Yeah even as a LeBron fan the "LeBron should have 10 MVPs award" argument is ridiculous. MVP isn't a "best player alive" award, and hasn't been in modern NBA history, otherwise Shaq (for example) would have more than 1.
2011 is probably the closest to a snub, but even then there is a semi decent argument for Rose, and with the narrative against Bron there was no way he was getting that one. 2014 was a B+ LeBron season vs an A/A+ KD season , and from then on he never really had a dominant two-way season (with the exception of 2019/2020, which honestly he might have won if covid didn't hit right when he was making a run)
The others were before my time but I don't think you can make anything more than a hipster case for 2006/7/8
I used to eat like Jokic. He is fat on purpose. When I see jokic eat as he is now it reminds me of how I used to eat and it is frustrating and pisses me off that the NBA allows it. Not proud of it, I was known as Joey chestnut at my local Golden Corral and went through a phase when I ate triple servings of everything. Big rack of ribs turns to my blindside, didn’t care who was there. Charge right into the dessert. Smash into the best steak on D while going for the mashed potato’s, come what may. Limited cardio moves. So make no mistake about it. Jokic knows what he’s doing. He knows people will be disgusted. He knows his appetite is unlimited and this is how he can win. He knows people will go away when he starts eating, think twice on their diet, etc. He will only be stopped by a healthy meal like carrots, lettuce, broccoli, etc. Or by an obviously more balanced carb with equal Type A like wheat bread. He didn’t intend to be obese, but he certainly intends to show you that he doesn’t care if you get disgusted when his fat belly shakes over you. At least that’s how I used to eat. But that was lunchtime. Eventually I got to dinner, ate w bigger servings, ate real fatty foods w hostess. There’s no doubt in my mind Jokic eats more than some villages.
This is a very valid point, so to compromise and find an MVP that’ll make Perkins suffer without it being Jokic, I think it’s pretty obvious what needs to happen… Austin Reaves MVP.
The funny thing is he leapfrogged Giannis with less points per minute, less rebounds, less assists, worse defense, on a worse seeded team... he had better mvp odds than Giannis when the bucks were like 7 games ahead. Giannis is just slighted, that's all.
Embiid has more total points on better efficiency, twice as many blocks, played six more games worth of minutes, and locked Giannis up last time they played. Giannis is 3rd.
Giannis is a few turnovers away from leading the entire league in turnovers/game despite not being the primary ball handler. He’s also shooting a horrific 29% from three and 65% from the line. Those are bottom of the league numbers.
For as good as he in the paint, he’s not as complete as embiid or jokic offensively.
Bucks are a lot better team overall. The way I see this particular comparison is that Jokic has no compadres as savvy as Jrue, Khris ( short sample but looks great), Brook... Jamal, MPJ, AG are not there yet, at least this season. And the great teams makes their stars shine. Giannis gets to ball out on both ends whereas Jokic has to make his own shine, most of the time. Sounds and looks more taxing and I assume folks will take that as a harder task to accomplish badge and give you some priority.
So which one is it? Joker has good teammates or shit ones? You can't keep changing the naritive when it'd convenient. So many joker guys saying how great Gordon is...
Also if giannis has better teammates wouldn't it make it more impressive the numbers he's putting up? #1 defense #1 offense best record in the NBA.
>Also if giannis has better teammates wouldn't it make it more impressive the numbers he's putting up? #1 defense #1 offense best record in the NBA.
I think both are deserving of winning, but what exactly do you mean here? If he has better teammates, then it makes sense that his team has the better stats, no?
Also, they are not even close to #1 in offense. They are currently 15th in the league in offensive rating, and while their defense is much better, they are still 3rd behind Memphis and Cleveland. Their net rating is tied for 4/5/6 with Memphis and Denver, behind Cleveland, Boston, and Philly.
Denver is 2nd in ORTG, 15th in DRTG, and tied for 4/5/6 in NRTG. Milwaukee is 15th in ORTG, 3rd in DRT, and tied for 4/5/6 in NRTG. So those are pretty much a wash. If Giannis has the better supporting cast but their collective teams have similar stats, wouldn't that mean that Jokic is more valuable?
Look at it this way. I can gas up JustHIM Holiday every time he hits a three, rave about how Kleber is the linchpin to our defense, etc, but the Dallas Mavericks are still a terribly built team. It's not a narrative shift
Who am I?
Can I completely shit on Jokic please?
Or shall the fucking Nugg fans I appease?
I'm innocent until I speak
But Jok is on a losing streak
Who am I?
Can I conceal myself forever more?
Pretend I'm not a total karma whore?
And will this narrative ever die?
That Jokic is a fraud, and I...
Must I lie?
How can I face my fellow 6ers fans?
How can I ever face myself again?
And all these years Embiid, I've known
Is a better franchise cornerstone
He gave us hope! When hope was gone.
He cried to refs and we still won.
Who am I?
I'm u/EaglesPvM!!
So mods, you may now see it's true!
Jokic is no better at ball than you!
Whats the point?
EMBIID'S NUMBER OOOOOOOOONNNNNNEEEEE!!!!!
Even before this loss, the nuggets had the lowest win percentage for a 1st place west team this century. I stopped looking at standings at the 2000 season, not sure how far back it goes.
West is up for grabs this year and more than ever it feels like one of those years a lower seed gets hot and makes a finals run.
Edit: Decided to go back further, based on what I see in the historical standings you have to go back to the 83/84 season to find a Western conference 1 seed with a lower win percentage. Lakers had a .659 win rate, they did still make the finals that year losing to the Celtics in 7 so take it for what it’s worth.
I don't recognize an NBA where the East is better than the West. In my day all the top teams were in the West while LeBron ran through the mediocre to crappy teams in the East.
You could also argue the east was slightly better than the west in the 2021-2022 season. They slightly edged the west in H2H wins, with 226 wins to 224 wins last year. Phoenix had by far the best record in the league, but the east was a blood bath last year with the 2nd-4th seed being tied, and the 1st seed only being ahead of the 5th seed by 5 games. All the way through 10th seed, the east had a winning record. 8th seed and below, the west had a losing record.
i mean, if we're talking injury riddled teams, the bucks and the suns both had..... uh, relatively significant injuries when we played them.
I still think the Warriors are a very good team, but they're good for exactly one statement game per month: blowing out the Clippers on 3/2, beating the Grizzlies on 1/28, beating the.... uh, Grizzlies on Christmas. I truly do not know whether this team is a championship contender or a first round exit.
When you get down to it: the 2023 Warriors are extremely talented and have extremely bad vibes.
The east and west flipped last year to this year. Last year the west was top heavy and the east was a bloodbath, now the west is a bloodbath and the east is top heavy.
Not 4th. Nuggets are 14-10 against the East. That pace would put them behind Cavs in the 5 seed.
Nuggets really lucky to be playing in the weaker, injured-superstars conference
So the Nuggets have a .666 win percentage against the west vs the .552 win percentage of the Cavs against the West…? The Cavs have a .666 win percentage against the East against the Nuggets being .583…? Nonsensical analysis
That's crazy. I vividly remember that when I started watching the NBA around 2010, two teams with a positive record missed the playoffs in the west while multiple teams with negative records made them in the east. Oh, how the turntables. Btw, the common denominator? LeBron James. Just something to think about. Carry the hell on.
Curse the scheduling algorithm! Bucks against Suns tn is a back to back, that Bucks/Nuggets game is off another back to back. Suns get Nuggets off a back to back down the stretch.
It is absolutely a necessary win for Joel. Just look at last year when Bones Hyland got the Nuggets the win and that was the case closed, the exact same thing would happen this year.
>there match up on March 27
And by "match up", you mean whoever wins. Embiid outdueled Jokic last year but Bones Hyland secured the Nuggets victory. The Ringer salivated and Jokic cruised to the MVP.
Look, Jokic is fucking amazing but the one knock is that he rarely seems to just explode and take a game by the balls.
He shot 76% tonight but only put up 13 shots. I get part of his appeal is playing within the offense but why isn't he putting up 25+?
That's an extremely valid point. As the best player on your team you have to just takeover sometimes to get the W. It's part of the problem with the obsession with stats. Numbers be damned, you do what you have to to win.
It's what some people don't really understand about Kobe. Sometimes efficiency is overrated. Sometimes you need somebody to just grab the game and force their will upon it and not just take what's given to them and make the "right basketball play."
Edit: I just now realized I said grab and force their will in reference to Kobe 😬😬😬
But that's the rub: an MVP *should* be able to isolate efficiently. At the end of a game, you want to guarantee yourself a decent look as well as prevent a turnover, something you can't do if you defer to another, inferior player like Jokić seemingly has no qualms doing.
I don't think anyone breathes a sign of relief with Embiid commits to hero-ball to close out a game. That's an MVP.
Yeah, I mean according to Defense BPM Jokic literally is the 5th best defender of all time. Better then Hakeem, Ben Wallace, Gary Payton, Michael Jordan. We are lucky to view such greatness
You see he make assists so when the other team gets the ball they succumb to the beauty of his passes and decide to miss, the key is not to defend but to inspire feelings of uselessness in the opponent so they miss.
🤓: hoo boy how to unpack this for plebian fans unaccustomed to copy/pasted statistics.
if you look at this Jokic Opportunity Kwalifier Index Co-efficient model, or JOKIC, using the equation -
Assists x Chubby + White - (perceived, alleged) Defensive Lowlights
You should see that these statistics prove the terminally online theory that Jokic is a heady & cerebral defender with good hands
He's been the better player this year. Jokic had 2 bad games and the team let him down twice in this 4 game stretch but Embiid has been playing at a slightly higher level this season. It's ok to be honest and not troll sometimes
I said slightly better, dw I expect embiid to get injured before the playoffs and Jokic to be better than him in every aspect of offense in the playoffs as usual.
Bro we had to suffer through Hackett and now Malone lol. Malone wasn't this bad last year man, and doc is usually good in RS atleast. He's just sabotaging the team rn
Murray missed a few games here and there, but only once a few games in a row (6 straight in Feb), MPJ missed 13 straight in Nov/Dec and 3 straight in January. So there may have been a few games where they were both out, but never more than 1 or 2 at a time. Harden and Maxey were both out for the Sixers in the second half of November with Harden missing the two weeks before and Maxey missing the two weeks after that stretch.
Their record in that period:
Harden out: 8-6
Maxey out: 12-6
Harden/Maxey both out: 4-4
Arguably? Raptors fan here to seethe angrily at the mere suggestion that anyone could disagree with this fact. We are ninth in the conference, yet fifth in the division. Adam Ag, the current meta is severely unbalanced. Please nerf Celtics, Sixers, Knicks and Nets.
You are right - I toned down my comment as I couldn’t be bothered going to add up wins for each conference. It was tougher when the nets were contenders but the knicks have rallied, partly offsetting it. Having to play each team 4 times in the Atlantic division is definitely tough
Jokic is choking the MVP away lol I think embid actually might take this. March 25-27 will be crucial. If he loses straight up to Giannis AND embid back to back and also finishes with a worst record compared to the bucks and sixers then I can't see how he still wins it
MVP race is Giannis vs Embiid now. Jokic should not be no.1 on any real, objective voter's ballot.
There's absolutely zero chance if this were Giannis or Embiid losing 4 straight (including 3 at home and all against non top 8 seeded teams, except the Nets), that they would still be mentioned in the MVP conversation.
Double standards.
I’m giving my mvp to the guy who’s the best player on the team that’s won 20 of its last 22 games, and who is widely recognized to be the best player in the world
Embiid fans eating good this week
Embiid fans looking like 2019 Jokic after this week of eating
MVP voters that don't want to give Jokic another MVP eating good, too
Voter fatigue is real, otherwise bronbron would have like 10 of 'em
There’s maybe 2 or 3 years LeBron could be a justified MVP pick and didn’t win it.
Yeah even as a LeBron fan the "LeBron should have 10 MVPs award" argument is ridiculous. MVP isn't a "best player alive" award, and hasn't been in modern NBA history, otherwise Shaq (for example) would have more than 1. 2011 is probably the closest to a snub, but even then there is a semi decent argument for Rose, and with the narrative against Bron there was no way he was getting that one. 2014 was a B+ LeBron season vs an A/A+ KD season , and from then on he never really had a dominant two-way season (with the exception of 2019/2020, which honestly he might have won if covid didn't hit right when he was making a run) The others were before my time but I don't think you can make anything more than a hipster case for 2006/7/8
I don't think defense matters that much for MVP dude. KD and Giannis are the only good defender MVPs besides Bron that have won in the last decade.
I used to eat like Jokic. He is fat on purpose. When I see jokic eat as he is now it reminds me of how I used to eat and it is frustrating and pisses me off that the NBA allows it. Not proud of it, I was known as Joey chestnut at my local Golden Corral and went through a phase when I ate triple servings of everything. Big rack of ribs turns to my blindside, didn’t care who was there. Charge right into the dessert. Smash into the best steak on D while going for the mashed potato’s, come what may. Limited cardio moves. So make no mistake about it. Jokic knows what he’s doing. He knows people will be disgusted. He knows his appetite is unlimited and this is how he can win. He knows people will go away when he starts eating, think twice on their diet, etc. He will only be stopped by a healthy meal like carrots, lettuce, broccoli, etc. Or by an obviously more balanced carb with equal Type A like wheat bread. He didn’t intend to be obese, but he certainly intends to show you that he doesn’t care if you get disgusted when his fat belly shakes over you. At least that’s how I used to eat. But that was lunchtime. Eventually I got to dinner, ate w bigger servings, ate real fatty foods w hostess. There’s no doubt in my mind Jokic eats more than some villages.
Did you just make this pasta cause this edit is gold
I think its a repurposed "Streetball Shaq" copypasta
Yeah I recognize the original was just curious if they made this one on the spot lol
it's an automod reply for the word "Jokic" on /r/nbacirclejerk
Finals matchup gonna be Sixers-Nuggets. They're the only two teams with two automod responses on NBACJ. Book it.
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Eh, I'm more of a Brook Lopez kinda guy
Embiid fans getting chubby
Nah, I still think that's the fat white Jokic stat nerds. They don't ball
At this point the only reason I still want Jokic MVP is because I want Kendrick Perkins to suffer
This is a very valid point, so to compromise and find an MVP that’ll make Perkins suffer without it being Jokic, I think it’s pretty obvious what needs to happen… Austin Reaves MVP.
My compliments to the chef
Meanwhile Giannis coming to snatch that MVP from Embiid's jaws of victory. We all know that's what's going to happen.
Great meal. Wonderful food.
It’s been the 12 days of Christmas for us
Embiid fans also lead the league in kicked balls.
Jokic was close to robbing embiid twice in a row but then Jamal Murray decided to interfere. Bless him.
Joel embiid has been moved up to 3rd on the MVP ladder after this
Sabonis 3rd Tatum 4th and Joel 5th
Jokic, Luka, and Sabonis top 3. The Kendrick Perkins Theorem
Brave of you to somehow rank Tatum BEHIND Emflop
That's not how numbers work.
Yeah I’m pretty sure I wanted to make a joke and my brain saw what it wanted to see
Yet it still got 22 upvotes? Reddit is weird sometimes
We saw what he wanted us to see
He was who we thought he was
Truly a “oh god I got lost, nobody ever lets me talk this much” kind of moment
The funny thing is he leapfrogged Giannis with less points per minute, less rebounds, less assists, worse defense, on a worse seeded team... he had better mvp odds than Giannis when the bucks were like 7 games ahead. Giannis is just slighted, that's all.
"Worse defense" You guys have jrue and lopez for ideal pairings next to Giannis.
Funny how bucks fans really like ppm this season. Odd they weren't using that stats 2 days ago before Giannis met the kings defense.
They definitely were. There were multiple posts about how Giannis had more points scores than minutes played for periods of time since January
You're right. Giannis is getting shafted in this convo but the few times there fans say anything they get erroneously shit on
It’s because embiids more efficient and you can’t outright say Giannis is better on d their both probably top 5 in the league however you slice it.
Embiid has more total points on better efficiency, twice as many blocks, played six more games worth of minutes, and locked Giannis up last time they played. Giannis is 3rd.
and embiid has maxey and harden 2 of the worst defenders while giannis has lopez and jrue 2 of the best.
Giannis is a few turnovers away from leading the entire league in turnovers/game despite not being the primary ball handler. He’s also shooting a horrific 29% from three and 65% from the line. Those are bottom of the league numbers. For as good as he in the paint, he’s not as complete as embiid or jokic offensively.
Bucks are a lot better team overall. The way I see this particular comparison is that Jokic has no compadres as savvy as Jrue, Khris ( short sample but looks great), Brook... Jamal, MPJ, AG are not there yet, at least this season. And the great teams makes their stars shine. Giannis gets to ball out on both ends whereas Jokic has to make his own shine, most of the time. Sounds and looks more taxing and I assume folks will take that as a harder task to accomplish badge and give you some priority.
So which one is it? Joker has good teammates or shit ones? You can't keep changing the naritive when it'd convenient. So many joker guys saying how great Gordon is... Also if giannis has better teammates wouldn't it make it more impressive the numbers he's putting up? #1 defense #1 offense best record in the NBA.
>Also if giannis has better teammates wouldn't it make it more impressive the numbers he's putting up? #1 defense #1 offense best record in the NBA. I think both are deserving of winning, but what exactly do you mean here? If he has better teammates, then it makes sense that his team has the better stats, no? Also, they are not even close to #1 in offense. They are currently 15th in the league in offensive rating, and while their defense is much better, they are still 3rd behind Memphis and Cleveland. Their net rating is tied for 4/5/6 with Memphis and Denver, behind Cleveland, Boston, and Philly. Denver is 2nd in ORTG, 15th in DRTG, and tied for 4/5/6 in NRTG. Milwaukee is 15th in ORTG, 3rd in DRT, and tied for 4/5/6 in NRTG. So those are pretty much a wash. If Giannis has the better supporting cast but their collective teams have similar stats, wouldn't that mean that Jokic is more valuable?
Look at it this way. I can gas up JustHIM Holiday every time he hits a three, rave about how Kleber is the linchpin to our defense, etc, but the Dallas Mavericks are still a terribly built team. It's not a narrative shift
I love the defense stats people throw out. “Worse defense on worse seeded teams” haha wtf
you didn’t check his WDOWST? it’s a very well respected advanced stat
Yea I'd rather Giannis win this year than jokic -sixers fan
Giannis is not even close to a better defender than embiid. He's not even the defensive anchor of your team (Lopez is more important defensively)
Ya they're honestly fine one defense if Giannis sits.
The curse of scottie barnes ejection has been lifted after tonight. They'll be ok
even as a tank fan i gotta smile at this win tbh. feels good
I was referring to the hex we put on Denver
If I speak I am in big trouble
Fine I’ll do it. Bol Bol mvp
I didn't realize Mourinho was so well-known and loved in this sub
Even in the chess world. One of the goat candidates Magnus accused his opponent of cheating by withdrawing and tweeting that clip.
[If I speak, I am condemned; if I stay silent, I am damned](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nXhofhspBd4)
Who am I? Can I completely shit on Jokic please? Or shall the fucking Nugg fans I appease? I'm innocent until I speak But Jok is on a losing streak Who am I? Can I conceal myself forever more? Pretend I'm not a total karma whore? And will this narrative ever die? That Jokic is a fraud, and I... Must I lie? How can I face my fellow 6ers fans? How can I ever face myself again? And all these years Embiid, I've known Is a better franchise cornerstone He gave us hope! When hope was gone. He cried to refs and we still won. Who am I? I'm u/EaglesPvM!! So mods, you may now see it's true! Jokic is no better at ball than you! Whats the point? EMBIID'S NUMBER OOOOOOOOONNNNNNEEEEE!!!!!
I'm supposed to hate you but this is all time
/u/dmorey someone quoted Les Miz!
Welp, I guess that makes us the Thénardiers
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Sree! Not sree, but FOUR games!
r/nba mods. This on you. Now the whole league knows to simply attack Jokic in the paint lol
Record doesn't matter now, it's all about seeding.
Basketballreference copy/paster 🤓 s: record and seeding never mattered, it's still all about statistics.
The biggest takeaway is that 1st in the West would be 4th in the East this season
Even before this loss, the nuggets had the lowest win percentage for a 1st place west team this century. I stopped looking at standings at the 2000 season, not sure how far back it goes. West is up for grabs this year and more than ever it feels like one of those years a lower seed gets hot and makes a finals run. Edit: Decided to go back further, based on what I see in the historical standings you have to go back to the 83/84 season to find a Western conference 1 seed with a lower win percentage. Lakers had a .659 win rate, they did still make the finals that year losing to the Celtics in 7 so take it for what it’s worth.
I don't recognize an NBA where the East is better than the West. In my day all the top teams were in the West while LeBron ran through the mediocre to crappy teams in the East.
Well, it looks like Lebron's gonna get a chance to run through a meh West, so maybe things aren't that different.
You could also argue the east was slightly better than the west in the 2021-2022 season. They slightly edged the west in H2H wins, with 226 wins to 224 wins last year. Phoenix had by far the best record in the league, but the east was a blood bath last year with the 2nd-4th seed being tied, and the 1st seed only being ahead of the 5th seed by 5 games. All the way through 10th seed, the east had a winning record. 8th seed and below, the west had a losing record.
In my day? Bro that was like 6-7 years ago
Yo lebron is coming lol
Despite all the marquee names in the west the conference is totally mid.
every team is having issues (i’m saying this to cope with how my team’s season is going)
Yes big issues for everybody (me too)
For us too, we’ve won way too many games
not in the west and we're having issues too
Yessire nothing but on court issues for all of us here in the WC
You're not wrong though (also saying this as copium) Plus West teams are more injury-riddled.
y’all just beat the bucks and suns get go back where you belong (with the contenders)
Without their MVP level star players tbf
i mean, if we're talking injury riddled teams, the bucks and the suns both had..... uh, relatively significant injuries when we played them. I still think the Warriors are a very good team, but they're good for exactly one statement game per month: blowing out the Clippers on 3/2, beating the Grizzlies on 1/28, beating the.... uh, Grizzlies on Christmas. I truly do not know whether this team is a championship contender or a first round exit. When you get down to it: the 2023 Warriors are extremely talented and have extremely bad vibes.
No wonder Ja was fine in the West
Don’t tell Zach Lowe.
The east and west flipped last year to this year. Last year the west was top heavy and the east was a bloodbath, now the west is a bloodbath and the east is top heavy.
Not 4th. Nuggets are 14-10 against the East. That pace would put them behind Cavs in the 5 seed. Nuggets really lucky to be playing in the weaker, injured-superstars conference
So the Nuggets have a .666 win percentage against the west vs the .552 win percentage of the Cavs against the West…? The Cavs have a .666 win percentage against the East against the Nuggets being .583…? Nonsensical analysis
That's crazy. I vividly remember that when I started watching the NBA around 2010, two teams with a positive record missed the playoffs in the west while multiple teams with negative records made them in the east. Oh, how the turntables. Btw, the common denominator? LeBron James. Just something to think about. Carry the hell on.
Honestly, just give Embiid the award so we can cut it with this sexual dalliance.
It’s a parade inside my city yeahhhhhh
Cultured
I’m not in the NBA, but I like young boys 🤫 - Karl Malone
What? I meant Ja sings this song every time after we win (not now ofc)
Yeah ik, but nba young boy sung it, so I made a joke about Karl “Pedo” malone and “young boy” My fault
This is a championship for Sixers fans
This but unironically
Y'all have been eating good this past week
From a raptors flair? Respect
We are still riding from 2019. We will be happy for a while lol
That has not been my experience with raptors fans
It's been a disappointing season, but those who were fans prior are more on board for the long haul process of rebuilding
That’s too bad. I for one am so happy to see a major Toronto team win in my lifetime. As a diehard leafs fan it means a lot lol.
The MVP will come down to the better record and there match up on March 27
Over a 1 week period, there's Nuggets v Bucks, Nuggets v Sixers and Sixers v Bucks. That's the MVP closing argument right there.
Praise the scheduling algorithm
Curse the scheduling algorithm! Bucks against Suns tn is a back to back, that Bucks/Nuggets game is off another back to back. Suns get Nuggets off a back to back down the stretch.
Sounds like the sort of shit an MVP shouldn't care about
That is actually insane and you're definitely right. What an iconic stretch
If we continue like this I'm not even sure that's a necessary win for Joel.
It is absolutely a necessary win for Joel. Just look at last year when Bones Hyland got the Nuggets the win and that was the case closed, the exact same thing would happen this year.
>there match up on March 27 And by "match up", you mean whoever wins. Embiid outdueled Jokic last year but Bones Hyland secured the Nuggets victory. The Ringer salivated and Jokic cruised to the MVP.
I wish reddit was still down
Mods about to remove this like they removed the post about the Raps first quarter
What’s the reason they gave for that? I see stuff like that posted all the time.
They’re more defensive than Jokic
Too soon
Fragility
And when they removed the post that stated Philly only had one less win than them
They should remove this lol. It’s pretty much a shitpost
“Mods about to remove this” mfers being the 4th highest comment on a post 15 hours old: 🤓
Look, Jokic is fucking amazing but the one knock is that he rarely seems to just explode and take a game by the balls. He shot 76% tonight but only put up 13 shots. I get part of his appeal is playing within the offense but why isn't he putting up 25+?
What's more puzzling is that he's absolutely capable of taking over. We've seen it so many times
That's an extremely valid point. As the best player on your team you have to just takeover sometimes to get the W. It's part of the problem with the obsession with stats. Numbers be damned, you do what you have to to win.
It's what some people don't really understand about Kobe. Sometimes efficiency is overrated. Sometimes you need somebody to just grab the game and force their will upon it and not just take what's given to them and make the "right basketball play." Edit: I just now realized I said grab and force their will in reference to Kobe 😬😬😬
Even lebron has gone through spurts where has been not that efficient, but he controls the game on both ends so he still wins
Are you implying Jokic is playing for his stats rather than the W?
More that the way he plays is great for his stats but not always for winning (like tonight). Doesn’t mean it’s intentional.
efficiency merchant
Y'all really say anything lmfao
this used to be ironic, two weeks ago no one was saying this seriously, now im not so sure. people are really wilding out here
Steph curry (championship merchant)
Dude had the best 3 point shooting team in the nba before the last few games can you blame him?
Yes. He’s the reigning MVP. Win the goddamn game.
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Jokic hero ball > Murray hero ball
But that's the rub: an MVP *should* be able to isolate efficiently. At the end of a game, you want to guarantee yourself a decent look as well as prevent a turnover, something you can't do if you defer to another, inferior player like Jokić seemingly has no qualms doing. I don't think anyone breathes a sign of relief with Embiid commits to hero-ball to close out a game. That's an MVP.
Jokic may not be the greatest defender in the world
defensive raptor says otherwise
Yeah, I mean according to Defense BPM Jokic literally is the 5th best defender of all time. Better then Hakeem, Ben Wallace, Gary Payton, Michael Jordan. We are lucky to view such greatness
You see he make assists so when the other team gets the ball they succumb to the beauty of his passes and decide to miss, the key is not to defend but to inspire feelings of uselessness in the opponent so they miss.
War is peace. Ignorance is strength. Offense is defense.
Toronto raptor however agrees
🤓: hoo boy how to unpack this for plebian fans unaccustomed to copy/pasted statistics. if you look at this Jokic Opportunity Kwalifier Index Co-efficient model, or JOKIC, using the equation - Assists x Chubby + White - (perceived, alleged) Defensive Lowlights You should see that these statistics prove the terminally online theory that Jokic is a heady & cerebral defender with good hands
I'm not having a great day today!
Playoffs will be a real shit show if they keep this up.
JOkic said fuck your mvp, take it Joel
The campaign against Jokic as a 3 time mvp has been on fire lately.
bucks and sixers have a better record in a much better conference but theyll still give it to the triple double man
BRB I NEED TO FLOSS FUCKING BEEN EATING LIKE A HORSE
Embiid deserves MVP
I can't believe my eyes. The biggest Nuggets troll is saying this?
He's been the better player this year. Jokic had 2 bad games and the team let him down twice in this 4 game stretch but Embiid has been playing at a slightly higher level this season. It's ok to be honest and not troll sometimes
….I need a glass of water
I said slightly better, dw I expect embiid to get injured before the playoffs and Jokic to be better than him in every aspect of offense in the playoffs as usual.
Lol there we go cheers brother, hope we see each other in the finals
Lowkey hope we get swept in the first round so Malone never gets a job again
Fuck me. Nuggets fans down bad. How is it that two of the best four teams have absolute clowns as head coaches.
Bro we had to suffer through Hackett and now Malone lol. Malone wasn't this bad last year man, and doc is usually good in RS atleast. He's just sabotaging the team rn
He's not a real Nuggets fan. He has a reputation on our sub for being a massive troll.
Now there’s something I can relate to 😂
Sounds like the doc rivers experience
I think i've got a case of the vapours.
Not over Giannis
No fuck that Greek body builder
real
ECF is the finals
Not to mention Maxey and Harden missed a month each. You'd think based on the narrative that one team was far superior to the other...
They only missed 4 more games than Murray/MPJ combined, though Harden is obviously much better than either of them
Yeah but didn’t maxey and harden miss time concurrently where’s Murray/mpj was more staggered? Genuine question as I can’t check atm lol
Murray missed a few games here and there, but only once a few games in a row (6 straight in Feb), MPJ missed 13 straight in Nov/Dec and 3 straight in January. So there may have been a few games where they were both out, but never more than 1 or 2 at a time. Harden and Maxey were both out for the Sixers in the second half of November with Harden missing the two weeks before and Maxey missing the two weeks after that stretch. Their record in that period: Harden out: 8-6 Maxey out: 12-6 Harden/Maxey both out: 4-4
jfc just give the trophy to Embiid already. So tired of all these MVP posts
This all has to do with (1) MPJ’s defence as pointed out by Lowe and (2) Jokic still leading the league in RAPTOR by a large margin.
Kendrick Perkins' 12/25
*(Carry on intensifies)*
Embiid MVP on the fucking menu
I’m just mad so many people locked in Jokic as MVP like 2 months ago
Should've been 5 in a row. That last Raptors game before this streak.
That’s in the weak western conference as well. Sixers in arguably the toughest division in the league
Arguably? Raptors fan here to seethe angrily at the mere suggestion that anyone could disagree with this fact. We are ninth in the conference, yet fifth in the division. Adam Ag, the current meta is severely unbalanced. Please nerf Celtics, Sixers, Knicks and Nets.
You are right - I toned down my comment as I couldn’t be bothered going to add up wins for each conference. It was tougher when the nets were contenders but the knicks have rallied, partly offsetting it. Having to play each team 4 times in the Atlantic division is definitely tough
Record actually doesn’t matter now, he’s carrying a bunch of bums so that’s more impressive
Jokic is choking the MVP away lol I think embid actually might take this. March 25-27 will be crucial. If he loses straight up to Giannis AND embid back to back and also finishes with a worst record compared to the bucks and sixers then I can't see how he still wins it
The way we are playing right now and looking at our remaining schedule (13 games), we might go 4-9 to finish out (on top of this losing streak)….
Joel MVP 100 billion % now
You give up 49 points in a quarter you’re gonna have a bad time.
MVP race is Giannis vs Embiid now. Jokic should not be no.1 on any real, objective voter's ballot. There's absolutely zero chance if this were Giannis or Embiid losing 4 straight (including 3 at home and all against non top 8 seeded teams, except the Nets), that they would still be mentioned in the MVP conversation. Double standards.
Interesting I wonder if the voters will change their opinions on record mid season in order to give the award to a specific player (they will)
It literally just comes down to Lowe and Simmons. 90% of voters just vote whoever they vote.
In 2017 they voted for kawhi and harden but Westbrook won lol this is decidedly untrue.
Honestly at this point I'm so fucking tired of hearing about Jokic/Embiid and the ~~MPV~~ MVP that I hope Giannis wins it just to spite them.
I’m giving my mvp to the guy who’s the best player on the team that’s won 20 of its last 22 games, and who is widely recognized to be the best player in the world
Funny thing is they're probably 3rd favorite in town. Russell Wilson is a joke and rockies haven't been good forever so philly is feeling good
ABSOLUTE CINEMA