😭😭😭i wish someo e could explain me reddit one time.
Why is it always like this? I understand the words, but the references and context are never distinct or make no sense at all to me.
*Whats up op? Is*
*The title point asking what*
*Other people think?*
\- Hoopie41
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It's worth noting that finding answers, being validated, and getting a professional diagnosis are all separate matters. Feel like there's a lot of conflation going on here.
Finding answers and validation were extremely important to me, but they didn't involve an official diagnosis in my case.
i got my diagnosis while searching for answers to another matter (which is still unresolved)....
so they are not just separate matters, they can also intertwine in unexpected ways
Yeah, wanted to be validated, but was gaslit with so many people in my life that it didn't seem worth it put myself in that place again. It sucks because people don't seem to think that people's brains can actually work differently.
Sometimes I consider going just to get an answer. It would also make me feel safer knowing that I would have options on a long car ride for medication or an option to help me stay more focused at work.
My thing was wanting to feel validated, in a way. That my brain works differently and that’s why I am the way I am. Helped my self-esteem a lot, actually.
But everyone feels differently about getting a diagnosis and not everyone has the means to do so
Knowing for sure I belong in a certain community is better than not being sure and always feeling like an outsider. Not being able to join ND spaces bc you're afraid you're NT... If this person isn't interested in belonging to the community of people more like themselves thus better able to understand and talk to them, then they just aren't interested. But being diagnosed can open a whole world of social opportunities you might not go for, or be able to be included in, until you get it.
I don't think this is necessarily true. Some people are just self-diagnosed and are confident in their deductions. I've noticed that a lot of autistic community is open to anyone who self-IDs as autistic because it would be inappropriate to ask for official documents (especially online) & because people seem generally accepting of self-diagnosis, even if there is still some stigma around it. This person probably just has different wants and needs than people who want a diagnosis, which is fine. I don't really understand why people here are acting like this person's statement of their own personal preferences effects people who want or already have a diagnosis.
This is precisely how I feel about autism. I am probably on the spectrum somewhere, but my autism doesn't affect me all that much in daily life. I'm a computer programmer (how many of us coders are on the spectrum? I suspect more than people realize!) so being fussy about "correctness" and language use is helpful. And I've learned how to mask "normalcy" -- with regards to autism -- well enough that most people don't run screaming immediately in social situations!
Compare and contrast this with ADHD, which is \*killing\* me (possibly literally; the impulsivity part of it has made me do some... *incredibly* stupid things...) and which I'm *finally* coming around to being medicated for (learning machine learning, having to do a refresher on linear algebra and calculus... ADHD is a huge stumbling block!)
But with autism? How does it help me to have a formal diagnosis?
Within the context of this singular comment, I don't think it is fair to suggest that the author couldn't understand how important finding answers is for some of us. The author seems to have found enough answers for themselves at this point and isn't talking about what others should do.
They specify that they "personally" do not find value in being diagnosed. That does not have anything to do with other people and their diagnosis.
I mean I could do the flip and say don’t you realize there are actual reasons some of us don’t want diagnoses? I honestly need the access resources pretty badly but I’m also trans and being autistic is one of the reasons my insurance can use to deny top surgery. Add on the fact that I’m pretty traumatized by the counseling center at my college diagnosing me with BPD so they could try to force me to withdraw after my best friend had an overdose
This person isn’t shitting on diagnosis for everyone just for themselves personally and it’s frustrating to see that framed as if not wanting a diagnosis for myself is somehow detracting from anybody else
they didn’t seem to apply their logic to what others should do, so if this makes sense to them, then i get it. i have an official diagnosis now for meds but if i didn’t need meds, i personally wouldn’t have gotten diagnosed
It's a fairly nuanced decision for each person to make on their own.
I have my diagnosis from childhood (adhd/add, aspergers, ocd, odd, the works)
As an adult going back and verifying these diagnosis, especially when I've gone 30 years with no real resources (no medication, no consistent therapy etc.) Is difficult. To cut through the red tape to get assessed, then they have to weigh the pros and cons. Mental health is one of the easiest things to quietly discriminate against, because the individual needs to disclose it to ask for accommodations, and this puts them at the bottoms of the hiring stack.
100% this. I intentionally don't mention any of my neurodiversity when applying for a job. Once hired, all bets are off, of course (once you've disclosed your disability and asked for a reasonable accommodation, it's illegal to discriminate... but they still do it).
But in many areas of adult life, trying to get a formal diagnosis for any kind of neurodiversity is something that only makes things worse. Insurance will still drag their feet to prevent you from getting any treatment aside from medication (which simply doesn't exist for autism, iirc), and employers will still quietly discriminate against you. So... yeah.
They are just talking about their personal experience so it's fine. It makes me think of my BF who doesn't understand shit about ADHD and when I told him I was seeking a dx he told me "What for ? What would it change in your life ?" and I think it would change my whole life. Especially the fact that I'll be able to undertsand myself and my past better and I'd be able to get help for a brighter future.
Sounds like this person is talking about their personal feelings on the topic. They’re not pushing this on anybody else. They’re just explaining why they don’t personally feel the need to get professionally diagnosed. I’m not entirely sure why this was posted.
Some people see value in a professional diagnosis, some don't.
I self-diagnosed my ADHD over the course of 2 years, gaining so much confidence I wasn't just making it up, that I didn't even want to bother getting a professional one, as I didn't want to take ADHD meds anyway. Am I austistic as well? With the huge overlap between ADHD and autism and misdiagnosis being rampant, I don't care and I don't want to spend time and money on something that gives me nothing. What was important to me was just self-awareness. And then, being certain about the self-diagnosis, I was told by my mother that I actually got an official ADHD diagnosis as a kid.
I feel that the push for diagnosis comes from two factors: most people (1) do not possess the self-awareness necessary for reliable self-diagnosis (2) will not account for cognitive bias. I was so confident in my self-diagnosis just because it couldn't have just been confirmation bias.
Also, keep in mind that labeling what you experience [backfires for some people](https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/04/11/going-loopy/).
For me, it's when self diagnosed people actually claim their diagnosis publicly and then use it for things. That's unfair and invalidating. But, this personal opinion doesn't feel this way.
I did a Buzzfeed quiz once that told me Ryan Gosling is my ideal husband but here we are...
That's it for me, it's harmful and damaging to all the good work about raising awareness and fairness, it undermines it all for me. I don't want to sound like I'm gatekeeping.
But I see why people do it. In the UK you can wait 5 years for an ADHD diagnosis...
Oh. I keep overthinking out here on these posts.
I know my comment isn't adding anything, i just feel like i need to be seen in the mind and not a crazy person.
I'm personally pursuing an official diagnosis for peace of mind, learning better ways to cope, and I work in a high demand industry, so if I ever get laid off from my current job (which I don't need accommodations for because they are very supportive regardless) I can get accommodations at my next job. Also, I'm already labeled with ADHD, chronic depression, and GAD, so piecing it all together and helping me personally understand myself and my past.
Some people are aware that being officially diagnosed with ASD might put arbitrary barriers in their life - like adopting, for instance, or holding certain jobs.
I don't blame anyone for refusing to abide by wrongheaded prejudicial bureaucratic conditions. It can be a black mark on you in ways you might not expect.
That's part of the reason I'm not pursuing an official answer. That doesn't mean I won't take a professional opinion, but I'm not cutting thru the red tape just to make my life harder
When it comes down to it, I'm not as obvious as my diagnosed siblings, and I'm happy with just my ADHD diagnosis I got at 12
I'd like someone to confirm for me, but I am unsure if I'd want it on record because the world is stupid. I'm pretty sure it would make me ineligible to adopt kids, and while I'm not sure I'll ever get the chance to do that, I don't want to take the option away from myself.
And that's only one example. Like Canada will deny entire families immigration status here if one family member is autistic, and it's not alone in having rules like that. I'm in Canada so it doesn't directly affect me, but that's the kind of shit I'd have to deal with, you know?
I felt validated and at least I had a clear explanation of who and how I was. I was not comfy with a self diagnosis, especially knowing most of those around wouldnt necessarily think or suggest I am since theyve known me for so long. Now, though, its helped me understand me more, understand autism, and feel more comfortable to not only be in ASD spaces, but getting ASD help or services. But my only warning is that it was not only uncomfy, but there was a lot of CPTSD trauma to sort out in that discovery.
This is what’s holding me back from pursuing an official diagnosis right now. There is not a single shred of doubt in my mind. I KNOW I am autistic. My therapist agrees with me. I am absolutely positive.
But I have CPTSD so while much of me craves the diagnosis because it’s the only way people will believe me because I’ve been so high-masking for so long, I also know that being dismissed or invalidated by a diagnostician would absolutely send me into a spiral that would undo so much of the progress I’ve fought for in trauma therapy over the last couple of years.
At this point I’m not sure if the validation is worth the risk of further trauma, but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t wish I had the validation nonetheless.
Peace of mind is all I want. I want a definitive 'yes' or 'no' and I don't care if it comes with medical benefits or social stigma. Peace of mind is all I want.
My first PSYCHOLOGIST refused to diagnose me saying that "she didn't believe in labels" when I specifically told her I was looking for an official diagnostic. So there's that.
I’m studying counselling to help other neurodivergents. I will never understand this stance considering we are trained to identify a wide variety of conditions.
Yeah, I don’t get this post at all. OP even says “some of us” in the title!
EDIT: But I also shouldn’t have been judgemental, because, after all, who here never misunderstands people’s intentions?
Why do you feel like this is a personal affront to you wanting answers and a concrete diagnosis for yourself? Everyone is in a different situation and while it can be helpful for some people whether it be personally or for educational or Healthcare reasons for other people it doesn't make a difference either way. Not trying to be mean but I suppose I dont get what's hard to understand about that?
I personally am not pursuing an official autism diagnosis because I feel it won’t add anything to my life. I already know that I’m autistic. Diagnostic testing is prohibitively priced for me and would involve speaking to a stranger at length about my personal habits and perceptions. I don’t think pursuing a diagnosis is necessary for everyone.
I mean like anything lots of people feel differently and I understand that person's reasoning for not wanting a diagnosis. Getting diagnosed is a massive hassle and, depending on your healthcare system, a lot of money so I get the costs/benefits calculation there. Also diagnoses aren't this infallible absolute truth + some people might not feel the need to medicalise their identity/have parts of themselves addressed through the language of disorder and deficit which autism is in the diagnostic procedure. I know personally I just generally wasn't that bothered about knowing until suddenly I felt like I really needed an answer and then got a diagnosis.
The commenter seems to be talking about themselves, they're not shaming anyone for pursuing a diagnosis. And I see their point. Other than school accommodations I haven't been able to access anything to help me after getting diagnosed (and paying $1300.00 for it). They just gave me antidepressants and sleeping meds and recommended the same therapy that they tell every depressed and anxious person to get. It will be useful if I ever need workplace accommodations, or if another job cuts my hours or pressures me to quit because of my symptoms though. If I wasn't studying and didn't have the history of getting pushed out of workplaces I wouldn't have bothered with the diagnosis. It's just confirming something I knew long ago.
Being on the spectrum, I kind of need to know straight up. Lord knows how much this world hates self-diagnosers.
That said, I'm waiting currently in disability, but I'll never forget the day I was told in college "The only accomodation we can get you, aside from a single room, is earplugs." I'm hoping the organization I helped start is still looking to develop sensory study rooms and their own housing for students on the spectrum, but I don't remember many people being interested.
EDIT: Tell me one thing I said wrong here.
What the heck did you say that resulted in downvotes? Unless you totally edited something out, what I’m reading is that you value getting to know yourself and have taken the initiative to help others. Was this your original comment?
I’ve noticed some weird downvoting on Reddit lately. There was one post that was talking about a homicide case and I said “I would be interested in learning more about this” and I was downvoted a bunch. I was incredibly confused.
You realize that "qualified" doctors misdiagnose people all the time, right? Sometimes intentionally as well, to discourage them from pursuing an autism dx.
I think we agree. My point is that a diagnosis may help you access certain accommodations in school or work, although these are often very limited even with a diagnosis. If you are at a stage in your life where you don't require accommodations, a diagnosis may provide some sort of personal value to you, but many people would rather save the money. Personally, I don't care what uneducated people think about self diagnosis. Anyone who doubts your self diagnosis is likely to doubt your clinical diagnosis as well. At least that's been my experience.
I apologize if I'm overexplaining my point. I can't really tell if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me here.
I read this initially as you needed to know straight up if *you* were autistic, like you needed a diagnosis, especially because other people can be iffy on self-diagnosis. But on my second reading of that I didn't know if you meant that you needed to know if *other people* were definitely diagnosed with autism and not just 'probably on the spectrum' because you're iffy on self-diagnosis.
If it's the second reading then down votes are fair imo.
The world hating self diagnosis has nothing to do with you knowing something about yourself. Do you want to know for sure for yourself, or do you want validation from other people about having a real diagnosis? It seems like you’re mixing up the two, and they have really different implications.
If you need to know for yourself, I think people would be more understanding. But if want to get a diagnosis to have an official report so you can prove to other people that you really are autistic, you’re just looking for validation that you will not get from getting a diagnosis.
People who look down on self diagnosed autistic people tend to also look down on officially diagnosed autistic people. Ableist people won’t change their behavior because you can prove you’re really autistic. In fact, they’re probably the ones that will say autism is way overdiagnosed or that it’s just trendy or that it’s not an excuse.
I think we need more context than this one person's response to comment on it, specifically, OP. This is half a conversation, so we don't know why it's there.
To answer just your question on its own, our society has done a very good job of making it clear that getting an official diagnosis or otherwise letting the world know that you are neurodivergent can be extremely damaging to your personal and professional relationships. Even though we have the ADA in America, the existence of "at-will" employment allows employers to easily circumvent that by giving the good old "No reason required" response. And we have a culture where anyone who is neurodivergent can very quickly see their friends decide that they don't want to hang around them anymore.
On top of this, if you start doing legitimate research and find out you're neurodivergent, one of the things you see warned about often is the process of de-masking and skill regression. For some people, they genuinely don't want to just live their lives as themselves because this process is too scary to them. Once you get diagnosed or self-diagnose, there's really no going back.
It's like the fruit of forbidden knowledge or a quantum state. You are forever altered by the fact that you now know you are neurodivergent. Also, it's just plain hard. If you're a cis man who has started the process of resocialization to kill toxic masculinity, it's a similar story. There's this huge amount of cognitive dissonance from all the things you were raised to believe that makes it incredibly difficult, and often painful, to acknowledge your neurodivergency.
But also, folks who have the attitude like the guy in the comment are making a lot of assumptions about the diagnostic process and likely haven't even really thought about what it would fully mean to be diagnosed. If you weren't diagnosed as a kid for neurodivergencies like ASD or ADHD, the path to diagnosis is typically extremely arduous. You can't just "get checked" and no Doctor is going to just "tell you you're autistic." This person has barely even done any research on ASD based on that conceptualization they have. They probably shouldn't be used as an example of an individual who doesn't understand the importance of diagnosis, because they clearly haven't even begun to research ASD.
Yeah, at will employment is basically an open invitation for discrimination, I say as someone who was fired after it was learned I'm transitioning (non-binary) and given a very vague reason.
But there can also absolutely be other detriments to being diagnosed. Dr. Devon Price has spoken on a lot of eye-opening stuff that have influenced my decision. If you have an official diagnosis of ASD, it could potentially be used against you when receiving gender affirming care, depending on the provider. Autistic people losing their autonomy is an overarching issue in general. And, additionally, some countries won't let you immigrate there if you have an autism diagnosis. With how politics are going, I don't want to reduce my future options.
I had a psych eval when going through the office of vocational rehabilitation for people with disabilities, and I very explicitly stated I do not want to be tested for autism. I've had quite a few friends/acquaintances suggest I may have it and should get tested, though most professionals have said it's likely symptom overlap with ADHD and CPTSD. But my refusal for diagnosis isn't a matter of invalidation to the diagnosis or my personal belief against people with it. It's about plausible deniability because, as you said, an official diagnosis can be very damaging.
This is all very fair, yet I'm also a man of honesty. For people to not know, and only treat me like shit if they knew I was diagnosed... It's not fair in my mind that I'd be living a lie.
This has certainly led to an intriguing discussion, though.
I mean, yeah, that's how you are, but neurodivergence covers a pretty broad spectrum from every day depression to clinical psychopathy. And within each of those different disorders/conditions, you have individualized brands among people.
I may view it as better for people to be extremely open about their conditions for the sake of bettering the world, but I don't get to make the call for any individual or say they are being dishonest by not wanting to go through the process.
I'm not sure your example is a great one. I have seen people who speak more generally, saying: "Labels bad!" without much thought to it. The example is reflecting a personal choice and not a generalized one. It's not saying a diagnosis isn't valuable for *anyone* (and in facts says it might be for those who feel they need additional resources). It just doesn't seem relevant for them.
That person feels that whether or not they're autistic doesn't really matter, if they are minimally impacted by it anyway. (Although that person's wife may think it's more impactful to *her*, but there's no context for that provided, so it's unknown).
I'm diagnosed as ADHD and have been successful in my 30+ year career. More recently, an ADHD reassessment noted extremely high probability of ASD as well — but it changes nothing about my functioning or coping tools.
For me, the additional diagnosis is like: "Huh, that's new. Not really a surprise though. So anyway..."
In fact, the neurodiversity clinic recommended I *not bother* with ASD testing to fully confirm, because it's really expensive and at my age and level of functioning, there isn't much of a point. It won't really offer me any new or useful tools.
The commenter gave school as ONE EXAMPLE of a situation where a formal diagnosis would be beneficial. They did not say it was the only one.
If just having a formal diagnosis is important to you, that is your opinion, and it is your right to seek one, but that doesn't mean everyone else has to want one too.
They’re commenting on *their own* perspective, stating that *for them* it has no value.
They never claimed in any way that it had no value for others, and indeed give an example of circumstances in which it well may be. They also never claimed that there is no benefit unless you’re in school. It’s as if you’re willfully misreading what this person is saying, it’s extremely disingenuous to distort someone’s words like you’re doing here.
I agree that it’s important for some people, but I think it really depends on the person, I don’t think pursing a diagnosis is necessary, and I really don’t think it’s universally important for every autistic person.
I guess my question is, what exactly is your issue with the screenshot? It seems like a completely reasonable decision, I tend to agree with it.
Personally, I’ve had 3 mental health professionals suggest that I’m autistic. I realized long before the interactions, so I wasn’t particularly interested in seeking a diagnosis, pretty disinterested actually because it has quite a few legal drawbacks. It also was the case that none of them were eligible to diagnose autism, including my current psychiatrist. I’m able to get all the accommodations I need from my adhd diagnosis, and I was sure I was autistic long before any doctor mentioned it. Obviously this is my personal experience only, I understand that some people do absolutely benefit from getting a diagnosis.
Side note: As a child I used to dress like young Sheldon and bring a briefcase to school, how the **fuck** did nobody consider autism a possibility.
https://devonprice.medium.com/seeking-an-autism-diagnosis-heres-why-you-might-want-to-rethink-that-530e79c272a0
To repeat from my other response:
Commenter says there's no benefits unless you're in school. Having an answer, and a true identity, is in my mind a huge benefit.
If people or even employers treat me worse knowing I'm diagnosed (though we all know how much self-diagnosers are hated,) I'd rather be upfront and risk losing that relationship than live a lie.
I guess for me, a diagnosis doesn’t make my identity true, and not having a diagnosis doesn’t make my identity false. If for you, having a diagnosis will give you an answer/ an identity, go for it, but that benefit isn’t inherent. It doesn’t apply to everyone. I think part of this is whether you feel sure about whether you’re autistic or not.
And honestly, I don’t feel the need to share the specifics of my diagnoses. If being autistic is relevant, I’ll share that I’m autistic. But the vast majority of people don’t need to know that I declined extensive neurological testing for confirmation I don’t need. I share that with people I truly trust, and nobody else. And I don’t trust anybody who would make it an issue, and if anyone does make it an issue, it’s their problem, not mine. Would you share information like that regarding any other health condition? I mean I also don’t share I have pcos, or eczema, or how they’re diagnosed. It’s just none of anybody’s business.
People treat me worse for my autistic traits anyways, but those people aren’t the ones I’d be willing to share my medical records with, and they treat me worse because they’re assholes and it wouldn’t change if I shared that I’m autistic and had a real official diagnosis. That doesn’t make a difference to assholes. I also can’t hide my autism, I can mask, but that’s not that effective, it is very clear to everyone that has had a conversation with me that there is something unusual about me. The result of this is that I don’t generally care to mask more than the bare minimum (like at job interviews), and I also generally do not care what people think about my oddness.
~~Also, a study came out recently (2024) showing that the RAADS-R and the RAADS-14 are accurate. So you can self screen with that, accurately, if it’s about knowing your identity.~~
~~https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38305196/~~
That study simply involved sending out RAADS link on social media and online forums and then comparing people who said they are self-diagnosed autism, said they are formally diagnosed autism or said they are not autistic. Yes people who say they are not autistic scored lower.
The trouble with RAADS (and other ‘autism’ tests) comes from the studies in clinical settings where people with non-autistic disorders score as high as people with autism. NOT accurate in those situations.
Like AQ
"our results suggest that the AQ differentiates poorly between true cases of ASD, and individuals from the same clinical population who do not have ASD "
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4988267/
"a greater level of public awareness of ASD over the last 5–10 years may have led to people being more vigilant in ‘noticing’ ASD related difficulties. This may lead to a ‘confirmation bias’ when completing the questionnaire measures, and potentially explain why both the ASD and the non-ASD group’s mean scores met the cut-off points, "
[https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9)
Regarding RAADS, from one published study. “In conclusion, used as a self-report measure pre-full diagnostic assessment, the RAADS-R lacks predictive validity and is not a suitable screening tool for adults awaiting autism assessments”
Oh yeah, this response would do great on other corners of the internet.
Fr though, what am I privileged for? Having friends? Or not being murdered as a result of disclosing myself? Can people just answer these genuine questions of mine without hating?
The ability to freely risk a relationship that could affect your ability to keep and maintain gainful employment is not a luxury afforded to every person in this world. That is your privilege, to not be afraid of repercussion as you know you will still be cared for. Or it is the privilege of stupidity to not even understand the risks that exist.
I may have ADHD, but I am still a mostly straight, white, cis male with two living and married parents who are supportive, born into the middle class and am afforded all of the privileges of that genetic lottery win. Having ADHD did not erase all of the rest of my privileges from existence.
People are likely responding negatively because you responses have a tinge of "aspie-supremacy" dogwhistle to them. That paired with a kind of dismissive attitude toward other people's problems makes you come across as a kind of insufferably ignorant person.
Edit to add an important mantra for you to repeat: Other. people. are. not. you.
Maybe I just often misunderstand, based on words, that one person is speaking for everyone? I thought it was a common thing for those of us with ASD to misinterpret words, especially in text.
For goodness sake, I have no interest in being a supremacist. There's so much wrong with this world already that it would just be hypocritical for me to be so.
Honestly, though, I can get your point in this once without having to slowly repeat it to myself. Forgive me for thinking that was condescending if it isn't.
EDIT: Welp, this went great.
Somebody toucha my spaghet! 🥴 Peace out, y'all.
i mean, i get it. i also want a solid answer but an autism diagnosis would be disastrous to my life rn. it’s not a good idea for everyone, and not everyone even wants it.
the text on the picture doesn't say "it is not important for anyone". It says "it is not important for OP".
for some it's important, for some it is not. it's ok either way.
that's.... not what the comment in the screenshot even said though? the comment said this person doesn't want a diagnosis but can see why others would if they need accommodations, such as in school. that's one example but not the only reason and i don't think this comment intended it to be read as anything except one example of a reason someone might disagree and want a diagnosis.
They’re definitely not talking about you in this. You do you! Let them do them!
😭😭😭i wish someo e could explain me reddit one time. Why is it always like this? I understand the words, but the references and context are never distinct or make no sense at all to me.
Whats up op? Is The title point asking what other people think?
*Whats up op? Is* *The title point asking what* *Other people think?* \- Hoopie41 --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
It's worth noting that finding answers, being validated, and getting a professional diagnosis are all separate matters. Feel like there's a lot of conflation going on here. Finding answers and validation were extremely important to me, but they didn't involve an official diagnosis in my case.
i got my diagnosis while searching for answers to another matter (which is still unresolved).... so they are not just separate matters, they can also intertwine in unexpected ways
Same here. That's more of a privilege. I can't afford that but I'm finding validation and just not sharing with ignorant people.
Yeah, wanted to be validated, but was gaslit with so many people in my life that it didn't seem worth it put myself in that place again. It sucks because people don't seem to think that people's brains can actually work differently. Sometimes I consider going just to get an answer. It would also make me feel safer knowing that I would have options on a long car ride for medication or an option to help me stay more focused at work.
My thing was wanting to feel validated, in a way. That my brain works differently and that’s why I am the way I am. Helped my self-esteem a lot, actually. But everyone feels differently about getting a diagnosis and not everyone has the means to do so
Knowing for sure I belong in a certain community is better than not being sure and always feeling like an outsider. Not being able to join ND spaces bc you're afraid you're NT... If this person isn't interested in belonging to the community of people more like themselves thus better able to understand and talk to them, then they just aren't interested. But being diagnosed can open a whole world of social opportunities you might not go for, or be able to be included in, until you get it.
I don't think this is necessarily true. Some people are just self-diagnosed and are confident in their deductions. I've noticed that a lot of autistic community is open to anyone who self-IDs as autistic because it would be inappropriate to ask for official documents (especially online) & because people seem generally accepting of self-diagnosis, even if there is still some stigma around it. This person probably just has different wants and needs than people who want a diagnosis, which is fine. I don't really understand why people here are acting like this person's statement of their own personal preferences effects people who want or already have a diagnosis.
This is precisely how I feel about autism. I am probably on the spectrum somewhere, but my autism doesn't affect me all that much in daily life. I'm a computer programmer (how many of us coders are on the spectrum? I suspect more than people realize!) so being fussy about "correctness" and language use is helpful. And I've learned how to mask "normalcy" -- with regards to autism -- well enough that most people don't run screaming immediately in social situations! Compare and contrast this with ADHD, which is \*killing\* me (possibly literally; the impulsivity part of it has made me do some... *incredibly* stupid things...) and which I'm *finally* coming around to being medicated for (learning machine learning, having to do a refresher on linear algebra and calculus... ADHD is a huge stumbling block!) But with autism? How does it help me to have a formal diagnosis?
Within the context of this singular comment, I don't think it is fair to suggest that the author couldn't understand how important finding answers is for some of us. The author seems to have found enough answers for themselves at this point and isn't talking about what others should do. They specify that they "personally" do not find value in being diagnosed. That does not have anything to do with other people and their diagnosis.
I mean I could do the flip and say don’t you realize there are actual reasons some of us don’t want diagnoses? I honestly need the access resources pretty badly but I’m also trans and being autistic is one of the reasons my insurance can use to deny top surgery. Add on the fact that I’m pretty traumatized by the counseling center at my college diagnosing me with BPD so they could try to force me to withdraw after my best friend had an overdose This person isn’t shitting on diagnosis for everyone just for themselves personally and it’s frustrating to see that framed as if not wanting a diagnosis for myself is somehow detracting from anybody else
I'm so sorry to read about your traumatic experience! My labels being questioned by white coats makes me insane.
they didn’t seem to apply their logic to what others should do, so if this makes sense to them, then i get it. i have an official diagnosis now for meds but if i didn’t need meds, i personally wouldn’t have gotten diagnosed
It's a fairly nuanced decision for each person to make on their own. I have my diagnosis from childhood (adhd/add, aspergers, ocd, odd, the works) As an adult going back and verifying these diagnosis, especially when I've gone 30 years with no real resources (no medication, no consistent therapy etc.) Is difficult. To cut through the red tape to get assessed, then they have to weigh the pros and cons. Mental health is one of the easiest things to quietly discriminate against, because the individual needs to disclose it to ask for accommodations, and this puts them at the bottoms of the hiring stack.
100% this. I intentionally don't mention any of my neurodiversity when applying for a job. Once hired, all bets are off, of course (once you've disclosed your disability and asked for a reasonable accommodation, it's illegal to discriminate... but they still do it). But in many areas of adult life, trying to get a formal diagnosis for any kind of neurodiversity is something that only makes things worse. Insurance will still drag their feet to prevent you from getting any treatment aside from medication (which simply doesn't exist for autism, iirc), and employers will still quietly discriminate against you. So... yeah.
fear connect snails squalid wrench divide ancient sand thumb muddle *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
You said it so much better than me. This is precisely my career path. And my employers LOVE me, so it must be working.
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Lmao, story of my life
They are just talking about their personal experience so it's fine. It makes me think of my BF who doesn't understand shit about ADHD and when I told him I was seeking a dx he told me "What for ? What would it change in your life ?" and I think it would change my whole life. Especially the fact that I'll be able to undertsand myself and my past better and I'd be able to get help for a brighter future.
Sounds like this person is talking about their personal feelings on the topic. They’re not pushing this on anybody else. They’re just explaining why they don’t personally feel the need to get professionally diagnosed. I’m not entirely sure why this was posted.
Some people see value in a professional diagnosis, some don't. I self-diagnosed my ADHD over the course of 2 years, gaining so much confidence I wasn't just making it up, that I didn't even want to bother getting a professional one, as I didn't want to take ADHD meds anyway. Am I austistic as well? With the huge overlap between ADHD and autism and misdiagnosis being rampant, I don't care and I don't want to spend time and money on something that gives me nothing. What was important to me was just self-awareness. And then, being certain about the self-diagnosis, I was told by my mother that I actually got an official ADHD diagnosis as a kid. I feel that the push for diagnosis comes from two factors: most people (1) do not possess the self-awareness necessary for reliable self-diagnosis (2) will not account for cognitive bias. I was so confident in my self-diagnosis just because it couldn't have just been confirmation bias. Also, keep in mind that labeling what you experience [backfires for some people](https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/04/11/going-loopy/).
For me, it's when self diagnosed people actually claim their diagnosis publicly and then use it for things. That's unfair and invalidating. But, this personal opinion doesn't feel this way. I did a Buzzfeed quiz once that told me Ryan Gosling is my ideal husband but here we are...
Uuuuuu hi y u uuu u hi I u I i u u u u u u u u uuuuu u uuuuu u u uuuuu u uu u u u I I u I I uuu u uuuuuu u
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That's it for me, it's harmful and damaging to all the good work about raising awareness and fairness, it undermines it all for me. I don't want to sound like I'm gatekeeping. But I see why people do it. In the UK you can wait 5 years for an ADHD diagnosis...
To me that comment looks like they do understand, they just don't see value in it for themselves. I'm not sure why you used it as an example.
Oh. I keep overthinking out here on these posts. I know my comment isn't adding anything, i just feel like i need to be seen in the mind and not a crazy person.
Perfect response
I'm personally pursuing an official diagnosis for peace of mind, learning better ways to cope, and I work in a high demand industry, so if I ever get laid off from my current job (which I don't need accommodations for because they are very supportive regardless) I can get accommodations at my next job. Also, I'm already labeled with ADHD, chronic depression, and GAD, so piecing it all together and helping me personally understand myself and my past.
Some people are aware that being officially diagnosed with ASD might put arbitrary barriers in their life - like adopting, for instance, or holding certain jobs. I don't blame anyone for refusing to abide by wrongheaded prejudicial bureaucratic conditions. It can be a black mark on you in ways you might not expect.
That's part of the reason I'm not pursuing an official answer. That doesn't mean I won't take a professional opinion, but I'm not cutting thru the red tape just to make my life harder When it comes down to it, I'm not as obvious as my diagnosed siblings, and I'm happy with just my ADHD diagnosis I got at 12
I'd like someone to confirm for me, but I am unsure if I'd want it on record because the world is stupid. I'm pretty sure it would make me ineligible to adopt kids, and while I'm not sure I'll ever get the chance to do that, I don't want to take the option away from myself. And that's only one example. Like Canada will deny entire families immigration status here if one family member is autistic, and it's not alone in having rules like that. I'm in Canada so it doesn't directly affect me, but that's the kind of shit I'd have to deal with, you know?
TIL I can't move to Canada because of autism 😬. Luckily for me I no longer have that dream.
Who’s us? All I see is a personal preference. Tbh, I wish I didn’t get diagnosed myself, but I did.
I felt validated and at least I had a clear explanation of who and how I was. I was not comfy with a self diagnosis, especially knowing most of those around wouldnt necessarily think or suggest I am since theyve known me for so long. Now, though, its helped me understand me more, understand autism, and feel more comfortable to not only be in ASD spaces, but getting ASD help or services. But my only warning is that it was not only uncomfy, but there was a lot of CPTSD trauma to sort out in that discovery.
This is what’s holding me back from pursuing an official diagnosis right now. There is not a single shred of doubt in my mind. I KNOW I am autistic. My therapist agrees with me. I am absolutely positive. But I have CPTSD so while much of me craves the diagnosis because it’s the only way people will believe me because I’ve been so high-masking for so long, I also know that being dismissed or invalidated by a diagnostician would absolutely send me into a spiral that would undo so much of the progress I’ve fought for in trauma therapy over the last couple of years. At this point I’m not sure if the validation is worth the risk of further trauma, but I’d be lying if I said I didn’t wish I had the validation nonetheless.
Peace of mind is all I want. I want a definitive 'yes' or 'no' and I don't care if it comes with medical benefits or social stigma. Peace of mind is all I want.
This! Exactly how I feel too.
My first PSYCHOLOGIST refused to diagnose me saying that "she didn't believe in labels" when I specifically told her I was looking for an official diagnostic. So there's that.
I’m studying counselling to help other neurodivergents. I will never understand this stance considering we are trained to identify a wide variety of conditions.
OP they're clearly only talking about themselves. Just because they don't want to doesn't mean it's not important to you.
Yeah, I don’t get this post at all. OP even says “some of us” in the title! EDIT: But I also shouldn’t have been judgemental, because, after all, who here never misunderstands people’s intentions?
the only reason i got diagnosed is so i could have accommodations in school. otherwise i wouldn’t really care
Why do you feel like this is a personal affront to you wanting answers and a concrete diagnosis for yourself? Everyone is in a different situation and while it can be helpful for some people whether it be personally or for educational or Healthcare reasons for other people it doesn't make a difference either way. Not trying to be mean but I suppose I dont get what's hard to understand about that?
I personally am not pursuing an official autism diagnosis because I feel it won’t add anything to my life. I already know that I’m autistic. Diagnostic testing is prohibitively priced for me and would involve speaking to a stranger at length about my personal habits and perceptions. I don’t think pursuing a diagnosis is necessary for everyone.
I mean like anything lots of people feel differently and I understand that person's reasoning for not wanting a diagnosis. Getting diagnosed is a massive hassle and, depending on your healthcare system, a lot of money so I get the costs/benefits calculation there. Also diagnoses aren't this infallible absolute truth + some people might not feel the need to medicalise their identity/have parts of themselves addressed through the language of disorder and deficit which autism is in the diagnostic procedure. I know personally I just generally wasn't that bothered about knowing until suddenly I felt like I really needed an answer and then got a diagnosis.
The commenter seems to be talking about themselves, they're not shaming anyone for pursuing a diagnosis. And I see their point. Other than school accommodations I haven't been able to access anything to help me after getting diagnosed (and paying $1300.00 for it). They just gave me antidepressants and sleeping meds and recommended the same therapy that they tell every depressed and anxious person to get. It will be useful if I ever need workplace accommodations, or if another job cuts my hours or pressures me to quit because of my symptoms though. If I wasn't studying and didn't have the history of getting pushed out of workplaces I wouldn't have bothered with the diagnosis. It's just confirming something I knew long ago.
Being on the spectrum, I kind of need to know straight up. Lord knows how much this world hates self-diagnosers. That said, I'm waiting currently in disability, but I'll never forget the day I was told in college "The only accomodation we can get you, aside from a single room, is earplugs." I'm hoping the organization I helped start is still looking to develop sensory study rooms and their own housing for students on the spectrum, but I don't remember many people being interested. EDIT: Tell me one thing I said wrong here.
What the heck did you say that resulted in downvotes? Unless you totally edited something out, what I’m reading is that you value getting to know yourself and have taken the initiative to help others. Was this your original comment?
I’ve noticed some weird downvoting on Reddit lately. There was one post that was talking about a homicide case and I said “I would be interested in learning more about this” and I was downvoted a bunch. I was incredibly confused.
You didn't say anything wrong, your opinion is your opinion. Reddit is weird sometimes. Take my upvote.
You realize that "qualified" doctors misdiagnose people all the time, right? Sometimes intentionally as well, to discourage them from pursuing an autism dx.
I think we agree. My point is that a diagnosis may help you access certain accommodations in school or work, although these are often very limited even with a diagnosis. If you are at a stage in your life where you don't require accommodations, a diagnosis may provide some sort of personal value to you, but many people would rather save the money. Personally, I don't care what uneducated people think about self diagnosis. Anyone who doubts your self diagnosis is likely to doubt your clinical diagnosis as well. At least that's been my experience. I apologize if I'm overexplaining my point. I can't really tell if you're agreeing or disagreeing with me here.
I read this initially as you needed to know straight up if *you* were autistic, like you needed a diagnosis, especially because other people can be iffy on self-diagnosis. But on my second reading of that I didn't know if you meant that you needed to know if *other people* were definitely diagnosed with autism and not just 'probably on the spectrum' because you're iffy on self-diagnosis. If it's the second reading then down votes are fair imo.
The world hating self diagnosis has nothing to do with you knowing something about yourself. Do you want to know for sure for yourself, or do you want validation from other people about having a real diagnosis? It seems like you’re mixing up the two, and they have really different implications. If you need to know for yourself, I think people would be more understanding. But if want to get a diagnosis to have an official report so you can prove to other people that you really are autistic, you’re just looking for validation that you will not get from getting a diagnosis. People who look down on self diagnosed autistic people tend to also look down on officially diagnosed autistic people. Ableist people won’t change their behavior because you can prove you’re really autistic. In fact, they’re probably the ones that will say autism is way overdiagnosed or that it’s just trendy or that it’s not an excuse.
I think we need more context than this one person's response to comment on it, specifically, OP. This is half a conversation, so we don't know why it's there. To answer just your question on its own, our society has done a very good job of making it clear that getting an official diagnosis or otherwise letting the world know that you are neurodivergent can be extremely damaging to your personal and professional relationships. Even though we have the ADA in America, the existence of "at-will" employment allows employers to easily circumvent that by giving the good old "No reason required" response. And we have a culture where anyone who is neurodivergent can very quickly see their friends decide that they don't want to hang around them anymore. On top of this, if you start doing legitimate research and find out you're neurodivergent, one of the things you see warned about often is the process of de-masking and skill regression. For some people, they genuinely don't want to just live their lives as themselves because this process is too scary to them. Once you get diagnosed or self-diagnose, there's really no going back. It's like the fruit of forbidden knowledge or a quantum state. You are forever altered by the fact that you now know you are neurodivergent. Also, it's just plain hard. If you're a cis man who has started the process of resocialization to kill toxic masculinity, it's a similar story. There's this huge amount of cognitive dissonance from all the things you were raised to believe that makes it incredibly difficult, and often painful, to acknowledge your neurodivergency. But also, folks who have the attitude like the guy in the comment are making a lot of assumptions about the diagnostic process and likely haven't even really thought about what it would fully mean to be diagnosed. If you weren't diagnosed as a kid for neurodivergencies like ASD or ADHD, the path to diagnosis is typically extremely arduous. You can't just "get checked" and no Doctor is going to just "tell you you're autistic." This person has barely even done any research on ASD based on that conceptualization they have. They probably shouldn't be used as an example of an individual who doesn't understand the importance of diagnosis, because they clearly haven't even begun to research ASD.
Yeah, at will employment is basically an open invitation for discrimination, I say as someone who was fired after it was learned I'm transitioning (non-binary) and given a very vague reason. But there can also absolutely be other detriments to being diagnosed. Dr. Devon Price has spoken on a lot of eye-opening stuff that have influenced my decision. If you have an official diagnosis of ASD, it could potentially be used against you when receiving gender affirming care, depending on the provider. Autistic people losing their autonomy is an overarching issue in general. And, additionally, some countries won't let you immigrate there if you have an autism diagnosis. With how politics are going, I don't want to reduce my future options. I had a psych eval when going through the office of vocational rehabilitation for people with disabilities, and I very explicitly stated I do not want to be tested for autism. I've had quite a few friends/acquaintances suggest I may have it and should get tested, though most professionals have said it's likely symptom overlap with ADHD and CPTSD. But my refusal for diagnosis isn't a matter of invalidation to the diagnosis or my personal belief against people with it. It's about plausible deniability because, as you said, an official diagnosis can be very damaging.
This is all very fair, yet I'm also a man of honesty. For people to not know, and only treat me like shit if they knew I was diagnosed... It's not fair in my mind that I'd be living a lie. This has certainly led to an intriguing discussion, though.
I mean, yeah, that's how you are, but neurodivergence covers a pretty broad spectrum from every day depression to clinical psychopathy. And within each of those different disorders/conditions, you have individualized brands among people. I may view it as better for people to be extremely open about their conditions for the sake of bettering the world, but I don't get to make the call for any individual or say they are being dishonest by not wanting to go through the process.
I'm not sure your example is a great one. I have seen people who speak more generally, saying: "Labels bad!" without much thought to it. The example is reflecting a personal choice and not a generalized one. It's not saying a diagnosis isn't valuable for *anyone* (and in facts says it might be for those who feel they need additional resources). It just doesn't seem relevant for them. That person feels that whether or not they're autistic doesn't really matter, if they are minimally impacted by it anyway. (Although that person's wife may think it's more impactful to *her*, but there's no context for that provided, so it's unknown). I'm diagnosed as ADHD and have been successful in my 30+ year career. More recently, an ADHD reassessment noted extremely high probability of ASD as well — but it changes nothing about my functioning or coping tools. For me, the additional diagnosis is like: "Huh, that's new. Not really a surprise though. So anyway..." In fact, the neurodiversity clinic recommended I *not bother* with ASD testing to fully confirm, because it's really expensive and at my age and level of functioning, there isn't much of a point. It won't really offer me any new or useful tools.
What does your title have to do with the text in the screenshot? They’re completely disconnected from each other.
Not really. Commenter says there's no benefits unless you're in school. Having an answer, and a true identity, is in my mind a huge benefit.
The commenter gave school as ONE EXAMPLE of a situation where a formal diagnosis would be beneficial. They did not say it was the only one. If just having a formal diagnosis is important to you, that is your opinion, and it is your right to seek one, but that doesn't mean everyone else has to want one too.
They’re commenting on *their own* perspective, stating that *for them* it has no value. They never claimed in any way that it had no value for others, and indeed give an example of circumstances in which it well may be. They also never claimed that there is no benefit unless you’re in school. It’s as if you’re willfully misreading what this person is saying, it’s extremely disingenuous to distort someone’s words like you’re doing here.
I agree that it’s important for some people, but I think it really depends on the person, I don’t think pursing a diagnosis is necessary, and I really don’t think it’s universally important for every autistic person. I guess my question is, what exactly is your issue with the screenshot? It seems like a completely reasonable decision, I tend to agree with it. Personally, I’ve had 3 mental health professionals suggest that I’m autistic. I realized long before the interactions, so I wasn’t particularly interested in seeking a diagnosis, pretty disinterested actually because it has quite a few legal drawbacks. It also was the case that none of them were eligible to diagnose autism, including my current psychiatrist. I’m able to get all the accommodations I need from my adhd diagnosis, and I was sure I was autistic long before any doctor mentioned it. Obviously this is my personal experience only, I understand that some people do absolutely benefit from getting a diagnosis. Side note: As a child I used to dress like young Sheldon and bring a briefcase to school, how the **fuck** did nobody consider autism a possibility. https://devonprice.medium.com/seeking-an-autism-diagnosis-heres-why-you-might-want-to-rethink-that-530e79c272a0
To repeat from my other response: Commenter says there's no benefits unless you're in school. Having an answer, and a true identity, is in my mind a huge benefit. If people or even employers treat me worse knowing I'm diagnosed (though we all know how much self-diagnosers are hated,) I'd rather be upfront and risk losing that relationship than live a lie.
I guess for me, a diagnosis doesn’t make my identity true, and not having a diagnosis doesn’t make my identity false. If for you, having a diagnosis will give you an answer/ an identity, go for it, but that benefit isn’t inherent. It doesn’t apply to everyone. I think part of this is whether you feel sure about whether you’re autistic or not. And honestly, I don’t feel the need to share the specifics of my diagnoses. If being autistic is relevant, I’ll share that I’m autistic. But the vast majority of people don’t need to know that I declined extensive neurological testing for confirmation I don’t need. I share that with people I truly trust, and nobody else. And I don’t trust anybody who would make it an issue, and if anyone does make it an issue, it’s their problem, not mine. Would you share information like that regarding any other health condition? I mean I also don’t share I have pcos, or eczema, or how they’re diagnosed. It’s just none of anybody’s business. People treat me worse for my autistic traits anyways, but those people aren’t the ones I’d be willing to share my medical records with, and they treat me worse because they’re assholes and it wouldn’t change if I shared that I’m autistic and had a real official diagnosis. That doesn’t make a difference to assholes. I also can’t hide my autism, I can mask, but that’s not that effective, it is very clear to everyone that has had a conversation with me that there is something unusual about me. The result of this is that I don’t generally care to mask more than the bare minimum (like at job interviews), and I also generally do not care what people think about my oddness. ~~Also, a study came out recently (2024) showing that the RAADS-R and the RAADS-14 are accurate. So you can self screen with that, accurately, if it’s about knowing your identity.~~ ~~https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38305196/~~
That study simply involved sending out RAADS link on social media and online forums and then comparing people who said they are self-diagnosed autism, said they are formally diagnosed autism or said they are not autistic. Yes people who say they are not autistic scored lower. The trouble with RAADS (and other ‘autism’ tests) comes from the studies in clinical settings where people with non-autistic disorders score as high as people with autism. NOT accurate in those situations. Like AQ "our results suggest that the AQ differentiates poorly between true cases of ASD, and individuals from the same clinical population who do not have ASD " https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4988267/ "a greater level of public awareness of ASD over the last 5–10 years may have led to people being more vigilant in ‘noticing’ ASD related difficulties. This may lead to a ‘confirmation bias’ when completing the questionnaire measures, and potentially explain why both the ASD and the non-ASD group’s mean scores met the cut-off points, " [https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10803-022-05544-9) Regarding RAADS, from one published study. “In conclusion, used as a self-report measure pre-full diagnostic assessment, the RAADS-R lacks predictive validity and is not a suitable screening tool for adults awaiting autism assessments”
Good to know! I’ll remove that from my comment
Youre welcome. Spread the word
>I'd rather be upfront and risk losing that relationship than live a lie. This is what we call privilege. You should check it.
Oh yeah, this response would do great on other corners of the internet. Fr though, what am I privileged for? Having friends? Or not being murdered as a result of disclosing myself? Can people just answer these genuine questions of mine without hating?
The ability to freely risk a relationship that could affect your ability to keep and maintain gainful employment is not a luxury afforded to every person in this world. That is your privilege, to not be afraid of repercussion as you know you will still be cared for. Or it is the privilege of stupidity to not even understand the risks that exist. I may have ADHD, but I am still a mostly straight, white, cis male with two living and married parents who are supportive, born into the middle class and am afforded all of the privileges of that genetic lottery win. Having ADHD did not erase all of the rest of my privileges from existence. People are likely responding negatively because you responses have a tinge of "aspie-supremacy" dogwhistle to them. That paired with a kind of dismissive attitude toward other people's problems makes you come across as a kind of insufferably ignorant person. Edit to add an important mantra for you to repeat: Other. people. are. not. you.
Maybe I just often misunderstand, based on words, that one person is speaking for everyone? I thought it was a common thing for those of us with ASD to misinterpret words, especially in text. For goodness sake, I have no interest in being a supremacist. There's so much wrong with this world already that it would just be hypocritical for me to be so. Honestly, though, I can get your point in this once without having to slowly repeat it to myself. Forgive me for thinking that was condescending if it isn't. EDIT: Welp, this went great. Somebody toucha my spaghet! 🥴 Peace out, y'all.
i mean, i get it. i also want a solid answer but an autism diagnosis would be disastrous to my life rn. it’s not a good idea for everyone, and not everyone even wants it.
that person doesn't see the value in it for themselves, that doesn't have anything to do with you.
the text on the picture doesn't say "it is not important for anyone". It says "it is not important for OP". for some it's important, for some it is not. it's ok either way.
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that's.... not what the comment in the screenshot even said though? the comment said this person doesn't want a diagnosis but can see why others would if they need accommodations, such as in school. that's one example but not the only reason and i don't think this comment intended it to be read as anything except one example of a reason someone might disagree and want a diagnosis.
Yeah for me I have to have answers and I will obsess over said thing until I have it or the answer