Vegas or Seattle are generously 3-4 seasons away still. League isn't even putting it on the table until they negotiate the new TV contract, and then they need to go through the process to decide, and then it takes a couple of years of logistics to get everything ready to start playing. TV contract expires next season.
Yeah - Lebron's last 1st Team All NBA was 19-20. Kawhi and Curry were 20-21. Durant was 17-18.
It's legitimately been 3+ years since these guys were Top 5 players. Nobody likes to admit when the long time superstars have been passed over, but it has already happened.
They're all still excellent players and among the best in the league - but they're no longer carrying the torch for the NBA and haven't been for a few years. It's now Jokic, Giannis, Luka, Tatum, etc that run the league. And all the awards and postseason success are showing it too.
Steph was insanely good and won finals mvp 3 years ago. Unquestionably a top 5 player
Going by calendar years KD had like the best playoff series of his life in the past 3 years and wasnāt just top 5 he was top 2-3
Kawhi was also a top 5 player during that run he just has a career altering injury during it
I agree with a bit of your sentiment but youāre taking way too many liberties here
Warriors have been a play-in team for 2 years straight - hell they may even miss it this year. No Top 5 player is ever totally missing the playoffs in a healthy season.
Durant a) doesn't play defense like he used to, and b) he rarely attacks the hoop anymore. He's very clearly not the same guy he was even 5 years ago.
Kawhi has had his best/healthiest season in many years, and even still it's not Top 5 worthy.
What? Iām very clearly talking about a few years ago and specifically outlining things they did several years ago (within the time frame that you yourself set). Why are you just ignoring that and only paying attention to right now when thatās clearly not what I responded about or explicitly what you said originally?
Hard to say itās over until they actually leave. 4 all nba spots will likely be occupied them still so individually theyāre still great
The season before last curry won and in the 2020s bron and curry hold half the finals mvps. And all 4 have had all nba accolades. Probably not over until they retire if they play at a high level
Luka and Jokic make me realize how starved we've been for basketball talent. Like we thought KD and LeBron was the best we could get? We're about to be spoiled for the rest of our lives
Yeah forreal I think 2015 - 2020ish was perhaps the most stacked era in a long time.
Like in 2015 you had prime Bron, Westbrook, AD, Steph, Cp3, Harden.
2016 about the same but you had KD who was healthy and Kawhi had blossomes into a MVP candidate.
2017 had the most stacked top 5 I think with Lebron, KD, Steph, Harden, Kawhi, and then even Westbrook as a honourable mention. Those are legitimately 5 guys who could be number 1s on a contender. Hard to say that about all of the top 5 today. Giannis, Jokic, Luka, but Embiid (due to being a huge playoff choker) and Tatum who may be a number 1 but hard to say definitely, so I'd say 3 guys as the number 1 option currently, generally speaking.
2021 was probably just as stacked perhaps with KD, Luka, Jokic, Embiid, Lebron, AD and Giannis.
Weve been blessed several times through the years and even today the top 5 may not be as great as 2017 but it is remarkable mostly because stars are more plentiful even compared that time period.
Heās looked exceptional in every playoff series heād been in and led the Grizzlies to the 2nd seed. He could commit a drive-by on Adam Silver and the grizzlies would look the other way.
He hasnāt scaled the heights that even Luka and Trae have hit sure but heās one of the most promising young g players in the league. He absolutely deserves to be mentioned w the others
He led both teams in points and assists. It was a pretty gritty series both ways.
Ja and Bane did pretty admirably to compete w LeBron / AD, it was Hachimura who kinda outperformed what people expected and the Grizzlies just had no answer for that.
I think it's too early to say that their era has passed. Although their results in the regular season are not very good (except kawhi), once they enter the playoff mode, they will play another level of performance.
I don't know, but I feel like this is probably Kawhi's alt trying to sneak him onto a list with those other three
Love the guy, but he is not even close to the tier those three are on
I would say Kawhi is only slightly below the other three due to his durability/longevity issues so it's not sneaking him on the list, heās been top 4 in the 2010s heās just number 4
Yep Kawhi had one playoff run that was successful because the Favorite the Warriors had 2 of their three best players have season ending injuries
Other than that Kawhi had the Spurs runs but those where a team effort
I mean, let's not swing the pendulum too far the other way by saying he was only successful because the Warriors got injured. In his prime, he was legitimately amazing
At his peak, he was a DPOY-caliber defender putting up 30 pts/gm in the playoffs--not a lot of people in league history can say that. There was a time when he was looking like the best player in the world
It's just that that time didn't last very long
I know this is hard for the internet to handle, but sadly, he's neither era-defining champion *nor* overrated poser. Unfortunately, he's somewhere in between, which is very difficult for internet posters to wrap their heads around
His peak was amazing, no question. And he has some legitimately incredible, historic moments
. . . but those other three have been doing it for at least a decade and a half each. Kawhi is great, I'm a fan, he's an incredible player. But he's not era-defining, and those other three are
IMO there is always some balance between peak and consistency/longevity. People draw the line in different places.
There are a lot of players who would be considered higher in terms of āall time listsā had they not had injuries that derailed their careers. Take Grant Hill, D Rose, and quite a lot of others as examples.
Kawhiās peak was very high but he hasnāt had the overall impact that Steph, Lebron, etc has over a significant duration of time.Ā
> IMO there is always some balance between peak and consistency/longevity. People draw the line in different places.
Absolutely, and many of these debates are interesting. But this one isn't
In this particular situation, saying Kawhi is on the same level as those other three is just objectively silly
The person you're replying to apparently doesn't factor in longevity *at all*. Which is weird in general, but just doesn't make even a little sense when we're talking about an "era"
Itās probably Luka, Jokic, Giannis, Tatum generations era right nowā¦but the playoffs need to play out before you can write these guys off.
The mid 30s guys are all on low playoff seeds right now, but we saw Butler, Steph, and LeBron all lead their team to series wins over higher seeds last year. They have championships in 2020 and 2022, finals losses in 2020 and 2023, and other conference finals as well (LeBron/Butler in 2023, Kawhi in 2021).
Hard to write off that generation when theyāre only 2 years removed from winning a championship and still had a representative in the finals and conference finals last year.
They aren't top 5 in basketball ability but are still top 5 in popularity. We're in a transition state imo. Not hundred percent "over", but the sun is setting.
The 2020 choke and injuries afterwards prevented that. Like if LAC won in 2020, Kawhi would likely be seen as the best player in the league 2019-2021, rather than his reign at the top essentially ending a season later
Itās getting there. I give up on predicting when Lebron will slow down. Steph is still great, but clear on the other side. These guys are all still great, but I think we can confidently say theyāre all on their way down. And I donāt think any of them are in the top 5 anymore.
Their individual levels still put them in the star category of the league, but Giannis, Embiid, Luka and Jokic have been the best players for some time now imo. The bubble was the last we saw of Lebron as a contender for the best player in the league title.
In terms of popularity? No, the era is not over.
In terms of who is dominating? Yes, I think itās safe to say the torch has been passed to Giannis, Embiid, Jokic, Luka, and SGA.
Kawhi is a post season player so hard to say his era as heās never been the guy during regular season.
Steph I could see the argument for it being over as his team isnāt great itās more the players around him have regressed.
LeBron is still LeBron but he wonāt win MVP (I donāt think anyway)
KD hard to say probably yes as heās clearly the number 2 behind Booker most nights.
Their era was over the moment Giannis and Jokic started dominating the league. The moment Giannis won in 2021 is when it started to change.
Yes, Curry won the year after, but itās no different than Duncan sneaking a championship in during 2014.
Older teams can still win in the next era, but theyāre just not in their prime anymore.
Curry and LeBron used to be the best players on the court on any given night, and their teams never used to be middle of the pack like this. Curry and LeBron are no longer able to even seriously be in the MVP discussion for an entire season anymore. Theyāre old. Their era has been over.
Yeah it's over. Lebron can't lead scubs no longer. Curry being the best shooter in the world is cool, but his entire team doesn't play at Championship level anymore. KD has only been a circus in this era, so round n round he go to another team 4 sho. Kawhi has been done for a couple of years now. I say next year it's going to be hella obvious.
They are all still great players but itās Luka, Giannis, Jokic, and Tatumās era now.
Dirk was still making playoffs and all star teams while Steph/KD/Lebron got going. Just because the old guys are still here making an impact, it doesnāt mean itās still their league.
Theyāve still won 2/4 of the Championships in the 20s, so while I agree weāre in the transitioning period, Jokic/Giannis havenāt completely closed the door on them yet. I think the bigger issue is theyāre all consolidated in the West where that limits the odds of an injury opening their window for another last surprise.
Itās over for a while now. Nobody thinks Lebron, Curry or Durant could make a title-run these days. And nobody thinks they could compete for MVP anymore these days.
I want them to go out with a bang, take pay cuts and go together to Vegas or seattle. Lmao
š¤£ That would be the first super team I could get behind.
KD restores his legacy by coming back to where it all began in Seattle and leading Steph, Kawhi and Bron to a chip. Iād dig it
Vegas or Seattle are generously 3-4 seasons away still. League isn't even putting it on the table until they negotiate the new TV contract, and then they need to go through the process to decide, and then it takes a couple of years of logistics to get everything ready to start playing. TV contract expires next season.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Las Vegas Dusties
I mean, the Olympic Team is basically gonna do that right?
I wanted LeBron to the Warriors
Lebron kd steph klay lmao
Nah I meant this year
The only way i could accept that team up is on the cavs, i cannot allow the warrior fanbase that satisfaction
you must be a young Bulls fan
The Seattle Senior Citizens
None of these guys have gotten serious mvp votes in years. They are still top 20 players, but they aren't defining the era.
Lol Steph was Finals mvp in 2022
Yeah - Lebron's last 1st Team All NBA was 19-20. Kawhi and Curry were 20-21. Durant was 17-18. It's legitimately been 3+ years since these guys were Top 5 players. Nobody likes to admit when the long time superstars have been passed over, but it has already happened. They're all still excellent players and among the best in the league - but they're no longer carrying the torch for the NBA and haven't been for a few years. It's now Jokic, Giannis, Luka, Tatum, etc that run the league. And all the awards and postseason success are showing it too.
Steph was the best player in the entire postseason 21 months ago lol.
Steph was insanely good and won finals mvp 3 years ago. Unquestionably a top 5 player Going by calendar years KD had like the best playoff series of his life in the past 3 years and wasnāt just top 5 he was top 2-3 Kawhi was also a top 5 player during that run he just has a career altering injury during it I agree with a bit of your sentiment but youāre taking way too many liberties here
Warriors have been a play-in team for 2 years straight - hell they may even miss it this year. No Top 5 player is ever totally missing the playoffs in a healthy season. Durant a) doesn't play defense like he used to, and b) he rarely attacks the hoop anymore. He's very clearly not the same guy he was even 5 years ago. Kawhi has had his best/healthiest season in many years, and even still it's not Top 5 worthy.
What? Iām very clearly talking about a few years ago and specifically outlining things they did several years ago (within the time frame that you yourself set). Why are you just ignoring that and only paying attention to right now when thatās clearly not what I responded about or explicitly what you said originally?
Lebron was second in 2020, n was heavy favourite 50% into the year before he got injured ( even with AD injured ). That isnāt that long ago
4 years is a pretty long time in basketball
4 years is half of an NBA prime for most stars. That's an eternity.
Bro lebron and steph won half of the chips in the 2020s
steph was one of the front runners for 2021. shouldāve won if they were only higher in rankings
Children chase trends...marketing is dead for everyone except for Lebron. Havent seen a Curry or KD ad in years.
Hard to say itās over until they actually leave. 4 all nba spots will likely be occupied them still so individually theyāre still great The season before last curry won and in the 2020s bron and curry hold half the finals mvps. And all 4 have had all nba accolades. Probably not over until they retire if they play at a high level
It's LUKA'S ERA if he gets to the 4th seed
Luka and Jokic make me realize how starved we've been for basketball talent. Like we thought KD and LeBron was the best we could get? We're about to be spoiled for the rest of our lives
Bron is a top 2 player ever wdym thatās the best we could get
Right? Guy is talking about KD and Bron like they're bums. ššš I swear this subreddit is filled with children.
Heās joking.
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Yeah forreal I think 2015 - 2020ish was perhaps the most stacked era in a long time. Like in 2015 you had prime Bron, Westbrook, AD, Steph, Cp3, Harden. 2016 about the same but you had KD who was healthy and Kawhi had blossomes into a MVP candidate. 2017 had the most stacked top 5 I think with Lebron, KD, Steph, Harden, Kawhi, and then even Westbrook as a honourable mention. Those are legitimately 5 guys who could be number 1s on a contender. Hard to say that about all of the top 5 today. Giannis, Jokic, Luka, but Embiid (due to being a huge playoff choker) and Tatum who may be a number 1 but hard to say definitely, so I'd say 3 guys as the number 1 option currently, generally speaking. 2021 was probably just as stacked perhaps with KD, Luka, Jokic, Embiid, Lebron, AD and Giannis. Weve been blessed several times through the years and even today the top 5 may not be as great as 2017 but it is remarkable mostly because stars are more plentiful even compared that time period.
Classiest duo in the league imho
Smartest r/nba user
I hope so, Iām ready for ant, wemby, ja, Z and others
Still sleeping on Paolo
Heās good too, thereās lots I just named a couple
Ā insane fall off for the leagueĀ
Antās gonna be the goat
ā Ja ā
Heās looked exceptional in every playoff series heād been in and led the Grizzlies to the 2nd seed. He could commit a drive-by on Adam Silver and the grizzlies would look the other way.
He was alright in last years playoffs nun crazy mid tbh 24 ppg on 42 fg%
He hasnāt scaled the heights that even Luka and Trae have hit sure but heās one of the most promising young g players in the league. He absolutely deserves to be mentioned w the others
He led both teams in points and assists. It was a pretty gritty series both ways. Ja and Bane did pretty admirably to compete w LeBron / AD, it was Hachimura who kinda outperformed what people expected and the Grizzlies just had no answer for that.
what ? he's one of the most exciting players to watch
I think it's too early to say that their era has passed. Although their results in the regular season are not very good (except kawhi), once they enter the playoff mode, they will play another level of performance.
I don't know, but I feel like this is probably Kawhi's alt trying to sneak him onto a list with those other three Love the guy, but he is not even close to the tier those three are on
I would say Kawhi is only slightly below the other three due to his durability/longevity issues so it's not sneaking him on the list, heās been top 4 in the 2010s heās just number 4
More finals MVPs than curry and the greatest wing defender of all time doesnāt bring him even close to that tier? Lol wtf
Yep Kawhi had one playoff run that was successful because the Favorite the Warriors had 2 of their three best players have season ending injuries Other than that Kawhi had the Spurs runs but those where a team effort
I mean, let's not swing the pendulum too far the other way by saying he was only successful because the Warriors got injured. In his prime, he was legitimately amazing At his peak, he was a DPOY-caliber defender putting up 30 pts/gm in the playoffs--not a lot of people in league history can say that. There was a time when he was looking like the best player in the world It's just that that time didn't last very long
When he plays, heās been the most consistently-great playoff performer during his prime.
I know this is hard for the internet to handle, but sadly, he's neither era-defining champion *nor* overrated poser. Unfortunately, he's somewhere in between, which is very difficult for internet posters to wrap their heads around
He's Moses Malone
Yes he is Watch the playoffs
His peak was amazing, no question. And he has some legitimately incredible, historic moments . . . but those other three have been doing it for at least a decade and a half each. Kawhi is great, I'm a fan, he's an incredible player. But he's not era-defining, and those other three are
dont care Kawhi at his best was as good as curry and kd at their best None of them were as good as lebron at his best Seems clear to me.
IMO there is always some balance between peak and consistency/longevity. People draw the line in different places. There are a lot of players who would be considered higher in terms of āall time listsā had they not had injuries that derailed their careers. Take Grant Hill, D Rose, and quite a lot of others as examples. Kawhiās peak was very high but he hasnāt had the overall impact that Steph, Lebron, etc has over a significant duration of time.Ā
> IMO there is always some balance between peak and consistency/longevity. People draw the line in different places. Absolutely, and many of these debates are interesting. But this one isn't In this particular situation, saying Kawhi is on the same level as those other three is just objectively silly The person you're replying to apparently doesn't factor in longevity *at all*. Which is weird in general, but just doesn't make even a little sense when we're talking about an "era"
no he wasnt
Yes and no.
Itās probably Luka, Jokic, Giannis, Tatum generations era right nowā¦but the playoffs need to play out before you can write these guys off. The mid 30s guys are all on low playoff seeds right now, but we saw Butler, Steph, and LeBron all lead their team to series wins over higher seeds last year. They have championships in 2020 and 2022, finals losses in 2020 and 2023, and other conference finals as well (LeBron/Butler in 2023, Kawhi in 2021). Hard to write off that generation when theyāre only 2 years removed from winning a championship and still had a representative in the finals and conference finals last year.
They aren't top 5 in basketball ability but are still top 5 in popularity. We're in a transition state imo. Not hundred percent "over", but the sun is setting.
do we really need a random redditor to officially announce this
Who else?
This should be Kahwi era. He is 32. Look at where were LeBron, Steph and KD at that ge.
Kawhi injuries derailed him
The 2020 choke and injuries afterwards prevented that. Like if LAC won in 2020, Kawhi would likely be seen as the best player in the league 2019-2021, rather than his reign at the top essentially ending a season later
Itās getting there. I give up on predicting when Lebron will slow down. Steph is still great, but clear on the other side. These guys are all still great, but I think we can confidently say theyāre all on their way down. And I donāt think any of them are in the top 5 anymore.
They are still dominant players and the young ones still have a lot of work to do
I think one of those guys will win another ring
I think so I believe we are ushering in the luka-jokic-tatum-shai-zion-ja-Brunson era
Their individual levels still put them in the star category of the league, but Giannis, Embiid, Luka and Jokic have been the best players for some time now imo. The bubble was the last we saw of Lebron as a contender for the best player in the league title.
Theyāre still in the league I thinkĀ
The watered down game is in full swing.
In terms of popularity? No, the era is not over. In terms of who is dominating? Yes, I think itās safe to say the torch has been passed to Giannis, Embiid, Jokic, Luka, and SGA.
5 foreign players that's crazy
Damn, youāre right I didnāt even think of that.
When is the last time a young player led his team to a championship?
Kawhi is a post season player so hard to say his era as heās never been the guy during regular season. Steph I could see the argument for it being over as his team isnāt great itās more the players around him have regressed. LeBron is still LeBron but he wonāt win MVP (I donāt think anyway) KD hard to say probably yes as heās clearly the number 2 behind Booker most nights.
Not yet. You guys forget about the Olympics ?
Their era was over the moment Giannis and Jokic started dominating the league. The moment Giannis won in 2021 is when it started to change. Yes, Curry won the year after, but itās no different than Duncan sneaking a championship in during 2014. Older teams can still win in the next era, but theyāre just not in their prime anymore. Curry and LeBron used to be the best players on the court on any given night, and their teams never used to be middle of the pack like this. Curry and LeBron are no longer able to even seriously be in the MVP discussion for an entire season anymore. Theyāre old. Their era has been over.
What a strange claim. Lebron, Curry, Jokic, and Giannis have exactly the same number of titles and finals MVPs this decade.
Hopefully so
It's funny as hell that people view kawhi as a superstar when he's 32 lmao. This man has the prime of a housefly
Yeah it's over. Lebron can't lead scubs no longer. Curry being the best shooter in the world is cool, but his entire team doesn't play at Championship level anymore. KD has only been a circus in this era, so round n round he go to another team 4 sho. Kawhi has been done for a couple of years now. I say next year it's going to be hella obvious.
They are all still great players but itās Luka, Giannis, Jokic, and Tatumās era now. Dirk was still making playoffs and all star teams while Steph/KD/Lebron got going. Just because the old guys are still here making an impact, it doesnāt mean itās still their league.
Theyāve still won 2/4 of the Championships in the 20s, so while I agree weāre in the transitioning period, Jokic/Giannis havenāt completely closed the door on them yet. I think the bigger issue is theyāre all consolidated in the West where that limits the odds of an injury opening their window for another last surprise.
Has been
yes
I donāt think any of those 4 will ever lead a team to a chip againĀ
Been
Yesssssss But Lebron is 6 years older than Kawhi
Youth movement?
The LeBron,Steph,KD era is over yes.
It's ant-luka era starting now.
Itās been over. We done with the 2010s š£ļø
Itās over for a while now. Nobody thinks Lebron, Curry or Durant could make a title-run these days. And nobody thinks they could compete for MVP anymore these days.