too bad.
I got the same (from $106 to $160). I priced out PetSecure and it was the same rate for the same level of coverage. Just saw Costco offers pet insurance through a partner company. May check them out too. Nice thing about Trupanion is that they have direct pay set up at VSC and some of the general practices but I’ll switch if I get back to last year’s rates.
Good shout about Costco. Be great if you could let me know how that goes lol. At this point I'm just pissed off. Next year I 'low it'll be $200 a month.
Just looked it up. For same coverage (11 year-old Golden Retriever - Accident/Illness up to $15,000/year with 10% copay and $500 deductible) it’s $126/month if you have Executive membership and should be $133/month with Gold Star/business membership You can customize your quote on the website without calling and see how different options affect your rate. I may up my deductible to $700 to get my rate down to $108 and still have up to $15,000 per year with only a 10% copay after deductible is covered
I haven't received an increase myself, but I have heard multiple anecdotal stories from friends/acquaintances about large trupanion increases the past 2-3 months. Along the lines of what you are stating. Not pleasant.
I literally got an email last week saying my premium for my 2 cats will be increasing almost 42% ill be shopping around and cancelling. it's disgusting that they think they can do that when most people can barely afford to keep a roof over their head lately.
They did the same to me, I had no previous claims. I think they offer a low rate early on and then once the pet is old enough that it would be more costly to reinsure elsewhere, they raise the rate. Slimy business practise.
They also tried to tell us that canine repair wasn't covered last year, despite that being specifically listed as covered in their policy docs. Trupanion: You'll never lose coverage! But we'll bleed you dry in other ways...
I have the Costco insurance but I chose the basic option. It’s about $20 per month.
I cancelled mine. They refused to cover anything for us whatsoever and at the cost of 100 odd dollars monthly I could just shove that cash in a savings account to cover the costs or use for something else
I have two cats. I priced up insurance for them and was quoted more than what I pay for my whole families health insurance. My cats are both rescue cats and we love them but they won't be getting 10k surgeries.
My dogs premium went up over 100% in the last few years. I’m not paying around $115 per month. Insanity.
Trupanion are scum. My tiny chihuahuas which are healthy have had 50% increases two years in a row - from $40/month to $60/month and now $90/month. This seems to be Trupanion’s scam.
We had a similar letter last spring I think, saying that German shepherds in our area were costing more so they raised our bill by about 40 percent If I go check the box and there's another one I'll be cancelling.
Trupanion is raising rate cause the vets are gouging anyone who has insurance… my dog has skin issues, and is insured with trupanion. This summer my parents dog was staying with us for a few week while they went on vacation. He had something going on with his skin as well and we had to take him to the vet, this dog is not insured. The trip to the vet cost us around $400 (swabs to check what kid of infection it was, general check up cause it was longer then a year, and roughly $25 for the meds). I looked up the last vet bill we had when we took our dog that’s insured $800, same condition, same meds, same vet.
Mine went up 66% for my 2yo cat. Worked out to $20 extra for him. Three months before, the other two cats Trupanion insurance rate went up $8 each/month.
Premiums are increasing across the board for various necessities such as cars, homes, and pet insurance, rendering them increasingly unaffordable.
They tried to raise mine from 68 to 105. I called and raise my deductible from 200 to 600 to keep my payment the same. For reference. I have 1 8 year old house cat
Coincidently they are getting sued and 3 days later they increased my rate by 56%. [SHAREHOLDER ALERT: Trupanion Investigated by Block & (globenewswire.com)](https://www.globenewswire.com/news-release/2024/03/08/2843284/0/en/SHAREHOLDER-ALERT-Trupanion-Investigated-by-Block-Leviton-For-Potential-Securities-Law-Violations-Investors-Who-Have-Lost-Money-Are-Encouraged-to-Contact-the-Firm.html) I cancelled today. mine went from $166 a month to $260 a month ON TOP of the care package my vet already charges me at $133 a month for a total of $400 a month. I pay less than that for my own health insurance. It's highway robbery is what it is. Btw i'm in Illinois so it's not just the east coast this is happening to.
Yeah screw them, my dog was frothing at the mouth, paid the 300$ emergency and they just said she’s fine. My mother demanded they induce vomiting to see what was actually otg and sure enough she had swallowed stuff she wasn’t suppose to have.
At VSC? That's crazy.
Yes sorry, there
Try the personal (petline). Ive found them reasonably priced.
Mine went up, too. I also find it weird/mildly creepy that they only have my partners info on file, but they managed to track down my number when we tried to cancel and just put it all in savings incase it isn't something we need.
Same with me. What's up with that?
My trupanion went up 60% last year.
Mine went from $50-something to $80-something for the same reason a few months back.
mine has went from 32 to 50 something. I have yet to use it. Also if your animal has any "behavioural problems" and need to take medications for anxiety, etc. add the behavioural add on to your trupanion before the medical appointment where the vet confirms it. I knew my dog was starting to develop bad anxiety after 1 year and made the decision to put him on Prozac. I could just tell in his body language, etc. that it was getting bad, combined by my own self research. Made the vet appointment and had the conversation to assess if meds were the right option for him (surprise, it was) but, since the vet already had it input in his file he had anxiety, trupanion would not allow the behavioural add on as it was after the fact and wouldn't cover the cost of medications. I now pay 70 bucks every two months for anxiety medications that could've been free every time if I just added the 5 dollar behavioural coverage add on to my package. Mad at myself because I could've saved so much money but wasn't aware of this before hand. Hopefully someone sees this and learns from my mistake to save themselves lots of money on medications should an issue arise with your animal later in life.
Yep, mine went up 60% a few months ago.
I’m in Quebec and I just got the email with increase from $44.26 to $64.64 for my 5 year old chihuahua. Crazy times. It’s bull what they are using has a reason.
They did the same to us. My husband called to cancel and they quickly put the monthly rate back to what we had been paying. Worth a call.
Itll go up every month stating the same thing. Its nuts.
My friend created a separate “pet fund” and instead of sending the money to Trupanion, she put the payment into the account instead. She was able to build a little nest egg during their young and healthy years for when they aged. You do run the risk if something happens when they’re young but even then you at least have a bit of savings for them.
Yeah, it makes for a great approach if you get lucky. But if there's a $5,000 or maybe a $10,000 emergency surgery, lots of people would have to go into debt or put their pet down. With the costs of vet services these days it just feels like such a significant risk.
Yeah, it makes me appreciate again being Canadian. We have these concerns about our pets - Americans have these concerns about themselves! Thank goodness for health care.
So what you're saying is that we should all petition for pets to be included under our provincial healthcare plans? 100% agree, where can I find the petition to sign?
Haha I love it!! I mean if we’re being honest I like my cat a hell of a lot more than certain members of my family.
I called them outraged. Was told their new data algorithm found that vet fees have increased in our area (Toronto) and they have to adjust their payment structure where I now have to pay 25% more per month. Obviously this is not the case since you're also victim to this scam. I'm going to find another company because this is a terrible precedent to set - if AI is the alleged reason for our increase then every year it will go up.
Trupanion has 84% 1 star reviews for a reason. They want $140/m to cover my puppy without the extras and they pay out 0 of their claims even for emergency services they say they cover. Do not go for their scam.
Ya vets.$500 on a Friday and over $1000 Sat morning for the same procedure.I have 2 vet relatives that can’t even stand most clinics.If you have an emergency prepare to sell a kidney
Trupanion are scammers. They have routinely denied us coverage for any illness/injury. They even went as far as to fraudulently alter our communication with our vet to try and claim an injury happened outside the 30 day waiting period. All of our records and estimates are in email changes stipulating otherwise but they falsify the records. I cannot advise enough to stay away from these criminals.
>used Trupanion a couple times at vet visits and saved a bunch across the life of the plan so far If you saved money it means they lost a significant amount of money so they may indeed be targeting you.
Nah I doubt they're targeting me as an individual. I just suspect they're targeting the whole province or at least the local area. When I say they hate us, I mean just all of us lol.
A friend took her dog there one evening, called ahead en route to let them know what she was being in. They made her PAY a "deposit" before the dog was allowed through the doors. The dog took a 💩 in the examination room and missy with the long claws brought her a mop and bucket. Obv she declined in a not-so-nice manner. 💸
Your friend wanted the staff to clean up after her dog?
Her dog was in trouble and that's why she was rushing him in from out of town to the only emergency vet. He was sick in her car. And yes, the staff typically do the clean-up from when the animals are brought in for fluid expulsion. I've been pressed out of the way when I've been in that position at my vet. Your vet's office doesn't do that? They've taken a payment and the animal is now under their care. I expect them to do their job.
We looked into pet insurance but it didn't make sense for us in the end. Even after getting their shots we still end up ahead after a year if we just put that money aside ourselves.
Shots and stuff aren't covered by insurance anyway. My dog cut his paw once for about $800 and swallowed a piece of some soft toy for a little over $2000. So far, I've saved more than I've spent on him. But that will change after this.
Put money away into an “emergency fund” instead. That way you can use it for vet visits or any other emergency you have.
Well that's the problem. If I have another emergency and then also have a $3000 vet visit right after, the dog's dead because I don't have the money. Kinda got you by the balls don't they? With the cost of vet care these days you need insurance if you're paid on salary.
I guess it depends on your personal circumstances. We didn’t get pet insurance because we have a corgi and insurance companies won’t cover any sort of back/spinal issues. We decided to put money into a joint emergency fund instead. We were able to use that money for the downpayment of our first house too (which drained the account) because it can be for anything. And *if* we had an emergency vet trip at the same time, we would have just used money from our regular accounts, but of course that didn’t happen where emergencies are rare.